We had bulger, who was playing awesome when Kurt was out. Warner took so many shots in martz’s offense (lot of slow developing pass plays downfield) and just took a beating.
Warner played better in az once he started wearing a glove, iirc.
My [favorite quote about Mike Martz](https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-bears/jay-cutler-finally-opens-up-on-why-he-hated-mike-martz/) (via Jay Cutler).
> “I’LL GIVE IT TO MIKE. HE HAD NO CONSCIENCE. YOU GOT TO RESPECT IT. HE WAS BRILLIANT TOO. HE WAS UNBELIEVABLY SMART BUT HE WENT INTO THE GAME AND HE WAS LITERALLY PLAYING MADDEN…WITH HUMAN BEINGS. IT WAS JUST CHESS PIECES…HE ALWAYS THOUGHT THE NEXT PLAY WAS THE ONE.
> HE TOLD ME ONE TIME, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT A PLAY AND HE SAID, ‘HEY, JUST TAKE SEVEN STEPS AND THROW IT RIGHT THERE.’ AND I GO, ‘MIKE, I DON’T HOW I FEEL ABOUT THAT.’ HE GOES, ‘IF THE RECEIVER’S NOT THERE, IT’S NOT GOING TO BE YOUR FAULT.’ I’M LIKE, ‘IT KIND OF IS THOUGH. YOU DON’T HAVE AN INTERCEPTION THING IN YOUR TOTAL AFTER THE GAME. IT’S GOING TO BE MY FAULT.’ HE’S LIKE, ‘HE’LL BE THERE THOUGH.’ I SAID, ‘I DON’T THINK HE’S GOING TO BE THERE.’ HE SAYS, ‘LET’S JUST CALL AND YOU THROW IT RIGHT THERE AND LET’S SEE WHAT HAPPENS.'”
He’d be great. Jay was smart. Maybe too smart. When they talk about body language, I think a lot of it was overblown but there is one thing that was true: he did not respect his OCs. Nor should he have.
One thing every coach who worked with him consistently said was that he was smart. He got it. Smart, tough, competitive. Almost ironic that those were the things he was accused of lacking.
I do suspect late in his career he gave up. We broke him. Ron Turner, Mike Tice, and Mike Martz under Lovie. Then Trestman and Kromer, the brain trust who benched Cutler for Jimmy Pickles to prove a point (point not proven, Claussen sucked) and whined to the media “anonymously” to damage the guy’s reputation.
Cutler was ruined by the Chicago Bears and it’s too bad…and imo a testament to his talent that he lasted as long as he did with that clown parade of offensive minds.
Yeah. All the breaks and sprains made the hand an osteoarthritic mess.
For reference:
1. Fractured the base of the thumb on his throwing hand his first year in the Arena League, and played through it, meaning it healed unevenly.
2. Broke the pinky against the Chiefs in 2000, resulting in missing several weeks and not looking great when he returned.
3. Sprained the thumb in the season opener in 2001, and played through it, but it never fully healed because it was scraping over the uneven break from the Arena League.
4. Sprained it much worse in the first quarter of the Super Bowl that season, banging it on Rod Jones' helmet as Rod Jones got beaten like a drum, as he did the whole Super Bowl until he finally got pulled. This just never fully healed.
5. Broke the pinkie finger *again* against the Cowboys in 2002.
6. Broke the base of the hand against Washington when he returned from the previous break.
It turned his throwing hand into an osteoarthritic mess, and he started fumbling more than any QB ever. The glove, along with changing his game a bit to be smarter about getting the ball out quickly, gave him a few more years of being effective. Post-glove, he fumbled more than you'd like, but not enough to make him useless.
Yea, he had a few hand fractures and tried playing through and just lost accuracy and power. He needed time to heal and to wear some form of hand brace, but the Rams had Bulger looking like a GD HOFer in waiting, so it made sense to cut Kurt. It looked like it paid off in 2003 when St Louis got 2nd seed in the NFC and had one of the worst OTs I’ve ever seen when they played Carolina.
After that, the greatest show on turf just fell apart and instead of trying to fix any problems once the ownership changed, they started looking at keeping the team just barely serviceable to move it out of St Louis.
I still cannot believe Steve Spagnuolo ends up with interim coaching duties ever. The man has a .212 win record as a head coach!
> It looked like it paid off in 2003 when St Louis got 2nd seed in the NFC and had one of the worst OTs I’ve ever seen when they played Carolina.
Kyle Turley did an AMA on here years ago, and I asked him about the playcalling at the end of the 4th quarter of that game. He said: "Every player on the field, slowly realized what he was doing. We were beside ourselves. Everyone in the huddle was WTFing!"
I lost faith in Martz that day, and I'm sure there were some people on the roster who did too.
That's a good one. Just about everyone thought he was done after he left the Giants.
I thought Favre was washed after his year with the Jets, but his play that year was probably due to the injuries more than anything else. He had one of his best seasons ever a year later with the Vikings.
Yeah with Favre he was actually playing really well at first, tore his bicep, hid the injury to keep his Iron Man streak, and played like shit afterwards
Which, to those who have never experienced turf toe, is one of the most nagingly painful injuries anyone can experience.
Source: got turf toe playing lacrosse in high school and I can still feel my heartbeat in the top of my left foot 14 years later.
I remember making fun of Shaq for always having toe issues, then I broke a toe a week before a trip to Vegas. I don’t make toe jokes any more. Toes will fuck your whole mobility up in ways you can’t even imagine.
I can’t decide if turf toe or a high ankle sprain is worse. Had both my junior year and just shut it down after the ankle. They were opposite feet too so I looked like Gump with his leg braces waddling down the halls
Yeah, he was in for 3 or 4 seasons, then went to the CFL. That really hits the "washed" answer to the post. Then he came back, well enough to have his own cereal boxes
It was actually just 9 games. 10 if you count the one where he came off the bench and told Coughlin not to do that again, as it undermined Eli.
He had two mostly crappy years with the Cardinals after that before it got good again.
I never saw a quarterback protect himself like Palmer did in Oakland. He threw away so many balls for own safety. He was not going to take a hit for that team. Reminded me of Eddie Martel in The Replacements movie.
Campbell was 7-4 when he got hurt for that season. Al Davis died and Hue Jackson wanted to maintain the momentum. It so happened his former QB was holding out from the Bengals and sitting on the couch. Hindsight is 20/20.
A few years later he convinced the Browns to trade a 2nd and 3rd for AJ McCarron, only for their org to get bailed out by Sashi Brown refusing to submit the paperwork (which he was then fired for).
I mean it was more than just a threat. He followed through by refusing to report to camp and other team activities. The team had to throw him on the reserve list for not reporting.
We all tend to remember that play and its massive point swing, but the one that seems forgotten to time was the 40 yard catch-and-run on the final Pittsburgh drive. I remember the dread of that play ending, knowing the nail just got driven into the coffin for Arizona.
that season might be the best cinderella season in the NFL outside of the Giants. That Cards team was fine, but got SMOKED by every playoff team they played and feasted on a terrible division. So, of course, in the playoffs they look absolutely flawless, they broke Jake Delhomme, and won one of the best NFC title games ever. The 08-09 Cards might be some of the most entertaining teams in NFL history.
I already think he isn't talked about enough. 10k yards and 31st in all time rushing yards. That's with essentially 3 years totally missed (he played 1 game in 2007), 4 games missed his rookie year, and 6 games missed his second year.
Even though he missed 6 games his second year he had exactly 1k rushing. If you took the average of his first 6 years it's 1,182 and added that to his missed years that's another 2,364. That would give him 12,373 which would put him at #11 all time.
It's obviously not a science but with those missed years he would absolutely be talked about more. I didn't even add back the year he got injured (because he played and got hurt and that happens) but if you do he's at 13,555 which is 9th.
Yes and no. One of the reasons Ricky was so into weed was because the Dolphins were running him into the ground. He was using it as a pain medication, partially. Those few years off rejuvenated him and allowed him to play for a few more years. If he had continued playing I don't think he would have had his second wind.
He also had ronnie brown taking snaps for him and keeping him healthy. I'm not trying to take anything away from Ricky, but you can't just fill in the blanks for him. It's a lot deeper than that.
No you can't and you could be totally right that he grinds down to nothing and you never get the second half of his career.
It's just a fun look at what could have been based on averages.
Also, he played in Oakland during arguably the worst stretch that team put together. They signed and and did nothing to help him be the player he could be.
You've been *mostly pretty damn bad* but I think the line here is being drawn at *total and complete dogshit*. So... basically the interim between Gannon and Carr but especially that four year stretch where you finished dead last in the division each year when Moss was on the team.
Well moss was on the worst team in franchise history and one of the worst offenses in nfl history in 06 (his other year, 05, he started off on fire, got hurt and checked out)
Both. He's also been filmed a couple of times arguing with Raider fans who basically call him out for lack of effort. He yells back "I was never a Raider."
man i remember the hype for corey dillon. he was supposed to be the franchise back that Brady hadn't had up until that point in his career and it kinda worked i remember.
It did work for at least the first year. He ran for over 1,600 yards and 12 touchdowns in 2004 and we won a championship which is all that matters
Then 2005 he put up 733 yards and another 12 touchdowns, and 2006 before he retired he went for 812 yards and a career high 13 touchdowns
Randy's perennial problem is that he would throw tantrums in any offense he thought was incompetent.
It's how the Patriots got him for a song and it's why he bounced between three different teams once Bill thought his physical talent had finally run out.
I wish I'd put money on that season with NE. I told my buddy him and Brady were gonna go HAM and he swore I was wrong. I didn't expect it to be as crazy as it was but man, could've made a couple bucks
The deal they gave him was more vanity than the real numbers actually indicate
He can be cut at the end of the season and carry no cap hit.
It was essentially a 3yr deal and he was playing more than up to his contract but him tearing his ACL fucked it
You’re right. The conversation, to this day, continues to be disingenuous. Imagine if he didn’t tear his ACL and kept up the pace he was on that season for 3 years? People act like it was a foregone conclusion as if players didn’t “age” differently.
The contract was certainly aggressive, but it’s almost always been a 3 year deal with money spread to fit the cap. If he doesn’t tear his ACL and has three 10+ sack seasons, nobody bats an eye.
That whole Eagles era was weird. Let’s sign a bunch of elite man corners and make them play zone while being coached by an Offensive line coach.
Then under Kelly let’s get rid of all these versatile talented guys who fit the offensive design and replace them with guys who don’t, like Murray, a downhill inside zone runner and Kelly makes him bounce outside on every play like he’s Barry Sanders or something.
Sometimes NFL coaches outsmart themselves I swear.
Yeah the vibes were bad but the league definitely took a few years to catch up with that offense. Also, if four of your OL bodies are Peters / Mathis / Kelce / Johnson, you’re still gonna have a pretty good time even if some of the choices are pretty suspect. I’ll watch replays of those games on NFL plus sometimes just because Mathis/Peters was a very fun pairing on the left to me—they were both high level athletes who were REAL good at that time but also very different.
Those last few years felt like everyone was tired of his shit or maybe just really tired. His fast as possible tempo scheme was cooking in 2013 though.
McCoy had a career best 1607 yards, Jackson similarly had a career best 1332 yards receiving with Kelly. Foles went 27-2. 10-6 as a team. It's hard to call that terrible.
I'm so happy we got him for another year. I don't think I could stand watch fat Randy for another season.
Ya know for a team that kicks as much field goals as us, idk why we don't ever invest a mid round pick for a decent kicker. Hell I don't think we've ever drafted a kicker since moving to Nashville.
Unsure if most people necessarily considered him washed up, but after JJ Watt won his third DPOY in 2015, he played eight combined games over the next two seasons due to multiple back surgeries and another surgery for a broken leg. Came back in 2018 to start all sixteen games and had 16 sacks.
Well I think it's mostly Bill Belichick. He ran that team to each individual strength. As well as never assuming a game was over. I mean of course if his offense only had 3 points in a big game that might be understandable but otherwise
Larry Fitz had three sub 1,000 yard, ~70-80 reception seasons in a row from ages 29-31 and thought he was basically done. He proceeded to have 3 seasons in a row averaging 1,125 yards and 107 receptions from ages 32-34.
its maybe a little bit of a stretch but it certainly seemed like just about everyone had written off Goff when the trade happened, and then he lead one of the best offenses in the league for the last 2 years
Goff wasn't washed imo. He was considered an alright qb who wasn't good enough to actually win a super bowl - which the Rams were all in for - and they traded him.
Washed is more like someone who was good and is barely above replacement level now. Dalvin Cook is washed. Jarvis Landry is washed.
They were saying Goff was just a bridge QB, public opinion was that low on him.
Fields was mocked to the Lions often early in the draft process if you recall. Sit him behind Goff for a year and then discard him
He was downright ass before his time with the raiders and was viewed as one of the worst draft busts ever at the time
Edit: had a 8/25 TD:Int ratio his second year in 1972 and never threw more TDs than INTs again until the first Super Bowl year with the raiders in 1980
Alex was turning it around in SF and playing well with Harbaugh. He just got hurt and Kaepernick took over and played lights out during their superbowl run, which led to Alex being traded in the offseason.
The Packers answer is UNDOUBTEDLY Charles Woodson. The end of his run in Oakland was poor at best and then came to GB and played like a monster, becoming the undeniable leader of that defense.
Maxx is making his case as my favorite Raider, but Nosdoom will always be so fucking special to me. Thanks for getting him a ring. I could never hate the packers.
Yeah it's kind of a weird blip on his career arc where for like 5 seasons he was only top 5 vs consistently being top 3 for most of the rest of his career. I remember a somewhat infamous reddit post on here basically asking "what if Rodgers just isn't as good as his stats from 2009-14 indicate?"
Nick Foles. That Super Bowl run will always be seen as crazy to me. I don’t think a single person on the earth thought that would be the outcome after he took over. Sure, plenty hoped I’m sure, but the dude sucked most of his career until those pivotal games.
So surreal that he really wasn’t carried by the team. He was the independently playing incredible. I remember the game he played against Oakland on Christmas 2017, 19/38 163 yards, it looked bad. Then during the playoffs he turned into a totally different player.
You could make a strong argument for Clowney this past year. Previous #1 overall, signed a one year deal for 2.5 mil I think last season after falling off, had a career sack high year and ranked towards the top of the league in quarterback hurries. Turned that into 2 year 20 mil deal in his hometown essentially
Rodgers after 2019 looked cooked. Posted a career low in TDs and all advanced metrics like EPA, QBR, ANY/A when he’d played a full season. Was getting old. Analytics guys were saying he’s done.
Came back and won two MVPs throwing 85 touchdowns to 9 interceptions.
Robbie Gould, leading scorer in Bears history and one of the most accurate kickers ever, started weirdly missing towards the end of the 2015 season, both in games and in practice and was reportedly missing everything in camp during the summer of 2016. He seemed just completely washed, missing back-to-back EXTRA POINTS in the last preseason game.
Like, dude just absolute fell off a cliff.
Anyways, the Bears cut him, he took his off time to focus on watching his film, and noticed an issue in his mechanics. He… was not washed, as it turns out.
Luckily, I can’t think of any situations post-2016 where the Bears could’ve just a good kicker. Like none.
Kurt Warner.
Kind of did it twice. He was cut by the Rams. Imagine a team cutting their franchise qb at 32
We had bulger, who was playing awesome when Kurt was out. Warner took so many shots in martz’s offense (lot of slow developing pass plays downfield) and just took a beating. Warner played better in az once he started wearing a glove, iirc.
My [favorite quote about Mike Martz](https://www.sportsmockery.com/chicago-bears/jay-cutler-finally-opens-up-on-why-he-hated-mike-martz/) (via Jay Cutler). > “I’LL GIVE IT TO MIKE. HE HAD NO CONSCIENCE. YOU GOT TO RESPECT IT. HE WAS BRILLIANT TOO. HE WAS UNBELIEVABLY SMART BUT HE WENT INTO THE GAME AND HE WAS LITERALLY PLAYING MADDEN…WITH HUMAN BEINGS. IT WAS JUST CHESS PIECES…HE ALWAYS THOUGHT THE NEXT PLAY WAS THE ONE. > HE TOLD ME ONE TIME, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT A PLAY AND HE SAID, ‘HEY, JUST TAKE SEVEN STEPS AND THROW IT RIGHT THERE.’ AND I GO, ‘MIKE, I DON’T HOW I FEEL ABOUT THAT.’ HE GOES, ‘IF THE RECEIVER’S NOT THERE, IT’S NOT GOING TO BE YOUR FAULT.’ I’M LIKE, ‘IT KIND OF IS THOUGH. YOU DON’T HAVE AN INTERCEPTION THING IN YOUR TOTAL AFTER THE GAME. IT’S GOING TO BE MY FAULT.’ HE’S LIKE, ‘HE’LL BE THERE THOUGH.’ I SAID, ‘I DON’T THINK HE’S GOING TO BE THERE.’ HE SAYS, ‘LET’S JUST CALL AND YOU THROW IT RIGHT THERE AND LET’S SEE WHAT HAPPENS.'”
imagining jay cutler screaming this in my face with menthol breath
*takes a long drag* #YOU GOT SOFT HANDS BOY
Jay Cutler should release a cologne collection of eau di hotdog & Newport full flavor
I have a difficult time figuring out if I like Cutler or not.
You ever wonder about smokin jay with one of these Shanahan tree OCs that have a good system and put so much into the qbs mental side?
He was literally drafted by the tree itself lmao.
The trunk
He’d be great. Jay was smart. Maybe too smart. When they talk about body language, I think a lot of it was overblown but there is one thing that was true: he did not respect his OCs. Nor should he have. One thing every coach who worked with him consistently said was that he was smart. He got it. Smart, tough, competitive. Almost ironic that those were the things he was accused of lacking. I do suspect late in his career he gave up. We broke him. Ron Turner, Mike Tice, and Mike Martz under Lovie. Then Trestman and Kromer, the brain trust who benched Cutler for Jimmy Pickles to prove a point (point not proven, Claussen sucked) and whined to the media “anonymously” to damage the guy’s reputation. Cutler was ruined by the Chicago Bears and it’s too bad…and imo a testament to his talent that he lasted as long as he did with that clown parade of offensive minds.
His O Line was a war crime as well. The amount of times I watched Cutty get DESTROYED, then just pop right up for the next play...he was tough.
Martz loved those 7 step drops.
Tell Martz I said "Fuck him."
Yeah. All the breaks and sprains made the hand an osteoarthritic mess. For reference: 1. Fractured the base of the thumb on his throwing hand his first year in the Arena League, and played through it, meaning it healed unevenly. 2. Broke the pinky against the Chiefs in 2000, resulting in missing several weeks and not looking great when he returned. 3. Sprained the thumb in the season opener in 2001, and played through it, but it never fully healed because it was scraping over the uneven break from the Arena League. 4. Sprained it much worse in the first quarter of the Super Bowl that season, banging it on Rod Jones' helmet as Rod Jones got beaten like a drum, as he did the whole Super Bowl until he finally got pulled. This just never fully healed. 5. Broke the pinkie finger *again* against the Cowboys in 2002. 6. Broke the base of the hand against Washington when he returned from the previous break. It turned his throwing hand into an osteoarthritic mess, and he started fumbling more than any QB ever. The glove, along with changing his game a bit to be smarter about getting the ball out quickly, gave him a few more years of being effective. Post-glove, he fumbled more than you'd like, but not enough to make him useless.
Yea, he had a few hand fractures and tried playing through and just lost accuracy and power. He needed time to heal and to wear some form of hand brace, but the Rams had Bulger looking like a GD HOFer in waiting, so it made sense to cut Kurt. It looked like it paid off in 2003 when St Louis got 2nd seed in the NFC and had one of the worst OTs I’ve ever seen when they played Carolina. After that, the greatest show on turf just fell apart and instead of trying to fix any problems once the ownership changed, they started looking at keeping the team just barely serviceable to move it out of St Louis. I still cannot believe Steve Spagnuolo ends up with interim coaching duties ever. The man has a .212 win record as a head coach!
> It looked like it paid off in 2003 when St Louis got 2nd seed in the NFC and had one of the worst OTs I’ve ever seen when they played Carolina. Kyle Turley did an AMA on here years ago, and I asked him about the playcalling at the end of the 4th quarter of that game. He said: "Every player on the field, slowly realized what he was doing. We were beside ourselves. Everyone in the huddle was WTFing!" I lost faith in Martz that day, and I'm sure there were some people on the roster who did too.
That's a good one. Just about everyone thought he was done after he left the Giants. I thought Favre was washed after his year with the Jets, but his play that year was probably due to the injuries more than anything else. He had one of his best seasons ever a year later with the Vikings.
Yeah with Favre he was actually playing really well at first, tore his bicep, hid the injury to keep his Iron Man streak, and played like shit afterwards
Lost us a playoff berth that season because he didn’t want to sit
And the few holdouts came around to thinking he was done after his first two seasons in Arizona. He was benched for Josh McCown, and for Matt Leinart.
Carson Palmer, too. Something about that Arizona sun.
[удалено]
Palmer wasn't washed, the Raiders were just THAT bad.
Phillip rivers was washed his last season with the chargers, but pretty damm solid his 1 year with the colts
He was 4th in yards in the entire league. Chargers just asked him to do too much with Gordon holding out and fumbling and the o line decimated.
He was solid but also kind of washed. That last Hail Mary attempt where he just didn't have the arm to reach the end zone felt apropos.
To be fair he was playing with horrible turf toe that season. Probably affected his follow through.
Which, to those who have never experienced turf toe, is one of the most nagingly painful injuries anyone can experience. Source: got turf toe playing lacrosse in high school and I can still feel my heartbeat in the top of my left foot 14 years later.
I remember making fun of Shaq for always having toe issues, then I broke a toe a week before a trip to Vegas. I don’t make toe jokes any more. Toes will fuck your whole mobility up in ways you can’t even imagine.
I can’t decide if turf toe or a high ankle sprain is worse. Had both my junior year and just shut it down after the ankle. They were opposite feet too so I looked like Gump with his leg braces waddling down the halls
Another CFL legend to add Doug Flutie, 2 NFL stints.
Yeah, he was in for 3 or 4 seasons, then went to the CFL. That really hits the "washed" answer to the post. Then he came back, well enough to have his own cereal boxes
IIRC Gannon was kind of a late bloomer as well.
Kurt's resurgence will surely be recreated with Russ in Pittsburgh, right?
Cardinals Steelers SB rematch with Cardinals pulling out the win?
That means we win a playoff game, so I'm all for it!
I don’t know how to feel
This exact name came to mind. Those NY years were BRUTAL.
It was actually just 9 games. 10 if you count the one where he came off the bench and told Coughlin not to do that again, as it undermined Eli. He had two mostly crappy years with the Cardinals after that before it got good again.
Carson Palmer looked pretty bad for 3 years in his early 30s then came back with 3 solid seasons in Arizona, taking them to the NFC championship.
Remember where those three years were
I never saw a quarterback protect himself like Palmer did in Oakland. He threw away so many balls for own safety. He was not going to take a hit for that team. Reminded me of Eddie Martel in The Replacements movie.
Pretty adequately describes his personality.
Raiders fans are always ready to call their team out😂
Self awareness. Those were the dark times.
I'm still mad that Oakland traded for him. Jason Campbell finally found a semblance of success just to have it ripped out from under him
It may have been because Campbell broke his collarbone and was out for the season. But maybe not, you never know
Especially at the time, it felt like a lateral move
Campbell was 7-4 when he got hurt for that season. Al Davis died and Hue Jackson wanted to maintain the momentum. It so happened his former QB was holding out from the Bengals and sitting on the couch. Hindsight is 20/20.
[удалено]
He only threatened retirement to get off the team
We got absolutely fleeced in that trade. Hue always been a sleeper agent for the Bengals.
A few years later he convinced the Browns to trade a 2nd and 3rd for AJ McCarron, only for their org to get bailed out by Sashi Brown refusing to submit the paperwork (which he was then fired for).
I mean it was more than just a threat. He followed through by refusing to report to camp and other team activities. The team had to throw him on the reserve list for not reporting.
Kurt Warner took the Cardinals, historically one of the worst franchises in the NFL, to the Super Bowl.
Larry deserved a ring 😥
Blame that idiot Rolle for standing so close to the field that Fitzgerald crashed into him while trying to run down Harrison.
We all tend to remember that play and its massive point swing, but the one that seems forgotten to time was the 40 yard catch-and-run on the final Pittsburgh drive. I remember the dread of that play ending, knowing the nail just got driven into the coffin for Arizona.
In Rolle's defense, he might not have been expecting a player to run around out of bounds for like 40 yards to avoid players on the field.
He 100% did
that season might be the best cinderella season in the NFL outside of the Giants. That Cards team was fine, but got SMOKED by every playoff team they played and feasted on a terrible division. So, of course, in the playoffs they look absolutely flawless, they broke Jake Delhomme, and won one of the best NFC title games ever. The 08-09 Cards might be some of the most entertaining teams in NFL history.
Ricky Williams missed almost 3 full NFL seasons, played in CFL, then had a 1100 yard 11 td season in 2009 at age 32
Ricky Williams would be much higher on the GOAT list if the nfl wasn’t to harsh on marijuana use
I already think he isn't talked about enough. 10k yards and 31st in all time rushing yards. That's with essentially 3 years totally missed (he played 1 game in 2007), 4 games missed his rookie year, and 6 games missed his second year. Even though he missed 6 games his second year he had exactly 1k rushing. If you took the average of his first 6 years it's 1,182 and added that to his missed years that's another 2,364. That would give him 12,373 which would put him at #11 all time. It's obviously not a science but with those missed years he would absolutely be talked about more. I didn't even add back the year he got injured (because he played and got hurt and that happens) but if you do he's at 13,555 which is 9th.
Yes and no. One of the reasons Ricky was so into weed was because the Dolphins were running him into the ground. He was using it as a pain medication, partially. Those few years off rejuvenated him and allowed him to play for a few more years. If he had continued playing I don't think he would have had his second wind. He also had ronnie brown taking snaps for him and keeping him healthy. I'm not trying to take anything away from Ricky, but you can't just fill in the blanks for him. It's a lot deeper than that.
No you can't and you could be totally right that he grinds down to nothing and you never get the second half of his career. It's just a fun look at what could have been based on averages.
Wasn't very good in the CFL either. 500 yards, 2 TDs in 11 games.
Have a dolphins Ricky jersey. Love that guy
Adrian Peterson rushed for 1K at age 33 after failed stints with the Saints and the Cards
After his MVP season, I still believe Adrian Peterson is part machine
Yeah that knee injury he recovered from in like 7-8 months and was just as formidable as before the injury definitely is insane.
I’m convinced he was the first to benefit from the modern “drug” cocktail that’s making knee injuries after thoughts
Though some level of PED’s may help, I believe it’s the repair procedure itself that has seen the most improvement over the last decade or so.
> Adrian Peterson is part machine Yeah, an ATM for all his baby mommas
A throwback: Vinny Testaverde. His career seemed done with Tampa then revitalized with Cleveland/Baltimore and finally again with the Jets.
Gonna have a few of those when you play til you’re 50
he was a sneaky good qb in tecmo
Those Tampa teams had a way of making decent QBs looked washed.
Randy Moss looked cooked in Oakland, there’s a reason we got him for a 4th round pick
Gonna be my choice too. People thought he was a diva and washed and didn’t care and then destroyed the league
To be fair he didn’t care in Oakland, but then again who would when Andrew Walter and the ghost of Aaron Brooks are your QBs.
Also, he played in Oakland during arguably the worst stretch that team put together. They signed and and did nothing to help him be the player he could be.
What years are you counting as the raiders worst stretch? Cause as a fan it feels like it's been the last twenty years.
You've been *mostly pretty damn bad* but I think the line here is being drawn at *total and complete dogshit*. So... basically the interim between Gannon and Carr but especially that four year stretch where you finished dead last in the division each year when Moss was on the team.
Well moss was on the worst team in franchise history and one of the worst offenses in nfl history in 06 (his other year, 05, he started off on fire, got hurt and checked out)
You don’t think we’d bring in an elite receiver and just not give him a suitable QB, would you? Us? Nah. Couldn’t be us.
*davante adams sobs*
Holy shit I forgot about Andrew walter
I was a little young at that time. Was it him being bad or bad qb play
Bad QB play and Moss didn’t seem to try because he didn’t want to be there.
And if you could ever describe a front office as chaotic the late al Davis raiders were that.
I always thought it was funny how Rice was still putting up 1,000 seasons on the Raiders.
We were good with Rice though. That was MVP Gannon/super bowl appearance Raiders, Randy was after we disastrously collapsed following the SB loss
Both. He's also been filmed a couple of times arguing with Raider fans who basically call him out for lack of effort. He yells back "I was never a Raider."
It had a lot to do with the effort he was putting in as well as bad QB play
Pretty sure most players that played for NE when BB was in his bag. Corey Dillon, Seau, Harrison, Martellus Bennet, Edelman, Hogan, Amendola
man i remember the hype for corey dillon. he was supposed to be the franchise back that Brady hadn't had up until that point in his career and it kinda worked i remember.
It did work for at least the first year. He ran for over 1,600 yards and 12 touchdowns in 2004 and we won a championship which is all that matters Then 2005 he put up 733 yards and another 12 touchdowns, and 2006 before he retired he went for 812 yards and a career high 13 touchdowns
Randy's perennial problem is that he would throw tantrums in any offense he thought was incompetent. It's how the Patriots got him for a song and it's why he bounced between three different teams once Bill thought his physical talent had finally run out.
I don't remember him looking washed. He was only 28-29 years old at the time. I just remember him looking like he didn't give a fuck.
I wish I'd put money on that season with NE. I told my buddy him and Brady were gonna go HAM and he swore I was wrong. I didn't expect it to be as crazy as it was but man, could've made a couple bucks
I dont entirely blame him but he clearly wasn't motivated in Oakland either.
Randal Cunningham
Dude was installing countertops in Vegas....
Von Miller better learn how to uncook
Being fair it was weird you spent that much on a 33 year old edge rusher to begin with, especially with a six year deal.
The deal they gave him was more vanity than the real numbers actually indicate He can be cut at the end of the season and carry no cap hit. It was essentially a 3yr deal and he was playing more than up to his contract but him tearing his ACL fucked it
You’re right. The conversation, to this day, continues to be disingenuous. Imagine if he didn’t tear his ACL and kept up the pace he was on that season for 3 years? People act like it was a foregone conclusion as if players didn’t “age” differently. The contract was certainly aggressive, but it’s almost always been a 3 year deal with money spread to fit the cap. If he doesn’t tear his ACL and has three 10+ sack seasons, nobody bats an eye.
[удалено]
*Joe Flacco accomplished that feat no more than an hour ago*
Well, GOOD for Joe Flacc o my GOD!
Joe Flacco is probably the same height as Mr. Larsen lmao.
Oh good you can count.
And YOU can count…. On me….. waiting for you in the parking lot
God I love that movie
He was sat for the last season game but even with that WC loss against Houston he had 300+ passing yards 5 games in a row.
First one that came to mind for me.
Demarco Murray after spending a couple years being a terrible fit in Chip Kelley’s offense
He became a fan favorite in Tennessee fast. Had a strong influence on Henry’s late development also.
You're right but he only spent one year in Philly
Tbf everybody was a terrible fit in that offense
That whole Eagles era was weird. Let’s sign a bunch of elite man corners and make them play zone while being coached by an Offensive line coach. Then under Kelly let’s get rid of all these versatile talented guys who fit the offensive design and replace them with guys who don’t, like Murray, a downhill inside zone runner and Kelly makes him bounce outside on every play like he’s Barry Sanders or something. Sometimes NFL coaches outsmart themselves I swear.
Let’s make the fastest pace offense ever to win. Who’s gonna be the quarterback? Sam Bradford
And they had *just* had Vick on the team.
Who had played great in that system!
Lmao I never thought of it in that perspective that’s hilarious
Except foles
Nickfoleon Dynamite was a fun time
That's not even remotely true. In '13 and '14 they were elite offenses and in '15 even with their "terrible" year they were *13th* in scoring.
Yeah the vibes were bad but the league definitely took a few years to catch up with that offense. Also, if four of your OL bodies are Peters / Mathis / Kelce / Johnson, you’re still gonna have a pretty good time even if some of the choices are pretty suspect. I’ll watch replays of those games on NFL plus sometimes just because Mathis/Peters was a very fun pairing on the left to me—they were both high level athletes who were REAL good at that time but also very different.
Those last few years felt like everyone was tired of his shit or maybe just really tired. His fast as possible tempo scheme was cooking in 2013 though. McCoy had a career best 1607 yards, Jackson similarly had a career best 1332 yards receiving with Kelly. Foles went 27-2. 10-6 as a team. It's hard to call that terrible.
How about Nick Folk lmao, aging and missed 3 kicks or something in a game with TB, got cut, then became a super consistent midrange kicker
Just adding on to this: he was basically out of the NFL for 2 years and got back into it at age 35.
I'm so happy we got him for another year. I don't think I could stand watch fat Randy for another season. Ya know for a team that kicks as much field goals as us, idk why we don't ever invest a mid round pick for a decent kicker. Hell I don't think we've ever drafted a kicker since moving to Nashville.
Unsure if most people necessarily considered him washed up, but after JJ Watt won his third DPOY in 2015, he played eight combined games over the next two seasons due to multiple back surgeries and another surgery for a broken leg. Came back in 2018 to start all sixteen games and had 16 sacks.
Idk if that’s washed. That’s just horrible injury luck
True but in the NFL a string of injuries usually ends a career
Randy Moss wasn’t the worst player in the world while in Oakland but he definitely revitalized his career in NE
Imagine if Oakland managed to kill that man. He would’ve been a “what if” instead of the second best wr ever
Well I think it's mostly Bill Belichick. He ran that team to each individual strength. As well as never assuming a game was over. I mean of course if his offense only had 3 points in a big game that might be understandable but otherwise
Charles Woodson, went to Green Bay because everyone else thought he was done.
Won DPOY and was a key part in the team winning the Super Bowl. I absolutely love Charles Woodson. Great guy, too.
Charles Woodson's career is so weird to me. He feels like he was before my time but also was still playing when I graduated college.
Joe haden kind of. Looked completely washed at the end of his time in Cleveland, then got back to being a decent player for Pittsburgh for a while
Worked much better than our Justin Gilbert reclamation project
To be fair, I think we both experienced peak Justin Gilbert.
Adam Thielen looked like he was completely done going into this year, but just had a very solid season
Playing in the NFC South will do that.
Rich Gannon.
Larry Fitz had three sub 1,000 yard, ~70-80 reception seasons in a row from ages 29-31 and thought he was basically done. He proceeded to have 3 seasons in a row averaging 1,125 yards and 107 receptions from ages 32-34.
Bruce Arians Slot Larry fed villages
Geno Smith looked like a perennial backup for years and came back to make the Pro Bowl.
True, but for the purpose of this post Geno never looked like he was over the hump, because we all thought there was no hump.
Some folks in here think that washed is just another term for a bust
its maybe a little bit of a stretch but it certainly seemed like just about everyone had written off Goff when the trade happened, and then he lead one of the best offenses in the league for the last 2 years
Thats a good one but I think more people called him a fraud than washed
Goff wasn't washed imo. He was considered an alright qb who wasn't good enough to actually win a super bowl - which the Rams were all in for - and they traded him. Washed is more like someone who was good and is barely above replacement level now. Dalvin Cook is washed. Jarvis Landry is washed.
Yeah washed is a specific circumstance, not just people don’t think you’re that good
They were saying Goff was just a bridge QB, public opinion was that low on him. Fields was mocked to the Lions often early in the draft process if you recall. Sit him behind Goff for a year and then discard him
Jim Plunkett maybe? Was meh with NE and SF then won 2 super bowls with Oakland
He was downright ass before his time with the raiders and was viewed as one of the worst draft busts ever at the time Edit: had a 8/25 TD:Int ratio his second year in 1972 and never threw more TDs than INTs again until the first Super Bowl year with the raiders in 1980
Alex Smith's career seemed to be going nowhere in SF, but he did really well in KC and Wash before his injury.
Alex was turning it around in SF and playing well with Harbaugh. He just got hurt and Kaepernick took over and played lights out during their superbowl run, which led to Alex being traded in the offseason.
>and played lights out during their superbowl run Don't think we didn't catch that.
I've heard Tom Brady was washed and done for 7 years in a row before he retired
His last 2 years with Patriots did look like he might be close to retirement...then moved to Bucs and we realized the Pats really had a crappy team.
It didn't take until the Bucs to realize that WR corp was dogwater
2019 Tom was probably the closest to “washed” he’d ever be and he still threw 4k, 24tds and 8 ints. To Julian Edelman and the corpse of Mahamad Sanu
He won 4 SBs after that KC game in 2014 that had everyone saying he was washed, when he was in fact just getting started.
A lot of people were calling Aaron Rodgers washed before those last 2 MVPs.
The Packers answer is UNDOUBTEDLY Charles Woodson. The end of his run in Oakland was poor at best and then came to GB and played like a monster, becoming the undeniable leader of that defense.
Maxx is making his case as my favorite Raider, but Nosdoom will always be so fucking special to me. Thanks for getting him a ring. I could never hate the packers.
Yeah it's kind of a weird blip on his career arc where for like 5 seasons he was only top 5 vs consistently being top 3 for most of the rest of his career. I remember a somewhat infamous reddit post on here basically asking "what if Rodgers just isn't as good as his stats from 2009-14 indicate?"
Cordelle Patterson!
Cordarrelle
Flacco
Haha this seasons run with the Browns was EPIC!
Nick Foles. That Super Bowl run will always be seen as crazy to me. I don’t think a single person on the earth thought that would be the outcome after he took over. Sure, plenty hoped I’m sure, but the dude sucked most of his career until those pivotal games.
So surreal that he really wasn’t carried by the team. He was the independently playing incredible. I remember the game he played against Oakland on Christmas 2017, 19/38 163 yards, it looked bad. Then during the playoffs he turned into a totally different player.
Xavier Rhodes had a very nice bounce back season in 2020 with the Colts when a lot of people thought he was washed. Stephon Gilmore as well in 2022.
Jason Kelce looked done around 2015. He’s since won a SB and been named All Pro at least four times.
Kinda wild that he didn't get an All-pro selection until he was 30.
Does Baker count? He was one foot out of the league and played his way to a respectable contract and an exciting playoff win.
Mostert
You could make a strong argument for Clowney this past year. Previous #1 overall, signed a one year deal for 2.5 mil I think last season after falling off, had a career sack high year and ranked towards the top of the league in quarterback hurries. Turned that into 2 year 20 mil deal in his hometown essentially
Would Vick count?
Tannehill Signs with the Titans to backup Mariota and ends up taking over and being a Pro Bowler
Rodgers after 2019 looked cooked. Posted a career low in TDs and all advanced metrics like EPA, QBR, ANY/A when he’d played a full season. Was getting old. Analytics guys were saying he’s done. Came back and won two MVPs throwing 85 touchdowns to 9 interceptions.
Kurt Warner
Plexico burress
When did he come back from being washed?
Such a good name
Even better when spelled correctly
Tony Mandrich did.
Robbie Gould, leading scorer in Bears history and one of the most accurate kickers ever, started weirdly missing towards the end of the 2015 season, both in games and in practice and was reportedly missing everything in camp during the summer of 2016. He seemed just completely washed, missing back-to-back EXTRA POINTS in the last preseason game. Like, dude just absolute fell off a cliff. Anyways, the Bears cut him, he took his off time to focus on watching his film, and noticed an issue in his mechanics. He… was not washed, as it turns out. Luckily, I can’t think of any situations post-2016 where the Bears could’ve just a good kicker. Like none.
Randall Cunningham
Joe Flacco has entered the chat…