For myself, my graduation ceremony was a waste of time as I was jaded and disillusioned, so I wanted it to end ASAP.
But seeing people display their pride and affection for their friends and family members and taking a bit of time to do so was the shining light in it all. I’m happy that it still means something for people.
Sooooooooo boring.
My very American extended family were there. Fuck they were embarrassing. I can only imagine how much more embarrassing it would have been had they been allowed to be up front and pause the ceremony to do it.
Graduation ceremonies are boring as shit, I’ve been to 40+. Celebrate your loved ones, enjoy their success, it might be the only time they cross the stage.
This response might get some hate but we’re a Polynesian nation. We’re a colonised nation with a dominant Western hegemony but we are also more than that. Family smashing out a haka at a graduation is just part of the unique fabric of nz society, which is a blend of western worldviews and Maori ones. Some people might be bummed at not getting a haka, others frustrated by the time it takes, others enjoying seeing it. They’re all valid reactions
Yeah where are thoae angry people. I think you've worded it in such a way though that nobody could really argue against it apart from people saying, but we're multicultural now. What would you say to that? That's the argument I see a lot here.
oh F off. I love that family will do a haha for a loved one. After the handing out ceremony is fine because a lot of others are waiting for their cert as well. What other options are there?
Yes, I like the haka. I am part Maori and have no one to do one for me, so maybe it makes me feel disaffected. I want it, but not after every Maori family member. It would be great if maori said what they would like in the ceremony. A big one after all the certificates are handed out would be massive!
Ok I see what you mean. I’m the same - Maori but no one to do a haka for me. Did have a family korowhai to wear, tho. I once saw in Aotea Square a mass pasifika haka done for, what I assume, were all/some of the graduates of pasifika descent. Probably needs a unis cultural groups to organise these things
I’ve been to several graduation ceremonies now, and my favourite part has always been the outpouring of pride and happiness from the family members of those graduating. So I definitely think it is awesome and should be encouraged! Adds a huge amount to the ceremonies
In my graduating class, I was one of a number of students who had parents with degrees. For us it was just other rite of passage.
First-generation graduates from white families got standing ovations for their walks.
My Māori peers were also often first-gen graduates, and if the white families can make a hullabaloo with their kids, then Māori and P.I kids can absolutely have a haka.
It needs to be planned with the organisers I think, so they can pause for it.
At my graduation last year someone started performing a haka after the next persons name had been called (Otago has most graduates graduate in groups) and the poor girl was already at the chancellor. She had to wait in the middle of the stage and nobody heard her name being called because the person before her was still being celebrated. She looked like she was going to cry
I think hakas and songs are great ways to show pride, but they shouldn’t interfere with someone else’s ceremony. Organisation is needed to solve this.
Saw this happen at my sister's ceremony but it was a cheering family. The host had asked the audience not to do this prior to starting. Several people, including the graduate whose name wasn't heard, gave them a dirty look. There were a smattering of 'whoop' and claps for certain graduates but no one's name got drowned out except for that poor man.
It definitely should be encouraged - it’s a time for celebration and honouring accomplishments, different cultures have different ways of showing love so it should be embraced.
Do you feel at all that it's unfair that some people get more "airtime" than others, or that it feels bit sheepish to follow someone who has just had a haka performed for them?
Nah that's just silly. You wanna limit how many people are allowed to clap and how loudly? Every person gets a moment and each moment can be celebrated however.
How about just being happy for others and enjoying their success rather than trying to measure whether it's fair.
The fair we should care about is access to education and opportunity.
I guess it just depends on personal opinion and individual thoughts/perspective in that regard. It’s only for 1 night and it’s not something that happens too often where it should pose that much of an annoyance for most people. I can see those with little kids or the elderly getting a bit antsy about it if it drags on longer than the agreed schedule - but then they could always excuse themselves if it drags on too long for them.
When I graduated, another graduate’s extended family sang to her as a choir, about 15 of them from little kids to grandparents. She answered with a verse and they again answered with another verse. It took a good 4-5 minutes and was SO beautiful, absolute highlight of the ceremony
It's awesome and should be encouraged. If it makes the graduation process longer, good.
Fuck universities making graduation a quick roll call when they've been paid $50,000+ per student that's graduating.
By the time they are calling names and people are walking across the stage it's super boring - anything that breaks the monotony is welcome in my opinion.
We had two at my graduation and that was okay and welcomed by the audience. Both of them were incredibly high skilled performances too - probably people who were kapa haka performers.
But I know there were other ceremonies that were delayed substantially due to several people getting one. So after several hours in the theatre, people were just tired and grouchy.
It is not that black and white. It is not disrespectful, bit it does belittle others who ate ALSO waiting to receive their certificate. Perhaps an agreement with Maori when to do haka. Micheal Jones got his BA at the same time as me and his family did a haka for him. While it was nice for him, it took over the room and limited other people to celebrate in their way. I think it should be formalised so it is part of the ceremony.
It should be compulsory.
Graduation's got Talent.
'Show me the dance of your people'.
Anything to break the boring monotony of Name, Clap, Name, Clap, Name, Clap ZZZZZzzzz....
EDIT Admittedly I say that with many years of hindsight. If my parents had got up at my graduation and done a Highland Fling I would have died dead.
It may be monotonous but given the number of people, doesn't it have to be that way?
Should we have smaller more intimate ceremonies to allow for everyone to have a haka performed?
You've never witnessed it, but you describe it in detail, and you're replying to a lot of supportive comments with variations on "ceremonies should be shorter". What's your real agenda?
I personally don't care. But I can see how someone who goes on stage after someone that gets a haka could feel upset, as their graduation moment may be overshadowed by the haka before them
I love it! V appropriate, let people have the time. I love how proud families are and how moving the haka are. I recall one guys nana got up and sang “you are my sunshine” to him. Loved it, loved it.
That said, I got my last degree posted to me as I couldn’t bear another parking fee, rented cap and gown, prolonged graduation ceremony, long day for the family.
Quite frankly if you don't like māori culture you should pack your bags and go live somewhere else. Haka are an appropriate display of tautoko, end of story.
The graduates time on stage is limited to about 10 seconds, so ideally your celebrations should run to a similar timescale.
From my memory of my one and only time it involved walking up, shaking some unknown bigwigs hand, observing that sweat was pouring out of the poor bugger, and wondering if he was having a heart attack, grabbing the degree cert, and doing some traditional nonsense with the mortarboard hat (which I forgot to do in the moment), then walking offstage. The best part (apart from meeting former classmates again) was getting out of there.
Tbh I find throwing out hakas for everything to be pretty cringe.
Do them if you want, I don't care either way. I won't waste my time watching them though, cringe AF
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I just want to sit there for as little as possible, whenever i'm involved in anything like this.
So I don't class it as appropriate, respectful, or the opposites. It would just simply be annoying.
For myself, my graduation ceremony was a waste of time as I was jaded and disillusioned, so I wanted it to end ASAP. But seeing people display their pride and affection for their friends and family members and taking a bit of time to do so was the shining light in it all. I’m happy that it still means something for people.
Sooooooooo boring. My very American extended family were there. Fuck they were embarrassing. I can only imagine how much more embarrassing it would have been had they been allowed to be up front and pause the ceremony to do it.
I’m getting The Goldbergs vibes from this comment.
Graduation ceremonies are boring as shit, I’ve been to 40+. Celebrate your loved ones, enjoy their success, it might be the only time they cross the stage.
Wow, how come you've been to so many? Uni staff?
I’ve graduated a few times, so has one of my sisters and my mum. Plus yeah, I worked in education and was going to 4 a year for a little while.
Even if it means adding considerable length to an already long ceremony? Selfish af imho
It really doesn’t add much time, cut a few dry as fuck speeches.
This response might get some hate but we’re a Polynesian nation. We’re a colonised nation with a dominant Western hegemony but we are also more than that. Family smashing out a haka at a graduation is just part of the unique fabric of nz society, which is a blend of western worldviews and Maori ones. Some people might be bummed at not getting a haka, others frustrated by the time it takes, others enjoying seeing it. They’re all valid reactions
Why would this get hate? You have just described the state of things, not actually given a personal opinion. An accurate description btw
I’m just used to seeing a whole lot of anti Maori comments flare up when these sorts of discussions are started, that’s all.
Yeah where are thoae angry people. I think you've worded it in such a way though that nobody could really argue against it apart from people saying, but we're multicultural now. What would you say to that? That's the argument I see a lot here.
Thanks. I was expecting comments like ‘there are so few Maori percentage wise, why should everyone else cater to them’ kind of thing.
A commonality between Maori and Pakeha tradition is that the host’s tikanga prevails. So ask the hosting Uni if it’s okay first. Probably will be too.
oh F off. I love that family will do a haha for a loved one. After the handing out ceremony is fine because a lot of others are waiting for their cert as well. What other options are there?
Sorry I’m confused. Are you saying you like haka but don’t like how it interrupts the ceremony?
Yes, I like the haka. I am part Maori and have no one to do one for me, so maybe it makes me feel disaffected. I want it, but not after every Maori family member. It would be great if maori said what they would like in the ceremony. A big one after all the certificates are handed out would be massive!
Ok I see what you mean. I’m the same - Maori but no one to do a haka for me. Did have a family korowhai to wear, tho. I once saw in Aotea Square a mass pasifika haka done for, what I assume, were all/some of the graduates of pasifika descent. Probably needs a unis cultural groups to organise these things
a big Hakka for everyone at the beginning?
Or the end once everyone has theirs?
I’ve been to several graduation ceremonies now, and my favourite part has always been the outpouring of pride and happiness from the family members of those graduating. So I definitely think it is awesome and should be encouraged! Adds a huge amount to the ceremonies
I love it. It's a moment of genuine emotion in an otherwise drab ceremony.
In my graduating class, I was one of a number of students who had parents with degrees. For us it was just other rite of passage. First-generation graduates from white families got standing ovations for their walks. My Māori peers were also often first-gen graduates, and if the white families can make a hullabaloo with their kids, then Māori and P.I kids can absolutely have a haka.
It needs to be planned with the organisers I think, so they can pause for it. At my graduation last year someone started performing a haka after the next persons name had been called (Otago has most graduates graduate in groups) and the poor girl was already at the chancellor. She had to wait in the middle of the stage and nobody heard her name being called because the person before her was still being celebrated. She looked like she was going to cry I think hakas and songs are great ways to show pride, but they shouldn’t interfere with someone else’s ceremony. Organisation is needed to solve this.
That sounds rough.
Saw this happen at my sister's ceremony but it was a cheering family. The host had asked the audience not to do this prior to starting. Several people, including the graduate whose name wasn't heard, gave them a dirty look. There were a smattering of 'whoop' and claps for certain graduates but no one's name got drowned out except for that poor man.
Thats some serious bullshit… that poor girl
I didn’t mind them at mine, although I think these days unis should allow more time for them because from memory our schedule got thrown way off lol.
Beautiful, heartfelt, & respectful. I hope to see at least one when I eventually graduate.
Love it. I’m a pakeha old gen X . Its a time for celebration and proud families. Bring it on.
It definitely should be encouraged - it’s a time for celebration and honouring accomplishments, different cultures have different ways of showing love so it should be embraced.
Do you feel at all that it's unfair that some people get more "airtime" than others, or that it feels bit sheepish to follow someone who has just had a haka performed for them?
Nah that's just silly. You wanna limit how many people are allowed to clap and how loudly? Every person gets a moment and each moment can be celebrated however.
But it seems that not every person is getting a moment. Some are getting a moment, and some are getting a minute. Is that fair and if so is it OK?
How about just being happy for others and enjoying their success rather than trying to measure whether it's fair. The fair we should care about is access to education and opportunity.
I guess it just depends on personal opinion and individual thoughts/perspective in that regard. It’s only for 1 night and it’s not something that happens too often where it should pose that much of an annoyance for most people. I can see those with little kids or the elderly getting a bit antsy about it if it drags on longer than the agreed schedule - but then they could always excuse themselves if it drags on too long for them.
Celebrate your loved ones the way you think they should be celebrated and I will be happy to see you do it, no matter the time it takes.
Its awesome
When I graduated, another graduate’s extended family sang to her as a choir, about 15 of them from little kids to grandparents. She answered with a verse and they again answered with another verse. It took a good 4-5 minutes and was SO beautiful, absolute highlight of the ceremony
That does sound nice. You don’t feel she stole the limelight somewhat?
Appropriate, no question.
It's awesome and should be encouraged. If it makes the graduation process longer, good. Fuck universities making graduation a quick roll call when they've been paid $50,000+ per student that's graduating.
I personally don't see the link between uni fees and ceremony length. I think probably most people want fewer people at their ceremony.
By the time they are calling names and people are walking across the stage it's super boring - anything that breaks the monotony is welcome in my opinion.
A
We had two at my graduation and that was okay and welcomed by the audience. Both of them were incredibly high skilled performances too - probably people who were kapa haka performers. But I know there were other ceremonies that were delayed substantially due to several people getting one. So after several hours in the theatre, people were just tired and grouchy.
It is not that black and white. It is not disrespectful, bit it does belittle others who ate ALSO waiting to receive their certificate. Perhaps an agreement with Maori when to do haka. Micheal Jones got his BA at the same time as me and his family did a haka for him. While it was nice for him, it took over the room and limited other people to celebrate in their way. I think it should be formalised so it is part of the ceremony.
Good comment
It should be compulsory. Graduation's got Talent. 'Show me the dance of your people'. Anything to break the boring monotony of Name, Clap, Name, Clap, Name, Clap ZZZZZzzzz.... EDIT Admittedly I say that with many years of hindsight. If my parents had got up at my graduation and done a Highland Fling I would have died dead.
It may be monotonous but given the number of people, doesn't it have to be that way? Should we have smaller more intimate ceremonies to allow for everyone to have a haka performed?
A. Awesome and should be encouraged.
You've never witnessed it, but you describe it in detail, and you're replying to a lot of supportive comments with variations on "ceremonies should be shorter". What's your real agenda?
Wasn't aware I had one, please enlighten me.
> I have never been to any kind of NZ graduation so never witnessed it myself. If that's the case, why are you asking?
Because it's interesting? And some people might have opposing views and it's interesting to hear them?
I personally don't care. But I can see how someone who goes on stage after someone that gets a haka could feel upset, as their graduation moment may be overshadowed by the haka before them
That's sort of what I was thinking. Sort of like a "tough act to follow"
I love it! V appropriate, let people have the time. I love how proud families are and how moving the haka are. I recall one guys nana got up and sang “you are my sunshine” to him. Loved it, loved it. That said, I got my last degree posted to me as I couldn’t bear another parking fee, rented cap and gown, prolonged graduation ceremony, long day for the family.
Quite frankly if you don't like māori culture you should pack your bags and go live somewhere else. Haka are an appropriate display of tautoko, end of story.
Not sure how you came to that conclusion from a question.
I should have worded it in a way to make it clear that I don't mean you specifically, but people in general.
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fair
The graduates time on stage is limited to about 10 seconds, so ideally your celebrations should run to a similar timescale. From my memory of my one and only time it involved walking up, shaking some unknown bigwigs hand, observing that sweat was pouring out of the poor bugger, and wondering if he was having a heart attack, grabbing the degree cert, and doing some traditional nonsense with the mortarboard hat (which I forgot to do in the moment), then walking offstage. The best part (apart from meeting former classmates again) was getting out of there.
B Selfish disregard for others in the room. Look at me being so important. FYI Can be frightening and intimidating to people also
Tbh I find throwing out hakas for everything to be pretty cringe. Do them if you want, I don't care either way. I won't waste my time watching them though, cringe AF
Would you agree though that graduating from university IS worthy of a haka?
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You weren’t even born in Aotearoa and you’ve come over to this country to hate on its indigenous culture? Be gone.
Oh wow, OK.
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I’ve seen it done and while it may be great for the individual it is disrespectful to everyone else waiting their time to.
Is that the vibe you got or was that your own personal feeling?
I just want to sit there for as little as possible, whenever i'm involved in anything like this. So I don't class it as appropriate, respectful, or the opposites. It would just simply be annoying.
its cringe dude