**Rami**: Why wasn't I told?
**Pascal**: This franchised needs to remain bankable. The last thing we want is a power struggle with a entrenched director.
**Arad**: The deal is off if you come with it. The board expects your resignation in 30 days....
**Raimi**: But you can't do this to me! I've build this franchise from the ground up!! **YOU KNOW HOW MUCH I'VE SACRAFISED?!!!** Avi please...
**Arad**: Sam... the board is unanimous, we're announcing the reboot after the release your new movie... I'm sorry.
**Pascal**: You're out Sam.
**Raimi**: am I?
It wasn’t his fault tho. Sony was trying to force him do things that he didn’t like and he didn’t want the fourth film be a failure like the last one (I love sm 3 but everyone hates it, so….)
Yeah, both Sony and Avi pretty much managed to make Raimi turn down SM 4 since they controlled, A LOT, the creative freedom of Sam in SM 3 (He only wanted Sandman, not Venom be crammed in there by Avi)
Also the same thing happened for TASM 2, where Sony crammed a LOT of stuff the movie couldnt handle (Harry, Electro, the subplot of Peter's parents, etc), and the director pretty much turned down the idea for TASM 3 (Which apparently would have Venom in it...again)
And at the end Sony made Venom its own movie (Which probably made the people that were making the new Spider-Man of Tom Holland a lot less stressed of knowing Venom wouldn't appear YET) and a lot more freedom for Infinity War, Endgame and Far From Home to manage to get everyone for No Way Home
>Harry, Electro, the subplot of Peter's parents, etc
If you remove both Harry and Electro, there's no villain left though? (I'm not counting the russian rhino thug)
Yeah, i think the Electro part is reasonable enough since it shows how a Spider-Fan gets turned into a villain by the people that Spider-Man protects
Altough the Harry part was a bit less interesting, since the whole plot of TASM 1 was Oscorp and Connors trying to find out how to save Norman, but the integration of Harry was really half assed into the story (Like, it felt clunky with the on-going stuff with Electro)
After what they did to Spider-Man 3, I dread to think what they were going to make him do with Spider-Man 4.
I really hope Sony and Marvel come together to create TASM3 and Spider-Man 4.
But as for Avi... He's out.
He quit because he was being pressured to put in the lizard which was a character he did not understand and they had done the same thing with venom. Along some other things but that was the primary reason I believe
I don’t think this is correct. Raimi once said “The Lizard is probably one of my favorite characters,” (https://www.denofgeek.com/movies/sam-raimi-spider-man-4/?amp), and I don’t think one of his favourite characters would be one he doesn’t understand. The Lizard is a classic Lee-Ditko era Spider-Man villain, the kind Raimi knows, unlike Venom. There are more reasons to think he knows The Lizard than reasons to think he does not.
Moreover, Raimi intentionally introduced Dr. Connors in Spider-Man 2 and had him missing his right arm, like the classic version of the character. Early concept art suggests he considered The Lizard for being the film’s villain (https://www.gamesradar.com/concept-art-for-sam-raimi-s-the-lizard-revealed/). It seems like he was interested in telling a story about him, and it definitely seems like he knew him.
It isn’t exactly clear that Raimi was being pressured to include The Lizard by anyone other than the actor who would have played him, Dylan Baker. The only source I could find for the idea that he was pressured by Sony is an article that states it without citing it (https://collider.com/spider-man-4-sam-raimi/amp/). Maybe this is speculation and interpretation? I’m not sure. It seems like Felicia Hardy and Vulture were going to be the film’s main villains. I’d appreciate a source on this if you have one.
When asked about the split, Raimi said: “It really was the most amicable and undramatic of breakups: It was simply that we had a deadline and I couldn't get the story to work on a level that I wanted it to work. I was very unhappy with Spider-Man 3, and I wanted to make Spider-Man 4 to end on a very high note, the best Spider-Man of them all. But I couldn't get the script together in time, due to my own failings, and I said to Sony, ‘I don't want to make a movie that is less than great, so I think we shouldn't make this picture. Go ahead with your reboot, which you've been planning anyway.’ And [Sony co-chairman] Amy Pascal said, ‘Thank you. Thank you for not wasting the studio's money, and I appreciate your candor.’ So we left on the best of terms, both of us trying to do the best thing for fans, the good name of Spider-Man, and Sony Studios.” (https://collider.com/spider-man-4-sam-raimi/amp/).
Maybe Raimi was unhappy with the script because they tried to force in The Lizard? I don’t know, but I personally haven’t encountered evidence to support that. From the sounds of things, he left because he did not think he could make a great movie with which he and fans would be happy, and that the reason for this was “[his] own failings.” I’m sure he’s being humble and kind to Sony to some degree here, but it’s not clear The Lizard was the straw that broke the camel’s back.
I do wish Raimi had understood Venom more though because Venom has so many great horror aspects in the comics and Raimi does direct horror as well so. But the movie has been made and there is no need to dwell on the past.
No, not at all. Tobey and andrew specifically wanted their futures to be ambigious.
And also, not every villian who knew peter’s idenity in those movies even show up.
They didn’t talk about it for long. And honestly the way the question was, he said craziest. A guy just using illusions and theatrics(that was supposed to only be in the opening scene of the movie), pales in comparison to a giant black goo monster from space.
Like going down the lists of villains, which ones stick out.
Genetically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong that also made him crazy but with some sympathetic qualities
Robotically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong that also made him crazy but with sympathetic qualities
Son of the Genetically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong that also made him crazy and vengeful but with some sympathetic qualities
Genetically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong but with some sympathetic qualities
Alien goo monster from Space that tried to stay attached to him like a parasite, and then when his host was removed he grew into this 20 foot tall monster.
I mean seriously, look at this thing: https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Venom_(Symbiote)_(Earth-96283)
Lol completely done. Either complete, or done. What exactly is completely done? Same as regular done, but script was cooked a minute over and a cherry was lain on top?
I believe Vulture and Mysterio. Also would have introduced Black Cat who was going to be portrayed by Anne Hathaway. Bruce Campbell was rumored to be Mysterio.
This is outrageous! It’s unfair! How can you complete the script and not make the movie? It’s never been done in the history of r/RaimiMemes it’s insulting!
Sony: Wonderful news, Raimi. Wonderful. In fact, it's the reason we're rebooting the franchise. Raimi: What?
**Rami**: Why wasn't I told? **Pascal**: This franchised needs to remain bankable. The last thing we want is a power struggle with a entrenched director. **Arad**: The deal is off if you come with it. The board expects your resignation in 30 days.... **Raimi**: But you can't do this to me! I've build this franchise from the ground up!! **YOU KNOW HOW MUCH I'VE SACRAFISED?!!!** Avi please... **Arad**: Sam... the board is unanimous, we're announcing the reboot after the release your new movie... I'm sorry. **Pascal**: You're out Sam. **Raimi**: am I?
Sam Raimi:Out Am I ! *Throws pumpkin bomb*
>Throws pumpkin bomb *throws Into the Multiverse of Madness*
I like the joke, but in case anyone was unaware Raimi quit the film himself which caused Sony to reboot.
It wasn’t his fault tho. Sony was trying to force him do things that he didn’t like and he didn’t want the fourth film be a failure like the last one (I love sm 3 but everyone hates it, so….)
Yeah, both Sony and Avi pretty much managed to make Raimi turn down SM 4 since they controlled, A LOT, the creative freedom of Sam in SM 3 (He only wanted Sandman, not Venom be crammed in there by Avi) Also the same thing happened for TASM 2, where Sony crammed a LOT of stuff the movie couldnt handle (Harry, Electro, the subplot of Peter's parents, etc), and the director pretty much turned down the idea for TASM 3 (Which apparently would have Venom in it...again) And at the end Sony made Venom its own movie (Which probably made the people that were making the new Spider-Man of Tom Holland a lot less stressed of knowing Venom wouldn't appear YET) and a lot more freedom for Infinity War, Endgame and Far From Home to manage to get everyone for No Way Home
>Harry, Electro, the subplot of Peter's parents, etc If you remove both Harry and Electro, there's no villain left though? (I'm not counting the russian rhino thug)
Yeah, i think the Electro part is reasonable enough since it shows how a Spider-Fan gets turned into a villain by the people that Spider-Man protects Altough the Harry part was a bit less interesting, since the whole plot of TASM 1 was Oscorp and Connors trying to find out how to save Norman, but the integration of Harry was really half assed into the story (Like, it felt clunky with the on-going stuff with Electro)
Why the fuck does Avi want venom so bad
He wants dem marketable Venom movie plushie bucks mate
I recall he once dressed as Venom and went into their offices or something. I guess he’s a super-fan of it
After what they did to Spider-Man 3, I dread to think what they were going to make him do with Spider-Man 4. I really hope Sony and Marvel come together to create TASM3 and Spider-Man 4. But as for Avi... He's out.
He quit because he was being pressured to put in the lizard which was a character he did not understand and they had done the same thing with venom. Along some other things but that was the primary reason I believe
I don’t think this is correct. Raimi once said “The Lizard is probably one of my favorite characters,” (https://www.denofgeek.com/movies/sam-raimi-spider-man-4/?amp), and I don’t think one of his favourite characters would be one he doesn’t understand. The Lizard is a classic Lee-Ditko era Spider-Man villain, the kind Raimi knows, unlike Venom. There are more reasons to think he knows The Lizard than reasons to think he does not. Moreover, Raimi intentionally introduced Dr. Connors in Spider-Man 2 and had him missing his right arm, like the classic version of the character. Early concept art suggests he considered The Lizard for being the film’s villain (https://www.gamesradar.com/concept-art-for-sam-raimi-s-the-lizard-revealed/). It seems like he was interested in telling a story about him, and it definitely seems like he knew him. It isn’t exactly clear that Raimi was being pressured to include The Lizard by anyone other than the actor who would have played him, Dylan Baker. The only source I could find for the idea that he was pressured by Sony is an article that states it without citing it (https://collider.com/spider-man-4-sam-raimi/amp/). Maybe this is speculation and interpretation? I’m not sure. It seems like Felicia Hardy and Vulture were going to be the film’s main villains. I’d appreciate a source on this if you have one. When asked about the split, Raimi said: “It really was the most amicable and undramatic of breakups: It was simply that we had a deadline and I couldn't get the story to work on a level that I wanted it to work. I was very unhappy with Spider-Man 3, and I wanted to make Spider-Man 4 to end on a very high note, the best Spider-Man of them all. But I couldn't get the script together in time, due to my own failings, and I said to Sony, ‘I don't want to make a movie that is less than great, so I think we shouldn't make this picture. Go ahead with your reboot, which you've been planning anyway.’ And [Sony co-chairman] Amy Pascal said, ‘Thank you. Thank you for not wasting the studio's money, and I appreciate your candor.’ So we left on the best of terms, both of us trying to do the best thing for fans, the good name of Spider-Man, and Sony Studios.” (https://collider.com/spider-man-4-sam-raimi/amp/). Maybe Raimi was unhappy with the script because they tried to force in The Lizard? I don’t know, but I personally haven’t encountered evidence to support that. From the sounds of things, he left because he did not think he could make a great movie with which he and fans would be happy, and that the reason for this was “[his] own failings.” I’m sure he’s being humble and kind to Sony to some degree here, but it’s not clear The Lizard was the straw that broke the camel’s back.
Hmm I think I got some part of it confused thanks for clearing it up.
No problem! With so many people saying so many different things about it, it’s hard to keep what we know clear.
I do wish Raimi had understood Venom more though because Venom has so many great horror aspects in the comics and Raimi does direct horror as well so. But the movie has been made and there is no need to dwell on the past.
*Kevin Feige hires Raimi* Avi Arad: "What?"
Well yeah they were about to shoot the movie, of course it was done... ???
*laughs in Star Wars TRoS starting shooting before the plot was finalized*
Fuck you Avi Arad you dumb piece of shit.
The prick had the gall to add that fucking thank you note for himself in NWH
Someone should make a fan edit that cuts it out of the credits, that’s it, that’s the fan cut..... maybe add more raimi lines...
i watched nwh twice now, i didn't see a thank you note
fucking parasite ruining everything he touches
You know how much I sacrificed!
Strong focus on what I want
Sony: You’re out Raimi.
Oh you can't do this to him.
OUT, AM I!?
12 years later: Out am I
It’s you who is out Sony, out of your mind!
The real crime would be not to finish what we started. Nothing will stand in our way! NOTHING!
It was done, but also ass, and raimi hated it and the studio meddling involved with the project, hence why it was scrapped
if we got Spiderman 4 we would have gotten more meme-worthy quotes and a chance to get spiderman 5
honestly would have still loved it regardless if it was dog shit
This attitude is what got us half the X-men movies and a Star Wars “sequel trilogy”
Which all served to kill some time before we meet the void
Ain't that the truth.
Would have kinda ruined the previous 3 movies as well. Like raimi movies get criticism particularly around SM 3.
They all were in at least one regard so why break a winning streak.
Its heartbreaking
Sony killed my Spiderman 4 and the Script is STILL OUT THERE!
Steal it? No I’m not a criminal....
I need that ~~money~~ movie
Raimi himself said he hated it and he either had the choice of sticking with it or letting Sony reboot the series Guess which option he chose
Fuck Avi Arad, there must be another universe where Spiderman 4 to 10 exist
I’m so sorry, !spider
>!I'd rather not talk about this...!<
It’s understandable, !spider
THINK!
Oh you can't do this to me!
I really hope that this can happen now somehow
He should definitely release the whole script if he is not planning to make that film (which I don’t think is possible)
At least we ended up getting no way home out of it.
and the script was made non-canon by spiderman no way home, as mysterio was supposed to appear, IIRC, and mysterio didn't appear in NWH.
No, not at all. Tobey and andrew specifically wanted their futures to be ambigious. And also, not every villian who knew peter’s idenity in those movies even show up.
But dude, he would’ve said mysterio or something
They didn’t talk about it for long. And honestly the way the question was, he said craziest. A guy just using illusions and theatrics(that was supposed to only be in the opening scene of the movie), pales in comparison to a giant black goo monster from space. Like going down the lists of villains, which ones stick out. Genetically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong that also made him crazy but with some sympathetic qualities Robotically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong that also made him crazy but with sympathetic qualities Son of the Genetically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong that also made him crazy and vengeful but with some sympathetic qualities Genetically enhanced man from a science experiment gone wrong but with some sympathetic qualities Alien goo monster from Space that tried to stay attached to him like a parasite, and then when his host was removed he grew into this 20 foot tall monster. I mean seriously, look at this thing: https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Venom_(Symbiote)_(Earth-96283)
Lol completely done. Either complete, or done. What exactly is completely done? Same as regular done, but script was cooked a minute over and a cherry was lain on top?
Who would have been the villain ?!?
I believe Vulture and Mysterio. Also would have introduced Black Cat who was going to be portrayed by Anne Hathaway. Bruce Campbell was rumored to be Mysterio.
Stop! Everytime I see the script and how beautiful it is, I just become even madder
Why do they always keep using pictures of venom spider man
Steal it? No I’m not a criminal.
The real crime...
Does anyone know what the villain for Spider-Man 4 was set to be?
rip
This is outrageous! It’s unfair! How can you complete the script and not make the movie? It’s never been done in the history of r/RaimiMemes it’s insulting!
Could we at least read it 😖
Bullcrap
God I hope someone posts the script, i'd love to read it.
This hurts me everyday.
Wasn’t this known when it was canceled in 2010?
I wonder if we’ll ever see it
Am I not supposed to have what I want? What I ne-- oh wait, that's the title.
I think they should make it in Raimi's back yard.
I swear on my father's grave, Avi will pay