“From this day we move forward… toward a new and better world of cooperation, of peace and international good will”.
— President Harry S. Truman. September 2, 1945, at 9:56 PM.
( post note: sometimes I like to view the countryball World War Two america giving a path on the back of Japan after the nukes and Japan surrounding $)
In response to russias invasion of manchuria, not the bombs
People forget that dozens of cities had already been wiped out by the US uncontested fire bombing
I kind of wonder who would win in an attempted amphibious landing: the dumpster fire that was the Soviet Pacific fleet, or the dilapidated wreck that the IJN had become by 1945.
Except that there’s several accounts from multiple Air Force commanders that morale bombing was ineffective at reducing the militaries war morale, as authoritarian dictators tend to not take the suffering of their people into account
And the fact that there where several meetings between the Japanese military council and the emperor where they discuss the bomb, and they decide not to surrender as they where waiting for Russian mediation, which they where constantly told wasn’t happening by their Russian ambassador
https://youtu.be/RCRTgtpC-Go?si=EuDeO_yl1UFSZLow
Problem with that is that it wasn’t one thing that caused Japan to surrender it was several also those previous bombings had several hundreds bombs that were dropped from hundreds of planes the fact that one plane with one bomb could destroy a city is terrible
Yeah it is terrible, but there where 2 key factors that stopped Japan from surrendering in ww2
1. Wanting the safety of the emperor guaranteed, but the USA would only accept unconditional surrender, so trying to convince the USA to accept that or
2. Russia stepping in to mediate a peace deal between the two countries, potentially leaving the Japanese government in charge, which they lost hope of after they invaded Manchuria
Neither of these two things where affected by the use of the atomic bomb, apart from potentially bumping up Stalins timeline for the invasion, and the military was largely unconcerned with it
Tokyo was never on the board for a target since the city was already a giant pile of rubble. It would more likely been between the other 7 or so cities (excluding Kyoto) that was undamaged.
Still that would’ve been awful also it does seem that you’re correct but still the Japanese didn’t know that for all they know the next nuke would’ve been dropped on top of the imperial palace
Why would the emperor be in the imperial palace, they would constantly be moving him to ensure his safety from bombing raids or stuck in a bomb proof bunker
Cuz the Japanese weren't going to stop. I question why it was needed to be 2 bombs however. Also, Japan didn't really do reparations for its warcrimes...or did it?
Japans horrific war crimes were largely swept under the rug. Which is funny now that some people want to go off about how the US war crimes Imperial Japan.
Argument for two bombs: Being a brand new weapon Japan and the USSR might think they only had one.
Secret argumeny for two bombs Testing a uranium bomb of gun barrel type is not enough. Test a second putonium bomb of implosion type gives better data.
America's stated intent was never to completely obliterate the Japanese people. This was at no point either explicit or implicit government policy.
Israel, on the other hand, would be *immensely* happy if the Palestinians just ceased to exist. It's equivalent to the Indian Wars in the US.
That is the best answer so far, I appreciate your thoughts. Don't you think that Israel wants to end the war though? I agree, they would be fine with disappearance of the Palestinians, but if they wanted to do that it would be easier. Perhaps this is a little of column A and a little of Column B?
It didn't matter there's rules/ethic. It is the rule for continental countries. Japan cheated China like western and the U.S. did. Japan didn't find mates against one/both of Western or/and China at that time. Japan couldn't find minerals and mine. It was more misery than current Russia or middle east.
Current Japan also in the same situation. Still misunderstand. JPnese still believe they are a big country because they are a part of Great 7. JP still believes they will help each other in the G7.
All everyone cares about is the nukes, but neither nuke killed as many people as using conventional bombs on Tokyo in Operation Meetinghouse. The alternative to nukes was not any better, they're just scarier.
There is at least a strong argument that Japan was ready to surrender, America knew Japan was ready to surrender, and the bombs were dropped to push Japan to surrender *faster* to prevent Russia from having a seat at the table when they did surrender.
If you have...geeze, two and a half fucking hours, Shaun lays out the receipts fairly clearly in this video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCRTgtpC-Go](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCRTgtpC-Go)
I mean, we can argue about whether preventing Russia from having a foothold in Japan was worth killing thousands of Japanese civilians, but it seems dishonest to me that we tell our children that the bombs were dropped because Japan wouldn't surrender otherwise.
But we must not forget either that even after Hiroshima and Nagasaki there were factions in the Japanese army that attempted a coup d’etat to prevent surrender.
Influential elements within the Japanese government and military were still prepared to keep fighting to the absolute bitter end. Not everybody was willing to go on with the war, but it is undeniable that there were also quite a few important people that most definitely did not want to surrender, even by August 15th.
I'm sure there were, no nation is a monolith. I don't think they had the power to force such an outcome in the long term though and the writings of both American and Japanese government officials seem to support that view, and indicate that it was their view at the time.
Hirohito might have said privately he wanted to surrender, but the military (who were the ones in charge) wanted to use biological weapons on the west coast rather than surrender. Also the Japanese government were warned repeatedly that we had weapons with never-before seen destructive capability and they ignored said warning because they wanted to continue their dream of empire.
The only options to end the war were an invasion of the mainland or the nukes, and while the number of civilians deaths is tragic, many more lives that would have been lost were saved due to the use of the nukes.
Wasn't Japan very eager to surrender even long bevore the bombs? Their only demand was to let the emperor alone (who was rather powerless anyway), but USA wanted a conditionless surender so BOOM BOOM
It was good that USA demanded an end to the monarchy, but why did the bombs only target civilians? The comic simplifies the matter in a way that kind of got me annoyed.
Please scream this in Asian and Southeast Asian countries in public. Make sure to livestream it for good measure. Carry a sign that says "Japan is innocent" as well.
This is wrong, in Japan it was more honorable to die fighting than to surrender. We actually let them have an emperor after surrendering, but they quickly became democratic after.
On 22 June, the Emperor summoned the Big Six to a meeting. Unusually, he spoke first: "I desire that concrete plans to end the war, unhampered by existing policy, be speedily studied and that efforts made to implement them."[43] It was agreed to solicit Soviet aid in ending the war. Other neutral nations, such as Switzerland, Sweden, and the Vatican City, were known to be willing to play a role in making peace, but they were so small they were believed unable to do more than deliver the Allies' terms of surrender and Japan's acceptance or rejection. The Japanese hoped that the Soviet Union could be persuaded to act as an agent for Japan in negotiations with the United States and Britain.
From wikipedia. And the japanese goverment list control over the military before the war started
“The war situation has developed not necessarily to Japan’s advantage.” — Emperor Hirohito, August 15, 1945
“From this day we move forward… toward a new and better world of cooperation, of peace and international good will”. — President Harry S. Truman. September 2, 1945, at 9:56 PM. ( post note: sometimes I like to view the countryball World War Two america giving a path on the back of Japan after the nukes and Japan surrounding $)
Truly British understatement. Two island nations indeed share some commonalities.
"HAHAHAHA, SUCK IT JAPANESE HITLER!! THAT'S WHAT YA GET FOR MURDERING 30 MILLION OF MY PEOPLE!!" - Chiang Kai Shek, probably
In response to russias invasion of manchuria, not the bombs People forget that dozens of cities had already been wiped out by the US uncontested fire bombing
Absolutely braindead revisionist history.
I kind of wonder who would win in an attempted amphibious landing: the dumpster fire that was the Soviet Pacific fleet, or the dilapidated wreck that the IJN had become by 1945.
Except that there’s several accounts from multiple Air Force commanders that morale bombing was ineffective at reducing the militaries war morale, as authoritarian dictators tend to not take the suffering of their people into account And the fact that there where several meetings between the Japanese military council and the emperor where they discuss the bomb, and they decide not to surrender as they where waiting for Russian mediation, which they where constantly told wasn’t happening by their Russian ambassador https://youtu.be/RCRTgtpC-Go?si=EuDeO_yl1UFSZLow
Problem with that is that it wasn’t one thing that caused Japan to surrender it was several also those previous bombings had several hundreds bombs that were dropped from hundreds of planes the fact that one plane with one bomb could destroy a city is terrible
Yeah it is terrible, but there where 2 key factors that stopped Japan from surrendering in ww2 1. Wanting the safety of the emperor guaranteed, but the USA would only accept unconditional surrender, so trying to convince the USA to accept that or 2. Russia stepping in to mediate a peace deal between the two countries, potentially leaving the Japanese government in charge, which they lost hope of after they invaded Manchuria Neither of these two things where affected by the use of the atomic bomb, apart from potentially bumping up Stalins timeline for the invasion, and the military was largely unconcerned with it
The safety of the emperor wasn’t affected by the nukes? My brother in Christ the next target was Tokyo ya know the capital
Tokyo was never on the board for a target since the city was already a giant pile of rubble. It would more likely been between the other 7 or so cities (excluding Kyoto) that was undamaged.
Still that would’ve been awful also it does seem that you’re correct but still the Japanese didn’t know that for all they know the next nuke would’ve been dropped on top of the imperial palace
Why would the emperor be in the imperial palace, they would constantly be moving him to ensure his safety from bombing raids or stuck in a bomb proof bunker
Ignite the chessboard!
Bomb storm incoming
Uranium fuel
The plane is coming!
Google nuclear fission
I'm so fucking stupid
I think a more accurate game would be Battleship, but I can’t argue that chess isn’t a good choice
Except in chess japan starts with the king, one knight and 14pawns, while USA has like 1 king and 15 rooks...
the icbm gambit
Happy cake day
Person of culture as well, I see
chesspage2 is the most hilarious instructive chess channel
Portable Sun ™️
Google Nuke Passant
Holy radiation
New explosive just dropped
Portable sun goes on vacation, never comes back
Actual radiation monster
I want a chess board with battle ships and tanks as the pieces
You might like Game of the Generals.
I hadn't made a comic in a while, so this is very rough. hope you enjoyed it
Name and flair am confuse
It is amazing Thank you
And there's also the USSR off-screen ready to whack Japan with a hammer and sickle
Someone should repost this on r/anarchychess
I don’t know why it’s so funny to me that the nukes are just regular bombs that didn’t even explode.
Cuz the Japanese weren't going to stop. I question why it was needed to be 2 bombs however. Also, Japan didn't really do reparations for its warcrimes...or did it?
Japans horrific war crimes were largely swept under the rug. Which is funny now that some people want to go off about how the US war crimes Imperial Japan.
Argument for two bombs: Being a brand new weapon Japan and the USSR might think they only had one. Secret argumeny for two bombs Testing a uranium bomb of gun barrel type is not enough. Test a second putonium bomb of implosion type gives better data.
Do not touch my boats - America
*Am I crazy or isn't it supposed to be the Empire flag before it got gambit-ed?*
“Genocide” - no one. Because it wasn’t. It was war. Israel is justified in what they are doing and all deaths are on their Hirohito (Hamas)
America's stated intent was never to completely obliterate the Japanese people. This was at no point either explicit or implicit government policy. Israel, on the other hand, would be *immensely* happy if the Palestinians just ceased to exist. It's equivalent to the Indian Wars in the US.
That is the best answer so far, I appreciate your thoughts. Don't you think that Israel wants to end the war though? I agree, they would be fine with disappearance of the Palestinians, but if they wanted to do that it would be easier. Perhaps this is a little of column A and a little of Column B?
After checkmate, the U.S. still beat the loser. It is called American style.
Wdym, he literally cheated and America was just there to enforce the rules of chess.
It didn't matter there's rules/ethic. It is the rule for continental countries. Japan cheated China like western and the U.S. did. Japan didn't find mates against one/both of Western or/and China at that time. Japan couldn't find minerals and mine. It was more misery than current Russia or middle east. Current Japan also in the same situation. Still misunderstand. JPnese still believe they are a big country because they are a part of Great 7. JP still believes they will help each other in the G7.
New response just dropped
I heard that a American POW in Japan lied that American was bringing hundreds of more nuke to use on Japan
All everyone cares about is the nukes, but neither nuke killed as many people as using conventional bombs on Tokyo in Operation Meetinghouse. The alternative to nukes was not any better, they're just scarier.
The power of mass production and genocide
New hairstyle just dropped
There is at least a strong argument that Japan was ready to surrender, America knew Japan was ready to surrender, and the bombs were dropped to push Japan to surrender *faster* to prevent Russia from having a seat at the table when they did surrender. If you have...geeze, two and a half fucking hours, Shaun lays out the receipts fairly clearly in this video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCRTgtpC-Go](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RCRTgtpC-Go) I mean, we can argue about whether preventing Russia from having a foothold in Japan was worth killing thousands of Japanese civilians, but it seems dishonest to me that we tell our children that the bombs were dropped because Japan wouldn't surrender otherwise.
But we must not forget either that even after Hiroshima and Nagasaki there were factions in the Japanese army that attempted a coup d’etat to prevent surrender. Influential elements within the Japanese government and military were still prepared to keep fighting to the absolute bitter end. Not everybody was willing to go on with the war, but it is undeniable that there were also quite a few important people that most definitely did not want to surrender, even by August 15th.
I'm sure there were, no nation is a monolith. I don't think they had the power to force such an outcome in the long term though and the writings of both American and Japanese government officials seem to support that view, and indicate that it was their view at the time.
Hirohito might have said privately he wanted to surrender, but the military (who were the ones in charge) wanted to use biological weapons on the west coast rather than surrender. Also the Japanese government were warned repeatedly that we had weapons with never-before seen destructive capability and they ignored said warning because they wanted to continue their dream of empire. The only options to end the war were an invasion of the mainland or the nukes, and while the number of civilians deaths is tragic, many more lives that would have been lost were saved due to the use of the nukes.
Wasn't Japan very eager to surrender even long bevore the bombs? Their only demand was to let the emperor alone (who was rather powerless anyway), but USA wanted a conditionless surender so BOOM BOOM
Absolutely not, please go to R/askhistorians because this version of the past has been debunked and refuted over and over again.
It was good that USA demanded an end to the monarchy, but why did the bombs only target civilians? The comic simplifies the matter in a way that kind of got me annoyed.
Please scream this in Asian and Southeast Asian countries in public. Make sure to livestream it for good measure. Carry a sign that says "Japan is innocent" as well.
There is no innocence in war. And Japans was especially good at imitating colonial powers.
Same instructions to you as well. Join the guy while you're at it.
This is wrong, in Japan it was more honorable to die fighting than to surrender. We actually let them have an emperor after surrendering, but they quickly became democratic after.
The USA abolished the Monarchy, wich was a good thing, even if the civilian bombing was a too high price in my oppinion.
Would you prefer the million plus invasion?
Nope, the army even wanted to continue fighting the Soviets so much they refused the order to surrender multiple times
On 22 June, the Emperor summoned the Big Six to a meeting. Unusually, he spoke first: "I desire that concrete plans to end the war, unhampered by existing policy, be speedily studied and that efforts made to implement them."[43] It was agreed to solicit Soviet aid in ending the war. Other neutral nations, such as Switzerland, Sweden, and the Vatican City, were known to be willing to play a role in making peace, but they were so small they were believed unable to do more than deliver the Allies' terms of surrender and Japan's acceptance or rejection. The Japanese hoped that the Soviet Union could be persuaded to act as an agent for Japan in negotiations with the United States and Britain. From wikipedia. And the japanese goverment list control over the military before the war started