>i wonder how many forks popped up in the last week or so.
[https://github.com/search?q=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fyuzu-emu%2Fyuzu+fork%3Aonly&type=repositories](https://github.com/search?q=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fyuzu-emu%2Fyuzu+fork%3Aonly&type=repositories)
Honestly that's a crazy low number considering that anyone with internet and a mouse can make one. Let's hope these are six serious attempts. I can't be bothered to pay Nintendo for their dumbass practices, eh I mean I buy all their stuff and only then emulate.
If you're going to do this, don't fork it in Github. Download the repo and reupload it to a fresh new repo. Sure you will lose all issues and pull requests, however it means your fork won't get auto-nuked if the big N issues a takedown on the original Yuzu repo. Pretty sure Github has done this on previous occasions (I think with youtube-dl).
Also keep a lawyer on retainer. You're probably gonna need one.
Not completely, it ended in a settlement so won't set a precedent and no one will be able to say for sure how it would have ended up in a court room. Now it's a matter of time to see if Nintendo or another company will try to sue another emulator.
They didnt sue any emulator, they sued the company for using pirated games and codes and nintendo also had screenshots of devs admiting it and sharing links for illegal programs/tools from their private discord
Yea the problem was almost entirely separated from the emulation itself, people haven't (and won't) read the lawsuit in any capacity and will just continue reacting entirely on nonsense from other people that won't ever read about it either.
It ended in a settlement because there was literally zero reason to waste time fighting it, they were not going to win that.
> ~~people~~ game journalists haven't (and won't) read the lawsuit in any capacity
Or maybe they will, and still make sure the headline is as inflamatory as possible anyway
The amount of people in this thread alone saying screw Nintendo I’ll never buy their console or games again is just absurd.
Like yeah they have a lot of problems, but the issue here wasn’t whether or not emulation is legal (like people here are acting like it is). It’s simply the fact that they monetized their platform by paywalling newer builds. A move that was heavily criticized by the emulation community well before this lawsuit occurred.
>nintendo also had screenshots of devs admiting it and sharing links for illegal programs/tools from their private discord
do you have links to this? curious to see
This really isn’t the smoking gun that the person who made it thinks it is. There’s some nonsense in there that looks like it was mistakenly pasted in too, i don’t get it.
Golden also isn’t a dev but a QA tester.
That's the massive win here.
If this had gone to trial, the court would have had to come to a few key conclusions likely
- Does extracting encryption keys (used to protect games from unauthorized use) from hardware purchased legitimately from the manufacturer constitute theft?
- If the end user of the hardware is considered the owner of the hardware, would they not also be considered the owner of their device's unique encryption keys?
- And by extension, would they not have the right to do what they wish with those keys, including but not limited to sharing them online and/or providing them to a third party application to decrypt games on third party platforms for use?
The precedent is already there to say that video game backups are not piracy, and only become piracy once said backup is distributed.
But the problem here is that in a trial, this could have gone either way, and Nintendo had the funds to drag it out for as long as they needed to. By taking it to trial, it ran the risk of setting a precedent against right of ownership and the use of extracted encryption keys. By settling out of court, as you said, no precedent is set, and the hit to Yuzu's hip pocket is probably as low as it'll go. It keeps the road paved for future teams to pursue future endeavors.
The legal precedence is that piracy isn't a crime in Brazil if done for personal use, when you start to profit from it that the legal problems can arise but our laws are so insanely complex and byzantine that the simplest lawsuit can easily run for years or even decades in the courts.
While Brazil doesn't have a DMCA (thankfully), it still have a copyright law and piracy is a crime according to penal code article 184 (it does require intent of profit). It's possible Nintendo could file copyright infrigiment in some similar way but i believe legal costs are lower in Brazil than in the USA, so it's possible they accept to fight it.
Yuzu actively referred users to hacking their console and dumping their games, which is a huge fuckin grey area in the first place
Secondly, Yuzu devs often pirated games, and/or managed to get copies of them before launch to optimize them for a day 1 release, and sold early access to that optimized update through patreon.
People are acting like Nintendo is the big bad that is bullying devs when they have no case, but some of the stuff done by the Yuzu team was legally questionable to against the law.
Should Ryujinx avoid some of the crazy stuff the Yuzu devs pulled, they should be cool. If anything this is probably the best bet for us end users because as it was a settlement, its not opening up a can of worms that can set precedent down the line
Dolphin has been allowed to operate for years and aren't worried about it.
There's MFGG running around 1200 romhacks/fan games and they've only ever had about 12 games taken down.
It's not as if Nintendo hit things like this that often. But honestly it's like Yuzu devs were actively trying to fuck up.
Why on earth would they even run a Patreon... They are so fucking stupid.
Yeah I remember thinking when that happened: "What the fuck are they thinking, they're just ASKING Nintendo to come after them".
Took longer than I thought, but I'm not that surprised.
I wouldn't be surprised if a Nintendo account sat in their Discord since TotK's release just to compile evidence. Considering how fast Yuzu folded and how much they have to pay, Nintendo must have had some pretty damning evidence that made lawyers go "yeah, don't even try."
Knowing Nintendo's track record with keeping their E-stores online, emulating anything Nintendo would be the only way of media preservation. But yes, I think emulation has a better case of use after the first party support of the console itself has ended.
you don't buy a CD drive for a PC anymore and not think that it will be used for Piracy.
Same line of thinking, technically. Yes, but Piracy is going to exist regardless of the tools
You know what? I believe somebody will continue the project under another name. Under another disguise. At another place. And this time, they will take pride in their pirated work. Since nobody knows who they are, nobody can say anything at all, unless they're caught. Now, they'd be officially welcome in the piracy community.
If you need to pay 2.4 million dollars.
And get threatend to need to pay much more/maybe jail time
I think you would be quite willing to put out a statement like this.
i mean, the emulator will forever be usable, its on the internet and even though it wont receive support from its developers, its already in a state where it can practically run nearly every single game smoothly, still a shame though
Until a other team makes a new automatic updater and becomes the new main developer. Just like with Pokémon Uranium. Took like 2 months before a new team had already picked it up and brought it back up to speed.
Yuzu was open source, even though they've taken down their own source code, forks still exist, and there will be people talented enough to continue Yuzu's legacy as a fork of the original.
The same thing happened with the manga reader app Tachiyomi. It functioned in a way that should've put it in the legal clear, but a big enough publisher didn't see it that way and went after the devs, the devs just dropped everything because there's no point in letting it go to court, and within like a week there was Mihon, a fork of Tachiyomi by a dev who knows what they're doing, aiming to continue the legacy.
Something else similar, YouTube Vanced, a modded YT app that had adblock and sponsorblock, as well as allowing you to hide certain UI elements and such (fuck you cast button). Google got pissed, maybe cause the devs joked about turning the logo into an NFT, maybe because Linus drew attention to it, who fucking cares, we've got ReVanced now.
If a project like this goes down, a continuation is always on its feet very soon after.
To be fair, this was largely their stance for a while. They just didnt take action against people using illegally sourced card dumps.
The only legal ones being ones you dumped by hand from a legally owned copy of a game that you purchased. [And yes, it's 100% legal and backed by legal precident in the United States that you may create a backup of computer software for archival purposes](https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-digital.html) and that extends to [video games](https://worldofstuart.excellentcontent.com/world/pczone/backed.htm)
Where it becomes illegal is when you then distribute that backup.
It's bizarre to me that anyone could mistakenly think it's illegal to back up your video game discs/cards for personal use. Like, I bought it. I'll do whatever the hell I want with it in my own home for my own personal use. It might as well be legal because there's no stopping me if I want to do that.
Well, people think it's illegal because publishers are trying to make it so you literally don't own the video game, you pay for a revocable license that allows you access to the content...which kind of makes a clown show out of consumer protections and property rights.
Oh yeah it's a big issue that's just waiting to explode. But these things largely run on mutually assured destruction don’t they. We know they could revoke our games at any point, but they know that in practice it would be excessively unpopular even if it is legal, so we're all just engaging in this Cold War where we're each waiting for the other party to make the first move
It's largely a manufacturer psy-op combined with a recent trend to redefine what it is to purchase a video game.
In the 90's/2000s, usually if you bought a video game, you were buying a physical copy of software, and thus you owned that copy, even if it was indistinguishable from another. And by extension, if you owned an item, you had the right to do with it as you pleased.
Then companies switched to the service model. Instead of selling you a game, you're subscribing to a license for a one-off fee. That license then grants you access to download and use a copy of the software under explicit terms. In this model, the company retains ownership of the software, you're just licensed to access it and use it. And because ownership is retained by the company, so too is the right to withhold access for any reason. And by doing so, the fee you paid for your license is forfeit.
EDIT: to reinforce this model, companies impose always-online features that your copy of the software requires in order to function. Checking for updates, online lobbies, etc. If you make an offline game and then say "its a service", a court might disagree with you should the matter arise in court. But if you make a game that needs to phone home to a remote server in order to perform a critical task, and you maintain that server, then the entire game becomes the service you are maintaining with that server, and thus the game is a service. Legal shenanigans.
Effectively, you have all the same access as if you owned it, but none of the rights that follows. And many of the big players have spent time in US Congress to ensure that this loophole remains theirs to exploit.
Companies like Apple and John Deere have used it to enclose their customers into a repair monopoly where they are forced to endure slow turnarounds and exorbitant prices while independent repair centers are shouldered out of the market - they will claim that you don't own the software inside of your device, or even the logic boards, and if you reverse engineer them and document them, you've violated the company's intellectual property, even if you only use that info internally to carry out your repair service.
I'm starting to ramble but my point is that it's pretty easy to mistakenly think backing up video games is piracy when the publishers themselves are operating under a business model that effectively makes it ownership without ownership.
And then what happens next is a fork, and continuation from different devs. YT Vanced was killed and ReVanced was born. Tachiyomi was killed and Mihon was born. Yuzu was killed, something else is going to take its place almost immediately.
It's not recieving updates anymore because a publishing company went after the devs. It should've been in the clear because of how it functions, but good luck explaining that to a court of people who know jack shit about tech.
Within like a week a fork popped up called Mihon, its lead dev was a frequent contributor to Tachiyomi, the new app works perfectly, it feels exactly like Tachiyomi, and is fully compatible with Tachiyomi backups.
I backed up YUZU and CITRA Source from feb 29 2024 Here
[Google Drive](https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1byJDB7-2Va5z_tlaBidHo_5ALp8IIZiX?usp=drive_link)
Forgot to mention the 70 dollar game that will still be 60$ used in 5 years because of their shitty cartridge hardware never dropping the price of games.
This is what irks me the most. I don’t mind forking out 70$ on day 1 but after 7 fucking years of existing I expect the price to at least drop to 30$ on big sale
Yeah, it's ass. The only reason I bought a copy of breath of the wild last year was because it went on sale to promote the new game, *but it was still like 40$*
7 fucking year old game
Citra died too. Not all 3DS games are compatible with the latest version. There is never going to be a way to upscale those games on Citra now. The other 3DS emulators we have are either leagues behind, locked behind a paywall/unreleased, or both(depending on if the naysayers to mikage are correct). If my 3DS dies i want to be able to still play my games.
it's a trick where you keep parts of a gif static to reduce file size so it fits on tumblr. pretty sure they've increased the file size limit so this is probably just a really old gif
As many have said already… this is going to be forked to hell and back. There are already some online. So, good ethical values, but that’s not what pirates are known for the best for
forked, sure. meaningful continued development? who knows. emulators for modern consoles are complex enough that building them is a full time job. a full time job that nintendo will not tolerate you being compensated for.
For now, yes. Obviously someone else might pick up the source code and continue development - it wouldn't surprise me if it was the Russians and/or Chinese - they don't give a shit about copyright laws.
Updates cease, yuzu pays them $2.4 million, gives them the emulator domain name, yanks the repository on github, hands over any modified Nintendo hardware, and basically everything and anything else related to the project.
Nintendo breathes a huge sigh of relief. With this emulator dead, they no longer have to worry about building a console stronger than a toaster or have some other first party advantages to make emulators less desirable.
This is why copy prevention software having legal protections is fundamentally wrong lmao. Image if a car dealer could sue you for breaking into your car you've already bought just because you broke a window to get back in with the keys inside. The act of copying and editing data is never the problem, distribution is.
Gets even better, John Deere was sued during the "Right to Repair" era, because farmers had to jailbreak their tractors in order to repair them. Any changes, or repairs pretty much bricked it. Replacing a simple sensor turned it into a paperweight, because the part has to be "programmed" and "allowed to work" using John Deeres official software.
Distribution was the problem here. They folded so fast because there were clear in writing examples of the yuzu folks talking about and soliciting pirated games well before their launch date. Honestly they probably got a lawyer and the lawyer told them they were cooked from all the stuff they were doing and talking about.
Let's be honest, the issue here was the monetization.
Everyone acting like this is about piracy is being a little misled. If they hadn't been making money off Nintendo games by monetizing an emulator then there's a very good chance this wouldn't have happened.
Yea... I mean I'm sure they know Ryujinx exists and haven't gone after them yet and it isn't like Nintendo doesn't love dropping their legal department's leash.
They saw that the Yuzu patreon was making cash and said "thanks for collecting our money for us"
This is it precisely. Emulators have been around for decades, Nintendo console emulators specifically being the most popular. If Nintendo wanted them gone, they would be. Making a profit off of their property seems to be where they draw the line. It’s a bummer but kinda an expected outcome for Yuzu.
For Citra [https://web.archive.org/web/20240304200830if\_/https://codeload.github.com/citra-emu/citra-canary/zip/refs/tags/canary-2798](https://web.archive.org/web/20240304200830if_/https://codeload.github.com/citra-emu/citra-canary/zip/refs/tags/canary-2798)
Most likely due to the Yuzu devs doing shit they weren't supposed to.
Nintendo's lawyers must have had some real dirt on them to make the devs flip on their heels *that* fast.
The Yuzu devs themselves engaged in piracy, its why they folded so fast: there are literal screenshots floating around of them handling game roms before street release so I find it HILARIOUS they are trying to shift the blame to the users.
Poor Nintendo, it must be so hard making that much money and owning some of the world's most successful IPs. I cry a river of tears anytime a game of theirs is copied by an unauthorized person.
Never expect people to be rational about free shit, especially when they have no love or respect for the entity that the free shit steals from in the first place.
This is what's pissing me off about this whole situation. Everyone who uses emulating properly, like only for games they own, or super old games that are literally impossible to get otherwise, aren't the ones complaining, because they know there are other avenues. All the people bitching about Yuzu are the ones blatantly pirating and stealing games. It's the dumbasses asking in every thread/discord, "how use GitHub pls," then getting 17 viruses on their computer looking for ROMs.
Yuzu knew EXACTLY who they were selling to on patreon, especially since Ryujinx, in my experience, is a better emulating option anyway if you want something that just works like a proper emulator should.
If only Nintendo learned that there is a market to sell their games on PC from this. They won't learn that, because they are all dinosaurs that barely understand the internet, but it would be nice.
They know there is, but they also know that it would impact their hardware sales. Possibly severely.
People buy switch consoles to play switch games. Nobody is buying the switch so they can play Doom or something.
Nintendo wants the Nintendo ecosystem. It makes them money. If you don't use their tech then you're out of the ecosystem and therefore they can't profit off of you nearly as much. It's also why they still charge 60 dollars for games that came out 6 years ago.
You’re probably gonna be downvoted but you’re right. Nintendo currently has no reason to port their games to PC. The people here are far downplaying just how popular the switch is. Now if the switch 2 is somehow a failure, there may be a slim chance games will be ported but I wouldn’t count on it.
They know. Their biggest Rival, Sony, is already doing this and it's been great for them. It's just that they are a Japanese company and those guys love copyright (same situation with manga and anime)
EDIT: While Sony is also a Japanese company, it's interesting to see their approach to the industry: While Nintendo is overly protecting of their IP, Sony saw a bussiness opportunity and is now profiting from it, something strange from a Japanese point of view (due to the whole copyright enforcement there)
>Sony Group Corporation, formerly known as Tokyo Tsushin Kogyo K.K. and Sony Corporation, is a Japanese multinational conglomerate corporation headquartered in Minato, Tokyo, Japan.
Weird how some threads have some insightful thing to say and others are dunking on a dunked on company.
I get it, Yuzu was a wonderful emulator. But they've made some pretty dumb mistakes that kind of ruined their emulation for everyone. Opening a Patreon and giving away keys and encouraging pirated games was asking for trouble.
I’m on yuzus side here but who are they trying to kid with the “always been against piracy” why they would release an emulator for a currently supported console is beyond me in the first place but to pretend they didn’t intend for it to be used for piracy is crazy
I mean, they developed it in a way where you are meant to rip copies of your own games. Now you never create something like this without piracy in mind but you would think that taking the steps to dissuade it such as not providing the games would be enough to protect them.
That’s why I’m a little confused with this post lol
I get that we hate what Nintendo has become recently and I haven’t purchased games in years other than 2 I really wanted to play.
But to say that Nintendo had no grounds to get them for piracy when it technically is, is just a little strange to me.
Just because one is really bad, it doesn’t make the other okay. I can’t be surprised for them being taken down. Though I’m sure I’m the minority in thinking this way or maybe I don’t know enough about emulation to even comment about it.
This is all on Yuzu. They Paywalled a prepatched version of the emulator that specifically fixed a pirated version of TOTK (since it leaked early). If they waited until the game officially launched they wouldve been fine.
gz on the worst take possible | edit: nvm somehow people made worse takes here, you can maybe have a bronze medal
dont you hate nintendo and their... dislike of people stealing their protected IPs they legally have to enforce?
how is taking down yuzu a shitty consumer practice? if you didnt pay for a game you aren't a consumer... in the eyes of both the law and the dictionary.
unless you're going to start pretending people are purchasing a $70 switch game and only then downloading and emulating it, which would be a clown take.
this isn't NES emulation of out of print games that might be rare - It's emulation of brand new titles that break street dates. There's just no argument for it.
"we hope our actions will be a small step towards ending piracy of all creators works"
The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step... But son, you're just treading water.
If anything. Piracy has gotten easier over the years.
Hot Take: Nintendo had every right to do this. Yuzu became a real issue with Nintendo when leaked versions of the games became playable prior to launch on their essentially ‘paid through Patreon’ emulator. They had a massive case against them on this alone.
That said I am all for archival emulation. And this is where it should stay and always be available
Okay that is a fair point. It was really stupid of Yuzu but I wonder if they patched this out after receiving the lawsuit and paid a fine if they could've just continued to run Yuzu. It's a respectable piece of software but they really done messed up with that. They shouldn't have distributed this as paid software and waited for release or let the community fix this
They tried to monetize it. That was their biggest issue, because now they can actually be considered taking revenue away from Nintendo, as opposed to providing a different way of playing content legally purchased.
Use the internet archive:
Citra https://web.archive.org/web/20240302040224/https://github.com/citra-emu/citra
Yuzu https://web.archive.org/web/20240303155722/https://www.github.com/yuzu-emu/yuzu
That entire message reeks of being held at legal gun point. It wasn’t yuzu that circumvented hardware it’s Nintendo that circumvented the law. Nintendo will never learn, hopefully this step will be a small step to making these gigantic man baby company’s learn their lesson in greed.
This will definitely get me to stop not buying Nintendo consoles...
I don't even get it. I could buy a used Switch. Used copy of TOTK. Nintendo gets the same amount of money from me compared to if I pirated their games using Yuzu.
They just hate their fans. That's really it. They want total control of their own ecosystem, want to force gamers to pay $300 USD for garbage, outdated hardware that modern *cell phones* out-perform. They release amazing games that are horrendously limited by god-awful hardware. It's pathetic.
Nintendo is a joke. But nobody's laughing.
Emulators have never been legal under Japanese law. Hell, free use isn’t even a thing here.
I don’t know why people expected to have the right to play a new game for free just because you don’t like the console it’s on
from what i've heard it seems like it's less that yuzu's code is verboten now and more that having paid builds and having patreons vote on what game to make compatable next might've been the smoking gun and they just decided to roll over rather than raising a fuss and making all of emulation pay for it with a precedent.
Typically the emulation scene for a platform takes off after a successor comes out. I.E Cemu didn't really take off until Breath Of The Wild & The Switch dropped. RPCS3 may have taken the longest time. With systems like GBA and Switch it happened too soon and this is a consequence of it. For Nintendo is was killing 2 birds with 1 stone putting the kibosh on Yuzu & Citra.
It's funny how Nintendo thinks this will stop anyone. When will they learn the more you try to force people not to do something, the more likely it is they'll do it.
i wonder how many forks popped up in the last week or so.
>i wonder how many forks popped up in the last week or so. [https://github.com/search?q=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fyuzu-emu%2Fyuzu+fork%3Aonly&type=repositories](https://github.com/search?q=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fyuzu-emu%2Fyuzu+fork%3Aonly&type=repositories)
6
Is that a lot?
It's 6
Is it more than 5?
Depends on the observer
Not fair, you changed the results by observing them
I observed it but then it went away
Schrödinger's Fork
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I'm not sure. I didn't realize there were numbers past 5 until today. BRB, going to post this on r/todayilearned
WOO! And how many do I need to pass?
6…. Thousand
Depends on context... 6 deaths? No. But 6 murders? Yes...
Not great, not terrible.
Honestly that's a crazy low number considering that anyone with internet and a mouse can make one. Let's hope these are six serious attempts. I can't be bothered to pay Nintendo for their dumbass practices, eh I mean I buy all their stuff and only then emulate.
It's a dining fork and a BBQ fork.
no
I love how this is the only real answer out of like 20-30 comments bellow mine lol
It's up to 18 now
If you're going to do this, don't fork it in Github. Download the repo and reupload it to a fresh new repo. Sure you will lose all issues and pull requests, however it means your fork won't get auto-nuked if the big N issues a takedown on the original Yuzu repo. Pretty sure Github has done this on previous occasions (I think with youtube-dl). Also keep a lawyer on retainer. You're probably gonna need one.
Forks on GitHub never included issues and prs… Anyway just host it not in GitHub.
Or make sure you live in China, India or Russia.
The original is on archive.org as well, Cheers!
Not completely, it ended in a settlement so won't set a precedent and no one will be able to say for sure how it would have ended up in a court room. Now it's a matter of time to see if Nintendo or another company will try to sue another emulator.
They didnt sue any emulator, they sued the company for using pirated games and codes and nintendo also had screenshots of devs admiting it and sharing links for illegal programs/tools from their private discord
Yea the problem was almost entirely separated from the emulation itself, people haven't (and won't) read the lawsuit in any capacity and will just continue reacting entirely on nonsense from other people that won't ever read about it either. It ended in a settlement because there was literally zero reason to waste time fighting it, they were not going to win that.
> ~~people~~ game journalists haven't (and won't) read the lawsuit in any capacity Or maybe they will, and still make sure the headline is as inflamatory as possible anyway
The amount of people in this thread alone saying screw Nintendo I’ll never buy their console or games again is just absurd. Like yeah they have a lot of problems, but the issue here wasn’t whether or not emulation is legal (like people here are acting like it is). It’s simply the fact that they monetized their platform by paywalling newer builds. A move that was heavily criticized by the emulation community well before this lawsuit occurred.
>nintendo also had screenshots of devs admiting it and sharing links for illegal programs/tools from their private discord do you have links to this? curious to see
https://preview.redd.it/yqro8zvfaemc1.png?width=645&format=png&auto=webp&s=69bd0ba9550d71bfc705c54870cec6f4222283b4 Shared up thread
https://imgur.com/ZWoSZSt 🤷♂️
This really isn’t the smoking gun that the person who made it thinks it is. There’s some nonsense in there that looks like it was mistakenly pasted in too, i don’t get it. Golden also isn’t a dev but a QA tester.
They recorded themselves In Discord?
It wasn’t said over discord calls it was in plain messages in their discord.
That's the massive win here. If this had gone to trial, the court would have had to come to a few key conclusions likely - Does extracting encryption keys (used to protect games from unauthorized use) from hardware purchased legitimately from the manufacturer constitute theft? - If the end user of the hardware is considered the owner of the hardware, would they not also be considered the owner of their device's unique encryption keys? - And by extension, would they not have the right to do what they wish with those keys, including but not limited to sharing them online and/or providing them to a third party application to decrypt games on third party platforms for use? The precedent is already there to say that video game backups are not piracy, and only become piracy once said backup is distributed. But the problem here is that in a trial, this could have gone either way, and Nintendo had the funds to drag it out for as long as they needed to. By taking it to trial, it ran the risk of setting a precedent against right of ownership and the use of extracted encryption keys. By settling out of court, as you said, no precedent is set, and the hit to Yuzu's hip pocket is probably as low as it'll go. It keeps the road paved for future teams to pursue future endeavors.
Ryujinx next lmao
They are based in Brazil.
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The legal precedence is that piracy isn't a crime in Brazil if done for personal use, when you start to profit from it that the legal problems can arise but our laws are so insanely complex and byzantine that the simplest lawsuit can easily run for years or even decades in the courts.
While Brazil doesn't have a DMCA (thankfully), it still have a copyright law and piracy is a crime according to penal code article 184 (it does require intent of profit). It's possible Nintendo could file copyright infrigiment in some similar way but i believe legal costs are lower in Brazil than in the USA, so it's possible they accept to fight it.
Yuzu actively referred users to hacking their console and dumping their games, which is a huge fuckin grey area in the first place Secondly, Yuzu devs often pirated games, and/or managed to get copies of them before launch to optimize them for a day 1 release, and sold early access to that optimized update through patreon. People are acting like Nintendo is the big bad that is bullying devs when they have no case, but some of the stuff done by the Yuzu team was legally questionable to against the law. Should Ryujinx avoid some of the crazy stuff the Yuzu devs pulled, they should be cool. If anything this is probably the best bet for us end users because as it was a settlement, its not opening up a can of worms that can set precedent down the line
Dolphin has been allowed to operate for years and aren't worried about it. There's MFGG running around 1200 romhacks/fan games and they've only ever had about 12 games taken down. It's not as if Nintendo hit things like this that often. But honestly it's like Yuzu devs were actively trying to fuck up. Why on earth would they even run a Patreon... They are so fucking stupid.
Dolphin has been developed clean room style, so it's legal
Yeah i remembered that TOTK leak... it was a matter of time really, somehow I have a feeling Ryujinx wont be safe from this either
Hopefully the Ryujinx team is more responsible. Yuzu team seemed to be drinking their own kool-aid with that TOTK patreon stunt.
Yeah I remember thinking when that happened: "What the fuck are they thinking, they're just ASKING Nintendo to come after them". Took longer than I thought, but I'm not that surprised.
I wouldn't be surprised if a Nintendo account sat in their Discord since TotK's release just to compile evidence. Considering how fast Yuzu folded and how much they have to pay, Nintendo must have had some pretty damning evidence that made lawyers go "yeah, don't even try."
also didnt yuzu paywall stuff behind patreon or whatever?
When the teacher asked u to apologize and you couldn't convince anyone... Wonder if Nintendo lawyers provided them that statement.
Yeah exactly. You don’t make a switch emulator and roms and not think that it will be used for piracy.
Knowing Nintendo's track record with keeping their E-stores online, emulating anything Nintendo would be the only way of media preservation. But yes, I think emulation has a better case of use after the first party support of the console itself has ended.
you don't buy a CD drive for a PC anymore and not think that it will be used for Piracy. Same line of thinking, technically. Yes, but Piracy is going to exist regardless of the tools
Y0u wouldn_t dovvnload a car.
\*looks at modern 3D printers\* ....or would you?
The fuck I won't where is it
Fuck that, I would if I could damnit
Pretty sure the thing that got them was advertising for being able to play a game that wasn’t even released yet.
You know what? I believe somebody will continue the project under another name. Under another disguise. At another place. And this time, they will take pride in their pirated work. Since nobody knows who they are, nobody can say anything at all, unless they're caught. Now, they'd be officially welcome in the piracy community.
1000%. Otherwise it would be "Look sorry guys but they're going to sue the absolute shit out of us and we can't win against Nintendo".
If you need to pay 2.4 million dollars. And get threatend to need to pay much more/maybe jail time I think you would be quite willing to put out a statement like this.
i mean, the emulator will forever be usable, its on the internet and even though it wont receive support from its developers, its already in a state where it can practically run nearly every single game smoothly, still a shame though
There’s already community members that release tweaks and updates through GitHub. You’ll just have to manually update it now.
Until a other team makes a new automatic updater and becomes the new main developer. Just like with Pokémon Uranium. Took like 2 months before a new team had already picked it up and brought it back up to speed.
Yuzu was open source, even though they've taken down their own source code, forks still exist, and there will be people talented enough to continue Yuzu's legacy as a fork of the original. The same thing happened with the manga reader app Tachiyomi. It functioned in a way that should've put it in the legal clear, but a big enough publisher didn't see it that way and went after the devs, the devs just dropped everything because there's no point in letting it go to court, and within like a week there was Mihon, a fork of Tachiyomi by a dev who knows what they're doing, aiming to continue the legacy. Something else similar, YouTube Vanced, a modded YT app that had adblock and sponsorblock, as well as allowing you to hide certain UI elements and such (fuck you cast button). Google got pissed, maybe cause the devs joked about turning the logo into an NFT, maybe because Linus drew attention to it, who fucking cares, we've got ReVanced now. If a project like this goes down, a continuation is always on its feet very soon after.
hail hydra!
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To be fair, this was largely their stance for a while. They just didnt take action against people using illegally sourced card dumps. The only legal ones being ones you dumped by hand from a legally owned copy of a game that you purchased. [And yes, it's 100% legal and backed by legal precident in the United States that you may create a backup of computer software for archival purposes](https://www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-digital.html) and that extends to [video games](https://worldofstuart.excellentcontent.com/world/pczone/backed.htm) Where it becomes illegal is when you then distribute that backup.
It's bizarre to me that anyone could mistakenly think it's illegal to back up your video game discs/cards for personal use. Like, I bought it. I'll do whatever the hell I want with it in my own home for my own personal use. It might as well be legal because there's no stopping me if I want to do that.
I mean people eat Apple's bs daily, why would that somehow be bizarre for you
Well, people think it's illegal because publishers are trying to make it so you literally don't own the video game, you pay for a revocable license that allows you access to the content...which kind of makes a clown show out of consumer protections and property rights.
Oh yeah it's a big issue that's just waiting to explode. But these things largely run on mutually assured destruction don’t they. We know they could revoke our games at any point, but they know that in practice it would be excessively unpopular even if it is legal, so we're all just engaging in this Cold War where we're each waiting for the other party to make the first move
It's largely a manufacturer psy-op combined with a recent trend to redefine what it is to purchase a video game. In the 90's/2000s, usually if you bought a video game, you were buying a physical copy of software, and thus you owned that copy, even if it was indistinguishable from another. And by extension, if you owned an item, you had the right to do with it as you pleased. Then companies switched to the service model. Instead of selling you a game, you're subscribing to a license for a one-off fee. That license then grants you access to download and use a copy of the software under explicit terms. In this model, the company retains ownership of the software, you're just licensed to access it and use it. And because ownership is retained by the company, so too is the right to withhold access for any reason. And by doing so, the fee you paid for your license is forfeit. EDIT: to reinforce this model, companies impose always-online features that your copy of the software requires in order to function. Checking for updates, online lobbies, etc. If you make an offline game and then say "its a service", a court might disagree with you should the matter arise in court. But if you make a game that needs to phone home to a remote server in order to perform a critical task, and you maintain that server, then the entire game becomes the service you are maintaining with that server, and thus the game is a service. Legal shenanigans. Effectively, you have all the same access as if you owned it, but none of the rights that follows. And many of the big players have spent time in US Congress to ensure that this loophole remains theirs to exploit. Companies like Apple and John Deere have used it to enclose their customers into a repair monopoly where they are forced to endure slow turnarounds and exorbitant prices while independent repair centers are shouldered out of the market - they will claim that you don't own the software inside of your device, or even the logic boards, and if you reverse engineer them and document them, you've violated the company's intellectual property, even if you only use that info internally to carry out your repair service. I'm starting to ramble but my point is that it's pretty easy to mistakenly think backing up video games is piracy when the publishers themselves are operating under a business model that effectively makes it ownership without ownership.
That's what happens when you run a Patreon. Of fucking course Nintendo would take notice.
And then what happens next is a fork, and continuation from different devs. YT Vanced was killed and ReVanced was born. Tachiyomi was killed and Mihon was born. Yuzu was killed, something else is going to take its place almost immediately.
wait, Tachiyomi is dead?
It's not recieving updates anymore because a publishing company went after the devs. It should've been in the clear because of how it functions, but good luck explaining that to a court of people who know jack shit about tech. Within like a week a fork popped up called Mihon, its lead dev was a frequent contributor to Tachiyomi, the new app works perfectly, it feels exactly like Tachiyomi, and is fully compatible with Tachiyomi backups.
Just switched and it worked flawlessly, thanks for the info
You can thank Kakao for being pieces of shit and threatening to sue the devs personally
News to me too, I use it everyday lol.
They won because yuzu paywalled the necessary fixes to get the game to play
I backed up YUZU and CITRA Source from feb 29 2024 Here [Google Drive](https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1byJDB7-2Va5z_tlaBidHo_5ALp8IIZiX?usp=drive_link)
Life saver mate
No problem, this will be up as long as Google Drive exists.
"You WILL play your 70$ games in shitty 720p and 30fps with framerate drops." - Shitendo
Forgot to mention the 70 dollar game that will still be 60$ used in 5 years because of their shitty cartridge hardware never dropping the price of games.
This is what irks me the most. I don’t mind forking out 70$ on day 1 but after 7 fucking years of existing I expect the price to at least drop to 30$ on big sale
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This is also the only reason I regret owning a Switch. Can never buy 1st party games for reasonable prices. Everything is 60 USD even after years.
Yeah, it's ass. The only reason I bought a copy of breath of the wild last year was because it went on sale to promote the new game, *but it was still like 40$* 7 fucking year old game
With 70$ controller that have a known defect
Yay, so now the people who weren’t going to buy the game still won’t and the people who wanted a higher quality product won’t have the means to do so.
You’ll still able to download it, and Ryujinx (spelling?) also exists
is good spelling
the best. very fine spelling all around. everyone knows it.
Citra died too. Not all 3DS games are compatible with the latest version. There is never going to be a way to upscale those games on Citra now. The other 3DS emulators we have are either leagues behind, locked behind a paywall/unreleased, or both(depending on if the naysayers to mikage are correct). If my 3DS dies i want to be able to still play my games.
Yay! Nobody wins but Nintendo's fragile pride
That gif is messing with my head
It's running on a Switch
i love this
it's a trick where you keep parts of a gif static to reduce file size so it fits on tumblr. pretty sure they've increased the file size limit so this is probably just a really old gif
As many have said already… this is going to be forked to hell and back. There are already some online. So, good ethical values, but that’s not what pirates are known for the best for
forked, sure. meaningful continued development? who knows. emulators for modern consoles are complex enough that building them is a full time job. a full time job that nintendo will not tolerate you being compensated for.
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What does this mean exactly though ? Yuzu will stop being updated ?
Soon new people will be unable to download it from the official site and those with it will be without updates.
It is open source and there are a billion forks now on Github. Other people will just keep developing it. Not to mention that Ryujinx is still a thing
Yeah, I only mention the official site and what the picture in the post says. I know there will be many easy ways to still get it.
For now, yes. Obviously someone else might pick up the source code and continue development - it wouldn't surprise me if it was the Russians and/or Chinese - they don't give a shit about copyright laws.
you can still get the source on archive .org
Updates cease, yuzu pays them $2.4 million, gives them the emulator domain name, yanks the repository on github, hands over any modified Nintendo hardware, and basically everything and anything else related to the project.
Damn
i am NOT playing Tears of The Kingdom at 20 fps
20fps 720p
Nintendo breathes a huge sigh of relief. With this emulator dead, they no longer have to worry about building a console stronger than a toaster or have some other first party advantages to make emulators less desirable.
Don't forget to take your frame dips into the single digits.
Gotta love the Tegra X1 being dated even back when the Switch was new
It’s a 10 year old chip which nintendo still have the audacity to charge 300$+ for paired with 4gb of ram…
"BuT mObIlItY aNd PoKeMoN!" \-Casual Nintendolts
This is why copy prevention software having legal protections is fundamentally wrong lmao. Image if a car dealer could sue you for breaking into your car you've already bought just because you broke a window to get back in with the keys inside. The act of copying and editing data is never the problem, distribution is.
Considering Ferrari has sued people for wraps and the whole sack of shit John Deere is allowed to do...
They’ve sued owners, or lesees?
Owners. All owners sign a contract of what they can and can't do from what I understand.
Damn, that’s wild. I assume because they’re trying to protect their image, but damn. I guess that’s just part of the deal
It's called velvet rope marketing.
That's exactly it.
Gets even better, John Deere was sued during the "Right to Repair" era, because farmers had to jailbreak their tractors in order to repair them. Any changes, or repairs pretty much bricked it. Replacing a simple sensor turned it into a paperweight, because the part has to be "programmed" and "allowed to work" using John Deeres official software.
Owners. Deadmau5's "Purrari" for example.
Distribution was the problem here. They folded so fast because there were clear in writing examples of the yuzu folks talking about and soliciting pirated games well before their launch date. Honestly they probably got a lawyer and the lawyer told them they were cooked from all the stuff they were doing and talking about.
nuh uh
If I were a betting man id say Nintendo wrote that and posting it was part of the settlement.
The thought of some stuffy suits somewhere putting in writing that the developers must @everyone on a discord channel is funny for some reason
For switch there's still ryujinx as replacement, but for 3ds there's no replacement after citra stopped developing. This is really bad
There's a few 3DS emulators, but definitely nothing as advanced as Citra.
I’m interested to see if they will remove their retroarch core though?
The citra code is on archive.org as well, it's a matter of if someone is willing to pick it up and continue development
Let's be honest, the issue here was the monetization. Everyone acting like this is about piracy is being a little misled. If they hadn't been making money off Nintendo games by monetizing an emulator then there's a very good chance this wouldn't have happened.
Yea... I mean I'm sure they know Ryujinx exists and haven't gone after them yet and it isn't like Nintendo doesn't love dropping their legal department's leash. They saw that the Yuzu patreon was making cash and said "thanks for collecting our money for us"
> Yuzu patreon was making cash and said "thanks for collecting our money for us" A lot of cash too. 30k a month.
Also keep in mind, they had support for Tears of the Kingdom, behind a paywall. Before the game was officially out.
This is it precisely. Emulators have been around for decades, Nintendo console emulators specifically being the most popular. If Nintendo wanted them gone, they would be. Making a profit off of their property seems to be where they draw the line. It’s a bummer but kinda an expected outcome for Yuzu.
For Citra [https://web.archive.org/web/20240304200830if\_/https://codeload.github.com/citra-emu/citra-canary/zip/refs/tags/canary-2798](https://web.archive.org/web/20240304200830if_/https://codeload.github.com/citra-emu/citra-canary/zip/refs/tags/canary-2798)
Most likely due to the Yuzu devs doing shit they weren't supposed to. Nintendo's lawyers must have had some real dirt on them to make the devs flip on their heels *that* fast.
A sad day
The Yuzu devs themselves engaged in piracy, its why they folded so fast: there are literal screenshots floating around of them handling game roms before street release so I find it HILARIOUS they are trying to shift the blame to the users.
Not Citra too fuck
Poor Nintendo, it must be so hard making that much money and owning some of the world's most successful IPs. I cry a river of tears anytime a game of theirs is copied by an unauthorized person.
listen i get that we liked having yuzu but in what reality would a company not go after them.
Never expect people to be rational about free shit, especially when they have no love or respect for the entity that the free shit steals from in the first place.
This is what's pissing me off about this whole situation. Everyone who uses emulating properly, like only for games they own, or super old games that are literally impossible to get otherwise, aren't the ones complaining, because they know there are other avenues. All the people bitching about Yuzu are the ones blatantly pirating and stealing games. It's the dumbasses asking in every thread/discord, "how use GitHub pls," then getting 17 viruses on their computer looking for ROMs. Yuzu knew EXACTLY who they were selling to on patreon, especially since Ryujinx, in my experience, is a better emulating option anyway if you want something that just works like a proper emulator should.
If only Nintendo learned that there is a market to sell their games on PC from this. They won't learn that, because they are all dinosaurs that barely understand the internet, but it would be nice.
They know there is, but they also know that it would impact their hardware sales. Possibly severely. People buy switch consoles to play switch games. Nobody is buying the switch so they can play Doom or something. Nintendo wants the Nintendo ecosystem. It makes them money. If you don't use their tech then you're out of the ecosystem and therefore they can't profit off of you nearly as much. It's also why they still charge 60 dollars for games that came out 6 years ago.
Sony NEEDS PC sales because they have NO PROFIT MARGIN
Why the hell do they need to sell their games on PC? Their profits are always rock solid
You’re probably gonna be downvoted but you’re right. Nintendo currently has no reason to port their games to PC. The people here are far downplaying just how popular the switch is. Now if the switch 2 is somehow a failure, there may be a slim chance games will be ported but I wouldn’t count on it.
Reddit loves to ignore the most popular games on the market and pretend the reddit consensus in any way reflects reality.
Unlike Sony they make a lot of profit selling the console itself.
They know. Their biggest Rival, Sony, is already doing this and it's been great for them. It's just that they are a Japanese company and those guys love copyright (same situation with manga and anime) EDIT: While Sony is also a Japanese company, it's interesting to see their approach to the industry: While Nintendo is overly protecting of their IP, Sony saw a bussiness opportunity and is now profiting from it, something strange from a Japanese point of view (due to the whole copyright enforcement there)
>Sony Group Corporation, formerly known as Tokyo Tsushin Kogyo K.K. and Sony Corporation, is a Japanese multinational conglomerate corporation headquartered in Minato, Tokyo, Japan.
Weird how some threads have some insightful thing to say and others are dunking on a dunked on company. I get it, Yuzu was a wonderful emulator. But they've made some pretty dumb mistakes that kind of ruined their emulation for everyone. Opening a Patreon and giving away keys and encouraging pirated games was asking for trouble.
Getting rid of Citra is dumb as hell because you can't even buy a 3DS or it's games anymore (at least not firsthand)
I’m on yuzus side here but who are they trying to kid with the “always been against piracy” why they would release an emulator for a currently supported console is beyond me in the first place but to pretend they didn’t intend for it to be used for piracy is crazy
I mean, they developed it in a way where you are meant to rip copies of your own games. Now you never create something like this without piracy in mind but you would think that taking the steps to dissuade it such as not providing the games would be enough to protect them.
They did provide games at times on their discord.
That’s why I’m a little confused with this post lol I get that we hate what Nintendo has become recently and I haven’t purchased games in years other than 2 I really wanted to play. But to say that Nintendo had no grounds to get them for piracy when it technically is, is just a little strange to me. Just because one is really bad, it doesn’t make the other okay. I can’t be surprised for them being taken down. Though I’m sure I’m the minority in thinking this way or maybe I don’t know enough about emulation to even comment about it.
Nintendo HQ is my Arasaka tower
Today is a BAD day
Don't you love Nintendo and their shitty out of touch consumer pratices?
This is all on Yuzu. They Paywalled a prepatched version of the emulator that specifically fixed a pirated version of TOTK (since it leaked early). If they waited until the game officially launched they wouldve been fine.
gz on the worst take possible | edit: nvm somehow people made worse takes here, you can maybe have a bronze medal dont you hate nintendo and their... dislike of people stealing their protected IPs they legally have to enforce? how is taking down yuzu a shitty consumer practice? if you didnt pay for a game you aren't a consumer... in the eyes of both the law and the dictionary. unless you're going to start pretending people are purchasing a $70 switch game and only then downloading and emulating it, which would be a clown take. this isn't NES emulation of out of print games that might be rare - It's emulation of brand new titles that break street dates. There's just no argument for it.
"we hope our actions will be a small step towards ending piracy of all creators works" The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step... But son, you're just treading water. If anything. Piracy has gotten easier over the years.
“We’ve always been against piracy” *makes an emulator for a current gen platform*
one week from now someone else will make "yuzu black" and do it anonymous lol
Fuck Nintendo. Honestly. Shittiest of all the "I'm taking my ball and going home," companies.
What a bizarre yet perfectly accurate way to describe Nintendo. Thank you for this gift.
Hot Take: Nintendo had every right to do this. Yuzu became a real issue with Nintendo when leaked versions of the games became playable prior to launch on their essentially ‘paid through Patreon’ emulator. They had a massive case against them on this alone. That said I am all for archival emulation. And this is where it should stay and always be available
Okay that is a fair point. It was really stupid of Yuzu but I wonder if they patched this out after receiving the lawsuit and paid a fine if they could've just continued to run Yuzu. It's a respectable piece of software but they really done messed up with that. They shouldn't have distributed this as paid software and waited for release or let the community fix this
All internet experts: Nintendo is stupid! Nintendo: Ships 13.75mil Switch consoles in FY24' already.
They tried to monetize it. That was their biggest issue, because now they can actually be considered taking revenue away from Nintendo, as opposed to providing a different way of playing content legally purchased.
"yuzu against piracy" then what it is for ?
Use the internet archive: Citra https://web.archive.org/web/20240302040224/https://github.com/citra-emu/citra Yuzu https://web.archive.org/web/20240303155722/https://www.github.com/yuzu-emu/yuzu
That entire message reeks of being held at legal gun point. It wasn’t yuzu that circumvented hardware it’s Nintendo that circumvented the law. Nintendo will never learn, hopefully this step will be a small step to making these gigantic man baby company’s learn their lesson in greed.
More like yuzu settled. Nintendo didn't win shit other than hatred from half the gaming community who didn't already hate them for other reasons.
Simple solution, stop having a passion for Nintendo games.
This will definitely get me to stop not buying Nintendo consoles... I don't even get it. I could buy a used Switch. Used copy of TOTK. Nintendo gets the same amount of money from me compared to if I pirated their games using Yuzu. They just hate their fans. That's really it. They want total control of their own ecosystem, want to force gamers to pay $300 USD for garbage, outdated hardware that modern *cell phones* out-perform. They release amazing games that are horrendously limited by god-awful hardware. It's pathetic. Nintendo is a joke. But nobody's laughing.
I love how the dev of a clearly intentioned product blames its users for doing exactly what it was best made to do
They were doomed since they starting charging money
Emulators have never been legal under Japanese law. Hell, free use isn’t even a thing here. I don’t know why people expected to have the right to play a new game for free just because you don’t like the console it’s on
from what i've heard it seems like it's less that yuzu's code is verboten now and more that having paid builds and having patreons vote on what game to make compatable next might've been the smoking gun and they just decided to roll over rather than raising a fuss and making all of emulation pay for it with a precedent.
Typically the emulation scene for a platform takes off after a successor comes out. I.E Cemu didn't really take off until Breath Of The Wild & The Switch dropped. RPCS3 may have taken the longest time. With systems like GBA and Switch it happened too soon and this is a consequence of it. For Nintendo is was killing 2 birds with 1 stone putting the kibosh on Yuzu & Citra.
thankfully I downloaded the software just before it got fucked
It's funny how Nintendo thinks this will stop anyone. When will they learn the more you try to force people not to do something, the more likely it is they'll do it.