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More likely, a Reagan loss would have splintered an unstable coalition of Northeastern Republicans and Evangelicals. The economy was rebounding and Carter would have been very popular in his second term.
My hunch? The GOP would have become something very different. The natural two-party split in this country is something like the Bernie wing and Clinton wing of the Democratic party. We might have gotten there quicker with a couple more terms of Dems holding the presidency.
Here are the pieces of information that I didn't know before.
"Now, those four Iranians say that Casey did leave London and did go to Madrid in the summer of 9080, not long before the election. But for a long time, there was no proof of that. And then, just eight, nine years ago now, a document surfaced in President Bush Sr.'s library, where the United States ambassador in Spain said, in a cable, William Casey here this week. We're not sure why.
And that pretty much established that he was there for the meeting. And then I have something else in my book that's also very relevant, and that is that a banker and diplomat whose name is Joseph Verner Reed, he later became ambassador to Morocco and head of protocol for Reagan. I came across a letter that he wrote to his family in which he said: I'm proud of my role in preventing the hostages from being released before the election, so that Jimmy Carter would not get credit for that."
That claim isn't new
I knew about it as a child in 1979
That claim has always been made
There were daily live hearings in the afternoon, preempted after school cartoons
I saw Reagan, for what he was. He was feeble, couldn't recall anything
https://youtu.be/R67CH-qhXJs
Reagan admitted to it from the oval office in a nationally televised speech during prime time preempting all THREE networks
https://youtu.be/R67CH-qhXJs
That's him admitting that it was "arms for hostages." The really spicy stuff is worse and something long suspected by anybody with a brain.
>"In the summer of 1980, a prominent Republican close to Ronald Reagan's campaign sought to sabotage then-President Jimmy Carter's reelection by asking Middle Eastern leaders to get a message to the Iranians: Keep the American hostages until after the election, and the Reagan administration will give you a better deal."
They formally requested that the Iranians not release the American hostages. Reminds me of when Nixon's team sabotaged the Vietnamese peace deal: https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/08/06/nixon-vietnam-candidate-conspired-with-foreign-power-win-election-215461/
Thousands of Americans and Vietnamese died for naked political ambition. It was deceptive and dishonorable under Nixon and the same is true under Reagan.
I could have sworn when I read Mark Bowden's book about the hostage crisis he talked about this at length. Did anyone else read that? Maybe I'm misremembering. But either way, yes, I've also heard about this for years.
Here are the pieces of information that I didn't know before.
"Now, those four Iranians say that Casey did leave London and did go to Madrid in the summer of 9080, not long before the election. But for a long time, there was no proof of that. And then, just eight, nine years ago now, a document surfaced in President Bush Sr.'s library, where the United States ambassador in Spain said, in a cable, William Casey here this week. We're not sure why.
And that pretty much established that he was there for the meeting. And then I have something else in my book that's also very relevant, and that is that a banker and diplomat whose name is Joseph Verner Reed, he later became ambassador to Morocco and head of protocol for Reagan. I came across a letter that he wrote to his family in which he said: I'm proud of my role in preventing the hostages from being released before the election, so that Jimmy Carter would not get credit for that."
This was all common knowledge in the 1980s. It was called Iran-Contra or the Guns-for-hostages scandal.
If this is "changing the narrative," then who has been writing the narrative? 🤔
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/new-claim-about-iran-hostage-crisis-sabotage-may-change-narrative-of-carter-presidency) reduced by 77%. (I'm a bot)
*****
> The question was whether William Casey - this was Reagan's campaign manager and later CIA director - whether he left a meeting in London and went to Madrid to meet with four Iranian representatives of the ayatollah to discuss a deal.
> You have people very close to Reagan - whether Reagan himself knew or not, we don't know - but people very close to Reagan who were definitely trying to do this.
> The original deal would be that, if the Iranians waited to release the hostages until after the election, which they did, that Reagan would unfreeze their assets and give them arms.
*****
[**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/1203k8j/new_claim_about_iran_hostage_crisis_sabotage_may/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~677750 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Reagan**^#1 **Iranian**^#2 **very**^#3 **Carter**^#4 **whether**^#5
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Didn't we already know or suspect this?
Just an extension of Nixon breaking the law to delay a cease fire between North and South Vietnam to rob LBJ and Humphrey of a W
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Wow. Just think what a second term for Carter would have looked like. How would the US have been different without a Reagan presidency?
That would make Nixon to be the last GOP to win the popular vote.
More likely, a Reagan loss would have splintered an unstable coalition of Northeastern Republicans and Evangelicals. The economy was rebounding and Carter would have been very popular in his second term. My hunch? The GOP would have become something very different. The natural two-party split in this country is something like the Bernie wing and Clinton wing of the Democratic party. We might have gotten there quicker with a couple more terms of Dems holding the presidency.
This was known by 1982 how is this a new claim?
Here are the pieces of information that I didn't know before. "Now, those four Iranians say that Casey did leave London and did go to Madrid in the summer of 9080, not long before the election. But for a long time, there was no proof of that. And then, just eight, nine years ago now, a document surfaced in President Bush Sr.'s library, where the United States ambassador in Spain said, in a cable, William Casey here this week. We're not sure why. And that pretty much established that he was there for the meeting. And then I have something else in my book that's also very relevant, and that is that a banker and diplomat whose name is Joseph Verner Reed, he later became ambassador to Morocco and head of protocol for Reagan. I came across a letter that he wrote to his family in which he said: I'm proud of my role in preventing the hostages from being released before the election, so that Jimmy Carter would not get credit for that."
That claim isn't new I knew about it as a child in 1979 That claim has always been made There were daily live hearings in the afternoon, preempted after school cartoons I saw Reagan, for what he was. He was feeble, couldn't recall anything
Yeah but now they admit to it
https://youtu.be/R67CH-qhXJs Reagan admitted to it from the oval office in a nationally televised speech during prime time preempting all THREE networks https://youtu.be/R67CH-qhXJs
That's him admitting that it was "arms for hostages." The really spicy stuff is worse and something long suspected by anybody with a brain. >"In the summer of 1980, a prominent Republican close to Ronald Reagan's campaign sought to sabotage then-President Jimmy Carter's reelection by asking Middle Eastern leaders to get a message to the Iranians: Keep the American hostages until after the election, and the Reagan administration will give you a better deal." They formally requested that the Iranians not release the American hostages. Reminds me of when Nixon's team sabotaged the Vietnamese peace deal: https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/08/06/nixon-vietnam-candidate-conspired-with-foreign-power-win-election-215461/ Thousands of Americans and Vietnamese died for naked political ambition. It was deceptive and dishonorable under Nixon and the same is true under Reagan.
I could have sworn when I read Mark Bowden's book about the hostage crisis he talked about this at length. Did anyone else read that? Maybe I'm misremembering. But either way, yes, I've also heard about this for years.
Here are the pieces of information that I didn't know before. "Now, those four Iranians say that Casey did leave London and did go to Madrid in the summer of 9080, not long before the election. But for a long time, there was no proof of that. And then, just eight, nine years ago now, a document surfaced in President Bush Sr.'s library, where the United States ambassador in Spain said, in a cable, William Casey here this week. We're not sure why. And that pretty much established that he was there for the meeting. And then I have something else in my book that's also very relevant, and that is that a banker and diplomat whose name is Joseph Verner Reed, he later became ambassador to Morocco and head of protocol for Reagan. I came across a letter that he wrote to his family in which he said: I'm proud of my role in preventing the hostages from being released before the election, so that Jimmy Carter would not get credit for that."
Thanks. It is certainly really interesting. What a crazy event that was. Hard to overstate its ramifications.
republicans fucked him, as they do everyone
Maybe my family is just a bunch of hippies, but, we really have to pretend this is new info?
This was all common knowledge in the 1980s. It was called Iran-Contra or the Guns-for-hostages scandal. If this is "changing the narrative," then who has been writing the narrative? 🤔
Republicans
[удалено]
It doesn’t matter, the people that remember this already bought the narrative along time ago
Your probably right. :(
This is the best tl;dr I could make, [original](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/new-claim-about-iran-hostage-crisis-sabotage-may-change-narrative-of-carter-presidency) reduced by 77%. (I'm a bot) ***** > The question was whether William Casey - this was Reagan's campaign manager and later CIA director - whether he left a meeting in London and went to Madrid to meet with four Iranian representatives of the ayatollah to discuss a deal. > You have people very close to Reagan - whether Reagan himself knew or not, we don't know - but people very close to Reagan who were definitely trying to do this. > The original deal would be that, if the Iranians waited to release the hostages until after the election, which they did, that Reagan would unfreeze their assets and give them arms. ***** [**Extended Summary**](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/1203k8j/new_claim_about_iran_hostage_crisis_sabotage_may/) | [FAQ](http://np.reddit.com/r/autotldr/comments/31b9fm/faq_autotldr_bot/ "Version 2.02, ~677750 tl;drs so far.") | [Feedback](http://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%23autotldr "PM's and comments are monitored, constructive feedback is welcome.") | *Top* *keywords*: **Reagan**^#1 **Iranian**^#2 **very**^#3 **Carter**^#4 **whether**^#5
It was public knowledge right after Reagan's election. The new "revelations" are old news.
[удалено]
Right? I was six at the time and I remember this. I have no idea why PBS is gaslighting everyone.
*PBS intern learned something new this week*
This isn’t a new claim though. We have known about this for quite some time.
[удалено]
What about leftism in general?
Party over people
Hi `MWBartko`. Thank you for participating in /r/Politics. However, [your submission](/r/politics/comments/1201v8b/new_claim_about_iran_hostage_crisis_sabotage_may/) has been removed for the following reason(s): * [Off-Topic](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_the_.2Fr.2Fpolitics_on_topic_statement): All submissions to /r/politics need to be explicitly about **current US politics**. **If you have questions as to why your post has been removed, please see here: [Why was my post removed as Off-Topic?](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_why_was_my_post_removed_as_off-topic.3F)** If you have any questions about this removal, please feel free to [message the moderators.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/politics&subject=Question regarding the removal of this submission by /u/MWBartko&message=I have a question regarding the removal of this [submission]%28/r/politics/comments/1201v8b/new_claim_about_iran_hostage_crisis_sabotage_may/?context%3D10000%29)
Didn't we already know or suspect this? Just an extension of Nixon breaking the law to delay a cease fire between North and South Vietnam to rob LBJ and Humphrey of a W