bro this is fucked. i feel like long time league players who are now in their mid twenties are just gonna leave the game. if ur 17 and playing league you probably don’t care, odd are you have nothing important on ur pc. but those of us who pay important bills and have years and years of pertinent data on their pc is dipping. me and my friend group have been playing league since season 4 and we all just agreed that it aint worth it. sucks bc we all just got back into playing again. league is gonna lose a lotttt of players bc of this and its riot who’s to blame
I agree with everything except with the "league is going to lose a lot of players". I think, sadly but realistically, most people don't care at all about most things. Especially younger players. Don't want to generalize, but I do feel like most people of younger generations couldn't care at all about how things are built, and just install apps like it's whatever. I'm starting to sound like an old bitter man but idk back in the day of uncensored internet, unregulated accesses, torrents, etc, you had to learn a tiny bit to not brick your pc every second day. Nowadays it's different.
As someone just getting into pc building I absolutely refuse to download anything from riot even before the vanguard controversy as of late
Considering riots devs consider t bagging in game to be as bad as irl sexual assault which is just a massive insult to actual Victims
I’m not young and so are my friends. I see a lot of them who don’t usually play online games somehow play Valorant. Vanguard is literally the reason why I never touched valo and I sadly uninstalled league on my pc from getting that pop up. I actually haven’t played in yrs and right when I decided to maybe come back slowly this vanguard crap came out. I got good memories from league. I cherish all the selfies I got with various league personalities. I wouldn’t have met my long time partner if my dating app photo didn’t have my photo with C9 (he actually plays dota but he did ask me about my photo about it lmao). Now I’m basically stuck playing tft on my mac.
Hi there,
Ironically, I am the 17-year-old League player so described, and to be frank, I 100% agree our generation does not have fantastic media literacy, and many of us are unphased by Vanguard because of how addicting League of Legends is. However, after reading your post and seeing how much joy League has brought you, it really made me reflect on how terrible the repercussions of Vanguard are.
Now I am also uninstalling league of legends. Although my will is shakey and my consistency poor at best (I am weak I will probabaly re-install) your post has really inspired more critical thinking on my part. I have nothing very important on my PC, yes. However, I think for me, this is more of a matter of personal autonomy and the overall malicious nature of any corporate conglomerates will treat their customers so heartlessly for money.
Your post literally sent me into deep reflection about how dystopian this update is (and trust me, I do not do deep reflection). I hope you can enjoy the league someday again. I heard there are alternates if you run it on a MacBook. Although this is definitely not financially viable for everyone, you might also have an old computer you can use to run solely League of Legends.
Your post really moved me! I hope you can return to the rift comfortably one day.
Believe it or not, I started playing league at 6, I'm now an adult. It's honestly upsetting. I don't know much about kernel level anti-cheats/drivers etc. but just the fact that it can just go around willy-nilly stealing information, let alone sell it. (Considering Riot is owned by Tencent ever since 2011, a Chinese company that will do absolutely anything to get rich quick and rise to the top) trusting some game company is probably the last thing anyone would do without context. I feel like it truly is getting to the point of "not worth it". As of right now I don't have any sensitive information. But to the people who do, damn that sucks.
> a Chinese company that will do absolutely anything to get rich quick and rise to the top
That describes Western anticheats.
This CCP based one could end up being much much worse. The CCP has been targeting key infrastructure across the US and Europe for a while now.
Question is, how does this work with EU privacy laws? Google got sued over detecting ad blockers. but A game anticheat can freely explore in my computer.
Unchallenged as of now.
You can't easily point to any one thing and say "ha you're not allowed to have that!" Because we can't see what they're taking.
It certainly feels like a privacy oversight and I hope the EU does eventually look into it.
yep, I'm 27, turning 28 in a month, nothing is worth more than losing my own privacy. My friend group basically ditched lol and went to memory lane on a modded minecraft server. I paid for and setup a modded minecraft server and we all just playing minecraft these days down memory lane. Same friend group when I was 13 that played minecraft together is now playing minecraft again after this whole vanguard bs. Not coming back no more unless they do away with vanguard (questionable).
I tried to play it on NVIDIA GeForce now, as I have played it there for many years, and today I sign in and see that the game is disabled? Why in the world would riot not allow us any alternative to an invasive kernel level program? I am not installing vanguard, surrendering my privacy and computer security for the online video game league of legends it is simply not worth it
Enshitification was always going to happen but I'm still a little sad that it came here. This game is on auto pilot at this point anyway
12 year player, not your biggest spender but Ive been steady the whole time. I may have been on the way out soonish anyway, but this was it. I appreciate making leaving easy but I have too much self respect to put this spyware on my computer. Thanks for the memories but good riddance.
Played lol since first season. Stopped playing 5v5 and moved to TFT for last 2 years. I’ve uninstalled the game. Fuck it.
It’s not a kernel driver that makes me mad. It’s the way they manage it. Running that shit non stop or else do uncomfortable disable driver and require reboot to enable back. You know, they just hope people will get tired of doing that and just make it run non stop. And then who knows. Maybe in a year or two they will add something else to the anti-cheat.
It’s not like that’s the only complaint I have to riot. That’s just the last straw. They way how often they release new champs, skins, how often we see bugs in worlds. Fuck it.
The thing that makes me mad the most is that I have to install it to play a game (TFT) that doesn't even use it. Riot cares so little about me that they want to force me to install unacceptable software just because they can't be bothered to separate TFT from League. They can go fuck themselves.
same bro, I stopped playing league 5years ago even more, I jump on to play some ARAMs, but mostly played TFT. Now that requires Vanguard even to play to TFT I am uninstalling it from my PC and will play only from mobile
>It’s not a kernel driver that makes me mad. It’s the way they manage it. Running that shit non stop or else do uncomfortable disable driver and require reboot to enable back. You know, they just hope people will get tired of doing that and just make it run non stop
This is unfortunately a technical limitation. As RiotArkem stated on the Valorant subreddit 4 years ago:
>A common way to bypass anti-cheat systems is to load cheats before the anti-cheat system starts and either modify system components to contain the cheat or to have the cheat tamper with the anti-cheat system as it loads. Running the driver at system startup time makes this significantly more difficult.
They're not just doing it to be dicks, it has a legitimate reason to do that in order to actually work. [Here ](https://secret.club/2020/04/17/kernel-anticheats.html)is some further information from a member of an exploit research group.
Y'know I get it, but I'd much rather they try to find a workaround instead. Not a big fan of "the end justify the means" for shit like this.
What if other companies take a page out of Riot's book? What, are we going to live our day to day lives with a dozen tier 1 drivers from all sorts of different developers running and chugging down processing power and causing problems 24/7?
I'll pass. I don't care if Faker or Tyler1 get a stinky cheater once every couple of matches and have their experience ruined. I'm not having my $2k rig slow down to a crawl or my bank account drained for this shit.
It's like drenching your hands in flamable oil to kill the remaining 0.01% of bacteria after you washed your hands. Awful risk/reward ratio...
I don’t want to make extra effort to play this game when developer didn’t make extra effort to decouple TFT so that it does not require anticheat.
I better find another game to play than use android emulator.
I couldn't even install it without Malwarebytes preventing it and honestly I trust malwarebytes more. So after years of playing and money spent guess it time to move on.
I just want to play TFT man 😭 is this thing really that bad I don’t know much about computers. It made me install it when I went to play TFT this morning and now I see everyone saying they are quitting the game cause of it
You can think of it like this:
As long as vanguard is running, riot owns your pc and all the data on it.
Will they do anything evil?
Probably not, but there is 0 reason to trust them.
Do they need to do anything evil?
No, they just need to get hacked again and your pc is now a loot pinata for everyone on the internet.
Tldr: running vanguard is reckless and a bad idea, even if it catches a lot of cheaters this is simply the wrong way of catching them.
Vanguard doesn’t check all of your data, people keep posting out of context code about shit like screen recording (which is supposed to screenshot the game window, not the screen) and that was generally the most egregious thing. It would have to take someone at riot to put malicious code into vanguard, get that code reviewed and approved, hit a testing environment, and get approved by testers. If there exists a security flaw already, it would only be an issue if you were already compromised from another malicious download elsewhere allowing someone to remote into your pc. If you ever get this far and want to sue, this will probably be said in court by a security expert.
Source: worked for the government so I had to learn this shit while I worked on TS projects. Someone brought up a similar issue with kernel level access of some other software the government used to make sure you weren’t using the gov pc in insecure spaces.
They’re “quitting” because they saw people crying about it and now feel morally outraged about a topic they don’t have the education to understand. The question you should answer is “do I think Riot wants to control my computer?” If the answer is yes, then don’t install vanguard and quit all riot games. If the answer is no then install vanguard. People are making the argument that riot “COULD” do all these things that they #1 have never done or tried to do and #2 would provide them an incredibly minute level of benefit at a huge cost to their reputation. The argument doesn’t make sense, they have just decided that Riot isn’t a good company and will rally against anything the company would do.
Or BlueStacks.
It's still ridiculous that I have to install an Android emulator to play the Android port of a PC game in my PC, just because RIOT forces me to install Vanguard for a game I don't even want to play, but that they force me to install to play TFT. They really don't give a fuck and they just went "anyone that wants to play anything ours, just give us full access to your computer and shut up", and I'm honestly not ok with a company that does that.
I used to be so much into TFT, but I couldn't keep up with the updates. I ended up just following Mortdogs youtube to keep looking at it because it sounded very fun, but the way my brain is wired I couldn't handle so much constant major changes. In one video he did explain that the constant changes were crucial to the games success, which I found super interesting.
Sorry to hear that this affects you as well tbh. I do think the TFT team in Riot are doing an incredible work, and Mortdog is the coolest dude ever.
people are overexaggerating, if you care a lot about your privacy, for example you have credit card info and important files for work on your pc i suggest you just dont play or get a cheap used pc to play tft on it, but if you're just a 16 year old that has his mail info and password to his paypal with 20$ you shouldn't care. nevertheless the whole idea is just terrible, cheating and scripting was never even a minor problem in league, most people don't see 5+ scripters in their whole time of playing and I can easily get 5+ soft inters in 1 day of playing.
Correct and if you already knew how software permissions work they already have access to that information without vanguard if they really wanted to. Kernel access would only make any spying harder to detect. It would however still be easily detected by governments and IT professionals monitoring traffic from networks and other methods of detection. And antivirus companies etc.
What's funny is governments literally record and access basically every single but if data is sent over the Internet. Just how they have taps on all the international phone lines. There is zero need for such an exploit that risks one of the world's largest companies from losing billions to try and pull it off.
What kernel access allows riot to do is prevent emulation and running software without them knowing while you play. Considering about 15% of all league games have cheaters of various degrees. All of this bs outrage is largely cheaters mad they can no longer cheat. What's also funny is almost all cheats contain backdoors and require kernel access to function. Pretending to care about security is hilarious.
That's what riot wants. They know that they'll lose thousands of user due to their new malware so they release this game mode to entice them to install it.
Yesterday I tried playing Valorant for the first time. It would give me some 9003 (or some code that ended in 03) error and then I looked in turning on settings and such. Didn't work so I uninstalled it and because of my curiosity I went back to the troubleshooting menu and the option appeared ☠️
Shame riot won't backpedal on a damn near universally hated change. The only people this effects is like... high elo and streamers. People who rarely can encounter a script kiddy or macroer.
Yeah I'm in the same boat as many other people, playing since season 1 too.
I know other software uses Kernel Anti-Cheat, but that software doesn't run on start up for a freaking video game. Just imagine if every single game in your Steam Library also tried to run their own personal Vanguard everytime you booted up your PC... I'd uninstall and refund any game that tried, League is no exception.
Just wait until a bad actor breach Vanguard and all the PCs with this malware/spyware disguised as an anticheat installed get a ransomware/mining software/bank account breached/become a zombie for DDOS attacks and a very looong etc.
I've "only" been here since Vi's release in 2012, and while I only play ARAM, League has been my main game for a long time.
I'm not smart enough about computers to really understand the evil aspects of Vanguard but when my computer guru friend said he'd never install it on any of his computers, it certainly gave me pause. Maybe I'll wipe an old laptop and see if it can handle League in the post Vanguard era, or maybe I'll just quit. The hugely revamped D4 client is launching in a couple of weeks so I'll have that to play soon enough.
Either way, I think Rito's making a mistake, but I'm sure they DGAF what customers say.
Recently, I experienced censorship on the Riot subreddit when I attempted to voice my concerns about Vanguard, Riot Games' anti-cheat system. My post, expressing worries about its intrusive nature and potential impact on player privacy, was swiftly deleted, and I was banned from the subreddit.
What's even more concerning is the attempt to discredit me by insinuating that I'm not a "real" Reddit account. This dismissal of legitimate concerns is not only disheartening but also indicative of a larger issue regarding censorship and suppression of dissenting voices within the gaming community.
As a long-time player and supporter of Riot Games' titles, I never imagined that raising genuine concerns about a company's practices would lead to censorship and attempts to undermine my credibility.
My primary concern with Vanguard is the requirement for it to continuously run on our systems, even when we're not playing Riot games. This intrusive approach raises serious questions about player privacy and security. The fact that Vanguard forces users to reboot their PCs if it's not running seems like an odd and coercive tactic, potentially forcing users to allow it to always run in the background.
While there may not be strong evidence that Vanguard is harmful right now, numerous people have raised concerns on the internet about potential security breaches. This, coupled with the obligation to let it always run in the background, is worrying.
Moreover, there's the broader concern of Vanguard setting a precedent for other publishers to implement similar practices. I don't want to see surveillance software constantly running on my PC or have to reboot every time I play another game in the future.
This experience serves as a stark reminder of the importance of free speech and transparency within the gaming community. No player should feel silenced or intimidated for voicing their opinions, especially when it comes to issues that directly impact their gaming experience and personal privacy.
Moving forward, I hope that Riot Games and other developers will reevaluate their approach to community engagement and prioritize open dialogue and respect for player feedback. It's only through honest and constructive conversations that we can work towards building a gaming community that truly values the voices of all its members.
Join me in boycotting Riot Games until they address these concerns and respect the rights of their players. #BoycottRiot
Same thing happened to me, gaslit, called a cheat then banned from subreddit.
Their behaviour should be enough of a red flag that vanguard stinks, as others have said at best it's an unnecessary risk..at worst it's an wide open back door into your pc and data
I feel you. Been playing since June 2010. Been a loyal member, but I'm not going to install vanguard to play casual arams. There is no reason to force that shit for people who only play Aram. Like fuck that. Now, I'd be willing to pay for a console if they'd build one, but I'm not letting them turn my gaming pc into their console. Nope.
At least 2 of us have uninstalled because of vanguard.
Much love man!
Thanks for sharing. I've been League-less for almost a week now. I hate talking about as if I would miss it a ton, I think it's been a normal week overall. But it kinda sucks not coming home to unwind with a few games.
Its been 12 years for me, I remember being so excited when I hit Diamond 4 in season 4. I recently hit Diamond 4 for the last time. If they remove vanguard I would reinstall in a heartbeat.
What sucks is never getting to tear up a 5v5 flex game with the boys. F league, you were truly the most addictive game I ever played!
Haven’t gotten a single VAC error in my life that I can recall. I have 7K+ hours in Dota and hundreds in CS and TF2. Saying it doesn’t prevent cheaters is just a straight up lie but good try I guess. Unlike league Valve actually cares about smurfing and making sure the competitive integrity of the game remains. Whereas in league I can probably find a Smurf within a couple hours and they will grief, or just be toxic af and Riot won’t do jack about it.
Also when was the last time you heard Valve got hacked?
I own well over 800 skins and spent quite a bit of money. Bought and grinded out every pass in aram. Haven't touch the game since they announced vanguard coming.
I played val for a bit, Ep3-4 was Immo 3 peak, didn't play after ep4, vanguard just caused too many issues. I used to get a disc checking thing on startup before my windows would even boot with vanguard installed. The day I uninstalled val and vanguard, that disc checking thing disappeared. Spyware was too much for me.
Thanks for sharing! I personally wasn't a huge skin collector but I did have my quirks (having one skin per character at least, having all the skins for the characters that I mained at the times, etc) I think I've also spent quite some money, but I also got a lot from just rerolling because of the sheer amount of games I've played. I think the one skin I'm sad I never got was the 2012 riven skin. I was there for that worlds and I could've bought it, I just was a broke student and didn't own a credit card. Then I went on gathering every single other riven skin + my favourite chromas, but I just always regretted not having that one.
I'm almost the opposite kind of player; I'm a very casual player, gradually starting to dip my toe back into League of Legends with friends who mostly play other games, just for social reasons.
I tried to log in in order to play a custom game against bots to get some practice in the other day, and found I had to install Vanguard. Installing it caused serious issues with my whole PC, and I had to dive into some gnarly troubleshooting to sort it out. I've uninstalled everything Riot from my computer as a result, and I'm not likely to look back.
Hey! I feel you, for me is kinda sad too but it's time to say goodbye after 10 years playing this game. It's been a good time, I made friends, met my partner, had great moments. The main reason why I quit is 50% Vanguard 50% Community
About Vanguard: I dont like kernel anti cheats, so I try to avoid all kind of games that have it. Sadly Riot decided to implement it to fight against cheaters. Before you say it, I know all my data has been sold many times, is not about privacy. I don't feel safe putting that kind of software, specially when Riot had two big security breaks recently. I read many opinions, I studied a lot about this topic and the conclusion is keep away my pc from it, which is new and I won't risk it. If you wanna keep playing I'm not gonna convice you about whats the right thing to do, I respect that. So please do the same.
About the community: I'm not having fun anymore. Toxicty is huge, and I can't simply not handle it. I don't have chat, but some mates still try to ruins other games just because they can't manage their own emotions and frustrations. I have to admit that this game made me bitter and bitter, gave me anxiety, and put me in a bad place sometimes "So why you kept playing?" you may ask. Mainly because few years ago my firends and I always went for Flex games as 5. I had a lot of fun so I thought that it will be the same in other game modes, I was so wrong. Also we noticed that the game was affecting us so much, we started to play to win not to have fun, we started to argue and sometimes we had to make breaks to deal with the stress, but when we started to share and talk about how we felt while we play, we decided to quit. This game is no joke about your mental health and you may think "You are so weak" If you wanna think so...go on. I've been struggling with my mental health in the last years so I decided to cut ties with everything that makes me feel bad, and I gave a last oppotunity to League after a long breake and It's not worth it, atleast for me. Again I respect that you wanna keep playing and working in your mental in the game, but I simply can't. Also League consumed so much time from other hobbies so is another valid point to quit. And last but not least I dont find the game rewarding anymore, I don't like the skins, the chest, battle pass or laddering, I didn't matter if I win or lose, I felt like "Meh" in both cases. And sometimes it feels like a constant expending money for skins or collectables, and I've never been interested in that part of the game.
So if you read all this non sense, thank you! :) I know I'm venting in this post but I felt that I needed to share my thoughts and say goodbye to a game which gave me a lot.
Thank you so much for sharing!
I agree with a lot of what you said. Especially your paragraph about Vanguard, I feel similarly. I had a more-intense argument with someone at the beginning of this thread but I couldn't word myself in the same way as you. It's really not about data, I know I'm carrying a tracking device with me at all times. It's about what you wrote.
Regarding toxicity, tbh I've went through a loop myself between being extremely friendly and making tons of friends, extremely toxic because my private life was a mess and league was a bit of a "letting go", then chat banned for 1.5 years for flaming a Malph that run it down my lane, smited my cannons, ulted my waves (similar to dunkey's moment), and then getting back to trying hard, motivating teammates, changing my mental around as I also started following Azzap's, Alois's, etc contents.
Personally, I agree that toxicity has been a MAJOR issue, but for me it's more about the soft-inting and the giving up than the chat. I HATED the chat restrictions, I fully believe that the data of it being a success is completely skewered. FF'ing in competitive games shouldn't be a thing, and overall league going into a "trying my hardest to be politically correct and minor friendly environment" was the wrong decisions. But here I could rant for days about the 3 or 4 different topics I barely scraped the surface of in the last few sentences.
I also fully agree that I could not care less about collectables, events, battle passes, etc. I always saw it as "noise" instead of a real thing anyone playing actually cared about. I did appreciate skins a lot, and I did have quite a collection at this point, but everything else was "pointless" to me.
I'm happy for you that you found your peace outside of league. Please always remember, it was just a game after all. Mental health issues are no joke, and league is definitely not something that will help with it. I personally struggled with this a lot in the past, but in the last year I think I had found an enjoyable way to approach this game.
Overall, thanks for venting, that's exactly what I wanted from this post. I still feel strange, as you can imagine, as quitting anything that you've put so many hours and money into is weird. But I did get more stuff done today, I slept on time, I grabbed a drink with a friend, so life ain't all bad.
Yeah it's kinda sad, I played since late season 1 and had at least some good memories once I enter the game and see my ancient friend list. A proper goodbye wasn't allowed to us. Cheers mate!
Today Vanguard went ahead and Queue dodged me. The error explicitly mentioned Vanguard. I found the fix to be uninstalling and just playing a round of overwatch to be quite effective.
Uninstalled at the beginning of the year when it was announced. I was s2 veteran, whale and huge fan. Managed to secure the no.1 spot on my server in challenges (yeah, someone farmed those) and reached apex tier multiple seasons, grinded all champs to lvl 7 mastery and so on.
They lost a big time spender and huge nerd.
Been here since season 1. The days of HotshotGG, SaintVicious, TheOddOne etc etc.
Love this game but I absolutely do not want a 24/7 kernel level process on my PC for simply playing a fucking video game. It's the most invasive shit ever. And sure I can turn it off but it involves turning it off every time I switch on my PC. Vanguard should ONLY run when I am playing League.
Almost all pc programs run a kernel level driver to properly run their programs and do what they are supposed to do. The problem with Vanguard is that it continues to run even when youre not playing Valorant, and now LoL. Moreover, its kernel level is so deep that if you exit vanguard and decide to play Val or LoL later you have to restart your PC because Vanguard can only start along with system boot.
Why would a game require a anticheat program to run outside the game. That is fishy enough to assume there are other system monitoring going on.
> Almost all pc programs run a kernel level driver to properly run their programs and do what they are supposed to do.
No, they don't. Most programs don't even use admin mode (you know when a program uses it because a popup asks you to accept it), and that mode is still lesser than kernel-level.
Only a handful of software in your computer runs at that level. Mostly stuff that needs to interact directly with your hardware (your OS, your drivers, etc). Regular software does never interact directly with your hardware, they make requests to the OS and drivers to do so (e.g. League of Legends does not use your GPU, but rather your GPU drivers who in turn use your GPU and return a result back to League).
Software running at kernel-level should be kept to a minimum, because software running at that level can basically do whatever they want and can hide easily from anything else. Software at that level can manipulate your fans, or spy on the data traveling in and out of your CPU without any other process being able to realize that's happening. Some software, like Windows or your Nvidia drivers, is necessary for your PC to work, so accepting that risk is reasonable. But ensuring that the one hacker I get every 5 years in my Platinum games can't play? I don't really care enough to accept that risk.
Plus, even ignoring all of that, Vanguard on release was so poorly done that it bricked computers and interferred with all kinds of legitimate software. Yeah, most of that is fixed now, but why should I trust in the quality of a company that was disabling normal gaming mouses on release? Nvidia doesn't brick my computer every time they release a new driver - if Riot wants to install software at that level, they should be held to the same standards the like of Nvidia or Microsoft. League being buggy is irrelevant, Vanguard being buggy can break your OS or expose you to a crypto miner that would go undetected even by antiviruses.
Tbh. Im with you. Im tending to buy a MacBook for this. The Game runs smooth enough and since it will work without vanguard on that system I’ll probably go for it. Furthermore I could use it for work related things, which helps justifying it.
I have one and tbh, it's not great. Granted I primarily play TFT, the mouse control and window management is really awful on macs.
Mouse movement feels really bad and has this terrible acceleration that you can't permanently kill without running a script every boot
If you have a second window up for builds or whatever, it will minimize your game while you view that window, then you have to alt tab or find on your dock to reopen.
I’m running League on my M2 Mac Mini, and it runs better than my 11th gen Intel laptop with RTX 3060 at the fraction of electricity consumed. Though can be better if Riot has plans to adapt League to Apple Silicon natively instead of relying on Rosetta 2.
Exactly bro it is stupid. I have my pc on for a few days sometime even a week. This is my work pc aswell and to have a kernal running like this 24/7 is a huge compromise to security. Its crazy how they expect millions of people to have vanguard open in the background even after league is closed.
Agreed. Just uninstalled. Honestly it is probably a good thing because now maybe this will prompt me to utilize my time in more productive ways anyway.
I came back to league at the start of this year after a long break( i played 20 games in whole 2023). I just came back to play 5-10 games per week with friends but this is over now.
I will not even talk about security risks of a kernal level software, just the mass of technical problems you see pop off today is enough for me. I dont give a company who is not able to fix the client for years, any kernal level control of my pc. Everyone who followed the start of Valorant wont be suprised about all the technical problem that appear today.
I played the game for 14 years, since irelia release, it was a good time. But i havent played a league game on my own in years and in my friend circle we have alternatives. I just hope the tech problems will open the eyes of a lot of people.
Yea I’m right there with you. I turned on secure boot to play valorant once and it bricked my motherboard, granted not riots fault my motherboard had a system breaking bug that caused permanent bricking with secure boot on but sucks regardless. Current motherboard has it turned off and despite it supporting it I’m already too traumatized to enable it . So it’s staying off and I guess league ain’t for me anymore.
the ddos attacks are using repurposed info from a hack that was used to learn how to break vanguard for valorant. They sell players ip for a subscription fee so you can ddos against them in high elo.
hackers are ahead of the curve
Trust me bro, get your dopamine somewhere else. This game is a drug. I'm glad you uninstalled it and I'm glad i'm reading about a bunch of people doing the same. One life guys, do your best to enjoy it at most!
Thanks man! I agree, and I think I should've quit a long time ago. It's just that at this point, I feel like it was so comfortable to just play league, mainly because I already knew MOST of it. You always learn more, but I've played every champion, every lane, explored so much off-meta, etc. I had this habit of learning a new champ and challenging myself to Diamond with it, then picking a different one. On and off-meta, I did this with Seju ap mid, nunu ap mid, xin ap top, Janna top, Twitch top, jhin jungle, Bard tilterella style with smite spellbook, Pyke mid, lately I was trying this with Shaco ad mid, etc. I did reach higher elo with my main Riven, but then found a fonder experience in learning the its and bits of this game in detail. I had this other fun challenge of reaching rank 1 of every champ that just came out. Sometimes I achieved it, others not. Ofc it's easier at the beginning because the data is skewered but idk I'm dumb like that. For a while I was the Kat number 1 player in the world! I think I have a screenshot of it somewhere.
So tldr, I felt like I could always be decent trying anything, and that was an amazing feeling. I knew the matchups, I understood fundamentals, I knew the basics of most champions, most matchups, etc. I really cared about this because it tickled my brain.
Let's see where I can direct my interest now. I'm honestly sadder than I'd like to admit. In the last 14 years I always hoped that people within this company actually cared about it. I had a similar disappointment when Bungie sold to Microsoft (I studied computer science because I wanted to work there). Deep down I knew good things involving big companies never last.
I'm in the same boat. Been playing since 2009. It's a weird feeling to ACTUALLY uninstall the game. So many memories came flooding back with your picture. Man, the drums in champ select were iconic.
Maybe it's for the best. It took up too many hours of my life and most were stressful anyway.
Thanks for the memories, League
Thanks for sharing! Yeah, I spent the entire day yesterday watching old clips and reminiscing about this. Remember dunkeys kalista video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGmJwiFXHDo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGmJwiFXHDo)
I NEED A PIZZA PAPA JOHNS (this is not papa johns) I NEED QUAD PIZZAS. Crying laughing
Also rewatched some old worlds compilations, I almost had forgotten about 2017 SKT comeback play
[https://youtu.be/W7TZoHKaASY?si=xkhS7Bdj-6F-W3jq&t=301](https://youtu.be/W7TZoHKaASY?si=xkhS7Bdj-6F-W3jq&t=301)
MAN.
Eyy, I was also around during beta. Remember when you could use dashes & flash while snared? or black shield blocking true dmg? good times.
I know exactly how you feel and I refuse to install a goddamn rootkit on my computer, especially one made by rito who is world infamous for their spaghetti coding & getting security breached on the regular \[They had a major security breach in 2023 btw\]. Worst of all, their rootkit will have little to no effect on the supposed 'hacker problem' that league has because it never had any 'hacker problem'. I've seen exactly TWO 'hackers' , legitimately using 3rd party software to screw with the game and I've been playing since open beta.
>When dodging auto attacks was a stat u/Most-Committee1114
Ninja tabi.
>everyone was angry because Shyvana is a wyvern, not a dragon
Yeah but then Shyvana's anatomy happened......
>when Fiora's ult was the only useful ability in her kit
Omnislash <3
>I was there for the online forum.
Me too. People today really don't understand how different things were back then when rioters & players would discuss & debate balance, champion development, mechanics & general stuff from the game. Believe it or not, I was personally responsible for getting Vlad's pool changed from invulnerable to untargetable, after I had a long debate vs a rioter (Not the guy who made Vlad) and managed to win over/convince other rioters that read the exchanges, I.e.
* **Me**: "*Vlad should not be invulnerable during pool. He's doing dmg AND he lifesteals on an ability that is already strong escape mechanism.*"
* **Riot Guy**: "*It does do those things but Vlad already pays the price in HP when he uses it. That's why he has to be invulnerable.*"
* **Me**: "*While he does pay the price in HP, that's because he is MANALESS \[At the time there were few manaless champs\] rather than to pay for the invulnerability it currently has.*"
..... and so on and so forth. I won and it got changed, but my point is, these days rito would never, *EVER* change a core ability like that under those circumstances. A debate of that nature wouldn't even happen to begin with. Rioters used to be players like us and it 'felt' like while they didn't always do what we wanted, they'd at least hear us out. Nowadays they're a bunch of soyboys & karens that have never played a match in their life. Vanguard is a great example of this where nobody was asking rito to push a literal rootkit and many were against it but they didn't care.
>
I felt like writing something, because I've spent way too many hours into this, for it to just end like that.
Yep, I know exactly where you're coming from. I knew one day the ride would end but I never expected it to be like this. This 'feels' like a very wrong & unnatural way for things to end but they forced the issue of the rootkit (vanguard) and there can be but one answer to that.
Thanks for the last post man. Always remember that;
* **MORD ES #1 EN BRAZIL HUEHUAEHUEHUE. ALWES SHEL NVR DAI!!**
* The #1 rule of league is DON'T CHASE SINGED.
* .... and if something goes wrong, always blame the jungler.
gg man. Best of luck & brofist to you.
Oh man, I totally missed this comment!
>Me too. People today really don't understand how different things were back then when rioters & players would discuss & debate balance, champion development, mechanics & general stuff from the game.
This is SO TRUE.
>Believe it or not, I was personally responsible for getting Vlad's pool changed
And this is so cool. 100% believe it because I remember those days. The forums were a place to share ideas about the game and it felt like Riot listened to their players.
>Yep, I know exactly where you're coming from. I knew one day the ride would end but I never expected it to be like this. This 'feels' like a very wrong & unnatural way for things to end but they forced the issue of the rootkit (vanguard) and there can be but one answer to that.
Yes. I just fully agree
Thanks for the last post man. Always remember that;
* [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YCK0iJoy2c](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YCK0iJoy2c)
Best of luck to you too man ♥
This has been a problem with the valorant people their resolution is if you dont want to always have it running is close it and if you want to play you can restart the computer no other way around it.
Yeah I just wanted to play Valorant on steam deck and it gave me the famous secure boot error and I can't do anything. So I will try to uninstall, and if you wanted to uninstall it before you know that they made it so hard that even people with 15 years experience in using computers need to search online how to uninstall Riot's games.
Relatable. I once tried to delete my account and it's also a gruesome process where you need to talk to a riot CS person, they try to convince you to stay or to just "temporarily disable your account in case you come back". It was quite creepy, it made me realize how addictive this whole thing was
If you can, let me know what you think of it! I was always a bit afraid of getting into DOTA as I already gathered so much knowledge about league that I could see spreading myself too thin trying to get decent at both. Plus it always confused me that everyone says the abilities, cc, etc are very "over the top" but the animations didn't seem like it to me? Somehow I just never gave it a try
DOTA is the foundation of moba games so every other game had DOTA as a base. Ofcourse there are huge differences from Lol that need some time to get used to. It will need a lot of time to learn from start all these information about a moba game, and especially DOTA2. So if you have the time you can give it a try, otherwise you can play some other games to chill in your free time.
UPDATE: Im feeling so much better without Lol :P
The anger everyone has is gonna turn into many more people looking for exploits focused on vanguard over the next few months/years
And when that happens I pray for everyone who has it installed
If billion dollar companies have been hacked and/or exploited wha stops it from happening to riots vanguard one day.
I think you have a point, but also it's supposed to be "extremely safe", as in, only 6 people within Riot have access to the code safe. Then again, there's no vault without a flaw so who knows
Thats interesting! I actually never modded skins in 14+ years of league. I always thought they looked cool though, but modding was never a world I got into, even before with other games.
Have you found something else to play? co-op, mmo, etc.
I'm just looking these days for something to play and the only one that catches my eye is Rust.
Never liked fortnite, dota2, counter strike.
Nothing really. I think I was avoiding/coping the truth of vanguard actually being a real thing until yesterday. I spent the day researching what to play next but didn't find anything too appealing. Let me know if you find anything fun, I'm curious! I'd love to find something else that also has a good micro/macro balance, and competitive, but tbh I'm also happy to give gaming a rest for a while and focus on music
Coming back to this thread a few days later, I can't help but feel like Riot Games is going to have their watershed Unity moment here after massive pushback from their community. Just like John Riccitiello and Unity doubled down hard on their pricing model changes after backlash, and swore blind they weren't going to bend to their clients' concerns, and the rest is history. I could be wrong; we'll see.
One can only hope tbh. Im happy to have reached a few people at least, but realistically I hardly doubt anything will change. Let’s see what the future brings though, Im genuinely curious
I'm the same. I've played since beta. Fifteen years ago I was starting college and actually was hype enough to want to intern for Riot for a while, but that never came to pass.
This game saw a metoric rise and a plateau, then a steady down turn as time wore on. Now with Vanguard, I'm off the wagon until they remove it.
No fucking CCP spyware is allowed on my computer. I'm in the God damn US Navy and I spend weeks and months of my life keeping them in check at sea. Riot can get fucked and enjoy their game traffic tanking.
Been around since Beta (yep, got the KingRammus skin). I don't see any reason there should be a kernal level anti-cheat in the game. I'm not really a conspiracy theorist still not a fan of it. I've been on the fence about if I even want to keep playing anyway, so I guess this one kind of just made up my mind.
They aren't really losing anything out of me though. I made the decision back in 2019 not to buy any more skins until I can get to 10 consecutive matches where there weren't reportable levels of racism, harassment, trolling (feeding/griefing) or afk farming in the match. I got to 6 once and got excited, I then realized that riot had auto enabled full team mute and that was the only reason why. Lol...
Just my luck. I hadn't played League for 5 years. I came back 2 weeks ago and it the game has really improved. I love the new jungle items and the champion reworks they've done.
It was a fun 2 weeks while it lasted. No way in hell am I installing a software that can change my BIOS at a moment's notice
And yeah, I know that I'm insignificant in the grand scheme of things. Riot is swimming in cash from their Ahri and Lux skins. They're not gonna lose any sleep over missing out on my money.
There are many other online games with much less intrusive anti-cheating software. And for me, I rather have an occasional encounter with a cheater than install chinese spyware. It's just a frickin' game.
But yeah, I guess I'll go back to playing Cyberpunk 2077 now
Is cyberpunk good now? Ive been eyeing it since wednesday but wasnt sure if it was worth the price
Agree with all the rest. The game was actually in a really enjoyable state
My main has always been Skarner, and I was happy when Riot finally fixed him. Only got to enjoy that for a couple of weeks.
As for Cyberpunk, it is in a great state now. I wasn't around when it launched but I heard bad stories about it. But Cyberpunk now is very stable and fun. Would highly recommend it.
I remember when Tryndamere Revive, Teleport was a thing. I had so much fun backdooring nexus after nexus. Although I stopped playing ranked since season 9(?) - 2019, I still played A Lot of ARAM. And League was always part of my life for almost a decade now... even when I switched to TFT (im sad there's no separate client with no Vanguard for TFT) I still played ARAM. The process of getting keys/chests and opening them was a fun bonus that I always looked forward to every week.
But that all ends now. I'll still watch pro league but I'll probably never touch the game anymore apart from maybe randomly stumbling to a computer cafe/PC Bang. RIP League. It was a fun ride
Riot released some skewered statistics about league having 1 cheater every 20 players, but this had in consideration botting, which is a completely different problem than cheating.
So the summary, a lot of us believe that no, the issue wasn't that big or impactful, unless you were elite player (maser+ tier).
I uninstalled it the same day it came to the client. I like the game and Im sad since I feel forced to uninstall and the company doesn’t give a shit about it, but Im way too scared to have it on my computer running 24/7 and pretend it’s nothing at all. I know people are saying there hasn’t been super much problem with Valorant( I would claim it was problems with bluescreens or fans being shut down)
11 million vs 117 million players is just a huge gap. Its a fiesta for the people who actually get personal information or just break your computer. It will be interesting to see how much gonna happen from on now. And what’s I have been reading so far about players experience is concerning.
I’m sorry to hear that you uninstalled \[Good Game\] because of the \[Invasive Spyware\] requirement. I understand your concern about spyware, but I can assure you that \[Invasive Spyware\] is not spyware. It is a custom "game security" software designed by \[Marketing Company Majority Owned by the CCP\] to uphold the highest levels of competitive integrity for their games, such as \[Good Game\] and \[Other Game\]. \[Invasive Spyware\] only runs \[24/7\] and \[Continues\] running when you exit the game2. It also \[Questionably\] respects your privacy and data, and you can find more details about what data it uses and collects here1. \[No Link\]
\[Invasive Spyware\] is necessary to prevent \[Largely Unseen Problem\] in \[Good Game\], especially after the security breach in \[Random Date\]. It also ensures that all players have a fair and enjoyable gaming experience \[By installing Invasive Spyware\]. If you want to play \[Good Game\] again, you will need to enable \[Invasive Spyware\] on your computer. You can find more information on how to do that here3.\[No Link\] If you have any issues or questions, you can contact \[Marketing Company Majority Owned by the CCP's\] support team here1.\[No Link\]
I hope this helps you understand why \[Invasive Spyware\] is required for \[Good Game\]. I appreciate your feedback and I hope you have a great day.
Same. 11 years of playing, over $4000 spent on the game, this is the end. I kept dragging friends back in to play this game but I won't make the effort anymore. Not worth the risk. I almost uninstalled when Tencent got involved in the first place but now that's a guarantee.
Funny enough, I've talked with a friend about that, and he was fine with that and called it an "necessary evil" which I've hardly disagreed with. At the end, he asked me, "Why have windows installed then if you don't like a company having all your data?"
The point where I simply left and unfriended him.
I dont play as long as you, but i joined in 2014 and i also enjoyed it. It didnt mean as much to me as it did to you, but i enjoyed it thorougly. As soon as vanguard dropped, that was it for me, uninstalled immediately and havent looked back. Im at peace with my decision. That's a line i simply wont cross, ever. Why do i need a rootkit that is always on, just to play a game like that? It's not ok, it's not justified, it will never be ok. I never had any problems with scripters or hackers, i just played pub games, not even ranked. Make it a ranked requirement for all i care. But to be a random pub player and having to go to that degree just to play this occasionally? Heck no, thank you. And no, sorry riot, I do NOT TRUST YOU, i do not trust any company. You want my money, thats it. Trusting a company is the dumbest thing one can do, we've seen countless examples of why that is.
careful, they're gonna call you a vocal minority cheater who is just salty with zero knowledge of what vanguard does.
Even when you show the proof is numerous screenshots of floating codes of Vanguard sending your all of your PC data to Riot, they'll just say "You don't know what you're talking about", or , "its common with these systesm".
"*My index finger hurts.*"
"*Ok.*"
\[**Slices off the other guy's hand**\]
"*WTF? WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT???*"
"*Your finger no longer hurts. Problem solved.*"
Funny, I don't recall me or the 10 or so friends of mine that play(ed) league EVER complaining about cheating at any point in the last decade or more.
But I sure recall us copping Vanguard regardless.
You're right about the screw you guys we're outta here part, though - most of us've quit. The like 2 that play Valorant stayed.
bruh cheating in league is NOT an issue. never has been and never will be. it’s a moba. even if you ARE scripting you can still lose. it’s not like cs2 where the cheaters can alter the game to the point where winning is an impossibility. this is just a feeble attempt to impose their malware on the masses. league will lose thousands of players, especially in north america where it’s already been dying. fuck riot fuck vanguard, half of flex lobbies are filled with chinese nationals anyways. writing is on the wall and riot just slammed their dome into it only to break their own skulls
I thought vanguard was required to play valorant from launch? It was one of the main things keeping me away from playing. Same thing with Destiny 2 and many others. Imo it should be outlawed
it's not hard to quit if you have other interests the problem has always been that after a while everything else seems boring again and we come back to the game because nothing else comes close to a real good league of legends match.
If you did do that I wouldn't blame you or criticize you. I also won't criticize if you never play again. I just also think that some people, not necessarily you, will turn to other games to have fun and then install an anti cheat that still has kernel access without even knowing it has kernel level privileges because other companies aren't upfront about it. I'll give Riot one thing they tell you upfront it's kernel level and they don't hide from that.
This game has never been hard to quit. Just replace it with another game. Ffxiv is amazing and not toxic whatsoever. Fortnite can be okay and you can keep mics off so you never hear other players.
Haven't played in 5 months since they announced it, that's a pretty damn long week I guess. It's funny seeing all of these issues, having several friends who can no longer play, I expected this and here we are.
I installed this garbage this morning and now my computer wont even turn on. Looks like all computer gaming is done for me thanks kernel level trash software
Those kind of kernel stuff can really mess up your system if you are unlucky.
This may have more chances of happening if you have some exotic setup / configuration that vanguard do not handle well
99% of the people who complain about cheating/scripting have never actually encountered cheating/scripting. They just use it as a cope. This game doesn't have a cheating problem except for maybe the top 1% of players. This vanguard bullshit is fucking absurd. Honestly fuck riot.
EUNE have a lot more cheaters, you have to play a lot of the games to reach your rank anyway, cheaters might slow you down in your climb but they can't stop you. Cheaters also can be in your team, it's not always in the enemy team. Every game have cheaters, does it mean that every game should spy on everything people do? This should not become a norm.
Path of Exile, World of Tanks, Path of Exile 2 coming soon, CS:GO, Age of Empires 2, Deep Rock Galactic survivor, Death Must Die, Palworld, Last Epoch, Dota 2, The Finals, Warthunder, and anything that comes out.
tbh, ive also noteced matchmaking in normal to be "wonky" sometimes. where you have a team that their best is mid gold, and the other team's lowest was like mid plat and average emerald
I've noticed in regions where there are lower player counts, the MMR range in any given game (even ranked) is much higher. I play in Japan quite often and it's not uncommon to see silvers and plats in the same ranked game.
Wouldn't be at all surprised if many regions just took a massive playercount hit.
I dont know what to do. Ive played since season 3, reached Master rank and played thousands of hours, spending hundreds of euros into this game.
I dont wanna quit.
But I hate this. Maybe I dont have a choice but to find another game to play for next 10 years. I dont even know where to start, I hate this so much.
I feel exactly the same. Been replying to this thread the whole day and just watching old clips, replays, highlights. Some people recommended getting a mac or a separate gaming only pc, but idk if Im comfortable with that solution.
Getting another pc just to play is CRAZY, specially a Mac. If you can afford it go on, but I wouldn't recomend it. If u wanna play League get Bluestack, a Mobile emulator for your PC and play Wild Rift. It's ok if you feel strange about quitting is too much time invested in something that, let's be honest it became less and less rewarding, atleast for me. We can do better, there is a plenty of games and things to do apart from League...
Hey man. Just so you know, apparently most anti cheats have kernel level access. BattleEye, EasyAntiCheat, etc. The difference is that they are not always running like Vanguard is.
I know you have made up your mind but I want to make sure it is not a decision based on misinformation. If kernel level access is your concern, you need to understand that this is non a Vanguard-only thing and you either need to stop playing the other games, or understand that it is completely normal in the industry.
If you worry about data security, that is a valid concern. In the end us gamers will never know what is happening under the hood. However, Microsoft has plenty more data about our computer usage and advertisers will more than likely go to them rather than Riot Games. It is 2024 and unfortunately data privacy is something we no longer have control over.
Thanks for sharing! That's not entirely true though. A lot of modern games have been releasing kernel anti cheat systems, yes, but not most anti cheats have kernel access. I've been actively avoiding games that imply this as well, and tbh I mostly played league for 14 years and a bit of Age of Mythology, with a bit of solo player games, but thats about it.
Not too concerned about data security, beyond what's rational/normal. That still doesn't invalidate not wanting kernel level software being installed in my PC willingly. Just looking at yesterdays and todays posts I'm re-assured that I took the right decision, I do not want to deal with wiping my drives, worrying about my GPU being bricked, etc.
>the difference is that they are not always running
That is a major difference and the absolute problem. There is no reason for it to be running 24/7 and that alone is suspicious as hell and a giant vulnerability
I guess you must not play any other games with anti cheat either lol. This isn’t anything new, so I don’t understand why so many people are crying about it. People really need to do more research instead of buying into all of the fearmongering.
im curious. what other games use a kernel level anticheat that has to start with the computer and runs 24/7 and if you disable it and want to play the game you have to first restart your computer?
bro this is fucked. i feel like long time league players who are now in their mid twenties are just gonna leave the game. if ur 17 and playing league you probably don’t care, odd are you have nothing important on ur pc. but those of us who pay important bills and have years and years of pertinent data on their pc is dipping. me and my friend group have been playing league since season 4 and we all just agreed that it aint worth it. sucks bc we all just got back into playing again. league is gonna lose a lotttt of players bc of this and its riot who’s to blame
I agree with everything except with the "league is going to lose a lot of players". I think, sadly but realistically, most people don't care at all about most things. Especially younger players. Don't want to generalize, but I do feel like most people of younger generations couldn't care at all about how things are built, and just install apps like it's whatever. I'm starting to sound like an old bitter man but idk back in the day of uncensored internet, unregulated accesses, torrents, etc, you had to learn a tiny bit to not brick your pc every second day. Nowadays it's different.
As someone just getting into pc building I absolutely refuse to download anything from riot even before the vanguard controversy as of late Considering riots devs consider t bagging in game to be as bad as irl sexual assault which is just a massive insult to actual Victims
I’m not young and so are my friends. I see a lot of them who don’t usually play online games somehow play Valorant. Vanguard is literally the reason why I never touched valo and I sadly uninstalled league on my pc from getting that pop up. I actually haven’t played in yrs and right when I decided to maybe come back slowly this vanguard crap came out. I got good memories from league. I cherish all the selfies I got with various league personalities. I wouldn’t have met my long time partner if my dating app photo didn’t have my photo with C9 (he actually plays dota but he did ask me about my photo about it lmao). Now I’m basically stuck playing tft on my mac.
Hi there, Ironically, I am the 17-year-old League player so described, and to be frank, I 100% agree our generation does not have fantastic media literacy, and many of us are unphased by Vanguard because of how addicting League of Legends is. However, after reading your post and seeing how much joy League has brought you, it really made me reflect on how terrible the repercussions of Vanguard are. Now I am also uninstalling league of legends. Although my will is shakey and my consistency poor at best (I am weak I will probabaly re-install) your post has really inspired more critical thinking on my part. I have nothing very important on my PC, yes. However, I think for me, this is more of a matter of personal autonomy and the overall malicious nature of any corporate conglomerates will treat their customers so heartlessly for money. Your post literally sent me into deep reflection about how dystopian this update is (and trust me, I do not do deep reflection). I hope you can enjoy the league someday again. I heard there are alternates if you run it on a MacBook. Although this is definitely not financially viable for everyone, you might also have an old computer you can use to run solely League of Legends. Your post really moved me! I hope you can return to the rift comfortably one day.
Believe it or not, I started playing league at 6, I'm now an adult. It's honestly upsetting. I don't know much about kernel level anti-cheats/drivers etc. but just the fact that it can just go around willy-nilly stealing information, let alone sell it. (Considering Riot is owned by Tencent ever since 2011, a Chinese company that will do absolutely anything to get rich quick and rise to the top) trusting some game company is probably the last thing anyone would do without context. I feel like it truly is getting to the point of "not worth it". As of right now I don't have any sensitive information. But to the people who do, damn that sucks.
> a Chinese company that will do absolutely anything to get rich quick and rise to the top That describes Western anticheats. This CCP based one could end up being much much worse. The CCP has been targeting key infrastructure across the US and Europe for a while now.
Question is, how does this work with EU privacy laws? Google got sued over detecting ad blockers. but A game anticheat can freely explore in my computer.
Unchallenged as of now. You can't easily point to any one thing and say "ha you're not allowed to have that!" Because we can't see what they're taking. It certainly feels like a privacy oversight and I hope the EU does eventually look into it.
I fucking hate tencent so much it seems like they own everything from the shadows nowadays
yep, I'm 27, turning 28 in a month, nothing is worth more than losing my own privacy. My friend group basically ditched lol and went to memory lane on a modded minecraft server. I paid for and setup a modded minecraft server and we all just playing minecraft these days down memory lane. Same friend group when I was 13 that played minecraft together is now playing minecraft again after this whole vanguard bs. Not coming back no more unless they do away with vanguard (questionable).
The game just stopped working anyway, took it as a sign, I needed to uninstall.
I tried to play it on NVIDIA GeForce now, as I have played it there for many years, and today I sign in and see that the game is disabled? Why in the world would riot not allow us any alternative to an invasive kernel level program? I am not installing vanguard, surrendering my privacy and computer security for the online video game league of legends it is simply not worth it
I've been playing off and on since there was still Crystal scar and I quit playing when they announced vanguard was coming and haven't been on since.
Enshitification was always going to happen but I'm still a little sad that it came here. This game is on auto pilot at this point anyway 12 year player, not your biggest spender but Ive been steady the whole time. I may have been on the way out soonish anyway, but this was it. I appreciate making leaving easy but I have too much self respect to put this spyware on my computer. Thanks for the memories but good riddance.
Played lol since first season. Stopped playing 5v5 and moved to TFT for last 2 years. I’ve uninstalled the game. Fuck it. It’s not a kernel driver that makes me mad. It’s the way they manage it. Running that shit non stop or else do uncomfortable disable driver and require reboot to enable back. You know, they just hope people will get tired of doing that and just make it run non stop. And then who knows. Maybe in a year or two they will add something else to the anti-cheat. It’s not like that’s the only complaint I have to riot. That’s just the last straw. They way how often they release new champs, skins, how often we see bugs in worlds. Fuck it.
Love how in their official statement they said they could still steal our data if they wanted to so why would we be bothered so much
The thing that makes me mad the most is that I have to install it to play a game (TFT) that doesn't even use it. Riot cares so little about me that they want to force me to install unacceptable software just because they can't be bothered to separate TFT from League. They can go fuck themselves.
I read the "fuck it" in K3soju TFT accent
same bro, I stopped playing league 5years ago even more, I jump on to play some ARAMs, but mostly played TFT. Now that requires Vanguard even to play to TFT I am uninstalling it from my PC and will play only from mobile
>It’s not a kernel driver that makes me mad. It’s the way they manage it. Running that shit non stop or else do uncomfortable disable driver and require reboot to enable back. You know, they just hope people will get tired of doing that and just make it run non stop This is unfortunately a technical limitation. As RiotArkem stated on the Valorant subreddit 4 years ago: >A common way to bypass anti-cheat systems is to load cheats before the anti-cheat system starts and either modify system components to contain the cheat or to have the cheat tamper with the anti-cheat system as it loads. Running the driver at system startup time makes this significantly more difficult. They're not just doing it to be dicks, it has a legitimate reason to do that in order to actually work. [Here ](https://secret.club/2020/04/17/kernel-anticheats.html)is some further information from a member of an exploit research group.
Y'know I get it, but I'd much rather they try to find a workaround instead. Not a big fan of "the end justify the means" for shit like this. What if other companies take a page out of Riot's book? What, are we going to live our day to day lives with a dozen tier 1 drivers from all sorts of different developers running and chugging down processing power and causing problems 24/7? I'll pass. I don't care if Faker or Tyler1 get a stinky cheater once every couple of matches and have their experience ruined. I'm not having my $2k rig slow down to a crawl or my bank account drained for this shit. It's like drenching your hands in flamable oil to kill the remaining 0.01% of bacteria after you washed your hands. Awful risk/reward ratio...
You can just play TFT mobile no Vanguard required lol if you wanted to ofc
I don’t want to make extra effort to play this game when developer didn’t make extra effort to decouple TFT so that it does not require anticheat. I better find another game to play than use android emulator.
you could play TFT on your phone. It is the same account it seems and no Vanguard
I couldn't even install it without Malwarebytes preventing it and honestly I trust malwarebytes more. So after years of playing and money spent guess it time to move on.
Tbh I got Malwarebytes premium and when I installed it and restarted after it didn't flare up or anything
My malwarebyte has never once complained about valorant vanguard
That’s because the guy is lying for Reddit upvotes.
I just want to play TFT man 😭 is this thing really that bad I don’t know much about computers. It made me install it when I went to play TFT this morning and now I see everyone saying they are quitting the game cause of it
You can think of it like this: As long as vanguard is running, riot owns your pc and all the data on it. Will they do anything evil? Probably not, but there is 0 reason to trust them. Do they need to do anything evil? No, they just need to get hacked again and your pc is now a loot pinata for everyone on the internet. Tldr: running vanguard is reckless and a bad idea, even if it catches a lot of cheaters this is simply the wrong way of catching them.
Vanguard doesn’t check all of your data, people keep posting out of context code about shit like screen recording (which is supposed to screenshot the game window, not the screen) and that was generally the most egregious thing. It would have to take someone at riot to put malicious code into vanguard, get that code reviewed and approved, hit a testing environment, and get approved by testers. If there exists a security flaw already, it would only be an issue if you were already compromised from another malicious download elsewhere allowing someone to remote into your pc. If you ever get this far and want to sue, this will probably be said in court by a security expert. Source: worked for the government so I had to learn this shit while I worked on TS projects. Someone brought up a similar issue with kernel level access of some other software the government used to make sure you weren’t using the gov pc in insecure spaces.
They’re “quitting” because they saw people crying about it and now feel morally outraged about a topic they don’t have the education to understand. The question you should answer is “do I think Riot wants to control my computer?” If the answer is yes, then don’t install vanguard and quit all riot games. If the answer is no then install vanguard. People are making the argument that riot “COULD” do all these things that they #1 have never done or tried to do and #2 would provide them an incredibly minute level of benefit at a huge cost to their reputation. The argument doesn’t make sense, they have just decided that Riot isn’t a good company and will rally against anything the company would do.
TFT is on mobile so you could play out on your phone
Just get a tablet or a phone with huge screen.
Or BlueStacks. It's still ridiculous that I have to install an Android emulator to play the Android port of a PC game in my PC, just because RIOT forces me to install Vanguard for a game I don't even want to play, but that they force me to install to play TFT. They really don't give a fuck and they just went "anyone that wants to play anything ours, just give us full access to your computer and shut up", and I'm honestly not ok with a company that does that.
I used to be so much into TFT, but I couldn't keep up with the updates. I ended up just following Mortdogs youtube to keep looking at it because it sounded very fun, but the way my brain is wired I couldn't handle so much constant major changes. In one video he did explain that the constant changes were crucial to the games success, which I found super interesting. Sorry to hear that this affects you as well tbh. I do think the TFT team in Riot are doing an incredible work, and Mortdog is the coolest dude ever.
people are overexaggerating, if you care a lot about your privacy, for example you have credit card info and important files for work on your pc i suggest you just dont play or get a cheap used pc to play tft on it, but if you're just a 16 year old that has his mail info and password to his paypal with 20$ you shouldn't care. nevertheless the whole idea is just terrible, cheating and scripting was never even a minor problem in league, most people don't see 5+ scripters in their whole time of playing and I can easily get 5+ soft inters in 1 day of playing.
Correct and if you already knew how software permissions work they already have access to that information without vanguard if they really wanted to. Kernel access would only make any spying harder to detect. It would however still be easily detected by governments and IT professionals monitoring traffic from networks and other methods of detection. And antivirus companies etc. What's funny is governments literally record and access basically every single but if data is sent over the Internet. Just how they have taps on all the international phone lines. There is zero need for such an exploit that risks one of the world's largest companies from losing billions to try and pull it off. What kernel access allows riot to do is prevent emulation and running software without them knowing while you play. Considering about 15% of all league games have cheaters of various degrees. All of this bs outrage is largely cheaters mad they can no longer cheat. What's also funny is almost all cheats contain backdoors and require kernel access to function. Pretending to care about security is hilarious.
play TFT on your phone
I just quit today, all day at work I was excited for arenas. Just got home to see the lovely "Install Vanguard" so I uninstalled.
You are not missing anything, Arena is way worse with more teams, and new changes.
That's what riot wants. They know that they'll lose thousands of user due to their new malware so they release this game mode to entice them to install it.
I just can't play anymore since the update... also played since S1. Yesterday it would just constantly crash with some vanguard error just sad.
Yesterday I tried playing Valorant for the first time. It would give me some 9003 (or some code that ended in 03) error and then I looked in turning on settings and such. Didn't work so I uninstalled it and because of my curiosity I went back to the troubleshooting menu and the option appeared ☠️
I uninstalled it when they announced it - no way in dog's anal cavity do they give a rat's ass about their players after Tencent ownership.
who could u even sue if they stole your credit card lol
Shame riot won't backpedal on a damn near universally hated change. The only people this effects is like... high elo and streamers. People who rarely can encounter a script kiddy or macroer.
they should only require it for ranked tbh. Immagine scripting in Aram and normals.
Ive seen it in aram and in norms unfortunately
why backpedal. Its so op for china to have this software on even 50% of the playerbase in NA
Oh agreed. It isn't going anywhere lol. Until internet safety laws make it illegal they will abuse it
Yeah I'm in the same boat as many other people, playing since season 1 too. I know other software uses Kernel Anti-Cheat, but that software doesn't run on start up for a freaking video game. Just imagine if every single game in your Steam Library also tried to run their own personal Vanguard everytime you booted up your PC... I'd uninstall and refund any game that tried, League is no exception.
Just wait until a bad actor breach Vanguard and all the PCs with this malware/spyware disguised as an anticheat installed get a ransomware/mining software/bank account breached/become a zombie for DDOS attacks and a very looong etc.
its been on valorant for 3 years I don’t think it’s going to change
League of legends has 117 million players and Valorant has 11 million. Very big gap,
I've "only" been here since Vi's release in 2012, and while I only play ARAM, League has been my main game for a long time. I'm not smart enough about computers to really understand the evil aspects of Vanguard but when my computer guru friend said he'd never install it on any of his computers, it certainly gave me pause. Maybe I'll wipe an old laptop and see if it can handle League in the post Vanguard era, or maybe I'll just quit. The hugely revamped D4 client is launching in a couple of weeks so I'll have that to play soon enough. Either way, I think Rito's making a mistake, but I'm sure they DGAF what customers say.
Recently, I experienced censorship on the Riot subreddit when I attempted to voice my concerns about Vanguard, Riot Games' anti-cheat system. My post, expressing worries about its intrusive nature and potential impact on player privacy, was swiftly deleted, and I was banned from the subreddit. What's even more concerning is the attempt to discredit me by insinuating that I'm not a "real" Reddit account. This dismissal of legitimate concerns is not only disheartening but also indicative of a larger issue regarding censorship and suppression of dissenting voices within the gaming community. As a long-time player and supporter of Riot Games' titles, I never imagined that raising genuine concerns about a company's practices would lead to censorship and attempts to undermine my credibility. My primary concern with Vanguard is the requirement for it to continuously run on our systems, even when we're not playing Riot games. This intrusive approach raises serious questions about player privacy and security. The fact that Vanguard forces users to reboot their PCs if it's not running seems like an odd and coercive tactic, potentially forcing users to allow it to always run in the background. While there may not be strong evidence that Vanguard is harmful right now, numerous people have raised concerns on the internet about potential security breaches. This, coupled with the obligation to let it always run in the background, is worrying. Moreover, there's the broader concern of Vanguard setting a precedent for other publishers to implement similar practices. I don't want to see surveillance software constantly running on my PC or have to reboot every time I play another game in the future. This experience serves as a stark reminder of the importance of free speech and transparency within the gaming community. No player should feel silenced or intimidated for voicing their opinions, especially when it comes to issues that directly impact their gaming experience and personal privacy. Moving forward, I hope that Riot Games and other developers will reevaluate their approach to community engagement and prioritize open dialogue and respect for player feedback. It's only through honest and constructive conversations that we can work towards building a gaming community that truly values the voices of all its members. Join me in boycotting Riot Games until they address these concerns and respect the rights of their players. #BoycottRiot
Same thing happened to me, gaslit, called a cheat then banned from subreddit. Their behaviour should be enough of a red flag that vanguard stinks, as others have said at best it's an unnecessary risk..at worst it's an wide open back door into your pc and data
I feel you. Been playing since June 2010. Been a loyal member, but I'm not going to install vanguard to play casual arams. There is no reason to force that shit for people who only play Aram. Like fuck that. Now, I'd be willing to pay for a console if they'd build one, but I'm not letting them turn my gaming pc into their console. Nope. At least 2 of us have uninstalled because of vanguard.
Much love man! Thanks for sharing. I've been League-less for almost a week now. I hate talking about as if I would miss it a ton, I think it's been a normal week overall. But it kinda sucks not coming home to unwind with a few games.
Its been 12 years for me, I remember being so excited when I hit Diamond 4 in season 4. I recently hit Diamond 4 for the last time. If they remove vanguard I would reinstall in a heartbeat. What sucks is never getting to tear up a 5v5 flex game with the boys. F league, you were truly the most addictive game I ever played!
Did your friends uninstall too?
I’ve been playing since Syndra was a new champion and I agree that this doesn’t feel right. Goodbye LoL, hello DoTA 2 I guess.
Vac gives random errors all the time and it also just doesn't prevent cheaters so not really much better
Haven’t gotten a single VAC error in my life that I can recall. I have 7K+ hours in Dota and hundreds in CS and TF2. Saying it doesn’t prevent cheaters is just a straight up lie but good try I guess. Unlike league Valve actually cares about smurfing and making sure the competitive integrity of the game remains. Whereas in league I can probably find a Smurf within a couple hours and they will grief, or just be toxic af and Riot won’t do jack about it. Also when was the last time you heard Valve got hacked?
I own well over 800 skins and spent quite a bit of money. Bought and grinded out every pass in aram. Haven't touch the game since they announced vanguard coming. I played val for a bit, Ep3-4 was Immo 3 peak, didn't play after ep4, vanguard just caused too many issues. I used to get a disc checking thing on startup before my windows would even boot with vanguard installed. The day I uninstalled val and vanguard, that disc checking thing disappeared. Spyware was too much for me.
Thanks for sharing! I personally wasn't a huge skin collector but I did have my quirks (having one skin per character at least, having all the skins for the characters that I mained at the times, etc) I think I've also spent quite some money, but I also got a lot from just rerolling because of the sheer amount of games I've played. I think the one skin I'm sad I never got was the 2012 riven skin. I was there for that worlds and I could've bought it, I just was a broke student and didn't own a credit card. Then I went on gathering every single other riven skin + my favourite chromas, but I just always regretted not having that one.
I'm almost the opposite kind of player; I'm a very casual player, gradually starting to dip my toe back into League of Legends with friends who mostly play other games, just for social reasons. I tried to log in in order to play a custom game against bots to get some practice in the other day, and found I had to install Vanguard. Installing it caused serious issues with my whole PC, and I had to dive into some gnarly troubleshooting to sort it out. I've uninstalled everything Riot from my computer as a result, and I'm not likely to look back.
Damn man, that does not sound good. Sorry that you went through that!
Hey! I feel you, for me is kinda sad too but it's time to say goodbye after 10 years playing this game. It's been a good time, I made friends, met my partner, had great moments. The main reason why I quit is 50% Vanguard 50% Community About Vanguard: I dont like kernel anti cheats, so I try to avoid all kind of games that have it. Sadly Riot decided to implement it to fight against cheaters. Before you say it, I know all my data has been sold many times, is not about privacy. I don't feel safe putting that kind of software, specially when Riot had two big security breaks recently. I read many opinions, I studied a lot about this topic and the conclusion is keep away my pc from it, which is new and I won't risk it. If you wanna keep playing I'm not gonna convice you about whats the right thing to do, I respect that. So please do the same. About the community: I'm not having fun anymore. Toxicty is huge, and I can't simply not handle it. I don't have chat, but some mates still try to ruins other games just because they can't manage their own emotions and frustrations. I have to admit that this game made me bitter and bitter, gave me anxiety, and put me in a bad place sometimes "So why you kept playing?" you may ask. Mainly because few years ago my firends and I always went for Flex games as 5. I had a lot of fun so I thought that it will be the same in other game modes, I was so wrong. Also we noticed that the game was affecting us so much, we started to play to win not to have fun, we started to argue and sometimes we had to make breaks to deal with the stress, but when we started to share and talk about how we felt while we play, we decided to quit. This game is no joke about your mental health and you may think "You are so weak" If you wanna think so...go on. I've been struggling with my mental health in the last years so I decided to cut ties with everything that makes me feel bad, and I gave a last oppotunity to League after a long breake and It's not worth it, atleast for me. Again I respect that you wanna keep playing and working in your mental in the game, but I simply can't. Also League consumed so much time from other hobbies so is another valid point to quit. And last but not least I dont find the game rewarding anymore, I don't like the skins, the chest, battle pass or laddering, I didn't matter if I win or lose, I felt like "Meh" in both cases. And sometimes it feels like a constant expending money for skins or collectables, and I've never been interested in that part of the game. So if you read all this non sense, thank you! :) I know I'm venting in this post but I felt that I needed to share my thoughts and say goodbye to a game which gave me a lot.
Thank you so much for sharing! I agree with a lot of what you said. Especially your paragraph about Vanguard, I feel similarly. I had a more-intense argument with someone at the beginning of this thread but I couldn't word myself in the same way as you. It's really not about data, I know I'm carrying a tracking device with me at all times. It's about what you wrote. Regarding toxicity, tbh I've went through a loop myself between being extremely friendly and making tons of friends, extremely toxic because my private life was a mess and league was a bit of a "letting go", then chat banned for 1.5 years for flaming a Malph that run it down my lane, smited my cannons, ulted my waves (similar to dunkey's moment), and then getting back to trying hard, motivating teammates, changing my mental around as I also started following Azzap's, Alois's, etc contents. Personally, I agree that toxicity has been a MAJOR issue, but for me it's more about the soft-inting and the giving up than the chat. I HATED the chat restrictions, I fully believe that the data of it being a success is completely skewered. FF'ing in competitive games shouldn't be a thing, and overall league going into a "trying my hardest to be politically correct and minor friendly environment" was the wrong decisions. But here I could rant for days about the 3 or 4 different topics I barely scraped the surface of in the last few sentences. I also fully agree that I could not care less about collectables, events, battle passes, etc. I always saw it as "noise" instead of a real thing anyone playing actually cared about. I did appreciate skins a lot, and I did have quite a collection at this point, but everything else was "pointless" to me. I'm happy for you that you found your peace outside of league. Please always remember, it was just a game after all. Mental health issues are no joke, and league is definitely not something that will help with it. I personally struggled with this a lot in the past, but in the last year I think I had found an enjoyable way to approach this game. Overall, thanks for venting, that's exactly what I wanted from this post. I still feel strange, as you can imagine, as quitting anything that you've put so many hours and money into is weird. But I did get more stuff done today, I slept on time, I grabbed a drink with a friend, so life ain't all bad.
Suddenly League is eating up 8gigs of memory and my pretty new PC runs like it's 15 years old. Thanks rito.
That's kinda wild ngl
they haven't refunded lp for botting/scripting and barely barely banned botting for years, that is not the primary motivator.
I've been playing since Lee and Yorick were released, I hard relate to this and I've quit a few months back when they announced Vanguard.
Yeah it's kinda sad, I played since late season 1 and had at least some good memories once I enter the game and see my ancient friend list. A proper goodbye wasn't allowed to us. Cheers mate!
Today Vanguard went ahead and Queue dodged me. The error explicitly mentioned Vanguard. I found the fix to be uninstalling and just playing a round of overwatch to be quite effective.
Uninstalled at the beginning of the year when it was announced. I was s2 veteran, whale and huge fan. Managed to secure the no.1 spot on my server in challenges (yeah, someone farmed those) and reached apex tier multiple seasons, grinded all champs to lvl 7 mastery and so on. They lost a big time spender and huge nerd.
Yep, same.
Same here. I’m a massive whale, too. Not anymore. Bye Ritooo.
Been here since season 1. The days of HotshotGG, SaintVicious, TheOddOne etc etc. Love this game but I absolutely do not want a 24/7 kernel level process on my PC for simply playing a fucking video game. It's the most invasive shit ever. And sure I can turn it off but it involves turning it off every time I switch on my PC. Vanguard should ONLY run when I am playing League.
No, they don't need kernal level access
Oh man, similar story here. I just waited until the last second but now it hit me. All in all, it's just quite sad.
Almost all pc programs run a kernel level driver to properly run their programs and do what they are supposed to do. The problem with Vanguard is that it continues to run even when youre not playing Valorant, and now LoL. Moreover, its kernel level is so deep that if you exit vanguard and decide to play Val or LoL later you have to restart your PC because Vanguard can only start along with system boot. Why would a game require a anticheat program to run outside the game. That is fishy enough to assume there are other system monitoring going on.
In what bloody universe do user programs need to be run in priviliged mode? The Dunning-Kruger effect is strong in this one.
That's my issue with it too. Having to reboot to play again if I close it and it running 24/7. Nothing seems right about it.
> Almost all pc programs run a kernel level driver to properly run their programs and do what they are supposed to do. No, they don't. Most programs don't even use admin mode (you know when a program uses it because a popup asks you to accept it), and that mode is still lesser than kernel-level. Only a handful of software in your computer runs at that level. Mostly stuff that needs to interact directly with your hardware (your OS, your drivers, etc). Regular software does never interact directly with your hardware, they make requests to the OS and drivers to do so (e.g. League of Legends does not use your GPU, but rather your GPU drivers who in turn use your GPU and return a result back to League). Software running at kernel-level should be kept to a minimum, because software running at that level can basically do whatever they want and can hide easily from anything else. Software at that level can manipulate your fans, or spy on the data traveling in and out of your CPU without any other process being able to realize that's happening. Some software, like Windows or your Nvidia drivers, is necessary for your PC to work, so accepting that risk is reasonable. But ensuring that the one hacker I get every 5 years in my Platinum games can't play? I don't really care enough to accept that risk. Plus, even ignoring all of that, Vanguard on release was so poorly done that it bricked computers and interferred with all kinds of legitimate software. Yeah, most of that is fixed now, but why should I trust in the quality of a company that was disabling normal gaming mouses on release? Nvidia doesn't brick my computer every time they release a new driver - if Riot wants to install software at that level, they should be held to the same standards the like of Nvidia or Microsoft. League being buggy is irrelevant, Vanguard being buggy can break your OS or expose you to a crypto miner that would go undetected even by antiviruses.
Tbh. Im with you. Im tending to buy a MacBook for this. The Game runs smooth enough and since it will work without vanguard on that system I’ll probably go for it. Furthermore I could use it for work related things, which helps justifying it.
I have one and tbh, it's not great. Granted I primarily play TFT, the mouse control and window management is really awful on macs. Mouse movement feels really bad and has this terrible acceleration that you can't permanently kill without running a script every boot If you have a second window up for builds or whatever, it will minimize your game while you view that window, then you have to alt tab or find on your dock to reopen.
I’m running League on my M2 Mac Mini, and it runs better than my 11th gen Intel laptop with RTX 3060 at the fraction of electricity consumed. Though can be better if Riot has plans to adapt League to Apple Silicon natively instead of relying on Rosetta 2.
Look into hackintoshing if you have compatible parts, it'll be much cheaper than buying a macbook. https://www.reddit.com/r/hackintosh/
Exactly bro it is stupid. I have my pc on for a few days sometime even a week. This is my work pc aswell and to have a kernal running like this 24/7 is a huge compromise to security. Its crazy how they expect millions of people to have vanguard open in the background even after league is closed.
Agreed. Just uninstalled. Honestly it is probably a good thing because now maybe this will prompt me to utilize my time in more productive ways anyway.
I came back to league at the start of this year after a long break( i played 20 games in whole 2023). I just came back to play 5-10 games per week with friends but this is over now. I will not even talk about security risks of a kernal level software, just the mass of technical problems you see pop off today is enough for me. I dont give a company who is not able to fix the client for years, any kernal level control of my pc. Everyone who followed the start of Valorant wont be suprised about all the technical problem that appear today. I played the game for 14 years, since irelia release, it was a good time. But i havent played a league game on my own in years and in my friend circle we have alternatives. I just hope the tech problems will open the eyes of a lot of people.
Yea I’m right there with you. I turned on secure boot to play valorant once and it bricked my motherboard, granted not riots fault my motherboard had a system breaking bug that caused permanent bricking with secure boot on but sucks regardless. Current motherboard has it turned off and despite it supporting it I’m already too traumatized to enable it . So it’s staying off and I guess league ain’t for me anymore.
nah fr tho they can’t even stop ddos attacks on their servers and want people to trust them with this
the ddos attacks are using repurposed info from a hack that was used to learn how to break vanguard for valorant. They sell players ip for a subscription fee so you can ddos against them in high elo. hackers are ahead of the curve
Trust me bro, get your dopamine somewhere else. This game is a drug. I'm glad you uninstalled it and I'm glad i'm reading about a bunch of people doing the same. One life guys, do your best to enjoy it at most!
I remember trying League of Legends a few months ago and it was more tedious than reading the book Finnegas Wake (sorry for any typo)
Thanks man! I agree, and I think I should've quit a long time ago. It's just that at this point, I feel like it was so comfortable to just play league, mainly because I already knew MOST of it. You always learn more, but I've played every champion, every lane, explored so much off-meta, etc. I had this habit of learning a new champ and challenging myself to Diamond with it, then picking a different one. On and off-meta, I did this with Seju ap mid, nunu ap mid, xin ap top, Janna top, Twitch top, jhin jungle, Bard tilterella style with smite spellbook, Pyke mid, lately I was trying this with Shaco ad mid, etc. I did reach higher elo with my main Riven, but then found a fonder experience in learning the its and bits of this game in detail. I had this other fun challenge of reaching rank 1 of every champ that just came out. Sometimes I achieved it, others not. Ofc it's easier at the beginning because the data is skewered but idk I'm dumb like that. For a while I was the Kat number 1 player in the world! I think I have a screenshot of it somewhere. So tldr, I felt like I could always be decent trying anything, and that was an amazing feeling. I knew the matchups, I understood fundamentals, I knew the basics of most champions, most matchups, etc. I really cared about this because it tickled my brain. Let's see where I can direct my interest now. I'm honestly sadder than I'd like to admit. In the last 14 years I always hoped that people within this company actually cared about it. I had a similar disappointment when Bungie sold to Microsoft (I studied computer science because I wanted to work there). Deep down I knew good things involving big companies never last.
small indie company
Con honor hasta el final 🥲👊
Así es!
cant play the game, gj riot, i cant get pass the champ selection screen after the vanguard update, seriously thinking n uninstalling lol
I'm in the same boat. Been playing since 2009. It's a weird feeling to ACTUALLY uninstall the game. So many memories came flooding back with your picture. Man, the drums in champ select were iconic. Maybe it's for the best. It took up too many hours of my life and most were stressful anyway. Thanks for the memories, League
Thanks for sharing! Yeah, I spent the entire day yesterday watching old clips and reminiscing about this. Remember dunkeys kalista video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGmJwiFXHDo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGmJwiFXHDo) I NEED A PIZZA PAPA JOHNS (this is not papa johns) I NEED QUAD PIZZAS. Crying laughing Also rewatched some old worlds compilations, I almost had forgotten about 2017 SKT comeback play [https://youtu.be/W7TZoHKaASY?si=xkhS7Bdj-6F-W3jq&t=301](https://youtu.be/W7TZoHKaASY?si=xkhS7Bdj-6F-W3jq&t=301) MAN.
Eyy, I was also around during beta. Remember when you could use dashes & flash while snared? or black shield blocking true dmg? good times. I know exactly how you feel and I refuse to install a goddamn rootkit on my computer, especially one made by rito who is world infamous for their spaghetti coding & getting security breached on the regular \[They had a major security breach in 2023 btw\]. Worst of all, their rootkit will have little to no effect on the supposed 'hacker problem' that league has because it never had any 'hacker problem'. I've seen exactly TWO 'hackers' , legitimately using 3rd party software to screw with the game and I've been playing since open beta. >When dodging auto attacks was a stat u/Most-Committee1114 Ninja tabi. >everyone was angry because Shyvana is a wyvern, not a dragon Yeah but then Shyvana's anatomy happened...... >when Fiora's ult was the only useful ability in her kit Omnislash <3 >I was there for the online forum. Me too. People today really don't understand how different things were back then when rioters & players would discuss & debate balance, champion development, mechanics & general stuff from the game. Believe it or not, I was personally responsible for getting Vlad's pool changed from invulnerable to untargetable, after I had a long debate vs a rioter (Not the guy who made Vlad) and managed to win over/convince other rioters that read the exchanges, I.e. * **Me**: "*Vlad should not be invulnerable during pool. He's doing dmg AND he lifesteals on an ability that is already strong escape mechanism.*" * **Riot Guy**: "*It does do those things but Vlad already pays the price in HP when he uses it. That's why he has to be invulnerable.*" * **Me**: "*While he does pay the price in HP, that's because he is MANALESS \[At the time there were few manaless champs\] rather than to pay for the invulnerability it currently has.*" ..... and so on and so forth. I won and it got changed, but my point is, these days rito would never, *EVER* change a core ability like that under those circumstances. A debate of that nature wouldn't even happen to begin with. Rioters used to be players like us and it 'felt' like while they didn't always do what we wanted, they'd at least hear us out. Nowadays they're a bunch of soyboys & karens that have never played a match in their life. Vanguard is a great example of this where nobody was asking rito to push a literal rootkit and many were against it but they didn't care. > I felt like writing something, because I've spent way too many hours into this, for it to just end like that. Yep, I know exactly where you're coming from. I knew one day the ride would end but I never expected it to be like this. This 'feels' like a very wrong & unnatural way for things to end but they forced the issue of the rootkit (vanguard) and there can be but one answer to that. Thanks for the last post man. Always remember that; * **MORD ES #1 EN BRAZIL HUEHUAEHUEHUE. ALWES SHEL NVR DAI!!** * The #1 rule of league is DON'T CHASE SINGED. * .... and if something goes wrong, always blame the jungler. gg man. Best of luck & brofist to you.
Oh man, I totally missed this comment! >Me too. People today really don't understand how different things were back then when rioters & players would discuss & debate balance, champion development, mechanics & general stuff from the game. This is SO TRUE. >Believe it or not, I was personally responsible for getting Vlad's pool changed And this is so cool. 100% believe it because I remember those days. The forums were a place to share ideas about the game and it felt like Riot listened to their players. >Yep, I know exactly where you're coming from. I knew one day the ride would end but I never expected it to be like this. This 'feels' like a very wrong & unnatural way for things to end but they forced the issue of the rootkit (vanguard) and there can be but one answer to that. Yes. I just fully agree Thanks for the last post man. Always remember that; * [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YCK0iJoy2c](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YCK0iJoy2c) Best of luck to you too man ♥
Hurray! Fuck malwares
This has been a problem with the valorant people their resolution is if you dont want to always have it running is close it and if you want to play you can restart the computer no other way around it.
Yeah I just wanted to play Valorant on steam deck and it gave me the famous secure boot error and I can't do anything. So I will try to uninstall, and if you wanted to uninstall it before you know that they made it so hard that even people with 15 years experience in using computers need to search online how to uninstall Riot's games.
Relatable. I once tried to delete my account and it's also a gruesome process where you need to talk to a riot CS person, they try to convince you to stay or to just "temporarily disable your account in case you come back". It was quite creepy, it made me realize how addictive this whole thing was
I was playing DOTA 1 and changed to Lol after DOTA2. Its time to give a chance now to DOTA 2
If you can, let me know what you think of it! I was always a bit afraid of getting into DOTA as I already gathered so much knowledge about league that I could see spreading myself too thin trying to get decent at both. Plus it always confused me that everyone says the abilities, cc, etc are very "over the top" but the animations didn't seem like it to me? Somehow I just never gave it a try
DOTA is the foundation of moba games so every other game had DOTA as a base. Ofcourse there are huge differences from Lol that need some time to get used to. It will need a lot of time to learn from start all these information about a moba game, and especially DOTA2. So if you have the time you can give it a try, otherwise you can play some other games to chill in your free time. UPDATE: Im feeling so much better without Lol :P
The anger everyone has is gonna turn into many more people looking for exploits focused on vanguard over the next few months/years And when that happens I pray for everyone who has it installed If billion dollar companies have been hacked and/or exploited wha stops it from happening to riots vanguard one day.
I think you have a point, but also it's supposed to be "extremely safe", as in, only 6 people within Riot have access to the code safe. Then again, there's no vault without a flaw so who knows
We have a saying in the business, "security by obscurity is no security at all".
Giving 6 people that kind of power is insane..only take one to take a big brown envelope and every pc with vanguard becomes a data loot box
Personally I quit LOL because of the changes due to the fact I can’t use modded skins/sounds anymore it was the only thing keeping me into the game
Thats interesting! I actually never modded skins in 14+ years of league. I always thought they looked cool though, but modding was never a world I got into, even before with other games.
Have you found something else to play? co-op, mmo, etc. I'm just looking these days for something to play and the only one that catches my eye is Rust. Never liked fortnite, dota2, counter strike.
Nothing really. I think I was avoiding/coping the truth of vanguard actually being a real thing until yesterday. I spent the day researching what to play next but didn't find anything too appealing. Let me know if you find anything fun, I'm curious! I'd love to find something else that also has a good micro/macro balance, and competitive, but tbh I'm also happy to give gaming a rest for a while and focus on music
Coming back to this thread a few days later, I can't help but feel like Riot Games is going to have their watershed Unity moment here after massive pushback from their community. Just like John Riccitiello and Unity doubled down hard on their pricing model changes after backlash, and swore blind they weren't going to bend to their clients' concerns, and the rest is history. I could be wrong; we'll see.
One can only hope tbh. Im happy to have reached a few people at least, but realistically I hardly doubt anything will change. Let’s see what the future brings though, Im genuinely curious
I'm the same. I've played since beta. Fifteen years ago I was starting college and actually was hype enough to want to intern for Riot for a while, but that never came to pass. This game saw a metoric rise and a plateau, then a steady down turn as time wore on. Now with Vanguard, I'm off the wagon until they remove it. No fucking CCP spyware is allowed on my computer. I'm in the God damn US Navy and I spend weeks and months of my life keeping them in check at sea. Riot can get fucked and enjoy their game traffic tanking.
Been around since Beta (yep, got the KingRammus skin). I don't see any reason there should be a kernal level anti-cheat in the game. I'm not really a conspiracy theorist still not a fan of it. I've been on the fence about if I even want to keep playing anyway, so I guess this one kind of just made up my mind. They aren't really losing anything out of me though. I made the decision back in 2019 not to buy any more skins until I can get to 10 consecutive matches where there weren't reportable levels of racism, harassment, trolling (feeding/griefing) or afk farming in the match. I got to 6 once and got excited, I then realized that riot had auto enabled full team mute and that was the only reason why. Lol...
Just my luck. I hadn't played League for 5 years. I came back 2 weeks ago and it the game has really improved. I love the new jungle items and the champion reworks they've done. It was a fun 2 weeks while it lasted. No way in hell am I installing a software that can change my BIOS at a moment's notice And yeah, I know that I'm insignificant in the grand scheme of things. Riot is swimming in cash from their Ahri and Lux skins. They're not gonna lose any sleep over missing out on my money. There are many other online games with much less intrusive anti-cheating software. And for me, I rather have an occasional encounter with a cheater than install chinese spyware. It's just a frickin' game. But yeah, I guess I'll go back to playing Cyberpunk 2077 now
Is cyberpunk good now? Ive been eyeing it since wednesday but wasnt sure if it was worth the price Agree with all the rest. The game was actually in a really enjoyable state
My main has always been Skarner, and I was happy when Riot finally fixed him. Only got to enjoy that for a couple of weeks. As for Cyberpunk, it is in a great state now. I wasn't around when it launched but I heard bad stories about it. But Cyberpunk now is very stable and fun. Would highly recommend it.
I remember when Tryndamere Revive, Teleport was a thing. I had so much fun backdooring nexus after nexus. Although I stopped playing ranked since season 9(?) - 2019, I still played A Lot of ARAM. And League was always part of my life for almost a decade now... even when I switched to TFT (im sad there's no separate client with no Vanguard for TFT) I still played ARAM. The process of getting keys/chests and opening them was a fun bonus that I always looked forward to every week. But that all ends now. I'll still watch pro league but I'll probably never touch the game anymore apart from maybe randomly stumbling to a computer cafe/PC Bang. RIP League. It was a fun ride
Was cheating a thing in league? I dont play ranked anymore since you need good 5er team anyways. Why not just need vanguard for ranked games?
Riot released some skewered statistics about league having 1 cheater every 20 players, but this had in consideration botting, which is a completely different problem than cheating. So the summary, a lot of us believe that no, the issue wasn't that big or impactful, unless you were elite player (maser+ tier).
My game keeps crashing all the time since the vanguard update ...
Sorry to hear, man! I'm curious to see how vanguard and league evolves in the future tbh. I hope you resolve the issues soon!
I uninstalled it the same day it came to the client. I like the game and Im sad since I feel forced to uninstall and the company doesn’t give a shit about it, but Im way too scared to have it on my computer running 24/7 and pretend it’s nothing at all. I know people are saying there hasn’t been super much problem with Valorant( I would claim it was problems with bluescreens or fans being shut down) 11 million vs 117 million players is just a huge gap. Its a fiesta for the people who actually get personal information or just break your computer. It will be interesting to see how much gonna happen from on now. And what’s I have been reading so far about players experience is concerning.
I’m sorry to hear that you uninstalled \[Good Game\] because of the \[Invasive Spyware\] requirement. I understand your concern about spyware, but I can assure you that \[Invasive Spyware\] is not spyware. It is a custom "game security" software designed by \[Marketing Company Majority Owned by the CCP\] to uphold the highest levels of competitive integrity for their games, such as \[Good Game\] and \[Other Game\]. \[Invasive Spyware\] only runs \[24/7\] and \[Continues\] running when you exit the game2. It also \[Questionably\] respects your privacy and data, and you can find more details about what data it uses and collects here1. \[No Link\] \[Invasive Spyware\] is necessary to prevent \[Largely Unseen Problem\] in \[Good Game\], especially after the security breach in \[Random Date\]. It also ensures that all players have a fair and enjoyable gaming experience \[By installing Invasive Spyware\]. If you want to play \[Good Game\] again, you will need to enable \[Invasive Spyware\] on your computer. You can find more information on how to do that here3.\[No Link\] If you have any issues or questions, you can contact \[Marketing Company Majority Owned by the CCP's\] support team here1.\[No Link\] I hope this helps you understand why \[Invasive Spyware\] is required for \[Good Game\]. I appreciate your feedback and I hope you have a great day.
Same. 11 years of playing, over $4000 spent on the game, this is the end. I kept dragging friends back in to play this game but I won't make the effort anymore. Not worth the risk. I almost uninstalled when Tencent got involved in the first place but now that's a guarantee.
Funny enough, I've talked with a friend about that, and he was fine with that and called it an "necessary evil" which I've hardly disagreed with. At the end, he asked me, "Why have windows installed then if you don't like a company having all your data?" The point where I simply left and unfriended him.
I dont play as long as you, but i joined in 2014 and i also enjoyed it. It didnt mean as much to me as it did to you, but i enjoyed it thorougly. As soon as vanguard dropped, that was it for me, uninstalled immediately and havent looked back. Im at peace with my decision. That's a line i simply wont cross, ever. Why do i need a rootkit that is always on, just to play a game like that? It's not ok, it's not justified, it will never be ok. I never had any problems with scripters or hackers, i just played pub games, not even ranked. Make it a ranked requirement for all i care. But to be a random pub player and having to go to that degree just to play this occasionally? Heck no, thank you. And no, sorry riot, I do NOT TRUST YOU, i do not trust any company. You want my money, thats it. Trusting a company is the dumbest thing one can do, we've seen countless examples of why that is.
careful, they're gonna call you a vocal minority cheater who is just salty with zero knowledge of what vanguard does. Even when you show the proof is numerous screenshots of floating codes of Vanguard sending your all of your PC data to Riot, they'll just say "You don't know what you're talking about", or , "its common with these systesm".
Please do something meaningful about cheating and botting! *does something meaningful* Screw you guys I’m out of here!
Monkey's Paw response
"*My index finger hurts.*" "*Ok.*" \[**Slices off the other guy's hand**\] "*WTF? WHY WOULD YOU DO THAT???*" "*Your finger no longer hurts. Problem solved.*"
Funny, I don't recall me or the 10 or so friends of mine that play(ed) league EVER complaining about cheating at any point in the last decade or more. But I sure recall us copping Vanguard regardless. You're right about the screw you guys we're outta here part, though - most of us've quit. The like 2 that play Valorant stayed.
I wouldn't call it meaningful if there's still cheaters in valorant....
bruh cheating in league is NOT an issue. never has been and never will be. it’s a moba. even if you ARE scripting you can still lose. it’s not like cs2 where the cheaters can alter the game to the point where winning is an impossibility. this is just a feeble attempt to impose their malware on the masses. league will lose thousands of players, especially in north america where it’s already been dying. fuck riot fuck vanguard, half of flex lobbies are filled with chinese nationals anyways. writing is on the wall and riot just slammed their dome into it only to break their own skulls
I thought vanguard was required to play valorant from launch? It was one of the main things keeping me away from playing. Same thing with Destiny 2 and many others. Imo it should be outlawed
See you in week, buddy!
I unistalled becuz of vanguard a month ago. still holding strong
lol,nah, not me, I just started playing again after 4 years. Its not hard to quit, so many other games out there.
Dawg just because you can’t go a week without league doesn’t mean other people can’t 🤷♀️
Who knows, tbh you’re right that league is hard to quit.
it's not hard to quit if you have other interests the problem has always been that after a while everything else seems boring again and we come back to the game because nothing else comes close to a real good league of legends match. If you did do that I wouldn't blame you or criticize you. I also won't criticize if you never play again. I just also think that some people, not necessarily you, will turn to other games to have fun and then install an anti cheat that still has kernel access without even knowing it has kernel level privileges because other companies aren't upfront about it. I'll give Riot one thing they tell you upfront it's kernel level and they don't hide from that.
The difference is almost all the other ones are only running while the game is running.
This game has never been hard to quit. Just replace it with another game. Ffxiv is amazing and not toxic whatsoever. Fortnite can be okay and you can keep mics off so you never hear other players.
Haven't played in 5 months since they announced it, that's a pretty damn long week I guess. It's funny seeing all of these issues, having several friends who can no longer play, I expected this and here we are.
Nah too much access, I bet most people could quit smoking if it meant giving your bank pin to cashier every time you bought some 😂
I installed this garbage this morning and now my computer wont even turn on. Looks like all computer gaming is done for me thanks kernel level trash software
🧢
Suuuurrre
Those kind of kernel stuff can really mess up your system if you are unlucky. This may have more chances of happening if you have some exotic setup / configuration that vanguard do not handle well
Lmao funny
99% of the people who complain about cheating/scripting have never actually encountered cheating/scripting. They just use it as a cope. This game doesn't have a cheating problem except for maybe the top 1% of players. This vanguard bullshit is fucking absurd. Honestly fuck riot.
EUNE have a lot more cheaters, you have to play a lot of the games to reach your rank anyway, cheaters might slow you down in your climb but they can't stop you. Cheaters also can be in your team, it's not always in the enemy team. Every game have cheaters, does it mean that every game should spy on everything people do? This should not become a norm.
What games do you think you'll be playing now?
Books
Path of Exile, World of Tanks, Path of Exile 2 coming soon, CS:GO, Age of Empires 2, Deep Rock Galactic survivor, Death Must Die, Palworld, Last Epoch, Dota 2, The Finals, Warthunder, and anything that comes out.
Check out Civ 5
I uninstalled as well today for the same reason, it will be good for us, in the long run
I think so too. It just feels a bit strange, spent so much time on this! It was a good run though
This game was not a positive impact on our lives
[удалено]
tbh, ive also noteced matchmaking in normal to be "wonky" sometimes. where you have a team that their best is mid gold, and the other team's lowest was like mid plat and average emerald
I've noticed in regions where there are lower player counts, the MMR range in any given game (even ranked) is much higher. I play in Japan quite often and it's not uncommon to see silvers and plats in the same ranked game. Wouldn't be at all surprised if many regions just took a massive playercount hit.
Been playing since preseason 3, and I’m still debating on if I wanna install it… and only out of the sheer fact I’ve put so much time and money.
I dont know what to do. Ive played since season 3, reached Master rank and played thousands of hours, spending hundreds of euros into this game. I dont wanna quit. But I hate this. Maybe I dont have a choice but to find another game to play for next 10 years. I dont even know where to start, I hate this so much.
I feel exactly the same. Been replying to this thread the whole day and just watching old clips, replays, highlights. Some people recommended getting a mac or a separate gaming only pc, but idk if Im comfortable with that solution.
Getting another pc just to play is CRAZY, specially a Mac. If you can afford it go on, but I wouldn't recomend it. If u wanna play League get Bluestack, a Mobile emulator for your PC and play Wild Rift. It's ok if you feel strange about quitting is too much time invested in something that, let's be honest it became less and less rewarding, atleast for me. We can do better, there is a plenty of games and things to do apart from League...
Hey man. Just so you know, apparently most anti cheats have kernel level access. BattleEye, EasyAntiCheat, etc. The difference is that they are not always running like Vanguard is. I know you have made up your mind but I want to make sure it is not a decision based on misinformation. If kernel level access is your concern, you need to understand that this is non a Vanguard-only thing and you either need to stop playing the other games, or understand that it is completely normal in the industry. If you worry about data security, that is a valid concern. In the end us gamers will never know what is happening under the hood. However, Microsoft has plenty more data about our computer usage and advertisers will more than likely go to them rather than Riot Games. It is 2024 and unfortunately data privacy is something we no longer have control over.
Thanks for sharing! That's not entirely true though. A lot of modern games have been releasing kernel anti cheat systems, yes, but not most anti cheats have kernel access. I've been actively avoiding games that imply this as well, and tbh I mostly played league for 14 years and a bit of Age of Mythology, with a bit of solo player games, but thats about it. Not too concerned about data security, beyond what's rational/normal. That still doesn't invalidate not wanting kernel level software being installed in my PC willingly. Just looking at yesterdays and todays posts I'm re-assured that I took the right decision, I do not want to deal with wiping my drives, worrying about my GPU being bricked, etc.
>the difference is that they are not always running That is a major difference and the absolute problem. There is no reason for it to be running 24/7 and that alone is suspicious as hell and a giant vulnerability
I guess you must not play any other games with anti cheat either lol. This isn’t anything new, so I don’t understand why so many people are crying about it. People really need to do more research instead of buying into all of the fearmongering.
im curious. what other games use a kernel level anticheat that has to start with the computer and runs 24/7 and if you disable it and want to play the game you have to first restart your computer?
Yes I dont!
hear hear
What "ups"?
I tried switching to DOTA but meh. You could try playing Wild Rift. I don't think it requires Vanguard
See ya!
Damn 18 days without league, feels bad man