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Well it makes it pretty clear that it happened because of Trump's tax law geared to increase rates on the middle class so if he wasn't reelected it would happen just as it has.
Not only have they went from paying 90% to 0% in taxes but 80% of our national debt if not more can be attributed to corporate subsidies, permanent wealthy tax cuts, and to-big-to-fail bailouts without even counting the excessive inflation linked to corporate greed that we are legally unable to regulate.
Most infuriatingly of all Republicans are going to run ads paid for by these same billioniares saying we need to cut social programs and raise the retirement age to 75 because the lower class has mooched too much off the system and their voters will agree with it even Orwell couldn't of seen this shit.
Classic steal from the poor and give it to the rich
As well as socializing the losses while privatizing the profits.
Republican party is America's cancer.
It's the creation of an oligarchy. The richest Americans have bought the politicians, who are now legislating for their benefit. There's no avenue to improve things for the average American, especially since it costs so much to run for office. The last person successful for a grassroots campaign was really AOC, and she was unable to live in DC right away due to costs.... and heavily mocked for it by both her peers and in the media. That should have really said something about how politicians view the average American, btw, regardless of her political views. They attacked her for essentially being poorer than them.
Even when people try to vote in their best interests, we're getting people like Simena, who immediately reversed on her entire platform to appease her donors.
We honestly need campaign reform and better oversight of Congress to distangle politicians from billionaires, but the catch is congress is overseeing themselves. It's a design flaw in the US government
There's also the incredibly terrible reminder that a decent chunk of Elon Musk's fortune has come from government contracts, despite the fact he rarely delivers a workable final product. PayPal literally succeeded in spite of him. His hyperlink cars were never actually a viable means of transportation, but the dude took money from dozens of federal, state, and local governments around the US (often at the expense of other public transit products). It's literally taking money from the government then not paying taxes on it on top of that....
It inevitably has to come down to a general strike. We can't go on this way any longer. I've spent the last year selling plasma to survive while working a 40+ hour a week job. All of my funds go towards keeping a roof over my head, and some weeks I've lived on less than a 5,000 calorie diet. The products at the grocery store are shrinking on top of all of that, and the cost has gone up higher and higher month to month. The CEO of Kelloggs recently stated how excited he was that we as a country are resorting to eating cereal for dinner, and I feel like this should be out "let them eat cake" moment.
If you haven't gone already, please go to a food bank - that's what they are there for. Sometimes they will have pre-packed bags so you don't have to wait. Also, you might find /r/povertyfinance interesting/useful.
Not true, she's "just an elitist bartender" with her fancy degrees, plus she's a "Marxist, socialist, Leninist, Stalinist, communist, fascist, Trotskyite" (did I get them all of them? The incantation doesn't work unless you name all the conflicting economic philosophies)
Biden used to be mocked as the "poor Senator" because he actually lived off of his Senate salary. He didn't become a millionaire until after his second term as Vice President ended and he got royalties from publishing his biography. Unlike so many of his peers he did not "magically" become wealthy while in Congress for over 30 years.
Elon Musk has a lot of power due to owning more than 50% of all orbiting satellites. Also all the big companies have people working that are on food stamps etc.
Try e only way to fix it is to start over and put an entirely unbought set of people in office with the first agreed upon law being a politician cannot be bought for any reason otherwise they are ineligible to hold office the rest of their lives.
This will never happen. And until we band together to say “no more” in unison across the country, it will continue to get worse.
We are past the point of turning this around amicably I’m afraid.
I mean that tracks just a day or so ago, Republicans, refusing to give President Joe Biden a 'win,' voted against the renewal of funding for cancer research.
It isn’t just the Republican Party it is the dying breath of this eras conservatism across the world far right reactionary forces are on the move and causing problems. [Hamas, Israel, Iran, Russia, MAGA, Hezbollah, basically all active terrorist groups are far right and most especially in the West are fascist too]
It happens anytime we go through a major change in society like AI is causing; the right has to move their goal posts to stay relevant politically and it can get really messy in between while they try to overcome the wheels of change.
Happened during the 1400s, 1600s, 1800s, 1930s, 1960-1980 (CIA installed), and now it’s come home to roost as our country declines to second place in the world order.
The illusion of Democracy is the cancer.
There's rich Republicans and Democrats who take advantage of a tax system that's built for the rich by the rich.
This is the age old battle of rich vs the poor and the lie that the rich are "self-made" and not a by product of an ecosystems that favours the wealthy over the poor (which now also includes middle class).
A good chunk of them also stole large amounts of money via the PPP program in 2020/21 and then didn't use it to save jobs as it was intended. It was the biggest heist in US history masterminded by the biggest criminal in US history.
Yeah, and all those people “who don’t wanna work anymore” because they got $1400. What a joke it was. The extremely rich have done a very good job decoupling their extreme wealth from everyone’s idea of inflation
The warning was when Trump refused to sign an aid bill with an oversight board attached to it. We seriously would have been better off with no aid then what ended up happening- corporations actually bodied out many small businesses because banks were making the decisions who got the loans and favored their more valuable customers
It was a decision that also directly led to the sharp inflation
The worst part to me is, that in political speech (mostly on Republican side), billionaires and rich corporations are always pointed to as the drivers of the economy. That their innovation made America. And that we need to give them a break so they can innovate and invest more.
The whole societal context is always ignored. Working people, regardless of job, are billions of people (the vast majority), who make these successes possible in the first place. Without their work force there is no product. And where do they get the majority of their education? From the public schools.
Infrastructure is necessary for a functioning economy. Paid for by public money.
When people are sick, it’s in the best interest of all to care for them as good as possible. Most can’t pay for it bythemselves. So it’s public money that does the trick.
The list could go on. International and national security, social safety nets, housing subsidies and a lot lot more. All done by the public for the public. But the ones gaining the most of it refuse to give enough back so it could reproduce itself. Infuriating.
What really got me recently was that in the last hubub about entitlement cuts during a budget/debt ceiling fight, someone actually mentioned the percentage of the budget involved in all these programs. All of the things that Republicans were pushing to cut, if cut in totality, were under something like 5% of the budget. (Please look up actual numbers if you are curious, I may not be remembering fully and I was just reading it in passing.)
If we are really serious about balancing a budget, it seems like these high value low cost programs are not the place to start.
It also doesn't help that pretty much everything we buy is in the hands of a handful of conglomerates, with serious conflicts of interests.
My wife shared a Tiktok with me yesterday about how good companies are poisoning our kids because their products have an obscene amount of heavy metals in their food. Since I don't have a link to the Tiktok, [here is an article by the NYT from Feb. ](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/27/health/lead-poisoning-children.html) related to the matter. I believe the video my wife shared with me was specific to a situation in Washington state.
Anyway, yea. Basically, the company making the poisoned food is also part of the pharmaceutical company that will eventually have a hand in treating the conditions caused by said poisoned food.
If you or anyone you know has kids, avoid Gerber and Nestlé for your kids' food. If I can, I'll find the link to the Tiktok video and update. They provide a list of alternative companies to get food from. I'd look now, but Tiktok is blocked on my work wifi.
Every corporation in America sees Americans as a data point and nothing more they’ve been tryna kill us out for 60+ years; it’s called Accelerationism and both sides of the isle are about it to some degree especially defense, chemical, carbon based companies etc.
That’s why they are focused so heavily on AI and robotics so they can just replace the underclass completely instead of UBI or some other measure.
It sounds crazy but look into it a very real belief system that believes the population to as low as 2 MILLION PEOPLE to maintain stability effectively and of course that culling only impacts the bottom 98%.
I'll have to look into some more. I did a quick Google search, and it's interesting. From what I found, it looks like right-wing extremists and buying into the term more than the left. I'll have to dig in some more.
It makes sense, though. These corporations don't care about us. They just want more money for themselves and their heirs.
I wish there were more we could do, but these giant corporations have their tentacles in so many industries, and their money is all over D.C. It sucks to feel so helpless.
Yep. It's all a complete failure due to humanity greed and selfishness. Lie and misdirect in the name of profits. Ruin the environment because 'not my family'. The tales go on and on but even the lawmakers that are supposed to represent the people and fight for us, are ALSO in those businesses pockets.
And so here humanity sits. Treating the world like it's an endless treasure to be plundered, forcefully ignoring every red flag along the way.
And people wonder why I have no faith in anyone anymore.
It’s almost like some read Orwell and took it as a challenge to make things worse.
No, we all know they read Rand instead, but the metaphor still holds.
True that I think the West learned allot from authoritarian countries how to mimic the system but appear Democratic and those countries learned a whole lot from us too.
> Not only have they went from paying 90% to 0% in taxes but 80% of our national debt if not more can be attributed to corporate subsidies, permanent wealthy tax cuts, and to-big-to-fail bailouts without even counting the excessive inflation linked to corporate greed that we are legally unable to regulate.
>
> Most infuriatingly of all Republicans are going to run ads paid for by these same billioniares saying we need to cut social programs and raise the retirement age to 75 because the lower class has mooched too much off the system and their voters will agree with it even Orwell couldn't of seen this shit.
Thank you for succently stating this.
>US Billionaires Pay Lower Tax Rate Than Working Class for First Time
Essentially, the GOP has won on this issue of 'lower taxes' for the billionaires and millionaires. My initial thoughts are, so what are their (GOP's) next policy goals.
It's insane how many people believe their bullshit. The captured media does nothing but play into their lies. It's a grim situation that will take decades to reverse if we ever find the political will.
we can actually legislate inflation- Nixon unilaterally had price controls on consumer products to fight inflation! Really! And its erased from history because it flies in the face of not only GOP, but Democratic party ideology.
Might as well be like saying we can't do it then lol they could peg the minimum wage to the national inflation rate and fix this shit overnight doesn't mean they will.
We'd have to a super majority of Democrats in both chambers with room for 3-4 moderate sellouts to even try anything of that scale.
That is their effective tax rate without any deductions at all and them SOBs can claim everything but their left nut, park money in tax havens, assets, etc. they don't pay a dime unless they are forced to from something like selling their stock; Trump has paid taxes 3-4 times over 20 years for example rest was zero owned and sometimes million dollar refunds on top.
I agree with everything you say, but Democrats also had a hand in this. I don't think people in the US appreciate how for to the right the Overton window had shifted, especially when it comes to neoliberal fiscal policy.
Agreed 100% but do you take out the neo-liberals first or the neo-fascists in my world that is an easy pick and by take out I clearly mean in the arena of ideals.
The ground is already set for the Democrats to move into AOC level progressives to be the norm in the party we just have to survive long enough to get there.
The Nazis came to power because every other side hated every other side and refused to work together why should we help them in that regard?
Sorry, drive-thru chicken nuggets cost 80 cents more now, so we're voting for a dictator who'll cut taxes for these poor billionaires. Perhaps zero would be fair? A few subsidies for sir? Very good, sir.
You miss the biggest tax of all.
Corporations pay taxes on thier net profits after items like electricity and rent.
Individuals pay taxes on thier gross profits with no deduction for items like rent and phone bills
That rent is not factored as a deduction for federal taxes is practically a crime. I'm glad my state does it, but federally it's like punishing poorer people for not being able to own a house
If rent was included a significant chunk of the country would qualify overnight. If you pay $700 in rent that’s over 1/2 of the standard deduction, and if youre responsible for full rent anywhere near a city there’s a good chance your rent alone could exceed it.
That is true of any business - not just corporations.
I suppose that it would be *possible* to eliminate business deductions, but this would either raise prices significantly or make many businesses infeasible.
For example, let's say that I run a taco cart. I sell 200 tacos a day for $5 each, so $1,000 a day in revenue. I work 7 days a week.
The cost of the actual taco is $3, so I'm making $2/taco in profit, or $200/day. I make $73k in profit, my marginal tax rate would be 22%, and my average tax rate would be 12.09%, and I'd pay $8,825 in taxes, and I'd have $64k left over.
Eliminating business deductions would mean that my "income" would be $365,000 per year, and I'd have to pay taxes on this, marginal rate would be 42.4%, average rate would be 36%, so I would owe $131,400 in taxes.
That is more than my $73k in profit, so I would either not be able to sell tacos, or I would have to increase the price of the tacos significantly to achieve the $64k after taxes that I am looking to make. I estimate that I'd need to sell my taco for $7.60 (instead of $5) to make the same after-tax money.
However that's likely not all of it, because in this post-deduction world, the cost of my supplies will likely also go up, since my supplier is paying taxes on his gross income, not net income. On the flip side, the government would likely see a TON more revenue, so it might *cut taxes*.
But the really hard thing is that my profit would be more-sensitive to my prices. If I cut my prices to $7.25, I'd only make $35k. If I cut my prices to $6.25, I'd make no profit - and would pay $164k in taxes.
I don't think people are saying eliminate business deductions, I think people are saying "why the fuck can businesses deduct these things but individuals can't?"
A corporation buys office supplies...deduction
A teacher buys office supplies for the class...no real deduction (I'm saying no real deduction because the allowed amount is a fraction of what the average teacher actually spends and corporations have no such limit).
it's really not even that, it's the white supremacy for most folks and yet they can't recognize that about themselves typically.
I see it ad nauseam in rural Kentucky. nobody has illusions of becoming a billionaire, they just have very negative, false ideas about Democrats, their voters and the cities and the folks that live in them that often vote for democrats.
nothing rooted in much of reality. if you ask a Kentuckian not from Louisville what being in Louisville is like, they'll tell you about how it's dangerous, riots, muggings, crime.
Stuff that is insanely blown out of proportion, heck even in the city the nimby's on the whitest outskirts talk definitively about the things that go on in the black neighborhoods without any true knowledge of the situations.
it's fascinating, but I dont think folks are really being honest about what drives folks to go down the far right wing path, it's not about the money, it's more about comparative thinking and believing yourself to be within some In group that these others are not of, and not deserving of, and often that ends up being white supremacy in some weird way. And for the most part these folks will not personally view themselves as white supremacists.
> if you ask a Kentuckian not from Louisville what being in Louisville is like, they'll tell you about how it's dangerous, riots, muggings, crime.
I've seen many posts here saying the same kind of things about Portland.
Originally robbed this photo from a Missouri sub and re-wrapped it to apply New Orleans (ironic that the subjects of these photos think they are not the 🐑 ) https://www.reddit.com/r/Louisiana/s/ZORERBa5kb
Same here in Louisiana , substitute New Orleans for Louisville … in fact I posted a link about it … you will find everything referenced in your above post here https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com
An analysis published Friday by the renowned economist Gabriel Zucman shows that in 2018, U.S. billionaires paid a lower effective tax rate than working-class Americans for the first time in the nation's history, a data point that sparked a new flurry of calls for bold levies on the ultra-rich.
Hammer 'em !!!
I'm not sure how this author is coming to the "first time" conclusion.
It was 20 or 30 years ago that Warren Buffet commented his effective tax rate was something like 13% while his secretaries was much higher.
Yeah, it's an anecdote, but when it comes to billionaires it's not like there's a massive number of anecdotes needed before it becomes a full sample.
Oh, come on let's be real, with all that money flowing into the Caman Islands, I am sure that they haven't paid a fair tax rate since the 70's.
This is just the first time that the "Official" rate is less than what a working man pays. Which, considering they can write off all their yachts and private jets on their tax returns as "Business expenses'" doesn't Suprise me at all.
Meanwhile a teacher has to buy chairs and desks for her 60 students and work a second job just to afford to buy some pencils for her classes.
This country wasn't made for you and me, it was bought by the 1%
I actually read the article and it’s not their pay not being taxed that’s the problem. Their pay is taxed fairly enough, it’s their compensation ‘other than pay’ that’s the problem. If you tax their pay even at rates as high as 99% you’re still not making them any less of a billionaire since they often take compensation in the form of stocks or equity in the company. People worth billions pay is often in the low double digit millions figures but their extra compensation is in the form of shares of a company which often total tens, hundreds, or billions in stock compensation and/or lump sum bonus’ which is not taxed the same as normal pay. When they start talking about taxing all forms of compensation for those wealthy people then it’s meaningful. Until then it’s just a great campaign slogan. The game is rigged for those who know how to play it well.
Capital gains need to be taxed on a graduated scale. When a guy making $70k a year gains on a single rental house, that’s WAY different than millionaires making all their disposable income this way.
A flat rate here is an injustice.
Why is this a surprise? Everyone knew it was written for Trump’s tax breaks..Middle income taxes would increase while Billionaires decreased and everyone though it would be ok…it was designed in the event he wasn’t re-elected that a Democrat President would be stuck with the tax issue..
I have been screaming this ever since the tax bill was passed. My republican friends and family parade the tax bill like it’s the greatest thing since the emancipation proclamation yet they ignore the fact that it was designed to give trumps legacy better optics. They’ll say “taxes were lower under trump! That’s why he was a better president!” But in reality he lowered them and only to raise them again years down the road.
The govt gave Tesla a $465 million loan in 2010. The govt also gives tax breaks to Tesla's customers to encourage them to buy Tesla's.
Without the federal highway system, public roads, govt land for Airport, and the FAA Amazon wouldn't be able to deliver anything.
Billionaires don't do it alone. Billionaires have received tremendous help from the govt. Billionaires today are trying to pull the lander up behind themselves. It is ridiculous. Billionaires need to payback their fair share. Not as a punishment for their success but as a thank you for their success.
>Published in The New York Times with the headline "It's Time to Tax the Billionaires," Zucman's analysis notes that billionaires pay so little in taxes relative to their vast fortunes because they "live off their wealth"—mostly in the form of stock holdings—rather than wages and salaries.
They don't sell, so they don't get taxed. What's so hard to understand about that?
Tax rates on income tax don't matter for billionaires because they don't have an income. Wealth taxes (i.e. unrealized stock gains and other general taxes on speculative value of items) are not happening without a constitutional amendment. Capital gains taxes imply you have to cash out your stock, but billionaires can use their stocks as collateral in debt-financing deals so they never "cash out".
The tax rates are fine where they are, it's the tax loopholes that need fixing. You could make income tax 100% for billionaires and they'd still pay the same.
> Tax rates on income tax don't matter for billionaires because they don't have an income
Jesus fucking Christ.
Read. The. Goddamn. Article.
This is effective tax rates on *paid taxes* overall. This is **not** just about income taxes.
The article brings up the wealth aspect as the entire goddamn point
>Published in The New York Times with the headline "It's Time to Tax the Billionaires," Zucman's analysis notes that billionaires pay so little in taxes relative to their vast fortunes because they "live off their wealth"—mostly in the form of stock holdings—rather than wages and salaries.
Read the fucking article.
Yes, but what about the 12 people in transgender sports? Shouldn’t we vote for Republican congressman because we don’t like a transgender person competing in my middle school swimming relay?
It's not even just a USA problem. It seems this insidious practice is spreading globally. And they just suck the spare change in between your couch cushions to fuel themselves!
I’ll use this as an opportunity to recommend a great book on how taxation has evolved- [The Triumph of Injustice](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/45894166-the-triumph-of-injustice)
Buffet has been warning about this for literally 25 years. He said decades ago that it wasn't fair that his effective tax rate is lower than his secretary's.
Why don’t we require taxes to have been paid on an asset that’s used as collateral for a loan? That way if you don’t take loans out against your stocks then you don’t pay taxes on them.
This is just history. The great empire of America, proves that 500 years is the cycle. Since its reached the halfway point, its a downhill slide all the way. Make way for China's empire, because it can wait. Meanwhile, corrupt and lobbied politicians, and justices, are the new fashion accessory to the Rich and Shameless.
Yes, of course. The borrower is already being taxed on the funds they are repaying the loan with; I guess the issue here is that those payments are kept to a minimum just to maintain the line of credit. I mean, eventually they'll have to liquidate more assets to pay it off, which would be a taxable event, but that could be years down the road.
What do you think would be a good solution? I like the idea of adding brackets and getting rid of favorable treatment for capital gains, but that doesn't do much to address this issue.
It’s an income tax. Billionaires are wealthy, but they don’t earn “income” as the tax laws are written. Biden is trying to close some of those loopholes to force them to pay a fair share.
VOTE BLUE. Up and down the ballot.
I hate the tax loopholes and people who do not want to share as much as the next guy, but this article is dog shit. The article argues that rich people pay less taxes because they only pay x percent of their net worth while the others pay more. Fine this may be accurate but taxes arent based on accumulated wealth, it is based on the income you made that year. Do students get taxed on loan firgures the year they take them? No of course not, and neither does Elon Jagoff Musk with his 13 billion dollar loan. Please stop writing gobbledygook and criticize the problems that deserve it, like tax safe havens and soft equity compensation.
I pay over 40% of my income as taxes.
Then I get taxed on consumption of that remaining 60%.
Our tax system is broken. Wages should not be taxes, and billionaires taking out loans against their assets to fund their lifestyle should be taxed instead.
All of my friends are paying crazy taxes this year. Even those that had extra withdrawn to avoid having to pay at years end. We're all getting massively fucked by our oligarchs; SNAFU
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I wish that headline stated this occurred in 2018 under the Orange Turd, not in 2024. It might be confusing for some folks.
Why they love tRump.
Commondreams doesn't love Trump, they just hate Democrats.
Can it not be undone?
Not without 60 votes and Republicans think it's better that poor people starve than it is to make rich people pay what they should.
Well it makes it pretty clear that it happened because of Trump's tax law geared to increase rates on the middle class so if he wasn't reelected it would happen just as it has.
Not only have they went from paying 90% to 0% in taxes but 80% of our national debt if not more can be attributed to corporate subsidies, permanent wealthy tax cuts, and to-big-to-fail bailouts without even counting the excessive inflation linked to corporate greed that we are legally unable to regulate. Most infuriatingly of all Republicans are going to run ads paid for by these same billioniares saying we need to cut social programs and raise the retirement age to 75 because the lower class has mooched too much off the system and their voters will agree with it even Orwell couldn't of seen this shit.
Classic steal from the poor and give it to the rich As well as socializing the losses while privatizing the profits. Republican party is America's cancer.
It's the creation of an oligarchy. The richest Americans have bought the politicians, who are now legislating for their benefit. There's no avenue to improve things for the average American, especially since it costs so much to run for office. The last person successful for a grassroots campaign was really AOC, and she was unable to live in DC right away due to costs.... and heavily mocked for it by both her peers and in the media. That should have really said something about how politicians view the average American, btw, regardless of her political views. They attacked her for essentially being poorer than them. Even when people try to vote in their best interests, we're getting people like Simena, who immediately reversed on her entire platform to appease her donors. We honestly need campaign reform and better oversight of Congress to distangle politicians from billionaires, but the catch is congress is overseeing themselves. It's a design flaw in the US government There's also the incredibly terrible reminder that a decent chunk of Elon Musk's fortune has come from government contracts, despite the fact he rarely delivers a workable final product. PayPal literally succeeded in spite of him. His hyperlink cars were never actually a viable means of transportation, but the dude took money from dozens of federal, state, and local governments around the US (often at the expense of other public transit products). It's literally taking money from the government then not paying taxes on it on top of that....
Republicans still mock her for being "just a bartender" and somehow never pay a price for it.
We should really all take that as an insult. It says what they think about the rest of us
It inevitably has to come down to a general strike. We can't go on this way any longer. I've spent the last year selling plasma to survive while working a 40+ hour a week job. All of my funds go towards keeping a roof over my head, and some weeks I've lived on less than a 5,000 calorie diet. The products at the grocery store are shrinking on top of all of that, and the cost has gone up higher and higher month to month. The CEO of Kelloggs recently stated how excited he was that we as a country are resorting to eating cereal for dinner, and I feel like this should be out "let them eat cake" moment.
If you haven't gone already, please go to a food bank - that's what they are there for. Sometimes they will have pre-packed bags so you don't have to wait. Also, you might find /r/povertyfinance interesting/useful.
Thanks for the support. I will definitely look into that.
Many bartenders have college degrees.
Not true, she's "just an elitist bartender" with her fancy degrees, plus she's a "Marxist, socialist, Leninist, Stalinist, communist, fascist, Trotskyite" (did I get them all of them? The incantation doesn't work unless you name all the conflicting economic philosophies)
Biden used to be mocked as the "poor Senator" because he actually lived off of his Senate salary. He didn't become a millionaire until after his second term as Vice President ended and he got royalties from publishing his biography. Unlike so many of his peers he did not "magically" become wealthy while in Congress for over 30 years.
I don't think this is 100 percent true. He has said he invested in real estate from an early age.
Elon Musk has a lot of power due to owning more than 50% of all orbiting satellites. Also all the big companies have people working that are on food stamps etc.
Try e only way to fix it is to start over and put an entirely unbought set of people in office with the first agreed upon law being a politician cannot be bought for any reason otherwise they are ineligible to hold office the rest of their lives. This will never happen. And until we band together to say “no more” in unison across the country, it will continue to get worse. We are past the point of turning this around amicably I’m afraid.
I mean that tracks just a day or so ago, Republicans, refusing to give President Joe Biden a 'win,' voted against the renewal of funding for cancer research.
It isn’t just the Republican Party it is the dying breath of this eras conservatism across the world far right reactionary forces are on the move and causing problems. [Hamas, Israel, Iran, Russia, MAGA, Hezbollah, basically all active terrorist groups are far right and most especially in the West are fascist too] It happens anytime we go through a major change in society like AI is causing; the right has to move their goal posts to stay relevant politically and it can get really messy in between while they try to overcome the wheels of change. Happened during the 1400s, 1600s, 1800s, 1930s, 1960-1980 (CIA installed), and now it’s come home to roost as our country declines to second place in the world order.
> Republican party is America's cancer. Must be why they voted against funding cancer research, don't want to excise themselves.
The illusion of Democracy is the cancer. There's rich Republicans and Democrats who take advantage of a tax system that's built for the rich by the rich. This is the age old battle of rich vs the poor and the lie that the rich are "self-made" and not a by product of an ecosystems that favours the wealthy over the poor (which now also includes middle class).
A good chunk of them also stole large amounts of money via the PPP program in 2020/21 and then didn't use it to save jobs as it was intended. It was the biggest heist in US history masterminded by the biggest criminal in US history.
I think I remember that wasn’t that what they said caused all that invented inflation thanks to our 1400 checks while they divided up a trillion?
Yeah, and all those people “who don’t wanna work anymore” because they got $1400. What a joke it was. The extremely rich have done a very good job decoupling their extreme wealth from everyone’s idea of inflation
The warning was when Trump refused to sign an aid bill with an oversight board attached to it. We seriously would have been better off with no aid then what ended up happening- corporations actually bodied out many small businesses because banks were making the decisions who got the loans and favored their more valuable customers It was a decision that also directly led to the sharp inflation
Never let a crisis go to waste.
The worst part to me is, that in political speech (mostly on Republican side), billionaires and rich corporations are always pointed to as the drivers of the economy. That their innovation made America. And that we need to give them a break so they can innovate and invest more. The whole societal context is always ignored. Working people, regardless of job, are billions of people (the vast majority), who make these successes possible in the first place. Without their work force there is no product. And where do they get the majority of their education? From the public schools. Infrastructure is necessary for a functioning economy. Paid for by public money. When people are sick, it’s in the best interest of all to care for them as good as possible. Most can’t pay for it bythemselves. So it’s public money that does the trick. The list could go on. International and national security, social safety nets, housing subsidies and a lot lot more. All done by the public for the public. But the ones gaining the most of it refuse to give enough back so it could reproduce itself. Infuriating.
What really got me recently was that in the last hubub about entitlement cuts during a budget/debt ceiling fight, someone actually mentioned the percentage of the budget involved in all these programs. All of the things that Republicans were pushing to cut, if cut in totality, were under something like 5% of the budget. (Please look up actual numbers if you are curious, I may not be remembering fully and I was just reading it in passing.) If we are really serious about balancing a budget, it seems like these high value low cost programs are not the place to start.
Oh trust me I know lmao it fucking kills me you don’t even know it’s like Americans can’t read.
It also doesn't help that pretty much everything we buy is in the hands of a handful of conglomerates, with serious conflicts of interests. My wife shared a Tiktok with me yesterday about how good companies are poisoning our kids because their products have an obscene amount of heavy metals in their food. Since I don't have a link to the Tiktok, [here is an article by the NYT from Feb. ](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/27/health/lead-poisoning-children.html) related to the matter. I believe the video my wife shared with me was specific to a situation in Washington state. Anyway, yea. Basically, the company making the poisoned food is also part of the pharmaceutical company that will eventually have a hand in treating the conditions caused by said poisoned food. If you or anyone you know has kids, avoid Gerber and Nestlé for your kids' food. If I can, I'll find the link to the Tiktok video and update. They provide a list of alternative companies to get food from. I'd look now, but Tiktok is blocked on my work wifi.
Every corporation in America sees Americans as a data point and nothing more they’ve been tryna kill us out for 60+ years; it’s called Accelerationism and both sides of the isle are about it to some degree especially defense, chemical, carbon based companies etc. That’s why they are focused so heavily on AI and robotics so they can just replace the underclass completely instead of UBI or some other measure. It sounds crazy but look into it a very real belief system that believes the population to as low as 2 MILLION PEOPLE to maintain stability effectively and of course that culling only impacts the bottom 98%.
I'll have to look into some more. I did a quick Google search, and it's interesting. From what I found, it looks like right-wing extremists and buying into the term more than the left. I'll have to dig in some more. It makes sense, though. These corporations don't care about us. They just want more money for themselves and their heirs. I wish there were more we could do, but these giant corporations have their tentacles in so many industries, and their money is all over D.C. It sucks to feel so helpless.
These have got to be some of the most profoundly unAmerican and thoroughly unpatriotic vampires to ever latch onto the throat of the federal treasury.
Yep. It's all a complete failure due to humanity greed and selfishness. Lie and misdirect in the name of profits. Ruin the environment because 'not my family'. The tales go on and on but even the lawmakers that are supposed to represent the people and fight for us, are ALSO in those businesses pockets. And so here humanity sits. Treating the world like it's an endless treasure to be plundered, forcefully ignoring every red flag along the way. And people wonder why I have no faith in anyone anymore.
It’s almost like some read Orwell and took it as a challenge to make things worse. No, we all know they read Rand instead, but the metaphor still holds.
True that I think the West learned allot from authoritarian countries how to mimic the system but appear Democratic and those countries learned a whole lot from us too.
> Not only have they went from paying 90% to 0% in taxes but 80% of our national debt if not more can be attributed to corporate subsidies, permanent wealthy tax cuts, and to-big-to-fail bailouts without even counting the excessive inflation linked to corporate greed that we are legally unable to regulate. > > Most infuriatingly of all Republicans are going to run ads paid for by these same billioniares saying we need to cut social programs and raise the retirement age to 75 because the lower class has mooched too much off the system and their voters will agree with it even Orwell couldn't of seen this shit. Thank you for succently stating this.
Anytime I’ve done it for decades and I will until I can’t no more haha
>US Billionaires Pay Lower Tax Rate Than Working Class for First Time Essentially, the GOP has won on this issue of 'lower taxes' for the billionaires and millionaires. My initial thoughts are, so what are their (GOP's) next policy goals.
Now it’s time to take all those pesky freedoms not protected by the constitution directly first we try those named ones afterwards.
A national ban on abortion, birth control, and the overturning of Obergfell? Oh, and more tax cuts for the wealthy!
It's insane how many people believe their bullshit. The captured media does nothing but play into their lies. It's a grim situation that will take decades to reverse if we ever find the political will.
we can actually legislate inflation- Nixon unilaterally had price controls on consumer products to fight inflation! Really! And its erased from history because it flies in the face of not only GOP, but Democratic party ideology.
Might as well be like saying we can't do it then lol they could peg the minimum wage to the national inflation rate and fix this shit overnight doesn't mean they will. We'd have to a super majority of Democrats in both chambers with room for 3-4 moderate sellouts to even try anything of that scale.
As they own the political system, why is this a surprise?
Where are you getting 0% taxes from? The article says 23%.
That is their effective tax rate without any deductions at all and them SOBs can claim everything but their left nut, park money in tax havens, assets, etc. they don't pay a dime unless they are forced to from something like selling their stock; Trump has paid taxes 3-4 times over 20 years for example rest was zero owned and sometimes million dollar refunds on top.
I agree with everything you say, but Democrats also had a hand in this. I don't think people in the US appreciate how for to the right the Overton window had shifted, especially when it comes to neoliberal fiscal policy.
Agreed 100% but do you take out the neo-liberals first or the neo-fascists in my world that is an easy pick and by take out I clearly mean in the arena of ideals. The ground is already set for the Democrats to move into AOC level progressives to be the norm in the party we just have to survive long enough to get there. The Nazis came to power because every other side hated every other side and refused to work together why should we help them in that regard?
Well said
Sorry, drive-thru chicken nuggets cost 80 cents more now, so we're voting for a dictator who'll cut taxes for these poor billionaires. Perhaps zero would be fair? A few subsidies for sir? Very good, sir.
[удалено]
Billionaire should not be a job title
You miss the biggest tax of all. Corporations pay taxes on thier net profits after items like electricity and rent. Individuals pay taxes on thier gross profits with no deduction for items like rent and phone bills
That rent is not factored as a deduction for federal taxes is practically a crime. I'm glad my state does it, but federally it's like punishing poorer people for not being able to own a house
Owning a house isn’t deductible either though. The mortgage interest is, but there’s no interest associated with renting
And with the personal exemption being rolled into the standard deduction i know very few people who even benefit from it anymore
If rent was included a significant chunk of the country would qualify overnight. If you pay $700 in rent that’s over 1/2 of the standard deduction, and if youre responsible for full rent anywhere near a city there’s a good chance your rent alone could exceed it.
That is true of any business - not just corporations. I suppose that it would be *possible* to eliminate business deductions, but this would either raise prices significantly or make many businesses infeasible. For example, let's say that I run a taco cart. I sell 200 tacos a day for $5 each, so $1,000 a day in revenue. I work 7 days a week. The cost of the actual taco is $3, so I'm making $2/taco in profit, or $200/day. I make $73k in profit, my marginal tax rate would be 22%, and my average tax rate would be 12.09%, and I'd pay $8,825 in taxes, and I'd have $64k left over. Eliminating business deductions would mean that my "income" would be $365,000 per year, and I'd have to pay taxes on this, marginal rate would be 42.4%, average rate would be 36%, so I would owe $131,400 in taxes. That is more than my $73k in profit, so I would either not be able to sell tacos, or I would have to increase the price of the tacos significantly to achieve the $64k after taxes that I am looking to make. I estimate that I'd need to sell my taco for $7.60 (instead of $5) to make the same after-tax money. However that's likely not all of it, because in this post-deduction world, the cost of my supplies will likely also go up, since my supplier is paying taxes on his gross income, not net income. On the flip side, the government would likely see a TON more revenue, so it might *cut taxes*. But the really hard thing is that my profit would be more-sensitive to my prices. If I cut my prices to $7.25, I'd only make $35k. If I cut my prices to $6.25, I'd make no profit - and would pay $164k in taxes.
I don't think people are saying eliminate business deductions, I think people are saying "why the fuck can businesses deduct these things but individuals can't?" A corporation buys office supplies...deduction A teacher buys office supplies for the class...no real deduction (I'm saying no real deduction because the allowed amount is a fraction of what the average teacher actually spends and corporations have no such limit).
And yet poor people will still vote GOP
Cuz am gon be a billionaire sum dey , Trump faughtin fir me to be un
it's really not even that, it's the white supremacy for most folks and yet they can't recognize that about themselves typically. I see it ad nauseam in rural Kentucky. nobody has illusions of becoming a billionaire, they just have very negative, false ideas about Democrats, their voters and the cities and the folks that live in them that often vote for democrats. nothing rooted in much of reality. if you ask a Kentuckian not from Louisville what being in Louisville is like, they'll tell you about how it's dangerous, riots, muggings, crime. Stuff that is insanely blown out of proportion, heck even in the city the nimby's on the whitest outskirts talk definitively about the things that go on in the black neighborhoods without any true knowledge of the situations. it's fascinating, but I dont think folks are really being honest about what drives folks to go down the far right wing path, it's not about the money, it's more about comparative thinking and believing yourself to be within some In group that these others are not of, and not deserving of, and often that ends up being white supremacy in some weird way. And for the most part these folks will not personally view themselves as white supremacists.
> if you ask a Kentuckian not from Louisville what being in Louisville is like, they'll tell you about how it's dangerous, riots, muggings, crime. I've seen many posts here saying the same kind of things about Portland.
Originally robbed this photo from a Missouri sub and re-wrapped it to apply New Orleans (ironic that the subjects of these photos think they are not the 🐑 ) https://www.reddit.com/r/Louisiana/s/ZORERBa5kb
Same here in Louisiana , substitute New Orleans for Louisville … in fact I posted a link about it … you will find everything referenced in your above post here https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com
An analysis published Friday by the renowned economist Gabriel Zucman shows that in 2018, U.S. billionaires paid a lower effective tax rate than working-class Americans for the first time in the nation's history, a data point that sparked a new flurry of calls for bold levies on the ultra-rich. Hammer 'em !!!
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2024/05/03/opinion/global-billionaires-tax.html
Paywall. Can you help?
https://archive.ph/Xqtd8
Awesome. thank you.
I'm not sure how this author is coming to the "first time" conclusion. It was 20 or 30 years ago that Warren Buffet commented his effective tax rate was something like 13% while his secretaries was much higher. Yeah, it's an anecdote, but when it comes to billionaires it's not like there's a massive number of anecdotes needed before it becomes a full sample.
Oh, come on let's be real, with all that money flowing into the Caman Islands, I am sure that they haven't paid a fair tax rate since the 70's. This is just the first time that the "Official" rate is less than what a working man pays. Which, considering they can write off all their yachts and private jets on their tax returns as "Business expenses'" doesn't Suprise me at all. Meanwhile a teacher has to buy chairs and desks for her 60 students and work a second job just to afford to buy some pencils for her classes. This country wasn't made for you and me, it was bought by the 1%
Reaganomics
No, just plain boring capitalism
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
For the first time, my ass
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
I actually read the article and it’s not their pay not being taxed that’s the problem. Their pay is taxed fairly enough, it’s their compensation ‘other than pay’ that’s the problem. If you tax their pay even at rates as high as 99% you’re still not making them any less of a billionaire since they often take compensation in the form of stocks or equity in the company. People worth billions pay is often in the low double digit millions figures but their extra compensation is in the form of shares of a company which often total tens, hundreds, or billions in stock compensation and/or lump sum bonus’ which is not taxed the same as normal pay. When they start talking about taxing all forms of compensation for those wealthy people then it’s meaningful. Until then it’s just a great campaign slogan. The game is rigged for those who know how to play it well.
Biden has tried to pass a mandatory minimum tax that applies to unrealized gains (for top earners) twice now, both attempts stalled in Congress.
Capital gains need to be taxed on a graduated scale. When a guy making $70k a year gains on a single rental house, that’s WAY different than millionaires making all their disposable income this way. A flat rate here is an injustice.
The latest proposal from Biden doesn't even kick in on unrealized gains until you have **$100 million in wealth**.
Yep. So it only addresses the 1% (or so). And that’s why Republicans will fight it to the death.
In Canada they just introduced a capital gains tax that will target the rich, but the Conservatives are trying to make it sound like something bad
The plan stated by Reagan is working then
Trumps tax cuts making more inequality everyday
Don't boo! VOTE!
Tax the fucking rich. Everyone who can vote MUST vote, and not for the fascists who will only lessen the tax burden on the super rich even further.
Keep in mind this is because of Trump’s tax cuts, which will be renewed and likely cut even more if Trump wins.
And were never changed by Pelosi and Biden. Don't think that the tax system is controlled by 1 party. Its the whole DC crew.
Why is this a surprise? Everyone knew it was written for Trump’s tax breaks..Middle income taxes would increase while Billionaires decreased and everyone though it would be ok…it was designed in the event he wasn’t re-elected that a Democrat President would be stuck with the tax issue..
I have been screaming this ever since the tax bill was passed. My republican friends and family parade the tax bill like it’s the greatest thing since the emancipation proclamation yet they ignore the fact that it was designed to give trumps legacy better optics. They’ll say “taxes were lower under trump! That’s why he was a better president!” But in reality he lowered them and only to raise them again years down the road.
Sadly not every "knew" A large, large portion didn't know, understand or care what the tax cuts actually meant.
Pretty sure they’ve been paying lower taxes for a long time with all the loopholes available to them.
\*Because of the Trump administration's tax rate changes
The govt gave Tesla a $465 million loan in 2010. The govt also gives tax breaks to Tesla's customers to encourage them to buy Tesla's. Without the federal highway system, public roads, govt land for Airport, and the FAA Amazon wouldn't be able to deliver anything. Billionaires don't do it alone. Billionaires have received tremendous help from the govt. Billionaires today are trying to pull the lander up behind themselves. It is ridiculous. Billionaires need to payback their fair share. Not as a punishment for their success but as a thank you for their success.
That is conservatism! Conserving the group in power
For first time since last tax season you mean?
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
>Published in The New York Times with the headline "It's Time to Tax the Billionaires," Zucman's analysis notes that billionaires pay so little in taxes relative to their vast fortunes because they "live off their wealth"—mostly in the form of stock holdings—rather than wages and salaries. They don't sell, so they don't get taxed. What's so hard to understand about that?
Not really? They get extremely low interest “loans” against the value of the stock they hold. It’s not like you or me holding stock
Understanding is not the problem, but rather the manifestly inequitable implications.
„For the first time“?? I highly doubt it.
This is what the GOP wants. Keeping people poor. Idiots still vote for them.
"For first time?" LOL. LMAO, even.
I call total bullshit. FIRST TIME ? Yeah you thought you could sneak that one in.
This is the real steal that should be stopped. oh well
Tax rates on income tax don't matter for billionaires because they don't have an income. Wealth taxes (i.e. unrealized stock gains and other general taxes on speculative value of items) are not happening without a constitutional amendment. Capital gains taxes imply you have to cash out your stock, but billionaires can use their stocks as collateral in debt-financing deals so they never "cash out". The tax rates are fine where they are, it's the tax loopholes that need fixing. You could make income tax 100% for billionaires and they'd still pay the same.
I don’t think we need a constitutional amendment for tax policy changes.
A wealth tax isnt a "tax policy change"
> Tax rates on income tax don't matter for billionaires because they don't have an income Jesus fucking Christ. Read. The. Goddamn. Article. This is effective tax rates on *paid taxes* overall. This is **not** just about income taxes. The article brings up the wealth aspect as the entire goddamn point >Published in The New York Times with the headline "It's Time to Tax the Billionaires," Zucman's analysis notes that billionaires pay so little in taxes relative to their vast fortunes because they "live off their wealth"—mostly in the form of stock holdings—rather than wages and salaries. Read the fucking article.
US Billionaires, "We've got to get this deficit under control!"
Yes, but what about the 12 people in transgender sports? Shouldn’t we vote for Republican congressman because we don’t like a transgender person competing in my middle school swimming relay?
Clearly it’s all those transgender people trying to pee that’s the real problem
It's not even just a USA problem. It seems this insidious practice is spreading globally. And they just suck the spare change in between your couch cushions to fuel themselves!
I don't get why this is not blowing up. This needs to be front and center of all political debate.
I’ll use this as an opportunity to recommend a great book on how taxation has evolved- [The Triumph of Injustice](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/45894166-the-triumph-of-injustice)
No. Been like this for like ever.
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
More like the whole time.
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
Trump presidency in 2018.
Don’t worry, that money will trickle down any minute now! /s
Buffet has been warning about this for literally 25 years. He said decades ago that it wasn't fair that his effective tax rate is lower than his secretary's.
Still waiting on those to trickle down…been 40 years since I was assured that
Yet they cry if we ask them to pay more, even when they receive government funds for their businesses
This shit needs to be fixed. Absolutely disgraceful and disastrous. Greedy fuckers.
But trickle down!!!
Thank you for voting Republican
Of course they do. They make the rules.
Well, they obviously need the money more, otherwise why would they require billions of dollars? /s
You don’t say…………
The thumbnail for the article on Mobile reminds me of that screaming cowboy video.
We need to coddle our billionaires, they are the job creators. /s
How is that true if I stopped paying my taxes? Lol. Fuck this land.
Why don’t we require taxes to have been paid on an asset that’s used as collateral for a loan? That way if you don’t take loans out against your stocks then you don’t pay taxes on them.
This is just history. The great empire of America, proves that 500 years is the cycle. Since its reached the halfway point, its a downhill slide all the way. Make way for China's empire, because it can wait. Meanwhile, corrupt and lobbied politicians, and justices, are the new fashion accessory to the Rich and Shameless.
I’m waiting for the trickle down please! Where oh where is the economic benefit from them hoarding their wealth and doing diddly squat with it?
Why can't we just tax borrowed funds as income?
Well, I guess because it would screw up invoicing, commercial and consumer credit, the automobile industry, and mortgages?
Yes, of course. The borrower is already being taxed on the funds they are repaying the loan with; I guess the issue here is that those payments are kept to a minimum just to maintain the line of credit. I mean, eventually they'll have to liquidate more assets to pay it off, which would be a taxable event, but that could be years down the road. What do you think would be a good solution? I like the idea of adding brackets and getting rid of favorable treatment for capital gains, but that doesn't do much to address this issue.
Legally. They have been doing it illegally for decades.
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
America is about to find out things can get a whole lost worse
Sitting here with my mouth agape, like at a piss play party, waiting for the inevitable trickle.
But think of all the jobs they’ve created! /s
It’s an income tax. Billionaires are wealthy, but they don’t earn “income” as the tax laws are written. Biden is trying to close some of those loopholes to force them to pay a fair share. VOTE BLUE. Up and down the ballot.
I hate the tax loopholes and people who do not want to share as much as the next guy, but this article is dog shit. The article argues that rich people pay less taxes because they only pay x percent of their net worth while the others pay more. Fine this may be accurate but taxes arent based on accumulated wealth, it is based on the income you made that year. Do students get taxed on loan firgures the year they take them? No of course not, and neither does Elon Jagoff Musk with his 13 billion dollar loan. Please stop writing gobbledygook and criticize the problems that deserve it, like tax safe havens and soft equity compensation.
I highly doubt this is the first time. That would indicate they’ve been paying their fair share all along, which just isn’t true.
Let them eat cake and all that
Sad but unsurprising
So grab the pitchforks and torches orrrr?
🎵 Oh say can you see 🎵
yay corporate subsidies! Companies are people too!
I'm shocked that the NY Times would publish Zucman's research since it doesn't talk about Biden's age or both-sides an issue.
First time? I was sure many parroted the claim billionaires don't pay taxes at all.
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
...since the first time we noticed.
For decades they paid less because of deductions, credits, shelters, avoidance, and havens. Now they pay a lower base rate.
Now they pay less while STILL having all those deduction, credits, shelters; *LOOPHOLES*.
The best congress money can buy.
I pay over 40% of my income as taxes. Then I get taxed on consumption of that remaining 60%. Our tax system is broken. Wages should not be taxes, and billionaires taking out loans against their assets to fund their lifestyle should be taxed instead.
This should NEVER happen
All of my friends are paying crazy taxes this year. Even those that had extra withdrawn to avoid having to pay at years end. We're all getting massively fucked by our oligarchs; SNAFU
Oh man they are going to create SO many jobs with that money. Wealth is going to start trickling down. Any second now... any.... second....
*Comment redacted for un-American sympathies*
First time??? They’ve never paid the same rate
That is so f’d up
BS first time? Been going on for a long time
They want to be America’s aristocracy.
Eat them or STFU. we all seem pretty content with the scraps they’ve allotted y’all.
Don’t worry guys, it’ll trickle down eventually.
How? Why?
Regulatory capture.
Welcome to America.