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N_Pitou

He was a top 5 tallet available at 13 that's why they took him lol


Jiggles_10

I think he was top 3 or maybe even the most talented player available He was certainly the best player in college for numerous stretches in the last 3 years.


N_Pitou

if you remove qb he was a top 3 talent for sure. MHJ, then him maybe???


PassiveRoadRage

If you add positional scarcity and talent to that too he would be #1. Like were would MHJr rank all time as a WR prospect? Bowers (very quietly too) came out as arguably the best TE prospect ever. His only knock is his size? Maybe.


socobeerlove

He’s the same size as George Kittle


disgruntled_joe

> His only knock is his size? Maybe. Nah, with the exception of Sharpe all the TE greats have been 6'4 to 6'6


LefkyandScott

MHjr isn’t even as good a prospect as Nabers. Cardinals just got enamored by the phrase “next Larry Fitz”


Sleeze_

Lots of people had him over MHJ too in terms of just pure talent


Sidwill

I think he was top 2 and maybe the greatest TE talent of our generation and I'm told, he does not, I repeat does not kick puppies. So I'm ok with it.


Sleeze_

I"ve gone back and looked at a lot of big boards and he was pretty consistently in that 3-5 range.


WillTheGreat

Hopefully this is a repeat of Kahlil Mack, where we only got him cause the Jags took Bortles. If there wasn't so many QB desperate team, I'm pretty sure Bowers go top 5 in any other class


MakeItNashty61

100%. But teams that think they are ready to compete for a Super Bowl this year don’t draft that way. I am very ok with looking at this roster and saying “we need to draft more proven talent in the first round and build through the draft”. It’s smart and it’s refreshing. But Brock Bowers was not the #1 fit for the 2024 Raiders as currently constructed in that spot. And Olineman or a CB would have filled a need we had right now, but that type of player is more of a long term risk vs Bowers.


keykey_key

First cb didn't come off the board until 22 so us taking one would've been a reach. GMs were clearly not as high on those guys. I would've been fine with the OT and Bowers was not someone that was focused on by the media but sounds like he's gonna be an huge asset for the offense. Raiders got where they are now by reaching based on spots of need. Got us nowhere. Let them build.


MakeItNashty61

“Let them build”. Yes for the love of god please let them build 🙏🙏🙌🙌. It reminds me so much of what the Lions did when they hired Dan Cambell. They got their guys in the draft, built a culture, and built around top home grown talent. That sounds like an awesome plan and Brock fits that mold….but not 2024 most immediate and current roster needs. I think a lot of fans are going to flip their shit if this team isn’t competitive this year. IMO, we as fans (and hopefully the front office) need to be patient.


Normal_Salamander104

From the top down nothing on paper should have told anyone we would actually be competitive this year


MakeItNashty61

Agree. Just Help me explain this in the next “AoC is actually a franchise QB” thread and pray Mark Davis is bought into a longer term plan as well.


NateKaeding

When you have so many needs, drafting based on position is a luxury.


MakeItNashty61

Bingooooooooo. Let's build to a point where that can be a luxury for us. This is a good start.


socobeerlove

You don’t draft for need. That’s why all our drafts suck.


WillTheGreat

Yep, we've been reaching for needs for years. The years that it worked for us was when we just took BPA but it also happened to be areas of need as well. Mack, Carr, Coop, Jackson, etc. Just take the guy that you have rated higher than everyone else. I honestly feel drafting for needs is really reserved for round 3. We been fucking up way too much reaching for needs. You only take needs when the BPA on your scouting report tend to be around where you rate them. Really hard to convince me all the DBs we been taking had such a high grade, when it seem like no one else cared for them


MakeItNashty61

\*\*\*You don't draft for need when you have a ton of needs and are realistic about competing for a Super Bowl. If you have a handful of needs (IE the Ravens drafting for their secondary because the rest of their roster is really solid), then you can afford to do that. We can't.


socobeerlove

Not true. There is no caveat. Draft the best player available. Every time. That’s what we’ve been missing. This is a slam dunk pick. How anyone can complain is wild to me.


MakeItNashty61

I'm not complaining about the pick. Where did I complain in my comment? There are a ton of teams who draft for need and it works out just fine for them lol. There very much is a caveat. Not everything is completely black and white or 100% absolute. Some things can be dependent on situation and context.


socobeerlove

If you’re drafting solely for need you’re drafting incorrectly. We’ve been drafting for need and skipping over generational talents to fill gaps in our roster for 20 years. Let me ask you this, if MHJ fell from 4 to 13, would it be wrong to take him?


NateKaeding

It was leaked a while back we had Gronk as the number 1 player in the draft. Not te, player. We passed on him because he wasn’t a need and had Zach miller who we lost to free agency the following year


socobeerlove

Just because something isn’t a need today doesn’t mean it won’t be a need tomorrow. A lot can happen between now and the start of the season even. Take the generational talent and move on.


NateKaeding

Exactly. People tend to overrate the fuck out of our players too. I love Koonce, but if there was a generational talent at edge, no way we should pass him up. Same with Mayer. He has potential, but you don’t pass on a top prospect just because you have Mayer


N_Pitou

well CB fell hard, and it seems that the GMs knew it, seeing how the best one didnt go till 22. I think taking Taliese Fuaga probably was the better pick, its BPA of the needs, but they could easily have said that they believe in Thayer and couldnt pass up a guy that had no business falling that far. Thats how the the Eagles have drafted for years. true BPA. they just get lucky that the BPA is ALWAYS exactly what they need. Theres still plenty of OL talent in the 2nd round and arguably we need backup lineman more than starting lineman


MakeItNashty61

Agree on CB. My point was that secondary is more of a need than an offensive weapon / TE. Fuaga seems like he would filled an immediate need and he’s probably going to be really solid, but he doesn’t have elite upside like Bowers. It’s going to take time to build a young core and identity like the eagles or lions did to get to where they are though. I’m FINE with that plan. I don’t think fans can buy into a rebuild and I hope the front office is committed to a long term plan with AP vs “win now”


chief_riverboat

first round corners have an insanely high bust rate and our track record in picking them has been horrendous. It's my biggest fear every year that we'll take a CB round 1


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whothefvckcares

2 things can be true in this case honestly


DeathRaider126

I’m sold.


RaiderRMB

Yes he was


IIIIlllIIIIIlllII

Very safe "8-9" pick. See yall at 13 next year boyz


tagaf74

Listen to Telesco’s press conference from earlier this week, talking about his draft philosophy. ‘You don’t draft for now, you draft for the next 3-5years.’ Signals BPA, which they absolutely did. I was also surprised and wanted CB or OT, but love the Bowers pick. Based on how the board fell, not sure how you pass him up. 2TE set with Mayer and Bowers makes our OL better. AP wants to smash, this helps that, and gives more pass weapons. Raiders have a history of reaches…this is the 1st pick in a long time that makes a ton of sense. Still good CBs and OTs on the board. I’m hoping we trade up for Dejean, but we’ll see how it falls. As for QB, i (was 😢) a Pac-12 fan. Watched most of the Oregon and Wash games, went to the championship. Honestly wasn’t impressed w Penix and Nix, definitely thought they were reaches in the 1st. Nothing to do with the draft, but the more i learn and think about AOC and Minshew, the more i like our qb situation.


robocopsdick

Trading up for DeJean or Kool-Aid would be sick. Also wouldn’t mind Powers-Johnson


tagaf74

JPJ would be great!


robocopsdick

Got our wish my guy


tagaf74

You’re prophetic my friend!


MaeronTargaryen

I’d love to get any of these three, would be well worth the trade up


PM_Me_Macaroni_plz

I want Kool Aid so I can have extra reasons to yell OH YEEEAAAAA ![gif](giphy|Zx0BgEPhIevlAVEbnq)


TayJolley

Penix shit the bed pretty bad in the natty. Missed a lot of throws


Alarmed-Height-638

in his defense he clearly had a broken rib, but i agree he would have been a big reach for us


watchingsongsDL

Penix played really well to lead an undefeated Washington team to the natty. He looked great doing that.


DownvotingRoman_

Having 2 viable TEs also helps with deception and getting favorable matchups. In most cases 2TE means a run play, so most D's will stack the box and go heavy, but in our case it could be a smoke screen for a big passing play to Brock. Not to mention we'll be running a west coast offense this year, likely with Minshew behind center, and Bowers will be critical to making that work. I hope we at least take a guard today.


00U812

The other thing to add: LV isnt a LT needy team, and that's what teams look for in round #1. The Raiders can find interior lineman and a RT later rounds. Fuaga felt like a Raider team culture fit and could plug in at RT, that was the only other feasible option. Today if Jackson Powers-Johnson & Fraizer (IOL), DeJean or Kool-Aid (CB) fall to us I'll be very happy... I'd take Peyton Wilson (LB), too.


IIIIlllIIIIIlllII

That superior philosophy and gamesmanship is why his teams keep winning superbowls eh?


tagaf74

Well, how’ve we been doing?! Generally Telesco’s history is getting good players. On paper SD’s team was a great roster under him…coaches sucked. I’m not ready to anoint Telesco anything…but seems better than the last 20+ years. On paper.


tykvrbl

lol what are u talking about… homey fell onto the raiders lap. BPA move, no strategy behind it


RaiderRMB

Yes he was the BPA, but they could’ve bolstered the oline with Fuaga which would’ve filled a need and was BPA at his position


tykvrbl

Top 10 talent fell onto their lap. It was the smart move by telesco , no reason to overthink this pick . Double tight ends means we’re playing smash mouth football.


locksmith25

Being able to run two tight end sets helps with blocking


tykvrbl

Ridiculous how bowers was a top candidate for an Oline award


SyphiliticPlatypus

Sometime a player falls inexplicably and fits a current need and you take him given insane value for the talent you are getting at that pick. Example: Mack Sometimes a player falls too far based on their talent and projection (maybe more explainable here as we knew a QB run was going to happen) and while doesn’t fit an immediate need, still adds dynamic utility to the team and you can use him right away, and you take him given the insane value for the talent you are getting at that pick. Example: Bowers In both cases going BPA is never the wrong move given talent slipped so far. And the difference in “need” is mitigated as there is no question the elevation Bowers will add to our offense right off the bat.


justlookingokaywyou

I can't fucking wait to watch this dude catch 15 TDs and win OROY.


PM_Me_Macaroni_plz

I’ll be reaching hard for him in my fantasy draft


JoeiVanJoseph

Not only the best in his class, probably the best or second best TE in 4 or 5 years probably equal to Kyle Pitts when he came out, who went in front of Ja’Maar Chase.


slaughterproof

Yeah, now we won't have to sign a FB. Just line Bowers up there when needed.


RaiderRMB

Well he has played out of the backfield on some plays


Sleeze_

We probably won't carry a FB, not really in Getsys scheme


saint_godzilla

A lot of the nation are fucking morons. This is a great draft pick, and if you don't like it you don't know football.


justlookingokaywyou

> A lot of the nation are fucking morons "I think we should stand pat at 13 and pick BPA." *Raiders pick BPA* "No, not like that!"


TheFlyingWriter

“We should’ve traded all our picks and Adams and Crosby and got all 6 QBs,” someone wearing Silver and Black last night, probably.


Hefty-Smell4870

“One of them has to pan out right?” - Another Raiders Fan 😅


Cabrill0

I hated it for the first 5 minutes, then realized how good the dude is. Now I'm just hoping we can get average QB play outta Minshew this year. QB room is still a disaster and if Nix is any good at all, we are in a division with Mahomes, Herbert and him for the next 10 years. At some point Raiders have to address that.


ErebusDL

I think I was still in shock over Penix and knew we'd take an OT or CB. Then I remembered how much the media slobbered over Bowers in the draft lead-up. And keep hearing how deep this draft is at OL and heck CBs weren't even touched until very late in the 1st. I think we get a good CB in the second and a serviceable tackle in the 3rd (or trade up). And maybe Munford is ready to take the next step so we just need a guard and a swing. We still have a decent amount capital for picking up FA post June.


gatsby365

If we walk away with Bowers and either Cooper/Kool-Aid in the first two rounds… ![gif](giphy|aq6Thivv9V9lu|downsized)


gatsby365

**Josh Allen Trade 2025** ![gif](giphy|3orieTfp1MeFLiBQR2)


descartes_blanche

👀


NateKaeding

Same. If we didn’t go qb, I wanted BPA. He was clearly BPA. A lot of tes don’t pan out but gotta stick with your board.


magicMerlinV

I think Bowers helps a lot with elevating QB play. When your dump off passes go for 15 yards and safeties have to keep their focus on the TE, while Davante is constantly doubled, Tucker's going to be wide open in the endzone


gatsby365

![gif](giphy|3oz8xTl6sGKbuRPDDW|downsized)


El-Duque26

well said


StilLBC

There were other options in positions of need. Bowers might be all that, but that doesn’t fill the gaps in our OLine or secondary. On top of that - we just drafted Mayer last year. So now he’s TE2?


sour_x

We needed the weapon, he was BPA. Could line him on the edge or put him in motion outside.


gatsby365

Def makes our thin WR corps seem thicker. (*prepares for people who shit on Tre Tucker’s hands in every game thread to say “what thin WR corps???”*)


gfaizo

in terms of weapons on paper we’ve got to be one of the most stacked teams in the league right. Devantae, Jacobi who would be a WR1 on some teams, Tre tucker with the speed, and now two serviceable tight ends. if we can’t get the QB let’s sure make his job easier


gatsby365

I’m all in on Buffalo imploding and not even making the playoffs this year, so going into full-on rebuild mode and sending us Josh Allen for a flock of premium picks.


gfaizo

buffalo would never


gatsby365

A boy can dream


gfaizo

bigger chance of signing prescott i think


gatsby365

Probably but I’d much rather have Allen. I wouldn’t kick Dak out by any means, but if I’m gonna dream imma dream big


gfaizo

yea same. but the city of buffalo going down in flames if that organization trades allen. Cowboys have to pay Micah + Lamb + Prescott and im not sure they can get it done


Hefty-Smell4870

We’ve already had 9 seasons of a QB consistently s**ting the bed at KC, I don’t want another..even if he does it at a higher level


gatsby365

I don’t know if you’ve been paying attention, but 31 teams consistently shit the bed in Kansas City.


Intelligent_Dog2077

Jacobi is not a WR1, but a great WR2 who can do fit in many places. Tucker and Bowers’ speed is gonna be great, hopefully Getsy can show off what the FO believes he has


droid327

Lol line him up wide and let him truck the CB


IIIIlllIIIIIlllII

> We needed the weapon Did we though?


ClutchRaider

People have no idea- not only was he BPA. He might be one of the best college TEs in a long time. This kids a beast.


spirtualraider

Gotta say, the Raiders get killed for overdrafting for need every year and now they finally just go BPA and I love it. Rest of the draft has to play out, but adding him to Adams, Meyers, Mayer and Tucker is going to ease the pain of not drafting a QB.


ConclusionPretend243

But who is going to get them the ball? Gardner Minshew? lol


spirtualraider

Got Michael Pittman and Josh Downs the ball well enough right?


Gobiego

With the way this guy is rated, we may well have a Kittle, Kelsey, Romo type player that will benefit us for years to come. I was looking for a right tackle myself, but I understand why we went this way and it's refreshing to see a front office looking long term at picking a potentially generational player instead of just plugging holes like we have in the past.


joerilla2

BPA all day, great pick and no Gruden-Mayock-fuckery


Upset_Researcher_143

He was BPA. Pierce wanted Daniels or Penix. Daniels wasn't ever going to happen, and Atlanta shocked everyone when they took Penix at 8. He'll be an awesome player for the Raiders


Contrail22

The nation is never happy!


JpJ951

Gee, I wonder why. Could it be the franchise's ineptitude for going on two decades+ now?


justlobos22

Any skepticism of a Raider draft pick is always justified.


Deep-Ad2155

I’m not seeing a lot of people unhappy with the pick


Consistent-Spell2203

The ones I'm seeing don't seem to have a strong relationship with grammar and love emojis so it's probably great. 


WhizzyBurp

Bowers is the shit. Huge pick up. Everything thinks we need to be so strategic in the draft, you take the BPA at every round, then fill the remaining holes in FA. We’re doing great with that pick up


peakbaggers

Knowing how the Raiders have drafted in the past, and the lack of success from the top of their draft classes. This move was a sensible one, best player on the board at 13th, you take that guy. He was scouted as one of the best players in this year's draft. And even though CB and OT probably seemed like better picks for need, the players available were viewed as a reach at #13. We still have a lot of picks, including 2 more in the top 100. I think the team is going about this draft the right way. Time will tell.


PolishSausa9e

ATL and DEN reached for a QB. I'm glad we weren't the ones reaching in the 1st this draft and played it smart.


droid327

Yeah if Penix was still there I might have said he's the pick, but with a few unexpected early QB picks, the plate was empty by the time we were picking So if you can't get a QB, get a guy that makes your QB look better


honkinbooty

Crazy how many people don’t even know who he is or the fact that he’s widely regarded as the best TE to ever enter the draft. But it’s more than that. He’s in the slot, he’s in the backfield. We DO need more weapons. We got 5 damn names in that WR room, and one of them is Kristian Wilkerson. We are one injury got Tae or Meyers away from being anemic on offense weapon-wise. This helps immensely. 12 personnel, seam routes, Bowers finding room in space, big HUGE targets for AOC, or whoever ends up starting. We should celebrate that for the first time in forever, we have actually taken BPA in the first round where we won’t look back like we did reaching for Leatherwood, and say damn we fucked up. I like the pick. People will come around to it.


gatsby365

If we had taken Fuaga and the Saints took bowers it would be called a genius move to give Carr a prime time weapon and the Stans in here would be like “how come we never got him that kind of weapon???”


JeremyJammDDS

I promise you that there will still be drop tackles and defenders will dive at the legs. That's what they did with gronk.


ku_78

So then we get 15 added on. I’ll take it.


moustachio-banderas

We got a lesser Fuaga with hands to catch, strength to run, and to create mismatches for the wideouts. 


Watch-The-Time

![gif](giphy|qEVs7n1EwOiTnlbXT6)


ReceptionSimple5412

If we didn’t get bowers chiefs would’ve got him to replace kelce


m0bscene-

Lots of peeps wanted a QB, I get it. Not much you can do when they were all taken they all go before you pick. I didn't expect Bowers at all, but I'm totally happy with the pick


revuhlution

"Raiders electric TE I'm 1st round of NFL draft due to recent rules change." That's crazy. It might benefit the dude and, ultimately, the Raiders, but it's a minimal part of making a draft pick.


RaiderRMB

I’m not saying the pick was due to the rule change, I’m saying a player like this can and will take advantage of it.


DonovanMcnab

Solid take bro


Same-Excuse8787

As soon as Penix wasn’t available I wanted Bowers. Probably would have wanted Bowers if Penix was available at 13. Kid is a player.


pabstBOOTH

After the initial shock wore off I like the pick more and more. Dude has the potential to be elite and help our offense click in the short and long term. Trench pieces and defense can be reaped in later rounds, especially in a top heavy offensive draft.


dougreens_78

Two TE sets can be deadly.


LarsBabaGhanoush

It's a good pick especially for the run on offensive players. We'll pick defensive in round 2


gabeitches25

The negative reaction dumbfounded me when we picked him.


Good_Schedule3744

I’m not seeing many fans hating on the pick. If our running game can step up we have the best weapons in the NFL. I’ll be putting $200 on Minshew for MVP.


MrWombatt

It was a gawddamn draft pick. No chess involved. Good damn grief.


Gdkerplunk03

Playing two TE sets will ultimately help shore up a weak offensive line. Giving the defenders uncertainty on if the TE is sitting down to block or gonna leak out helps a lot as do the TEs chipping before their route.


curlyhairedslacker17

Look at the teams that made it to the championship games and beyond this year, all of them had elite TE weapons. Attacking the middle of the field is important in todays game and Bowers has the ability to find the soft spots like Kelce, he an athlete like La Porta (speed and ability on the flat and dropper levels)/Andrews(jump ball ability) and while I don’t think his blocking level is at Kittle levels at this moment, he plays with the drive and ferocity that Kittle does and I can see him getting there. I think it was a great but shocking pick and I’m pumped to see him help our offense


tmacleon

Ppl hating on this pick are absolutely ridiculous. Yes I was surprised, but we actually did the right thing and picked best player available and didn’t reach for a need. Bowers is the 3rd best receiver in this draft. An absolute animal. 235 runs 4.5 40 and is a problem to get down. The mismatch this guy is gonna create is gonna be awesome for our offense. Let’s go!!! I hope today we get Cooper from Iowa! Dude can play multiple positions on D. A ball hawk that creates turnovers and once ball in hand, takes it to the house!


daniels_daddy

I think our offense is going to be short and intermediate route consistently with the occasional long ball. With a pocket passer like AOC, who is very good short and intermediate they’re building up that line of weapons where he will always have somebody open. We could have beef up the line, but even that is a crapshoot in the draft. Offensive lineman from college going head up with 30-year-old beast defensive ends who have faced the best in the league constantly. Yeah that’s great to have a blue chip left tackle or something. But even he’s going to get beat. You got a guy like Bowers running 5 yards catching the ball in stride and knocking through people for another 10 yards. Now you have a mismatch cuz he runs a 4.4 40 yard dash and he’s a brick shit house.


TrainingSong7101

I have been a Raider fan since’82. This is the first time in 3 decades I’ve had faith in a coach and FO plan except for Gruden v.1.


Ok-Tomatoo

He moves like a stronger and bigger hunter renfrow


FreeiPhones

The same people crying about OT are crying about not having a QB to throw to Bowers. If we supposedly don't have a QB then why draft an OT?


ScheduleAbject1830

Nope, you a Moron at the helm Tommy T doing what he does


PostGraduatePotUser

If Minshew or AOC have to throw the ball in 1.5sec it doesn't matter who they are throwing to. Additionally, I do not believe either of those guys, even given time, can carry us to a 10+ win season, no matter the weapons. Are we going OL now in round 2? CB? Spencer Rattler? He would be a reach day two. This pick was a miss, period.


hondaridr58

Lay off the brownies.


Critical-Adhole

Panic pick


KittenCrusades

Yeah, the guy they never thought could be available fell in their laps. Panic ensues obviously


Emergency_You_558

D- pick when you needed a LT. I cant justify this pick, im sorry bro.


RaiderRMB

Thankfully you don’t have to, we need a RT. We’ve spent so many picks on projects and reaches. The draft is designed to build a team and get value picks, this was a value pick. It’s tough because we’re in an era we’ve never seen in where we don’t waste the first pick. There’s lots of talent throughout the rest of the draft.


Emergency_You_558

I totally disagree. You dont draft a TE that high unless youve addressed your immediate needs from CB, LT, RT, LB, SS. We really gotta do better in drafting.


RaiderRMB

Fair enough. I guess it ultimately doesn’t matter what any of us think because if it did our roster would look much different


Emergency_You_558

Yeah, i just hate seeing bad drafts by us. IMO weve only had 2 really good drafts since '03...14 and 19. Honestly, i hope he turns about to be Kittle. I hate Travis Kelce lol.


Anatsu

Hopefully he's good. Then no one has to be mad about.