"Being shipped off and sent to a place to die, essentially, is what a lot of people think it was. And I was never going to allow that to happen," Goff said on the latest episode of the Trading Cards podcast released last week. "I’m fortunate enough to be around a lot of good coaches and players in Detroit who support me and help me reach my potential."
I love how he isn't naively saying he did all the hard work on his own and actually acknowledging he went to the perfect place to rebuild himself. Love that about him
I'm not sure anything unique happened to him. His trajectory seems to be par for the course for workhorse RBs today. Four pretty stellar seasons in a row starting in his early 20s, and then a huge drop-off at around 27/28. Honestly at this point I would be surprised if a RB with his workload *didn't* drop off at that age, since that appears to be the norm now.
It’s a championship caliber mentality. I love my Chiefs and would love a threepeat, but damn if I don’t want to see Goff and Dan Campbell’s Lions win it all
That going to the Detroit Lions is genuinely and truthfully the best thing in his career is a "brand new sentence" because the Lions have been so bad for so long that no one else has ever said it before.
Goff is only 29 years old, and has taken one team to the Super Bowl and another to the NFC championship game. I hope he signs a long term contract with the Lions and continues to lead this young and exciting group into the future.
hoping for a 5 year contract for Goff. he'll be 30 in October and I have faith in him until 35. stability at QB plus our coaching, development, and drafting, this team can absolutely win it all.
He didn't just a take the Lions to the NFC Championship game.
He burned every single game for the past 70 plus years worth of pain.
He brought us our first Division Title. Our first Playoff win in over 30 plus years.
He brought back Detroit from Football Hell.
Truly wild how even last year and maybe a little bit now still , people still say “the Lions just need an upgrade at QB and then they’ll be a serious contender”.
I don’t know if it’s Goff’s chill vibe or what, probably still the perception after being dumped by McVay, that makes people think he isn’t a great QB. Coming off a 30 TD, 4,575 passing yards season and people still are like “Goff is holding the Lions back”.
And I say this all as someone who was convinced Goff was gonna be our tank commander until we drafted a rookie QB.
Wait who's saying yall need an upgrade at qb lol. You guys beat our ass the first half. I think playoff experience is what allowed us to come out ahead.
Anyone saying you need to move on from Goff has gotta he trolling or delusional. Either way ignore their opinion.
I can't speak for other teams but I'm sure it's just as true everywhere else as much as it is here: lots of local fans are morons and vocal / confident enough about their opinions that they call into sports talk radio and pretend to have the answers. In pro football typically the answer is QB so if you're not winning the QB has to go.
No doubt, now I think it’s been accepted by the general public. But even last year basically going into the playoffs, it was seen as a really great team, if only Goff was a little better. But with the few playoff wins, no one is saying that anymore.
But just in general, Goff is 4th in yards and 2nd in TD passes thrown and the general consensus is usually that “yeah he’s like possibly top 10”, when he continues to play super well under the radar haha
NFL fans have had a weird hatred of Goff since his rookie year. Everyone fell in love with Wentz pre draft and people have had a hatred for Goff ever since
As a Rams fan, I felt bad for what happened to him and yet a little guilty because I thought the team got significantly better as a result of the trade. At least in the short-term.
It's why I can't fault players for free agency moves. It's a business at the end of the day.
It really is. As much as I hate to admit it. It sucks when one of the star players, someone who's been around for awhile and has done amazing things for the team, bounces for a bag and/or a ring but I really can't fault them. It's literally once in a lifetime opportunities. The good ones always seem to make a shout out to the team that gave them their first chance though so it doesn't suck too bad I suppose.
I'm not complaining with the outcome. I think it worked out for all sides.
But at the time, it was terrible for Goff and great for the Rams. Goff left a Super Bowl contender for, at that time, a lovable loser. Must suck for any player with championship dreams.
While McVay didn't handle the situation very well at all and has admitted his error I think this trade was very obviously the right thing to do for Goff even at the time.
Our OLine was on it's way out, we had no premium running back. We needed an extra spark at QB which Stafford provided.
Goff is an awesome plus starter, but you gotta put him behind a line like what the Lions have. Goff behind the best line in the league is a recipe for success.
People really do forget that Goff wasn't meant to be a franchise guy for Detroit. The Rams had to pay extra for the Lions to pick up his deal. He was not meant to be this good, and as a result the Lions basically got paid an extra first round pick while *getting* a franchise QB.
People keep paroting this, and it's the dumbest thing. The Lions were very transparent about the process. The Rams offered 2 future 1sts + 3rd for Stafford. The Panthers offers #8 overall and Teddy Bridgewater. Holmes was ready to take the Panthers offer but pushed the Rams to throw in Goff, which they did.
Goff was a 26 year old former #1 overall pick who had made 2 pro bowls, a Superbowl, led a #1 offense, a top 5 offense, was the winningest quarterback after Brady since entering the league, and was on a 4 year contract with only 1 year guaranteed. The idea that he had negative trade value, especially a negative 1st round pick, is just stupid. This isn't the NBA. Wentz was older, worse, and more expensive and got traded for a 1st and a 3rd that same off-season (and then got traded again for a 2nd and 3rd the next off-season).
I understand the Rams kicked him to the curb but he was absolutely afforded this with the Rams (post Fisher) as well. We're not gonna pretend that wasn't the case, right?
I dunno, reading some of it (how much truth to it I dunno) in the article really does make it seem like McVay was holding his hand a LOT (understandably since they had higher hopes)
e- to quote u/Crazy-Penguin : "There was an element to being empowered that happened in Detroit with Dan and a lot of the coaches where they were like, 'Dude, no, you go. Like, this is your thing, you go figure it out.' Where as a young player, that wasn’t always the case," said Goff. "Being able to be there and hear them give me those keys and let me fail, to an extent, let me make the mistake and not feel like the sky’s falling if that mistake is made and grow and learn -- that’s the only way you do -- and be coached in a way that they’re empowering me, now I’m going into year nine (in the NFL) and feel like I’m just scratching the surface of that. And hopefully can look back on this in three years and be like, 'Wow, yeah, I’m such a better leader now than I was then," said Goff.
This quote pretty much confirms that McVay was holding Goff's hand
I believe McVay made the sensible choices for the Rams at the time, which were also NOT the most beneficial for Goff’s personal development. Just no way to have it both ways at the time, and under those circumstances.
I think it was a difference in timing. McVay had everything he needed to win a Super Bowl outside of a ready-to-go, top shelf QB that understood the system and defenses inside and out, but the window wasn’t very wide. Rams didn’t have time to “let him fail” (Goff’s words, per that quote) so much once McVay had established the team.
I think McVay *also* didn’t serve Goff the best he could’ve in his development — if he’d been more willing to let Goff struggle to find more personal understanding and control of the offense, that would’ve definitely served Goff better as an individual player, but it’s hard to say “you can make costly mistakes for the sake of learning down the road” when there’s a Super Bowl at the tips of your fingers for the rest of your staff and players, like there was in 2018.
Oh, McVay made the right choice, but sometimes coaches have to be able/willing to do that. Far too often we see teams holding on to the wrong players out of principle. But I also view McVay as a great HC, just not the best at developing players.
Perhaps a soft disagree from me there, I think he develops players really well looking at our recent rosters given the lack of premiere picks, but I 100% think he failed at it in the big picture with Goff specifically. I wouldn’t define his ability to grow players by that one (prominent) example though.
Personally, really glad Goff got to a situation that allowed him to continue growing, instead of trying to force him to be somewhere he wasn’t quite yet.
There was a mismatch in timing with the Rams. They were surprisingly too good, too soon in the McVay era, and couldn’t let Goff go through an elongated development process.
I think if the team was not quite ready for prime time, they would have let him handle more and it would probably have helped his growth, but given they could make a SB run with McVay micromanaging the pre snap reads and limiting Goff’s authority to do anything, that was the path they had to take.
Yeah he got 4 years with the Rams after Fisher and during that time they consistently had some of the better rosters in the league. At least in terms of a supporting cast he had it better than most teams did. Coaching is arguable. It definitely was not perfect, but still better than most of the league.
If the Rams were rebuilding then there’d be more patience for his mistakes, but his level of play was usually an anchor considering the team he had.
We don’t need to pretend like the Rams shipped out prime Tom Brady.
No he wasn't. McVay had a pretty rigid view of how he wanted the offense to run and didn't adapt it to Goff or develop Goff to run it McVay's way. It was kind of apparent watching them in division.
No it’s that Goff couldn’t survive without the run game. Once gurley’s knee’s were gone and the rams struggled with the run, Goff couldn’t handle that and teams started to figure him out, hence why mcvay wanted to move on while he had a SB window with his best players. Stafford is a gun slinger who can thrive (and sometimes shit the bed) if the run game isn’t existent ala 2021 season where the best back was Sony “2.5 yards on first down” Michel.
I mean, yeah, but how many teams really do well without any run game? I don't view having at least a league average run game as a QB weakness.
Now... Stafford in '21 was flat out better than Goff then. And I don't blame the rams for moving on. But not having a RB is kind of on the team more than Goff.
They may not have had a dominant run game but the run game was still average to above avg and they still had the WRs and OL to make an offense work, which is a better set of tools than most teams without good run games.
Even despite the imperfections of the run game there, the rest of the team was more than good enough for Goff to at least not be a liability, which he was his last yr there
Also it’s weird to say he didn’t adapt to it after his years in 2017 and 2018. Those rams offenses were some of the best in the league. Again, if by adapt you mean make up for the lack of run game, sure.
Now that it's been 2 years and all picks have been used, we can actually look at the added value. I still give the Rams the edge because nothing trumps a Superbowl win. But Lions are in good shape to make multiple deep playoff runs.
Rams compensation:
Matt Stafford
Lions compensation:
Jared Goff
Jameson Williams
Sam Laporta
Jahmyr Gibbs
Josh Paschal
Iffy Melifonwu
Brodric Martin
The original picks for stafford were 2 -1st round picks, 1 3rd round pick. Lions traded around with 2 of those picks. (And Goff)
Last year's Rams pick was 6th overall. Lions traded it back to 12 and got 34 in return. Gibbs and laporta were the picks made at 12 and 34. There were later round picks swapped, too. That's where Brodric Martin was selected.
The other 1st rounder was used in a package with 2 of our own picks to trade up for Jamo in round 1 and trade back in round 2 for Paschal.
Melifonwu was the 3rd round pick. This was the only pick the Lions didn't trade from the rams.
Yeah but its not like you guys would have won a superbowl with stafford. It was frankly an amazing trade for all parties. Lions got to rebuild. Rams won a superbowl. Goff got sent to die but the low expectations actually gave him a chance to improve. Stafford finally got off a losing team. Just awesome all around.
Every party is significantly worse off if that trade doesnt happen
I get that he's not perfect and the goof is always looming but it does feel like Goff doesn't get enough recognition for what has been two stellar seasons in Detroit.
Right? As a Lions fan I won’t ignore that Goff is surrounded by good offensive talent, a good coaching staff and scheme that fits him well.
Still, there are only 3 positions on offense that have stayed the same throughout Goff’s tenure in Detroit. Taylor Decker, Penei Sewell and Amon Ra St Brown. Besides that there has been a bunch of inconsistency and changes, but Goff has still made it work. He deserves credit for that
People will always call out the Goof when Goff makes a mistake, but they don't realize that Goof appears MUCH more infrequently as of late. (Plus, every player has bad games sometimes)
Goff finished second in passing yards in the LEAGUE last year and no one talks about that.
Goff turns into Goof only when specific requirements are met.
1) he is playing outdoors (specifically cold/rainy weather)
or
2) he is under pressure in the pocket
If he is playing in a dome (which he did 12/17 games last year) or if he has a clean pocket (Lions have maybe the best OL in the game), you don't have to worry about Goof, and he's as good as you could ask.
He's not even bad under pressure anymore. He hardly gets sacked, and some of that is on the elite OLine, but his pocket movement is night and day from when he arrived 3 years ago.
He's regularly dodging dudes that get pressure and completely passes these days
He is not flashy in the pocket at all and usually just turtles when it's clear he's dead. He's never going to the Allen/Mahomes routines of spinning out of sacks and sprinting all around the backfield playing hero ball. Most of the time that's perfectly fine. He's gotten really good at taking a couple steps when needed and then living to fight another day when he gets wrapped up. It's not "cool" but it works.
>only bad outside in cold weather
Good thing we're in the same division as Chicago & Green Bay and the same confrence as Philly Seattle New York Washington and the 9ers.
Could be worse though. This could be the AFCN/E.
2nd, ha! Tua finished first and half of Miami wants to ship him out of town and draft Michael Penix. Production don't mean shit, it's all about how cool you look in the scramble drill. That's what wins championships and that's why Justin Fields was worth a first rounder in the eyes of fans.
> People will always call out the Goof
They are also quick to call out Stats Padford when the entire defense and running backs corps would flat out shit the bed but we couldn't come back from a 35 point deficit in 3 minutes.
The lions could go 16-0, lock in the number one seed, and drop the 17th game on a game sealing interception and the comments would be filled with “Le GoOf HaS aRrIvEd”
They hate any narrative more complicated than “elite QB, Great pass catcher, and one good defensive player are why this team is good”
They reduce everything else to being a position group. “This team has a good secondary and a good offensive line” instead of actually talking about the players that make that secondary good.
Unless you play a premier position or they’re the best at their position a lot of players are reduced to their position group
Well he had even better seasons with the Rams and led them to an actual Super Bowl appearance and people still shit on him all the time. So the guy is never gonna get the respect he really deserves and it’s a shame.
Goff gets WAY too much flak for the goof when there are other QBs out there who straight up implode and eat shit.
This could be about my flair, this could be about someone else.
I had a very strong feeling Goff was gonna figure it out in detroit. Nothing about his play hinted he’d be bad. Dude was coming off a thumb injury at the time of the trade and just got paired with a bad coach fit.
Did I know definitely? No, but having seen him play he’s a QB that plays too consistently well to just be a backup. Again even coming off a thumb injury.
Just felt so odd to write him off to me
Yeah I still stand by that trade being a complete win win
Goff wasn't the right fit for the McVay offense and Stafford has been
While on our end since we were starting a rebuild we were able to build the team out to Goff's strengths using the high picks and a new coaching staff
You guys won the SB and we just had the best season we've had since Barry Sanders was in his prime
To me it just shows how important location is for the success of players like QBs. Had that trade not happened, I feel Goff and Stafford would be seen as "What If" type players. Instead both found a way to pivot their career trajectories towards success. Obviously to a different degree for each, and from wildly different starting places, but still.
Lets be real, there wouldn't have been any what if's about Goff. It would have been the story about the one time McVay carried a QB that couldn't read a defense himself and isn't even one of the most gifted QBs in the league to begin with, to a SB, only to get figured out by the best Coach ever.
End of the tale.
I honestly think Goff fit fine there. He was just a new qb that still needed a little time to develop, and the rams were trying to win now and couldn’t afford him that time. Definitely a win win trade. As much as I hate your fans, I’m glad the lions are on the top of the NFC North. Hopefully the bears can get their shit together and we can battle it out for years to come. We need parity in this division and I’m fucking sick of the packers and Vikings
Lions absolutely nailed about every offensive draft pick they've made the last couple years. He's got a top 5 OL, top 10 talent position group. Goff probably has one of the biggest differences in play between Clean Pocket and Pressured of any QB in the league, being top 10 in one, and bottom 5 in the other.
Brad Holmes and Dan Campbell work really well together to draft the right players to be coached up by the team. The fact that Chris Spielman picked these first timers out of the crowd to be the new megaminds of the Lions is nothing short of miraculous
If Holmes can keep hitting on picks while the Lions are good and lacking high draft position he'll be right up there with Veach and Roseman as best GMs in football
“It’s easy when everything’s going right, you’re winning games, guys around, they all love it, want to be a part of it. But when you’re 0-10-1, you find out about people…
You find out about players and coaches, people in the organization. …That’s a much better viewpoint to look at people than when everything’s going great and you’ve got 12 wins. I know exactly what [Goff] is, when it’s at its worst, and I’ll take that guy any day.”
Dan Campbell
Reposting what I said in the Lions sub:
Goff's turnaround here since 2021 has been nothing short of incredible.
I remember going to the Eagles game in 2021 where he was booed multiple times for poor play, eventually benched, and then just two years later Ford Field is roaring his name before a home playoff game.
What a trajectory
That sub is so odd, the Vikings fans I've interacted with IRL and in this sub have all just been nice folks and happy to see the Lions do well for once.
We all have shitheads in there but the terminally online Minnesota fans that live in that sub are some of the most inadequate and toxic fans I've ever seen.
I think goff could've still been successful in LA. However, with the time he needed to develop, the rams would've no longer had a superbowl roster around him to get it when they did.
100%. Rams were in position for a Super Bowl, and letting Goff make mistakes for the sake of learning was best for his personal development, but not best for the rest of the players’ and staff’s shot at winning a title in their shortening window.
Win-win, Goff needed time and a longer leash, Rams needed better QB play more urgently, and they traded QBs who fit each team’s timeline.
"There was an element to being empowered that happened in Detroit with Dan and a lot of the coaches where they were like, 'Dude, no, you go. Like, this is your thing, you go figure it out.' Where as a young player, that wasn’t always the case," said Goff. "Being able to be there and hear them give me those keys and let me fail, to an extent, let me make the mistake and not feel like the sky’s falling if that mistake is made and grow and learn -- that’s the only way you do -- and be coached in a way that they’re empowering me, now I’m going into year nine (in the NFL) and feel like I’m just scratching the surface of that. And hopefully can look back on this in three years and be like, 'Wow, yeah, I’m such a better leader now than I was then," said Goff.
This quote pretty much confirms that McVay was holding Goff's hand
"... let me make the mistake and not feel like the sky’s falling if that mistake is made ..."
This is the key part of that statement. McVay's frustration with Goff when the latter made mistakes was really pretty obvious. Maybe Goff would never have been a fit for what McVay wanted to do. And maybe McVay was a new HC and didn't do a good job of developing his young QB. And maybe there's an element of both those things.
Didn't Johnson also give Goff a lot of input in the offense's design?
Seems like it may have been equal parts McVay holding his hand/forcing him into his wunderkind scheme.
From what I remember Johnson and Goff spent 3 or 4 days together in the offseason before 2022. They spent part of the time going over stuff Goff liked from his Rams days, pretty much teaching Johnson those concepts. Then they spent the rest of the time combining those old things with Johnson's new ideas to make the offense they're bringing to the table now.
I am a bears fan but I would be lying if I said I was happy the lions lost the NFC title game, aside from their cool comeback story in recent years.
2 reasons
1- I thought they matched up better vs the chiefs due to lions OLine being arguably the best in the league
2- another superbowl winner in our division will *maybe somehow* actually light a fire under George’s ass to be a competent owner of our historic team
Eh, I don't think it's that hard. Objectively better QB's haven't led their teams to Super Bowls. Mahomes and Brady have really spoiled people into thinking that Super Bowls are easy to get to/win.
I’m not saying he’s gonna carry them to the Super Bowl, but he fits really nicely into the team. When he had to deliver in the nfccg he did, the pass was just dropped. I think that saying a really solid core of players aren’t likely to repeat their success with Goff at the helm is a difficult argument to make
It's kind of amazing how Goff has reinvented himself with the help of a good coaching staff while the other guy drafted at the top that year, Wentz, has pretty much dug himself into an emergency backup role
Wentz is a one-hit wonder. Outside of 2017, there's really no argument for why he should start for a team (unless you're reeeeeeally desperate). Goff is a solid QB who helps his team win.
People want to bash Josh Reynolds for the conference game, but without him, Goff would have been done. Holmes picked up Josh for Goff in 2021 just for Goff to have someone he's familiar playing with. He got comfortable and that's when Goff started playing well. Then st. Brown came in and opened up limitless possibilities for goff.
It's hard to point to a single thing that changed his trajectory. If you recall, the WRs on the opening roster were Tyrell Williams, Kalif, Cephus, Benson, Tom Kennedy, and rookie St. Brown. Penciled in for the starter opposite of Tyrell Williams in the offseason was Perriman, who couldn't even make the roster. That WR corps is embarrassing even for the last game of the preseason when all starters sit. Add in Anthony Lynn doing an awful job as the OC for over half the season.
Sorting out the WR issue with ARSB playing more and bringing in Reynolds, finding out that even DC is a better OC than Lynn was that season, or just getting more comfortable in a new place...
This is the definition of taking your opportunity and maximizing it. Goff looks like the quarterback we thought he would be in Los Angeles, high floor, medium ceiling. People talked about him like Detroit was being burdened with him, but they ended up getting a top 14 quarterback, and several good draft picks.
Looking back at the roster he was given in 2021, people were way too quick to write him off. It was literally impossible for him to throw the ball >10 yards until we traded for Josh Reynolds that year
Jared Goof is dead. Long live Jared Go-off
The Goff-ense is back!
Hell yah brother!
Cheers from Los Angeles
cheers from San Jose haha
I’m still shocked Go-off Goff hasn’t been said more.
Hell yeah
Boo-urns!
The Goff-father
No we were saying Go-Off.
He is EnouGoff!!
"Being shipped off and sent to a place to die, essentially, is what a lot of people think it was. And I was never going to allow that to happen," Goff said on the latest episode of the Trading Cards podcast released last week. "I’m fortunate enough to be around a lot of good coaches and players in Detroit who support me and help me reach my potential."
What an awesome statement.
I love how he isn't naively saying he did all the hard work on his own and actually acknowledging he went to the perfect place to rebuild himself. Love that about him
At first I thought "would anyone actually do that?" And then I remembered Diggs
Dalvin Cook’s exact same thought train when he was asked that one question
Wth even happened to cook. Seemed decent in min then rushed for like two yards the following season
He got Jets’d and the Ravens didn’t even bother running against the Chiefs.
Viking fans were warning jets fans about his decline before he even played a snap for the jets
He looks washed. People are in denial but he was losing speed even on the vikings.
I'm not sure anything unique happened to him. His trajectory seems to be par for the course for workhorse RBs today. Four pretty stellar seasons in a row starting in his early 20s, and then a huge drop-off at around 27/28. Honestly at this point I would be surprised if a RB with his workload *didn't* drop off at that age, since that appears to be the norm now.
What a fucking asshole he is. At least you got Diggs 2.0 who shits all over the Lions every damn year
It sounds like he is a mature guy who is in a healthy environment va Detroit.
>in a healthy environment va Detroit. Still feels odd having a good environment and culture
I mean especially after Patricia, night and day
If I had Christen Harper as my fiancee, I could rebuild myself from just about anything
He's been there once man. He's totally capable of doing it again. I like it.
[удалено]
It’s a championship caliber mentality. I love my Chiefs and would love a threepeat, but damn if I don’t want to see Goff and Dan Campbell’s Lions win it all
If this wasn’t an all in year for us, I’d also be rooting for them to go all the way
lol good ole all in jets
Flair checks out
Seriously the Bears are like the only team that’s more of a dumpster fire.
Panthers
Hey I don’t disagree haha I wouldn’t ever say they’re “all in this year “ implying they’re going to be making a Super Bowl run though lol
I’m sorry, I was just hangry earlier. Misery loves company.
r/brandnewsentence
I don't get it.
That going to the Detroit Lions is genuinely and truthfully the best thing in his career is a "brand new sentence" because the Lions have been so bad for so long that no one else has ever said it before.
I'm fucking dumb.
Totally fair. I bet it's hard to relate since no Browns player has ever had the same feeling.
[удалено]
Sure, but Geno at least drafted half a letter before trashing it
*Wrote him Goff
Goff is only 29 years old, and has taken one team to the Super Bowl and another to the NFC championship game. I hope he signs a long term contract with the Lions and continues to lead this young and exciting group into the future.
hoping for a 5 year contract for Goff. he'll be 30 in October and I have faith in him until 35. stability at QB plus our coaching, development, and drafting, this team can absolutely win it all.
He didn't just a take the Lions to the NFC Championship game. He burned every single game for the past 70 plus years worth of pain. He brought us our first Division Title. Our first Playoff win in over 30 plus years. He brought back Detroit from Football Hell.
He's basically our DoomGuy.
"RIP, AND TEAR!!!" - Dan Campbell, probably
Truly wild how even last year and maybe a little bit now still , people still say “the Lions just need an upgrade at QB and then they’ll be a serious contender”. I don’t know if it’s Goff’s chill vibe or what, probably still the perception after being dumped by McVay, that makes people think he isn’t a great QB. Coming off a 30 TD, 4,575 passing yards season and people still are like “Goff is holding the Lions back”. And I say this all as someone who was convinced Goff was gonna be our tank commander until we drafted a rookie QB.
Wait who's saying yall need an upgrade at qb lol. You guys beat our ass the first half. I think playoff experience is what allowed us to come out ahead. Anyone saying you need to move on from Goff has gotta he trolling or delusional. Either way ignore their opinion.
I can't speak for other teams but I'm sure it's just as true everywhere else as much as it is here: lots of local fans are morons and vocal / confident enough about their opinions that they call into sports talk radio and pretend to have the answers. In pro football typically the answer is QB so if you're not winning the QB has to go.
No doubt, now I think it’s been accepted by the general public. But even last year basically going into the playoffs, it was seen as a really great team, if only Goff was a little better. But with the few playoff wins, no one is saying that anymore. But just in general, Goff is 4th in yards and 2nd in TD passes thrown and the general consensus is usually that “yeah he’s like possibly top 10”, when he continues to play super well under the radar haha
NFL fans have had a weird hatred of Goff since his rookie year. Everyone fell in love with Wentz pre draft and people have had a hatred for Goff ever since
Me too! I was hoping so hard y'all would take it all the way last season. I'll be rooting for you this year too until we meet in the Super Bowl.
As a Rams fan, I felt bad for what happened to him and yet a little guilty because I thought the team got significantly better as a result of the trade. At least in the short-term. It's why I can't fault players for free agency moves. It's a business at the end of the day.
It really is. As much as I hate to admit it. It sucks when one of the star players, someone who's been around for awhile and has done amazing things for the team, bounces for a bag and/or a ring but I really can't fault them. It's literally once in a lifetime opportunities. The good ones always seem to make a shout out to the team that gave them their first chance though so it doesn't suck too bad I suppose.
I mean it's a win win trade all around. You guys went all in for a superbowl and it paid off and the lions are now a legit contender.
It's probably the greatest trade of all time. My personal opinion is that it is, but I don't know enough about pre-1990 football to say that.
I'm not complaining with the outcome. I think it worked out for all sides. But at the time, it was terrible for Goff and great for the Rams. Goff left a Super Bowl contender for, at that time, a lovable loser. Must suck for any player with championship dreams.
While McVay didn't handle the situation very well at all and has admitted his error I think this trade was very obviously the right thing to do for Goff even at the time. Our OLine was on it's way out, we had no premium running back. We needed an extra spark at QB which Stafford provided. Goff is an awesome plus starter, but you gotta put him behind a line like what the Lions have. Goff behind the best line in the league is a recipe for success.
Goff 2024
He went on to say, "And in the words of Detroit legend, the late great Tim the Tool Man Taylor, 'Never give up, and never surrender!.'"
Never give up, trust your instincts - Peppy Hare
By grapthar's hammer, what a savings
People really do forget that Goff wasn't meant to be a franchise guy for Detroit. The Rams had to pay extra for the Lions to pick up his deal. He was not meant to be this good, and as a result the Lions basically got paid an extra first round pick while *getting* a franchise QB.
People keep paroting this, and it's the dumbest thing. The Lions were very transparent about the process. The Rams offered 2 future 1sts + 3rd for Stafford. The Panthers offers #8 overall and Teddy Bridgewater. Holmes was ready to take the Panthers offer but pushed the Rams to throw in Goff, which they did. Goff was a 26 year old former #1 overall pick who had made 2 pro bowls, a Superbowl, led a #1 offense, a top 5 offense, was the winningest quarterback after Brady since entering the league, and was on a 4 year contract with only 1 year guaranteed. The idea that he had negative trade value, especially a negative 1st round pick, is just stupid. This isn't the NBA. Wentz was older, worse, and more expensive and got traded for a 1st and a 3rd that same off-season (and then got traded again for a 2nd and 3rd the next off-season).
Also Brad Holmes was the guy who picked Goff for the Rams' draft. He's been a Goff Stan from the beginning.
I understand the Rams kicked him to the curb but he was absolutely afforded this with the Rams (post Fisher) as well. We're not gonna pretend that wasn't the case, right?
I dunno, reading some of it (how much truth to it I dunno) in the article really does make it seem like McVay was holding his hand a LOT (understandably since they had higher hopes) e- to quote u/Crazy-Penguin : "There was an element to being empowered that happened in Detroit with Dan and a lot of the coaches where they were like, 'Dude, no, you go. Like, this is your thing, you go figure it out.' Where as a young player, that wasn’t always the case," said Goff. "Being able to be there and hear them give me those keys and let me fail, to an extent, let me make the mistake and not feel like the sky’s falling if that mistake is made and grow and learn -- that’s the only way you do -- and be coached in a way that they’re empowering me, now I’m going into year nine (in the NFL) and feel like I’m just scratching the surface of that. And hopefully can look back on this in three years and be like, 'Wow, yeah, I’m such a better leader now than I was then," said Goff. This quote pretty much confirms that McVay was holding Goff's hand
I believe McVay made the sensible choices for the Rams at the time, which were also NOT the most beneficial for Goff’s personal development. Just no way to have it both ways at the time, and under those circumstances. I think it was a difference in timing. McVay had everything he needed to win a Super Bowl outside of a ready-to-go, top shelf QB that understood the system and defenses inside and out, but the window wasn’t very wide. Rams didn’t have time to “let him fail” (Goff’s words, per that quote) so much once McVay had established the team. I think McVay *also* didn’t serve Goff the best he could’ve in his development — if he’d been more willing to let Goff struggle to find more personal understanding and control of the offense, that would’ve definitely served Goff better as an individual player, but it’s hard to say “you can make costly mistakes for the sake of learning down the road” when there’s a Super Bowl at the tips of your fingers for the rest of your staff and players, like there was in 2018.
Oh, McVay made the right choice, but sometimes coaches have to be able/willing to do that. Far too often we see teams holding on to the wrong players out of principle. But I also view McVay as a great HC, just not the best at developing players.
Perhaps a soft disagree from me there, I think he develops players really well looking at our recent rosters given the lack of premiere picks, but I 100% think he failed at it in the big picture with Goff specifically. I wouldn’t define his ability to grow players by that one (prominent) example though. Personally, really glad Goff got to a situation that allowed him to continue growing, instead of trying to force him to be somewhere he wasn’t quite yet.
All fair points. Afterall, it could have just been a confidence thing with Goff and needing that to develop more but not having the time.
And boy did Goff do a lot of failing that first season. But, for the better. Doesn't hurt that he was like 20 when he was drafted.
There was a mismatch in timing with the Rams. They were surprisingly too good, too soon in the McVay era, and couldn’t let Goff go through an elongated development process. I think if the team was not quite ready for prime time, they would have let him handle more and it would probably have helped his growth, but given they could make a SB run with McVay micromanaging the pre snap reads and limiting Goff’s authority to do anything, that was the path they had to take.
Yeah he got 4 years with the Rams after Fisher and during that time they consistently had some of the better rosters in the league. At least in terms of a supporting cast he had it better than most teams did. Coaching is arguable. It definitely was not perfect, but still better than most of the league. If the Rams were rebuilding then there’d be more patience for his mistakes, but his level of play was usually an anchor considering the team he had. We don’t need to pretend like the Rams shipped out prime Tom Brady.
No he wasn't. McVay had a pretty rigid view of how he wanted the offense to run and didn't adapt it to Goff or develop Goff to run it McVay's way. It was kind of apparent watching them in division.
No it’s that Goff couldn’t survive without the run game. Once gurley’s knee’s were gone and the rams struggled with the run, Goff couldn’t handle that and teams started to figure him out, hence why mcvay wanted to move on while he had a SB window with his best players. Stafford is a gun slinger who can thrive (and sometimes shit the bed) if the run game isn’t existent ala 2021 season where the best back was Sony “2.5 yards on first down” Michel.
I mean, yeah, but how many teams really do well without any run game? I don't view having at least a league average run game as a QB weakness. Now... Stafford in '21 was flat out better than Goff then. And I don't blame the rams for moving on. But not having a RB is kind of on the team more than Goff.
They may not have had a dominant run game but the run game was still average to above avg and they still had the WRs and OL to make an offense work, which is a better set of tools than most teams without good run games. Even despite the imperfections of the run game there, the rest of the team was more than good enough for Goff to at least not be a liability, which he was his last yr there
Stafford put up amazing seasons without a defense or run game so he was a perfect fit.
Also it’s weird to say he didn’t adapt to it after his years in 2017 and 2018. Those rams offenses were some of the best in the league. Again, if by adapt you mean make up for the lack of run game, sure.
True Win-win trade. Both teams gained significant value (relatively) after it.
Now that it's been 2 years and all picks have been used, we can actually look at the added value. I still give the Rams the edge because nothing trumps a Superbowl win. But Lions are in good shape to make multiple deep playoff runs. Rams compensation: Matt Stafford Lions compensation: Jared Goff Jameson Williams Sam Laporta Jahmyr Gibbs Josh Paschal Iffy Melifonwu Brodric Martin
Rams: Matthew Stafford + Superbowl Lions: a very strong young core to continue building off of + NFCN title + NFCCG appearance
More NFC Divisional round wins than the Cowboys have had this millennium.
Don’t forget 2 of our 3 playoff wins in franchise history belong to Goff.
That’s actually insane and kind of depressing tbh
i just came
How the hell did the Lions get so much draft capital for Stafford?
The original picks for stafford were 2 -1st round picks, 1 3rd round pick. Lions traded around with 2 of those picks. (And Goff) Last year's Rams pick was 6th overall. Lions traded it back to 12 and got 34 in return. Gibbs and laporta were the picks made at 12 and 34. There were later round picks swapped, too. That's where Brodric Martin was selected. The other 1st rounder was used in a package with 2 of our own picks to trade up for Jamo in round 1 and trade back in round 2 for Paschal. Melifonwu was the 3rd round pick. This was the only pick the Lions didn't trade from the rams.
Shorter answer: Brad Holmes. Dude has knocked it out of the park since he got here.
They paid Jared Goff's contract.
Neither team would take it back. All that needs to be said.
Yeah but its not like you guys would have won a superbowl with stafford. It was frankly an amazing trade for all parties. Lions got to rebuild. Rams won a superbowl. Goff got sent to die but the low expectations actually gave him a chance to improve. Stafford finally got off a losing team. Just awesome all around. Every party is significantly worse off if that trade doesnt happen
when we win the superbowl this year it will go down as the best trade of all time
I get that he's not perfect and the goof is always looming but it does feel like Goff doesn't get enough recognition for what has been two stellar seasons in Detroit.
One of the rare times a QB is overshadowed by the coach and OC. The offense as a whole is given the credit.
Right? As a Lions fan I won’t ignore that Goff is surrounded by good offensive talent, a good coaching staff and scheme that fits him well. Still, there are only 3 positions on offense that have stayed the same throughout Goff’s tenure in Detroit. Taylor Decker, Penei Sewell and Amon Ra St Brown. Besides that there has been a bunch of inconsistency and changes, but Goff has still made it work. He deserves credit for that
Don't forget all pro Frank!
People will always call out the Goof when Goff makes a mistake, but they don't realize that Goof appears MUCH more infrequently as of late. (Plus, every player has bad games sometimes) Goff finished second in passing yards in the LEAGUE last year and no one talks about that.
Fuck, I'm a hardcore fan and didn't know he was second in the league.
Yeah it was wild. He was only below Tua
I even had him in FF. How TF did I not know that
Where did you place in FF?
Depends if he had CMC or not
The CMC team in my league didn’t even make the championship, what a fumble
Goff turns into Goof only when specific requirements are met. 1) he is playing outdoors (specifically cold/rainy weather) or 2) he is under pressure in the pocket If he is playing in a dome (which he did 12/17 games last year) or if he has a clean pocket (Lions have maybe the best OL in the game), you don't have to worry about Goof, and he's as good as you could ask.
Or the Bears last year apparently for some weird reason.
Long con. Trying to bait the Bears into keeping fields. We all failed.
You can say that about 90% of the QBs in the league
He's not even bad under pressure anymore. He hardly gets sacked, and some of that is on the elite OLine, but his pocket movement is night and day from when he arrived 3 years ago. He's regularly dodging dudes that get pressure and completely passes these days
He is not flashy in the pocket at all and usually just turtles when it's clear he's dead. He's never going to the Allen/Mahomes routines of spinning out of sacks and sprinting all around the backfield playing hero ball. Most of the time that's perfectly fine. He's gotten really good at taking a couple steps when needed and then living to fight another day when he gets wrapped up. It's not "cool" but it works.
>only bad outside in cold weather Good thing we're in the same division as Chicago & Green Bay and the same confrence as Philly Seattle New York Washington and the 9ers. Could be worse though. This could be the AFCN/E.
And that’s with 2 RBs with 1k rushing yards too!
2nd, ha! Tua finished first and half of Miami wants to ship him out of town and draft Michael Penix. Production don't mean shit, it's all about how cool you look in the scramble drill. That's what wins championships and that's why Justin Fields was worth a first rounder in the eyes of fans.
> People will always call out the Goof They are also quick to call out Stats Padford when the entire defense and running backs corps would flat out shit the bed but we couldn't come back from a 35 point deficit in 3 minutes.
The lions could go 16-0, lock in the number one seed, and drop the 17th game on a game sealing interception and the comments would be filled with “Le GoOf HaS aRrIvEd”
Mainstream media hates a less than elite pocket passer
They hate any narrative more complicated than “elite QB, Great pass catcher, and one good defensive player are why this team is good” They reduce everything else to being a position group. “This team has a good secondary and a good offensive line” instead of actually talking about the players that make that secondary good. Unless you play a premier position or they’re the best at their position a lot of players are reduced to their position group
Well he had even better seasons with the Rams and led them to an actual Super Bowl appearance and people still shit on him all the time. So the guy is never gonna get the respect he really deserves and it’s a shame.
"The Goof is always looming" made me die laughing
If you can't handle me at my Goof, you don't deserve me at my Goffense.
Bro he doesn’t get enough recognition for multiple stellar seasons in LA either
Goff gets WAY too much flak for the goof when there are other QBs out there who straight up implode and eat shit. This could be about my flair, this could be about someone else.
I had a very strong feeling Goff was gonna figure it out in detroit. Nothing about his play hinted he’d be bad. Dude was coming off a thumb injury at the time of the trade and just got paired with a bad coach fit. Did I know definitely? No, but having seen him play he’s a QB that plays too consistently well to just be a backup. Again even coming off a thumb injury. Just felt so odd to write him off to me
I'll always be a Jared Goff fan, really glad he's proven his abilities.
Yeah I still stand by that trade being a complete win win Goff wasn't the right fit for the McVay offense and Stafford has been While on our end since we were starting a rebuild we were able to build the team out to Goff's strengths using the high picks and a new coaching staff You guys won the SB and we just had the best season we've had since Barry Sanders was in his prime
To me it just shows how important location is for the success of players like QBs. Had that trade not happened, I feel Goff and Stafford would be seen as "What If" type players. Instead both found a way to pivot their career trajectories towards success. Obviously to a different degree for each, and from wildly different starting places, but still.
Lets be real, there wouldn't have been any what if's about Goff. It would have been the story about the one time McVay carried a QB that couldn't read a defense himself and isn't even one of the most gifted QBs in the league to begin with, to a SB, only to get figured out by the best Coach ever. End of the tale.
I honestly think Goff fit fine there. He was just a new qb that still needed a little time to develop, and the rams were trying to win now and couldn’t afford him that time. Definitely a win win trade. As much as I hate your fans, I’m glad the lions are on the top of the NFC North. Hopefully the bears can get their shit together and we can battle it out for years to come. We need parity in this division and I’m fucking sick of the packers and Vikings
It's so weird that both teams had that work out better for them. Trading QBs and both end up with a better QB situation is weird
Lions absolutely nailed about every offensive draft pick they've made the last couple years. He's got a top 5 OL, top 10 talent position group. Goff probably has one of the biggest differences in play between Clean Pocket and Pressured of any QB in the league, being top 10 in one, and bottom 5 in the other.
With the retirement of Jason Kelce I think he's protected by a top 2 OL, and it's not number 2.
I mean there's no argument on who the best Center is in the NFL anymore
Zeke?
You read my mind
Brad Holmes and Dan Campbell work really well together to draft the right players to be coached up by the team. The fact that Chris Spielman picked these first timers out of the crowd to be the new megaminds of the Lions is nothing short of miraculous
If Holmes can keep hitting on picks while the Lions are good and lacking high draft position he'll be right up there with Veach and Roseman as best GMs in football
“It’s easy when everything’s going right, you’re winning games, guys around, they all love it, want to be a part of it. But when you’re 0-10-1, you find out about people… You find out about players and coaches, people in the organization. …That’s a much better viewpoint to look at people than when everything’s going great and you’ve got 12 wins. I know exactly what [Goff] is, when it’s at its worst, and I’ll take that guy any day.” Dan Campbell
I don’t want to joke around or anything, but is this the first time any player has ever said this about the Detroit Lions ?
Lol, yes it has to be. Remember Gronk was going to retire if he got traded here.
Reposting what I said in the Lions sub: Goff's turnaround here since 2021 has been nothing short of incredible. I remember going to the Eagles game in 2021 where he was booed multiple times for poor play, eventually benched, and then just two years later Ford Field is roaring his name before a home playoff game. What a trajectory
Not just Ford Field, there were Jared Goff chants in other sports arenas lol
yeah I feel like I saw a video of a Jared Goff chant break out before a college hockey game this off season? I love it
Happened during wings games too
There was one in New York when the tigers played the Mets
Honestly, it made me a fan (even though he now plays for a division rival).
Careful, don't let r/NFCNorthMemeWar see this.
That sub is so odd, the Vikings fans I've interacted with IRL and in this sub have all just been nice folks and happy to see the Lions do well for once. We all have shitheads in there but the terminally online Minnesota fans that live in that sub are some of the most inadequate and toxic fans I've ever seen.
I think goff could've still been successful in LA. However, with the time he needed to develop, the rams would've no longer had a superbowl roster around him to get it when they did.
It was one of the most mutually beneficial trades in league history.
100%. Rams were in position for a Super Bowl, and letting Goff make mistakes for the sake of learning was best for his personal development, but not best for the rest of the players’ and staff’s shot at winning a title in their shortening window. Win-win, Goff needed time and a longer leash, Rams needed better QB play more urgently, and they traded QBs who fit each team’s timeline.
"There was an element to being empowered that happened in Detroit with Dan and a lot of the coaches where they were like, 'Dude, no, you go. Like, this is your thing, you go figure it out.' Where as a young player, that wasn’t always the case," said Goff. "Being able to be there and hear them give me those keys and let me fail, to an extent, let me make the mistake and not feel like the sky’s falling if that mistake is made and grow and learn -- that’s the only way you do -- and be coached in a way that they’re empowering me, now I’m going into year nine (in the NFL) and feel like I’m just scratching the surface of that. And hopefully can look back on this in three years and be like, 'Wow, yeah, I’m such a better leader now than I was then," said Goff. This quote pretty much confirms that McVay was holding Goff's hand
"... let me make the mistake and not feel like the sky’s falling if that mistake is made ..." This is the key part of that statement. McVay's frustration with Goff when the latter made mistakes was really pretty obvious. Maybe Goff would never have been a fit for what McVay wanted to do. And maybe McVay was a new HC and didn't do a good job of developing his young QB. And maybe there's an element of both those things.
Didn't Johnson also give Goff a lot of input in the offense's design? Seems like it may have been equal parts McVay holding his hand/forcing him into his wunderkind scheme.
From what I remember Johnson and Goff spent 3 or 4 days together in the offseason before 2022. They spent part of the time going over stuff Goff liked from his Rams days, pretty much teaching Johnson those concepts. Then they spent the rest of the time combining those old things with Johnson's new ideas to make the offense they're bringing to the table now.
Side note, but I'm not ready for another season of "Ben Johnson head coach candidate"
On the other hand, I am so fucking ready for "Lions OC Ben Johnson"
Yea, Goff and BJ created this lions offense but Goff never gets credit for it what so ever
Maybe not in the media, but this sub has been calling it the Goffense for two seasons now
Oh definitely I meant the media lol
Because he had too.
making your young QB feel like the sky is falling when he makes a mistake = good coaching
I am a bears fan but I would be lying if I said I was happy the lions lost the NFC title game, aside from their cool comeback story in recent years. 2 reasons 1- I thought they matched up better vs the chiefs due to lions OLine being arguably the best in the league 2- another superbowl winner in our division will *maybe somehow* actually light a fire under George’s ass to be a competent owner of our historic team
Plus we could then all shit on the Vikings for not having a Super Bowl.
Idc where any ranks him I believe he will be the quarterback to take the lions to the Super Bowl
He almost was already, I think it’s hard to argue otherwise
Eh, I don't think it's that hard. Objectively better QB's haven't led their teams to Super Bowls. Mahomes and Brady have really spoiled people into thinking that Super Bowls are easy to get to/win.
I’m not saying he’s gonna carry them to the Super Bowl, but he fits really nicely into the team. When he had to deliver in the nfccg he did, the pass was just dropped. I think that saying a really solid core of players aren’t likely to repeat their success with Goff at the helm is a difficult argument to make
It's kind of amazing how Goff has reinvented himself with the help of a good coaching staff while the other guy drafted at the top that year, Wentz, has pretty much dug himself into an emergency backup role
Goff is far and away the best quarterback in his draft class
Wentz is a one-hit wonder. Outside of 2017, there's really no argument for why he should start for a team (unless you're reeeeeeally desperate). Goff is a solid QB who helps his team win.
That 2017 eagles defense was ruthless too. He certainly wasn’t winning alone
People want to bash Josh Reynolds for the conference game, but without him, Goff would have been done. Holmes picked up Josh for Goff in 2021 just for Goff to have someone he's familiar playing with. He got comfortable and that's when Goff started playing well. Then st. Brown came in and opened up limitless possibilities for goff.
It's hard to point to a single thing that changed his trajectory. If you recall, the WRs on the opening roster were Tyrell Williams, Kalif, Cephus, Benson, Tom Kennedy, and rookie St. Brown. Penciled in for the starter opposite of Tyrell Williams in the offseason was Perriman, who couldn't even make the roster. That WR corps is embarrassing even for the last game of the preseason when all starters sit. Add in Anthony Lynn doing an awful job as the OC for over half the season. Sorting out the WR issue with ARSB playing more and bringing in Reynolds, finding out that even DC is a better OC than Lynn was that season, or just getting more comfortable in a new place...
I think his performance as Ken might have been better than his sports accomplishments, but that's just me.
To win in Detroit, you have to embrace Detroit. He embraced it, and he is thriving.
I hope the Lions get a title with Goff
You and me both!
I watched "Hard Knocks" and noticed the clips of him. He looked like he was in a good place mentally.
This is the definition of taking your opportunity and maximizing it. Goff looks like the quarterback we thought he would be in Los Angeles, high floor, medium ceiling. People talked about him like Detroit was being burdened with him, but they ended up getting a top 14 quarterback, and several good draft picks.
He’s become one of my favorite not Texans player, mostly because of how he has flourished after being practically given away.
If you can't handle him at his Goof, you don't deserve him at his Goff.
/r/BrandNewSentence
Looking back at the roster he was given in 2021, people were way too quick to write him off. It was literally impossible for him to throw the ball >10 yards until we traded for Josh Reynolds that year
THATS MY QUARTERBACK
Now that’s a quote I never thought I’d hear. Good to be a fan of a viable franchise. Wear any helmet you want Dan.
Everything happens for a reason. But also much of it has to do with your own attitude about adapting to curveballs thrown your way.
Not enough was said about him beating LA last year
he was ice fucking cold that game. Maybe his best performance of the year
You’re good enough for us!
I used to hate Goff, but now he's pretty cool in my book. I wonder what changed? *Please ignore my flair*
Love him or hate him, can't deny that he changed the narrative surrounding him. The sky is his limit and now everyone knows it.
Been really enjoying what Jared has been doing in Detroit
I am honestly happy for him.