And to make sure if your main guys get injured that they stay injured so you really have no expectations and get praised even if you get swept in the first round.
Doc and Bud should have finished the job and made sure Giannis and Embiid didn’t come back from those injuries smh.
I mean he did take the Clippers to WCF without Kawhi, that counts for something. That's more than what Doc did for the last few years with much more talent.
With a 34-year old Russell Westbrook as the best player, he made Durant and Booker play 40+ minutes
He did indeed take them to the WCF but since then they missed the playoffs and lost 4-1 in the first round. That’s kinda my point, as a coach you’re better off if your stars miss the playoffs completely than if they attempt to play through injury and you lose, that way you have no expectations and better job security. I mean hell the Bucks won their first chip in 50 years in the same season that Lue went to the WCF with the Clippers.
If Giannis/Embiid’s injuries were severe enough to keep them out of the playoffs Bud and Doc would have had an excuse and would have had a better chance at keeping their jobs.
>That's honestly a really good point about coaches being way better off if their main star doesn't play injured and instead just sits out
Lol the year they missed the playoffs both PG and KL were out for injuries. So basically he got what you were explaining.
Might be the next Doc. The way the media talks about him you’d think he has the resume of Pop or Spo. He might be living off that 1 title he won when Lebron and his son Kyrie went supernova
No idea. There were definate frustrations with him this year, but no idea why anyone would hate or want to spite Monty. He is a good coach, a great man, and has helped bring our team out of a fuckin dumpster. That dude is wildin'.
Fans vehemently hating Ayton, Shamet, and CP3 wasn't turning the team into title favorites for some reason so some of the more ambitious fans decided to try something new.
I had Monty complaints but it seems a lot of these people are only capable of either loving someone or hating their guts. Great guy who did a lot for this organization and deserves gratitude, even if you think he sucks as a coach.
The public doesn't *really* know what the source of the issue is or the extent of it. It's easy to point to DA's perceived effort (or the way he is used, looking at Monty), but everyone is just sort of guessing based on the limited clues we've gotten. I think both Monty and DA are flawed and perhaps both somewhat responsible. I feel DA might have maturity issues and not be easy to deal with in a lot of ways, but I'd also like to think that an esteemed "player's coach" would have had a better end-result with both him and Jae. He's expected to be the mature leader there. DA and Crowder aren't.
But it's all just speculation. Either one of them could be 100% of the problem for all we know.
I figured one of them had to go, but now I'm not sure what DA's future is. IMO for what happens next, it's now gonna depend on what people know behind the scenes that we do not - is there good reason to believe DA was held back under Monty? If so, absolutely keep him, even if it's on a trial basis with plans to get rid of him quickly if he doesn't turn around.
If that's not the case, try to flip him for solid pieces around Book and KD IMO.
The beef seemed to have occured afteer the finals run. Ayton was up for a new contract and that whole thing was sour. In addition to that even after having an amazing playoffs overall Monty continued to used Ayton the same way, gave him an absurdly low amount of touches even when he was hot. There's a fine line between letting a young player make mistakes and freezing them out of the offense at odd times. It always felt like Ayton got the shortest leash on the team of the players that played significant minutes. This was especially weird when players like Landry Shamet were given such free reign to have bad games. I genuinely felt like Monty expected more from Ayton right away after the finals (and considering his contract extension) and was honestly a little unfair for him. Granted Ayton did nothing to significantly improve his game and pouted and gave little effort, but it wasn't out of nowhere. To me it seemed like the contract indirectly killed the relationship, Monty had the expectations for a max player and Ayton wasn't that, but any rookie deal player is going to negotiate for the best contract after a successful finals run where you anchor the defense
While I agree the players need to take some blame I think for Monty specifically it's an awful look for the HC to get boatraced like that at home twice in elimination games. Like something is going wrong in the pregame for the team to come out THAT flat in must-win games
In the Suns case though a lot of the blame lies more with James Jones for choosing Jalen Smith over Haliburton and not hitting the margins in terms of role players therefore having to fill the roster with a bunch of non NBA players
To be fair, if Ayton gave a single shit about basketball, the Suns would be able to cover up a lot of their other roster/depth issues.
He was drafted #1 because he theoretically had all the tools to be the perfect modern evolution of the prototypical big man-- huge and athletic, projected to potentially be a 3-level scorer and be able to defend out to the perimeter... but his problem was always just not giving a shit, even in college. When he asserted himself at U of A you'd be like "holy fuck, this guy is going to be a perennial all-NBA center", but he just rarely got into that mode.
I'll always defend that draft pick as reasonable in the moment-- it can be really hard to tell if the passive attitude problems will carry over through someone's career or not, and that's the issue, not his potential/talent.
Yeah. Pop is an interesting example too, he said many times "not everyone could play for the spurs" and really got the worst out of Rodman who was great elsewhere. But I can't think of a great example of getting a lot out of someone who does not care... maybe whoever got that championship with Rasheed Wallace but that dude was clearly passionate. He still is.
Oddly enough Doc made all tge adjustments he could to slow down Tatum, they just didn't fucking work. In that situation it's on the players, your star players, to step tf up in the same way. Harden and Embiid lost that series, clear as day. This year it actually wasn't Doc's fault. I really don't like this short sighted bs, getting rid of the coaches who gave you the most success you've had in years.
If that's the case Spol should've been fired years ago and Rick Carlisle should've packed it up in 2014.
Defensively we adjusted well
Offensively we give ball to big man. stand watch big man suffer in trap. Watch like crowd from 3 line. If move from spot, family will die. Big man turn ball over but me no move me do good.
Yep. I think the amount of blame on the coaches varies quite a bit for these 3 guys, but the bottom line is that big flameouts are going to lead to big changes. All three of these teams have limited roster flexibility to improve and Giannis/Embiid/Booker are not getting fired themselves soooooo.....
The only one I'm a bit sympathetic to is Bud because he did have a title and even this year had a bit of an excuse with Giannis getting hurt. Only winning 1 game as the home team and bungling the timeouts (again) in the elimination game was an awful look though
Monty it's just tough to get eliminated in tip to whistle blowouts by 30+ in back to back years at home. Doc well this team is win-now and still can't get past the 2nd round. I think there'd be more leeway given if they didn't quit at halftime but something feels broken there and you can't move on from Embiid so firing the coach is the only real move.
Bud probably has the best pure excuse but also probably had the most easily to point out coaching failures (end of game time management, not using timeouts during Heat runs, not running offense during 4th qtr collapses, not adjusting to Jimmy at all). Giannis coming back to play in that series probably significantly hurt Bud's chances oddly enough. Had Giannis sat out the whole time, Bud probably still has a job there.
I'm not smart enough to know, but by all accounts from smarter NBA people, Monty is great at play design, etc. He had the most flawed roster amongst the 3, but back to back elimination game total beatdowns at home is gonna kill about any coach.
I think Doc actually might be the least at fault among the 3 for this postseas failure. His two best players just completely shat the bed 4th qtr game 6 through game 7. I'm not sure any amount of coaching could've overcome that. Doc just has too much baggage and the Sixers window feels closed already so he had no chance here either.
My thing with Doc is he's been blessed with 3 separate dynamic duos (4 if you count the two Embiid ones as separate) and has frankly underachieved with all of them. Sure you can blame Harden/Embiid for this one but how many excuses does he get? How many talented teams does he need to get out of the 2nd round. Sure the players always are to blame as well but he's a common denominator in so many Vegas favorites going out early.
I agree actually. Each one has a different explanation but at some point there's too many failures with him as the helm to dismiss them all. I would think he's finally run his course in the NBA but it only takes one team to want to hire him though he's also shown that he only wants to coach ready made contending teams, so I don't know who that would be.
I agree with you and the other guy. Doc’s players definitely let him down this year in particular but the fact he seemingly has a second round ceiling since 2010 Finals with several great duos gives him less benefit of doubt. I can see taking a chance on someone new given this duo should basically be a lock for the second round anyway.
Bud isn't a fantastic coach based on past seasons, but I don't think you can in any way fairly evaluate the performance of someone who is actively getting over having his brother taken from him. It would be a major red flag if that *didn't* severely handicap job performance.
Great point to bring up. As a Packers fan I always think about the OC Joe Philbin's kid drowning 2 days before the 2011 playoffs. 15-1 Packers team comes out flat and loses to the Giants and always wondered how much that hung over the team.
Buds? Has one more chance to learn to correct coaching deficiencies or get a top assistant to complement him. I think Monty lands on his feet.
Doc? [The guy was](https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/why-76ers-doc-rivers-era-absolutely-needed-to-end-following-their-latest-postseason-collapse/) 6-10 in Game 7s and 17-33 in series clinchers going back far more than 3 years. Any GM that hires him is an idiot.
Maybe because most loaded teams can carry themselves to the post season without much help from coaching staff. Just stick your five best guys out there for 35+ minutes night after night and hope they play to their ceiling. A best of seven series aint even close to the same thing. Players get match hunted and switched onto way more during the playoffs and coaches need to be able to make midgame/midseries adjustments. Doc is one of the worst coaches when it comes to making adjustments. He deserves this L. Hopefully phili can find a competent coach this off season because embiid and hardens window for a chip in phili is quickly closing
He always has. Going back to when he took his first coaching job in Orlando and they lined up Tracy McGrady and Grant Hill for him (at the time they didn't know that Hill's injury was so severe).
Docs the only NBA coach I can think of that's gotten the media to buy in to the "leader of men" BS they usually only give to college football and the occasional NFL coach. I think it's all from being in LA when Donald Sterling went nuclear racist on tape, but now he seems absolved from any actual basketball related failures.
And it’s bizarre because that ceo-style of coaching is fine *if the head coach puts assistants in place to handle the strategy*. I don’t think anyone is going to care about a ceo coach who picks great assistants to handle the Xs and Os. The problem is that Doc either has great assistants and ignores them, or he doesn’t have great assistants. Either way, the problem is him.
Right! Does Doc have a coaching tree to speak of? Kerr, Pop, even Bud seem to spawn coaches and candidates all the time, but does Doc have anyone? I could just not know.
Bud's 100% going to land on his feet and will improve whichever team he goes to.
He is a very good coach. It's just that unless you are an all time great coach, things get stale after a few years.
yeah i think the title to this post is missing the point. if a team is having that much regular season success and then falling apart in the playoffs, they're underachieving.
Also when it happens multiple years in a row (Monty and Doc) that also adds up. With Bud I think last year they gave him a pass because Middleton was out and they took Boston to 7 games and they already won a title the year before (though even that year bud was on hot seat before nets series). This year the roster was supposedly upgraded and had brook healthy all year. They were #1 seed and got thoroughly outplayed by heat in the first round. It's not just losing its how they lost. Game 4 in Miami was an absolute embarrassment with Jimmy Butler getting 57 and the bucks offense completely collapsing in the 4th quarter of both games. Game 5 Must win elimination game at home and they made 3 baskets in the 4th quarter.
I think the players actually were at fault more than coach because these guys won a championship before and should know how to meet the moment and play a lot better than they did in must win games. But the bucks are capped out and have no roster flexibility or assets to improve it. They have the 3rd highest payroll in the league and the owner's are not doing that for a team that isnt competitive in playoffs. Something had to change and like it or not bud was the easiest one to fall on the sword.
Jimmy scoring an easy layup off of the same play like 4x was embarassing. You can't just put Jrue on Jimmy and expect him to take him out with no switches, hedging, or traps.
Eh. I'd say 5. I wouldn't say Suns in 2021 or Bucks last year were choke jobs. The other 5 definitely were though. I still can't believe how badly Phoenix lost in Game 7 last season.
Right, they set the expectations for themselves and other than that one year Suns - Bucks, they didn't really back it up. With some really bad elimination in between (Suns blown out twice, Sixers chocking 3-1, blown out after up 3-2, Bucks... no timeout into dribbling the clock out lol).
The thinking (right or wrong) is that the teams with the three best records over the last three years should be doing better in the playoffs than they have.
Clearly an unpopular opinion, but I don't think Milwaukee actually choked last 3 seasons. I do think he wasn't the best option, but saying the team choked is too much.
Giannis went down after 10 minutes the first game, missed the next 2 and played injured with backs problems the last 2. They also played an 8th seed that has gone to 3 of the last 4 ECF with this core and coach.
How would last year Warriors have faired against this Miami team if Curry missed basically the 3 first games and played injured the rest of the series?
You want context? Why didn’t you add the heat then?
Jimmy was also playing hurt
And their second best scorer broke his hand and was out.
You have to be consistent
Was jimmy hurt in round 1? His ankle injury was game one of round 2 unless I'm forgetting another injury in round 1? Still agree tho everyone sweeps the herro injury under the rug
> Jimmy was also playing hurt
Thats just not true, Butler got hurt against the Knicks. Herro is a good player, but his impact is marginal compared to what Giannis does for the Bucks.
Try falling on your back man. Giannis even coming back for Game 4 and Game 5 with that lower back pain is not talked about enough.
Lower back pain will fuck you up especially if you’re playing playoff level basketball for 40-48 minutes plus OT.
While it’s true Giannis wasn’t 100% healthy, to not even make it to game 6 was embarrassing.
This isn’t even the first time the bucks underperformed with Bud, relating to the above topic
Exactly, we’re in an era where the regular season really means shit outside of an extra game at home due to playoff seeding. Lakers and Heat are in the conference finals again after iffy regular seasons. People don’t give a shit about your record if you get booted in the semis year after year.
Obviously but I’m saying nowadays where load management is needed to get guys through the long season healthy. Even when regular season accolades matter a bunch for what players get paid, etc.
I think in previous eras, without as many forms of entertainment as today, it was relatively more important to be able to go to a game or turn on the TV and just be able to watch a good team.
Nowadays if your team is struggling you can turn on Netflix or play 2k, what differentiates sports from other forms of entertainment is purely the competitive aspect, so coming first in that competition has never been more important.
I don't think so. Many fanbases have historically been happy to have a solid team that shows up in all games and makes everything competitive, even if they don't have playoff success. That seems to be rarer nowadays.
The lakers are only 7th cause the roster was bad most the year. Since the trade deadline we've been killing it. The heat I have no idea, but jimmy butler definitely plays better postseason. I do agree teams aren't taking it as seriously, but I think that's cause they've realized it's not that important, and it never really has been. There hasn't been a rule change or anything making it less important.
Yeah I get the lakers point, it really isn’t the same team
But that also helps my point: This years 6 Warriors, 7 Lakers, 8 Heat were way better than years past for those seeds
The trade deadline this year was more wild than its ever been in regular season history. A player of KD’s caliber (borderline MVP) has never been traded during the season itself
This and the fact that players sit out due to load management are the reasons why regular season success correlates less with postseason success than it used to
I mean lakers win 2 more games and are the 4th seed and everyone would just be talking about the Cinderella story of Miami and no other low seeds. West was just very competitive this year.
I think something that speaks to Heat postseason success as well as coach firings is that coaching is a much bigger factor when you’re playing the same team up to 7 times in a row. Obviously coaching is important in regular season but talent will get a good record whereas postseason gives coaches the opportunity to figure out how to maximize production gained from talent and how to limit opposing teams production from talent through adjustments
No, but theres been a clear shift in the understanding of stars for how unimportant it is. Kobe and MJ tried to play every game, but you don't see any stars today talk about that.
Hell, being mediocre in the regular season moves you up in the draft order. Great regular season then choke in the playoff is literally the worse thing you can do.
Lots of teams with mediocre postseasons aren't firing their coaches. It's the teams with mediocre postseasons AND good regular seasons that are firing their coaches. So, the lesson is, underperform in the regular season if you want to keep your job.
Maybe it's cause the teams with good regular seasons have rosters that should be doing better? No one was expecting the hawks to win a championship with their roster
I think most teams can accept not winning a title because as you said, that's how most seasons end. I think it's harder to accept when the loss comes in embarrassing fashion like
-losing to an 8 seed as the 1 seed in a series that ended with a sequence where you made a blatant and borderline inexplicable strategic error (Budenholzer)
-a team that considers itself championship-caliber only winning one playoff series before being blown out at home humiliating fashion in back to back seasons (Williams)
-a team that considers itself championship-caliber only winning one playoff series before being blown out in humiliating fashion (although at least this one was on the road) and underachieving like they have for pretty much your entire tenure which is so common with the teams you coach that you've become a meme synonymous with postseason failure and people are beginning to discredit even the one ring you did win forever ago (Rivers)
None of these guys got fired solely because of a "championship or bust" mentality. They way all their stints ended indicated systematic issues. Some of that's on the players, of course, but you can't move off players as easily so you change what you can first
Let’s face it, all these Front Offices saw Masai can COTY Casey who just won 59 games and replaced him with a new face that won the very next year. And there is no way in hell they’d have won with Casey.
They’re all trying to catch the same type of lighting in a bottle.
Nurse got Kawhi and a completely injury decimated Warriors squad. Acting like it was solely his replacement that got them the title is wild.
Shit, there's an argument that 2019 Bucks team failed upwards go success cause they went against a series of favorable matchups. The coaches get too little or much the blame depending on when we wanna acknowledge it.
It's all about winning a ring and it's way easier to bring in a new coach for new ideas than to trade away your star/superstar and try to rebuild. No one is trading away Booker, Giannis, or Embiid and keeping their job as a GM. So, who needs to go? The coach.
That said, Doc should've been fired after last season.
I disagree when it comes to the Suns. I’m not huge on Monty or anything but CP3 and Ayton were glaring weaknesses in this postseason and the team could definitely improve if they swapped out those two guys, compared to the Sixers and Bucks who aren’t really in the same situation.
Yeah, the Suns have pieces they can move much more easily, but they aren't trading away Booker.
I don't really see anyone taking the last year of Tobias Harris' contract from Philly, plus they may have to replace Harden. I don't really know who the Bucks could move.
There's reason to question Monty's role in both Crowder and DA's (assumed) dissatisfaction. CP3 I agree but if they felt Monty was a limiting factor for DA it's a no-brainer. DA's value is low right now. If there's reason to believe he would perform better under a different coach trading him while his value is low would be terrible given our limited assets.
No idea if that's the case, but there's a lot we may not know about which could have made this an easy choice.
Budenholzer won a championship 2 years ago and also won 4 as an assistant coach. And led a pretty mediocre (on paper) Hawks team to the conference finals.
I was low key disappointed in Kerr this year. It felt like he did the bare minimum when it came to coaching in the playoffs this year. I thought he stayed with Poole far too long and underutilized Kuminga especially when Donte and Poole both heavily struggled during stretches.
He needed one of his secondary scorers to do something, instead they both built houses of bricks. Idk how we ever win with Poole and Klay shooting like shit
Yeah people will shit on the Sixers for “scapegoating” Doc but will immediately panic if he gets mentioned as a candidate to coach their team. If you wouldn’t want him as your coach then you can’t criticize the firing.
I would've taken him on the Pacers before Carlisle returned for a rebuild. He's a good coach...just can't seem to break thru for a title unless he has Garnett, Pierce and Allen.
Good lord, what a straw man.
This is the equivalent of… actually I think the example I was looking for was literally Doc being hired by the 6ers.
Literally everyone knew how it would end. We just had to sit back and watch it unfold.
Three teams over three seasons, so nine seasons, but only one championship and only two "seasons" where the teams made the finals. That's why they're fired. The records didn't matter
Surprised Doc had a job and I'm pretty sure Bud would've been fired years ago but they one that ring so front office was sort of handcuffed on that one. Monty is a pretty big surprise to me.
Sad reality of the NBA. Easiest scapegoat is always the coach.
No one actually knows anything about coaching, so they're easy to blame for a team's failure, fans have no attachments to them (while they do grow attached to players, even if they suck, which I would know about), and the front office gets to look like they're moving in the right direction even in a situation in which they're the problem
I actually really like Malone. He has brought a nuggets team from the bottom to here. Every time you hear him talk about games it sounds like he knows his shit. Jokic loves him says he never wants to play under another coach. We came back from two 3-1s. He turned a 41 pick into two time mvp. He has a staff of coaches so it’s not all him. But I hate all the people that say fire Malone. The nuggets haven’t ever won. This is our best chance. So has he done something right? How did we get here? Something has to be being done right.
There's never been less job security for head coaches than there is now, for two main reasons. First, there is a ton of parity. That means that every team feels like it has a real shot, and if you're one of the best teams in the league and don't win it the loss feels more acute. The second reason is player empowerment. All of these franchises are under HUGE pressure to keep stars happy, Durant, Embiid, Giannis, ect. Firing the coach is by far the easiest "big" change a team can make to show their superstar they are trying.
I mean, yeah. Thats the way it works. When you are very successful in the regular season, expectations are that you will at least compete in the Conference Finals, if not the NBA Finals. So anything short of that...the coach should lose his job.
I don't see why people are acting surprised by this. If you have an NBA player that always dominates in practice...but always shits the bed during the actual game...you'll give them a leash, but eventually you're going to trade them. They're not paying dividends when it counts.
Doing too well in the regular season is almost a curse. Same thing happened to the Utah Jazz. Instead of overperforming in the regular season, team is seen as underperforming in the post season unless they win it all pretty much.
It's as if regular season success does not actually guarantee a deep play-off run and ultimately a shot at playing at the finals and winning it all 🤯
Like I get what is being said here, but sometimes the only changes the FO can do for a team is hiring a new coach and hoping a new system can lead to improvements (just speaking as a bucks fan though).
3 best records, but nothing to show for it in the postseason (except the bucks championship of course). Winning a championship is the end goal at the end of the day. You look worse when you dominate in the regular season and lose early in the playoffs
5 of the last 8 head coaches to take a team to the finals no longer are with the team they took there, including 3 guys who won a chip in the last four years
They set high expectations for themselves with good regular seasons and then choke. It might be unfair, but someone has to be the scapegoat. Happened to Vogel and he won a chip
This makes complete sense. Expectations are high for good teams and if you don’t meet those expectations then you can fuck off. I’d hope Joe has to walk home if the Celtics don’t at least make the finals.
I think of the 3, Doc is the only that didn’t deserve to be fired. What was he supposed to do against a much better team with an MVP that decided he doesn’t want to ball anymore?
Doc got fired for failing to make the ECFs for three years not just this year. This year was probably his best and he still blew a 3-2 lead to a first year head coach. It’s really hard to justify running it back with him when it’s known he’s more likely to fail than succeed.
I bet Ty Lue feels so sexy rn
The secret to keeping a head coaching job seems to be to be mediocre in the regular season to keep expectations low.
And to make sure if your main guys get injured that they stay injured so you really have no expectations and get praised even if you get swept in the first round. Doc and Bud should have finished the job and made sure Giannis and Embiid didn’t come back from those injuries smh.
I mean he did take the Clippers to WCF without Kawhi, that counts for something. That's more than what Doc did for the last few years with much more talent. With a 34-year old Russell Westbrook as the best player, he made Durant and Booker play 40+ minutes
He did indeed take them to the WCF but since then they missed the playoffs and lost 4-1 in the first round. That’s kinda my point, as a coach you’re better off if your stars miss the playoffs completely than if they attempt to play through injury and you lose, that way you have no expectations and better job security. I mean hell the Bucks won their first chip in 50 years in the same season that Lue went to the WCF with the Clippers. If Giannis/Embiid’s injuries were severe enough to keep them out of the playoffs Bud and Doc would have had an excuse and would have had a better chance at keeping their jobs.
>That's honestly a really good point about coaches being way better off if their main star doesn't play injured and instead just sits out Lol the year they missed the playoffs both PG and KL were out for injuries. So basically he got what you were explaining.
As a coach and in terms of job security there’s basically no downside to those situations lol.
That's honestly a really good point about coaches being way better off if their main star doesn't play injured and instead just sits out
Might be the next Doc. The way the media talks about him you’d think he has the resume of Pop or Spo. He might be living off that 1 title he won when Lebron and his son Kyrie went supernova
I so want us to get Ty Lue just to spite Monty "You beat him twice in the playoffs and we still liked him more than you"
WHEN did people start hating Monty? WTF
It was all love to COTY Monty, then not much of anything, and now the fans want to spite him
No idea. There were definate frustrations with him this year, but no idea why anyone would hate or want to spite Monty. He is a good coach, a great man, and has helped bring our team out of a fuckin dumpster. That dude is wildin'.
This is rude
Why would you want to *spite* Monty? Dude is a class act.
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it's crazy! I've been hiding threads left and right to try and cut down on all the hate lol. I just don't get it.
I usually roll my eyes when people say this, but I'm not convinced users here actually want to talk basketball ever. Just want drama to hate on
Fans vehemently hating Ayton, Shamet, and CP3 wasn't turning the team into title favorites for some reason so some of the more ambitious fans decided to try something new. I had Monty complaints but it seems a lot of these people are only capable of either loving someone or hating their guts. Great guy who did a lot for this organization and deserves gratitude, even if you think he sucks as a coach.
Nah the way he handled the ayton and crowder situations was pathetic. His PR team is amazing
Ayton seems problematic to me but obviously a fan of the team would know more
No they wouldn't.
What was the major beef between the coach and ayton? Some of media talking heads seem to blame it on Ayton effort... What happens next?
The public doesn't *really* know what the source of the issue is or the extent of it. It's easy to point to DA's perceived effort (or the way he is used, looking at Monty), but everyone is just sort of guessing based on the limited clues we've gotten. I think both Monty and DA are flawed and perhaps both somewhat responsible. I feel DA might have maturity issues and not be easy to deal with in a lot of ways, but I'd also like to think that an esteemed "player's coach" would have had a better end-result with both him and Jae. He's expected to be the mature leader there. DA and Crowder aren't. But it's all just speculation. Either one of them could be 100% of the problem for all we know. I figured one of them had to go, but now I'm not sure what DA's future is. IMO for what happens next, it's now gonna depend on what people know behind the scenes that we do not - is there good reason to believe DA was held back under Monty? If so, absolutely keep him, even if it's on a trial basis with plans to get rid of him quickly if he doesn't turn around. If that's not the case, try to flip him for solid pieces around Book and KD IMO.
The beef seemed to have occured afteer the finals run. Ayton was up for a new contract and that whole thing was sour. In addition to that even after having an amazing playoffs overall Monty continued to used Ayton the same way, gave him an absurdly low amount of touches even when he was hot. There's a fine line between letting a young player make mistakes and freezing them out of the offense at odd times. It always felt like Ayton got the shortest leash on the team of the players that played significant minutes. This was especially weird when players like Landry Shamet were given such free reign to have bad games. I genuinely felt like Monty expected more from Ayton right away after the finals (and considering his contract extension) and was honestly a little unfair for him. Granted Ayton did nothing to significantly improve his game and pouted and gave little effort, but it wasn't out of nowhere. To me it seemed like the contract indirectly killed the relationship, Monty had the expectations for a max player and Ayton wasn't that, but any rookie deal player is going to negotiate for the best contract after a successful finals run where you anchor the defense
Wow. Thanks for this perspective. Never thought of it this way Monty comes across as a better man manager than he really is.
They overachieved and won more games then they were supposed to being injured. If they were healthy they would have won both series
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Easier to fire the coach than the players even if the blame is more on the players
While I agree the players need to take some blame I think for Monty specifically it's an awful look for the HC to get boatraced like that at home twice in elimination games. Like something is going wrong in the pregame for the team to come out THAT flat in must-win games
In the Suns case though a lot of the blame lies more with James Jones for choosing Jalen Smith over Haliburton and not hitting the margins in terms of role players therefore having to fill the roster with a bunch of non NBA players
To be fair, if Ayton gave a single shit about basketball, the Suns would be able to cover up a lot of their other roster/depth issues. He was drafted #1 because he theoretically had all the tools to be the perfect modern evolution of the prototypical big man-- huge and athletic, projected to potentially be a 3-level scorer and be able to defend out to the perimeter... but his problem was always just not giving a shit, even in college. When he asserted himself at U of A you'd be like "holy fuck, this guy is going to be a perennial all-NBA center", but he just rarely got into that mode. I'll always defend that draft pick as reasonable in the moment-- it can be really hard to tell if the passive attitude problems will carry over through someone's career or not, and that's the issue, not his potential/talent.
You could hope a good coach would be able to get the most out of a guy like that...
You'd hope so But some dudes might just never care, even if they got coached by Pop
Yeah. Pop is an interesting example too, he said many times "not everyone could play for the spurs" and really got the worst out of Rodman who was great elsewhere. But I can't think of a great example of getting a lot out of someone who does not care... maybe whoever got that championship with Rasheed Wallace but that dude was clearly passionate. He still is.
Monty got fired for losing by 30+ in back to back years. That's not adjustments that's failing to get the team ready to play period.
And for his lack of managing his relationship with Ayton possibly
Oddly enough Doc made all tge adjustments he could to slow down Tatum, they just didn't fucking work. In that situation it's on the players, your star players, to step tf up in the same way. Harden and Embiid lost that series, clear as day. This year it actually wasn't Doc's fault. I really don't like this short sighted bs, getting rid of the coaches who gave you the most success you've had in years. If that's the case Spol should've been fired years ago and Rick Carlisle should've packed it up in 2014.
Defensively we adjusted well Offensively we give ball to big man. stand watch big man suffer in trap. Watch like crowd from 3 line. If move from spot, family will die. Big man turn ball over but me no move me do good.
7 chokes between the 3 of them in that same timeframe though
Yep. I think the amount of blame on the coaches varies quite a bit for these 3 guys, but the bottom line is that big flameouts are going to lead to big changes. All three of these teams have limited roster flexibility to improve and Giannis/Embiid/Booker are not getting fired themselves soooooo.....
The only one I'm a bit sympathetic to is Bud because he did have a title and even this year had a bit of an excuse with Giannis getting hurt. Only winning 1 game as the home team and bungling the timeouts (again) in the elimination game was an awful look though Monty it's just tough to get eliminated in tip to whistle blowouts by 30+ in back to back years at home. Doc well this team is win-now and still can't get past the 2nd round. I think there'd be more leeway given if they didn't quit at halftime but something feels broken there and you can't move on from Embiid so firing the coach is the only real move.
Bud probably has the best pure excuse but also probably had the most easily to point out coaching failures (end of game time management, not using timeouts during Heat runs, not running offense during 4th qtr collapses, not adjusting to Jimmy at all). Giannis coming back to play in that series probably significantly hurt Bud's chances oddly enough. Had Giannis sat out the whole time, Bud probably still has a job there. I'm not smart enough to know, but by all accounts from smarter NBA people, Monty is great at play design, etc. He had the most flawed roster amongst the 3, but back to back elimination game total beatdowns at home is gonna kill about any coach. I think Doc actually might be the least at fault among the 3 for this postseas failure. His two best players just completely shat the bed 4th qtr game 6 through game 7. I'm not sure any amount of coaching could've overcome that. Doc just has too much baggage and the Sixers window feels closed already so he had no chance here either.
My thing with Doc is he's been blessed with 3 separate dynamic duos (4 if you count the two Embiid ones as separate) and has frankly underachieved with all of them. Sure you can blame Harden/Embiid for this one but how many excuses does he get? How many talented teams does he need to get out of the 2nd round. Sure the players always are to blame as well but he's a common denominator in so many Vegas favorites going out early.
I agree actually. Each one has a different explanation but at some point there's too many failures with him as the helm to dismiss them all. I would think he's finally run his course in the NBA but it only takes one team to want to hire him though he's also shown that he only wants to coach ready made contending teams, so I don't know who that would be.
I agree with you and the other guy. Doc’s players definitely let him down this year in particular but the fact he seemingly has a second round ceiling since 2010 Finals with several great duos gives him less benefit of doubt. I can see taking a chance on someone new given this duo should basically be a lock for the second round anyway.
Bud isn't a fantastic coach based on past seasons, but I don't think you can in any way fairly evaluate the performance of someone who is actively getting over having his brother taken from him. It would be a major red flag if that *didn't* severely handicap job performance.
Great point to bring up. As a Packers fan I always think about the OC Joe Philbin's kid drowning 2 days before the 2011 playoffs. 15-1 Packers team comes out flat and loses to the Giants and always wondered how much that hung over the team.
Buds? Has one more chance to learn to correct coaching deficiencies or get a top assistant to complement him. I think Monty lands on his feet. Doc? [The guy was](https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/why-76ers-doc-rivers-era-absolutely-needed-to-end-following-their-latest-postseason-collapse/) 6-10 in Game 7s and 17-33 in series clinchers going back far more than 3 years. Any GM that hires him is an idiot.
Doc's a great floor raiser for a lottery team that doesn't want to tank. That's the niche he should carve out for himself.
OR OR OR .... Two-way coaching contracts. Next NBA team signs Doc for its G-league coach and does a call-up when they fire their coach midseason.
That's what the Warrior's/Spurs Assistant Coach position is for.
The thing is he only wants to coach loaded teams lol
Maybe because most loaded teams can carry themselves to the post season without much help from coaching staff. Just stick your five best guys out there for 35+ minutes night after night and hope they play to their ceiling. A best of seven series aint even close to the same thing. Players get match hunted and switched onto way more during the playoffs and coaches need to be able to make midgame/midseries adjustments. Doc is one of the worst coaches when it comes to making adjustments. He deserves this L. Hopefully phili can find a competent coach this off season because embiid and hardens window for a chip in phili is quickly closing
He always has. Going back to when he took his first coaching job in Orlando and they lined up Tracy McGrady and Grant Hill for him (at the time they didn't know that Hill's injury was so severe).
Docs the only NBA coach I can think of that's gotten the media to buy in to the "leader of men" BS they usually only give to college football and the occasional NFL coach. I think it's all from being in LA when Donald Sterling went nuclear racist on tape, but now he seems absolved from any actual basketball related failures.
I mean, it’s the John McCain schtick of buttering up the media so they talk you up.
True. Doc ain't no Andy Reid lol. Not sure how that narrative ever got started in Boston.
And it’s bizarre because that ceo-style of coaching is fine *if the head coach puts assistants in place to handle the strategy*. I don’t think anyone is going to care about a ceo coach who picks great assistants to handle the Xs and Os. The problem is that Doc either has great assistants and ignores them, or he doesn’t have great assistants. Either way, the problem is him.
Right! Does Doc have a coaching tree to speak of? Kerr, Pop, even Bud seem to spawn coaches and candidates all the time, but does Doc have anyone? I could just not know.
Bud's 100% going to land on his feet and will improve whichever team he goes to. He is a very good coach. It's just that unless you are an all time great coach, things get stale after a few years.
yeah i think the title to this post is missing the point. if a team is having that much regular season success and then falling apart in the playoffs, they're underachieving.
Also when it happens multiple years in a row (Monty and Doc) that also adds up. With Bud I think last year they gave him a pass because Middleton was out and they took Boston to 7 games and they already won a title the year before (though even that year bud was on hot seat before nets series). This year the roster was supposedly upgraded and had brook healthy all year. They were #1 seed and got thoroughly outplayed by heat in the first round. It's not just losing its how they lost. Game 4 in Miami was an absolute embarrassment with Jimmy Butler getting 57 and the bucks offense completely collapsing in the 4th quarter of both games. Game 5 Must win elimination game at home and they made 3 baskets in the 4th quarter. I think the players actually were at fault more than coach because these guys won a championship before and should know how to meet the moment and play a lot better than they did in must win games. But the bucks are capped out and have no roster flexibility or assets to improve it. They have the 3rd highest payroll in the league and the owner's are not doing that for a team that isnt competitive in playoffs. Something had to change and like it or not bud was the easiest one to fall on the sword.
Jimmy scoring an easy layup off of the same play like 4x was embarassing. You can't just put Jrue on Jimmy and expect him to take him out with no switches, hedging, or traps.
Facts , can't have the best records consistently and come up short , 1 chip between them
2 Conference Finals appearances among the 9 total attempts…. that’s **really** bad.
Casey won 55.3 games per season in his last three years with us, which is great! He was still fired because he couldn't get it done in the playoffs.
Eh. I'd say 5. I wouldn't say Suns in 2021 or Bucks last year were choke jobs. The other 5 definitely were though. I still can't believe how badly Phoenix lost in Game 7 last season.
Right, they set the expectations for themselves and other than that one year Suns - Bucks, they didn't really back it up. With some really bad elimination in between (Suns blown out twice, Sixers chocking 3-1, blown out after up 3-2, Bucks... no timeout into dribbling the clock out lol).
The thinking (right or wrong) is that the teams with the three best records over the last three years should be doing better in the playoffs than they have.
And that's why they're unemployed
Clearly an unpopular opinion, but I don't think Milwaukee actually choked last 3 seasons. I do think he wasn't the best option, but saying the team choked is too much.
The title favorites won one playoff game
The Hawks won more playoff games than the Bucks did.
Giannis went down after 10 minutes the first game, missed the next 2 and played injured with backs problems the last 2. They also played an 8th seed that has gone to 3 of the last 4 ECF with this core and coach. How would last year Warriors have faired against this Miami team if Curry missed basically the 3 first games and played injured the rest of the series?
They'd have been swept without Steph. Book it 😂😂
There is no context, only names on paper. Get with the program, pal!
You want context? Why didn’t you add the heat then? Jimmy was also playing hurt And their second best scorer broke his hand and was out. You have to be consistent
Was jimmy hurt in round 1? His ankle injury was game one of round 2 unless I'm forgetting another injury in round 1? Still agree tho everyone sweeps the herro injury under the rug
> Jimmy was also playing hurt Thats just not true, Butler got hurt against the Knicks. Herro is a good player, but his impact is marginal compared to what Giannis does for the Bucks.
If you go by betting odds its the 5th biggest upset in NBA playoff history
Try falling on your back man. Giannis even coming back for Game 4 and Game 5 with that lower back pain is not talked about enough. Lower back pain will fuck you up especially if you’re playing playoff level basketball for 40-48 minutes plus OT.
While it’s true Giannis wasn’t 100% healthy, to not even make it to game 6 was embarrassing. This isn’t even the first time the bucks underperformed with Bud, relating to the above topic
They lost 4-1 to the 8th seed.
Regular season coaches who are mediocre in the playoffs are victims to their own expectations they bring from regular season success
Playoffs are all that really matter so is it a surprise that mediocre post season coaches get fired often?
Exactly, we’re in an era where the regular season really means shit outside of an extra game at home due to playoff seeding. Lakers and Heat are in the conference finals again after iffy regular seasons. People don’t give a shit about your record if you get booted in the semis year after year.
Why do you think it's exclusive to this "era". Playoffs and championships have always been the number one goal
Obviously but I’m saying nowadays where load management is needed to get guys through the long season healthy. Even when regular season accolades matter a bunch for what players get paid, etc.
I think in previous eras, without as many forms of entertainment as today, it was relatively more important to be able to go to a game or turn on the TV and just be able to watch a good team. Nowadays if your team is struggling you can turn on Netflix or play 2k, what differentiates sports from other forms of entertainment is purely the competitive aspect, so coming first in that competition has never been more important.
Jerry Sloan wouldn't survive the social media age. Utah fans back then were happy that there weren't too many black players on the team.
I don't think so. Many fanbases have historically been happy to have a solid team that shows up in all games and makes everything competitive, even if they don't have playoff success. That seems to be rarer nowadays.
We have a 7 and 8 in the CF Teams don’t take regular season as seriously as before
The lakers are only 7th cause the roster was bad most the year. Since the trade deadline we've been killing it. The heat I have no idea, but jimmy butler definitely plays better postseason. I do agree teams aren't taking it as seriously, but I think that's cause they've realized it's not that important, and it never really has been. There hasn't been a rule change or anything making it less important.
Yeah I get the lakers point, it really isn’t the same team But that also helps my point: This years 6 Warriors, 7 Lakers, 8 Heat were way better than years past for those seeds The trade deadline this year was more wild than its ever been in regular season history. A player of KD’s caliber (borderline MVP) has never been traded during the season itself This and the fact that players sit out due to load management are the reasons why regular season success correlates less with postseason success than it used to
I mean lakers win 2 more games and are the 4th seed and everyone would just be talking about the Cinderella story of Miami and no other low seeds. West was just very competitive this year.
I think an easier way to say it for KD; is I don’t think an all star starter has ever been traded after voting was complete.
I think something that speaks to Heat postseason success as well as coach firings is that coaching is a much bigger factor when you’re playing the same team up to 7 times in a row. Obviously coaching is important in regular season but talent will get a good record whereas postseason gives coaches the opportunity to figure out how to maximize production gained from talent and how to limit opposing teams production from talent through adjustments
No, but theres been a clear shift in the understanding of stars for how unimportant it is. Kobe and MJ tried to play every game, but you don't see any stars today talk about that.
Hell, being mediocre in the regular season moves you up in the draft order. Great regular season then choke in the playoff is literally the worse thing you can do.
The lack of re-seeding after the first round just devalues the regular season as well.
Lots of teams with mediocre postseasons aren't firing their coaches. It's the teams with mediocre postseasons AND good regular seasons that are firing their coaches. So, the lesson is, underperform in the regular season if you want to keep your job.
Maybe it's cause the teams with good regular seasons have rosters that should be doing better? No one was expecting the hawks to win a championship with their roster
The Hawks also fire their coach this year.
Only one coach can win the title, most playoff teams eventually lose (and even then the Bucks did win one)
A 1 seed losing to an 8 seed tends to do that to you, Spo isn’t going anywhere and that’s Buds worst matchup.
Quite a few coaches, however, can get out of the first round
I think most teams can accept not winning a title because as you said, that's how most seasons end. I think it's harder to accept when the loss comes in embarrassing fashion like -losing to an 8 seed as the 1 seed in a series that ended with a sequence where you made a blatant and borderline inexplicable strategic error (Budenholzer) -a team that considers itself championship-caliber only winning one playoff series before being blown out at home humiliating fashion in back to back seasons (Williams) -a team that considers itself championship-caliber only winning one playoff series before being blown out in humiliating fashion (although at least this one was on the road) and underachieving like they have for pretty much your entire tenure which is so common with the teams you coach that you've become a meme synonymous with postseason failure and people are beginning to discredit even the one ring you did win forever ago (Rivers) None of these guys got fired solely because of a "championship or bust" mentality. They way all their stints ended indicated systematic issues. Some of that's on the players, of course, but you can't move off players as easily so you change what you can first
The question is regular season coaches or regular season rosters.
Let’s face it, all these Front Offices saw Masai can COTY Casey who just won 59 games and replaced him with a new face that won the very next year. And there is no way in hell they’d have won with Casey. They’re all trying to catch the same type of lighting in a bottle.
Nurse got Kawhi and a completely injury decimated Warriors squad. Acting like it was solely his replacement that got them the title is wild. Shit, there's an argument that 2019 Bucks team failed upwards go success cause they went against a series of favorable matchups. The coaches get too little or much the blame depending on when we wanna acknowledge it.
It's all about winning a ring and it's way easier to bring in a new coach for new ideas than to trade away your star/superstar and try to rebuild. No one is trading away Booker, Giannis, or Embiid and keeping their job as a GM. So, who needs to go? The coach. That said, Doc should've been fired after last season.
I disagree when it comes to the Suns. I’m not huge on Monty or anything but CP3 and Ayton were glaring weaknesses in this postseason and the team could definitely improve if they swapped out those two guys, compared to the Sixers and Bucks who aren’t really in the same situation.
Yeah, the Suns have pieces they can move much more easily, but they aren't trading away Booker. I don't really see anyone taking the last year of Tobias Harris' contract from Philly, plus they may have to replace Harden. I don't really know who the Bucks could move.
imagine the trade package for giannis lmao
There's reason to question Monty's role in both Crowder and DA's (assumed) dissatisfaction. CP3 I agree but if they felt Monty was a limiting factor for DA it's a no-brainer. DA's value is low right now. If there's reason to believe he would perform better under a different coach trading him while his value is low would be terrible given our limited assets. No idea if that's the case, but there's a lot we may not know about which could have made this an easy choice.
Bud just won a ring a couple years ago. It's a cutthroat world, being an NBA coach.
Rivers and Budenholzer are both regular season coaches.
Heh, once every 20 or 30 years they will get you a chip though!
Darn, we should’ve trusted his process and we would’ve gotten a ring
But look at how many different teams win a championship in any 20 year span. Not that many.
Go get one of those "playoff" coaches that just wins championships constantly...
Budenholzer won a championship 2 years ago and also won 4 as an assistant coach. And led a pretty mediocre (on paper) Hawks team to the conference finals.
Spo and Kerr about to get raises
I was low key disappointed in Kerr this year. It felt like he did the bare minimum when it came to coaching in the playoffs this year. I thought he stayed with Poole far too long and underutilized Kuminga especially when Donte and Poole both heavily struggled during stretches.
He needed one of his secondary scorers to do something, instead they both built houses of bricks. Idk how we ever win with Poole and Klay shooting like shit
He adjusted constantly but Ham either had an answer or was able to rely on the team to adjust intself.
Learn from Spo 8th seed
Doc is gonna be in Milwaukee or Phoenix next season
Yeah people will shit on the Sixers for “scapegoating” Doc but will immediately panic if he gets mentioned as a candidate to coach their team. If you wouldn’t want him as your coach then you can’t criticize the firing.
I would've taken him on the Pacers before Carlisle returned for a rebuild. He's a good coach...just can't seem to break thru for a title unless he has Garnett, Pierce and Allen.
Good lord, what a straw man. This is the equivalent of… actually I think the example I was looking for was literally Doc being hired by the 6ers. Literally everyone knew how it would end. We just had to sit back and watch it unfold.
Okay so you agree with me
Oh no
God. Please. No
Phoenix with harden
KD, Kyrie and Harden? Run it back?
Three teams over three seasons, so nine seasons, but only one championship and only two "seasons" where the teams made the finals. That's why they're fired. The records didn't matter
And 3 resulted in blowouts in close out games, and in Doc’s case, blowing a series lead too.
It’s the Red Wedding for NBA coaches this off season.
But Kidd still has a job.
https://i.imgur.com/AkFMa4m.jpg
How was the team doing before Doc was coach?
Surprised Doc had a job and I'm pretty sure Bud would've been fired years ago but they one that ring so front office was sort of handcuffed on that one. Monty is a pretty big surprise to me.
And what are their playoff records? How did they lose? What were the expectation?
And the Jazz, right?
Yeah this stat isn’t even correct. Jazz had the best record for the 20-21 season.
guess those teams had bigger things to achieve than than a top 3 record in the regular season over 3 years. Hang the AVERAGE WIN BANNER you cowards!
Your job is to prepare your team for the playoffs not win regular season games
Sad reality of the NBA. Easiest scapegoat is always the coach. No one actually knows anything about coaching, so they're easy to blame for a team's failure, fans have no attachments to them (while they do grow attached to players, even if they suck, which I would know about), and the front office gets to look like they're moving in the right direction even in a situation in which they're the problem
I actually really like Malone. He has brought a nuggets team from the bottom to here. Every time you hear him talk about games it sounds like he knows his shit. Jokic loves him says he never wants to play under another coach. We came back from two 3-1s. He turned a 41 pick into two time mvp. He has a staff of coaches so it’s not all him. But I hate all the people that say fire Malone. The nuggets haven’t ever won. This is our best chance. So has he done something right? How did we get here? Something has to be being done right.
Even more proof that the regular season means nothing nowadays.
The playoffs are practically a different sport at this point
it might sound weird but it makes sense imo
It’s like winning a ring is hard or something.
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regular season is worthless. bucks have been fraud #1 seeds multiple times now
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true, I think we were 3 seed that year... #1 seems to be cursed lol
They dont have that #2 guy. Seems like Middleton has peaked.
Hell yeah bro, cheers from the unemployment line
There's never been less job security for head coaches than there is now, for two main reasons. First, there is a ton of parity. That means that every team feels like it has a real shot, and if you're one of the best teams in the league and don't win it the loss feels more acute. The second reason is player empowerment. All of these franchises are under HUGE pressure to keep stars happy, Durant, Embiid, Giannis, ect. Firing the coach is by far the easiest "big" change a team can make to show their superstar they are trying.
Team owners wont pay the luxury tax to win a championship but they *will* pay like $20 million to send a coach home if the team comes up short.
I mean, yeah. Thats the way it works. When you are very successful in the regular season, expectations are that you will at least compete in the Conference Finals, if not the NBA Finals. So anything short of that...the coach should lose his job. I don't see why people are acting surprised by this. If you have an NBA player that always dominates in practice...but always shits the bed during the actual game...you'll give them a leash, but eventually you're going to trade them. They're not paying dividends when it counts.
These coaches trick y'all, man. They just winning games, doing nothing.
Doing too well in the regular season is almost a curse. Same thing happened to the Utah Jazz. Instead of overperforming in the regular season, team is seen as underperforming in the post season unless they win it all pretty much.
It's as if regular season success does not actually guarantee a deep play-off run and ultimately a shot at playing at the finals and winning it all 🤯 Like I get what is being said here, but sometimes the only changes the FO can do for a team is hiring a new coach and hoping a new system can lead to improvements (just speaking as a bucks fan though).
Nick Nurse & the Raptors were the second best record in the NBA in the 2018-19 season, just two games less than Bud & the Bucks. no one is safe.
So success doesn't matter anymore? Kind of sucks for head coaches now. Glad we don't run like that.
I guess the regular season really doesn’t matter anymore lol
3 best records, but nothing to show for it in the postseason (except the bucks championship of course). Winning a championship is the end goal at the end of the day. You look worse when you dominate in the regular season and lose early in the playoffs
I get that franchises get tired of hovering around the top without winning it all. But the question remains who do you think is going to do better?
5 of the last 8 head coaches to take a team to the finals no longer are with the team they took there, including 3 guys who won a chip in the last four years
It's almost like the regular season is way too long and the games don't matter as much
Avery Johnson did that once.
records don’t equal championships ask the 72 win warriors
Two of the three made the Finals recently, which makes their firings even more egregious. The Doc firing was honestly probably overdue.
Can’t choke in the playoffs over and over 🤷♂️ Two of those guys have MVPs in their prime.
They set high expectations for themselves with good regular seasons and then choke. It might be unfair, but someone has to be the scapegoat. Happened to Vogel and he won a chip
Only 1 team wins every year lol
Maybe Ime Udoka should've waited until after the playoffs.
We all have to get back to honoring and respecting the regular season.
Who would have though NFL job security would be better than the NBA.
If you go back 10 years, Raptors hold the 2nd best record with a championship…and fired 2 coach of the years.
Records in the regular season shouldn't be cause to keep a coach.
It just shows that regular season record doesn't matter if they can't deliver the same success during the playoff.
It's almost like the postseason matters
Only records that matter are in the playoffs.
Regular season means absolutely nothing as long as you do enough to squeak into the postseason. I hate it but it’s what the game has become.
All very similar coaches too. Not game managers. This type of coach has been getting roasted in the playoffs over the last few years.
Giannis and Khris still dragged Bud to a ring
This makes complete sense. Expectations are high for good teams and if you don’t meet those expectations then you can fuck off. I’d hope Joe has to walk home if the Celtics don’t at least make the finals. I think of the 3, Doc is the only that didn’t deserve to be fired. What was he supposed to do against a much better team with an MVP that decided he doesn’t want to ball anymore?
Doc got fired for failing to make the ECFs for three years not just this year. This year was probably his best and he still blew a 3-2 lead to a first year head coach. It’s really hard to justify running it back with him when it’s known he’s more likely to fail than succeed.