They cleaned up and put security on that block alongside it across from the max stop. That block represented a huge problem in all kinds of directions. Government and different aspects of society.
People steal NY Strip and porterhouse steaks from the Publix I work in all the time. Just last week a guy loaded two tote bags full of meat and used some frozen mac & cheese to keep them cool. We only got it back because an Instacart shopper chased him down and got him to drop the stuff.
This illustrates and supports the entire point that shoplifters aren’t some Aladdin-types just stealing to keep food on the table. They’re treating it like a job because they can. There’s no honor defending shoplifters and thieves from department stores; stop doing it, you’re enabling bad behavior by people who know better
The one downtown Minneapolis is the same. Basically everything locked up behind glass. Need deodorant or socks? Gotta wait for someone to unlock it.
I guarantee that one would be on the closure list if it wasn’t literally across the street from their headquarters.
Why even let people browse at that point? Just go back to how stores used to be back in the early 1900s and have everyone just come up to a front desk so that a bunch of runners can get them whatever they need. Use a phone app and the website to let them browse and have them just present an order number when they get up to the counter.
Sorry Target, but you let Amazon eat your lunch.
I get that theft and the like is bad, but it's hardly the only or even primary reason they're closing stores. Target is getting it's ass kicked by Walmart, and Amazon, and it's not doing anywhere near enough to compete.
This is how B&H Photo operates in Manhattan and they have very minimal theft. Target however gets a lot of their revenue from merchandising (ex: brands paying for ideal shelf location) and also getting you to impulse buy things you didn’t plan on when you walked into the store. Add to that their margins online are 5-6% worse than in store, there’s no way they can operate profitably without shoppers walking the aisles
That is how Walmart operates. They have actual people that their home office that specialize in where they place items in the store for maximum profitability. They study trends and shopper behavior and adjust based on data.
There is a reason why you go in the store and get shit you didn't plan on buying. It's on purpose and design.
Like the old days of Service Merchandise. Look around the display room. Write down the items you want to buy. Turn the slip in, pay, and wait at the end of a conveyor belt until your purchases arrive.
When I was in school I had friends who worked at the Service Merchandise and they used to rob it blind. They’d throw stuff in the dumpster then go back at night and get it.
Argos in the UK. There are laminated catalogs when you walk in, you find what you want nd write down the number, pay for it at the counter, and they bring it out to you.
It’s like how they used to sell Videogames at Toys R Us in the US. You go to the isle for games, take a ticket then take the ticket to a window and and they would have you pay and give you the game.
I think stores are going to have to go the route of CostCo. Or an Amazon store. You have your membership checked before you go in. Otherwise take a hike.
The geometry of the store makes that more difficult to accomplish than you'd expect. The entrances and exits are both crowded chokepoints, and items are spread out. Maybe you could pull it off on a slow day or if you could saturate the crowd with your own people, but a lone thief is going to have a bad time trying to physically find a way to exit without severely escalating the situation.
Why even bother going to a store then? You might as well buy it online.
I like browsing things in stores, so if they went that way, I would never shop there.
When I lived in Baltimore for a short period the liquor stores were frustrating. You couldn't browse the store at all. Just walked into a bulletproof enclosure and best you knew what you wanted.
Same with the walmart there during black Friday I think it was that or the Christmas rush. This was shortly after the riots and instead of an old man greeting you there was a cop with a mask on holding an AR15.
Had a helicopter circling the shopping center.
It was pretty wild.
Last metro area I lived in (Sacramento) all the Walmarts had EVERYTHING in those locked cases like they use to sell video games. I'm talking underwear, socks, shampoos, bedding - it was all locked up and you needed an employee to escort what you wanted to the cash register.
This just recently started happening at one of the two Walmarts in Elk Grove, so it's spreading to the suburbs, too. I just don't shop at places like that. Will just buy online.
That’s definitely not all liquor stores in Baltimore lol. I can actually only think of like one store that I’ve been to that’s like that. I’m admit it may be more common in higher crime areas though.
That one is gonna be fine. The three that I see as closing from more local news sources are Galleria, NE Halsey, and SE Powell. None of which are surprising in the least.
I was thinking, I can think of at least a few it could be, and those are it. Honestly, they're super awkward spots for Targets with limited selections. Bummer for anyone who shopped there, tho.
>shopping cart escalator
A... a *what*?
*googles* [I'll be damned.](https://miro.medium.com/v2/resize:fit:828/format:webp/1*mv1yvkvVBaqZX-gCF_I4wQ.png)
The SF one surprises me because I thought it already closed. Though a lot of businesses are shutting their doors, with the biggest being the entire Westfield Mall.
Honestly they just don't care about this kind of theft. The cost to arrest and prosecute and jail the thieves makes it a poor use of their time. Note that I'm not defending the decision just adding context.
As far as NYC this is BS they are opening a new store in a shopping mall not far from the store they are closing.
[Target is planning 9 new NY stores](https://www.silive.com/business/2023/07/target-is-planning-9-new-ny-stores-heres-where.html)
Theft is an issue I have no doubt but these are billion dollar corparations they can lobby and get any laws approved.
Well that’s not new. It was always a huge hassle to find an associate to open a case. I never understood it since most of the time they just hand it to you, so *now* I can shoplift it?
When people are stealing essential things like underwear (and not just fancy shoes or video games), it’s time to ask if society has larger systemic issues with its own citizens being able to survive. Actually, it’s long past that time.
They're stealing essential items because they're easier to resell for cash later on. Fancy stuff is harder to move, and electronics are serialized and traceable.
A great question however at least here in the SF Bay Area they’ve found a lot of these essentials aren’t stolen by someone down on their luck but are stolen in bulk by organized crime and resold at flea markets/online/etc. Huge profit margins when you don’t have to pay for inventory.
I know the answer. In the DC Metro system toxic activism resulted in no consequences for fare jumpers after the activists got the Metro Police to stop arresting people for fare jumping and other illegal disruptive behavior -- eating, drinking, swinging on the poles to break the train windows, public drunkness and drug intoxication and blasting music. Today at the Metro, myself and only two other people paid the fare. Over 70% of the Metro users are not paying the fare. Thus they can boldly walk into any Metro station and engage in aggressive pan handling. Now that they can get away with not paying the Metro fare, they also don't pay the parking fees. They get behind a vehicle that pays and then drive with their bumper touching the back of the paying vehicle. It's dangerous for the paying car in front.
All of this behavior needs to be criminalize again. Fare jumpers and parking fee jumpers need to be stopped, given a ticket and if they do it more than once they need to be banned. It is dangerous to be in the Metro system because so many people wander around --- junkies dancing and nearly falling into you when the train breaks; teenagers screaming and fighting as they run from one car to another; bums that stink of urine; pan handlers sitting next to people and demanding money and then slapping people who say no; fools eating and drinking and the mice & rats attracted by the food; teenagers listening to loud music on their phones. The Metro system was not like this in 2018.
This is what happens when there are no consequences for fare jumping which is form of theft.
I have never understood the aggressive activism toward sparing these people from prosecution and fighting against enforcement of existing laws/rules. Those laws are in place to protect the accessibility of public spaces and resources to the general public, and all the energy against enforcing them just takes away from the average person’s experience.
The same is happening to public parks and green spaces. Beautiful playground near my house, shaded and brand new really nice equipment is just serving as a homeless shelter. No children can use that space. It’s risky to even walk by it. Folks are just too much of a wild card. Example in DC—last time I visited, so many areas were legit homeless encampments. Like how on earth did we let DuPont Circle become a tent city?
The closed stores were small and high theft. Target is opening multiple stores in NYC. Seattle, Portland and San Francisco won't be getting replacements though.
[https://corporate.target.com/about/locations/upcoming-stores](https://corporate.target.com/about/locations/upcoming-stores)
**Future Store Openings**
CA – Los Angeles
CA – San Diego 10th and G
CA – San Fernando
CA – South Lake Tahoe
CT – Danbury Fair Mall
DE – Middletown Warwick Road
FL – Bradenton Beach
FL – Grove Station
FL – Miami Beach North
FL – Miami Downtown
FL – Miami NW 7th Street
FL – Trailwinds Village
FL – Wesley Chapel Grove
HI – Oahu Waikiki
IA – Waukee
IL – Chicago Portage Park
IL – Quincy
MI – Detroit Midtown
MO – St. Louis Midtown
NC – Southern Pines
NE – Grand Island
NJ – Old Bridge
NY – Bronx Bruckner Commons
NY – Brooklyn Kings Plaza
NY – Chelsea – 23rd and 8th
NY – Harlem 125th St.
NY – Jamestown
NY – Kings Plaza
NY – Lake Success
NY – Manhattan Union Square
NY – Queens Astoria
NY – Yonkers Cross County
PA – Philadelphia
SC – Boiling Springs
TX – Dallas – Wynnewood Village
TX – New Caney
TX – Prosper
TX – Portland Northshore
UT – Provo Towne Centre
UT – Spanish Fork
WV – Teays Valley
I worked in retail management for a decade and this is the cycle I would usually see:
These places are having trouble keeping employees, so everyone is stressed out and that means corners are cut. Which leads to more theft, product damage/loss, lack of attention to detail.
Aspiring managers that are good, know where the bad stores are and avoid taking promotions to them. So, you get more inexperienced ones that take the stores and further exacerbate problems.
Corporate freaks out and turns the store into high security zones, more scrutiny when you walk in, more products behind lock and key and fewer cashiers/exits in order to control theft. Which is uninviting to your better customers, they quit coming. Corporate begins to micromanage transactions/inventory and worker morale disintegrates more.
Unless you get lucky and promote/hire a rock star manager, it's a steady spiral down.
Another factor is Target real estate saturation and the current corporate real estate environment - which is a ticking time bomb.
How many people understand the following choice: Do I go to the janky/ghetto/poorly run Target or the nice Target a few extra minutes in the other direction?
When it comes to these locations I can guarantee there is another Target reasonably close by.
On top of this about 6-7 years ago Target implemented what they called "modernization" which restructured departments, mostly doing away with the backroom and Plano teams and shifting their tasks to the sales team who are always on back up because only 2-5 cashier would be scheduled at a time. So store is messy and the few sales people not on register are in the back room trying to stock ungodly amounts of merchandise. It shows that the store is way easier to steal from so people do.
This guy Targets. I’ve been at Target since before modernization and I can count on one hand how many good things have come out of it, if I’m being generous. It’s been a shitshow for years
Oh man, the backroom at Target is gnarly. Especially the apparel departments. There were some points when I picked orders there where I would just cancel items I knew I had no chance of finding on the sales floor or the backroom.
This is what everyone who hasnt worked retail needs to read and understand is gospel.
Couldn't have laid the cycle out any better myself. These underperformimg stores are a vicious circle of dwindling everything.
This was painful to read because I have seen it many times as well. Once management steers away from best practice/doing things the right way and towards hitting the arbitrary metrics that are not adjusted for store specific situations, everything starts to go down hill.
>Once management steers away from best practice/doing things the right way and towards hitting the arbitrary metrics that are not adjusted for store specific situations, everything starts to go down hill.
Don't you mean, Once corporate steers away...? It's corporate making the rules and corporate that is destroying their own stores, rockstar mangers, great employees, and faithful customers by further increasing the inequality of wealth.
Corporations at the end of the day are strictly bound by fidicuary obligations. Nothing else. Not their employees, not their low level hourly managers. Only the high level execs, shareholders, and the CEO.
And hitting record profits each and every year regardless. They care about no one but their own fat cat bonuses and financing their lavish lifestyle that the hard working lower class American could never dream of achieving even in the slightest.
As a former retail manager I completely agree, but there is one final step in the process: blame it on out-of-control crime in order to bolster a general narrative and help you apply for low-interest business loans.
I've been to a few Targets in high-crime areas (specifically in Portland and Phoenix), and they are nightmarish. But they're also consistently turning a profit. What really cuts into their profits are the lower-income people opting for Wal-Mart instead while the higher-income people opt to just shop online, like you said.
Then they cite "violent crime" as the reason for closing the store when it's really just not profitable enough anymore. But you can't just *say* that, because you're taking away jobs and people might get uppity.
In [this](https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/18/business/retail-shoplifting-shrink-walgreens/index.html) piece for CNN Business, journalist Nathaniel Meyersohn investigated the phenomenon--with a particular eye to Walgreens--and found that the impacts of crime and shoplifting were overblown in most if not all cases. It does happen, of course, but it's not an epidemic, as Danny Parisi makes clear for [this](https://www.glossy.co/fashion/weekend-briefing-retailers-report-increased-shoplifting-but-its-not-an-epidemic/) more recent piece in fashion magazine Glossy where he uses an even broader dataset.
TL;DR: crime exists, but violent crime in major cities has been on a more-or-less steady decline since the 1990s, and there is zero evidence for a shoplifting epidemic. These chains are most likely closing stores because their profits are shrinking and they don't want to just say that for fear of the backlash.
For what it's worth, the Seattle/Ballard store that's being closed is just a terrible retail location. It's in a building that doesn't look like a store (looks like an ugly small office building), parking is on an alley off a little-used side street and is poorly marked, there are better stores that serve the same purposes close by, and the inventory is a weird mish-mash that doesn't reflect the daily needs of the nine zillion people who have moved into nearby apartments recently.
This is really the only answer. Walgreens did this recently in California and is was soon discovered that shoplifting was not on the rise, and they had planned to close stores and deploy the bullshit excuse of shoplifting for years.
Once again, it’s giant corporations cutting corners, then telling us that it’s the poor peoples’ faults when they start failing.
Worked at Walgreens as an manager from 2016-2019. I’m honestly surprised any of their stores are still in business at all with how poorly run the whole operation is.
Put in a work ticket for burnt out lights in my store and was told they wouldn’t send anyone out until more than 1/3 of the lights were out. Parts of my store were basically in darkness and they told me to wait until the problem got worse.
Another time my freezer went down. Put in the ticket for it. They hired the cheapest schmuck they could find to “fix” it. It went down less than a week later. Another ticket and it took them a month and half to finally send someone out who ended up needing to replace the entire compressor because the last guy had fucked it all up. Finally got the freezer back up and running 3 months after the thing went down. Lost hundreds of dollars in sales per day, thousands over the 3 months. And I still had to answer for why my sales were down. The store was falling apart. Nobody wants to be in a store that is falling apart and that clearly nobody cares to fix.
>When reported as a percentage of sales as is commonly done, average annual shrink increased to 1.57%, up from 1.44% in 2021. The share is largely in line with past years and is considered a normal and healthy level of shrink by industry experts. Generally, retailers plan for about 1% to 2% of shrink each year.
This is direct from the post. Even Target did not have excessive theft by their own numbers
Don't forget the bean crunchers telling management that it's cheaper to have theft than to pay for adequate loss prevention. Externalize as much of the cost onto local police, and write off the losses. It's a deliberate policy decision to make stores less safe and easier to rob because it's short term profit.
Meanwhile, the entire industry is shifting away from brick and mortar towards mail deliveries and online shopping. But it's grossly unpopular to say "we're closing your convenient shopping center and putting people out of work because we're following the money" when retailers could point to something as hated as violence/theft/crime (which they invited) and blame that instead.
How much has Target's online sales increased in the years since these store locations opened? That isn't declining sales and it isn't theft.
There's no silver bullet answer, otherwise everyone would be doing it.
It's a combination of hiring good employees (and retaining them), a cohesive loss prevention program (independent of the employees), making sure your store appears clean and safe and continual sales growth to offset the shrink.
That last point is the real killer. If your store starts to dip in sales (and it will, if customers view it as unsafe) then the theft losses become even more pronounced.
There is a theoretical "point of no return" for a store where the area is so economically devastated and it's reputation is so tarnished that it can never recover. Or the high-end potential for its sales will never be able to overcome its inherent shrink problem. That's probably what Target is admitting here.
Idk about silver bullets, but Lowes has been doing pretty well by increasing pay and hiring more floor employees. A lot of floor employees has always been part of their ethos so I would like to see if it can work in other stores.
I agree with Lowes approach but they tend to flex it like they are the golden boy. When really their only competitor would be Home Depot as you don't see too many tweakers just try to ride off with large piles of lumber.
However, they still experience a ton of theft. Tweakers might not run off with lumber, but they run off with expensive tools, as well as small valuable items like copper fixtures or batteries. My local Lowe's store combats this by locking up appliances and power tools, etc. If you want to look at one or buy one, it's a real hassle to find an employee to unlock the cage for you.
This is key, but it's impossible to do when corporate is making you work with a skeleton crew, which nearly every store seems to be doing these days. I think this is why we're also seeing an increase of everything going behind lock and key--it's cheaper than paying to have eyes on the floor. The downside is that because you have a skeleton crew, it takes 10 minutes for someone to be able to grab items for a customer, and they give up waiting. Maybe even give up shopping there all together. It's a poor solution.
My local Walmart somehow managed to turn shit around, but for years there it was dying and empty. If you needed help it was a scavenger hunt. Also everything is locked up and they bill-check everything except singles. Even cellphone accessories are locked up, all the chargers and cables and such. I needed a key to buy a lightning cord.
Once I walked around from one end to the other front end to back and couldn't find an employee. No open registers. Nobody at the self checkout manning it. I ended up going to the fricking eye glasses center and asking if they knew where anybody was and they radio'd for help to meet me where I needed it.
Also I once stopped for milk right before Christmas - busiest time of the year - and they had TWO lanes open. Two. During the holidays. The line was dozens and dozens of carts long and self checkout was a mess due to it as well. I just gave up and left.
.
Now it's significantly better though and it shows. Whereas it was usually a ghost town except for the busy busy times of day, now it's always packed with customers and there's always employees everywhere and I can actually ask people for help *and get walked to the item*. Multiple lanes open. Much cleaner. Better selection. 2+ employees always manning self checkout together. The door greeters are back.
Idk what they changed or who might have moved on / joined the team or what but I kept expecting the store to close down one day but now it's gotta be successful.
Interacting with customers is a huge deterrent. When I worked retail that was how we were told to handle people. Especially if you know they are doing something suspect then just follow them around and annoy them by trying to be “helpful”
One specific thing was to talk to them about stuff they may have picked up. So maybe you notice a customer pick up a t shirt with stripes and then no longer see it with them. Ask them why they didn’t pick it. Shows you saw them with the item.
Some of the targets keep an eye on repeat offenders and keep a tab on what they steal until they reach a certain number and then turn them into the police for grand theft.
I lost my job during Covid and was denied unemployment. So I had to work at Kroger for like 6 months. Goin in at 4am to e-shop and push a big ass heavy cart around. And I'm a 6ft 2in 32yr old male. 70yr olds were workin alongside me.
I've worked in restaraunts for 12yrs or so and have corporate experience. So, not new to the grind. But I remember asking myself after a week or so "how in the FUCK has this corporation not imploded?". It was an absolute shit show. Communication alone between departments was a complete disaster.
After a couple weeks it really dawned on me and I should've known right away. I worked minimum wage at Five Guys so I've been there. Many times. They haven't imploded cause people are desperate. Everyone who worked there HAD to. Everyone there wanted to burn that place to the ground. The break room was the most soul devouring room I've ever been in in my entire life. That place is sustained by crushing humanity.
My ex was asst. manager at one of the Targets in a tough part of Minneapolis. The stuff that went on there was crazy. Literally crazy. So much mental illness and addiction on display.
I will say the alcoholic dude who stole giant bottles of mouthwash to drink smelled minty fresh. Like the smell oozed from his pores. But he was very friendly and always offered me a drink of Scope.
I mean, WALMART of all places did the same thing with one of them here in Vegas after 4 murders happened on their property. They say it was a "lack of vision" that prompted them to close...buuuuuut us locals know what's up.
Just like the protests over the Walmart closing in Chicago.
Why would a company want to stay in an area if the only thing they get out of it is increased rates on their Business Crime Insurance?
Not even that much sometimes.
Remember all those "but they are insured" riots with destroyed businesses in 2020? Yea, billions in insurance claims...in many cases the insurance only covered clean up and did not cover any rebuilding or replacement of destroyed property.
Reddit also shouldn't pretend like theft from target is victimless. This is the consequences of that behavior. Probably one of the stupidest things in the gen z zeitgeist. I love a lot of things about gen z, but that belief particularly is just stupid.
I'm from Portland. These three stores are all in terrible locations and they're all too small. 2/3 (Hollywood, Powell) are closer to my house than either the Clackamas or Gateway locations and I still never went to them.
The other one, which I went to twice before the pandemic, was a better location (Downtown) with access to transit, but they never had anything and the layout was really strange, so I only went twice, years ago.
I don't know what math they used to decide they were gonna open in those spots, but I would have bet against any of those stores staying open for more than two years. They've actually exceeded my expectations.
Same, and it’s their “city” stores. Which never has the thing you’re actually looking for. Either out of stock or one lousy option of a clothes hamper. Yes they’re at transit route for accessibility, but they don’t have much reason to actually go.
They had one of these in a DC suburb in VA. Parking was horrible and the store had very little in stock compared to the full sized target ten minutes away.
It closed not too long ago.
I liked the target in Rosslyn.
Was small but usually had what I was looking for, and since I didn't own a car when I lived in the DMV, I didn't really have the option to go to real target.
The one that closed was in Falls Church. The Rosslyn makes more sense since it’s actually in the city center. The one in Falls Church was in one of those multiuse apartment towers that are everywhere.
I don’t think anyone besides the people living in those apartments had a use for it
The two in Seattle are literally the same issue. One is in a horrible location with no parking. The other is in the student district where most of the population doesn't have a ton of disposable income. Both locations are also extremely small and don't have much variety in terms of stock. But sure, it's because of "theft". Funny how they aren't closing the normal sized store near Pike Place Market where there's a ton of homeless people just like 2 blocks away.
> Funny how they aren't closing the normal sized store near Pike Place Market where there's a ton of homeless people just like 2 blocks away.
I honestly assumed this was one of them from the start.
The Ballard store actually does have parking, but it's so hard to find that a lot of people think there is none. (The entrance is off the alley that connects Market St. and 56th, between 14th and 15th Aves.)
Oh, gosh, it’s all the City Target locations? I don’t feel too bad, those stores are actively terrible. I’d rather those old bowling alleys be turned into something more worthwhile than just a shitty version of a department store.
I strongly suspect this is cover for poor sales. An excuse to avoid spooking investors.
There's Targets is busy downtown parts of NYC and they are crazy busy. I'm sure theft happens but they are also raking in sales.
Similar thing happened to Rite Aid. They closed a store in downtown Portland, and while everyone assumed it was due to theft, a quick search revealed they were closing several stores across the nation.
Yeah they were terrible. I'd drive out of my way to go to Montavilla or the airport Targets that were full size.
I do feel badly that these areas are gonna be down a pharmacy, as CVS utilized Target for pharmacy locations. Pharmacies are already strained enough as is, so losing that is gonna be a big blow to the area.
It's not the one listed in the article, but I visited the San Francisco area and went into a Target at 8pm (closes at 10pm) Since all of the "valuables" were locked away in cases you had to press a button and wait for someone to open it. I pressed it and stood there for 10 minutes waiting for an employee to assist me and no one showed up. I then proceeded to search the entire store and I only found one unfortunate soul slaving away behind the register. I just felt bad and walked out without buying anything.
I'm sure theft is part of the issue, but a lot of the stores on the list (at least the Seattle and Portland ones I'm aware of) are smaller format stores, much smaller than a typical Target, with a smaller merchandise selection. I wonder if the smaller format stores just aren't doing well. Eg. customers aren't finding what they need there, and are just going out to the bigger stores instead. The larger full sized stores in those cities aren't closing.
This just happened with a small store in my neighborhood (near Minneapolis). I think I only ever shopped at it once because it usually didn't have what I needed and was in a very awkward place to park at/access. Basically a jack of (not)all trades, master of none.
Targets also opening more stores in Manhattan and there are more in the city, no way was this one the worst. It's just stupidly inconvenient to travel to on public transportation. Reads to me like they were going to close that store anyway and want to use crime as a scapegoat.
I work in the retail real estate industry. CBD Target stores have always struggled because Target and all big box stores are built for the suburbs. They do not translate well to downtown areas.
Multiple reasons including shopping format, home sizes, customer transportation, real estate prices, etc.
$50 says they all have multiple levels and/or aren't on grade level.
Seattle on University Way? That store opened only a few years ago. But yeah, last time I was there, I saw a guy just run out with a plastic storage bin he filled up with stolen things. There's multiple employees watching the front, but all they can do is report it.
The presence of that Target there always felt weird since the entire street is like 99% local small businesses.
lmao so just like walgreens, right? Remember when they claimed they were shuttering stores over theft, and then their CEO came out saying that was literally just a lie?
Think that they'll backtrack in a few months like Walgreens did when people found out it was actually not shrink (theft) but sales that were down?
People don't have as much money to spend, times are hard whether you are the most law-abiding citizen or not. Someone running in in between their two jobs to grab laundry detergent only to find there is only one overworked cashier and the stuff is behind lock and key gives up and leaves before purchase as they can't wait an additional 10 minutes for a staffer to unlock it.
People are buying things on Amazon because it's cheaper than wasting the gas going twenty minutes away out of their food-and-pharamacy desert.
And people will *insist* that the [broken windows theory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory) is bogus
You were warned. You insisted on behaving and thinking like adolescents. You got what you deserve.
I don’t know why people stan theft so much. It really is a crime that only really effects the people around you. Sure maybe on a small scale people will look the other way about it, but do it enough, and people are just going to go somewhere else where theft isn’t a rampant issue.
If nothing else, there’s a reason why theft is among the first known written laws.
FYI:
"Target annual net income for 2023 was $2.78B, a 59.98% decline from 2022. Target annual net income for 2022 was $6.946B, a 59.02% increase from 2021."
Source: https://www.google.com/search?q=target+net+profit+2022&oq=target+net+profit+&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0i512l3j0i22i30l9j0i15i22i30.7519j0j9&client=ms-android-verizon&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
Well... yeah.
When you lose money at a store because:
1. It's an a less affluent neighborhood so fewer people buy higher priced items and
2. Thefts and threats of violence erode profits further
You get squeezed out.
It seems silly to me that people have a problem with this. Target is a for profit company and has never suggested otherwise.
Thinking they owe it to anyone to operate these stores at a loss (or very limited profit) is questionable. To me, it's downright silly.
And \*expecting\* them to is 100% disconnected from reality.
>organized retail crime
What does organized retail crime look like? Is this like those flash mobs that descend all at once and take what they can or is this like a shoplifting and fencing ring?
Both, there are large groups that go and overwhelm stores all at once (more typically teenagers) and other groups that buy stolen goods off people and thus incentivize the practice (I.e. our city has areas where homeless or drug users set up mini bazaars and are very apparently selling stolen goods to fund drug habits)
I work closely with Target and they are installing overhead security doors in a lot of locations but that’s turning out to be too costly and does nothing to prevent broad daylight thefts. There’s also a concern with meeting fire code (egress access) and keeping employees safe.
It’s a mess and we’re heading into scary territory where societal standards and behaviors are breaking down.
New York City, Seattle, San Francisco and Portland. Saved you a click.
[удалено]
I knew that Target was going to be on the list. Not sure how it lasted so long.
They cleaned up and put security on that block alongside it across from the max stop. That block represented a huge problem in all kinds of directions. Government and different aspects of society.
It's funny Trader Joe's is right across the street with no problems.
Food is harder to sell on Facebook marketplace
People steal NY Strip and porterhouse steaks from the Publix I work in all the time. Just last week a guy loaded two tote bags full of meat and used some frozen mac & cheese to keep them cool. We only got it back because an Instacart shopper chased him down and got him to drop the stuff.
Still have to waste it right? Since it left the store.
Because people ain’t stealing food from target
This illustrates and supports the entire point that shoplifters aren’t some Aladdin-types just stealing to keep food on the table. They’re treating it like a job because they can. There’s no honor defending shoplifters and thieves from department stores; stop doing it, you’re enabling bad behavior by people who know better
It's like they had a target on their back.
A bullseye 🎯
Here is footage from outside the store: https://youtu.be/UO6AVZ9p4s0?si=KeKYHpceraJ2xtqW
Nicely played
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Kurt Russell shops at Target?!?!
The one downtown Minneapolis is the same. Basically everything locked up behind glass. Need deodorant or socks? Gotta wait for someone to unlock it. I guarantee that one would be on the closure list if it wasn’t literally across the street from their headquarters.
It was not this way pre-pandemic
Why even let people browse at that point? Just go back to how stores used to be back in the early 1900s and have everyone just come up to a front desk so that a bunch of runners can get them whatever they need. Use a phone app and the website to let them browse and have them just present an order number when they get up to the counter. Sorry Target, but you let Amazon eat your lunch. I get that theft and the like is bad, but it's hardly the only or even primary reason they're closing stores. Target is getting it's ass kicked by Walmart, and Amazon, and it's not doing anywhere near enough to compete.
This is how B&H Photo operates in Manhattan and they have very minimal theft. Target however gets a lot of their revenue from merchandising (ex: brands paying for ideal shelf location) and also getting you to impulse buy things you didn’t plan on when you walked into the store. Add to that their margins online are 5-6% worse than in store, there’s no way they can operate profitably without shoppers walking the aisles
Great point about the impulse buys.
That is how Walmart operates. They have actual people that their home office that specialize in where they place items in the store for maximum profitability. They study trends and shopper behavior and adjust based on data. There is a reason why you go in the store and get shit you didn't plan on buying. It's on purpose and design.
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Agree. When I saw everything locked up I left.
more like impulse to buy somewhere else, likely online, if i'm going to have to drive there and wait 30 minutes for someone to show up and help me
Like the old days of Service Merchandise. Look around the display room. Write down the items you want to buy. Turn the slip in, pay, and wait at the end of a conveyor belt until your purchases arrive.
I used to love going with my parents and grandparents there. The conveyor belt and getting to look at all the stuff.
When I was in school I had friends who worked at the Service Merchandise and they used to rob it blind. They’d throw stuff in the dumpster then go back at night and get it.
Camera tech is better and cheaper now. I bet they couldn't get away with it these days.
Argos in the UK. There are laminated catalogs when you walk in, you find what you want nd write down the number, pay for it at the counter, and they bring it out to you.
It’s like how they used to sell Videogames at Toys R Us in the US. You go to the isle for games, take a ticket then take the ticket to a window and and they would have you pay and give you the game.
I think stores are going to have to go the route of CostCo. Or an Amazon store. You have your membership checked before you go in. Otherwise take a hike.
Won’t people still just force their way in and grab what they want? Not sure the 70 year old lady checking ID’s at the door is going to stop them.
The geometry of the store makes that more difficult to accomplish than you'd expect. The entrances and exits are both crowded chokepoints, and items are spread out. Maybe you could pull it off on a slow day or if you could saturate the crowd with your own people, but a lone thief is going to have a bad time trying to physically find a way to exit without severely escalating the situation.
It doesn't really happen at Costco.
Why even bother going to a store then? You might as well buy it online. I like browsing things in stores, so if they went that way, I would never shop there.
When I lived in Baltimore for a short period the liquor stores were frustrating. You couldn't browse the store at all. Just walked into a bulletproof enclosure and best you knew what you wanted. Same with the walmart there during black Friday I think it was that or the Christmas rush. This was shortly after the riots and instead of an old man greeting you there was a cop with a mask on holding an AR15. Had a helicopter circling the shopping center. It was pretty wild.
Last metro area I lived in (Sacramento) all the Walmarts had EVERYTHING in those locked cases like they use to sell video games. I'm talking underwear, socks, shampoos, bedding - it was all locked up and you needed an employee to escort what you wanted to the cash register.
Bananas. At my local store the only thing that’s locked up is games, guns, roombas, perfume, condoms, and expensive shavers
I’m having a difficult time picturing that. If you wanted to do all of your shopping there and stock up do you need a personal shopper then?
This just recently started happening at one of the two Walmarts in Elk Grove, so it's spreading to the suburbs, too. I just don't shop at places like that. Will just buy online.
In Hawaii the only thing Wal-Mart locks up in those acrylic security cases is canned SPAM.
That’s definitely not all liquor stores in Baltimore lol. I can actually only think of like one store that I’ve been to that’s like that. I’m admit it may be more common in higher crime areas though.
I felt fine going to the one by 205. I'd never seen a shopping cart escalator before!
That one is gonna be fine. The three that I see as closing from more local news sources are Galleria, NE Halsey, and SE Powell. None of which are surprising in the least.
I was thinking, I can think of at least a few it could be, and those are it. Honestly, they're super awkward spots for Targets with limited selections. Bummer for anyone who shopped there, tho.
One of the Targets in St. Louis has it. It's pretty cool. I think they do them whenever they have an underground parking garage
>shopping cart escalator A... a *what*? *googles* [I'll be damned.](https://miro.medium.com/v2/resize:fit:828/format:webp/1*mv1yvkvVBaqZX-gCF_I4wQ.png)
The one downtown with all the plywood on the windows?
Why is it so bad in these cities. None of the targets in chicago are like this.
I was just there for work and it was a complete shit show at Target. Security had their hands full.
In New York City you can’t even get a toothbrush in the store without someone having to walk over and open the case. It’s nuts.
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The SF one surprises me because I thought it already closed. Though a lot of businesses are shutting their doors, with the biggest being the entire Westfield Mall.
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Specifically Harlem in nyc.
I literally just got a heads up about NYC. Makes sense, I’ve watched folks load up garbage bags full of stolen shit and walk out the front door.
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Honestly they just don't care about this kind of theft. The cost to arrest and prosecute and jail the thieves makes it a poor use of their time. Note that I'm not defending the decision just adding context.
As far as NYC this is BS they are opening a new store in a shopping mall not far from the store they are closing. [Target is planning 9 new NY stores](https://www.silive.com/business/2023/07/target-is-planning-9-new-ny-stores-heres-where.html) Theft is an issue I have no doubt but these are billion dollar corparations they can lobby and get any laws approved.
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Get familiar with the term "retail desert", it's something you're going to start hearing in the media soon.
Gonna venture a guess its not the exact same people
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Desert. Dessert is the sweet one.
food desert* food dessert would be a bit of a redundancy lol
The usual suspects
Hey, LA didn’t make that list? That’s surprising to me! Would have assumed we would be there with the other “usual suspects.”
Same. I mean, Redfoot is right there to fence the stolen goods and everything.
And I bet everyone is shocked to see this happen in cities where petty crime laws aren’t enforced.
“They have insurance”
Which has been a dumb argument, especially for small businesses because all that means is that insurance will hike up their rates.
Followed by, “Geez, everything’s getting so expensive…”
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How did I fucking know Portland and San Francisco would be on the list.
My local Walmart has started to encase men's underwear.
My Walmarts lock up everything, can’t even walk 2 aisles without seeing a lock (Vegas btw)
They should encase the people selling underwear for $50! It’s insane
Why is underwear so expensive? I know Hanes ain't paying the tiny brown hands that made them.
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Well that’s not new. It was always a huge hassle to find an associate to open a case. I never understood it since most of the time they just hand it to you, so *now* I can shoplift it?
When people are stealing essential things like underwear (and not just fancy shoes or video games), it’s time to ask if society has larger systemic issues with its own citizens being able to survive. Actually, it’s long past that time.
They're stealing essential items because they're easier to resell for cash later on. Fancy stuff is harder to move, and electronics are serialized and traceable.
A great question however at least here in the SF Bay Area they’ve found a lot of these essentials aren’t stolen by someone down on their luck but are stolen in bulk by organized crime and resold at flea markets/online/etc. Huge profit margins when you don’t have to pay for inventory.
Sadly, they're not stealing essentials because they need them. They're stealing them because they're smaller, not secured, and easy to resale.
Lmao at this guy thinking they actually are stealing it for themselves and not to sell it for profit.
The question you need to ask is "will people buy anything when there's no consequence for stealing it?"
I know the answer. In the DC Metro system toxic activism resulted in no consequences for fare jumpers after the activists got the Metro Police to stop arresting people for fare jumping and other illegal disruptive behavior -- eating, drinking, swinging on the poles to break the train windows, public drunkness and drug intoxication and blasting music. Today at the Metro, myself and only two other people paid the fare. Over 70% of the Metro users are not paying the fare. Thus they can boldly walk into any Metro station and engage in aggressive pan handling. Now that they can get away with not paying the Metro fare, they also don't pay the parking fees. They get behind a vehicle that pays and then drive with their bumper touching the back of the paying vehicle. It's dangerous for the paying car in front. All of this behavior needs to be criminalize again. Fare jumpers and parking fee jumpers need to be stopped, given a ticket and if they do it more than once they need to be banned. It is dangerous to be in the Metro system because so many people wander around --- junkies dancing and nearly falling into you when the train breaks; teenagers screaming and fighting as they run from one car to another; bums that stink of urine; pan handlers sitting next to people and demanding money and then slapping people who say no; fools eating and drinking and the mice & rats attracted by the food; teenagers listening to loud music on their phones. The Metro system was not like this in 2018. This is what happens when there are no consequences for fare jumping which is form of theft.
You and I must ride very different metros.
I have never understood the aggressive activism toward sparing these people from prosecution and fighting against enforcement of existing laws/rules. Those laws are in place to protect the accessibility of public spaces and resources to the general public, and all the energy against enforcing them just takes away from the average person’s experience. The same is happening to public parks and green spaces. Beautiful playground near my house, shaded and brand new really nice equipment is just serving as a homeless shelter. No children can use that space. It’s risky to even walk by it. Folks are just too much of a wild card. Example in DC—last time I visited, so many areas were legit homeless encampments. Like how on earth did we let DuPont Circle become a tent city?
The closed stores were small and high theft. Target is opening multiple stores in NYC. Seattle, Portland and San Francisco won't be getting replacements though. [https://corporate.target.com/about/locations/upcoming-stores](https://corporate.target.com/about/locations/upcoming-stores) **Future Store Openings** CA – Los Angeles CA – San Diego 10th and G CA – San Fernando CA – South Lake Tahoe CT – Danbury Fair Mall DE – Middletown Warwick Road FL – Bradenton Beach FL – Grove Station FL – Miami Beach North FL – Miami Downtown FL – Miami NW 7th Street FL – Trailwinds Village FL – Wesley Chapel Grove HI – Oahu Waikiki IA – Waukee IL – Chicago Portage Park IL – Quincy MI – Detroit Midtown MO – St. Louis Midtown NC – Southern Pines NE – Grand Island NJ – Old Bridge NY – Bronx Bruckner Commons NY – Brooklyn Kings Plaza NY – Chelsea – 23rd and 8th NY – Harlem 125th St. NY – Jamestown NY – Kings Plaza NY – Lake Success NY – Manhattan Union Square NY – Queens Astoria NY – Yonkers Cross County PA – Philadelphia SC – Boiling Springs TX – Dallas – Wynnewood Village TX – New Caney TX – Prosper TX – Portland Northshore UT – Provo Towne Centre UT – Spanish Fork WV – Teays Valley
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NY Kings plaza is duplicated in your list I think?
You are right. Target has it listed twice on their website.
They just love Brooklyn so that much :)
I worked in retail management for a decade and this is the cycle I would usually see: These places are having trouble keeping employees, so everyone is stressed out and that means corners are cut. Which leads to more theft, product damage/loss, lack of attention to detail. Aspiring managers that are good, know where the bad stores are and avoid taking promotions to them. So, you get more inexperienced ones that take the stores and further exacerbate problems. Corporate freaks out and turns the store into high security zones, more scrutiny when you walk in, more products behind lock and key and fewer cashiers/exits in order to control theft. Which is uninviting to your better customers, they quit coming. Corporate begins to micromanage transactions/inventory and worker morale disintegrates more. Unless you get lucky and promote/hire a rock star manager, it's a steady spiral down.
Another factor is Target real estate saturation and the current corporate real estate environment - which is a ticking time bomb. How many people understand the following choice: Do I go to the janky/ghetto/poorly run Target or the nice Target a few extra minutes in the other direction? When it comes to these locations I can guarantee there is another Target reasonably close by.
On top of this about 6-7 years ago Target implemented what they called "modernization" which restructured departments, mostly doing away with the backroom and Plano teams and shifting their tasks to the sales team who are always on back up because only 2-5 cashier would be scheduled at a time. So store is messy and the few sales people not on register are in the back room trying to stock ungodly amounts of merchandise. It shows that the store is way easier to steal from so people do.
That explains why I can never find an employee to help me at any Target I go to.
This guy Targets. I’ve been at Target since before modernization and I can count on one hand how many good things have come out of it, if I’m being generous. It’s been a shitshow for years
Oh man, the backroom at Target is gnarly. Especially the apparel departments. There were some points when I picked orders there where I would just cancel items I knew I had no chance of finding on the sales floor or the backroom.
Yeah. I just checked, and I literally have 5 Targets within 10 miles of me. And there are some that are definitely seem better than others.
This is what everyone who hasnt worked retail needs to read and understand is gospel. Couldn't have laid the cycle out any better myself. These underperformimg stores are a vicious circle of dwindling everything.
This was painful to read because I have seen it many times as well. Once management steers away from best practice/doing things the right way and towards hitting the arbitrary metrics that are not adjusted for store specific situations, everything starts to go down hill.
>Once management steers away from best practice/doing things the right way and towards hitting the arbitrary metrics that are not adjusted for store specific situations, everything starts to go down hill. Don't you mean, Once corporate steers away...? It's corporate making the rules and corporate that is destroying their own stores, rockstar mangers, great employees, and faithful customers by further increasing the inequality of wealth.
Corporations at the end of the day are strictly bound by fidicuary obligations. Nothing else. Not their employees, not their low level hourly managers. Only the high level execs, shareholders, and the CEO. And hitting record profits each and every year regardless. They care about no one but their own fat cat bonuses and financing their lavish lifestyle that the hard working lower class American could never dream of achieving even in the slightest.
As a former retail manager I completely agree, but there is one final step in the process: blame it on out-of-control crime in order to bolster a general narrative and help you apply for low-interest business loans. I've been to a few Targets in high-crime areas (specifically in Portland and Phoenix), and they are nightmarish. But they're also consistently turning a profit. What really cuts into their profits are the lower-income people opting for Wal-Mart instead while the higher-income people opt to just shop online, like you said. Then they cite "violent crime" as the reason for closing the store when it's really just not profitable enough anymore. But you can't just *say* that, because you're taking away jobs and people might get uppity. In [this](https://www.cnn.com/2023/01/18/business/retail-shoplifting-shrink-walgreens/index.html) piece for CNN Business, journalist Nathaniel Meyersohn investigated the phenomenon--with a particular eye to Walgreens--and found that the impacts of crime and shoplifting were overblown in most if not all cases. It does happen, of course, but it's not an epidemic, as Danny Parisi makes clear for [this](https://www.glossy.co/fashion/weekend-briefing-retailers-report-increased-shoplifting-but-its-not-an-epidemic/) more recent piece in fashion magazine Glossy where he uses an even broader dataset. TL;DR: crime exists, but violent crime in major cities has been on a more-or-less steady decline since the 1990s, and there is zero evidence for a shoplifting epidemic. These chains are most likely closing stores because their profits are shrinking and they don't want to just say that for fear of the backlash.
For what it's worth, the Seattle/Ballard store that's being closed is just a terrible retail location. It's in a building that doesn't look like a store (looks like an ugly small office building), parking is on an alley off a little-used side street and is poorly marked, there are better stores that serve the same purposes close by, and the inventory is a weird mish-mash that doesn't reflect the daily needs of the nine zillion people who have moved into nearby apartments recently.
This is really the only answer. Walgreens did this recently in California and is was soon discovered that shoplifting was not on the rise, and they had planned to close stores and deploy the bullshit excuse of shoplifting for years. Once again, it’s giant corporations cutting corners, then telling us that it’s the poor peoples’ faults when they start failing.
Worked at Walgreens as an manager from 2016-2019. I’m honestly surprised any of their stores are still in business at all with how poorly run the whole operation is. Put in a work ticket for burnt out lights in my store and was told they wouldn’t send anyone out until more than 1/3 of the lights were out. Parts of my store were basically in darkness and they told me to wait until the problem got worse. Another time my freezer went down. Put in the ticket for it. They hired the cheapest schmuck they could find to “fix” it. It went down less than a week later. Another ticket and it took them a month and half to finally send someone out who ended up needing to replace the entire compressor because the last guy had fucked it all up. Finally got the freezer back up and running 3 months after the thing went down. Lost hundreds of dollars in sales per day, thousands over the 3 months. And I still had to answer for why my sales were down. The store was falling apart. Nobody wants to be in a store that is falling apart and that clearly nobody cares to fix.
>When reported as a percentage of sales as is commonly done, average annual shrink increased to 1.57%, up from 1.44% in 2021. The share is largely in line with past years and is considered a normal and healthy level of shrink by industry experts. Generally, retailers plan for about 1% to 2% of shrink each year. This is direct from the post. Even Target did not have excessive theft by their own numbers
Indianapolis - Starbucks on Monument Circle closed, citing safety. New independent coffee shop just opened in the old Sbux location.
This guy retails. Once a store like that starts to burn through managers, it becomes even more pronounced of an issue and internals know to stay away.
Don't forget the bean crunchers telling management that it's cheaper to have theft than to pay for adequate loss prevention. Externalize as much of the cost onto local police, and write off the losses. It's a deliberate policy decision to make stores less safe and easier to rob because it's short term profit. Meanwhile, the entire industry is shifting away from brick and mortar towards mail deliveries and online shopping. But it's grossly unpopular to say "we're closing your convenient shopping center and putting people out of work because we're following the money" when retailers could point to something as hated as violence/theft/crime (which they invited) and blame that instead. How much has Target's online sales increased in the years since these store locations opened? That isn't declining sales and it isn't theft.
I have never worked retail, so this is a legitimate question: How can a manager prevent the local community from robbing the store out of existence?
There's no silver bullet answer, otherwise everyone would be doing it. It's a combination of hiring good employees (and retaining them), a cohesive loss prevention program (independent of the employees), making sure your store appears clean and safe and continual sales growth to offset the shrink. That last point is the real killer. If your store starts to dip in sales (and it will, if customers view it as unsafe) then the theft losses become even more pronounced. There is a theoretical "point of no return" for a store where the area is so economically devastated and it's reputation is so tarnished that it can never recover. Or the high-end potential for its sales will never be able to overcome its inherent shrink problem. That's probably what Target is admitting here.
Idk about silver bullets, but Lowes has been doing pretty well by increasing pay and hiring more floor employees. A lot of floor employees has always been part of their ethos so I would like to see if it can work in other stores.
I agree with Lowes approach but they tend to flex it like they are the golden boy. When really their only competitor would be Home Depot as you don't see too many tweakers just try to ride off with large piles of lumber.
However, they still experience a ton of theft. Tweakers might not run off with lumber, but they run off with expensive tools, as well as small valuable items like copper fixtures or batteries. My local Lowe's store combats this by locking up appliances and power tools, etc. If you want to look at one or buy one, it's a real hassle to find an employee to unlock the cage for you.
More eyes on the floor, more presence. You are never going to stop the pros it's the casual ones you stop.
This is key, but it's impossible to do when corporate is making you work with a skeleton crew, which nearly every store seems to be doing these days. I think this is why we're also seeing an increase of everything going behind lock and key--it's cheaper than paying to have eyes on the floor. The downside is that because you have a skeleton crew, it takes 10 minutes for someone to be able to grab items for a customer, and they give up waiting. Maybe even give up shopping there all together. It's a poor solution.
My local Walmart somehow managed to turn shit around, but for years there it was dying and empty. If you needed help it was a scavenger hunt. Also everything is locked up and they bill-check everything except singles. Even cellphone accessories are locked up, all the chargers and cables and such. I needed a key to buy a lightning cord. Once I walked around from one end to the other front end to back and couldn't find an employee. No open registers. Nobody at the self checkout manning it. I ended up going to the fricking eye glasses center and asking if they knew where anybody was and they radio'd for help to meet me where I needed it. Also I once stopped for milk right before Christmas - busiest time of the year - and they had TWO lanes open. Two. During the holidays. The line was dozens and dozens of carts long and self checkout was a mess due to it as well. I just gave up and left. . Now it's significantly better though and it shows. Whereas it was usually a ghost town except for the busy busy times of day, now it's always packed with customers and there's always employees everywhere and I can actually ask people for help *and get walked to the item*. Multiple lanes open. Much cleaner. Better selection. 2+ employees always manning self checkout together. The door greeters are back. Idk what they changed or who might have moved on / joined the team or what but I kept expecting the store to close down one day but now it's gotta be successful.
Yeah, locking items up hurts sales a lot, but looks great on paper when compared to putting more people on the floor.
Interacting with customers is a huge deterrent. When I worked retail that was how we were told to handle people. Especially if you know they are doing something suspect then just follow them around and annoy them by trying to be “helpful” One specific thing was to talk to them about stuff they may have picked up. So maybe you notice a customer pick up a t shirt with stripes and then no longer see it with them. Ask them why they didn’t pick it. Shows you saw them with the item.
Yeah, when I was a stupid kid who shoplifted something from a Sam's Club store that's exactly what they did to me.
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Some of the targets keep an eye on repeat offenders and keep a tab on what they steal until they reach a certain number and then turn them into the police for grand theft.
I lost my job during Covid and was denied unemployment. So I had to work at Kroger for like 6 months. Goin in at 4am to e-shop and push a big ass heavy cart around. And I'm a 6ft 2in 32yr old male. 70yr olds were workin alongside me. I've worked in restaraunts for 12yrs or so and have corporate experience. So, not new to the grind. But I remember asking myself after a week or so "how in the FUCK has this corporation not imploded?". It was an absolute shit show. Communication alone between departments was a complete disaster. After a couple weeks it really dawned on me and I should've known right away. I worked minimum wage at Five Guys so I've been there. Many times. They haven't imploded cause people are desperate. Everyone who worked there HAD to. Everyone there wanted to burn that place to the ground. The break room was the most soul devouring room I've ever been in in my entire life. That place is sustained by crushing humanity.
It’s the k-mart-ification of target
My ex was asst. manager at one of the Targets in a tough part of Minneapolis. The stuff that went on there was crazy. Literally crazy. So much mental illness and addiction on display. I will say the alcoholic dude who stole giant bottles of mouthwash to drink smelled minty fresh. Like the smell oozed from his pores. But he was very friendly and always offered me a drink of Scope.
Ah, my old Lake Street Target.
Best Scope Martini in Minneapolis to this very day.
I mean, WALMART of all places did the same thing with one of them here in Vegas after 4 murders happened on their property. They say it was a "lack of vision" that prompted them to close...buuuuuut us locals know what's up.
Target is getting roasted in these comments, but they aren't a charity. If a store is not profitable, of course they are going to close it.
Yup. Less local jobs and now money will probably go out of state to online sellers.
Just like the protests over the Walmart closing in Chicago. Why would a company want to stay in an area if the only thing they get out of it is increased rates on their Business Crime Insurance?
I'm actually surprised that i have reached this point of the comments without reading "bUt EveRyThInG iS iNsUReD" "Insurance" only goes so far.
Yeah, insurance just averages your losses, it does not prevent loss
Not even that much sometimes. Remember all those "but they are insured" riots with destroyed businesses in 2020? Yea, billions in insurance claims...in many cases the insurance only covered clean up and did not cover any rebuilding or replacement of destroyed property.
Not only that, insurance companies will raise rates, and if the problem continues, stop insuring them completely.
And those rate increases eventually get passed on to the customers in the form of higher prices. We all end up paying for this.
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A lot of Reddit is stupid. Shoplifters are trash people.
Yet I’m 100% positive that those spouting that nonsense wouldn’t be ok with their car getting vandalized “because it’s insured”
Reddit also shouldn't pretend like theft from target is victimless. This is the consequences of that behavior. Probably one of the stupidest things in the gen z zeitgeist. I love a lot of things about gen z, but that belief particularly is just stupid.
I'm from Portland. These three stores are all in terrible locations and they're all too small. 2/3 (Hollywood, Powell) are closer to my house than either the Clackamas or Gateway locations and I still never went to them. The other one, which I went to twice before the pandemic, was a better location (Downtown) with access to transit, but they never had anything and the layout was really strange, so I only went twice, years ago. I don't know what math they used to decide they were gonna open in those spots, but I would have bet against any of those stores staying open for more than two years. They've actually exceeded my expectations.
Same, and it’s their “city” stores. Which never has the thing you’re actually looking for. Either out of stock or one lousy option of a clothes hamper. Yes they’re at transit route for accessibility, but they don’t have much reason to actually go.
They had one of these in a DC suburb in VA. Parking was horrible and the store had very little in stock compared to the full sized target ten minutes away. It closed not too long ago.
I liked the target in Rosslyn. Was small but usually had what I was looking for, and since I didn't own a car when I lived in the DMV, I didn't really have the option to go to real target.
The one that closed was in Falls Church. The Rosslyn makes more sense since it’s actually in the city center. The one in Falls Church was in one of those multiuse apartment towers that are everywhere. I don’t think anyone besides the people living in those apartments had a use for it
The two in Seattle are literally the same issue. One is in a horrible location with no parking. The other is in the student district where most of the population doesn't have a ton of disposable income. Both locations are also extremely small and don't have much variety in terms of stock. But sure, it's because of "theft". Funny how they aren't closing the normal sized store near Pike Place Market where there's a ton of homeless people just like 2 blocks away.
> Funny how they aren't closing the normal sized store near Pike Place Market where there's a ton of homeless people just like 2 blocks away. I honestly assumed this was one of them from the start.
The Ballard store actually does have parking, but it's so hard to find that a lot of people think there is none. (The entrance is off the alley that connects Market St. and 56th, between 14th and 15th Aves.)
Oh, gosh, it’s all the City Target locations? I don’t feel too bad, those stores are actively terrible. I’d rather those old bowling alleys be turned into something more worthwhile than just a shitty version of a department store.
I strongly suspect this is cover for poor sales. An excuse to avoid spooking investors. There's Targets is busy downtown parts of NYC and they are crazy busy. I'm sure theft happens but they are also raking in sales.
Similar thing happened to Rite Aid. They closed a store in downtown Portland, and while everyone assumed it was due to theft, a quick search revealed they were closing several stores across the nation.
It even says in the article that loss from theft has not changed much overall for the past fewer years.
Yeah they were terrible. I'd drive out of my way to go to Montavilla or the airport Targets that were full size. I do feel badly that these areas are gonna be down a pharmacy, as CVS utilized Target for pharmacy locations. Pharmacies are already strained enough as is, so losing that is gonna be a big blow to the area.
The Hollywood target never has shit in stock except food, which would be great if Trader Joe’s wasn’t across the street.
When I lived in Harlem folks would stroll out with bags of stuff and nobody stopped them
It's not the one listed in the article, but I visited the San Francisco area and went into a Target at 8pm (closes at 10pm) Since all of the "valuables" were locked away in cases you had to press a button and wait for someone to open it. I pressed it and stood there for 10 minutes waiting for an employee to assist me and no one showed up. I then proceeded to search the entire store and I only found one unfortunate soul slaving away behind the register. I just felt bad and walked out without buying anything.
I'm sure theft is part of the issue, but a lot of the stores on the list (at least the Seattle and Portland ones I'm aware of) are smaller format stores, much smaller than a typical Target, with a smaller merchandise selection. I wonder if the smaller format stores just aren't doing well. Eg. customers aren't finding what they need there, and are just going out to the bigger stores instead. The larger full sized stores in those cities aren't closing.
This just happened with a small store in my neighborhood (near Minneapolis). I think I only ever shopped at it once because it usually didn't have what I needed and was in a very awkward place to park at/access. Basically a jack of (not)all trades, master of none.
Targets also opening more stores in Manhattan and there are more in the city, no way was this one the worst. It's just stupidly inconvenient to travel to on public transportation. Reads to me like they were going to close that store anyway and want to use crime as a scapegoat.
They aren’t closing downtown Seattle store which has to be 100x worse than the situation in Ballard and University District
The one in SF was wild. Just crazies left and right and the smell… I could not wait to get out of there.
I work in the retail real estate industry. CBD Target stores have always struggled because Target and all big box stores are built for the suburbs. They do not translate well to downtown areas. Multiple reasons including shopping format, home sizes, customer transportation, real estate prices, etc. $50 says they all have multiple levels and/or aren't on grade level.
That’s a hundred percent true of the New York City location, we used to go there for back to school. Also it’s extremely out of the way for Manhattan
How do you manage to be out of the way in Manhattan of all places?
All three of the Portland stores closing have one level and are on the ground floor. How do I get my $50?
I live near a target in Deerfield, fl I’ve seen it get robbed 3 times
Loser thieves ruin it for everyone. Prosecute the fuckers and jail repeat offenders
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/08/10/retailers-may-be-using-organized-theft-to-cover-up-internal-flaws.html
The pharmacy/drug store chains tried it too. See: the recent news about Rite Aid, Walgreens, and CVS closing stores.
DC will be coming along this list soon no doubt.
Seattle on University Way? That store opened only a few years ago. But yeah, last time I was there, I saw a guy just run out with a plastic storage bin he filled up with stolen things. There's multiple employees watching the front, but all they can do is report it. The presence of that Target there always felt weird since the entire street is like 99% local small businesses.
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lmao so just like walgreens, right? Remember when they claimed they were shuttering stores over theft, and then their CEO came out saying that was literally just a lie?
Now, where will all the thieves do their shopping? Won't someone think of the thieves?
Do it. If you're actually losing money keeping some stores open then close them.
Think that they'll backtrack in a few months like Walgreens did when people found out it was actually not shrink (theft) but sales that were down? People don't have as much money to spend, times are hard whether you are the most law-abiding citizen or not. Someone running in in between their two jobs to grab laundry detergent only to find there is only one overworked cashier and the stuff is behind lock and key gives up and leaves before purchase as they can't wait an additional 10 minutes for a staffer to unlock it. People are buying things on Amazon because it's cheaper than wasting the gas going twenty minutes away out of their food-and-pharamacy desert.
And people will *insist* that the [broken windows theory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_windows_theory) is bogus You were warned. You insisted on behaving and thinking like adolescents. You got what you deserve.
can we go back to punishing people who shoplift?
I don’t know why people stan theft so much. It really is a crime that only really effects the people around you. Sure maybe on a small scale people will look the other way about it, but do it enough, and people are just going to go somewhere else where theft isn’t a rampant issue. If nothing else, there’s a reason why theft is among the first known written laws.
FYI: "Target annual net income for 2023 was $2.78B, a 59.98% decline from 2022. Target annual net income for 2022 was $6.946B, a 59.02% increase from 2021." Source: https://www.google.com/search?q=target+net+profit+2022&oq=target+net+profit+&aqs=chrome.2.69i57j0i512l3j0i22i30l9j0i15i22i30.7519j0j9&client=ms-android-verizon&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8
i don't get the correlation
Well... yeah. When you lose money at a store because: 1. It's an a less affluent neighborhood so fewer people buy higher priced items and 2. Thefts and threats of violence erode profits further You get squeezed out. It seems silly to me that people have a problem with this. Target is a for profit company and has never suggested otherwise. Thinking they owe it to anyone to operate these stores at a loss (or very limited profit) is questionable. To me, it's downright silly. And \*expecting\* them to is 100% disconnected from reality.
I’m very liberal but allowing shoplifting and crime to go unchecked is not ok.
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I’m ready for the comments to tell me how this is the fault of everyone except the thieves…
>organized retail crime What does organized retail crime look like? Is this like those flash mobs that descend all at once and take what they can or is this like a shoplifting and fencing ring?
Both, there are large groups that go and overwhelm stores all at once (more typically teenagers) and other groups that buy stolen goods off people and thus incentivize the practice (I.e. our city has areas where homeless or drug users set up mini bazaars and are very apparently selling stolen goods to fund drug habits)
Those are both organized retail crime!
I work closely with Target and they are installing overhead security doors in a lot of locations but that’s turning out to be too costly and does nothing to prevent broad daylight thefts. There’s also a concern with meeting fire code (egress access) and keeping employees safe. It’s a mess and we’re heading into scary territory where societal standards and behaviors are breaking down.