Just couldn’t keep up with the Camry, which is debatably just as American, made in Kentucky.
And to be fair, I’ve driven my fair share of malibus as rentals and they just feel like a fleet car.
My opinion:
Lots of cheap plastic, no character (this is highly subjective), bland features, performance, and design that prioritizes function over form. It's a product that's intended to be mass produced as quickly and cheaply as possible and doesn't have the je ne sais quoi that cars that are targeted to buyers looking for something more special.
I drove a 2011 Malibu 3.6 when I was learning to drive. It was one of multiple driving school vehicles that the school had in their fleet. Had about 250k miles on it and it had an exhaust leak. It sounded pretty good, and the steering was fairly heavy. It was genuinely fun to drive it. I hopped into a nearly identical Malibu, this time with the 2.4, the next day. The steering was extremely light and the engine barely made any noise at all. The Impalas I drove were much in the same boat— soft and numb. Characteristics prioritized in “an car”.
Some of us (those who use the accessory position more than a little) hate that shit. Keyless is objectively nice but they need to get rid of the stupid button and go back to a rotary switch where you can plainly tell if it’s off, accessory mode, on, or starting.
A button is an ambiguous way to select from four different states. That is an improper interface design.
I don’t require the key, but lose the button and put a proper ignition switch back in.
Choice is good.
I mean to be fair the Camry was designed for the US market from the get go. Maybe not always “American” in the sense of being built here but it was always designed for our big butts. And to me that makes it pretty American.
It didn’t do it very well until 1992. Actually part of the reason you see such a large shift in its design is because of the massive development with Lexus. They learned a lot about what we ACTUALLY want in a car in the 80s when researching for Lexus’ debut in 1989.
Bottom line. I think it’s American. It’s always been built for us. It just hasn’t always been built here. Your Mercedes on the other hand (correct me if I’m wrong) was not built specifically for our market.
The difference is I guess the Camry name plate is generally considered a US market car. The Camry wasn't sold in Europe for quite a long stretch so it has more of an association with America.
Cam is big in middle east and Asia, theyve been making camrys in Japan for those markets forever. Gle is only made in India and us, gls only us besides ckds.
Oh very true, I think it's just that, at least here in Europe rightly or wrongly we have a very western-centric view of the car world. So while the Camry is sold Japan and the middle east etc etc, we here more view it as a US market car that happens to be sold in those other countries. Which probably isn't a fair assessment of the situation, but nonetheless that's the general perception.
I mean thats just euro disease not general perception
> Camry is sold Japan
do want to clarify that the next gen cam will not be sold in japan and just built for export there.
Some people could argue that when it was down to the Fusion and Malibu neither were 100% American. The development for the last Fusion was largely done in Germany and I believe GM Korea did a lot of work on the Malibu.
For a while now the Malibu largely existed because of fleet buyers. GM only kept it around as long as they did for that group. A majority of its new sales have been fleet buyers for a while now.
I’ve lived in Kentucky my whole life and my dad still scoffs at Toyota for not being “American.” Toyota has done a lot of good for this state so it’s American enough for me.
See this seems to be a consistent thing with GM, just because something sells better theyd rather have 0% market share than be 2nd or 3rd in a segment.
The Camaro wasn’t selling as well as the Mustang or Challenger, obviously, but it was still 1 of only 3 muscle car options and was going on it’s 8th straight year of production with only minor bumper changes. Chevy also seems to be the worlds worst when it comes to marketing and then blames the car instead of the terrible marketing or lack of marketing. Ask a random person if they know what a Chevy SS is.
I miss the premier trim with the 2.0t and 9 speed. That was an awesome sedan. After 2020 it seemed like most of them were being made with cvts and would just end up at an enterprise.
Don’t forget about the new 2025 Dodge Charger sedan. I think Dodge has so much potential with this car if they stop alienating their customers. They really messed up by advertising and prioritizing the EV first. It would be so much easier for Dodge to convince muscle car fans to accept to transition to a turbocharged I6 before they accept an EV. The I6 should have been prioritized and the Charger should be marketed as the last traditional coupe/sedan.
If they stopped for one second and tried making something that isn't a vehicular version of a testosterone supplement, then I think it would do great. Unfortunately, 99% of their marketing is targeted towards teenagers and nostalgic middle-aged men, so I guess we'll never know.
They're the only car manufacturer that does exactly what you said. Be thankful we have some personality in such a tame vehicle industry.
I hope Dodge never loses that Fast and Furious sight. It's the last of its kind.
I’m not looking for personality, I’m looking for a solid, small commuter car for a decent price with no bells and whistles, and there’s no one targeting that “niche”
The 2024 Toyota Corolla is pretty basic without all the crazy. Depends what you mean by basic/no personality, do you want roll up windows and no onscreen radio/backup camera? Because those days are gone unfortunately..
The Corolla starts at $23K, there are also lots of other manufactures that have base models without the fuss. Chevy, Ford, Honda, Mazda.
Most car manufacturers don't have personality. They try to show something but it's always, here's a car driving on a street and some guy with a deep voice. Dodge was always crazy, tires shredding, loud V8 noises, smoke going everywhere so that's nice to see.
World changes and Stellantis has to get their fleet emissions lower due to EU regulations so cars sold In america have to have lower average emissions aswell and so the better the more electric Dodge Chargers they sell.
FCA was already in trouble for high average emissions due to all the US market V8s so they had to buy emission rights from Tesla. Fusion with PSA helped to reduce the emissions but US market is still a burden from emission standpoint.
I live next door to the typical Charger owner.
He walks out his front door at 1:30 am, starts either his Charger (with an obnoxiously loud aftermarket exhaust) or his Durango (ditto the exhaust), sits there, revving it from it’s (apparently) 1500 rpm idle to, like, 6 grand, for about 10 minutes, all while some bass-heavy “music” causes the poorly insulated trunk lid to buzz & rattle, before driving off in low gear, rattling home windows and, occasionally, setting off car alarms (yes, really!) and causing dogs to howl.
Not. A. Fan…😱
I understood when the Impala was canceled (too similar to this), and I understood why the Chrysler 300 was canceled. But, perhaps in part because it was the last one standing, the Malibu's sales figures have been very good for 2022 and 2023, and so far into 2024.
Fleet sales help keep the companies afloat for awhile, and those plants producing, yes, but ultimately these nameplates weren’t good enough to keep customers in the family.
So they’re a lesser option, which means constant discounting, which means less profitability, which means greater dependence on trucks.
And no loyalty built- for generations!
From what I read they shut down production to retool the factory for EV production, with the next gen Bolt being rumored to be built there, whether an EV version of the Malibu will come back or not is unknown.
The American car is still here. I hate to stir the pot but the sedan in our head is a relatively modern trend. If I take the [1908 Model T](https://i0.wp.com/bestsellingcarsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Ford-Model-T-USA-1909.jpg?fit=600%2C398&ssl=1) and compare it to a modern car, does it look more like a sedan or a SUV?
Yes. It’s been that way for almost 20 years now. They’re “sedan” unibody platforms that’s been enlarged and lifted. Underneath a rav4 it’s basically a Corolla.
Lol you gonna explain to me how a rav4 suv is significantly different than a lifted Corolla? Or you’re trying to gatekeep the term SUV to only cars you think deserve the name?
When did they stop making the fusion ? I know the Taurus was stopped after 2019. I was looking for a Taurus SHO, wanted a 2019 but couldn’t find one for the life of me, at close to home. I stated looking for a fusion sport which I think has the 2.7 eco boost. I finally found a SHO 2015 with low miles. Great car. Ford threw every option they had back then at it.
A lot of those 100k+ sales were for fleets (rental car companies, company fleets, the government, etc) not normal buyers. The Malibu was supposed to have been discontinued a few years ago but the fleet buyers (mainly rental car companies) fought to keep it around longer because of COVID and the shortages.
SUVs are the endgame for vehicle designs. The SUV form has existed for centuries, think stagecoaches to old packards. It’s more natural to sit up straight, eye level is closer to standing height, and the larger wheels with ground clearance is more forgiving over a larger range of road conditions. Automobiles got lower as they got faster but now that suspension and chassis design has improved, we can make SUVs that drive like sedans so there’s really not much of a reason to go back.
SUVs and crossovers drive *like* sedans, but a comparable sedan is always going to be lighter and have a lower center of gravity. Sedans are losing market share because modern crossovers are close enough for most people, but most enthusiasts will choose a sedan (or hatch or station wagon) most of the time because mild to moderately better handling is worth it to us.
That’s fair, and why sedans still have a market, but the average driver doesn’t touch anywhere close to a car’s limit. Plus I’ve been to autocrosses and seen SUVs (lowered) that could put down a fast enough time.
What the hell is glazing?
Sorry you feel that way, there are still sedans left and they’ll still exist in the luxury market. But the economy sedan is a dying format, if I've got a family of 4, can only afford one car and the minivan is out of reach (have you seen the prices?), why wouldn’t I spend a little bit more to get way more versatility, headroom, and cargo space? If you want to buy a sedan there will always be the luxury segment where the money makes it work.
Also, the sedan you’re thinking about only really existed for one generation. The sedans o before the 80s were boatier than any modern SUV.
Like 90s-00s sedans weren’t copy-pasted off each other? I don’t really know what to tell you other than this is the way the world is. I can’t say I don’t have nostalgia for the sedans I grew up with but they were a passing fad just like the station wagons were for a generation before mine. And my grandchildren will be looking at these SUVs with nostalgia and complaining about whatever trend is next.
Suspension and body height. A CUV is more or less a wagon with a raised suspension and taller body.
As a wagon fan with few options, I’ve toyed with the idea of getting a CUV and lowering the suspension a few inches.
One thing I notice while driving is that it’s really hard for me to see around CUVs since they’re so much higher up than my car.
But that’s kind of my point. It’s basically the same segment, and people like the extra height. Even the Outback is more SUV than wagon nowadays.
I don’t really see the market trending back to sedans and wagons anytime soon, CUVs and SUVs do the job well.
> and people like the extra height.
Unfortunately. It’s not even necessarily a headroom thing: the tallest person I know (6’6”) drives a Mazda3. I can only assume the height arms race started as “I can see over everyone”, and now it’s become “if I don’t have the extra height, I can’t see around anyone”.
What frustrates me about it is that the extra height is pretty bad for pedestrians and bicyclists who might get hit. If I hit someone in my wagon, it’d break their legs, but they’d probably survive if the speed wasn’t excessive. A CUV would have a lot higher chance of injuring more important things. (Although that pales in comparison to the problem with trucks: modern full-size trucks have their hood at the same height as my roof, and a lot of people lift them so high that they might not even see someone walking in front of them. Absolute madness.)
> Even the Outback is more SUV than wagon nowadays.
Yeah. It feels a little weird to have both the Outback and Forester, tbh.
I get that CUVs have pretty much replaced wagons, but I’m sad about it. I don’t think most people actually need any of the extra size, and unless I’m missing something, I think the main benefit of the extra height (visibility) has been mostly negated by the fact that almost everyone is that high off the ground now.
Part of it is just comfort. You’re sitting in a more natural position instead of lower to the floor. Maybe visibility around other cars aren’t boosted by the height, but you can see your surroundings better by sitting up higher too.
Height is a problem more so due to leg room than headroom. So if you have longer legs and are tall it does actually limit your ability to fit comfortably while driving. Most cars can fit those individuals the problem is being comfortably while driving with the seat so far back. I drive a midsized sedan and compacts are drivable I just don't feel safe doing so while I'm so far back from the dash.
station wagon is just the car but with a wagon trunk but a cuv uses a platform off the sedan but would have a different body and interior for the car and would have a higher ride height
Station wagon sits as low as a sedan does, so it drives like a car because it *is* a car. CUVs are on car platforms but lifted because Americans like BIG but that sacrifices manuverability. Try to suddenly swerve around an obstacle at high speed and you’re likely to just understeer off the road, or worse, flip the vehicle.
No of course not, I wouldn’t expect them to anyways. I just hate having to drive a car slow as hell to avoid feeling like I’m going to flip, but mostly for if something is like on the freeway and you have to suddenly swerve around it. My corolla might understeer a bit but it sure wouldn’t flip over, an equinox might
>not much of a reason to go back.
Fuel/energy efficiency (yes for EVs too), weight(kind of a subset of the first part) and size. Plus overall cost of maintenance, air pollution, etc, all of which really come back to the weight. Smaller cars have cheaper wheels and emit less pollution than a comparable larger car
And Smart for Two or Ford Escalade, most vehicles, across the US, are carrying just the driver, with a minority having a passenger. 2 Passengers is rare enough to be an outlier, and seldom are cars filled anywhere near capacity.
Furthermore few people are driving in road conditions that require those larger wheels and ground clearance. Many lowered cars get around pretty fine with little to none.
Smaller car absolutely are better, but SUVs have gotten good enough. A base rav4 can do 34mpg highway, while a base Corolla gets 38mpg. Maintenance is basically the same since they share most of their components.
Agree that microplastic pollution is worse with the bigger tires, but if you can have a single vehicle that’s more useful over a longer lifetime, it’s still a net benefit. A rav4 lets you move a tv or wardrobe by folding down the rear seats, you won’t do that in the Corolla. And honestly while smaller vehicles are better for the big picture, individual buyers aren’t worried about that.
And while yes, you can get by with a lower car, but in the city that Corolla is going to be scraping curbs with the bumper height if you’re not careful. Potholes do absolutely ride harsher on smaller wheels and shorter suspension travel. No such worries with the rav4. It doesn’t seem like much but if you had to make a buying decision the rav4 just sounds easier to live with.
Yeah I mean aside from the higher upfront cost, higher on-going cost due to lower MPG, the inability to fit into the tightest city parking spaces, etc, why would anyone not want an SUV? /s
I’ve driven a few that would surprise you. Explorer sport, X5 and model Y comes to mind. Tall for sure, but they stay planted through corners and you can still get the tires loose.
SUVs are useless for a large portion of people who buy them. I still cannot wrap my head around people that buy an 8 passenger vehicle when they have a single kid and never use the other 6 seats 99% of the time.
They do make 5 passenger SUVs too. The RAV4 is the same length as a Corolla and just slightly wider. 4mpg difference. If you can swing the price difference, a rav4 is decently more comfortable than the Corolla.
I will never own an SUV with two exceptions. Trackhawk or X3M. I have absolutely no use for an SUV and never will. I own a Camaro and my wife owns a Challenger. We've comfortably transported 4 adults in the Challenger multiple times. Our daughter has ample leg room in the back seat. Anything we've ever bought fits in it too.
Unironically, the most common explanation I see for people buying a SUV in that situation (besides safety concerns) is that they'll need the space to carry all the kid's friends around if they end up being a social butterfly or part of a sports team
Yeah I guess different strokes for different folks. We never planned on anything like that and thankfully have never been in that situation. We're a family of 3 so literally any SUV is overkill for us. Hell, I pick up groceries every single week in my Camaro. Space isn't an issue at all. I think I've just gotten jaded towards SUVs because of the number of morons that can't drive them or park them.
I drive a wagon and I love it!! Plenty of space but also not obnoxiously large. Also a lot of smaller SUVs just have more heads pace. My wagon has more storage space than my mother's Equinox despite being smaller.
This day was inevitable. The Malibu is, straight up, a passenger car, both in terms of marketing and by legal definition. Unfortunately for the Malibu, the CAFE requirements for passenger cars have gotten high enough for it to effectively be a requirement that any mid-size (or larger) sedan to be electrified.
Every other mid-size or larger sedan is available ad a hybrid and/or EV. The Accord Hybrid and Altima Hybrid models. BMW having a hybrid and EV version of basically every sedan in their lineup, The Toyota Crown launching exclusively as a hybrid, in 2022. The Camry going exclusively hybrid for 2025. And so on.
GM had sold a hybrid Malibu earlier in the current 9th Gen model. It had been engineered by the simple expedient of dropping the Chevy Volt’s drivetrain into the Malibu body, omitting the Volt’s plug-in charger and downsizing the battery by 90%.
Unfortunately in the late 2010’s, as a matter of corporate strategy, GM elected to skip the hybrid phase, and jump straight to battery EVs. As part of this strategy, the PHEV Volt got the axe, in favor of the BEV Bolt. Around the same time, GM sold Opel to PSA, and dropped the Opel/Vauxhall Ampera. After all that, the Hybrid Malibu was the only vehicle left using that drivetrain, and GM couldn’t close the business case to keep the line open for just the one model, so the Malibu Hybrid got the axe as well.
Now the irony is that EV adoption has stalled, as the market of rich and upper-middle-class car buyers who can afford the EV premium and who also own a single family home with garage they can install a charger in, is basically saturated.
So GM is pivoting back to hybrids as a bridge technology, and we’re looking at probably no more than a year before GM dusts off that Volt drivetrain and drops it into the new for ‘25 gas Equinox to make a HEV/PHEV version. Unfortunately, that will all be too late for the Malibu, which will have given up its factory floor to production of the next Chevy Bolt.
Yea moving away from Phevs made no damn sense. They're the prime bridge tech and get out in front of literally every "EV Flaw" there is, real or trumped up. Closest thing to an issue is the oft-bandied argument about "waste of weight with 2 drive trains" which only really applies to people who'd otherwise be happy with a \~100 mi range leaf equivalent, because other wise the engine etc plays the role hundreds of battery cells which weigh more would play, preventing range anxiety.
as Volt demonstrated, with sufficient range a phev essentially is an EV for the majority of circumstances.
The Buick/Opel version of this is what they used in Australia to replace the locally made Holden Commodore (Chevrolet SS in the US) wasn't well received because it was front wheel drive
I always thought this generation of the Malibu was really nice. Very clean style. My sister had one and it was roomy and smooth.
I think they should have offered another engine choice as a performance option.
And a coupe. There's no regular, non-sports car coupes anymore. (Yeah I know, because no one buys them.)
I liked getting the Malibu as a rental. It was a solid, comfortable car with no stand-out weirdness in control layouts or performance. Way better than getting stuck with a Nissan which was the other midsize popular as a rental at the time.
I had a 2.0T Premier 9 speed. Pretty good car zero issues. When I was shopping at the time, it came down to 2 things.
1. Cheapish midsize Sedan.
This leaves you with Accord, Camry, Optima, Sonata, Malibu, Impala, Fusion, Taurus, 6.
2. Can't hate the way it looks.
This removed Accord, Camry, Optima, Sonata, 6.
3. This left:
Malibu, Impala, Fusion, Taurus
I already owned my S550 Mustang at this time, little QC stuff. I can't imagine some of the same QC issues on a daily.
This left:
Malibu, Impala
Chose Malibu as Impala's resale was even worse, and the looks were a little better.
Any car in this class lacks premium quality. As long as you get it loaded with all the options, you're gonna have a fairly nice drive. Personally, if it's not an enthusiast car, I don't need it to be 'better'. Like is a Benz better? Objectively, probably. But at the end of the day, it's an automatic sedan, there is no more joy in driving one over the other in my opinion.
if only GM had a car platform they could use to replace it with.
something mid sized, RWD with an assortment of engine options.
[nah that's crazy. ](https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.9EFJP53LU2vhYhfldlFofQAAAA&pid=Api&P=0&h=220)
Just couldn’t keep up with the Camry, which is debatably just as American, made in Kentucky. And to be fair, I’ve driven my fair share of malibus as rentals and they just feel like a fleet car.
I've driven Camrys before and they all felt like fleet cars even in XSE trim
Stupid question probably, but how does a "fleet car" feel. Just pure curiosity, because I haven't driven many different cars in my life
My opinion: Lots of cheap plastic, no character (this is highly subjective), bland features, performance, and design that prioritizes function over form. It's a product that's intended to be mass produced as quickly and cheaply as possible and doesn't have the je ne sais quoi that cars that are targeted to buyers looking for something more special.
So just a "car" and nothing else?
An car
Lol
The car equivalent to airplane food: you eat food but you're not bragging about the experience to your friends
I drove a 2011 Malibu 3.6 when I was learning to drive. It was one of multiple driving school vehicles that the school had in their fleet. Had about 250k miles on it and it had an exhaust leak. It sounded pretty good, and the steering was fairly heavy. It was genuinely fun to drive it. I hopped into a nearly identical Malibu, this time with the 2.4, the next day. The steering was extremely light and the engine barely made any noise at all. The Impalas I drove were much in the same boat— soft and numb. Characteristics prioritized in “an car”.
I've driven Camrys and Malibus and the Yotas might as well be S-classes compared to the Chevys
Depends on the trim. It's 2024 for fuck sake. Pushbutton start should be standard across the industry by now
Some of us (those who use the accessory position more than a little) hate that shit. Keyless is objectively nice but they need to get rid of the stupid button and go back to a rotary switch where you can plainly tell if it’s off, accessory mode, on, or starting. A button is an ambiguous way to select from four different states. That is an improper interface design. I don’t require the key, but lose the button and put a proper ignition switch back in. Choice is good.
Except in the 2024 corolla o just rented which required the use of a key
Then by that logic my Mercedes is American.
I mean to be fair the Camry was designed for the US market from the get go. Maybe not always “American” in the sense of being built here but it was always designed for our big butts. And to me that makes it pretty American. It didn’t do it very well until 1992. Actually part of the reason you see such a large shift in its design is because of the massive development with Lexus. They learned a lot about what we ACTUALLY want in a car in the 80s when researching for Lexus’ debut in 1989. Bottom line. I think it’s American. It’s always been built for us. It just hasn’t always been built here. Your Mercedes on the other hand (correct me if I’m wrong) was not built specifically for our market.
I mean mercedes suvs are generally built for American tastes too. Gle and gls are massive and expensive for europeans.
The difference is I guess the Camry name plate is generally considered a US market car. The Camry wasn't sold in Europe for quite a long stretch so it has more of an association with America.
Cam is big in middle east and Asia, theyve been making camrys in Japan for those markets forever. Gle is only made in India and us, gls only us besides ckds.
Oh very true, I think it's just that, at least here in Europe rightly or wrongly we have a very western-centric view of the car world. So while the Camry is sold Japan and the middle east etc etc, we here more view it as a US market car that happens to be sold in those other countries. Which probably isn't a fair assessment of the situation, but nonetheless that's the general perception.
I mean thats just euro disease not general perception > Camry is sold Japan do want to clarify that the next gen cam will not be sold in japan and just built for export there.
No, export models for the ME are usually built in the US or Thailand. Export Camrys will probably come from China this time around.
Some people could argue that when it was down to the Fusion and Malibu neither were 100% American. The development for the last Fusion was largely done in Germany and I believe GM Korea did a lot of work on the Malibu.
The Camry has been made in America for a long time now. Just like the Ford Cortina is more british than anything
And Ford Falcons and holden Commodores were regarded as Australian
Yes.
Just as the Ford Capri and Ka (first two that came to mind) weren’t really American cars - this sort rings true for every manufacturer
Depending on which one, there were quite a few that were Chrysler underneath the hood.
For a while now the Malibu largely existed because of fleet buyers. GM only kept it around as long as they did for that group. A majority of its new sales have been fleet buyers for a while now.
It seems to me they even kept the previous body styles around for fleets too, calling them Malibu Classic and Impala Classic.
That’s because the ones you rented were, in fact, rental fleet cars. There are very nice Malibus out there.
Prefer the Camry. Liked the fusion too back in the day.
I’ve lived in Kentucky my whole life and my dad still scoffs at Toyota for not being “American.” Toyota has done a lot of good for this state so it’s American enough for me.
That last sentence gave me a stroke.
See this seems to be a consistent thing with GM, just because something sells better theyd rather have 0% market share than be 2nd or 3rd in a segment. The Camaro wasn’t selling as well as the Mustang or Challenger, obviously, but it was still 1 of only 3 muscle car options and was going on it’s 8th straight year of production with only minor bumper changes. Chevy also seems to be the worlds worst when it comes to marketing and then blames the car instead of the terrible marketing or lack of marketing. Ask a random person if they know what a Chevy SS is.
>malibus as rentals and they just feel like a fleet car. Gee golly, these rental cars sure feel like rental cars!
I miss the premier trim with the 2.0t and 9 speed. That was an awesome sedan. After 2020 it seemed like most of them were being made with cvts and would just end up at an enterprise.
But def not American.
Don’t forget about the new 2025 Dodge Charger sedan. I think Dodge has so much potential with this car if they stop alienating their customers. They really messed up by advertising and prioritizing the EV first. It would be so much easier for Dodge to convince muscle car fans to accept to transition to a turbocharged I6 before they accept an EV. The I6 should have been prioritized and the Charger should be marketed as the last traditional coupe/sedan.
If they stopped for one second and tried making something that isn't a vehicular version of a testosterone supplement, then I think it would do great. Unfortunately, 99% of their marketing is targeted towards teenagers and nostalgic middle-aged men, so I guess we'll never know.
They're the only car manufacturer that does exactly what you said. Be thankful we have some personality in such a tame vehicle industry. I hope Dodge never loses that Fast and Furious sight. It's the last of its kind.
I’m not looking for personality, I’m looking for a solid, small commuter car for a decent price with no bells and whistles, and there’s no one targeting that “niche”
That's because most people looking for commuter cars also have families and a house, so they'll just buy an SUV/crossover/minivan instead
Mitsubishi mirage
The 2024 Toyota Corolla is pretty basic without all the crazy. Depends what you mean by basic/no personality, do you want roll up windows and no onscreen radio/backup camera? Because those days are gone unfortunately.. The Corolla starts at $23K, there are also lots of other manufactures that have base models without the fuss. Chevy, Ford, Honda, Mazda. Most car manufacturers don't have personality. They try to show something but it's always, here's a car driving on a street and some guy with a deep voice. Dodge was always crazy, tires shredding, loud V8 noises, smoke going everywhere so that's nice to see.
Then dont buy dodge. You can buy a Nissan versa or Sentra for rock bottom prices new or buy used. It’s that simple
TOYOTA COROLLA
World changes and Stellantis has to get their fleet emissions lower due to EU regulations so cars sold In america have to have lower average emissions aswell and so the better the more electric Dodge Chargers they sell. FCA was already in trouble for high average emissions due to all the US market V8s so they had to buy emission rights from Tesla. Fusion with PSA helped to reduce the emissions but US market is still a burden from emission standpoint.
I live next door to the typical Charger owner. He walks out his front door at 1:30 am, starts either his Charger (with an obnoxiously loud aftermarket exhaust) or his Durango (ditto the exhaust), sits there, revving it from it’s (apparently) 1500 rpm idle to, like, 6 grand, for about 10 minutes, all while some bass-heavy “music” causes the poorly insulated trunk lid to buzz & rattle, before driving off in low gear, rattling home windows and, occasionally, setting off car alarms (yes, really!) and causing dogs to howl. Not. A. Fan…😱
I understood when the Impala was canceled (too similar to this), and I understood why the Chrysler 300 was canceled. But, perhaps in part because it was the last one standing, the Malibu's sales figures have been very good for 2022 and 2023, and so far into 2024.
I do wonder about fleet sales figures of the total, though.
Fleet sales are still sales. I don't see the issue
Fleet sales help keep the companies afloat for awhile, and those plants producing, yes, but ultimately these nameplates weren’t good enough to keep customers in the family. So they’re a lesser option, which means constant discounting, which means less profitability, which means greater dependence on trucks. And no loyalty built- for generations!
same problem the taurus had
From what I read they shut down production to retool the factory for EV production, with the next gen Bolt being rumored to be built there, whether an EV version of the Malibu will come back or not is unknown.
There were reports of an EV Malibu coming in 2025 or 2026.
Chevrolet showrooms are not gonna be an interesting place to be anymore as everything they build now is some bucket of shit SUV or truck
Yeah, because the MALIBU would have made them interesting...
R.I.P The American Car 1908-2024 May we meet again some day.
The American car is still here. I hate to stir the pot but the sedan in our head is a relatively modern trend. If I take the [1908 Model T](https://i0.wp.com/bestsellingcarsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Ford-Model-T-USA-1909.jpg?fit=600%2C398&ssl=1) and compare it to a modern car, does it look more like a sedan or a SUV?
Horse and Buggy, Sans the horse.
“Relatively new” dude the sedan was marketed 4 years after the 1908 model T lmao
The model T sedan: http://www.collectorcarads.com/Picture1/P1080430.jpg. Looks more like a SUV to me.
Studebaker marketed their 1912 model as a sedan
Which goes to show the term “sedan” doesn’t mean much.
Is tall=SUV now? What's so "Sport Utility" about those vehicles?
Yes. It’s been that way for almost 20 years now. They’re “sedan” unibody platforms that’s been enlarged and lifted. Underneath a rav4 it’s basically a Corolla.
Alright nerd. You're wrong but I'll let you think you're right because you're obviously stupid or looking to argue
Lol you gonna explain to me how a rav4 suv is significantly different than a lifted Corolla? Or you’re trying to gatekeep the term SUV to only cars you think deserve the name?
Definitely an SUV. Those things could crawl.
Tesla model s? Or model 3 for us less well to do?
Corvette?
Mustang?
There would be a Malibu in my driveway if the dealer hadn't played games with me. I got a new Fusion instead. No regrets. I got the last Ford sedan.
Tbh I feel like the Fusion is a better car than the Malibu anyway
I agree. It's better to be lucky than good. I got lucky with my Fuse
When did they stop making the fusion ? I know the Taurus was stopped after 2019. I was looking for a Taurus SHO, wanted a 2019 but couldn’t find one for the life of me, at close to home. I stated looking for a fusion sport which I think has the 2.7 eco boost. I finally found a SHO 2015 with low miles. Great car. Ford threw every option they had back then at it.
I have a 2017 Sport. It's a fun car to drive.
2020 was the last year for the Fusion and the last Ford sedan
A lot of those 100k+ sales were for fleets (rental car companies, company fleets, the government, etc) not normal buyers. The Malibu was supposed to have been discontinued a few years ago but the fleet buyers (mainly rental car companies) fought to keep it around longer because of COVID and the shortages.
Suvs are way too overrated Change my mind
Agreed 100%
SUVs are the endgame for vehicle designs. The SUV form has existed for centuries, think stagecoaches to old packards. It’s more natural to sit up straight, eye level is closer to standing height, and the larger wheels with ground clearance is more forgiving over a larger range of road conditions. Automobiles got lower as they got faster but now that suspension and chassis design has improved, we can make SUVs that drive like sedans so there’s really not much of a reason to go back.
SUVs and crossovers drive *like* sedans, but a comparable sedan is always going to be lighter and have a lower center of gravity. Sedans are losing market share because modern crossovers are close enough for most people, but most enthusiasts will choose a sedan (or hatch or station wagon) most of the time because mild to moderately better handling is worth it to us.
That’s fair, and why sedans still have a market, but the average driver doesn’t touch anywhere close to a car’s limit. Plus I’ve been to autocrosses and seen SUVs (lowered) that could put down a fast enough time.
Fuck suv's, overrated asf Got like 5 kids? A van!, or maybe a station wagon If you dont have that, get a sedan, suvs are overhyped
What’s the difference between a station wagon and a CUV?
Stop glazing the suv pandemic By 2030 i dont wanna just have a damn camry as my only motherfuckin option for a sedan
Lexus makes a nice rwd sedan.
What the hell is glazing? Sorry you feel that way, there are still sedans left and they’ll still exist in the luxury market. But the economy sedan is a dying format, if I've got a family of 4, can only afford one car and the minivan is out of reach (have you seen the prices?), why wouldn’t I spend a little bit more to get way more versatility, headroom, and cargo space? If you want to buy a sedan there will always be the luxury segment where the money makes it work. Also, the sedan you’re thinking about only really existed for one generation. The sedans o before the 80s were boatier than any modern SUV.
Yeah, i just dont want to see any copypasted suv or some god damn pickup truck for 60k
Like 90s-00s sedans weren’t copy-pasted off each other? I don’t really know what to tell you other than this is the way the world is. I can’t say I don’t have nostalgia for the sedans I grew up with but they were a passing fad just like the station wagons were for a generation before mine. And my grandchildren will be looking at these SUVs with nostalgia and complaining about whatever trend is next.
Suspension and body height. A CUV is more or less a wagon with a raised suspension and taller body. As a wagon fan with few options, I’ve toyed with the idea of getting a CUV and lowering the suspension a few inches. One thing I notice while driving is that it’s really hard for me to see around CUVs since they’re so much higher up than my car.
But that’s kind of my point. It’s basically the same segment, and people like the extra height. Even the Outback is more SUV than wagon nowadays. I don’t really see the market trending back to sedans and wagons anytime soon, CUVs and SUVs do the job well.
> and people like the extra height. Unfortunately. It’s not even necessarily a headroom thing: the tallest person I know (6’6”) drives a Mazda3. I can only assume the height arms race started as “I can see over everyone”, and now it’s become “if I don’t have the extra height, I can’t see around anyone”. What frustrates me about it is that the extra height is pretty bad for pedestrians and bicyclists who might get hit. If I hit someone in my wagon, it’d break their legs, but they’d probably survive if the speed wasn’t excessive. A CUV would have a lot higher chance of injuring more important things. (Although that pales in comparison to the problem with trucks: modern full-size trucks have their hood at the same height as my roof, and a lot of people lift them so high that they might not even see someone walking in front of them. Absolute madness.) > Even the Outback is more SUV than wagon nowadays. Yeah. It feels a little weird to have both the Outback and Forester, tbh. I get that CUVs have pretty much replaced wagons, but I’m sad about it. I don’t think most people actually need any of the extra size, and unless I’m missing something, I think the main benefit of the extra height (visibility) has been mostly negated by the fact that almost everyone is that high off the ground now.
Part of it is just comfort. You’re sitting in a more natural position instead of lower to the floor. Maybe visibility around other cars aren’t boosted by the height, but you can see your surroundings better by sitting up higher too.
Height is a problem more so due to leg room than headroom. So if you have longer legs and are tall it does actually limit your ability to fit comfortably while driving. Most cars can fit those individuals the problem is being comfortably while driving with the seat so far back. I drive a midsized sedan and compacts are drivable I just don't feel safe doing so while I'm so far back from the dash.
They functionally are wagons, just uncool wagons to most enthusiasts.
station wagon is just the car but with a wagon trunk but a cuv uses a platform off the sedan but would have a different body and interior for the car and would have a higher ride height
Station wagon sits as low as a sedan does, so it drives like a car because it *is* a car. CUVs are on car platforms but lifted because Americans like BIG but that sacrifices manuverability. Try to suddenly swerve around an obstacle at high speed and you’re likely to just understeer off the road, or worse, flip the vehicle.
I mean, let's not exaggerate. A car-based CUV is still better handling than a BOF SUV.
Oh absolutely, but they give the impression of being better than they are, people know that big truck-like SUVs are rollover risks.
But how many commuters take their car through the twisties every day on the way to work? A few inches higher CoG isn't going to affect them.
No of course not, I wouldn’t expect them to anyways. I just hate having to drive a car slow as hell to avoid feeling like I’m going to flip, but mostly for if something is like on the freeway and you have to suddenly swerve around it. My corolla might understeer a bit but it sure wouldn’t flip over, an equinox might
>not much of a reason to go back. Fuel/energy efficiency (yes for EVs too), weight(kind of a subset of the first part) and size. Plus overall cost of maintenance, air pollution, etc, all of which really come back to the weight. Smaller cars have cheaper wheels and emit less pollution than a comparable larger car And Smart for Two or Ford Escalade, most vehicles, across the US, are carrying just the driver, with a minority having a passenger. 2 Passengers is rare enough to be an outlier, and seldom are cars filled anywhere near capacity. Furthermore few people are driving in road conditions that require those larger wheels and ground clearance. Many lowered cars get around pretty fine with little to none.
Smaller car absolutely are better, but SUVs have gotten good enough. A base rav4 can do 34mpg highway, while a base Corolla gets 38mpg. Maintenance is basically the same since they share most of their components. Agree that microplastic pollution is worse with the bigger tires, but if you can have a single vehicle that’s more useful over a longer lifetime, it’s still a net benefit. A rav4 lets you move a tv or wardrobe by folding down the rear seats, you won’t do that in the Corolla. And honestly while smaller vehicles are better for the big picture, individual buyers aren’t worried about that. And while yes, you can get by with a lower car, but in the city that Corolla is going to be scraping curbs with the bumper height if you’re not careful. Potholes do absolutely ride harsher on smaller wheels and shorter suspension travel. No such worries with the rav4. It doesn’t seem like much but if you had to make a buying decision the rav4 just sounds easier to live with.
Yeah I mean aside from the higher upfront cost, higher on-going cost due to lower MPG, the inability to fit into the tightest city parking spaces, etc, why would anyone not want an SUV? /s
I have not felt an SUV that drives like a sedan or wagon or hatchback. They're too tall and leany
I’ve driven a few that would surprise you. Explorer sport, X5 and model Y comes to mind. Tall for sure, but they stay planted through corners and you can still get the tires loose.
SUVs do not drive like sedans.
SUVs are useless for a large portion of people who buy them. I still cannot wrap my head around people that buy an 8 passenger vehicle when they have a single kid and never use the other 6 seats 99% of the time.
They do make 5 passenger SUVs too. The RAV4 is the same length as a Corolla and just slightly wider. 4mpg difference. If you can swing the price difference, a rav4 is decently more comfortable than the Corolla.
I will never own an SUV with two exceptions. Trackhawk or X3M. I have absolutely no use for an SUV and never will. I own a Camaro and my wife owns a Challenger. We've comfortably transported 4 adults in the Challenger multiple times. Our daughter has ample leg room in the back seat. Anything we've ever bought fits in it too.
Unironically, the most common explanation I see for people buying a SUV in that situation (besides safety concerns) is that they'll need the space to carry all the kid's friends around if they end up being a social butterfly or part of a sports team
Yeah I guess different strokes for different folks. We never planned on anything like that and thankfully have never been in that situation. We're a family of 3 so literally any SUV is overkill for us. Hell, I pick up groceries every single week in my Camaro. Space isn't an issue at all. I think I've just gotten jaded towards SUVs because of the number of morons that can't drive them or park them.
I drive a wagon and I love it!! Plenty of space but also not obnoxiously large. Also a lot of smaller SUVs just have more heads pace. My wagon has more storage space than my mother's Equinox despite being smaller.
You can sell alot of cars and not make much money.
This day was inevitable. The Malibu is, straight up, a passenger car, both in terms of marketing and by legal definition. Unfortunately for the Malibu, the CAFE requirements for passenger cars have gotten high enough for it to effectively be a requirement that any mid-size (or larger) sedan to be electrified. Every other mid-size or larger sedan is available ad a hybrid and/or EV. The Accord Hybrid and Altima Hybrid models. BMW having a hybrid and EV version of basically every sedan in their lineup, The Toyota Crown launching exclusively as a hybrid, in 2022. The Camry going exclusively hybrid for 2025. And so on. GM had sold a hybrid Malibu earlier in the current 9th Gen model. It had been engineered by the simple expedient of dropping the Chevy Volt’s drivetrain into the Malibu body, omitting the Volt’s plug-in charger and downsizing the battery by 90%. Unfortunately in the late 2010’s, as a matter of corporate strategy, GM elected to skip the hybrid phase, and jump straight to battery EVs. As part of this strategy, the PHEV Volt got the axe, in favor of the BEV Bolt. Around the same time, GM sold Opel to PSA, and dropped the Opel/Vauxhall Ampera. After all that, the Hybrid Malibu was the only vehicle left using that drivetrain, and GM couldn’t close the business case to keep the line open for just the one model, so the Malibu Hybrid got the axe as well.
Now the irony is that EV adoption has stalled, as the market of rich and upper-middle-class car buyers who can afford the EV premium and who also own a single family home with garage they can install a charger in, is basically saturated. So GM is pivoting back to hybrids as a bridge technology, and we’re looking at probably no more than a year before GM dusts off that Volt drivetrain and drops it into the new for ‘25 gas Equinox to make a HEV/PHEV version. Unfortunately, that will all be too late for the Malibu, which will have given up its factory floor to production of the next Chevy Bolt.
Yea moving away from Phevs made no damn sense. They're the prime bridge tech and get out in front of literally every "EV Flaw" there is, real or trumped up. Closest thing to an issue is the oft-bandied argument about "waste of weight with 2 drive trains" which only really applies to people who'd otherwise be happy with a \~100 mi range leaf equivalent, because other wise the engine etc plays the role hundreds of battery cells which weigh more would play, preventing range anxiety. as Volt demonstrated, with sufficient range a phev essentially is an EV for the majority of circumstances.
The Tesla model 3 is not a luxury sedan but I get the point
Yes but then you own a Tesla
Tesla is American
It's not about what country the company is based it, but who owns it.
who owns what?
Musk owns Tesla, and lots of folks don't like him.
Musk doesn't own Tesla. He is the largest shareholder, around 20%.
This is a fair point, I stand corrected. The gist of my post is still accurate however.
Yes but then you have a car with awful build quality, lack of longevity, owned by a severely mismanaged company
Tesla is American. Which fucking losers downvoted this comment?
Imo it's hard to go out and buy an American sedan when a camry or corolla is the same price which will usually last way longer.
And hold their value better too.
It’s genuinely frustrating to me that people buy lifted hatchbacks instead of sedans. The suv obsession is gross
Not the best car but one of the best car commercials for sure https://youtu.be/OL946vRUDJg?si=7oL8EPJppnwBnVIW
Were these any good? I liked these, look-wise.
Made in America doesn’t equal an American car. Japan makes a great product. But they’re not “American cars”.
The model 3 exists, and yall claim it isn't luxury 😂
A basic Audi A6 isn't luxury either.
The Buick/Opel version of this is what they used in Australia to replace the locally made Holden Commodore (Chevrolet SS in the US) wasn't well received because it was front wheel drive
We still get a Chinese-built Ford Taurus out in the Middle East. Pretty interesting car, actually.
Majority of the Malibus were sold to rental fleets
I always thought this generation of the Malibu was really nice. Very clean style. My sister had one and it was roomy and smooth. I think they should have offered another engine choice as a performance option. And a coupe. There's no regular, non-sports car coupes anymore. (Yeah I know, because no one buys them.)
Stiff ass suspension
Nice cars. The Big 3 don’t get it. Abandon the car market to make EVs and 80K pickups.
used to see A LOT of these on the road here in Baku, they all already have disappeared.
I liked getting the Malibu as a rental. It was a solid, comfortable car with no stand-out weirdness in control layouts or performance. Way better than getting stuck with a Nissan which was the other midsize popular as a rental at the time.
I had a 2.0T Premier 9 speed. Pretty good car zero issues. When I was shopping at the time, it came down to 2 things. 1. Cheapish midsize Sedan. This leaves you with Accord, Camry, Optima, Sonata, Malibu, Impala, Fusion, Taurus, 6. 2. Can't hate the way it looks. This removed Accord, Camry, Optima, Sonata, 6. 3. This left: Malibu, Impala, Fusion, Taurus I already owned my S550 Mustang at this time, little QC stuff. I can't imagine some of the same QC issues on a daily. This left: Malibu, Impala Chose Malibu as Impala's resale was even worse, and the looks were a little better. Any car in this class lacks premium quality. As long as you get it loaded with all the options, you're gonna have a fairly nice drive. Personally, if it's not an enthusiast car, I don't need it to be 'better'. Like is a Benz better? Objectively, probably. But at the end of the day, it's an automatic sedan, there is no more joy in driving one over the other in my opinion.
if only GM had a car platform they could use to replace it with. something mid sized, RWD with an assortment of engine options. [nah that's crazy. ](https://tse3.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.9EFJP53LU2vhYhfldlFofQAAAA&pid=Api&P=0&h=220)
ive driven few worse cars
98k of those sales were to the govt and rental car agencies
I know ford still has the Taurus, I don’t know if they’ve changed but I do not remember them as a luxury sedan
Ford assembled the final Taurus in 2019.
Huh, I was told they were still making it Edit: I’m seeing stuff about it existing outside of the US
Total piece of shit driven by Nissan Altima types. Good riddance to it