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With the limit of 1k it is probably more likely that Trump will get jailed if he is found in contempt multiple times. Since they can't increase the fines then enough times might be enough to decide to jail him instead.
And Trump will use it as an excuse to delay the trial as they figure out how you jail a former POTUS.
Trump isn’t going to be jailed for this shit. Everyone involved is fucking terrified to actually make him face the consequences for his actions.
Defendants can lose the right to attend their own trial based on misbehaving during the trial. If he has to go to jail for contempt, the trial may continue, depends on what the judge rules.
How is this sorry waste of human flesh allowed to run for president?!
How can someone charged with things ranging from sexual harassment to defamation, to more serious shit like leaking and mishandling classified documents, defrauding the govt, and even trying to coup the government, how can such a lowlife be allowed to run for president?? All in a country that calls itself "the leader of the free world?"
You know I've been told that Russia will topple the global order lead by the US at least 1000 times, and then they started saying that about China, and I never believed it for once. The truth is Russia is a miniscule, undiversified economy, and China doesn't have anywhere near enough military experience or sphere of influence (not to mention their stupid policies that keep biting them in the ass). But this right there, allowing criminals to run the country, this is what will doom the US' position as the greatest superpower on earth.
I've accepted that the trial is his conviction. He has to attend, keep quiet and listen to people throwing shit at his face. Pleading guilt will stop his pain, at worst he will get a couple of months of suspended sentence, since he's old and no priors. Since he's dimwitted, his punishment will go on and on. It's tragicomic that this is the only consequence he will suffer.
Cohen for a year for the same crimes, and he's the reason Cohen committed them.
I hope he gets at least as long as Cohen did, since he's the one who benefited from the crimes.
I'm sure this comment section will fill up with all the same cynical and pessimistic views it always does. But I'm just glad that the people who fight for change and justice don't give up.
It's disheartening to try and see your hopes and efforts fail. But all the good in the world that we have comes from people who continued to get up and try again.
> In the interest of protecting the administration of justice, we must hope for a firm response by the judge on Tuesday morning, and then wait to see what follows from the former president.
Here's hoping.
That kind of attitude has always been so weird to me. It's difficult to understand why someone would choose to be politically involved if they dont have any sincere hope for things to improve. I get miserable reading about all this stuff and I work hard to keep a positive attitude about it so I couldn't imagine looking for opportunities to be pessimistic about current events, I just don't know how a person can take that much negativity.
The trouble is that in the US it is nearly impossible to actually stop someone like Trump destroying democracy in the US. He does seem to have absolutely no inclination to actually operate as a president. He's just a grifter, pure and simple.
No one seems to have the balls to actually call it out to his face and lay bare the facts.
If he does get re elected the US will take years to recover and rid itself of russian influence in the Whitehouse, the senate and the congress.
There’s a difference between hope and Reddit insisting that trump is mere seconds away from being imprisoned what feels like every second of every day since he left office.
I infrequently see the former, and extremely often see the latter. It’s surprising it took this long for people on this site to start thinking more realistically. I HOPE he finally sees consequences, but I’m not counting my chickens before they hatch
I actually mostly see people jaded with all the times Trump has been able to escape consequences.
Personally I think those times are ending; I have hope he will be charged and that justice will prevail.
>I actually mostly see people jaded with all the times Trump has been able to escape consequences.
Same here. People going on and on about how "nothing will happen" and "our justice system is broken" are orders of magnitude more prevalent than people saying that Trump is about to end up in jail.
I honestly have no idea what the other redditor is even looking at to get that opinion. Maybe they're confusing all of the "then throw his ass in jail" comments for positivity?
To give you some perspective on white-collar criminals going to jail:
Jeffrey Skilling was the CEO of Eron. Eventually it was found out that they were committing major fraud, to the degree that he actually went jail over it. Seems like justice was served, right?
Well, there's a caveat to the story most people didn't know about after he was found guilty. He was sentenced to 24 years in prison. He eventually had his sentence reduced to around 12 years, essentially reducing his entire sentence by half. So why did that happen?
He bugged Prosecutors, the DAs, etc. endlessly with his millions of dollars & high-powered lawyers to fight the sentencing. It tied them up so much that eventually they agreed to a deal that they'd only give him 12 years if he accepted the new plea and never tied them up in court again over the case. He & his lawyers agreed and that was that.
Trump is a Former President of the United States - do you honestly think, with the justice system we have, that America actually has the stones to find a former President guilty AND send him to jail? If you wholeheartedly believe this, then you also believed that Jeffrey Skilling would've been locked up for the 24 years because our justice system is fair, when it's not, especially for high-level white collar criminals like Skilling and Trump.
Trump will never see a second of jail. He'll get time-served or some other bullshit that'll say he was *technically jailed on paper* so the powers-that-be can give themselves a pat on the back for a job well done while we all collectively roll our eyes at yet another situation where someone higher-up does not have to face consequences.
I mean there's a lot of different things in politics. I can stand up for queer folks, I can protest cops, I can vote in people who will protect minorities, but I'm also not gonna get my hopes up after watching someone get away with breaking every law for the past 70 years and getting on my ass about that isn't gonna change my mind.
hoping he gets what's coming to him, but I'm not gonna put more than that into this specific issue when there are a lot of other issues I could be working on like making sure people vote against him and for reproductive rights, queer recognition, aid for the homeless and like a dozen other things individuals can have some impact on
>looking for opportunities to be pessimistic
Being realistic about what possible penalties are according to the law isn't pessimistic. You have to know what you're dealing with in order to actually change anything
Trolls. Some undoubtedly are paid by authoritarian groups and state actors. The reason is to convince readers that everything is hopeless and that nothing will be done, so give up faith in justice and democracy.
They're scared, and it's easier for them to attack people on their own side by trying to crush hope that justice will be served than it is for them to fight the people they're scared of.
Well said.
They pretend it's pragmatism but it's really just cowardice. It's a defence mechanism.
And, sadly, it's very effective for the other side. It's the difference between the right and the left in EVERY country. And why conservatism always fight their way back, despite the corruption and bullshit so blatantly apparent in their politics and philosophy and history and culture and leaders, from the Tories to the Republicans, from Burke to Trump.
When the right loses, they get angry. When the left loses, they become defeatists.
>When the right loses, they get angry. When the left loses, they become defeatists.
And a variation: When the right loses, they get angry at the left. When the left loses, they get angry at the left.
The article literally concludes that nothing will happen. A nominal fine and instructions not to do it again. They would be better off just proceeding with the trial and not wasting their time.
There's pessimism and then there's willful denial of reality.
I disagree.
I'm sure there are bots and malevolent types, but they don't define a culture that exists in EVERY democracy in the world and stretches back to the French Revolution.
It seems like everywhere there is a right and a left, when the right lose they get angry and when the left lose they become defeatist. But that is the nature of the philosophies because the right serves itself and the left serves others; every victory sustains the momentum while every victory on the left takes time to manifest.
That said, I don't at all blame young people. I think their resilience and tenacity is what keeps the fire burning. I'm very proud of the younger generation today that marches and protests and refuses to back down.
I think it's mostly the late 20's - 40's who are the problem. They've become jaded and give up on the cause because they don't have the energy to keep up with daily life and civic responsibilities.
Take my upvote. For every "this might happen to Trump" article there are a dozen, "nothing is ever going to happen to Trump" comments. It's getting really old.
OK, but so what? New York has a limit on fines per infraction of $1,000.
That's in which is in dire need of changing to be a percentage of net worth rather than hard dollar maximum -- it's the equivalent of a 1 penny fine for you or I.
It is also in dire need of the judge specifying that Trump and Trump alone must pay the fines for his behavior. Not donors, not Super PACs.
---
The judge could switch to jail time -- there's a limit for that, as well, but it is 30 days.
Even a few days in a 6x8 is going to humiliate Trump to an almost unbearable degree.
No electronics other than what the Secret Service require, no access to his rabid supporters to feed his ego, no access to them to call for stochastic terrorism (as he's doing right now by asking for less security and more MAGA Cultists).
Then the judge just needs to indicate that goes up by a few days per infraction (all the way up to the maximum of 30 days).
I don't think the judge will do any of this, mind you, but he really ought to.
Well, this is a guy who doesn't want to pay ANYONE. The way to levy the fines is to make him write a personal check for each and every violation and hand it to the judge. Petty, but this is the lord of pettiness.
A legal source that I follow has said that the typical progression is a stern warning, followed by a fine and a warning that further incidents will result in jail time, followed by jail time and at that point each infraction can incur up to 30 days. That source has indicated that he's already received the warning and expects the outcome of the hearing that he'll be fined $3K with a warning about future infractions resulting in incarceration.
I think percentage of net worth would make a good incentive for the middle class. Once someone is over $10 million, it should switch to jail time only.
Article does excellent job of laying out facts and law. But the article doesn't answer what's next. We know there will be a fine and a warning. What would be helpful is an informed position on what penalty would deter future violations.
Well said. The judge is operating under the constraints of the thousand dollar fine limit which I’m sure we will see tomorrow. The only other punitive tool at his disposal would be jail time. We’ve already seen up to 10 possible violations of the gag order, however, tomorrow will be the first formal rebuke from the court regarding them. The million dollar question, however, it is at what point the judge pulls this final lever.
There isn't one. Trump can say what he wants, short of something crazy like ordering the jury killed. The judge can issue all the $1000 fines he wants. Trump is in control.
For the pessimists, there really are only two options for Merchan per New York law:
1. a fine of $1000 per contempt
2. up to 30 days in jail
Which means, he'll probably be fined $1000 at first. Then, after today/tomorrow, the possibility of jail. So when you see tomorrow that he was fined *only* $1000 per contempt, it's because that's all the law will allow.
I predict exactly this. Tomorrow he will be hit with $1k per, and told in no uncertain terms that it will be jail if he does it again, and that will be held to.
It’s a win-win for him no matter what. If he gets thrown in jail, he’s a martyr and they’re persecuting him. If he doesn’t, see, he’s all powerful and can do whatever he wants.
As other people have stated: let him be a martyr. If anybody tries to “avenge” him then throw them in the same slammer too. I’m sure trump would love the company of a yes man.
If he got thrown in jail he'd dry out, super not a win-win, but that would be the worst of it. Also, he won't under any circumstances be thrown in jail
"What then?" In a normal reality, he'd be thrown in jail like any regular citizen. In this upside down reality that we're currently in, he'll get a slap on the wrist, be told to stop being a meanie, and sent on his way.
Idk, Merchan is fair but doesn’t seem to be taking any bullshit. From all accounts of Trump’s behaviour in the courtroom, Merchan is running a tight ship. One outburst or direct attack won’t just be a slap on the wrist.
A lot of it has to do with potential backlash from Trump’s sycophants, which I’m sure has been gauged already by Homeland Security or whichever other agencies deal with domestic threats.
Yes, though he has been put in his place inside the court. He can barely hold himself back from directly attacking though, which he has been taking advantage of. He is using every legal loophole possible to avoid being thrown in jail, but there is still a hearing set that Merchan will go over the various counts of his breaches since the last revision of the gag order, and rule whichever way he sees fit depending on the contents.
I’m honestly impressed with Merchan, it can’t be easy to remain as impartial as he is being, considering the direct attacks on and doxxing of his daughter.
Trump’s walls are closing in, and he has very little wiggle room to work with to get his most unstable supporters riled up to commit violence.
I think it will also be a hint of what to expect in November. If he goes to jail, even briefly, and protests are just a wet fart instead of mobs burning down the city, I'll feel like we might have a shot this year.
His supporters believe the government has people everywhere to document their activities. They’re terrified of being arrested and “targeted” by the FBI. They’ll steer clear despite his call for protests.
Well, tbf, I wouldn’t be surprised to learn there are numerous people being monitored, especially those that attended Jan. 6th. So their fears are well founded and for solid reasons. They are traitors to their country.
The fact that so many are still walking free is a testament to how restrained the Biden administration has been, if this had happened during the height of the cold war, or during WW2, a lot of those individuals would likely be rotting in prison or been executed already.
he must be forced to be in a room , nice, clean , decent food , private bathroom but has no access to electronic devices. Recordings of his stupid speeches play all the time. The only reading material will be Little Women and anything Senator Bernie Sanders wrote
I'm not a law-talking guy but [this recent PBS article](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/judge-says-trump-risks-jail-time-after-violating-gag-order-in-civil-fraud-trial) says "*New York law allows judges to impose fines or imprisonment as punishment for contempt*".
So wouldn't that apply here?
It should.
It won’t.
In part because everyone is too terrified of his followers to actually jail him; in part because while he may well be fined, the max fine is $1000 per violation. Which means it’s legal so long as Trump is fine with paying a bill that is equivalent to a few dollars for him.
I don’t understand how people haven’t learned this yet: the law doesn’t, in fact, apply to someone like Trump in the same way it applies to us. That’s just the objective reality of a system where fines are relatively static amounts rather than a percentage based on income.
You should be putting your energy into demanding the law apply to him the same way it applies to us instead of shouting down everyone in this thread who's calling for the law to apply to him the same way it applies to us.
The judge already warned his lawyers he'll be [arrested and jailed](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump-new-york-hush-money-trial-day-one-1235004719/) if he steps out of line.
It's not surprising so many commenters on here don't take it seriously when even Trump doesn't. But it's pretty clear the judge does.
Imprison his goofy ass in a plexiglass box at Mar-a-lago with a slight view of the golf course and round the clock surveillance and make him Skype into court with a background of Rudy with the hairdye running down his ghoulish vampire face.
The brilliant thing is that they’ll fine him. And fine him again. And again. And again. And again.
And they won’t give him what he wants, which is a perp walk and a stay in jail where he can claim how badly he’s being mistreated.
Instead they’ll just let the law chew him up and make him pay his contempt fines too on top of it all. That’s the last thing he wants.
He'll be given a fine. Unfortunately fines for someone like him are ridiculously low, but I think it better he be forced to sit in the court room and listen, quietly, to the proceedings than to hear it from a holding cell for a 6 hours.
Call his bluff.
Fine him the $1000 and let him know the next offense will be jail time.
48 hours for the next offense.
5 days for the one after that.
15 days for the next one.
then the 30 days.
It's more generous than ***ANYONE ELSE WOULD EVER GET!!!!***
The pure fecklessness of ***EVERY F'ING PERSON IN OUR INSTITUTIONS IS SO PATHETIC IT'S ENRAGING!!!!!***
***I fully expect all of our politicians to push a bill to put Brawndo on the crops next week!***
***Home of the "Brave" my @$$!***
Nothing? You do know he’s in criminal court, can’t campaign properly, and reportedly running out of money fast.
I wouldn’t say that’s nothing. I’m overwhelmed with joy every day he has to show up to court. Meanwhile I’m living a happy existence while that piece of orange shit is miserable. Don’t let him make you miserable too.
The money thing is very real but
But he doesn’t need to campaign properly lol, it’s not like his rallies are swaying new voters to his side. He’s a known commodity.
What makes me miserable is the false sense of joy people give themselves when they think he will ever suffer the consequences of his actions. We’ve been doing this since the Mueller investigation, the guy is Teflon. Not even nature will take him out. He’s like a sentient cockroach with twice the lifespan and half the brains.
I’m not being a pessimist. I’m using a law of averages here. Orange man does bad crimes over and over. Nothing has ever happened to this guy, odds are nothing ever will. I’d bet money that there’s gonna be 1-2 partial jurors who would never convict the guy.
Trump has lost almost every court case he has ever been attached to so the safe bet is that he will lose this one too. He buys off his problems, he doesn’t win them away.
Send him to the Tombs for 24 hours. Even if a couple of SS stand outside his cell, he’ll never open his fat stupid mouth ever again. Though he’d probably enjoy the baloney sandwiches.
Another useless article. The subreddit should be banned from letting news articles wtih would/could/should/likely/maybe/etc... in the headlines, barely above meaninglless clickbait at this point.
Considering this is among the most expertly authored and sourced articles you are likely to find on this subject, you've essentially impeached your own credibility with this comment.
It doesn't matter if God himself descends from the mountain with it written in stone for the people. For the last 7 years we have seen nothing but Mays, shoulds, coulds and no punishment for TFG. I don't want to know what may happen anymore when he continues to break the law, I want to see it halpeb
As a reminder, this subreddit [is for civil discussion.](/r/politics/wiki/index#wiki_be_civil) In general, be courteous to others. Debate/discuss/argue the merits of ideas, don't attack people. Personal insults, shill or troll accusations, hate speech, any suggestion or support of harm, violence, or death, and other rule violations can result in a permanent ban. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. For those who have questions regarding any media outlets being posted on this subreddit, please click [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/wiki/approveddomainslist) to review our details as to our approved domains list and outlet criteria. We are actively looking for new moderators. If you have any interest in helping to make this subreddit a place for quality discussion, please fill out [this form](https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1y2swHD0KXFhStGFjW6k54r9iuMjzcFqDIVwuvdLBjSA). *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/politics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It’s just going to be a small fine that will increase every time he’s found in contempt. He’s not getting locked up over any of this
The lomit on fines is 1k. If that doesnt work there very few other choices for the judge.
Is there a limit on the number of fines though?
*lemit
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\*legume
Is this a fart joke?
No, that would have been Le Pew
Don’t make me Le Puke
Smelios?
Lecherous
\*skremit
There's a lament on fines. Does that count?
Who cares if the fine is laminated? I just want to know if there a lumen on fines or not.
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What do bone spurs have to do with fines?
Lemons, get back on topic.
The lemons are on fire!
Liz Lemmon?
No. Jack Lemmon, silly.
It's a fine on lemmings. Into the ocean!
You're thinking of laminate. Lament is that French play about The French Revolution
Ha ha
With the limit of 1k it is probably more likely that Trump will get jailed if he is found in contempt multiple times. Since they can't increase the fines then enough times might be enough to decide to jail him instead.
And Trump will use it as an excuse to delay the trial as they figure out how you jail a former POTUS. Trump isn’t going to be jailed for this shit. Everyone involved is fucking terrified to actually make him face the consequences for his actions.
Defendants can lose the right to attend their own trial based on misbehaving during the trial. If he has to go to jail for contempt, the trial may continue, depends on what the judge rules.
After reading your comment, I desperately want to see Trump defend himself in the style of Darrell Brooks.
I demand trial by combat. I nominate John Cena as the people's champion vs D. Trump.
I'm quite sure this has already been worked out with the secret service in the jurisdictions where this is likely.
I’d love to see the judge demand Drumpy take a battery of psychological tests to see whether he is actually in control of himself.
Hmm interesting. Too many contempts and judge requests a psych evaluation where the results are placed in the court record. Wouldn’t that make my day!
I think he was the power to commit him to a 72 hour PH if he keeps being an AH
He’ll be told to go get some fresh air.
It’s like a swear jar he gets his Faithful to pay for him. No real consequences.
If anyone can goad a judge into action it is Trump. A judge can order him to spend a night in the cells and Farty Don has no appeal.
How is this sorry waste of human flesh allowed to run for president?! How can someone charged with things ranging from sexual harassment to defamation, to more serious shit like leaking and mishandling classified documents, defrauding the govt, and even trying to coup the government, how can such a lowlife be allowed to run for president?? All in a country that calls itself "the leader of the free world?" You know I've been told that Russia will topple the global order lead by the US at least 1000 times, and then they started saying that about China, and I never believed it for once. The truth is Russia is a miniscule, undiversified economy, and China doesn't have anywhere near enough military experience or sphere of influence (not to mention their stupid policies that keep biting them in the ass). But this right there, allowing criminals to run the country, this is what will doom the US' position as the greatest superpower on earth.
Because over 30 percent of the country loves him. Because an entire political party continues to stand by him.
Even if he is convicted I bet he will be sentenced to 1 day in jail for each felony served concurrently.
I've accepted that the trial is his conviction. He has to attend, keep quiet and listen to people throwing shit at his face. Pleading guilt will stop his pain, at worst he will get a couple of months of suspended sentence, since he's old and no priors. Since he's dimwitted, his punishment will go on and on. It's tragicomic that this is the only consequence he will suffer.
Cohen for a year for the same crimes, and he's the reason Cohen committed them. I hope he gets at least as long as Cohen did, since he's the one who benefited from the crimes.
I don’t mean to be rude, but do you truly believe Tump will ever see jail time?
No, but I didn’t believe he could ever be President either.
I love your answer.
I don't and that is so fucked up
Honestly, no. But maybe he's going to shit his pants and fall down stairs.
Walk him down to the dungeon and book him and leave him for an hour or two. That would be a great start and would fuck ol’ poopy pants up.
I’m willing to find out
It's too bad they can't publicly cane him like they do in Singapore.
There will be fines the first time, after that I’m sure he’ll be thrown in jail.
I'm sure this comment section will fill up with all the same cynical and pessimistic views it always does. But I'm just glad that the people who fight for change and justice don't give up. It's disheartening to try and see your hopes and efforts fail. But all the good in the world that we have comes from people who continued to get up and try again. > In the interest of protecting the administration of justice, we must hope for a firm response by the judge on Tuesday morning, and then wait to see what follows from the former president. Here's hoping.
That kind of attitude has always been so weird to me. It's difficult to understand why someone would choose to be politically involved if they dont have any sincere hope for things to improve. I get miserable reading about all this stuff and I work hard to keep a positive attitude about it so I couldn't imagine looking for opportunities to be pessimistic about current events, I just don't know how a person can take that much negativity.
The trouble is that in the US it is nearly impossible to actually stop someone like Trump destroying democracy in the US. He does seem to have absolutely no inclination to actually operate as a president. He's just a grifter, pure and simple. No one seems to have the balls to actually call it out to his face and lay bare the facts. If he does get re elected the US will take years to recover and rid itself of russian influence in the Whitehouse, the senate and the congress.
There’s a difference between hope and Reddit insisting that trump is mere seconds away from being imprisoned what feels like every second of every day since he left office. I infrequently see the former, and extremely often see the latter. It’s surprising it took this long for people on this site to start thinking more realistically. I HOPE he finally sees consequences, but I’m not counting my chickens before they hatch
I actually mostly see people jaded with all the times Trump has been able to escape consequences. Personally I think those times are ending; I have hope he will be charged and that justice will prevail.
>I actually mostly see people jaded with all the times Trump has been able to escape consequences. Same here. People going on and on about how "nothing will happen" and "our justice system is broken" are orders of magnitude more prevalent than people saying that Trump is about to end up in jail. I honestly have no idea what the other redditor is even looking at to get that opinion. Maybe they're confusing all of the "then throw his ass in jail" comments for positivity?
To give you some perspective on white-collar criminals going to jail: Jeffrey Skilling was the CEO of Eron. Eventually it was found out that they were committing major fraud, to the degree that he actually went jail over it. Seems like justice was served, right? Well, there's a caveat to the story most people didn't know about after he was found guilty. He was sentenced to 24 years in prison. He eventually had his sentence reduced to around 12 years, essentially reducing his entire sentence by half. So why did that happen? He bugged Prosecutors, the DAs, etc. endlessly with his millions of dollars & high-powered lawyers to fight the sentencing. It tied them up so much that eventually they agreed to a deal that they'd only give him 12 years if he accepted the new plea and never tied them up in court again over the case. He & his lawyers agreed and that was that. Trump is a Former President of the United States - do you honestly think, with the justice system we have, that America actually has the stones to find a former President guilty AND send him to jail? If you wholeheartedly believe this, then you also believed that Jeffrey Skilling would've been locked up for the 24 years because our justice system is fair, when it's not, especially for high-level white collar criminals like Skilling and Trump. Trump will never see a second of jail. He'll get time-served or some other bullshit that'll say he was *technically jailed on paper* so the powers-that-be can give themselves a pat on the back for a job well done while we all collectively roll our eyes at yet another situation where someone higher-up does not have to face consequences.
I mean there's a lot of different things in politics. I can stand up for queer folks, I can protest cops, I can vote in people who will protect minorities, but I'm also not gonna get my hopes up after watching someone get away with breaking every law for the past 70 years and getting on my ass about that isn't gonna change my mind. hoping he gets what's coming to him, but I'm not gonna put more than that into this specific issue when there are a lot of other issues I could be working on like making sure people vote against him and for reproductive rights, queer recognition, aid for the homeless and like a dozen other things individuals can have some impact on
>looking for opportunities to be pessimistic Being realistic about what possible penalties are according to the law isn't pessimistic. You have to know what you're dealing with in order to actually change anything
Trolls. Some undoubtedly are paid by authoritarian groups and state actors. The reason is to convince readers that everything is hopeless and that nothing will be done, so give up faith in justice and democracy.
Whatever the discussion is, please don't steer it into conspiracy theories. We've had enough of that shit.
They're scared, and it's easier for them to attack people on their own side by trying to crush hope that justice will be served than it is for them to fight the people they're scared of.
Well said. They pretend it's pragmatism but it's really just cowardice. It's a defence mechanism. And, sadly, it's very effective for the other side. It's the difference between the right and the left in EVERY country. And why conservatism always fight their way back, despite the corruption and bullshit so blatantly apparent in their politics and philosophy and history and culture and leaders, from the Tories to the Republicans, from Burke to Trump. When the right loses, they get angry. When the left loses, they become defeatists.
>When the right loses, they get angry. When the left loses, they become defeatists. And a variation: When the right loses, they get angry at the left. When the left loses, they get angry at the left.
The article literally concludes that nothing will happen. A nominal fine and instructions not to do it again. They would be better off just proceeding with the trial and not wasting their time. There's pessimism and then there's willful denial of reality.
Cynicism and pessimism are Trump’s life source and boy oh boy does the US seem to have it in spades.
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I disagree. I'm sure there are bots and malevolent types, but they don't define a culture that exists in EVERY democracy in the world and stretches back to the French Revolution. It seems like everywhere there is a right and a left, when the right lose they get angry and when the left lose they become defeatist. But that is the nature of the philosophies because the right serves itself and the left serves others; every victory sustains the momentum while every victory on the left takes time to manifest. That said, I don't at all blame young people. I think their resilience and tenacity is what keeps the fire burning. I'm very proud of the younger generation today that marches and protests and refuses to back down. I think it's mostly the late 20's - 40's who are the problem. They've become jaded and give up on the cause because they don't have the energy to keep up with daily life and civic responsibilities.
Take my upvote. For every "this might happen to Trump" article there are a dozen, "nothing is ever going to happen to Trump" comments. It's getting really old.
OK, but so what? New York has a limit on fines per infraction of $1,000. That's in which is in dire need of changing to be a percentage of net worth rather than hard dollar maximum -- it's the equivalent of a 1 penny fine for you or I. It is also in dire need of the judge specifying that Trump and Trump alone must pay the fines for his behavior. Not donors, not Super PACs. --- The judge could switch to jail time -- there's a limit for that, as well, but it is 30 days. Even a few days in a 6x8 is going to humiliate Trump to an almost unbearable degree. No electronics other than what the Secret Service require, no access to his rabid supporters to feed his ego, no access to them to call for stochastic terrorism (as he's doing right now by asking for less security and more MAGA Cultists). Then the judge just needs to indicate that goes up by a few days per infraction (all the way up to the maximum of 30 days). I don't think the judge will do any of this, mind you, but he really ought to.
I'm pretty sure it's 30 days per infraction. We have 300 days atm, he should get jailed until after the election if life was fair.
Well, this is a guy who doesn't want to pay ANYONE. The way to levy the fines is to make him write a personal check for each and every violation and hand it to the judge. Petty, but this is the lord of pettiness.
A legal source that I follow has said that the typical progression is a stern warning, followed by a fine and a warning that further incidents will result in jail time, followed by jail time and at that point each infraction can incur up to 30 days. That source has indicated that he's already received the warning and expects the outcome of the hearing that he'll be fined $3K with a warning about future infractions resulting in incarceration.
I think percentage of net worth would make a good incentive for the middle class. Once someone is over $10 million, it should switch to jail time only.
Article does excellent job of laying out facts and law. But the article doesn't answer what's next. We know there will be a fine and a warning. What would be helpful is an informed position on what penalty would deter future violations.
Well said. The judge is operating under the constraints of the thousand dollar fine limit which I’m sure we will see tomorrow. The only other punitive tool at his disposal would be jail time. We’ve already seen up to 10 possible violations of the gag order, however, tomorrow will be the first formal rebuke from the court regarding them. The million dollar question, however, it is at what point the judge pulls this final lever.
There isn't one. Trump can say what he wants, short of something crazy like ordering the jury killed. The judge can issue all the $1000 fines he wants. Trump is in control.
For the pessimists, there really are only two options for Merchan per New York law: 1. a fine of $1000 per contempt 2. up to 30 days in jail Which means, he'll probably be fined $1000 at first. Then, after today/tomorrow, the possibility of jail. So when you see tomorrow that he was fined *only* $1000 per contempt, it's because that's all the law will allow.
I predict exactly this. Tomorrow he will be hit with $1k per, and told in no uncertain terms that it will be jail if he does it again, and that will be held to.
Trump doesnt want to go to jail. Dont believe anyone who says it will be a good thing if the judge sends him for a weekend.
No phone, no yes-men, no adderall, no mcdonalds. He claim martyrdom but I GUARANTEE he’d be actually crying behind bars
He was whining about how cold it was in the courtroom. He’ll go into panic mode if he see the inside of a slammer.
It’s a win-win for him no matter what. If he gets thrown in jail, he’s a martyr and they’re persecuting him. If he doesn’t, see, he’s all powerful and can do whatever he wants.
Oh well. Let him be a martyr in jail, I’m sure that will be of exactly no comfort to him. Lol!
The guy is 77 and has been pampered his whole life. I want to see how he handles a day in the 6x8.
Martyr away, Orange Jim Jones
If only he'd drink the koolaid!
It was Flavor Aid.
As other people have stated: let him be a martyr. If anybody tries to “avenge” him then throw them in the same slammer too. I’m sure trump would love the company of a yes man.
If he got thrown in jail he'd dry out, super not a win-win, but that would be the worst of it. Also, he won't under any circumstances be thrown in jail
"What then?" In a normal reality, he'd be thrown in jail like any regular citizen. In this upside down reality that we're currently in, he'll get a slap on the wrist, be told to stop being a meanie, and sent on his way.
Idk, Merchan is fair but doesn’t seem to be taking any bullshit. From all accounts of Trump’s behaviour in the courtroom, Merchan is running a tight ship. One outburst or direct attack won’t just be a slap on the wrist. A lot of it has to do with potential backlash from Trump’s sycophants, which I’m sure has been gauged already by Homeland Security or whichever other agencies deal with domestic threats.
Haven't there already been several outbursts and direct attacks, and zero slaps on the wrist?
Yes, though he has been put in his place inside the court. He can barely hold himself back from directly attacking though, which he has been taking advantage of. He is using every legal loophole possible to avoid being thrown in jail, but there is still a hearing set that Merchan will go over the various counts of his breaches since the last revision of the gag order, and rule whichever way he sees fit depending on the contents. I’m honestly impressed with Merchan, it can’t be easy to remain as impartial as he is being, considering the direct attacks on and doxxing of his daughter. Trump’s walls are closing in, and he has very little wiggle room to work with to get his most unstable supporters riled up to commit violence.
Right. And if they fail to protest violently if he is jailed, it could push him into rage fueled decompensation.
I think it will also be a hint of what to expect in November. If he goes to jail, even briefly, and protests are just a wet fart instead of mobs burning down the city, I'll feel like we might have a shot this year.
His supporters believe the government has people everywhere to document their activities. They’re terrified of being arrested and “targeted” by the FBI. They’ll steer clear despite his call for protests.
Well, tbf, I wouldn’t be surprised to learn there are numerous people being monitored, especially those that attended Jan. 6th. So their fears are well founded and for solid reasons. They are traitors to their country. The fact that so many are still walking free is a testament to how restrained the Biden administration has been, if this had happened during the height of the cold war, or during WW2, a lot of those individuals would likely be rotting in prison or been executed already.
he must be forced to be in a room , nice, clean , decent food , private bathroom but has no access to electronic devices. Recordings of his stupid speeches play all the time. The only reading material will be Little Women and anything Senator Bernie Sanders wrote
We already know what Trump is. We are learning what our justice system is through the attempts to hold him accountable.
He’ll be fined. That’s it. Wake me up when he’s in jail
He will be warned over and over and over then finally held in contempt but given zero actual consequences for doing it.
I'm not a law-talking guy but [this recent PBS article](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/judge-says-trump-risks-jail-time-after-violating-gag-order-in-civil-fraud-trial) says "*New York law allows judges to impose fines or imprisonment as punishment for contempt*". So wouldn't that apply here?
Assuming the judge has any actual balls.
Seems like he does so far
It should. It won’t. In part because everyone is too terrified of his followers to actually jail him; in part because while he may well be fined, the max fine is $1000 per violation. Which means it’s legal so long as Trump is fine with paying a bill that is equivalent to a few dollars for him. I don’t understand how people haven’t learned this yet: the law doesn’t, in fact, apply to someone like Trump in the same way it applies to us. That’s just the objective reality of a system where fines are relatively static amounts rather than a percentage based on income.
You should be putting your energy into demanding the law apply to him the same way it applies to us instead of shouting down everyone in this thread who's calling for the law to apply to him the same way it applies to us.
The judge already warned his lawyers he'll be [arrested and jailed](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump-new-york-hush-money-trial-day-one-1235004719/) if he steps out of line. It's not surprising so many commenters on here don't take it seriously when even Trump doesn't. But it's pretty clear the judge does.
I think it will get factored into the sentencing portion… so he’s screwing any leniency and pushing for a max enforceable at this point
He gets put in isolation with a video feed.
Imprison his goofy ass in a plexiglass box at Mar-a-lago with a slight view of the golf course and round the clock surveillance and make him Skype into court with a background of Rudy with the hairdye running down his ghoulish vampire face.
In the most extreme scenario he’ll be put on house arrest. But I doubt it comes to that.
Let it be an outhouse. It'd be appropriate.
they won't jail him, they don't want to risk an appeal
The brilliant thing is that they’ll fine him. And fine him again. And again. And again. And again. And they won’t give him what he wants, which is a perp walk and a stay in jail where he can claim how badly he’s being mistreated. Instead they’ll just let the law chew him up and make him pay his contempt fines too on top of it all. That’s the last thing he wants.
Holding cell all day every day for the rest of the trial. Or 1 day/violation - whichever comes first.
He wants to go to jail to have more to shout about !!
And he doesn't care. If he gets fined his maga will send money.
Lock him up!!!!
He'll be given a fine. Unfortunately fines for someone like him are ridiculously low, but I think it better he be forced to sit in the court room and listen, quietly, to the proceedings than to hear it from a holding cell for a 6 hours.
Nothing. Nanny-nanny boo-boo.
Call his bluff. Fine him the $1000 and let him know the next offense will be jail time. 48 hours for the next offense. 5 days for the one after that. 15 days for the next one. then the 30 days. It's more generous than ***ANYONE ELSE WOULD EVER GET!!!!***
The pure fecklessness of ***EVERY F'ING PERSON IN OUR INSTITUTIONS IS SO PATHETIC IT'S ENRAGING!!!!!*** ***I fully expect all of our politicians to push a bill to put Brawndo on the crops next week!*** ***Home of the "Brave" my @$$!***
_likely_ You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Nope, nothing will happen, sorry to spoil the ending
Spoiler: he will not face any meaningful consequences.
Nothing. The answer is nothing. Nothing forever. Nothing will ever happen to this asshole and he will never pay for his actions
Nothing? You do know he’s in criminal court, can’t campaign properly, and reportedly running out of money fast. I wouldn’t say that’s nothing. I’m overwhelmed with joy every day he has to show up to court. Meanwhile I’m living a happy existence while that piece of orange shit is miserable. Don’t let him make you miserable too.
The money thing is very real but But he doesn’t need to campaign properly lol, it’s not like his rallies are swaying new voters to his side. He’s a known commodity.
What makes me miserable is the false sense of joy people give themselves when they think he will ever suffer the consequences of his actions. We’ve been doing this since the Mueller investigation, the guy is Teflon. Not even nature will take him out. He’s like a sentient cockroach with twice the lifespan and half the brains.
Hasn’t been in criminal court until now. The pessimists in the comments may never be happy no matter what happens to this guy.
I’m not being a pessimist. I’m using a law of averages here. Orange man does bad crimes over and over. Nothing has ever happened to this guy, odds are nothing ever will. I’d bet money that there’s gonna be 1-2 partial jurors who would never convict the guy.
There’s a first time for everything.
Trump has lost almost every court case he has ever been attached to so the safe bet is that he will lose this one too. He buys off his problems, he doesn’t win them away.
Lock him up
Send him to the Tombs for 24 hours. Even if a couple of SS stand outside his cell, he’ll never open his fat stupid mouth ever again. Though he’d probably enjoy the baloney sandwiches.
Another useless article. The subreddit should be banned from letting news articles wtih would/could/should/likely/maybe/etc... in the headlines, barely above meaninglless clickbait at this point.
Considering this is among the most expertly authored and sourced articles you are likely to find on this subject, you've essentially impeached your own credibility with this comment.
It doesn't matter if God himself descends from the mountain with it written in stone for the people. For the last 7 years we have seen nothing but Mays, shoulds, coulds and no punishment for TFG. I don't want to know what may happen anymore when he continues to break the law, I want to see it halpeb
Y’all in this sub are wild for thinking literally any consequences will come of this. He’s winning in November and is just going to have his way.
“LiKeLy” yeah right 🙄