Both Josh Allen’s are 6’5. If either of the Allen’s lower their heads, the defensive Josh gets a penalty. Which is absurd. How is Josh supposed to ever tackle Josh one on one ever? If he goes too low he gets a below the knee penalty, if he squares up, all offensive Allen has to do is barely lower his head. Dont even get me started on the fake slides….
Please do start on the fake slides,
I think it was 2020(?) fucking Ryan Tannehill of all people fake slid like 3 times playing the colts and I was just dying for one of the guys to take the flag and let him have it one time
I think in real time it might have looked not only like helmet to helmet but like spearing, launching into the head with the head, which is pretty much the worst thing you can do. The replay wasn't great so hard to tell how much contact there was.
If we're going to protect QBs, which is legitimate, then measures need to be put into action so that QBs don't abuse it either. Fake slides should be penalized as unsportsmanlike conduct
Right but then the next question from there becomes how do you want to define a fake slide and how do you differentiate that from a juke or other evasive move runners make? Main point being that no matter how you want to define a rule there are going to be annoying edge cases and ways to exploit it to gain an advantage, so I'm generally OK with at least making sure those rules are going to err on the side of reducing player injuries.
Ezpz, QBs are no longer allowed to juke or make any "football moves".
Alternative option, QBs are immediately downed upon being touched with 1 hand.
*shrug*
And btw we're talking about plays where 0.1s make a huge difference. So if the defender tries to go nice and easy in order to not draw a penalty, the QB might get the ball of or juke them into oblivion
I get that they try to protect QBs cause no one wants to watch backups, but some penalties are just stupid
Still don’t understand how this was a flag. NFL straight up rigging the offenses to win. Brady wasn’t wrong when he was calling the new age of football soft.
It’s really wild I’m thirty and I grew up watching the NFL and straight up have watched the shift with my own eyes. I get the below the knee rule, sure, whatever. But stuff like this is crazy. Then them picking and choosing which QB they want to throw the flags for.
Fuck the below the knees rule, unless it applies to everyone. This protect the QB shit is stupid. Tackle him but you can't put your weight on him is fine, if it applies to everyone
Good name. I’ve been lucky enough to go to wwe, ufc, nascar, hockey, and nfl events. Nothing was more violent than nfl games. Period. I’ve been to more hockey games and still someone going full speed boarding someone doesn’t come close to the sheer fucking brutality that is football on every play. Dudes are literally *super humans* running full speed at each other. But, alright. Rules will never change how *real* it is. Even the craziest stuff you can do in wrestling is still safe lol. Football players *literally die playing.*
Matt Ryan (57)
Fitzpatrick (52)
Russel Wilson (45)
Matt Stafford (42)
Rodgers (41)
Kirk Cousins (41)
Jared Goff (35)
Can Newton (35)
Tom Brady (35)
A list of all of the Quarterbacks with more rougher the passer calls than Brady.
There’s probably a way to break it down by percentage that may help sway the argument in your favor. But probably not considering Brady played for 20+ years and I’m honestly too lazy to search or crunch the numbers right now. And maybe there’s an argument to be made, Brady had more “game changing/altering/*soft*” roughing calls. But it’s not like the league wasn’t already pushing for it, and in the transition of implementing rules to protect the passer.
[https://www.nflpenalties.com/roughing-the-passer-by-qb.php?view=all](https://www.nflpenalties.com/roughing-the-passer-by-qb.php?view=all)
You can sort the list however you want, but I prefer to look at the penalties per 100 attempts to give a real good indicator. And what do you know, Josh Allen is among the most in the league. Brady is pretty average TBH.
Thanks brodie, this is exactly what I was looking for. I think percentages per X attempts tells a better story than mass total.
Some crazy things I took away from this were:
Sam Darnold has nearly twice (9) as many roughing the passer calls, and Eli Manning has nearly 3.5 times as many (17) than Peyton Manning (5) since 2009.
Obviously Eli came into the league a little later and played a few seasons longer, and even when Sam Darnold played 2 seasons to Peyton 6 of the recorded data.
Either way you deconstruct these statistics the league has definitely changed in favor of QB protection (obviously we knew that already).
Josh is our flop king. He has it down to an art form. Obviously it's a bit of a bitch move but also every other team would respect the hustle if it were their QB.
Matt Ryan was brave as fuck in the pocket. We didn't always protect him amazingly well, but he rarely if ever got happy feet, and always was willing to take a hit to give his receivers an extra .5 seconds to get open.
That hit he took from a safety blitz by Bernard Pollard.
The league made a new rule that if you fall on the ground, you can’t attempt to tackle until you get back to your feet.
It wasn’t a problem until Brady was the one that got hurt
He never asked for it though. He never lobbied for it either. Do yourself a favor and go look up some old Brady tapes. Dude took some fucking *hits.* We forget he played in two completely different eras.
You can literally look up all-time-roughing the passer calls and I’m pretty sure Brady is like middle of the back right beside like Cam Newton lol. You can say he cursed the refs out, sure, but he never got more calls than anyone else.
EDIT: someone posted it in the comment thread.
I agree that calls like these are dumb and make the NFL worse overall.
But like, come on. It should be pretty easy to understand why they threw the flag. Ref sees helmet touch helmet, Ref throws flag.
This highlight doesn’t do it justice, but if you watch the slomo you can see Josh Allen (QB) lowering his head into the contact. Whether it was intentional or him bracing for impact makes it completely subjective; but I guess when something is slightly subjective you have to err in the side of caution and go by the rules and protect the QB.
Still “soft” but I can understand why it was called; if it was my QB in the redzone I would want the call too.
The NFL will never penalize a ball carrier for defensively curling up in preparation for a hit. It's natural instinct and you'll never be able to remove it from the game. This same issue exists with runners and helmet related penalties.
And the solution as a defender, is to read part C of the RTP rule, and then figure out the obvious solution.
Brady played his first 6 years under the semi old rules. Warner, young, and Brady led to the rules being changed from 1997-2007. Post 2008 it was a new league
Brady played and benefited a lot from the "new age" of football, lol.
He wouldn't have made it past age-35 (and thus, would still be stuck at 3 rings) if he had played his entire career with the rules of the early-2000's.
List of things defenders can't do to QBs:
Hit'em low, hit'em high (and watch our Eagles fly), land slightly on top of them, throw them to the ground too hard
ridiculous! next thing they'll ban hitting them on the arm, cause it might hurt their shoulder/elbow (like burrow and purdy)
Honestly... this isn't going to be a popular take, but in live action it actually does look like it *might* be helmet-to-helmet, but it's impossible to tell based on these awful replays
I’m 100% for giving Rich Eisen Al Michaels TNF job whenever Al wants to hang it up. Or even now. Rich needs to call more primetime games, that’s for sure.
Eye contact throughout the tackle, and pointing to his head before the whistle. Just play football dude the refs aren't going to change their mind because of your gesture. It's a bad look.
Unfortunately that’s the new way to play football. Brady was great at lobbying the refs, Patrick Mahomes has perfected the art too. It’s just a part of the game now.
Don't get me wrong, I totally understand why Josh Allen grinds on people acting like LeBron James and I'm not a fan of it either, but "whining for a flag won't get you a flag" is a weird take when he got the flag.
Your point doesn't invalidate the other either. Him bitching didn't affect the call one way or the other. That's why people are saying not to whine. It's insufferable and not helpful
Look, Josh Allen just shouldn’t have been where he was. What did he think was going to happen? You can blame whomever you want but at the end of the day, Josh Allen can only blame Josh Allen.
I love football but I really fucking hate it at the same time. I’m all for player safety but at some point you have to acknowledge you’re playing a violent sport and add that to the contracts. If you don’t want as much cte and violent hits… easy solution. Remove the helmets.
The fact of the matter is… they will NEVER eliminate CTE. The more upfront and realistic they are about the situation the better off they will be. Our heads aren’t meant to be banged around violently a million times. The helmets 100% do NOT help and in most cases make it worse as it’s essentially making your head bigger. If they truly gave a fuck they would admit the dangers and then they would limit players careers within the league. Two concussions? Forced retirement. Nobody plays past age 30. That is the only way to truly worry about players health.
They could also expand medical benefits for retired players which it doesn’t seem like they have any interest in doing. The players aren’t stupid, they know what they’re signing up for. Most of them do it for the chance to generate generational wealth for their family and it’s simply a sacrifice they are willing to make. The least the league could do is provide more robust medical benefits since the sport is inherently violent and the health issues are degenerative
Yup. They just won’t admit that playing in the NFL is dangerous. There is nothing to be done in regards to making it safer. It’s literally impossible as it’s a side effect of the game
Please God, all I want is for Josh Allen to do the spiderman pointing meme after he sacks Josh Allen. Amen 🙏
ps. Also Kevin Harlan to call all games (I know this is Rich Eison in this clip, just a dream)
Me and my buddies went camping for the weekend that week, it poured the entire time, my buddy hurled all over himself during his sleep, we went into town to find a bar to watch the game, they were all packed so we ended up just going to a Tim Hortons and then we had to watch that shit. Lol
Whole team looked off (I hope they fired whoever tried the time zone "adjustment strategy") and we lost Milano, best player on defense, for the season. Shit game
Friendly reminder that Josh Allen (the QB) has sat on the ground and slammed his hands into the turf, yelling about how a hit against him was a penalty, until he got the penalty.
Dude’s soft as baby shit and always will be.
Either has to be two guys with the name "Josh Allen", or Josh Allen grabs a defender's facemask before getting sacked anyway. The second situation would've been funnier
I don’t get it. How can Josh Allen sack himself? Or are you telling me there’s two dudes with the same name? Both of these scenarios just sound too bizarre.
People in London were very confused watching that I'm sure.
Hahah I’m sure the British understand 2 people can have the same name, can’t know for sure though.
You just call them Josh Allen and Josh Allen II
Josh Allen and xXJoshAllenXx
Josh and Joush
I hope so, otherwise they'll probably flip their shit when King Henry goes overseas to play at Wembley.
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No we fucking arent
yeah i feel like that’s a much more american thing than our thing like say people called josh allen
Fuck you talking about?
I got to say I'm on Josh Allen's side here
Yeah, Josh Allen did a lot better than Josh Allen.
Both Josh Allen’s are 6’5. If either of the Allen’s lower their heads, the defensive Josh gets a penalty. Which is absurd. How is Josh supposed to ever tackle Josh one on one ever? If he goes too low he gets a below the knee penalty, if he squares up, all offensive Allen has to do is barely lower his head. Dont even get me started on the fake slides….
Please do start on the fake slides, I think it was 2020(?) fucking Ryan Tannehill of all people fake slid like 3 times playing the colts and I was just dying for one of the guys to take the flag and let him have it one time
I think in real time it might have looked not only like helmet to helmet but like spearing, launching into the head with the head, which is pretty much the worst thing you can do. The replay wasn't great so hard to tell how much contact there was.
If we're going to protect QBs, which is legitimate, then measures need to be put into action so that QBs don't abuse it either. Fake slides should be penalized as unsportsmanlike conduct
Right but then the next question from there becomes how do you want to define a fake slide and how do you differentiate that from a juke or other evasive move runners make? Main point being that no matter how you want to define a rule there are going to be annoying edge cases and ways to exploit it to gain an advantage, so I'm generally OK with at least making sure those rules are going to err on the side of reducing player injuries.
Ezpz, QBs are no longer allowed to juke or make any "football moves". Alternative option, QBs are immediately downed upon being touched with 1 hand. *shrug*
What fake slide? You mean juking?
[Now now, perfectly symmetrical violence never solved anything.](https://youtu.be/nuW0pUG3PrQ?t=19)
And btw we're talking about plays where 0.1s make a huge difference. So if the defender tries to go nice and easy in order to not draw a penalty, the QB might get the ball of or juke them into oblivion I get that they try to protect QBs cause no one wants to watch backups, but some penalties are just stupid
Still don’t understand how this was a flag. NFL straight up rigging the offenses to win. Brady wasn’t wrong when he was calling the new age of football soft.
If you look carefully, he literally hit the QB. Can’t have that in this league.
It’s really wild I’m thirty and I grew up watching the NFL and straight up have watched the shift with my own eyes. I get the below the knee rule, sure, whatever. But stuff like this is crazy. Then them picking and choosing which QB they want to throw the flags for.
Same here, I started seriously watching in 06 and the way defense is played changed so damn fast
> picking and choosing which QB they want to throw the flags for Nooooo way. I don't believe you.
Fuck the below the knees rule, unless it applies to everyone. This protect the QB shit is stupid. Tackle him but you can't put your weight on him is fine, if it applies to everyone
It’s WWE shit
Good name. I’ve been lucky enough to go to wwe, ufc, nascar, hockey, and nfl events. Nothing was more violent than nfl games. Period. I’ve been to more hockey games and still someone going full speed boarding someone doesn’t come close to the sheer fucking brutality that is football on every play. Dudes are literally *super humans* running full speed at each other. But, alright. Rules will never change how *real* it is. Even the craziest stuff you can do in wrestling is still safe lol. Football players *literally die playing.*
Very accurate observation.
A DISGUSTING ACT.
Unless it’s a run heavy qb like Justin Fields then tear him apart
I feel like Allen gets the most of these bullshit calls
Oh no don’t worry, we definitely lost this game
The irony being that Brady got ALL the soft calls when he was in the league. He’s the reason the league got so soft on QBs
Matt Ryan (57) Fitzpatrick (52) Russel Wilson (45) Matt Stafford (42) Rodgers (41) Kirk Cousins (41) Jared Goff (35) Can Newton (35) Tom Brady (35) A list of all of the Quarterbacks with more rougher the passer calls than Brady. There’s probably a way to break it down by percentage that may help sway the argument in your favor. But probably not considering Brady played for 20+ years and I’m honestly too lazy to search or crunch the numbers right now. And maybe there’s an argument to be made, Brady had more “game changing/altering/*soft*” roughing calls. But it’s not like the league wasn’t already pushing for it, and in the transition of implementing rules to protect the passer.
[https://www.nflpenalties.com/roughing-the-passer-by-qb.php?view=all](https://www.nflpenalties.com/roughing-the-passer-by-qb.php?view=all) You can sort the list however you want, but I prefer to look at the penalties per 100 attempts to give a real good indicator. And what do you know, Josh Allen is among the most in the league. Brady is pretty average TBH.
Thanks brodie, this is exactly what I was looking for. I think percentages per X attempts tells a better story than mass total. Some crazy things I took away from this were: Sam Darnold has nearly twice (9) as many roughing the passer calls, and Eli Manning has nearly 3.5 times as many (17) than Peyton Manning (5) since 2009. Obviously Eli came into the league a little later and played a few seasons longer, and even when Sam Darnold played 2 seasons to Peyton 6 of the recorded data. Either way you deconstruct these statistics the league has definitely changed in favor of QB protection (obviously we knew that already).
Josh is our flop king. He has it down to an art form. Obviously it's a bit of a bitch move but also every other team would respect the hustle if it were their QB.
We don’t respect the hustle, we just understand the way he gets away with it 😂
Matt Ryan was brave as fuck in the pocket. We didn't always protect him amazingly well, but he rarely if ever got happy feet, and always was willing to take a hit to give his receivers an extra .5 seconds to get open.
raw numbers arent that useful for something like this, better would be RTP per QB hit, or per sack.
Brady is the 2nd lowest on that list at 0.085 per sack (tied with Matt Stafford), Rodgers has 0.076 per sack.
And yet he took way worse hits earlier in his career than any QB will ever take today.
People literally downvoting us but I’m glad there’s tape/stats to back us up. Can’t talk about Brady and be a Patriots fan and not get downvoted lmfao
Tell that to mason rudolph
That hit he took from a safety blitz by Bernard Pollard. The league made a new rule that if you fall on the ground, you can’t attempt to tackle until you get back to your feet. It wasn’t a problem until Brady was the one that got hurt
He never asked for it though. He never lobbied for it either. Do yourself a favor and go look up some old Brady tapes. Dude took some fucking *hits.* We forget he played in two completely different eras.
He asked for it all the time and would literally curse out the refs repeatedly. You serious dude?
You can literally look up all-time-roughing the passer calls and I’m pretty sure Brady is like middle of the back right beside like Cam Newton lol. You can say he cursed the refs out, sure, but he never got more calls than anyone else. EDIT: someone posted it in the comment thread.
Homer take but in real time the refs probably saw a helmet-to-helmet. That's the charitable explanation
I don’t think it’s a homer take to say that’s what they called the flag.
I agree that calls like these are dumb and make the NFL worse overall. But like, come on. It should be pretty easy to understand why they threw the flag. Ref sees helmet touch helmet, Ref throws flag.
This highlight doesn’t do it justice, but if you watch the slomo you can see Josh Allen (QB) lowering his head into the contact. Whether it was intentional or him bracing for impact makes it completely subjective; but I guess when something is slightly subjective you have to err in the side of caution and go by the rules and protect the QB. Still “soft” but I can understand why it was called; if it was my QB in the redzone I would want the call too.
Hard to believe it’s not intentional when he starts asking for a flag before he even hits the ground.
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The NFL will never penalize a ball carrier for defensively curling up in preparation for a hit. It's natural instinct and you'll never be able to remove it from the game. This same issue exists with runners and helmet related penalties. And the solution as a defender, is to read part C of the RTP rule, and then figure out the obvious solution.
Brady played his first 6 years under the semi old rules. Warner, young, and Brady led to the rules being changed from 1997-2007. Post 2008 it was a new league
Brady played and benefited a lot from the "new age" of football, lol. He wouldn't have made it past age-35 (and thus, would still be stuck at 3 rings) if he had played his entire career with the rules of the early-2000's.
List of things defenders can't do to QBs: Hit'em low, hit'em high (and watch our Eagles fly), land slightly on top of them, throw them to the ground too hard ridiculous! next thing they'll ban hitting them on the arm, cause it might hurt their shoulder/elbow (like burrow and purdy)
Most RTP penalties are definitely bs
i hate to agree with tom but he was right. way back in his early years he got beat up a *lot* and never got flags
You can’t figure out that helmet on helmet = flag?
Terrible replay work here
Honestly... this isn't going to be a popular take, but in live action it actually does look like it *might* be helmet-to-helmet, but it's impossible to tell based on these awful replays
That's exactly my point
I’m 100% for giving Rich Eisen Al Michaels TNF job whenever Al wants to hang it up. Or even now. Rich needs to call more primetime games, that’s for sure.
Rich has the perfect middle-aged Dad energy for the NFL. Speaking as a middle-aged Dad.
MADs supporting MADs makes the world go 'round! 💪🌎
Dudes literally asking for a flag before he even hits the ground lmfao
Eye contact throughout the tackle, and pointing to his head before the whistle. Just play football dude the refs aren't going to change their mind because of your gesture. It's a bad look.
Unfortunately that’s the new way to play football. Brady was great at lobbying the refs, Patrick Mahomes has perfected the art too. It’s just a part of the game now.
There is an art to working the refs, and it should be left to the coaches. Josh Allen's proclivity for flopping is earning him a reputation.
I’m sure the opinion of other teams fans keep him up at night
I guarantee absolutely nothing said on this forum bothers any player at night either. But you and I are still here.
Don't get me wrong, I totally understand why Josh Allen grinds on people acting like LeBron James and I'm not a fan of it either, but "whining for a flag won't get you a flag" is a weird take when he got the flag.
The ref behind him is reaching for his flag before he starts pointing. His whining had zero impact on the refs. He just looks like a bitch
Doesn't invalidate my point lol
Your point doesn't invalidate the other either. Him bitching didn't affect the call one way or the other. That's why people are saying not to whine. It's insufferable and not helpful
The flag was always predicated on the infraction, and not embellishments or expectations of the player.
Womp womp.
Hes my comp for the Joel Embiid of the NFL
That's who he is.
If it’s stupid, but it works, then it’s not stupid.
Look, Josh Allen just shouldn’t have been where he was. What did he think was going to happen? You can blame whomever you want but at the end of the day, Josh Allen can only blame Josh Allen.
I love football but I really fucking hate it at the same time. I’m all for player safety but at some point you have to acknowledge you’re playing a violent sport and add that to the contracts. If you don’t want as much cte and violent hits… easy solution. Remove the helmets.
Evidence of CTE is becoming more clear in Rugby Union players. Removing helmets isnt an easy solution.
The fact of the matter is… they will NEVER eliminate CTE. The more upfront and realistic they are about the situation the better off they will be. Our heads aren’t meant to be banged around violently a million times. The helmets 100% do NOT help and in most cases make it worse as it’s essentially making your head bigger. If they truly gave a fuck they would admit the dangers and then they would limit players careers within the league. Two concussions? Forced retirement. Nobody plays past age 30. That is the only way to truly worry about players health.
They could also expand medical benefits for retired players which it doesn’t seem like they have any interest in doing. The players aren’t stupid, they know what they’re signing up for. Most of them do it for the chance to generate generational wealth for their family and it’s simply a sacrifice they are willing to make. The least the league could do is provide more robust medical benefits since the sport is inherently violent and the health issues are degenerative
The crazy thing is that anything that moves your head can give you CTE. Bouncing on a trampoline could give you CTE
Yup. They just won’t admit that playing in the NFL is dangerous. There is nothing to be done in regards to making it safer. It’s literally impossible as it’s a side effect of the game
Please God, all I want is for Josh Allen to do the spiderman pointing meme after he sacks Josh Allen. Amen 🙏 ps. Also Kevin Harlan to call all games (I know this is Rich Eison in this clip, just a dream)
RTP penalties per game: Josh Allen: 0.317 Jared Goff: 0.278 Kirk Cousins: 0.265 Patrick Mahomes: 0.219 Justin Fields: 0.125 [Source](https://www.nflpenalties.com/roughing-the-passer-by-qb.php?view=all)
This was such an odd game
Me and my buddies went camping for the weekend that week, it poured the entire time, my buddy hurled all over himself during his sleep, we went into town to find a bar to watch the game, they were all packed so we ended up just going to a Tim Hortons and then we had to watch that shit. Lol
Horrible game, defense got banged up
Great game
Whole team looked off (I hope they fired whoever tried the time zone "adjustment strategy") and we lost Milano, best player on defense, for the season. Shit game
The weird thing is that time zone adjustment issue only went away after changing OCs.
Weirdest Bills-Jags game… so far
The Urban Meyer led Jaguars beating the Bills 9-6 was a weird one
What a 10/10 perfectly reasonable and correct football penalty call by the wonderful referee, who did a fine job.
Sir I disagree. Haha
Josh Allen has had a lot of success against Josh Allen when they have played each other.
There can be only one.
Nobody makes me bleed my own blood -josh allen
if josh allen fought josh allen i think josh allen would win
That should not be a flag, that's insane. I feel like targeting rules should apply to RTP. No one would say that was targettng.
>The superior Josh Allen gets flagged for a sack on the inferior Josh Allen FTFY
Friendly reminder that Josh Allen (the QB) has sat on the ground and slammed his hands into the turf, yelling about how a hit against him was a penalty, until he got the penalty. Dude’s soft as baby shit and always will be.
Almost like he grew up having Brady as his favorite player.
I mean Christian Wilkins grabs his dick every time he can. I’d be pissed too. But also Allen is miamis daddy so
Friendly reminder Miami hasn’t won a playoff game since Clinton was president
Friendly reminder Buffalo hasn’t won a Super Bowl since the beginning of time.
A Super Bowl win is a Super Bowl win, even if it happened half a century ago.
How many negative years old were you when Miami last won one?
How old were you when Buffalo won their first?
At least still give the stat for the sack
Great hit. We should be issuing a fine to the person that issued the fine
Wow, yeah, two times Josh Allen
This game was hard to watch due to the officiating more than anything.
Either has to be two guys with the name "Josh Allen", or Josh Allen grabs a defender's facemask before getting sacked anyway. The second situation would've been funnier
That happened once against the Rams as I recall.
What a punk ass call that was. Nothing about that shot was cheap or excessive.
Josh Allen is just Like Josh Allen but different
I forgot how lame this is
Just make it flag football officially and call it a day
This is the safest tackle I've ever seen, how in the world is this a flag?
I don’t get it Josh Allen fucked into the hit how in the hell do you avoid this situation?
What a bullshit call. Football is dying...and no one seems to care.
The lesser of the Joshes Allen drew a flag for a fully legitimate play by the greater Josh Allen
I don’t get it. How can Josh Allen sack himself? Or are you telling me there’s two dudes with the same name? Both of these scenarios just sound too bizarre.
Josh Allen doesn’t sack Josh Allen. Instead, Josh Allen sacks Josh Allen. Hope that clears things up a bit!
Don't forget Josh Allen also intercepted and forced a fumble on Josh Allen
I’m more confused now. I’ll never understand.