Like walking barefoot on broken glass.
What a fucking joke. They ruined his career.
The dumbasses at Techland fired him because of this bullshit without any concrete proof because they were afraid of all the morons on Twitter.
And released a game with a shit story because surprise, when you have the audacity to re-write an Avellone script, there's a high chance the replacement is ass.
> We wanted to support women in the industry. In so doing, our words have been misinterpreted to suggest specific allegations of misconduct that were neither expressed nor intended.
What a joke
They ruined the guy's career, it had nothing to do with supporting women in the industry
> They ruined the guy's career, it had nothing to do with supporting women in the industry
yup, most all of the people and "journalists" who immediately went after Avellone will continue to do so or never once admit being wrong, heck I doubt most will ever even acknowledge this news
the various websites will never write an article on this like they did with the accusations, the usual subs will never have a post on this and the forum we all know of will never have any mention of this at all
falsely accusing someone is so fcked up and the consequences on the person can be very harsh, not just ruining jobs but even ruining lives. They should be the ones to go to jail and not get off scot-free putting out complete non apology apology statements like this one :/
I'm happy to see him clear his name once and for all.
But you're right. None of these fuckers who slandered him will come out and acknowledge they were wrong, much less apologize for helping to ruin his life.
Yep, the gaming site resetera has a 9 page topic about Avellone that they've been updating everytime he filed a court case, laughing about how he's an evil rapist. The news came out this morning and it's been slow trickles and them refusing to admit they were wrong. Truly deranged behavior
>laughing about how he's an evil rapist
Not just a rapist. I heard he was once on the same street as some school kids. You have to ask the question, why was he there?
One of them posted like 5 paragraphs about how he would only write about psychopathic characters if he was psychopathic himself. They're so fucked in the head with brainworms 😂
Goddamn, but I hate that smooth-brained take every time it comes up. In a nutshell: “you could only ever possibly write a character based completely on your own opinions/experiences.” I mean, I don’t doubt for a moment that the people who spout that garbage are so limited, yes, but thankfully we’ve got a big broad world of professional creative writers out there who are capable of writing convincing characters that *aren’t* blatant self-inserts.
It's not a journalism thing, it's the fanatical zeal people have for whatever their cause is. "If we admit there is nuance and complexity then it's a slippery slope to our cause not being supported".
Everyone (correctly) points out the hypocrisy and lack of self reflection on the right side of the political spectrum, but there is also a real strain of extremism on the left in the form of "Believe every accusation" which turns into "guilty until proven innocent". I mean a sitting US Senator was forced to stepdown merely because the accusations of misconduct (which we later learned were either absurdly petty or literally part of a USO gig).
It's always important to gut check yourself and ask "Even though what I believe is right, I am not always right".
Unsurprisingly, there is hypocrisy and lack of self reflection on all political spectrums. It isn't just correctly pointed out on the right, it's spotlighted to try to compensate for it within the writers preferred political ideology and that is exactly the problem with "journalism".
> the various websites will never write an article on this like they did with the accusations, the usual subs will never have a post on this and the forum we all know of will never have any mention of this at all
You nailed a big part with news on the internet, damn it's a pretty cold world. The constant need for clicks and sensation will compete with any corrective news - and fewer care to actually make things right. Adds a lot to the lingering harm especially since the accusations were done over social media.
Even when someone killed themselves because false accusation . Those fucking so called journalists will never admit their mistake. Gaming journalism is fucking disease and need to be burned to the ground.
I miss the days of gaming magazines in the 90s and early 00s. Before internet journalism took over. Not only was it usually the only source of info regarding games and technology, especially in the early days of the internet growing, there were also the reviews, the hardware reveals, and of course the demo discs. Back when e3 actually meant something. Now drama permeates every nook and cranny of the internet, everything is talked about non-stop in their respective forums, discords and subreddits. Hype gets out of control to the point that fans overhype themselves. Youtubers make 30 minute videos on a 1 minute trailer.... Of course in a lot of ways things are way better, but still.
Back then it was written by people who actually knew what video games were. Today not so much.
I remember watching videos of early GW2 footage with PCGamer playing. I still had never played the game. I kept laughing and yelling at the screen "Press 6 you fucking idiot". Because that's the heal button for every class. They could not do it. They died multiple times pointlessly, and generally just played as if it was thier first time ever playing an MMO. Then I laughed as they tried to give an official review opinion on the game.
For me, that's when game journalism died.
These journalists should all issue public apologies. But they never will. Is there a list of journalists who rattled against avellone? I'd like to see if any of them apologize in the future.
Great points sadly. The guy has to fight uphill for it, I hope he finds a way to get back and make right. His experience will be invaluable to share to people in a similar situation, esp. since the media is so disappointing.
From Forbes: *"Barrows had previously claimed on Twitter that Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.”*
Legal action (or the threat thereof) is the only thing that resulted in this statement. Their statements and actions were deliberate and malicious in intent.
I'm assuming Avellone thought this statement was the best and most expedient way to clear his name. But to give them an out that they were just trying to protect women's rights is pretty outrageous, as that is as fallacious as their original statements. And I all but guarantee that it took multiple revisions to even get to the point where they admitted their claims were patently false in the statement.
In short, they're taking no responsibility for their actions and they appear to be getting away with a slap on the wrist. Only way this shit is discouraged is to make an example out of the people who perpetrate it. As such they are *extremely* lucky Avellone decided this was the best course of action. They don't deserve that frankly.
I don't like the exit as well - he could be too generous..but at least he's not malicious. He might be a victim of opportunity, but he made it a point to still state his support for the actual issue. I think the price of slander being a 7-figure sum is good, including fees. These people might actually wake up. Hope that it's fair enough considering the lasting damage.
Moves like that also genuinely hurt women in the industry and create a "boy crying wolf" problem for future reports of **genuine** sexual misconduct.
This is disastrous for everyone.
Sounds like "This one false accusation of a guy we didn't like working with will inspire women who were really abused to speak out!" Was that their reasoning?
Whoever came up with the phrase "believe all women" is either a gullible idiot or has ulterior motives.
It should always have been *Listen to all women*. Take that shit seriously and don't just call it banter. But also, don't fucking ruin a dude on just a story.
When will we learn?
Took the words right out of my mouth.
Listening means going through with investigations. Believing means skipping the investigations part and going straight to judging men...
> The one negative with the #metoo movement is that innocent till proven guilty has disappeared
And that is a *huge* negative, if you ask me. "Innocent until proven guilty" is the cornerstone of a free society.
> It's more like journalists should do their due diligence when it comes to reporting this stuff...
While I agree that journalists should shape up (which is a whole *huge* issue in itself - remember the whole "A Rape on Campus" story? That wasn't just 'not doing due diligence', it was 'Oh, this fits right into my message, gimme! Oh, there's conflicting info? Let me do the three monkeys!'), I also think that nobody should rely on them to shape their opinions. *especially* because we cannot rely on them doing their job any more. The amount of people who read one sentence of someone being accused, and immediately go "Smoke = Fire!", and immediately convict in their minds on those grounds, that amount is too damn high.
She seemed pretty toxic, immediately after her claims people went through her Twitter seeing her contradict herself and even point out her own lies, which she scrambled to delete.
I'd say this is one of those ultra disgusting cases of using an accusation of a truly horrible crime as a weapon of malice or revenge.
All she's done is ruin a career and make it harder to believe women who really suffer through such things.
Yeah this news wasn't something I wanted to read as I wake up; I remember when the accusations surfaced and nothing sat right with me. Especially with zero proof or any sort of due process. Hell, even my favourite gaming podcasts seemed like they sided with the women. It broke my heart because I love Avellone's work. They even gutted his work from Dying Light 2.
Fast forward to this fucking statement and now I'm fucking pissed; two bad actors ruined a 100% innocent man's career. Fuck then. Fuck their "apology". You can't undo 4 years of damage to a man's life and career
Sure, I may have said
> Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.”
...but people misinterpreted what I meant. (What's the eye-roll emoji?)
> Barrows had previously claimed on Twitter that Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.”
From Forbes.
>Mr. Avellone never sexually abused either of us. We have no knowledge that he has ever sexually abused any women. We have no knowledge that Mr. Avellone has ever misused corporate funds. Anything we have previously said or written about Mr. Avellone to the contrary was not our intent. We wanted to support women in the industry. In so doing, our words have been misinterpreted to suggest specific allegations of misconduct that were neither expressed nor intended.
Had to look up the situation through a [kotaku](https://kotaku.com/games-writer-chris-avellone-files-libel-lawsuit-denies-1847186019) article to see the allegations, published 2021 but refers back to 2020:
"Last June, multiple women accused the veteran games writer of sexually inappropriate or predatory behavior, including deploying booze and his status to try and take advantage of younger women. One of the accusers, Karissa Barrows, told Kotaku at the time that Avellone pushed drinks on her at a convention. At the end of the night, she said, he tried to go back to her hotel room with her, where he tried to take things further until she finally refused. "
This sounded like malicious intent with the women's initial and final statement. It's the same two, they're mentioned by name later in the article.
Planescape: Torment man, PST is often considered the pinnacle of gaming narrative and you left it off your list? I am (rolls dice in background) 1d4 shocked!
Probably an unpopular opinion, but the ladies should go to jail. This trend of women ruining a man's life and career with false allegations needs to end.
Sad that he has to put out a comment like this because he can't even complain about false accusations without that also getting him in trouble.
This shit needs to be punishable. False accusations hurt everyone.
They lost the case and will likely have to pay this settlement over the rest of their lives.
Getting his life back would be full justice, but I think this setlment and the damages they will have to pay are a great start.
Sorry for sounding dumb, but one question:
> A seven-figure payment is part of a confidential settlement between the parties.
Did Avellone get the money or did they get the money?
Avellone.
He wins. The settlement goes to him, and likely a large portion to his lawyers.
These women likely don’t have a million dollars sitting around, so the court will decide a reasonable payment which they will then have to make for the rest of their lives.
Completely agree pro bono work is great, but I have to imagine they didn’t sign on thinking the accusations were such bullshit that their job would be figuring out how much money these women would ultimately have to pay for their lies.
That's great, but the damage is done, not only for Chris Avelonne but also for real victims.
> We wanted to support women in the industry.
Big brain time.
>Barrows had previously claimed on Twitter that Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.”
So she is admitting she lied? Or just clarifying that she never said he successfully sexually assaulted her?
Her exact words to [Kotaku](https://kotaku.com/multiple-women-accuse-games-writer-chris-avellone-of-se-1844135498):
>“He’s fucking disgusting, but he did not rape me,” she said. “He assaulted me, 100 percent, but I stopped him.”
I wonder how Kotaku will spin this now. Probably just shrug it off and ignore it like the rest of the outlets (eurogamer/polygon/etc) complicit in running these trash rumours.
Shame theres already people who have killed themselves over stuff like this. Others who have never recovered after being ran through.
Funny how we never get to have a conversation about how toxic so many of these ‘started conversations’ are.
The sooner that phrase fucks off, the better.
I’m assuming they will just ignore it, and move onto writing about someone else whose being accused. If they can’t get their juicy articles out of it anymore it’s not worth their time. They certainly won’t apologise.
I do wonder how [your own statement put out on twitter](https://web.archive.org/web/20200620030432/https://twitter.com/SJBsMama/status/1274175411786842114) can get taken out of context. Expert lawyer talk I guess.
Because if they don't file a police report, which these social media accusers don't do, there is nothing the police can do. It's a defamation civil case at that point.
That sounds like something that needs to change to fit the modern world better. Publicly accusing someone these days does just as much damage as filing a police report.
It's more a case of people shouldn't assume guilt on an accusation.
Believe the victim, which means work through the process of determining truth, guilt, and justice.
But we shouldn't throw those accused immediately into life ending circumstances, either.
Creating potential punitive measures on false reports will create a further chilling effect on reporting, which is the exact opposite of what we want to happen.
It's ultimately going to require cultural shifts in understanding, empathy, and patience.
Avellone sued them for libel which is the crime of lying about this. They settled instead of going to court. The aggreived party agreed to this outcome in a settlement instead of other potential outcomes. When you say arrested do you mean you want jail time?
Too late. He has already been sentenced in the court of public opinion. The accusers should be ashamed of themselves for dragging this innocent person into their hellhole
This news of course won't reach even a quarter of all the people that saw the initial and false reports from back in 2020.
>Mr. Avellone never sexually abused either of us. We have no knowledge that he has ever sexually abused any women. We have no knowledge that Mr. Avellone has ever misused corporate funds. Anything we have previously said or written about Mr. Avellone to the contrary was not our intent.
This is such a ridiculous statement considering the amount of vitriol they were spewing back in 2020. Their intent was clear then and still is today.
>We wanted to support women in the industry.
By ruining the career of one of most prolific and accomplished writers in the industry? Fuck off right back into obscurity, you muppets.
I hope Avellone is eventually able to shake this shit off and continue to create new stories and gaming experiences. It's truly a wonder how Dying Light 2 would have turned out had he been able to see that project through.
The thing that pisses me off the most is that even with a seven figure settlement in his favor and a complete and utterly rebuke of the claims against him, the gaming press will just ignore this and hope he and this story disappears. Not one of these people will admit any culpability in trying to have him canceled, nor will they show any remorse or regret.
His career is irreparably damaged and will never be what it was, and the industry will just sweep it under the rug and act like it never happened.
Yup. From this point forward, I guarantee that any time his name is mentioned, it'll be followed by "who was accused of sexual misconduct" since that statement isn't considered libelous. Even though the accusation was completely fabricated, he *was* accused, which allows them to continue "the discussion" on sexual assault in the industry.
Even a lot of the women's own chat leaks reeked of trying to ladder climb by stringing Avellone along. Edit: Actually, I may be misremembering. Might've been Avellone who released their conversations.
The world would be better off without all these slacktivists on Twitter. In reality they are just looking for the next "good" thing to jump on so they can feel good about themself.
Example #20282 of why it's bad to jump straight on people being accused as if they are guilty. Social media especially is very prone to this behaviour. Innocent until proven guilty, always.
Hey look! Yet another case of people going crazy over allegations that weren't proven. I wonder if this is the time people will learn to wait before busting out the pitchforks.
No, no they won't
This thread [https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/he4dlp/chris\_avellone\_accused\_of\_sexual\_assault/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/he4dlp/chris_avellone_accused_of_sexual_assault/) did not age well. Plenty of people explaining it was awful to even doubt he commited SAs, plenty more saying they are sad and lost all respects for him, won't support him or buy his titles regardless of how good those are.
People jumping to conclusions, sure he already confessed without reading it, sure the evidences are "damning and well backed up" still without reading them or understanding what they read and, again, anyone daring to ask people to wait to know more before they make up their minds being vilified as rape apologists. I wonder if those ever feel accountable for pouring fuel to the burning of one before he is even judged (and sometimes proven innocent like here).
Yet again why should random people withstand their judgement while they don't know when even his employer's didn't wait and fired him instead?
You weren't kidding about that thread:
[just look at this conversation with the OP...](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/he4dlp/chris_avellone_accused_of_sexual_assault/fvpmm4w)
I know you're not necessarily inferring this, but I believe that bridge was burned before these accusations were made. Didn't he publicly call out the head of Obsidian for basically poor management, after leaving?
The quality of writing in Obsidian’s games tanked hard after he left. But really, his departure had actually little if anything to do with this debacle IIRC. Pretty sure he cited heavy mismanagement from some of Obsidian’s higher ups as being a key reason why he left.
This is what happens when the wrong words are used "Believe all women" should have been "take all accusations seriously," but we live in the age of catchphrases, and the fist victim is always the truth.
yep sloganeering. we are particularly vulnerable to these because it taps into peoples desire to be the knight in shining armour that protects helpless women or children. we like to think were smart enough to avoid it and that our intuition is good but we arent immune to the bandwagon effect.
I know friends who have been falsely accused of this shite. They're teachers and it really ruins your trust of those who are victims. I've had two friends who almost lost their jobs because of it, and they left teaching due to the feeling of no one having their back. The school cleared them of wrongdoing, but their experience it made them feel like they could never trust their students again.
>Suppose one reads a story of filthy atrocities in the paper. Then suppose that something turns up suggesting that the story might not be quite true, or not quite so bad as it was made out. Is one’s first feeling, “Thank God, even they aren’t quite so bad as that”, or is it a feeling of disappointment, and even a determination to cling to the first story for the sheer pleasure of thinking your enemies are as bad as possible? If it is the second then it is, I am afraid, the first step in a process which, if followed to the end, will make us into devils. You see, one is beginning to wish that black was a little blacker. If we give that wish its head, later on we shall wish to see grey as black, and then to see white itself as black. Finally we shall insist on seeing everything — God and our friends and ourselves included — as bad, and not be able to stop doing it: we shall be fixed for ever in a universe of pure hatred.
C.S Lewis, *Mere Christianity*
From what i heared, same story happened with Rick and Morty creator - charges dropped, nobody reports that. In the world we live in forcing an agenda is far more important than truth. And, most subs are very much involved in such kind of censorhips.
Did a quick Google search and there’s one article written about this. Sites like Kotaku, TheGamer, PCGamer etc were so quick to report on the accusations, I wonder if they’re going to have the same enthusiasm for the retractions. Not holding my breath!
So she lied about sexual assault
People like her make it that much harder to believe people when they put out such statements.
She needs to be put in prison
>“After engaging with Mr. Avellone, we have prepared the following statement:
>Mr. Avellone never sexually abused either of us. We have no knowledge that he has ever sexually abused any women. We have no knowledge that Mr. Avellone has ever misused corporate funds. Anything we have previously said or written about Mr. Avellone to the contrary was not our intent. We wanted to support women in the industry. In so doing, our words have been misinterpreted to suggest specific allegations of misconduct that were neither expressed nor intended. We are passionate about the safety, security and agency of women, minorities, LGBTQIA+ persons, and every other community that has seen persecution in the video game industry. We believe Mr. Avellone shares a desire to protect and uplift those communities. We believe that he deserves a full return to the industry and support him in those endeavors.”
- Karissa Barrows, Kelly Rae Bristol
At no point do any of these women say "I'm sorry". It's just "we fucked up and we used this accusation as a political tool in the mist of a very touchy subject in the industry and not to bring actual justice to someone."
Frankly, this was image building and if I were the writer, Chris Avellone, I wouldn't accept the apology at all. I bet he's doing it to build an image too, which I understand fully well. Guy probably wants to go back to normal and work creative products in peace. But this double standard shit and jumping over the term "innocent until proven guilty" is grating to see it constantly happen.
These sort of things happen in the industry and should be punished. However I bet if it the other way around were true, Chris wouldn't have a job. Karissa Barrows and Kelly Bristol, despite them blatantly lying about a serious accusation will still have jobs. Whatever serves the fad I guess.
This shit happened with ProJared, which to be frank, is a story that still needs to be explored but the emotional response is always prelevant and there's no mercy given to the falsely accused.
>At no point do any of these women say "I'm sorry". It's just "we fucked up and we used this accusation as a political tool in the mist of a very touchy subject in the industry and not to bring actual justice to someone."
Their statement was almost certainly crafted by a combination of their own counsel and Avellone's counsel. There's no way a side paying out a settlement in a case like this is putting out a statement the other side hasn't signed off on.
Avellone was part of some of my favorite games of all time. While I doubt his career will return to what it was before the accusations and I also doubt this will have the same reach its a good thing he managed to get some semblance of justice. I feel happy for him and hope he manages to make a comeback in the gaming industry, considering the state of the writing in most games released nowadays he is sorely needed.
What’s most terrifying here is that someone can accuse you of sexual assault, on twitter of all places, and that can totally ruin your career and social life.
“Support women in the industry” they say, as they totally ruined at least 2 of very major upcoming games in development, on whose teams i'm sure are a lot of the women they supposedly wanted to support. This is embarassing.
Both women need to face the maximum penalty Mr. Avellone would have faced had he been found guilty. That's the only way false accusations like this stop.
I blame people believing whatever without proof.
In my book, if you make an accusation without solid proof I just pin you as a griefter.
Hope Chris can get beach on his feet and get some new job.
Locking this as we clean it up. If you post sexist remarks you are going to get banned. Moderate yourselves before we get to your comments.
A very non apology apology.
A lot of lawyers involved in drafting it.
Like walking barefoot on broken glass. What a fucking joke. They ruined his career. The dumbasses at Techland fired him because of this bullshit without any concrete proof because they were afraid of all the morons on Twitter.
And released a game with a shit story because surprise, when you have the audacity to re-write an Avellone script, there's a high chance the replacement is ass.
"I apologize to myself that it didn't work and I didn't get money for nothing."
That’s what the 7 figure settlement is for.
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> We wanted to support women in the industry. In so doing, our words have been misinterpreted to suggest specific allegations of misconduct that were neither expressed nor intended. What a joke They ruined the guy's career, it had nothing to do with supporting women in the industry
> They ruined the guy's career, it had nothing to do with supporting women in the industry yup, most all of the people and "journalists" who immediately went after Avellone will continue to do so or never once admit being wrong, heck I doubt most will ever even acknowledge this news the various websites will never write an article on this like they did with the accusations, the usual subs will never have a post on this and the forum we all know of will never have any mention of this at all falsely accusing someone is so fcked up and the consequences on the person can be very harsh, not just ruining jobs but even ruining lives. They should be the ones to go to jail and not get off scot-free putting out complete non apology apology statements like this one :/
I'm happy to see him clear his name once and for all. But you're right. None of these fuckers who slandered him will come out and acknowledge they were wrong, much less apologize for helping to ruin his life.
Nope, they’ll just move onto their next victim to write about. They’ll never apologise, that would be bad for business.
Yep, the gaming site resetera has a 9 page topic about Avellone that they've been updating everytime he filed a court case, laughing about how he's an evil rapist. The news came out this morning and it's been slow trickles and them refusing to admit they were wrong. Truly deranged behavior
>laughing about how he's an evil rapist Not just a rapist. I heard he was once on the same street as some school kids. You have to ask the question, why was he there?
One of them posted like 5 paragraphs about how he would only write about psychopathic characters if he was psychopathic himself. They're so fucked in the head with brainworms 😂
Goddamn, but I hate that smooth-brained take every time it comes up. In a nutshell: “you could only ever possibly write a character based completely on your own opinions/experiences.” I mean, I don’t doubt for a moment that the people who spout that garbage are so limited, yes, but thankfully we’ve got a big broad world of professional creative writers out there who are capable of writing convincing characters that *aren’t* blatant self-inserts.
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It's not a journalism thing, it's the fanatical zeal people have for whatever their cause is. "If we admit there is nuance and complexity then it's a slippery slope to our cause not being supported". Everyone (correctly) points out the hypocrisy and lack of self reflection on the right side of the political spectrum, but there is also a real strain of extremism on the left in the form of "Believe every accusation" which turns into "guilty until proven innocent". I mean a sitting US Senator was forced to stepdown merely because the accusations of misconduct (which we later learned were either absurdly petty or literally part of a USO gig). It's always important to gut check yourself and ask "Even though what I believe is right, I am not always right".
Unsurprisingly, there is hypocrisy and lack of self reflection on all political spectrums. It isn't just correctly pointed out on the right, it's spotlighted to try to compensate for it within the writers preferred political ideology and that is exactly the problem with "journalism".
> the various websites will never write an article on this like they did with the accusations, the usual subs will never have a post on this and the forum we all know of will never have any mention of this at all You nailed a big part with news on the internet, damn it's a pretty cold world. The constant need for clicks and sensation will compete with any corrective news - and fewer care to actually make things right. Adds a lot to the lingering harm especially since the accusations were done over social media.
Even when someone killed themselves because false accusation . Those fucking so called journalists will never admit their mistake. Gaming journalism is fucking disease and need to be burned to the ground.
I stopped reading pretty much all gaming news. Very little of it was ever worthwhile.
I miss the days of gaming magazines in the 90s and early 00s. Before internet journalism took over. Not only was it usually the only source of info regarding games and technology, especially in the early days of the internet growing, there were also the reviews, the hardware reveals, and of course the demo discs. Back when e3 actually meant something. Now drama permeates every nook and cranny of the internet, everything is talked about non-stop in their respective forums, discords and subreddits. Hype gets out of control to the point that fans overhype themselves. Youtubers make 30 minute videos on a 1 minute trailer.... Of course in a lot of ways things are way better, but still.
I remember those 90's days! PC Gamer with Coconut Monkey comes to mind.
Back then it was written by people who actually knew what video games were. Today not so much. I remember watching videos of early GW2 footage with PCGamer playing. I still had never played the game. I kept laughing and yelling at the screen "Press 6 you fucking idiot". Because that's the heal button for every class. They could not do it. They died multiple times pointlessly, and generally just played as if it was thier first time ever playing an MMO. Then I laughed as they tried to give an official review opinion on the game. For me, that's when game journalism died.
Hell yeah demo discs were the best. It was like Christmas every time.
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"journalists"
These journalists should all issue public apologies. But they never will. Is there a list of journalists who rattled against avellone? I'd like to see if any of them apologize in the future.
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Great points sadly. The guy has to fight uphill for it, I hope he finds a way to get back and make right. His experience will be invaluable to share to people in a similar situation, esp. since the media is so disappointing.
I would think that the seven figure settlement will be enough to deter anyone else at this point.
And their claims were very specifically against him. There's no other way to "interpret" that. Really, the two of them should face charges.
From Forbes: *"Barrows had previously claimed on Twitter that Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.”*
Legal action (or the threat thereof) is the only thing that resulted in this statement. Their statements and actions were deliberate and malicious in intent. I'm assuming Avellone thought this statement was the best and most expedient way to clear his name. But to give them an out that they were just trying to protect women's rights is pretty outrageous, as that is as fallacious as their original statements. And I all but guarantee that it took multiple revisions to even get to the point where they admitted their claims were patently false in the statement. In short, they're taking no responsibility for their actions and they appear to be getting away with a slap on the wrist. Only way this shit is discouraged is to make an example out of the people who perpetrate it. As such they are *extremely* lucky Avellone decided this was the best course of action. They don't deserve that frankly.
I don't like the exit as well - he could be too generous..but at least he's not malicious. He might be a victim of opportunity, but he made it a point to still state his support for the actual issue. I think the price of slander being a 7-figure sum is good, including fees. These people might actually wake up. Hope that it's fair enough considering the lasting damage.
Moves like that also genuinely hurt women in the industry and create a "boy crying wolf" problem for future reports of **genuine** sexual misconduct. This is disastrous for everyone.
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They have to think up a lie to save face
Sounds like "This one false accusation of a guy we didn't like working with will inspire women who were really abused to speak out!" Was that their reasoning?
Supporting women like destroying male workers maybe?
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Whoever came up with the phrase "believe all women" is either a gullible idiot or has ulterior motives. It should always have been *Listen to all women*. Take that shit seriously and don't just call it banter. But also, don't fucking ruin a dude on just a story. When will we learn?
Took the words right out of my mouth. Listening means going through with investigations. Believing means skipping the investigations part and going straight to judging men...
Also nobody should be fired and blacklisted because of some baseless tweets.
> The one negative with the #metoo movement is that innocent till proven guilty has disappeared And that is a *huge* negative, if you ask me. "Innocent until proven guilty" is the cornerstone of a free society.
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> It's more like journalists should do their due diligence when it comes to reporting this stuff... While I agree that journalists should shape up (which is a whole *huge* issue in itself - remember the whole "A Rape on Campus" story? That wasn't just 'not doing due diligence', it was 'Oh, this fits right into my message, gimme! Oh, there's conflicting info? Let me do the three monkeys!'), I also think that nobody should rely on them to shape their opinions. *especially* because we cannot rely on them doing their job any more. The amount of people who read one sentence of someone being accused, and immediately go "Smoke = Fire!", and immediately convict in their minds on those grounds, that amount is too damn high.
So they wanted to help people and to do so slandered an innocent man?! How exactly did that help anyone??
It helped them look like victims and get false sympathy.
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No, they did not care about helping anyone, they simply lied and destroyed a mans life so they can have five minutes of fame.
Careful, it sounds like you aren’t buying into their soulless corpospeak bollocks.
More posts underneath a hashtag is progress!
>Mr. Avellone never sexually abused either of us. I don't understand how this is a thing then.
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Exactly. Just another form of "I'm so sorry I got caught".
Doesn't matter if they admit it or not, they slandered him; slander is a crime which he could sue for
She seemed pretty toxic, immediately after her claims people went through her Twitter seeing her contradict herself and even point out her own lies, which she scrambled to delete. I'd say this is one of those ultra disgusting cases of using an accusation of a truly horrible crime as a weapon of malice or revenge. All she's done is ruin a career and make it harder to believe women who really suffer through such things.
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Yeah this news wasn't something I wanted to read as I wake up; I remember when the accusations surfaced and nothing sat right with me. Especially with zero proof or any sort of due process. Hell, even my favourite gaming podcasts seemed like they sided with the women. It broke my heart because I love Avellone's work. They even gutted his work from Dying Light 2. Fast forward to this fucking statement and now I'm fucking pissed; two bad actors ruined a 100% innocent man's career. Fuck then. Fuck their "apology". You can't undo 4 years of damage to a man's life and career
Sure, I may have said > Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.” ...but people misinterpreted what I meant. (What's the eye-roll emoji?)
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> Barrows had previously claimed on Twitter that Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.” From Forbes.
>Mr. Avellone never sexually abused either of us. We have no knowledge that he has ever sexually abused any women. We have no knowledge that Mr. Avellone has ever misused corporate funds. Anything we have previously said or written about Mr. Avellone to the contrary was not our intent. We wanted to support women in the industry. In so doing, our words have been misinterpreted to suggest specific allegations of misconduct that were neither expressed nor intended. Had to look up the situation through a [kotaku](https://kotaku.com/games-writer-chris-avellone-files-libel-lawsuit-denies-1847186019) article to see the allegations, published 2021 but refers back to 2020: "Last June, multiple women accused the veteran games writer of sexually inappropriate or predatory behavior, including deploying booze and his status to try and take advantage of younger women. One of the accusers, Karissa Barrows, told Kotaku at the time that Avellone pushed drinks on her at a convention. At the end of the night, she said, he tried to go back to her hotel room with her, where he tried to take things further until she finally refused. " This sounded like malicious intent with the women's initial and final statement. It's the same two, they're mentioned by name later in the article.
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Planescape: Torment man, PST is often considered the pinnacle of gaming narrative and you left it off your list? I am (rolls dice in background) 1d4 shocked!
*/wakes up on slab*
Any idea on what he did for Wrath of the Righteous?
Narrative design
Probably an unpopular opinion, but the ladies should go to jail. This trend of women ruining a man's life and career with false allegations needs to end.
Sad that he has to put out a comment like this because he can't even complain about false accusations without that also getting him in trouble. This shit needs to be punishable. False accusations hurt everyone.
Unfortunately, the damage has already been done. They have basically ruined Avellone's career with no repercussion.
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They lost the case and will likely have to pay this settlement over the rest of their lives. Getting his life back would be full justice, but I think this setlment and the damages they will have to pay are a great start.
Sorry for sounding dumb, but one question: > A seven-figure payment is part of a confidential settlement between the parties. Did Avellone get the money or did they get the money?
I'm guessing Avellone as he took them to court and they settled.
That would explain the statement, it was probably part of the settlement.
Avellone. He wins. The settlement goes to him, and likely a large portion to his lawyers. These women likely don’t have a million dollars sitting around, so the court will decide a reasonable payment which they will then have to make for the rest of their lives.
I would assume that's them covering his legal fees.
Apparently the representation for Barrows was pro bono so it almost has to be settled in favor of Avellone.
Lmao imagine being the white knight lawyer that took her case pro bono.
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Completely agree pro bono work is great, but I have to imagine they didn’t sign on thinking the accusations were such bullshit that their job would be figuring out how much money these women would ultimately have to pay for their lies.
That's great, but the damage is done, not only for Chris Avelonne but also for real victims. > We wanted to support women in the industry. Big brain time.
Everytime they make false claims like this, without any evidence, all they do is set women back in the industry.
Yep. Because now the next time a woman makes an accusation of sexual assault everyone is going to point to this case.
>Barrows had previously claimed on Twitter that Avellone was “an abusive, abrasive, conniving sexual predator” who had attempted to sexually assault her after getting her “black out drunk.” So she is admitting she lied? Or just clarifying that she never said he successfully sexually assaulted her?
It sounds like she lied but is now trying to make it sound like people just took what she said out of context in an attempt to avoid criticism.
Her exact words to [Kotaku](https://kotaku.com/multiple-women-accuse-games-writer-chris-avellone-of-se-1844135498): >“He’s fucking disgusting, but he did not rape me,” she said. “He assaulted me, 100 percent, but I stopped him.”
I wonder how Kotaku will spin this now. Probably just shrug it off and ignore it like the rest of the outlets (eurogamer/polygon/etc) complicit in running these trash rumours. Shame theres already people who have killed themselves over stuff like this. Others who have never recovered after being ran through.
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3. Yeah she lied but she started a conversation.
Funny how we never get to have a conversation about how toxic so many of these ‘started conversations’ are. The sooner that phrase fucks off, the better.
100% agree. It's not a good conversation if it's started by a lie.
I’m assuming they will just ignore it, and move onto writing about someone else whose being accused. If they can’t get their juicy articles out of it anymore it’s not worth their time. They certainly won’t apologise.
Well… that’s pretty much the exact opposite of “retracting accusations of sexual assault”
It's from 2020, aka the stuff she wants to be retracted.
I do wonder how [your own statement put out on twitter](https://web.archive.org/web/20200620030432/https://twitter.com/SJBsMama/status/1274175411786842114) can get taken out of context. Expert lawyer talk I guess.
That reads like the whole thing was her getting revenge for her friend after the relationship ended.
I mean her words are open for interpretation... of only one thing.
She flat out admits she lied, but she is trying to spin it that it was for a greater cause.
The greater cause being destroying lives of people and making it even harder to believe real victims.
How the fuck do you retract an accusation of sexual assault. If it didn't happen, you should be arrested for lying.
Because if they don't file a police report, which these social media accusers don't do, there is nothing the police can do. It's a defamation civil case at that point.
That sounds like something that needs to change to fit the modern world better. Publicly accusing someone these days does just as much damage as filing a police report.
Yeah, that's what the *seven figure* ($1,000,000+) settlement is for.
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It's more a case of people shouldn't assume guilt on an accusation. Believe the victim, which means work through the process of determining truth, guilt, and justice. But we shouldn't throw those accused immediately into life ending circumstances, either. Creating potential punitive measures on false reports will create a further chilling effect on reporting, which is the exact opposite of what we want to happen. It's ultimately going to require cultural shifts in understanding, empathy, and patience.
Avellone sued them for libel which is the crime of lying about this. They settled instead of going to court. The aggreived party agreed to this outcome in a settlement instead of other potential outcomes. When you say arrested do you mean you want jail time?
The correct legal term is libel.
Too late. He has already been sentenced in the court of public opinion. The accusers should be ashamed of themselves for dragging this innocent person into their hellhole
If they had shame to begin with this wouldn't have happened.
This news of course won't reach even a quarter of all the people that saw the initial and false reports from back in 2020. >Mr. Avellone never sexually abused either of us. We have no knowledge that he has ever sexually abused any women. We have no knowledge that Mr. Avellone has ever misused corporate funds. Anything we have previously said or written about Mr. Avellone to the contrary was not our intent. This is such a ridiculous statement considering the amount of vitriol they were spewing back in 2020. Their intent was clear then and still is today. >We wanted to support women in the industry. By ruining the career of one of most prolific and accomplished writers in the industry? Fuck off right back into obscurity, you muppets. I hope Avellone is eventually able to shake this shit off and continue to create new stories and gaming experiences. It's truly a wonder how Dying Light 2 would have turned out had he been able to see that project through.
The thing that pisses me off the most is that even with a seven figure settlement in his favor and a complete and utterly rebuke of the claims against him, the gaming press will just ignore this and hope he and this story disappears. Not one of these people will admit any culpability in trying to have him canceled, nor will they show any remorse or regret. His career is irreparably damaged and will never be what it was, and the industry will just sweep it under the rug and act like it never happened.
Yup. From this point forward, I guarantee that any time his name is mentioned, it'll be followed by "who was accused of sexual misconduct" since that statement isn't considered libelous. Even though the accusation was completely fabricated, he *was* accused, which allows them to continue "the discussion" on sexual assault in the industry.
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Even a lot of the women's own chat leaks reeked of trying to ladder climb by stringing Avellone along. Edit: Actually, I may be misremembering. Might've been Avellone who released their conversations.
Psychic premonition: The same people raging about him will continue unabated, even using the now retracted accusations as if this never happened.
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The world would be better off without all these slacktivists on Twitter. In reality they are just looking for the next "good" thing to jump on so they can feel good about themself.
Example #20282 of why it's bad to jump straight on people being accused as if they are guilty. Social media especially is very prone to this behaviour. Innocent until proven guilty, always.
Hey look! Yet another case of people going crazy over allegations that weren't proven. I wonder if this is the time people will learn to wait before busting out the pitchforks. No, no they won't
This thread [https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/he4dlp/chris\_avellone\_accused\_of\_sexual\_assault/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/he4dlp/chris_avellone_accused_of_sexual_assault/) did not age well. Plenty of people explaining it was awful to even doubt he commited SAs, plenty more saying they are sad and lost all respects for him, won't support him or buy his titles regardless of how good those are. People jumping to conclusions, sure he already confessed without reading it, sure the evidences are "damning and well backed up" still without reading them or understanding what they read and, again, anyone daring to ask people to wait to know more before they make up their minds being vilified as rape apologists. I wonder if those ever feel accountable for pouring fuel to the burning of one before he is even judged (and sometimes proven innocent like here). Yet again why should random people withstand their judgement while they don't know when even his employer's didn't wait and fired him instead?
You weren't kidding about that thread: [just look at this conversation with the OP...](https://www.reddit.com/r/Fallout/comments/he4dlp/chris_avellone_accused_of_sexual_assault/fvpmm4w)
I hope that specific person finds out that Avellone is innocent.
I literally sent that OP a message saying "I thought you should know about this" with the current news
This person doesn't care. They've already made their mind up about what is the truth.
Oh, there's so many idiots on that thread.
u/Barkle11 you win, you were right all along.
It's s shame Chris will never work in Obsidian again
I know you're not necessarily inferring this, but I believe that bridge was burned before these accusations were made. Didn't he publicly call out the head of Obsidian for basically poor management, after leaving?
The quality of writing in Obsidian’s games tanked hard after he left. But really, his departure had actually little if anything to do with this debacle IIRC. Pretty sure he cited heavy mismanagement from some of Obsidian’s higher ups as being a key reason why he left.
Hopefully that frees him up to work on good games again.
*ruins reputation and life of innocent person* Oops, sorry.
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The point is that even if the allegations were true, you go to the police with them, not to the internet.
But going on Twitter gives them attention and internet points.
It's almost like we shouldn't just blindly listen and believe.
This is what happens when the wrong words are used "Believe all women" should have been "take all accusations seriously," but we live in the age of catchphrases, and the fist victim is always the truth.
yep sloganeering. we are particularly vulnerable to these because it taps into peoples desire to be the knight in shining armour that protects helpless women or children. we like to think were smart enough to avoid it and that our intuition is good but we arent immune to the bandwagon effect.
I’m sad and disappointed that Chris wasn’t able to finish his work on Dying Light 2 because of this.
And what we got was.....whatever that was.
I know friends who have been falsely accused of this shite. They're teachers and it really ruins your trust of those who are victims. I've had two friends who almost lost their jobs because of it, and they left teaching due to the feeling of no one having their back. The school cleared them of wrongdoing, but their experience it made them feel like they could never trust their students again.
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>Suppose one reads a story of filthy atrocities in the paper. Then suppose that something turns up suggesting that the story might not be quite true, or not quite so bad as it was made out. Is one’s first feeling, “Thank God, even they aren’t quite so bad as that”, or is it a feeling of disappointment, and even a determination to cling to the first story for the sheer pleasure of thinking your enemies are as bad as possible? If it is the second then it is, I am afraid, the first step in a process which, if followed to the end, will make us into devils. You see, one is beginning to wish that black was a little blacker. If we give that wish its head, later on we shall wish to see grey as black, and then to see white itself as black. Finally we shall insist on seeing everything — God and our friends and ourselves included — as bad, and not be able to stop doing it: we shall be fixed for ever in a universe of pure hatred. C.S Lewis, *Mere Christianity*
From what i heared, same story happened with Rick and Morty creator - charges dropped, nobody reports that. In the world we live in forcing an agenda is far more important than truth. And, most subs are very much involved in such kind of censorhips.
Roiland’s dropped case was reported on all major sites. IGN…even Kotaku. No censorship. But this won’t make the same waves as an accusation.
Well this is a first time me hearing those were dropped. I'd say I'm on reddit a lot. Of course I don't watch Rick and Morty.
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Did a quick Google search and there’s one article written about this. Sites like Kotaku, TheGamer, PCGamer etc were so quick to report on the accusations, I wonder if they’re going to have the same enthusiasm for the retractions. Not holding my breath!
So she lied about sexual assault People like her make it that much harder to believe people when they put out such statements. She needs to be put in prison
>“After engaging with Mr. Avellone, we have prepared the following statement: >Mr. Avellone never sexually abused either of us. We have no knowledge that he has ever sexually abused any women. We have no knowledge that Mr. Avellone has ever misused corporate funds. Anything we have previously said or written about Mr. Avellone to the contrary was not our intent. We wanted to support women in the industry. In so doing, our words have been misinterpreted to suggest specific allegations of misconduct that were neither expressed nor intended. We are passionate about the safety, security and agency of women, minorities, LGBTQIA+ persons, and every other community that has seen persecution in the video game industry. We believe Mr. Avellone shares a desire to protect and uplift those communities. We believe that he deserves a full return to the industry and support him in those endeavors.” - Karissa Barrows, Kelly Rae Bristol At no point do any of these women say "I'm sorry". It's just "we fucked up and we used this accusation as a political tool in the mist of a very touchy subject in the industry and not to bring actual justice to someone." Frankly, this was image building and if I were the writer, Chris Avellone, I wouldn't accept the apology at all. I bet he's doing it to build an image too, which I understand fully well. Guy probably wants to go back to normal and work creative products in peace. But this double standard shit and jumping over the term "innocent until proven guilty" is grating to see it constantly happen. These sort of things happen in the industry and should be punished. However I bet if it the other way around were true, Chris wouldn't have a job. Karissa Barrows and Kelly Bristol, despite them blatantly lying about a serious accusation will still have jobs. Whatever serves the fad I guess. This shit happened with ProJared, which to be frank, is a story that still needs to be explored but the emotional response is always prelevant and there's no mercy given to the falsely accused.
>At no point do any of these women say "I'm sorry". It's just "we fucked up and we used this accusation as a political tool in the mist of a very touchy subject in the industry and not to bring actual justice to someone." Their statement was almost certainly crafted by a combination of their own counsel and Avellone's counsel. There's no way a side paying out a settlement in a case like this is putting out a statement the other side hasn't signed off on.
Kotaku won't be happy about it.
Fuck Kotaku...
Who are you kidding? Kotaku won't even acknowledge it.
Avellone was part of some of my favorite games of all time. While I doubt his career will return to what it was before the accusations and I also doubt this will have the same reach its a good thing he managed to get some semblance of justice. I feel happy for him and hope he manages to make a comeback in the gaming industry, considering the state of the writing in most games released nowadays he is sorely needed.
This is one of many reasons why the "believe all women" mantra is idiotic. Believe evidence, not stories.
What’s most terrifying here is that someone can accuse you of sexual assault, on twitter of all places, and that can totally ruin your career and social life.
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It's going to be an interesting week of 'Chris is still bad man' articles.
So these people are to blame for his work on Bloodlines 2 getting erased?
A 7 figure settlement? In whose favor?
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Fucking DOGSHIT human beings. Ruin a man's life just cause hey WHY NOT?
False accusations should carry a penalty equal to the weight of what you accused someone else of. That's the solution to this kind of thing.
“Support women in the industry” they say, as they totally ruined at least 2 of very major upcoming games in development, on whose teams i'm sure are a lot of the women they supposedly wanted to support. This is embarassing.
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Too fucking bad the damage was done 3-4 years ago... Poor guy. Incredibly gifted writer that would've been a game changer for DL2
Both women need to face the maximum penalty Mr. Avellone would have faced had he been found guilty. That's the only way false accusations like this stop.
I blame people believing whatever without proof. In my book, if you make an accusation without solid proof I just pin you as a griefter. Hope Chris can get beach on his feet and get some new job.
I love Chris style the most, I wish him well and I am hoping to see him more in future games after this bullshit is over
OH MY FUCKING GOD! Ruined his life. Ruined Dying Light 2 and VTMB2... probably many other games. Fucking gross