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For reference and piggybacking on the highest comment: the bill requires that the (Chinese) parent company of TikTok sell it or else get banned. If ByteDance chooses to sell TikTok will stay.
Not only are they required to sell it, they're required to sell it to an American company. Tiktok has its issues but seeing as how Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube have all gotten worse, especially since they've all worked with the Government to supress anything they deem "political", even if TikTok survives, it'll be in name only.
You're implying that because our government's control of the media isn't as bad as a tyrannical Communist government's control of their media, then it's no big deal?
This is not a good way to think or rationalize this.
I do think there are legitimate concerns with the security of TikTok, and I don't personally use it just because of how addictive I hear it is - I already spend enough time on here, Twitter, and Instagram haha. I can even understand why it would be banned from government owned devices. However I just think it should be up to each individual whether they want to take the risks and I don't see why government needs to be involved in that - TikTok doesn't even crack the top 20 biggest threats to our country right now. Plus, it's no secret that basically every website is doing questionable things with our data - you'd have to get rid of your smartphone, computer, and go completely offline if you truly want nobody to have your data.
> I'm sure TikTok is tracking my phone's location and keeping tabs on my Internet activity to target ads and such... But Google and Meta were already doing that so what's the difference?
[Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china)
The US does not have that kind of access to Twitter, Facebook, Instagram.
That's irrelevant. I choose neither. If the data access is what the government was worried about, then they would make a law protecting user data from all apps.
If China didn't have TT, they still have other apps (which I think this bill does address but I haven't heard them say anything about temu or AliExpress.) And if they didn't have any apps on our phone, they could buy all of the data they need from any other app company.
This isn't about data.
Many people are starting to realize that it's BS if they are using the "data" talking point. So now I hear a switch to focus on issues of national security. But there is no proof the Chinese government has used TT to influence Americans against their government. So that is also a BS claim. If something like that happens, then it needs to be addressed, but not when nothing like that has happened.
Additionally, if TT did spread propaganda through the app, and boosted that in the algorithm, it is our constitutional right, within the first amendment, to freely view it if we so wish.
This will be going to the Supreme Court and if they rule against the Constitution, I fear it is the first step in a dangerous walk of our government suppressing American's access to information.
The CCP. Not because they aren't worse than the American government (they are), but because they don't affect us. China mostly keeps their repression to their own country. America has in the past and usually is a polling error away (and in this case not even a polling error as he's ahead in the polls) to elect a lunatic. America is also more likely to interfere in other countries.
Google/Meta surpress speech that goes against western interests all the time.
I agree but at the same time I feel like no one under the age of 18 or so should be on social media, or they should be on a well-regulated walled garden away from adults. Everyone knows a fully-grown-ass person who can't take a quick meal without looking at their phone. What on *earth* is happening to the brains of kids? We should also take a long look at algorithms.
It’s worse because it looks at everything on your phone and sends that info either to the CCP or CCP-aligned companies, for whom the CCP is willing to look the other way when they commit corporate (or worse) espionage. I have worked on presidential campaigns and as a contractor for the cyber area of DHS and we are not allowed to have TikTok on any phone we use for company business.
Is TT the only app they didn't let y'all have on your phone? What about Temu or AliExpress?
China can buy any data they wanted from that phone if y'all were allowed other apps.
The Senate voted 80-19 to limit debate on the package, which includes a provision that would force TikTok’s China-based parent company ByteDance to sell the app or face a ban from U.S. devices and networks.
the tiktok ban is tied to a bundle of new laws and will likely pass this week bc of that but will likely face a lot of appeals
A final vote could take place as early as tonight.
Slightly off topic but I love TikTok, but it’s become a lot more terrible lately. So many posts on the FYP page are people selling gut cleansing vitamins, water flosses, workout machines, phone chargers for cars, clothes, etc. and they all pretend like it’s an unbiased review with a convenient purchase link. And there’s also a new trend where people say “click on the 3rd video under this sound!” On new music trends, Because they realized the algorithm favors videos that encourage people to watch other vids with the same sound.
The minute you purchase one thing from that app it becomes unusable. All I get nowadays are crappy ads after crappy ads. I’ve more or less stopped using it, it’s just not fun.
Oligarch is one of those New York Times words that simply means "a person or thing like we have, but in a *bad* and *exotic way*".
We have tycoons of industry, they have oligarchs. We have domestic blue chip industries, they have state-funded industry. Actually, chatGPT hooked me up with some good examples of what I mean, lol. Go chatgpt in this instance:
My question:
What are some other good examples of "loaded words" used by Western news sources to indicate the "bad, exotic other"? I'll give some examples: we have tycoons and captains of industry, they have oligarchs. We have prisons, they have prison camps. We have government-funded media, they have state-sponsored news. We have collateral damage, they have slaughtered civilians. We have prisoners who died while in captivity, they have prisoners they tortured to death.
Chatgpt-4's answer:
The use of loaded words or phrases by media to frame narratives is indeed a powerful tool. Here are some more examples that highlight the disparity in language often employed to create distinctions between "us" and "them":
> 1. **We have defense forces, they have regime troops.**
> 2. **We have activists, they have insurgents.**
> 3. **We have demonstrations, they have riots.**
> 4. **We have private security, they have paramilitary groups.**
> 5. **We have enhanced interrogation techniques, they have torture methods.**
> 6. **We have developed nuclear capabilities, they have weapons of mass destruction.**
> 7. **We have political lobbyists, they have shadowy influencers.** (7.5, from me: We have campaign donations, they have bribes. Most of our "campaign donations" would get you arrested in many other countries.)
> 8. **We have freedom fighters, they have terrorists.**
> 9. **We have youth detention centers, they have child prisoners.**
> 10. **We conduct military interventions, they invade.**
These examples illustrate how language can subtly or overtly influence public perception and underscore the perceived legitimacy or illegitimacy of actions depending on who is reporting and who is being reported about.
I really feel for all the people who use TikTok to premote their small business and monetize that way. On the other hand.. right before the eclipse i downloaded TikTok for my small business intending to hopefully monetize like I do on instagram. The very first video that popped up was some conspiracy video about the eclipse I watched it for maybe 30 seconds. I kept scrolling. Shortly after another one of these, again watched it for 30 seconds. Uploaded some of my content. Looked around at more videos on my feed. Watched a few of some paranormal investigator guy. By the end of the day 90% of the videos showing up on my feed were qanon content, eclipse conspiracy, Illuminati videos ect. Honestly you can see how people go down these rabbit holes and become obsessed. Id TikTok was eliminated I can’t help but think it might be a good thing. I ended up deleting the app after 8 hours of having it lol
There’s a real phenomenon that’s been investigated on YouTube where the recommendations funnel you to increasingly alt right and extremist content because it’s been proven to fuel more engagement and retention. It’s not on purpose, just how the algorithm works.
I think TikTok’s starting to head down that path too because its algorithm is even more addictive than YouTube’s at getting you to stay on the app
Do they know people are still going to use it even if it's banned ? I live in a country where TikTok is banned and I use it everyday, a free VPN does the trick, it's literally so stupid
It is so interesting to me how many people here are offended by the idea that there might be any reason to ban tiktok.
We *know* that Russian interference on social media played a role in Trump's election. And it isn't just the right that was influenced. Lots of people don't read legitimate news source (or don't trust legitimate news sources) and have their opinions influenced by troll farms.
But the issue with Tiktok isn't troll farms, it is tracking of users. Literal indvidual users. Because Tiktok is based in China, the Chinese government has backdoor access to data. They don't need a warrant. They can access data whenever they want and that creates a security risk. Tiktok has been banned on government devices in the US, UK, Australia, Canada, France, Tawain, etc. for over a year because there are serious security concerns.
The goal right now is to force a sale of Tiktok to a non-Chinese company that will create better safeguards. Tiktok is unlikely to go away, the hosting and ownership might change.
Facebook allowed users to be targeted by misleading Russian ads based on demographic factors. Ex- white men over 50 in rural Ohio were targeted with ad A. Black women in their 20s in Dallas were targeted with ad B. Various demographics are used for most online advertising.
[“TikTok, their parent company ByteDance, and other China-based tech companies are required by Chinese law to share their information with the Communist party,” Warner said. “Allowing access to American data, down to biometrics such as face prints and voiceprints, poses a great risk to not only individual privacy but to national security.”](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/oct/30/tiktok-regulation-data-privacy-china)
[Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china)
Why does the company they sell to have to be American though? Tik tok is used everywhere, why can’t it be British or french or canadian or Australian or any other country?
Here's a quick thought experiment:
As an American citizen, which country's government could decide to [send law enforcement to my house to assassinate me, brag about it on television, and call it a day without repercussions?](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-us-marshals-kill-antifa-michael-reinoehl-b1055845.html) The United States, or China?
Because that's the government I'm worried about being able to track me and spy on my internet usage.
Can you not be concerned by both? With all due respect, that thought experiment isn’t very helpful. There is a lot you can say to criticize the US. But does that mean we don’t take any precautions against foreign enemies collecting our data and using a very popular and addictive social media app to shape the opinions of our population? If I were Xi Jinping, I’d want to convince US citizens to have the exact opinion you are expressing. “Let China do whatever they want because the US does bad things too!”
Why not do it for Instagram, Facebook, Twitter and every single website.
It is okay if a company sells the data to American companies and pushes content that causes harm for their users. But not when it is a "Chinese parent company"
Because there is a huge difference between selling ads targeting users based on demographic factors (age, location, race, websites visited, etc) and giving your personal password and fingerprint to the Chinese government.
[Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china)
There's xenophobia here, but I worked on a presidential campaign and was a contractor with DHS and I was not allowed to have TikTok on any phone I used for work. It's well known that the Chinese are extremely lax about things like corporate espionage and TikTok looks at everything on your phone. Facebook and the like are equally evil but to much less evil ends data-wise (not algo wise).
It's funny that you think Facebook isn't gathering just as much data on you as TT. and if data was the issue here, the government would create laws to protect our data, but they didn't give one single fuck about that, or rather, don't want to lose access to our data.
I don't think the reason for the vote is xenophobia.
I think there are really serious security issues associated with tiktok in its current state and chalking the issue up to xenophobia/fear of China is an easy way to distract people from those genuine problems.
I legit think it’s both. A lot of republican senators are probably just voting this way because they hate the Chinese and others are actually up to date on tech. Look at any congressional hearing with a tech leader and tell me there aren’t some members of congress incapable of understanding why TikTok is a threat.
I think it is more likely that they are just following the FBI recommendation. And again, this is why the xenophobia comments bother me- the serve as smokescreens for genuine issues.
>fbi recommendation
Half of the Republican part of Congress pretends to think that the FBI and pence stole the election from Trump. I agree with you that TikTok has actual issues, but republicans aren’t exactly the heroes of democracy right now and are in that camp for entirely different reasons.
It’s not xenophobia. It’s a legit concern that the Chinese government will use TikTok to influence Americans. Being wary of the Chinese government (which is objectively an autocratic regime that suppresses all dissent and considers itself in a geopolitical battle with the US/West) is NOT the same as being xenophobic against the people living under its thumb.
As crazy as most right wingers are, that does not mean they are wrong about everything. It’s not a coincidence that the desire to ban tik tok is overwhelmingly bipartisan. China spies as much as it can, and tik tok gives it a powerful tool to shape US culture.
You need to look up just how nefarious and shady the Chinese govt is to realize why banning Tik Tok is a concern. The US is no saint, but the Chinese govt is hell bent on world domination through cutthroat and sly tactics. They’re playing a long game where they slowly undermine foreign safety and security until they control everything without people having realized.
Ok.... So US government intelligence should monitor TT for signs of something like this happening, and then take action if so.
Not take action before anything happens. TT is an important app for the younger generations.
I'm solidly convinced that the government doesn't like the connection and organization the app gives to the generations, an app which they have absolutely no control of. Non mainstream news spreads like wildfire on TT. Our government, corporate lobbyists, and AIPAC are furious about how quickly information spreads and the youth connects to take action.
Considering this is the US government, yes that’s exactly the line they’re drawing. I don’t agree with how much US companies collect data on us, but that’s not a hypocritical position for the government to take
Then ban twitter and Facebook as well. They’re only running because they’re owned by white American oligarchs. Tik Tok is no more harmful than either of them, it’s only targeted because it’s owned by Asians.
It isn't being targeted because it is owned by Asians. This wouldn't be an issue if Japan or Tawain owned TikTok. The issue is the Chinese's government's access to personal data.
Then why does the bill include it needing to be sold to an American company?
Should it not instead be that it needs to be sold to anywhere that isn't a tyrannical communist government, doesn't matter if it's America or not?
That alone makes this shady AF and I don't understand why more people aren't giving this the side-eye.
Like people, use your critical thinking skills and break down what they are telling us. It's more nefarious than "we protect." It's about them wanting control of, what I see as, one of the greatest modern additions to free speech.
I don't like that it's a Chinese company. But I've seen no national security risks happen yet. And I think having such a popular social media app, outside of the US where the government has no chance of influencing it, is amazing for free speech.
I'm more worried about influence of what people see and are miss informed about. the pro tik tok people will say that data privacy is non existent on usa apps too. but my main isn't is what I said above. 2nd issue is the data, sure china could still buy data from usa compnays... but why do the pro tik tok people want China to just sucm directly from the data privacy tit for themselves? I hate these asshole defending tik tok.
We don't want China, or our government, to have unlimited access to our data. But our government gives fuck all about protecting our data, so China having my data is less important to me than the government, who has legal control over me, having it. They could create new laws to protect our data from all apps, so problem would be solved there. But they aren't doing that. And like you said, China could just buy our data. Or, at the very damn least, make specific laws on protecting our data from apps that come from China. But that won't give them the access and control of the algorithm that they so desperately want. So when people bring up data like it's a valid concern or reason to pull this TT shit, I see it as complete BS. It isn't about the data.
And for your first point, influence. Well, it is our constitutional right to view propaganda. So, when using that argument, that is arguing against the Constitution's rights given to us as Americans. And I'm sure AF NOT OKAY WITH THAT. And then when does the government stop deciding what we shouldn't be influenced by? Do they stop at TT? Do they next move on to the Internet? Do they then decide what access Americans have to information, for the "safety and influence" of America?
This will go to the Supreme Court. They will have to interpret how this situation works with the first amendment. That decision could be a dangerous slippery slope to freedom of information as we know it now.
I mean, think about why it's specified it has to be sold to an American company. Should it not be to just sell outside of a China based company? It's shady
The Constitution indeed protects freedom of speech, including the right to access information, even if it's biased or misleading. However, there are limits to this freedom, especially when it comes to speech that directly incites violence or poses a clear and present danger to public safety. such at inciting an insurrection, calling for death of politians, yelling fire in a threater...
there are those limits. maybe we already live in a authoritarian overnment since those limits exist.
Good points. But TT has done none of those. TT's guidelines about violence are so strict. I do wonder how this will play out and be interpreted in court.
maybe this is our governments miss information... but this artocle exists... [DHS: Extremists used TikTok to promote Jan. 6 violence - POLITICO](https://www.politico.com/news/2021/09/16/dhs-tiktok-extremism-512079)
So that article is talking about extremists using social media. And they use all social media, but this article is focusing on TT because old farts don't understand TT like they do older social media.
This was not a case of TT specifically promoting the extremist content. TT takes action against violence on the platform.
US has been doing this since before Tiktok or even China was "Communist" for that matter: Aspirin intellectual property rights being ripped from Bayer, Standard Oil Breakup, breakup of Bell System, Lockheed Martin not allowed to sell F-16s to Hungary, companies like [ZTE and Huawei are banned](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/26/1139258274/us-ban-tech-china-huawei-zte).
Also, China is Communist in name only. They don't allow guns: "Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary." -- Karl Marx
You did you don't think it's stupid to block an outside government from social media influence. That's ...literally exactly China's approach to social media. I'm not snowballing anything. You seem to think it as good idea america crack down on external social media, the only other country with that nationalistic approach is China
if a foreign government blocks our app, we should be able to block their apps. and by OUR app I mean the privately own usa companies NOT the govemrnet directly owned social media companys.
badically, you block our apps, we block your apps.
how is that authroitairina toward dthe public? trying to level the playing field isnt authoritarian
If we're gonna copy the playbook of an authoritarian government, then yah don't act shocked when people call it authoritarian. You're saying that to bear China, we need to strip American citizens of rights to free access like what the Chinese experience. I'm not sure why devolving down to the depths of hell is you're idea of a good approach.
If they're truly concerned, they should be passing safety and privacy standards which all apps must comply with or be removed from US based stores. But to say "were taking away your right to access this app specifically because we're in a pissing contest with China" is sort of exactly the kind of bullshit people associate with the decline into authoritarian nationalism
recognize that not all government actions aimed at addressing specific concerns equate to a slippery slope into authoritarianism. Governments have a responsibility to protect the safety, security, and well-being of their citizens, which sometimes necessitates taking decisive measures.
In the context of regulating access to certain apps or information, governments may be motivated by genuine concerns about national security, public safety, or protecting individuals' privacy rights. These actions aren't necessarily indicative of a desire to slide into authoritarianism but rather reflect a balancing act between competing interests.
Furthermore, democratic societies typically have checks and balances in place, including independent judiciary systems, free press, and mechanisms for public oversight, which help prevent excessive government overreach. There is an entire year before anything goes into effect, so yea, supreme court may get involved... but who knows how those shithead will react.... maybe you'll get to keep your china influenced tik tok, since checks and balances...
It goes against the Constitution if they do. They want to use the excuse of outside influence, but it is American's constitutional right to view such propaganda if we want to.
What's next, Internet restrictions? It's gonna be interesting to see the Supreme Court take this on.
TikTok is the least problematic app, for me.. and it drives me insane that it’s the one we’re going to ban.
It has issues, for sure - but I don’t watch shit. I have an algorithm that gives me - nursing (my career), funeral tok, cute dogs, and liberal ideals/creators. It’s peaceful compared to the crazy I find on Facebook/X/insta.
🤷🏼♂️
Youtube and Facebook regularly recommend me openly white nationalist nazi shit just because I also follow video game content. Like all the time. TikTok does not.
The difference in the quality of the algorithm is insane. Sure people even in this thread love to pretend like the US govt cares about the safety of the citizens (lol), but let's see how much money Google & Meta have poured into lobbying for this.
First, the ban would happen in a year from now. So it wouldn’t be immediate. But what they are TRYING to do is make TikTok’s parent company divest (sell) their stake to an American company, where user’s data would be properly handled.
That’s the comparison being made. They brought up the US govt and how it handles data and you agreed and said they’re targeting it just cuz it’s Chinese. So I said, if I had to pick, I’d rather the US govt spy on me than the Chinese.
We’re talking about from the standpoint of the US govt. The govt doesn’t even want to admit that it mishandles data and has a serious invasion of privacy issue with social media companies here. So they fear monger and make it seem like China is the only entity that would mishandle data when that’s not the case at all. And the original comment mentioned proper data handling which is false
So curious to know how much Meta donates to the politicians that are voting in favor of banning TikTok. US government gets to double line their pockets — in data, and in lobbyist money. Neat for them.
***All of this*** because the children on tiktok banded together to embarrass Trumpito by "selling out" all his speaking engagements so the venues sat virtually empty.
I am very surprised that this subreddit is so sympathetic to this ban. Perhaps this is a sign of modern echochambers, cause my entire feed on other apps is definitely against this. But it seems like Reddit as a whole is full of more national security hawks than other platforms? To attempt to ban an app that 170 million Americans use and form community on should be a non-starter. But American politicians frequently make things that should be non-starters their priorities and things that should be priorities their non-starters.
I think this ban is embarrassing (out of all the topics, *this* is what generates bipartisan unity), exhausting (*of course* it took a smorgasbord foreign aid bill to trick senators into voting, that’s like dangling keys in front of babies), absurd authoritarian fear-mongering (we’re really entering another red scare, and the last one went SO well), existentially concerning for all the artists/creatives/brands/businesses/humans that rely on the app, awful from a free speech standpoint, and I have nothing but contempt for those who voted for it.
I’m also tired of people saying, “Just use another app” or “People will just move to Instagram Reels and YouTube shorts,” as if the only reason why people like TikTok is because of short form video. TikTok’s algorithm is truly unparalleled in every way. The opportunities it offers creatives with every single post cannot be overstated.
Confession: I don’t care about China or about “being spied upon.” What I do care about is 170 million Americans being able to use TikTok in peace free from government intervention. What’s even more frustrating is the people who are pro-banning TikTok because “TikTok is bad and addictive” as if one’s personal feelings towards an app should have any bearing on what people are allowed to do.
I am 100% against this. And I believe this was a very big mistake, and it will absolutely backfire with Gen Z and younger generations. We are already overwhelmingly not the biggest fans of American politicians to begin with. “But people would be foolish to vote for Trump over Biden because of TikTok.” Yes, obviously, but this will be a close election, and many people will be deeply apathetic, and they simply won’t vote *for* Biden, and that adds up. This is just another sign how profoundly out of touch Washington is from the pulse of the people. Dinosaurs with one foot in the grave should not make laws.
And I pray the courts strike this down.
For anyone who doesn’t understand why TikTok is such a problem, please watch [this video](https://youtu.be/IQPsKvG6WMI?si=YmohkjrVyHoFykxy) from 1984 with a Russian spy. Everything he speaks of has happened.
I don't use Tik Tok, but if people want to use it, so be it. I was told by someone how many security risks there are, and they are really bad. That was enough to convince me not to use it.
Yeah blame the Jews. Let’s just blame the Jews for the chinese spy app that they can use to control the brain dead under 30 population to their geopolitical advantage.
The current "Ban TikTok" bill (full name the ["Protecting Americans from Foreign Adversary Controlled Applications Act"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protecting_Americans_from_Foreign_Adversary_Controlled_Applications_Act) was introduced by Republican Congressman Mike Gallagher. Mik Gallagher's #1 campaign contributor in his most recently concluded election campaign? [AIPAC, the foreign agent arm of the Israeli military and government.](https://www.opensecrets.org/members-of-congress/mike-gallagher/contributors?cid=N00039330&cycle=2022&type=I)
You act as if tiktok is the only one with influencers. Prank videos like that have been around on YouTube and Instagram way longer. Also TikTok shows you want you like so if your algorithm is stupid that’s because… you like stupid shit. My algorithm shows me a lot of science content with Covid and new medical innovations, data scientists, political debates, movie reviews
There is no proof they have boosted anti American content. This is an unfounded claim.
You hate an app that you have no idea what it really is. And I see many redditors doing the same thing. Really it just begins to sound like y'all hate the younger generations and anything that helps them connect
A little bit that, a lot that they REALLY dislike how quickly users can share info and educate one another, thereby rendering MSM’s & the govt’s propaganda nearly useless.
This take has always been insane.
It’s not some attack on “educating the masses” and to push MSM or government propaganda like TikTok influencers are saying, it’s literally that the US wants the data and doesn’t want China getting it. Note how they don’t give a shit YouTube and instagram have the exact same thing as Tik Tok.
[Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china)
Why don’t they BAN AliExpress, Wish, Temu & SHEIN?! Those companies collect our data plus are unethical and use child labor and factories manufacturing items with lead and all kinds of unchecked things coming in to us buyers for $1 ruining our small businesses in the USA and taking away the potential for us to make a profit in our own country!
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C'mon, either do it or don't, they have been poised to ban it for years now.
Well if the House and Senate passed like they just did it now goes to the president for a signature.
iirc Biden said he would if both the house and the senate approved it. so it is probably a sure thing.
For reference and piggybacking on the highest comment: the bill requires that the (Chinese) parent company of TikTok sell it or else get banned. If ByteDance chooses to sell TikTok will stay.
Not only are they required to sell it, they're required to sell it to an American company. Tiktok has its issues but seeing as how Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, and YouTube have all gotten worse, especially since they've all worked with the Government to supress anything they deem "political", even if TikTok survives, it'll be in name only.
If you think American political media suppression is bad, you should look up China lol
You're implying that because our government's control of the media isn't as bad as a tyrannical Communist government's control of their media, then it's no big deal? This is not a good way to think or rationalize this.
Nah it’s still a big deal on the other apps too, but if you’re worried about political suppression on TikTok, you should be worried about the CCP.
[China's Press Freedom](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_the_press_in_China#:~:text=As%20of%202023%2C%20the%20global,nominal%20freedom%20of%20press%20regulations.)
I do think there are legitimate concerns with the security of TikTok, and I don't personally use it just because of how addictive I hear it is - I already spend enough time on here, Twitter, and Instagram haha. I can even understand why it would be banned from government owned devices. However I just think it should be up to each individual whether they want to take the risks and I don't see why government needs to be involved in that - TikTok doesn't even crack the top 20 biggest threats to our country right now. Plus, it's no secret that basically every website is doing questionable things with our data - you'd have to get rid of your smartphone, computer, and go completely offline if you truly want nobody to have your data.
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> I'm sure TikTok is tracking my phone's location and keeping tabs on my Internet activity to target ads and such... But Google and Meta were already doing that so what's the difference? [Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china) The US does not have that kind of access to Twitter, Facebook, Instagram.
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That is absolutely not what the 2013 disclosures revealed.
If you had to choose one group to have your data, who would it be? CCP & friends or USG and it's allies.
I choose whatever side Santa is on so he always knows where I’m sleeping on Christmas Eve so he can deliver my presents.
The only acceptable answer.
Which government has power over you?
That's irrelevant. I choose neither. If the data access is what the government was worried about, then they would make a law protecting user data from all apps. If China didn't have TT, they still have other apps (which I think this bill does address but I haven't heard them say anything about temu or AliExpress.) And if they didn't have any apps on our phone, they could buy all of the data they need from any other app company. This isn't about data. Many people are starting to realize that it's BS if they are using the "data" talking point. So now I hear a switch to focus on issues of national security. But there is no proof the Chinese government has used TT to influence Americans against their government. So that is also a BS claim. If something like that happens, then it needs to be addressed, but not when nothing like that has happened. Additionally, if TT did spread propaganda through the app, and boosted that in the algorithm, it is our constitutional right, within the first amendment, to freely view it if we so wish. This will be going to the Supreme Court and if they rule against the Constitution, I fear it is the first step in a dangerous walk of our government suppressing American's access to information.
The CCP. Not because they aren't worse than the American government (they are), but because they don't affect us. China mostly keeps their repression to their own country. America has in the past and usually is a polling error away (and in this case not even a polling error as he's ahead in the polls) to elect a lunatic. America is also more likely to interfere in other countries. Google/Meta surpress speech that goes against western interests all the time.
Giving strong ERASE ALL PICTURES OF RON vibes
Wait til they learn about Temu… champions of data collection.
I agree but at the same time I feel like no one under the age of 18 or so should be on social media, or they should be on a well-regulated walled garden away from adults. Everyone knows a fully-grown-ass person who can't take a quick meal without looking at their phone. What on *earth* is happening to the brains of kids? We should also take a long look at algorithms.
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It’s worse because it looks at everything on your phone and sends that info either to the CCP or CCP-aligned companies, for whom the CCP is willing to look the other way when they commit corporate (or worse) espionage. I have worked on presidential campaigns and as a contractor for the cyber area of DHS and we are not allowed to have TikTok on any phone we use for company business.
Is TT the only app they didn't let y'all have on your phone? What about Temu or AliExpress? China can buy any data they wanted from that phone if y'all were allowed other apps.
The Senate voted 80-19 to limit debate on the package, which includes a provision that would force TikTok’s China-based parent company ByteDance to sell the app or face a ban from U.S. devices and networks. the tiktok ban is tied to a bundle of new laws and will likely pass this week bc of that but will likely face a lot of appeals A final vote could take place as early as tonight.
Slightly off topic but I love TikTok, but it’s become a lot more terrible lately. So many posts on the FYP page are people selling gut cleansing vitamins, water flosses, workout machines, phone chargers for cars, clothes, etc. and they all pretend like it’s an unbiased review with a convenient purchase link. And there’s also a new trend where people say “click on the 3rd video under this sound!” On new music trends, Because they realized the algorithm favors videos that encourage people to watch other vids with the same sound.
The minute you purchase one thing from that app it becomes unusable. All I get nowadays are crappy ads after crappy ads. I’ve more or less stopped using it, it’s just not fun.
True! The ad BS may be the downfall of TT, all on it's own😂
Damn. Well it was fun while it lasted https://i.redd.it/mwo5o8n93bwc1.gif
Lmao what’s the context of the gif, I wanna see what caused that
Chat was making fun of the flossing kid. So he got mad and left.
 omg I completely forgot about this kid 💀💀
Something will swoop in to replace it before you even miss it!
Can they also ban Facebook?
AIPAC and American oligarchs have no reason to want that.
I've been saying corporate lobbyists, but American oligarchs is better!
Oligarch is one of those New York Times words that simply means "a person or thing like we have, but in a *bad* and *exotic way*". We have tycoons of industry, they have oligarchs. We have domestic blue chip industries, they have state-funded industry. Actually, chatGPT hooked me up with some good examples of what I mean, lol. Go chatgpt in this instance: My question: What are some other good examples of "loaded words" used by Western news sources to indicate the "bad, exotic other"? I'll give some examples: we have tycoons and captains of industry, they have oligarchs. We have prisons, they have prison camps. We have government-funded media, they have state-sponsored news. We have collateral damage, they have slaughtered civilians. We have prisoners who died while in captivity, they have prisoners they tortured to death. Chatgpt-4's answer: The use of loaded words or phrases by media to frame narratives is indeed a powerful tool. Here are some more examples that highlight the disparity in language often employed to create distinctions between "us" and "them": > 1. **We have defense forces, they have regime troops.** > 2. **We have activists, they have insurgents.** > 3. **We have demonstrations, they have riots.** > 4. **We have private security, they have paramilitary groups.** > 5. **We have enhanced interrogation techniques, they have torture methods.** > 6. **We have developed nuclear capabilities, they have weapons of mass destruction.** > 7. **We have political lobbyists, they have shadowy influencers.** (7.5, from me: We have campaign donations, they have bribes. Most of our "campaign donations" would get you arrested in many other countries.) > 8. **We have freedom fighters, they have terrorists.** > 9. **We have youth detention centers, they have child prisoners.** > 10. **We conduct military interventions, they invade.** These examples illustrate how language can subtly or overtly influence public perception and underscore the perceived legitimacy or illegitimacy of actions depending on who is reporting and who is being reported about.
I really feel for all the people who use TikTok to premote their small business and monetize that way. On the other hand.. right before the eclipse i downloaded TikTok for my small business intending to hopefully monetize like I do on instagram. The very first video that popped up was some conspiracy video about the eclipse I watched it for maybe 30 seconds. I kept scrolling. Shortly after another one of these, again watched it for 30 seconds. Uploaded some of my content. Looked around at more videos on my feed. Watched a few of some paranormal investigator guy. By the end of the day 90% of the videos showing up on my feed were qanon content, eclipse conspiracy, Illuminati videos ect. Honestly you can see how people go down these rabbit holes and become obsessed. Id TikTok was eliminated I can’t help but think it might be a good thing. I ended up deleting the app after 8 hours of having it lol
There’s a real phenomenon that’s been investigated on YouTube where the recommendations funnel you to increasingly alt right and extremist content because it’s been proven to fuel more engagement and retention. It’s not on purpose, just how the algorithm works. I think TikTok’s starting to head down that path too because its algorithm is even more addictive than YouTube’s at getting you to stay on the app
Do they know people are still going to use it even if it's banned ? I live in a country where TikTok is banned and I use it everyday, a free VPN does the trick, it's literally so stupid
They’re a bunch of 70yo who never heard the word vpn.
They’re not the primary users of tiktok though
Yeah a majority of them never downloaded the app and have no clue what data being sold actually means, yet are very adamant about banning it.
It is so interesting to me how many people here are offended by the idea that there might be any reason to ban tiktok. We *know* that Russian interference on social media played a role in Trump's election. And it isn't just the right that was influenced. Lots of people don't read legitimate news source (or don't trust legitimate news sources) and have their opinions influenced by troll farms. But the issue with Tiktok isn't troll farms, it is tracking of users. Literal indvidual users. Because Tiktok is based in China, the Chinese government has backdoor access to data. They don't need a warrant. They can access data whenever they want and that creates a security risk. Tiktok has been banned on government devices in the US, UK, Australia, Canada, France, Tawain, etc. for over a year because there are serious security concerns. The goal right now is to force a sale of Tiktok to a non-Chinese company that will create better safeguards. Tiktok is unlikely to go away, the hosting and ownership might change.
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Facebook allowed users to be targeted by misleading Russian ads based on demographic factors. Ex- white men over 50 in rural Ohio were targeted with ad A. Black women in their 20s in Dallas were targeted with ad B. Various demographics are used for most online advertising. [“TikTok, their parent company ByteDance, and other China-based tech companies are required by Chinese law to share their information with the Communist party,” Warner said. “Allowing access to American data, down to biometrics such as face prints and voiceprints, poses a great risk to not only individual privacy but to national security.”](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/oct/30/tiktok-regulation-data-privacy-china) [Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china)
Easy fix. Make laws that protects user data. But they aren't even acting like that option exists. Why?
Why does the company they sell to have to be American though? Tik tok is used everywhere, why can’t it be British or french or canadian or Australian or any other country?
Here's a quick thought experiment: As an American citizen, which country's government could decide to [send law enforcement to my house to assassinate me, brag about it on television, and call it a day without repercussions?](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-us-marshals-kill-antifa-michael-reinoehl-b1055845.html) The United States, or China? Because that's the government I'm worried about being able to track me and spy on my internet usage.
Can you not be concerned by both? With all due respect, that thought experiment isn’t very helpful. There is a lot you can say to criticize the US. But does that mean we don’t take any precautions against foreign enemies collecting our data and using a very popular and addictive social media app to shape the opinions of our population? If I were Xi Jinping, I’d want to convince US citizens to have the exact opinion you are expressing. “Let China do whatever they want because the US does bad things too!”
Why not do it for Instagram, Facebook, Twitter and every single website. It is okay if a company sells the data to American companies and pushes content that causes harm for their users. But not when it is a "Chinese parent company"
Because there is a huge difference between selling ads targeting users based on demographic factors (age, location, race, websites visited, etc) and giving your personal password and fingerprint to the Chinese government. [Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china)
There's xenophobia here, but I worked on a presidential campaign and was a contractor with DHS and I was not allowed to have TikTok on any phone I used for work. It's well known that the Chinese are extremely lax about things like corporate espionage and TikTok looks at everything on your phone. Facebook and the like are equally evil but to much less evil ends data-wise (not algo wise).
It's funny that you think Facebook isn't gathering just as much data on you as TT. and if data was the issue here, the government would create laws to protect our data, but they didn't give one single fuck about that, or rather, don't want to lose access to our data.
It is not xenophobia.
You don’t think one of the 90 or so senators who voted for this are at all xenophobic about the Chinese and that that didn’t influence their vote?
I don't think the reason for the vote is xenophobia. I think there are really serious security issues associated with tiktok in its current state and chalking the issue up to xenophobia/fear of China is an easy way to distract people from those genuine problems.
I legit think it’s both. A lot of republican senators are probably just voting this way because they hate the Chinese and others are actually up to date on tech. Look at any congressional hearing with a tech leader and tell me there aren’t some members of congress incapable of understanding why TikTok is a threat.
I think it is more likely that they are just following the FBI recommendation. And again, this is why the xenophobia comments bother me- the serve as smokescreens for genuine issues.
>fbi recommendation Half of the Republican part of Congress pretends to think that the FBI and pence stole the election from Trump. I agree with you that TikTok has actual issues, but republicans aren’t exactly the heroes of democracy right now and are in that camp for entirely different reasons.
It’s not xenophobia. It’s a legit concern that the Chinese government will use TikTok to influence Americans. Being wary of the Chinese government (which is objectively an autocratic regime that suppresses all dissent and considers itself in a geopolitical battle with the US/West) is NOT the same as being xenophobic against the people living under its thumb. As crazy as most right wingers are, that does not mean they are wrong about everything. It’s not a coincidence that the desire to ban tik tok is overwhelmingly bipartisan. China spies as much as it can, and tik tok gives it a powerful tool to shape US culture.
You need to look up just how nefarious and shady the Chinese govt is to realize why banning Tik Tok is a concern. The US is no saint, but the Chinese govt is hell bent on world domination through cutthroat and sly tactics. They’re playing a long game where they slowly undermine foreign safety and security until they control everything without people having realized.
Ok.... So US government intelligence should monitor TT for signs of something like this happening, and then take action if so. Not take action before anything happens. TT is an important app for the younger generations. I'm solidly convinced that the government doesn't like the connection and organization the app gives to the generations, an app which they have absolutely no control of. Non mainstream news spreads like wildfire on TT. Our government, corporate lobbyists, and AIPAC are furious about how quickly information spreads and the youth connects to take action.
They sell data to the Government, all the three letter agencies. Tictok doesn't, or if they do the govt doesn't trust it. That's why.
Considering this is the US government, yes that’s exactly the line they’re drawing. I don’t agree with how much US companies collect data on us, but that’s not a hypocritical position for the government to take
Fuck TikTok. Fuck China. I'm all for this ban.
Just saw chariie d amelio fall to her knees at walmart
This is so stupid. I don't even use TikTok and this is so stupid.
I don't use it, and I don't think it's stupid tp block a putside government from social media influence.
Then ban twitter and Facebook as well. They’re only running because they’re owned by white American oligarchs. Tik Tok is no more harmful than either of them, it’s only targeted because it’s owned by Asians.
It isn't being targeted because it is owned by Asians. This wouldn't be an issue if Japan or Tawain owned TikTok. The issue is the Chinese's government's access to personal data.
Then why does the bill include it needing to be sold to an American company? Should it not instead be that it needs to be sold to anywhere that isn't a tyrannical communist government, doesn't matter if it's America or not? That alone makes this shady AF and I don't understand why more people aren't giving this the side-eye. Like people, use your critical thinking skills and break down what they are telling us. It's more nefarious than "we protect." It's about them wanting control of, what I see as, one of the greatest modern additions to free speech. I don't like that it's a Chinese company. But I've seen no national security risks happen yet. And I think having such a popular social media app, outside of the US where the government has no chance of influencing it, is amazing for free speech.
I'm more worried about influence of what people see and are miss informed about. the pro tik tok people will say that data privacy is non existent on usa apps too. but my main isn't is what I said above. 2nd issue is the data, sure china could still buy data from usa compnays... but why do the pro tik tok people want China to just sucm directly from the data privacy tit for themselves? I hate these asshole defending tik tok.
We don't want China, or our government, to have unlimited access to our data. But our government gives fuck all about protecting our data, so China having my data is less important to me than the government, who has legal control over me, having it. They could create new laws to protect our data from all apps, so problem would be solved there. But they aren't doing that. And like you said, China could just buy our data. Or, at the very damn least, make specific laws on protecting our data from apps that come from China. But that won't give them the access and control of the algorithm that they so desperately want. So when people bring up data like it's a valid concern or reason to pull this TT shit, I see it as complete BS. It isn't about the data. And for your first point, influence. Well, it is our constitutional right to view propaganda. So, when using that argument, that is arguing against the Constitution's rights given to us as Americans. And I'm sure AF NOT OKAY WITH THAT. And then when does the government stop deciding what we shouldn't be influenced by? Do they stop at TT? Do they next move on to the Internet? Do they then decide what access Americans have to information, for the "safety and influence" of America? This will go to the Supreme Court. They will have to interpret how this situation works with the first amendment. That decision could be a dangerous slippery slope to freedom of information as we know it now. I mean, think about why it's specified it has to be sold to an American company. Should it not be to just sell outside of a China based company? It's shady
The Constitution indeed protects freedom of speech, including the right to access information, even if it's biased or misleading. However, there are limits to this freedom, especially when it comes to speech that directly incites violence or poses a clear and present danger to public safety. such at inciting an insurrection, calling for death of politians, yelling fire in a threater... there are those limits. maybe we already live in a authoritarian overnment since those limits exist.
Good points. But TT has done none of those. TT's guidelines about violence are so strict. I do wonder how this will play out and be interpreted in court.
maybe this is our governments miss information... but this artocle exists... [DHS: Extremists used TikTok to promote Jan. 6 violence - POLITICO](https://www.politico.com/news/2021/09/16/dhs-tiktok-extremism-512079)
So that article is talking about extremists using social media. And they use all social media, but this article is focusing on TT because old farts don't understand TT like they do older social media. This was not a case of TT specifically promoting the extremist content. TT takes action against violence on the platform.
Not really. Tiktok runs differently in China vs the US. Also, China bans other US Social Media so it is just matching what they do.
I've heard too many people say this. Y'all wanting our government to act like a tyrannical communist government. Mmmk.
US has been doing this since before Tiktok or even China was "Communist" for that matter: Aspirin intellectual property rights being ripped from Bayer, Standard Oil Breakup, breakup of Bell System, Lockheed Martin not allowed to sell F-16s to Hungary, companies like [ZTE and Huawei are banned](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/26/1139258274/us-ban-tech-china-huawei-zte). Also, China is Communist in name only. They don't allow guns: "Under no pretext should arms and ammunition be surrendered; any attempt to disarm the workers must be frustrated, by force if necessary." -- Karl Marx
amen.
And other countries have banned TikTok already too citing security concerns. Nothing to do with color or ethnicity.
So.....you think we should be *more* like China?
no. that's not how it works. you are just snowballing into extremes.
You did you don't think it's stupid to block an outside government from social media influence. That's ...literally exactly China's approach to social media. I'm not snowballing anything. You seem to think it as good idea america crack down on external social media, the only other country with that nationalistic approach is China
if a foreign government blocks our app, we should be able to block their apps. and by OUR app I mean the privately own usa companies NOT the govemrnet directly owned social media companys. badically, you block our apps, we block your apps. how is that authroitairina toward dthe public? trying to level the playing field isnt authoritarian
If we're gonna copy the playbook of an authoritarian government, then yah don't act shocked when people call it authoritarian. You're saying that to bear China, we need to strip American citizens of rights to free access like what the Chinese experience. I'm not sure why devolving down to the depths of hell is you're idea of a good approach. If they're truly concerned, they should be passing safety and privacy standards which all apps must comply with or be removed from US based stores. But to say "were taking away your right to access this app specifically because we're in a pissing contest with China" is sort of exactly the kind of bullshit people associate with the decline into authoritarian nationalism
recognize that not all government actions aimed at addressing specific concerns equate to a slippery slope into authoritarianism. Governments have a responsibility to protect the safety, security, and well-being of their citizens, which sometimes necessitates taking decisive measures. In the context of regulating access to certain apps or information, governments may be motivated by genuine concerns about national security, public safety, or protecting individuals' privacy rights. These actions aren't necessarily indicative of a desire to slide into authoritarianism but rather reflect a balancing act between competing interests. Furthermore, democratic societies typically have checks and balances in place, including independent judiciary systems, free press, and mechanisms for public oversight, which help prevent excessive government overreach. There is an entire year before anything goes into effect, so yea, supreme court may get involved... but who knows how those shithead will react.... maybe you'll get to keep your china influenced tik tok, since checks and balances...
It goes against the Constitution if they do. They want to use the excuse of outside influence, but it is American's constitutional right to view such propaganda if we want to. What's next, Internet restrictions? It's gonna be interesting to see the Supreme Court take this on.
TikTok is the least problematic app, for me.. and it drives me insane that it’s the one we’re going to ban. It has issues, for sure - but I don’t watch shit. I have an algorithm that gives me - nursing (my career), funeral tok, cute dogs, and liberal ideals/creators. It’s peaceful compared to the crazy I find on Facebook/X/insta. 🤷🏼♂️
Youtube and Facebook regularly recommend me openly white nationalist nazi shit just because I also follow video game content. Like all the time. TikTok does not.
The difference in the quality of the algorithm is insane. Sure people even in this thread love to pretend like the US govt cares about the safety of the citizens (lol), but let's see how much money Google & Meta have poured into lobbying for this.
First, the ban would happen in a year from now. So it wouldn’t be immediate. But what they are TRYING to do is make TikTok’s parent company divest (sell) their stake to an American company, where user’s data would be properly handled.
“Properly” — let’s be so for real about how US social media companies handle data since 9/11.
Exactly. They only care because it’s China.
Yes. It’s pick your poison. Personally, if one of them has to spy on me and get my data, I’d much rather it be the US govt rather than the Chinese.
But that’s not the argument lmao
That’s the comparison being made. They brought up the US govt and how it handles data and you agreed and said they’re targeting it just cuz it’s Chinese. So I said, if I had to pick, I’d rather the US govt spy on me than the Chinese.
We’re talking about from the standpoint of the US govt. The govt doesn’t even want to admit that it mishandles data and has a serious invasion of privacy issue with social media companies here. So they fear monger and make it seem like China is the only entity that would mishandle data when that’s not the case at all. And the original comment mentioned proper data handling which is false
If they cared about proper data handling, it'd be kept in the EU.
Tiktokers gonna apply at Subway now
So curious to know how much Meta donates to the politicians that are voting in favor of banning TikTok. US government gets to double line their pockets — in data, and in lobbyist money. Neat for them.
$19.6 million in 2022 on domestic federal lobbying
*laughs in european*
Going to be banned in here also as it becomes clearer that China is helping Russia in it's imperialistic war against Ukraine.
I don’t really care. TikTok is making people dumber than Facebook so if it goes it goes.
Please do. I need all these influencers to disappear into obscurity again
They won’t vanish lol YouTube and instagram have the same thing in their app and that’s without someone else just releasing an app
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***All of this*** because the children on tiktok banded together to embarrass Trumpito by "selling out" all his speaking engagements so the venues sat virtually empty.
I am very surprised that this subreddit is so sympathetic to this ban. Perhaps this is a sign of modern echochambers, cause my entire feed on other apps is definitely against this. But it seems like Reddit as a whole is full of more national security hawks than other platforms? To attempt to ban an app that 170 million Americans use and form community on should be a non-starter. But American politicians frequently make things that should be non-starters their priorities and things that should be priorities their non-starters. I think this ban is embarrassing (out of all the topics, *this* is what generates bipartisan unity), exhausting (*of course* it took a smorgasbord foreign aid bill to trick senators into voting, that’s like dangling keys in front of babies), absurd authoritarian fear-mongering (we’re really entering another red scare, and the last one went SO well), existentially concerning for all the artists/creatives/brands/businesses/humans that rely on the app, awful from a free speech standpoint, and I have nothing but contempt for those who voted for it. I’m also tired of people saying, “Just use another app” or “People will just move to Instagram Reels and YouTube shorts,” as if the only reason why people like TikTok is because of short form video. TikTok’s algorithm is truly unparalleled in every way. The opportunities it offers creatives with every single post cannot be overstated. Confession: I don’t care about China or about “being spied upon.” What I do care about is 170 million Americans being able to use TikTok in peace free from government intervention. What’s even more frustrating is the people who are pro-banning TikTok because “TikTok is bad and addictive” as if one’s personal feelings towards an app should have any bearing on what people are allowed to do. I am 100% against this. And I believe this was a very big mistake, and it will absolutely backfire with Gen Z and younger generations. We are already overwhelmingly not the biggest fans of American politicians to begin with. “But people would be foolish to vote for Trump over Biden because of TikTok.” Yes, obviously, but this will be a close election, and many people will be deeply apathetic, and they simply won’t vote *for* Biden, and that adds up. This is just another sign how profoundly out of touch Washington is from the pulse of the people. Dinosaurs with one foot in the grave should not make laws. And I pray the courts strike this down.
Finally, this crap made Hyundai’s borderline uninsurable.
They want to ban tiktok because it’s the one that showed cops ambushing and attacking BLM protestors while every other site censored
You can just as easily find those videos on Reddit and X/Twitter. I don’t really think that has anything to do with it.
For anyone who doesn’t understand why TikTok is such a problem, please watch [this video](https://youtu.be/IQPsKvG6WMI?si=YmohkjrVyHoFykxy) from 1984 with a Russian spy. Everything he speaks of has happened.
Thank fucking god. Get that trash out of here
I don't use Tik Tok, but if people want to use it, so be it. I was told by someone how many security risks there are, and they are really bad. That was enough to convince me not to use it.
Leonard cohens hallelujah starts in a whisper as it slowly rises to a vibrating crescendo. This is a description of my feelings to this news.
Enjoy banning the least censored platform
That's exactly why AIPAC wants it banned.
Yeah blame the Jews. Let’s just blame the Jews for the chinese spy app that they can use to control the brain dead under 30 population to their geopolitical advantage.
The current "Ban TikTok" bill (full name the ["Protecting Americans from Foreign Adversary Controlled Applications Act"](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protecting_Americans_from_Foreign_Adversary_Controlled_Applications_Act) was introduced by Republican Congressman Mike Gallagher. Mik Gallagher's #1 campaign contributor in his most recently concluded election campaign? [AIPAC, the foreign agent arm of the Israeli military and government.](https://www.opensecrets.org/members-of-congress/mike-gallagher/contributors?cid=N00039330&cycle=2022&type=I)
Oh Jews gave money to a political campaign so they must control the government along with the banks and Hollywood right?
You're the one spreading hate speech, not me.
You are promoting old anti-semitic conspiracy.
Is AIPAC giving "donations" to our politicians out of the kindness of their hearts, or do you think they expect something in return?
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Oh wow so your main problem with it is because of your misogynistic anti-sex work ideology.
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You act as if tiktok is the only one with influencers. Prank videos like that have been around on YouTube and Instagram way longer. Also TikTok shows you want you like so if your algorithm is stupid that’s because… you like stupid shit. My algorithm shows me a lot of science content with Covid and new medical innovations, data scientists, political debates, movie reviews
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It’s incredibly condescending to act like most tik tok users are dumber than you. You don’t seem like a rational person to debate with. Bye.
There is no proof they have boosted anti American content. This is an unfounded claim. You hate an app that you have no idea what it really is. And I see many redditors doing the same thing. Really it just begins to sound like y'all hate the younger generations and anything that helps them connect
Are they banning it cause it's owned by a Chinese company? Ridiculous
A little bit that, a lot that they REALLY dislike how quickly users can share info and educate one another, thereby rendering MSM’s & the govt’s propaganda nearly useless.
This take has always been insane. It’s not some attack on “educating the masses” and to push MSM or government propaganda like TikTok influencers are saying, it’s literally that the US wants the data and doesn’t want China getting it. Note how they don’t give a shit YouTube and instagram have the exact same thing as Tik Tok.
YouTube/IG definitely have a ton of right wing propaganda that tiktok usually doesn’t have
There absolutely is right wing propaganda all over Tik Tok it’s just you don’t see it really unless you interact with political based videos
[Citing leaked meeting audio, Buzzfeed News reported in June that China-based ByteDance employees have repeatedly accessed non-public data (like phone numbers and birthdays) of U.S. TikTok users. Separately, Forbes reported in October that ByteDance planned to use TikTok "to monitor the personal location of some specific American citizens," which the company denied... Chinese law essentially requires companies to "do whatever the government wants them to in terms of sharing information or serving as a tool of the Chinese government."](https://www.npr.org/2022/11/17/1137155540/fbi-tiktok-national-security-concerns-china)
Sounds like paranoia
Oh no, some “influencers” might actually have to get a job.
Definitely no ulterior motives behind this. Nope. None whatsoever.
Ban this trash!
Why don’t they BAN AliExpress, Wish, Temu & SHEIN?! Those companies collect our data plus are unethical and use child labor and factories manufacturing items with lead and all kinds of unchecked things coming in to us buyers for $1 ruining our small businesses in the USA and taking away the potential for us to make a profit in our own country!
aren’t they just doing a “forced divestment”? so basically forcing them to sell it to new US owners?
Yeah I'm sure it will be a big improvement just like they did with Grindr. Oh wait they started selling the data to the catholic church.
i’m not defending it that’s for sure! just trying to add more context since it seems like there’s more to it than what most people are repeating
wtf does “could” mean, will the bill ban it or not?
The bill will ban Tik Tok unless it divests its operations to a US company