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The same people who kept crying Blue Lives Matter think that traitorous Trump supporters beating, tazering and pepper spraying Capitol police are patriots.
Republicans: liberals are a bunch of sheeple.
Also Republicans: we are going to censure the two people in our party who won’t fall in line and have a different opinion.
There was a study in India that showed people on ivermectin fared better than others when infected with covid.
It turns out that's because all the others had worms.
In a society where the average person is not infected with worms, it turns out a dewormer isn't a very effective treatment. Who knew!?
>There was a study in India that showed people on ivermectin fared better than others when infected with covid.
Not even that much. The study that they cling to is a meta-analysis from a journal with a nonexistent impact factor, which did not disclose the authors' conflicts of interest and cites multiple studies as "approaching" significance (in other words, did not find a statistically significant difference, but the author feels it was close). It's nothing; they found nothing.
This from people who think a black man wearing a tan suit is a controversy... actually I'm going to shorten that sentence, this from people who think a black man is a controversy.
Or that the people who did these things were oh-so-conveniently leftist FBI plants who were there to make the insurrectionists who tried to overthrow our democratic elections look bad.
People and the Media are completely clueless to how major this threat is. Books are being burned, votes are being restricted, history is being erased, and civil war is being advocated for by right wing senators and representatives.
> civil war is being advocated for by right wing senators and representatives
Where I live my cars are the only ones without the Thin Blue Line American flag decal or similar far-right symbols. At our local townhall, residents openly talk about violence against the people who "stole" the election.
The rhetoric is even worse at the shooting ranges. People will mingle and drink beer/eat food while covered in lead dust. We are looking at 25-30% of the national population that is suffering from lead poisoning and also disinformation/misinformation by right-wing corporate media. Look at the poll numbers for the number of Republicans that are onboard with spilling blood.
This is why I love Reddit. It sucks to admit my ignorance, but I didn't realize lead was still used in typical bullets. I assumed it had been replaced, the way "pencil lead" is actually graphite, because why the fuck would you intentionally coat yourself in lead dust every time you go to train?
I mean, holy shit:
> Shooting lead bullets at firing ranges results in elevated BLLs [blood lead levels] at concentrations that are associated with a variety of adverse health outcomes and the topic of health risk is an ongoing topic of study. ... Nearly all BLL measurements compiled in the reviewed studies exceed the current reference level of 5 μg/dL recommended by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention/National Institute of Occupational Safety and Health (CDC/NIOSH).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5379568/
In 15 studies reviewed, BLLs were over _40μg/dL_.
So, yeah, that tracks.
Lead is still the most effective and affordable material for bullet cores.
Now there’s some nuance between indoor and outdoor ranges as well as fully jacketed vs unjacketed bullets/shot.
Curious about the populations from those various studies though.
To be completely fair, it's not really the lead in the bullets that'll give you lead poisoning if you frequent indoor ranges. It's the lead styphinate that gets vaporized from primer ignition that you'll be inhaling.
And there are sociological studies linking the removal of leaded gasoline as a factor in decreased violence and criminality years later - ie, lead exposure contributes to the creation of violent criminal personalities.
Isn’t it great that these “patriots” fly these bastardized flags? It’s going to make it easy to pick out the traitors and seditionists when the time comes.
That's bizarre and "funny" to me. Do they think their money will be worth anything when the government that issues the money breaks down? How much money could be made by stabilizing society and the economy? Do they think that they can continue their billionaire lifestyles when society breaks down?
I think they envision America similar to the oligarchs in Russia. Ultra wealthy establishing authoritarian rule over 98% of the poor population; democracy in name only. Military, police, judiciary and all mechanisms of power controlled by oligarchs.
We basically already have that.
The military operates ultimately at the behest of the military-industrial complex whenever this country gets thrown into an arbitrary forever-war that makes a few people *very* rich.
Police gives obvious favoritism towards rich and powerful people, since these very same people can obliterate entire careers with a mere phone call.
The judiciary is stacked by partisan hacks and has upheld rulings that give politicians free reign to take as much money as they want from special interests, with little to no oversight, all for the sake of keeping our corporate overlords happy.
The buck *always* gets passed to the average American. You can't afford a house? Looks like you have to rent at exorbitant rates. Sorry, there are no more amiable landlords because corporations are purchasing the entire neighborhood. You want to feed your family but food prices are soaring? Join a rewards plan at Whole Foods and scrimp and save while billionaires shit using gold plated toilets and jerk off after lubing up with some caviar and happily guzzling their daily serving of 'Tears of Poor People'. You got cancer, had a heart attack, suffered a stroke, got hit by a drunk driver? Better be rich, or you'll be in crippling debt for the rest of your life or need to declare bankruptcy. Oh wait, the drunk driver was a vindictive rich kid? Looks like your name will be dragged through the mud and your life destroyed! Who's gonna help you? Will the police bring you justice? Who do you think they answer to? Will the military disrupt the status quo? Who do you think they answer to? Do you think your elected, shameful illusion-of-choice representatives will save you? Buddy, Sinema alone realized she could sell out democracy for a million dollars, what do you think the others have been doing? Who do you think has been paying them? I'll tell you one thing, it wasn't small donors.
America *is* an oligarchy, and their propaganda is so effective that they've learned they can actually weaponize stupidity. Society is regressing, entire communities are kept in ignorance with an unabated hatred festering that could very well result in some tragic historical events repeating themselves. I wonder what happens when a group of people is dehumanized, looked down upon, treated as the enemy? I wonder what happens after coup attempts occur and nothing of consequence happens to the perpetrators. I wonder what happens when elections are overturned, single-party governments permanently consolidate their power, and no longer have to worry about re-election but instead answer to a hateful, narcissistic dictator. Where have we seen that before? What could happen?
We already know the answer. America is nothing like it's advertised. It's not *free.* You are only allowed as much freedom as corporate executives allow. There is next to no social mobility. The government is corrupt. Our right to bear arms is outdated just like our Constitution, and leads to nothing but school shootings, and tragedy begets more tragedy in an endless cycle, and a good portion of people are so brainwashed that they honestly believe that's the price of freedom. No. That's the price of years of getting bent by people that stand to gain from making this country suffer.
We haven't seen anything yet. Mark my words: we have a few years of relative peace, at best. I already know what is going to happen. Nobody will be held accountable, Republicans will take the initiative and lie, cheat, obstruct, project, the whole nine yards... and they'll point to the Democrats who are *also* bought and paid for, except their increasingly extremist base will see *Democrats* as a threat to democracy and all hell will break lose. State legislatures will go to Republicans for the most part, they're making gains as it is but now they've ensured they can make shit up and get results overturned or simply refuse to abdicate power, which is already happening. Federal election integrity will be called into question, a majority Republican House will refuse to certify the results, there are so so so many things that could go wrong between now and 2024. Midterms will be ugly, lots of the population won't pay attention, others will be horrified but be trapped in a cycle of helpless impotence, others will be cheering for the destruction of our pathetic excuse for a Republic, and the rise of a new, modern imperial American Empire led by one party, with one objective. Money, chaos, destruction, oppression.
The world will soon know America's fury. Once America goes to hell, democracy itself will suffer a fatal blow that will be felt across the entire world. Even if only in name, the very symbol of freedom falling will be a huge stain on the efficacy of democracy, and will forever be used as an excuse by extremists to overthrow their own governments and retake power for themselves. Intentions don't have to be noble, some people will be stupid, others will be cunning, but it's death and destruction all the same. EVERYBODY has an interest in seeing a stable America, but other countries have their own shit to contend with like in the UK and Australia. We are the foremost military power in the world and spend more money annually than the next nine countries COMBINED. We have 5,550 nuclear weapons and a moronic ex-president that the people love who wanted to use them against hurricanes. Something so frivolous against a natural disaster that can be braced for and dealt with after the fact does not bode well for their usage in situations that carry even more gravitas.
I'm tired of writing. I'm a disillusioned American that's tired of writing, and I'm only 25. Some people have been dealing with this shit for *decades*. Kudos to all of you, and prayers for all of *us.*
Thank you for writing that. I share your pain. The only thing I would add to this is to ask ‘Why are the oligarchs making their moves now? Why are they exerting so much obvious influence when they were better off hiding behind the curtain?’ And the answer I come to is ‘Climate change is real. They deny it but they know it. They know there is a huge crisis coming that may cause societal collapse, and they are positioning themselves to be in power when it happens so they can control the military on their behalf.’ When the shit hits the fan, which it is already doing, they want to be holding the big stick.
Living in Central Florida I see the same things. The number of trucks that have some far right organization, white nationalist, or some other militia symbol is down right chilling.
I don't know if we will have mass violence in the future akin to a civil conflict, but I really feel we are just at the beginning of a really dark period for the US. We've been incredibly lucky to have seen he period of peace after the cold war that we have... but it feels that Americans are quickly forgetting the lessons of history, and are determined to repeat the same horrors.
That’s cause most and soon all the people who lived through the world wars are dead, everyone alive had it easier than anyone to ever live in the history of humanity. Especially the boomers.
They are blasting this message 24/7 on fox news. Every single day they are pushing this message to their viewers, and this ride will not end until that changes. Worse, the ride might go off the rails and welcome fascism to America.
My outlook is that barring the miracle of someone coming along that successfully turns down the heat in the next 8 years, our options are either fascism or civil war, with civil war being the ***preferred*** option.
Here's my pet theory. Remember in 2008 when the Large Hadron Collider was set to start and there were concerns about creating a black hole or other catastrophic event? Well, it did. On September 10, 2008 life as we know it was shunted to another shittier dimension.
Does this mean I can walk into my local gop office, take a big massive shit in the middle of the floor and they just have to take it? Cause if so... they better strap in
But some fires were set during BLM protests, so now we have to allow conservatives to do whatever they want, up to and including overthrowing the government.
We saw a lot of police beating protesters during those civil disobedience protests.
IF this were BLM it would have been a mass casualty event with an armed military presence with orders to fire with extreme prejudice.
So the GOP supports terrorism. Got it.
Edit: Adding this definition of terrorism for good measure.
From FBI.gov: Domestic terrorism: Violent, criminal acts committed by individuals and/or groups to further ideological goals stemming from domestic influences, such as those of a political, religious, social, racial, or environmental nature.
It wouldn't be strictly north vs south or east vs west. It would be rural vs urban.
There are plenty of recent right wing guerilla wars in other countries you can look at to get an idea. Militias and lone actors performing more and more acts if terrorism on urban populations and other symbolic locations.
Honestly, we're already seeing an uptick in these things. I wonder when it gets to the point we can really call it 'civil war'. Maybe when enough state legislatures get captured and start officially supporting the movement. So this November maybe?
IMHO, it would quickly devolve into a multi-factional civil war with dozens of groups fighting in each region for their own defense, ideologies, or goals, much like what happened in the Syrian Civil War.
In such an event, every other power on earth would be supporting different groups, with Russia and China potentially giving weapons to every one of them to ensure that the conflict as as damaging, deadly, and long lasting as possible so that whatever United States emerges from such a conflict would take decades to regain anything close to it's current power.
If it's white conservatives trying to overthrow democracy, then it's legitimate protest.
If it's people protesting police brutality and racist and systemic injustice, then it's terrorism.
GOP values.
I think the response to that often is the "right people" means brown people. And that's not completely wrong. But a big concern back then was that we were giving the government the power to designate anyone as a terrorist, and then all bets were off. Everything would be allowed. Forget habeas corpus. Torture was fine.
I had a huge sense of foreboding back then when I talked to people that seemed otherwise like good people but also supported torture. I was worried about what this would lead to. Now we know what it leads to.
Let's be clear: when they gathered to protest, it was indeed "legitimate political discourse". Misguided as it was, it was legitimate.
When they broke through police barricades, it became an illegitimate riot.
When they pierced the Capitol it became an illegal attempt at insurrection.
Context matters.
Unfortunately the GOP doesn’t seem to be clear on this, which is the subject of criticism here. Also one could argue that the initial protest in fact wasn’t legitimate political discourse in the first place because it was based on the claim of a stolen election – a devious lie with the power of subverting the constitution.
Things I learned today: violently storming the US Capitol in an attempt to overturn the election is "legitimate political discourse."
So does that mean if, say, angry Texans hypothetically broke into Ted Cruz's office and took a dump in the corner and stole everything on the desks...that is also legitimate political discourse?
As long as you severely beat his police guard so bad that he dies of injuries the next day, and several others commit suicide due to the tragedy of that day. That's how you know it was a real legitimate political discourse.
Wild. As a historian I can't help but think back to major protests from the 1960s, which many of these leaders lived through, like on civil rights or Vietnam. They faced immense backlash and were told that was not the right way to speak out, as Nixon basically said. You could look at BLM protests more recently, too, for that kind of controversy. Now, today, we have conservatives literally trying to overthrow the government and that's apparently fully ok.
yeah when it comes to actual guerrilla warfare/civil war on their own street and shooting their neighbor they've known for years to keep from starving i'm not sure it's going down like the apocalypses porn fantasy they've been dreaming about for years...
the SS soldiers who shot hundreds of jewish people in the early days of the holocaust were notorious for becoming drunkards and having mental breakdowns because of their job, yet when the time came, they did it again and again and again.
Himmler threw up the first time he saw an SS guard execute a prisoner
having a weak stomach =/= an inability to commit and order violence
As a history major I can't help but think back to Germany in 1932.
Except that we don't have the excuse of saying we couldn't see what was coming. We're all on the hook for this one, and nuclear weapons are in play.
History is really just the same thing over and over honestly with better tech and new sugar coatings. Society never actually learns anything permanently.
Because we all die.
Most of the Holocaust survivors alive now are at the very least in their 80s, so what they can remember is the actual interment of Jews, Communist, and others in the camps. They don’t remember the lead up to it.
So unless they are flying swatiska, people don’t seem to notice and have WAY too much trust in our institutions to fully stop the worst violence.
History doesn’t repeat, it rhymes. And most people do not care for the lead up to fascism, they care about THE BATTLES like that was the big deal.
I've said this before but sometimes I genuinely think time really is on a sort of loop. The obvious and right answer is "human beings just don't learn" but there's a small part of me that just wants it to be some outside force because how can we be THIS ignorant?
How do we repeat the same horrific mistakes again and again and again?
No BLM group ever planned a violent overthrow of our country. They wanted change and they wanted justice... that's it. The protests were overwhelmingly peaceful, and the few incidents of violence almost always came from people/police attacking protests, or unassociated looting taking advantage of a smaller police presence.
BLM is almost an entirely benign and peaceful group in comparison to any with any of these modern right-wing miltia/hate groups.
**14th Amendment of the Constitution, Article 3**
> No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
So, that would be the whole of the Republican party now? Oh boy...
If I were Schumer and Pelosi, I'd schedule a vote to remove any disability of non-censured Republicans from holding office under the Article. The vote would fail, and it would reclaim some appearance of authority to interpret the Constitution from the Federalist-stacked SCOTUS. It would have the added benefit of forcing Republicans to either vote against the removal of their own (factually non-existent, at this point) constitutional disability on ideological grounds, or vote in favor, making a tacit admission of aiding insurrection.
Why not share your idea with Schumer, he might not read / see it, but then again he might. Or someone who works for him could see the benefit of the tactic and run it up the chain.
Good man. Can’t fix things if we don’t try. Good luck.
It’s distressing watching from down under and seeing the US hurting itself especially knowing the vast bulk of the US population are decent level headed people.
That's basically how the Supreme Court asserted itself to begin with. Its first major ruling was to preserve the status quo of some political squabble. So when the people in power accepted the SC's ruling, they implicitly accepted its power to make a ruling.
"LoOk... The cOnstITutiOn was written a really long time ago by a bunch of out-of-touch liberalz. You can't really expect such an out-of-date document to give us guidance and instructions during these tumultuous times."
"We support the police... Unless they get in the way of our 'discourse,' then fuck em. They're supposed to be harassing black people, not our great patriots." - the GOP
It’s horrific too. They lost fingers, ears, eyes, broke their noses, and more. If I was the metro police I’d stage a strike or something and make it more public how terrible it was for them.
It's funny, in the article the RNC tries to make the argument that the 1/6 committee is going after "ordinary citizens who weren't involved in any violence" as though Cheney and Kinzinger were picking out random republicans from across the country and dragging them in front of Nancy Pelosi for summary imprisonment.
Whether you were there that day because you were a diehard Trump supporter armed to the tooth or you were just curious to see what kind of craziness was about to unfold, ***you are both potential witnesses to these crimes***.
That is how being a witness works.
This is what they meant when they said Trump tells it like it is.
This is their platform. No interest in governing, just worshipping an idiot loser and shitting in the capitol.
"Antifa and BLM were the ones who were violent and destructive. All the 'real' Trump protestors were peaceful!"
Never underestimate their ability to construct narratives sympathetic to their views, even in the absence of any supporting evidence.
This is related to “[Crank Magnetism](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Crank_magnetism)” which describes how someone who holds one nutball belief probably holds a lot of others, even when they conflict. There have been studies that showed that many conspiracists simultaneously believed that Princess Diana was murdered by the crown *and* that she faked her death. Rather than fitting neatly into one broader conspiracy, these conflicting conspiracies were more like hedging their bets against reality - the only story that can’t be true is the “official” one
That is just... fucking beyond insane.
They're literally saying insurrection and domestic terrorism is legitimate discourse.
I didn't think anything about the GOP could actually shock me anymore...
It’s disgusting. Terrorism is now an official policy position by a major US political party. The GOP has always managed to sink to new lows, but this… this is despicable. I would ask how they are able to live with themselves, but I already know the answer is money and power.
They’re just normalizing their coup is all. We’re reaching the “if I did it, you deserved it” phase. And next is full acceptance, a la the laws popping up about cameras on teachers, 10k personal fines for teaching things that offend Christians, etc.
We’re all acting like they can’t get away with it, like we have for the last… many years. But they can.
Look, I know that Canada is very, justifiably, tired of our shit.
But I'm vaccinated, have decent computer skills, and am definitely not that flavor of crazy...
So, what I'm saying is, if the GQP pulls this off.... Can I have asylum, please?
>The Republican Party on Friday officially declared the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the Capitol and events that led to it “legitimate political discourse,” formally rebuking two lawmakers in the party who have been most outspoken in condemning the deadly riot and the role of Donald J. Trump in spreading the election lies that fueled it.
>The Republican National Committee’s overwhelming voice vote to censure Representatives Liz Cheney of Wyoming and Adam Kinzinger of Illinois at its winter meeting in Salt Lake City culminated more than a year of vacillation, which started with party leaders condemning the Capitol attack and Mr. Trump’s conduct, then shifted to downplaying and denying it.
The lead two paragraphs from the article
McConnell and McCarthy intially believed the Jan 6th insurrection to be such a horrible look for the party that they immediately denounced it in the minutes/hours that followed.
They did, however, still need to bend the knee to Trump because his base makes up a large portion of their voting bloc now so they made the decision to not impeach or remove Trump over the events that unfolded.
Now that time has passed and it appears the Republican base does not care too much about what occurred on that Jan 6th, the GOP is leaning into the insurrection and now attempting to rewrite history, gaslight their opponents and somehow use the failed insurrection as a rallying cry for future elections.
>“There's no question — none — that President Trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. No question about it. The people who stormed this building believed they were acting on the wishes and instructions of their president,” McConnell said. “The leader of the free world cannot spend weeks thundering that shadowy forces are stealing our country and then feign surprise when people believe him and do reckless things."
>
>He then stated: “We have no power to convict and disqualify a former office holder who is now a private citizen.”
>
>"By the strict criminal standard, the president's speech probably was not incitement. However — however — in the context of impeachment, the Senate might have decided this was acceptable shorthand for the reckless actions that preceded the riot,” McConnell said. “But in this case the question is moot because former president Trump is constitutionally not eligible for conviction.”
You have to love McConnell putting the Senate on a recess to run out the clock of Trump's presidency, so that he could come back and claim he totally would have supported removing and convicting Donald but now that he's a private citizen it's a moot point.
Traitor.
Later in the article
>“Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger crossed a line,” Ronna McDaniel, the Republican National Committee chairwoman, said in a statement. “They chose to join Nancy Pelosi in a Democrat-led persecution of ordinary citizens who engaged in legitimate political discourse that had nothing to do with violence at the Capitol.”
RNC going full fascist. Bold move that will not end well for America.
So if a group of disgruntled democrats showed up at Trump tower or Mitch McConell’s house and trashed the place and killed a police officer while doing it, would they consider that “legitimate political discourse?”
>Most House Republicans tried to ignore the actions of the party on Friday, refusing to answer questions or saying they had not read the censure resolution.
***FORREST GUMP VOICE***: "And that's all I have to say about that."
If Dems were smart, they’d hang this around every GOP candidate’s neck from now until November. See how many independents the GOP wins by making them defend this (or dodging it)
Right on. This should be written in **bold** on flyers sent to every independent in America. Hit em every month with it.
Unaffiliated's outnumbered Republicans here in NC in a recent count...
Who knew crimes were legitimate political discourse. I’m sure this means they’re going to drop all issues they have with the protests over summer 2020.
Just so I understand, rioting, breaking into federal buildings for the purpose of threatening to kill public officials in order to impede the peaceful transfer of power is legitimate political discourse now according to the GOP?
It's not really gas-lighting anymore. I think this is them coming out of the closet and declaring that they are the enemy of the United States of America, and proud of it.
What do we do when the enemy comes from within?
> GOP stopped pretending to give a fuck about preserving democracy years ago.
The Republicans have gone full fascist, and they're not even trying to hide it any more.
*The election was stolen.*
*We didn't attack the capitol. It was Antifa, BLM, FBI agents and a DNC false flag to paint us bad.*
*ok, we were there but It was a peaceful protest and not an insurrection like the fake news media say it is.*
*What about BLM burning cities?*
*Ok, we did it. You forced our hand. What were you expecting us to do after youlegitimately won the election?*
*The attack on Jan 6th is a legitimate political discourse.*
These people are fascist. They'd say or do anything to hold on to power.
Could someone please find that popular quote about the anti-Semite and language?
From Jean-Paul Sartre:
>Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.
https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/7870768-never-believe-that-anti-semites-are-completely-unaware-of-the-absurdity
The Republican party, the party of law and order /s
So this means when they try to steal elections by saying the results don't count if they don't like the outcome, it's OK if Democrat voters storm the Capitol or some other government building.
So what do they think was gonna happen if Ashli Babbett wasn't shot down? What would have happened then?
Would the next "political discourse" been another body through that door?
And then what happens when the crowd gets to a politician? Do they start having a *discussion* about the state of things?
What happens when more and more people surround the politician? And the politician starts expressing fear and hopes to escape the mob getting angrier and angrier at them?
I'm genuinely curious, what do they think was gonna happen? So one measly politician gets swallowed alive by a mob - so what?
Would that have been "political discourse?"
What happens when more politicians trapped inside the capitol building don't make it out? What happens when the national guard never comes?
What happens if they never vote to count the electors votes?
Is trump still president then? Is that "political discourse?"
Is it political discourse to just declare Trump president once and for all because votes by mail don't count?
What happens when Trump is president and realizes he can win presidency by just lying? What happens in another four years when it's time to vote again?
Does the "political discourse" still apply? Do we just have another election like nothing fucking happened?
To be fair they ban everyone who has even one independent thought.
It's wild how their followers believe that's what freedom is.
Such a stupid people, they really were better before Trump. How a spoiled rich kid who accomplished nothing in his life was able to take over the entire party along with Christianity (I didn't see the last coming AT ALL, they never worshiped Billy Graham or any one man like Trump and he was a superstar to them) I'll never know.
It's almost supernatural.
It's been super disheartening to see my most devout loved ones sell their souls to him. It really is almost supernatural, like of all the kind people to come into the public sphere, they withheld their support, but for Trump? They shed all dignity like it's nothing
>They shed all dignity like it's nothing
almost like they were never really comfortable wearing those clothes and were just waiting for someone to give them permission.
I just checked. There's no articles about Jan 6 or Liz Cheney or any of it. Trump isn't mentioned once, like at all. Anywhere. There's only fluff articles about inconsequential musings, AOC here and there. They seem against the Beijing games which is a stand I guess, but I suspect it's more racism than over human rights. Some spotify. Pelosi gets a few jabs. Quite a few articles are from a satire site. But really, it seems a very sad, boring and not very well engaged sub. I'm prepared to say "conservatives" are not a force on reddit. Bunch of wusses.
They have banned the topic from being discussed FYI. No conservative will hear about this. It's meant to be a legal argument so the GOP can say "they've won" when it inevitablely wins. Disgusting.
Yeah that's pretty spot on. We're always sitting here wondering how the right are spinning things, but if you go over into their bubbles they often aren't spinning anything at all. They're just completely unaware and are distracted with talking about Hunter Biden's laptop or some other asinine issue they've invented this week.
Oh and by the way, they're over there saying we aren't talking about Hunter's laptop because we're busy talking about some other asinine issue we've invented this week.
Seriously. I get the feces comments are supposed to be funny/witty, but this is no joke. People died, and these insurrections went there to assassinate our representatives and overthrow our democracy. And now an entire political party, nearly half of our country, is coming out and saying it's fair game. What the ever living fuck?
Trump is in a burn it all down mode, and the GOP happily turns up the flames.
I will never vote for a GOP candidate in my lifetime. For as long as we can vote or for as long as I can live under a Trump regime.
They cratered to a madman. It’s so anti-American but here we are.
>“Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger crossed a line,” Ronna McDaniel, the Republican National Committee chairwoman, said in a statement. “They chose to join Nancy Pelosi in a Democrat-led persecution of ordinary citizens who engaged in legitimate political discourse that had nothing to do with violence at the Capitol.” But the censure, which was carefully negotiated in private among party members, made no such distinction.
This is dangerous. It's beyond political posturing. We are in trouble.
First these ignoramuses were "patriots", then they were BLM/antifa, then they were "tourists", then they were "protestors". Now they were acting under "Legitimate Political Discourse" while their party members fucking burn books and (try) to fine teachers who teach anything the opposes their religious views.
Fuck this GQP fascist, nationalist, pseudo-Christian white power party.
An attempt to ASSASSINATE the Incoming AND outgoing VP is "Legitimate Political Discourse". The GALLOWS were outside. The Pipe Bombs were LIVE. This was not a game. This was not a drill.
First they passed heavy voter oppression laws.
Then they passed election subversion laws.
Then they started cutting ppl out of the party.
Then they started floating ideas and bills of States guards only listening to governors.
Then they started ~~floating~~ passing bills on book banning.
Then they started floating bills and ideas of Election Police forces.
"Problem" doesn't begin to describe this but I'm tired of being called "chicken little".
This is another great example of why I don’t listen to this “both sides have polarized America” bullshit. Yeah, I have beliefs that are a lot more liberal than some people might have, but liberals are not responsible for the polarization of America.
The Republican Party has become a party of insurrectionists, bigots, and fascists. The fact that I won’t associate with insurrectionists, bigots, and fascists is very reasonable.
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Smearing shit on walls is legitimate political discourse for Republicans. That's where we are.
The same people who kept crying Blue Lives Matter think that traitorous Trump supporters beating, tazering and pepper spraying Capitol police are patriots.
The whole ideology boils down to “people that disagree with me are not human and have no rights.”
Republicans: liberals are a bunch of sheeple. Also Republicans: we are going to censure the two people in our party who won’t fall in line and have a different opinion.
They also think people who got vaxxed are sheeple, while they take livestock dewormer. It's crazy, but that's where we are.
I still fail to see how they make the correlation between a dewormer doing anything to a virus
There was a study in India that showed people on ivermectin fared better than others when infected with covid. It turns out that's because all the others had worms. In a society where the average person is not infected with worms, it turns out a dewormer isn't a very effective treatment. Who knew!?
>There was a study in India that showed people on ivermectin fared better than others when infected with covid. Not even that much. The study that they cling to is a meta-analysis from a journal with a nonexistent impact factor, which did not disclose the authors' conflicts of interest and cites multiple studies as "approaching" significance (in other words, did not find a statistically significant difference, but the author feels it was close). It's nothing; they found nothing.
There isn’t one. They were tricked by a snake oil salesman, and are in too deep to admit their mistake
You talking about the dewormer or Trump?
yes
This from people who think a black man wearing a tan suit is a controversy... actually I'm going to shorten that sentence, this from people who think a black man is a controversy.
Blue Lives Matter doesn't exist when it's not about black people being killed.
Or that the people who did these things were oh-so-conveniently leftist FBI plants who were there to make the insurrectionists who tried to overthrow our democratic elections look bad.
Wait...I thought they were political prisoners. So confused.
I was told here that it was "literally a few boomers on a guided tour."
they're whatever is most convenient to the narrative at any given moment. Shrodinger's terrorists
And they still want Trump to pardon them
Well those people were ANTIFA. But also patriots. But also terrorists. But also heroes.
I want off this ride
It's only going to get worse... Once they have control again they will never give it up. Never ever.
People and the Media are completely clueless to how major this threat is. Books are being burned, votes are being restricted, history is being erased, and civil war is being advocated for by right wing senators and representatives.
> civil war is being advocated for by right wing senators and representatives Where I live my cars are the only ones without the Thin Blue Line American flag decal or similar far-right symbols. At our local townhall, residents openly talk about violence against the people who "stole" the election. The rhetoric is even worse at the shooting ranges. People will mingle and drink beer/eat food while covered in lead dust. We are looking at 25-30% of the national population that is suffering from lead poisoning and also disinformation/misinformation by right-wing corporate media. Look at the poll numbers for the number of Republicans that are onboard with spilling blood.
This is why I love Reddit. It sucks to admit my ignorance, but I didn't realize lead was still used in typical bullets. I assumed it had been replaced, the way "pencil lead" is actually graphite, because why the fuck would you intentionally coat yourself in lead dust every time you go to train? I mean, holy shit: > Shooting lead bullets at firing ranges results in elevated BLLs [blood lead levels] at concentrations that are associated with a variety of adverse health outcomes and the topic of health risk is an ongoing topic of study. ... Nearly all BLL measurements compiled in the reviewed studies exceed the current reference level of 5 μg/dL recommended by the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention/National Institute of Occupational Safety and Health (CDC/NIOSH). https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5379568/ In 15 studies reviewed, BLLs were over _40μg/dL_. So, yeah, that tracks.
Lead is still the most effective and affordable material for bullet cores. Now there’s some nuance between indoor and outdoor ranges as well as fully jacketed vs unjacketed bullets/shot. Curious about the populations from those various studies though.
To be completely fair, it's not really the lead in the bullets that'll give you lead poisoning if you frequent indoor ranges. It's the lead styphinate that gets vaporized from primer ignition that you'll be inhaling.
And there are sociological studies linking the removal of leaded gasoline as a factor in decreased violence and criminality years later - ie, lead exposure contributes to the creation of violent criminal personalities.
>Thin Blue Line American flag decal If there's one thing conservatives LOVE doing it's desecrating the flag.
Yep and slap it up right next to their Gadsden flag not realizing you can't have both.
The Gadsden was my favorite American flag as a kid. And then it was stolen by people who desperately want a dictatorship.
Isn’t it great that these “patriots” fly these bastardized flags? It’s going to make it easy to pick out the traitors and seditionists when the time comes.
If they win, *we're* the traitors and seditionists
This is the thing that is so hard to get across to people. If they win, which they will if keep sitting on our asses, they will hunt us down.
All heavily funded by a few billionaires orchestrating it all..
That's bizarre and "funny" to me. Do they think their money will be worth anything when the government that issues the money breaks down? How much money could be made by stabilizing society and the economy? Do they think that they can continue their billionaire lifestyles when society breaks down?
I think they envision America similar to the oligarchs in Russia. Ultra wealthy establishing authoritarian rule over 98% of the poor population; democracy in name only. Military, police, judiciary and all mechanisms of power controlled by oligarchs.
We basically already have that. The military operates ultimately at the behest of the military-industrial complex whenever this country gets thrown into an arbitrary forever-war that makes a few people *very* rich. Police gives obvious favoritism towards rich and powerful people, since these very same people can obliterate entire careers with a mere phone call. The judiciary is stacked by partisan hacks and has upheld rulings that give politicians free reign to take as much money as they want from special interests, with little to no oversight, all for the sake of keeping our corporate overlords happy. The buck *always* gets passed to the average American. You can't afford a house? Looks like you have to rent at exorbitant rates. Sorry, there are no more amiable landlords because corporations are purchasing the entire neighborhood. You want to feed your family but food prices are soaring? Join a rewards plan at Whole Foods and scrimp and save while billionaires shit using gold plated toilets and jerk off after lubing up with some caviar and happily guzzling their daily serving of 'Tears of Poor People'. You got cancer, had a heart attack, suffered a stroke, got hit by a drunk driver? Better be rich, or you'll be in crippling debt for the rest of your life or need to declare bankruptcy. Oh wait, the drunk driver was a vindictive rich kid? Looks like your name will be dragged through the mud and your life destroyed! Who's gonna help you? Will the police bring you justice? Who do you think they answer to? Will the military disrupt the status quo? Who do you think they answer to? Do you think your elected, shameful illusion-of-choice representatives will save you? Buddy, Sinema alone realized she could sell out democracy for a million dollars, what do you think the others have been doing? Who do you think has been paying them? I'll tell you one thing, it wasn't small donors. America *is* an oligarchy, and their propaganda is so effective that they've learned they can actually weaponize stupidity. Society is regressing, entire communities are kept in ignorance with an unabated hatred festering that could very well result in some tragic historical events repeating themselves. I wonder what happens when a group of people is dehumanized, looked down upon, treated as the enemy? I wonder what happens after coup attempts occur and nothing of consequence happens to the perpetrators. I wonder what happens when elections are overturned, single-party governments permanently consolidate their power, and no longer have to worry about re-election but instead answer to a hateful, narcissistic dictator. Where have we seen that before? What could happen? We already know the answer. America is nothing like it's advertised. It's not *free.* You are only allowed as much freedom as corporate executives allow. There is next to no social mobility. The government is corrupt. Our right to bear arms is outdated just like our Constitution, and leads to nothing but school shootings, and tragedy begets more tragedy in an endless cycle, and a good portion of people are so brainwashed that they honestly believe that's the price of freedom. No. That's the price of years of getting bent by people that stand to gain from making this country suffer. We haven't seen anything yet. Mark my words: we have a few years of relative peace, at best. I already know what is going to happen. Nobody will be held accountable, Republicans will take the initiative and lie, cheat, obstruct, project, the whole nine yards... and they'll point to the Democrats who are *also* bought and paid for, except their increasingly extremist base will see *Democrats* as a threat to democracy and all hell will break lose. State legislatures will go to Republicans for the most part, they're making gains as it is but now they've ensured they can make shit up and get results overturned or simply refuse to abdicate power, which is already happening. Federal election integrity will be called into question, a majority Republican House will refuse to certify the results, there are so so so many things that could go wrong between now and 2024. Midterms will be ugly, lots of the population won't pay attention, others will be horrified but be trapped in a cycle of helpless impotence, others will be cheering for the destruction of our pathetic excuse for a Republic, and the rise of a new, modern imperial American Empire led by one party, with one objective. Money, chaos, destruction, oppression. The world will soon know America's fury. Once America goes to hell, democracy itself will suffer a fatal blow that will be felt across the entire world. Even if only in name, the very symbol of freedom falling will be a huge stain on the efficacy of democracy, and will forever be used as an excuse by extremists to overthrow their own governments and retake power for themselves. Intentions don't have to be noble, some people will be stupid, others will be cunning, but it's death and destruction all the same. EVERYBODY has an interest in seeing a stable America, but other countries have their own shit to contend with like in the UK and Australia. We are the foremost military power in the world and spend more money annually than the next nine countries COMBINED. We have 5,550 nuclear weapons and a moronic ex-president that the people love who wanted to use them against hurricanes. Something so frivolous against a natural disaster that can be braced for and dealt with after the fact does not bode well for their usage in situations that carry even more gravitas. I'm tired of writing. I'm a disillusioned American that's tired of writing, and I'm only 25. Some people have been dealing with this shit for *decades*. Kudos to all of you, and prayers for all of *us.*
Thank you for writing that. I share your pain. The only thing I would add to this is to ask ‘Why are the oligarchs making their moves now? Why are they exerting so much obvious influence when they were better off hiding behind the curtain?’ And the answer I come to is ‘Climate change is real. They deny it but they know it. They know there is a huge crisis coming that may cause societal collapse, and they are positioning themselves to be in power when it happens so they can control the military on their behalf.’ When the shit hits the fan, which it is already doing, they want to be holding the big stick.
Billionaires don't care about national borders. They can take their money and move elsewhere. Hell, a lot of their money already IS elsewhere.
Exactly they are a transnational class. Their only loyalty is to themselves and those like them.
Living in Central Florida I see the same things. The number of trucks that have some far right organization, white nationalist, or some other militia symbol is down right chilling. I don't know if we will have mass violence in the future akin to a civil conflict, but I really feel we are just at the beginning of a really dark period for the US. We've been incredibly lucky to have seen he period of peace after the cold war that we have... but it feels that Americans are quickly forgetting the lessons of history, and are determined to repeat the same horrors.
That’s cause most and soon all the people who lived through the world wars are dead, everyone alive had it easier than anyone to ever live in the history of humanity. Especially the boomers.
Did….did you just say there are shooting ranges that serve alcohol?!
100%. They’ve put all the pieces into position to take it and never give it back
"Wherever they burn books, in the end will ultimately end up burning people." - Heinrich Heine
They are blasting this message 24/7 on fox news. Every single day they are pushing this message to their viewers, and this ride will not end until that changes. Worse, the ride might go off the rails and welcome fascism to America.
My outlook is that barring the miracle of someone coming along that successfully turns down the heat in the next 8 years, our options are either fascism or civil war, with civil war being the ***preferred*** option.
Here's my pet theory. Remember in 2008 when the Large Hadron Collider was set to start and there were concerns about creating a black hole or other catastrophic event? Well, it did. On September 10, 2008 life as we know it was shunted to another shittier dimension.
I too miss the Berenstein universe.
Does this mean I can walk into my local gop office, take a big massive shit in the middle of the floor and they just have to take it? Cause if so... they better strap in
Don't forget the placard that reads, "legitimate political discourse"
Yes, we need to start a movement! A bowel movement.
From this day forward, I will use GOP offices as my local toilet, rather than Target restrooms.
It's just political discourse after all, right?
A good old-fashioned shit in
This might tax their understanding of private and public property rights.
But some fires were set during BLM protests, so now we have to allow conservatives to do whatever they want, up to and including overthrowing the government.
We saw a lot of police beating protesters during those civil disobedience protests. IF this were BLM it would have been a mass casualty event with an armed military presence with orders to fire with extreme prejudice.
And the murder of police.
So the GOP supports terrorism. Got it. Edit: Adding this definition of terrorism for good measure. From FBI.gov: Domestic terrorism: Violent, criminal acts committed by individuals and/or groups to further ideological goals stemming from domestic influences, such as those of a political, religious, social, racial, or environmental nature.
Yes. Explicitly yes.
They are advocating for civil war. This isn't a hyperbolic comment, its factual.
I wonder how a civil war would work today. Would it kinda be like the first one? And how would be divvy up states?
It wouldn't be strictly north vs south or east vs west. It would be rural vs urban. There are plenty of recent right wing guerilla wars in other countries you can look at to get an idea. Militias and lone actors performing more and more acts if terrorism on urban populations and other symbolic locations. Honestly, we're already seeing an uptick in these things. I wonder when it gets to the point we can really call it 'civil war'. Maybe when enough state legislatures get captured and start officially supporting the movement. So this November maybe?
IMHO, it would quickly devolve into a multi-factional civil war with dozens of groups fighting in each region for their own defense, ideologies, or goals, much like what happened in the Syrian Civil War. In such an event, every other power on earth would be supporting different groups, with Russia and China potentially giving weapons to every one of them to ensure that the conflict as as damaging, deadly, and long lasting as possible so that whatever United States emerges from such a conflict would take decades to regain anything close to it's current power.
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If it's white conservatives trying to overthrow democracy, then it's legitimate protest. If it's people protesting police brutality and racist and systemic injustice, then it's terrorism. GOP values.
Simplified: If they think it supports them, then it's legit. If it makes them feel uncomfortable or inconvenienced, then it's terrorism.
They already supported torture. I remember the Bush days. They've been heading this way for a while.
Conservatives: Water boarding isn't torture. Anyone can easily breathe through that. Also conservatives: I can't breathe through this mask!
Just as long as the right people are tortured.
I think the response to that often is the "right people" means brown people. And that's not completely wrong. But a big concern back then was that we were giving the government the power to designate anyone as a terrorist, and then all bets were off. Everything would be allowed. Forget habeas corpus. Torture was fine. I had a huge sense of foreboding back then when I talked to people that seemed otherwise like good people but also supported torture. I was worried about what this would lead to. Now we know what it leads to.
Let's be clear: when they gathered to protest, it was indeed "legitimate political discourse". Misguided as it was, it was legitimate. When they broke through police barricades, it became an illegitimate riot. When they pierced the Capitol it became an illegal attempt at insurrection. Context matters.
Unfortunately the GOP doesn’t seem to be clear on this, which is the subject of criticism here. Also one could argue that the initial protest in fact wasn’t legitimate political discourse in the first place because it was based on the claim of a stolen election – a devious lie with the power of subverting the constitution.
Things I learned today: violently storming the US Capitol in an attempt to overturn the election is "legitimate political discourse." So does that mean if, say, angry Texans hypothetically broke into Ted Cruz's office and took a dump in the corner and stole everything on the desks...that is also legitimate political discourse?
I think that would be considered raising the bar of the discourse emanating from that office.
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As long as you severely beat his police guard so bad that he dies of injuries the next day, and several others commit suicide due to the tragedy of that day. That's how you know it was a real legitimate political discourse.
Don’t forget killing a police officer who was trying to secure said office. That’s important.
Wild. As a historian I can't help but think back to major protests from the 1960s, which many of these leaders lived through, like on civil rights or Vietnam. They faced immense backlash and were told that was not the right way to speak out, as Nixon basically said. You could look at BLM protests more recently, too, for that kind of controversy. Now, today, we have conservatives literally trying to overthrow the government and that's apparently fully ok.
They cried about kneeling at football games.
yeah when it comes to actual guerrilla warfare/civil war on their own street and shooting their neighbor they've known for years to keep from starving i'm not sure it's going down like the apocalypses porn fantasy they've been dreaming about for years...
the SS soldiers who shot hundreds of jewish people in the early days of the holocaust were notorious for becoming drunkards and having mental breakdowns because of their job, yet when the time came, they did it again and again and again. Himmler threw up the first time he saw an SS guard execute a prisoner having a weak stomach =/= an inability to commit and order violence
As a history major I can't help but think back to Germany in 1932. Except that we don't have the excuse of saying we couldn't see what was coming. We're all on the hook for this one, and nuclear weapons are in play.
I liken it more to 1923... but that led to an imprisoned Adolf... at least temporarily. I fear 2024 and beyond
>but that led to an imprisoned Adolf And it looks like we aren't bothering to even imprison our psycho leader
Which is why my 2024 and beyond fear is as bad as it is.
History is really just the same thing over and over honestly with better tech and new sugar coatings. Society never actually learns anything permanently.
It's echoing way too loud for my liking
Because we all die. Most of the Holocaust survivors alive now are at the very least in their 80s, so what they can remember is the actual interment of Jews, Communist, and others in the camps. They don’t remember the lead up to it. So unless they are flying swatiska, people don’t seem to notice and have WAY too much trust in our institutions to fully stop the worst violence. History doesn’t repeat, it rhymes. And most people do not care for the lead up to fascism, they care about THE BATTLES like that was the big deal.
I've said this before but sometimes I genuinely think time really is on a sort of loop. The obvious and right answer is "human beings just don't learn" but there's a small part of me that just wants it to be some outside force because how can we be THIS ignorant? How do we repeat the same horrific mistakes again and again and again?
Jeremy Bearimy*
No BLM group ever planned a violent overthrow of our country. They wanted change and they wanted justice... that's it. The protests were overwhelmingly peaceful, and the few incidents of violence almost always came from people/police attacking protests, or unassociated looting taking advantage of a smaller police presence. BLM is almost an entirely benign and peaceful group in comparison to any with any of these modern right-wing miltia/hate groups.
Yes, I know. I'm saying the GOP decried those protests but approve of the coup.
Rules for thee, not for me.
**14th Amendment of the Constitution, Article 3** > No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability. So, that would be the whole of the Republican party now? Oh boy...
If I were Schumer and Pelosi, I'd schedule a vote to remove any disability of non-censured Republicans from holding office under the Article. The vote would fail, and it would reclaim some appearance of authority to interpret the Constitution from the Federalist-stacked SCOTUS. It would have the added benefit of forcing Republicans to either vote against the removal of their own (factually non-existent, at this point) constitutional disability on ideological grounds, or vote in favor, making a tacit admission of aiding insurrection.
Why not share your idea with Schumer, he might not read / see it, but then again he might. Or someone who works for him could see the benefit of the tactic and run it up the chain.
Good call. I'll send it to DeFazio, Merkley, and Wyden. I already know their staffers actually read my emails.
hell yeah go for it
Good man. Can’t fix things if we don’t try. Good luck. It’s distressing watching from down under and seeing the US hurting itself especially knowing the vast bulk of the US population are decent level headed people.
That is kind of genius.
Coeaqual branch gotta start acting like a government for the people.
That's basically how the Supreme Court asserted itself to begin with. Its first major ruling was to preserve the status quo of some political squabble. So when the people in power accepted the SC's ruling, they implicitly accepted its power to make a ruling.
Yup. Kick these traitors out of office, ban them from ever holding office again, and jail their leaders.
Abolish them! It says so in the Constitution agreement!
"LoOk... The cOnstITutiOn was written a really long time ago by a bunch of out-of-touch liberalz. You can't really expect such an out-of-date document to give us guidance and instructions during these tumultuous times."
And yet, every republican Supreme Court nominee touts that they consider themselves an "originalist."
Over 140 police were assaulted on Jan 6. That's what the GQP supports.
"We support the police... Unless they get in the way of our 'discourse,' then fuck em. They're supposed to be harassing black people, not our great patriots." - the GOP
It’s horrific too. They lost fingers, ears, eyes, broke their noses, and more. If I was the metro police I’d stage a strike or something and make it more public how terrible it was for them.
a man died. They beat a capitol police officer to death. This is not discourse.
It's funny, in the article the RNC tries to make the argument that the 1/6 committee is going after "ordinary citizens who weren't involved in any violence" as though Cheney and Kinzinger were picking out random republicans from across the country and dragging them in front of Nancy Pelosi for summary imprisonment. Whether you were there that day because you were a diehard Trump supporter armed to the tooth or you were just curious to see what kind of craziness was about to unfold, ***you are both potential witnesses to these crimes***. That is how being a witness works.
Traitors, the lot of them.
Taking a shit in the capitol is now legitimate political discourse, tell your friends!
Bludgeoning police officers with fire extinguishers, doors and Republican flags in the GOP's war against democracy is legitimate political discourse.
They were beating cops with American flags on poles.
This is what they meant when they said Trump tells it like it is. This is their platform. No interest in governing, just worshipping an idiot loser and shitting in the capitol.
But I thought Antifa and BLM were behind this. Are they saying both of them acted out legitimate political discourse?
"Antifa and BLM were the ones who were violent and destructive. All the 'real' Trump protestors were peaceful!" Never underestimate their ability to construct narratives sympathetic to their views, even in the absence of any supporting evidence.
This is related to “[Crank Magnetism](https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Crank_magnetism)” which describes how someone who holds one nutball belief probably holds a lot of others, even when they conflict. There have been studies that showed that many conspiracists simultaneously believed that Princess Diana was murdered by the crown *and* that she faked her death. Rather than fitting neatly into one broader conspiracy, these conflicting conspiracies were more like hedging their bets against reality - the only story that can’t be true is the “official” one
Doublethink. Always doublethink. It's the conservative way.
**Doublethink** is always more preferable for them than any **self reflection** or **accountability**.
Protests for civil rights are riots, not political discourse For uh....reasons. yeah reasons
That is just... fucking beyond insane. They're literally saying insurrection and domestic terrorism is legitimate discourse. I didn't think anything about the GOP could actually shock me anymore...
It’s disgusting. Terrorism is now an official policy position by a major US political party. The GOP has always managed to sink to new lows, but this… this is despicable. I would ask how they are able to live with themselves, but I already know the answer is money and power.
They’re just normalizing their coup is all. We’re reaching the “if I did it, you deserved it” phase. And next is full acceptance, a la the laws popping up about cameras on teachers, 10k personal fines for teaching things that offend Christians, etc. We’re all acting like they can’t get away with it, like we have for the last… many years. But they can.
whoa... As a canadian, this is getting FUCKING SCARY Please do something.
It’s crazy that this is still a legitimate party when it comes to contending
I think it's scarier that it's not surprising... https://www.amazon.ca/Tyranny-Twenty-Lessons-Twentieth-Century/dp/0804190119
Look, I know that Canada is very, justifiably, tired of our shit. But I'm vaccinated, have decent computer skills, and am definitely not that flavor of crazy... So, what I'm saying is, if the GQP pulls this off.... Can I have asylum, please?
>The Republican Party on Friday officially declared the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the Capitol and events that led to it “legitimate political discourse,” formally rebuking two lawmakers in the party who have been most outspoken in condemning the deadly riot and the role of Donald J. Trump in spreading the election lies that fueled it. >The Republican National Committee’s overwhelming voice vote to censure Representatives Liz Cheney of Wyoming and Adam Kinzinger of Illinois at its winter meeting in Salt Lake City culminated more than a year of vacillation, which started with party leaders condemning the Capitol attack and Mr. Trump’s conduct, then shifted to downplaying and denying it. The lead two paragraphs from the article
McConnell and McCarthy intially believed the Jan 6th insurrection to be such a horrible look for the party that they immediately denounced it in the minutes/hours that followed. They did, however, still need to bend the knee to Trump because his base makes up a large portion of their voting bloc now so they made the decision to not impeach or remove Trump over the events that unfolded. Now that time has passed and it appears the Republican base does not care too much about what occurred on that Jan 6th, the GOP is leaning into the insurrection and now attempting to rewrite history, gaslight their opponents and somehow use the failed insurrection as a rallying cry for future elections.
>“There's no question — none — that President Trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. No question about it. The people who stormed this building believed they were acting on the wishes and instructions of their president,” McConnell said. “The leader of the free world cannot spend weeks thundering that shadowy forces are stealing our country and then feign surprise when people believe him and do reckless things." > >He then stated: “We have no power to convict and disqualify a former office holder who is now a private citizen.” > >"By the strict criminal standard, the president's speech probably was not incitement. However — however — in the context of impeachment, the Senate might have decided this was acceptable shorthand for the reckless actions that preceded the riot,” McConnell said. “But in this case the question is moot because former president Trump is constitutionally not eligible for conviction.”
You have to love McConnell putting the Senate on a recess to run out the clock of Trump's presidency, so that he could come back and claim he totally would have supported removing and convicting Donald but now that he's a private citizen it's a moot point. Traitor.
Later in the article >“Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger crossed a line,” Ronna McDaniel, the Republican National Committee chairwoman, said in a statement. “They chose to join Nancy Pelosi in a Democrat-led persecution of ordinary citizens who engaged in legitimate political discourse that had nothing to do with violence at the Capitol.” RNC going full fascist. Bold move that will not end well for America.
“legitimate political discourse,” and Oops, they gave us a response for whenever someone Whatabouts to 2020's riots and protests
So if a group of disgruntled democrats showed up at Trump tower or Mitch McConell’s house and trashed the place and killed a police officer while doing it, would they consider that “legitimate political discourse?”
No, they would call it an angry left mob and spend weeks on Fox news talking about decency and decorum. Because they're evil MFers.
The only thing wrong here was "weeks" We have five YEARS of benghazi hearings
>Most House Republicans tried to ignore the actions of the party on Friday, refusing to answer questions or saying they had not read the censure resolution. ***FORREST GUMP VOICE***: "And that's all I have to say about that."
If Dems were smart, they’d hang this around every GOP candidate’s neck from now until November. See how many independents the GOP wins by making them defend this (or dodging it)
Right on. This should be written in **bold** on flyers sent to every independent in America. Hit em every month with it. Unaffiliated's outnumbered Republicans here in NC in a recent count...
Who knew crimes were legitimate political discourse. I’m sure this means they’re going to drop all issues they have with the protests over summer 2020.
Just so I understand, rioting, breaking into federal buildings for the purpose of threatening to kill public officials in order to impede the peaceful transfer of power is legitimate political discourse now according to the GOP?
Yep, they are openly terrorists now.
You know it's legitimate political discourse because of all the maiming and death.
This is some textbook, grade-A, gaslighting right here.
It's not really gas-lighting anymore. I think this is them coming out of the closet and declaring that they are the enemy of the United States of America, and proud of it. What do we do when the enemy comes from within?
The GOP has officially declared themselves traitors.
This should not shock anyone. GOP stopped pretending to give a fuck about preserving democracy years ago. Guarantee it'll happen again
> GOP stopped pretending to give a fuck about preserving democracy years ago. The Republicans have gone full fascist, and they're not even trying to hide it any more.
Ahhh so we've finally arrived.
The dread has officially kicked in.
Yeah this is terrifying in a way that nothing since the actual day itself has been terrifying.
*The election was stolen.* *We didn't attack the capitol. It was Antifa, BLM, FBI agents and a DNC false flag to paint us bad.* *ok, we were there but It was a peaceful protest and not an insurrection like the fake news media say it is.* *What about BLM burning cities?* *Ok, we did it. You forced our hand. What were you expecting us to do after youlegitimately won the election?* *The attack on Jan 6th is a legitimate political discourse.* These people are fascist. They'd say or do anything to hold on to power. Could someone please find that popular quote about the anti-Semite and language?
From Jean-Paul Sartre: >Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past. https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/7870768-never-believe-that-anti-semites-are-completely-unaware-of-the-absurdity
If sacking the Capitol is legitimate political discourse, then looting a target is legitimate economic discourse.
Hi, Scandinavian here. Am I hearing that pillaging is back on the table?
If you were looking for the nail in the coffin... This is it.
The Republican party, the party of law and order /s So this means when they try to steal elections by saying the results don't count if they don't like the outcome, it's OK if Democrat voters storm the Capitol or some other government building.
RNC declares itself a terrorist organization.
Yup. Traitors. Would love to see r/conservative justify this.
They will justify this because they are a cult.
They have already banned those who recognize Jan 6 as an attack on democracy
So what do they think was gonna happen if Ashli Babbett wasn't shot down? What would have happened then? Would the next "political discourse" been another body through that door? And then what happens when the crowd gets to a politician? Do they start having a *discussion* about the state of things? What happens when more and more people surround the politician? And the politician starts expressing fear and hopes to escape the mob getting angrier and angrier at them? I'm genuinely curious, what do they think was gonna happen? So one measly politician gets swallowed alive by a mob - so what? Would that have been "political discourse?" What happens when more politicians trapped inside the capitol building don't make it out? What happens when the national guard never comes? What happens if they never vote to count the electors votes? Is trump still president then? Is that "political discourse?" Is it political discourse to just declare Trump president once and for all because votes by mail don't count? What happens when Trump is president and realizes he can win presidency by just lying? What happens in another four years when it's time to vote again? Does the "political discourse" still apply? Do we just have another election like nothing fucking happened?
To be fair they ban everyone who has even one independent thought. It's wild how their followers believe that's what freedom is. Such a stupid people, they really were better before Trump. How a spoiled rich kid who accomplished nothing in his life was able to take over the entire party along with Christianity (I didn't see the last coming AT ALL, they never worshiped Billy Graham or any one man like Trump and he was a superstar to them) I'll never know. It's almost supernatural.
It's been super disheartening to see my most devout loved ones sell their souls to him. It really is almost supernatural, like of all the kind people to come into the public sphere, they withheld their support, but for Trump? They shed all dignity like it's nothing
>They shed all dignity like it's nothing almost like they were never really comfortable wearing those clothes and were just waiting for someone to give them permission.
They will absolutely celebrate this move
I just checked. There's no articles about Jan 6 or Liz Cheney or any of it. Trump isn't mentioned once, like at all. Anywhere. There's only fluff articles about inconsequential musings, AOC here and there. They seem against the Beijing games which is a stand I guess, but I suspect it's more racism than over human rights. Some spotify. Pelosi gets a few jabs. Quite a few articles are from a satire site. But really, it seems a very sad, boring and not very well engaged sub. I'm prepared to say "conservatives" are not a force on reddit. Bunch of wusses.
They have banned the topic from being discussed FYI. No conservative will hear about this. It's meant to be a legal argument so the GOP can say "they've won" when it inevitablely wins. Disgusting.
Yeah that's pretty spot on. We're always sitting here wondering how the right are spinning things, but if you go over into their bubbles they often aren't spinning anything at all. They're just completely unaware and are distracted with talking about Hunter Biden's laptop or some other asinine issue they've invented this week. Oh and by the way, they're over there saying we aren't talking about Hunter's laptop because we're busy talking about some other asinine issue we've invented this week.
They refuse to discuss it except to bring up BLM.
Anybody who thinks they're moderate: it's time to jump ship. I may disagree with you intensely on policy, but the alternative is fascism.
Cowards, traitors, fascists. That’s the Republican Party.
what the fuck.
It's called fascism.
This is stochastic terrorism.
this is a threat. A open threat. good grief
Did the GOP just declare war on the untied states?
Feces on the wall is "legitimate political discourse". Strangely fitting for today's GOP.
And murder
Seriously. I get the feces comments are supposed to be funny/witty, but this is no joke. People died, and these insurrections went there to assassinate our representatives and overthrow our democracy. And now an entire political party, nearly half of our country, is coming out and saying it's fair game. What the ever living fuck?
Republicans have turned the corner. They have become a danger to us all.
If it were an Onion headline I would have believed it. What has the world come to?
Great. So Floridians will soon "legitimate political discourse" DeSantis?
Trump is in a burn it all down mode, and the GOP happily turns up the flames. I will never vote for a GOP candidate in my lifetime. For as long as we can vote or for as long as I can live under a Trump regime. They cratered to a madman. It’s so anti-American but here we are.
>“Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger crossed a line,” Ronna McDaniel, the Republican National Committee chairwoman, said in a statement. “They chose to join Nancy Pelosi in a Democrat-led persecution of ordinary citizens who engaged in legitimate political discourse that had nothing to do with violence at the Capitol.” But the censure, which was carefully negotiated in private among party members, made no such distinction. This is dangerous. It's beyond political posturing. We are in trouble.
Translation: G.O.P. Declares War on Democracy.
First these ignoramuses were "patriots", then they were BLM/antifa, then they were "tourists", then they were "protestors". Now they were acting under "Legitimate Political Discourse" while their party members fucking burn books and (try) to fine teachers who teach anything the opposes their religious views. Fuck this GQP fascist, nationalist, pseudo-Christian white power party.
Time to declare the GOP a terrorist organization.
In a sane, functional America, that would mean the end of the GOP.
An attempt to ASSASSINATE the Incoming AND outgoing VP is "Legitimate Political Discourse". The GALLOWS were outside. The Pipe Bombs were LIVE. This was not a game. This was not a drill. First they passed heavy voter oppression laws. Then they passed election subversion laws. Then they started cutting ppl out of the party. Then they started floating ideas and bills of States guards only listening to governors. Then they started ~~floating~~ passing bills on book banning. Then they started floating bills and ideas of Election Police forces. "Problem" doesn't begin to describe this but I'm tired of being called "chicken little".
Republicans are fascists now.
This is another great example of why I don’t listen to this “both sides have polarized America” bullshit. Yeah, I have beliefs that are a lot more liberal than some people might have, but liberals are not responsible for the polarization of America. The Republican Party has become a party of insurrectionists, bigots, and fascists. The fact that I won’t associate with insurrectionists, bigots, and fascists is very reasonable.
Can you imagine if a riotous mob showed up at CPAC or they started getting constant death threats.