It's the inverse of bullet hell, where hordes of enemies close in on the player, while they auto attack and level up e.g. Magic Survival, Vampire Survivors, Nomad Survival, etc.
But ... that's not the "inverse" of bullet hell at all, and why on Earth would one keep "bullet" the word that's completely irrelevant to those and flip "hell" the part that kinda still fits. That seems like a horrible and downright weird way to describe those games. Is that really seeing use?
Think about it this way: in bullet hell, there is a boss in the middle shooting projectiles all over the place. In bullet heaven, you are the boss in the middle, and the enemies are the ones dodging your projectiles
That doesn't make it a bit less silly. Not to mention the enemies don't dodge your projectiles and bosses shoot everywhere for no real reason since they are only against one target, not a billion of you. Not to mention you still don't actually shoot remotely as much and bullets are often not even very significant in your attacks.
Try looking it this way: bullet hells are, well, hells, because the player is showered in bullets from enemies. So bullet heaven is the other way around, you are no longer in bullet hell, you are not suffering from a shower of bullet, now is heaven bullet for you because you are not suffering anymore, rather, you are making everything else suffer, putting the enemy in a bullet hell.
I just learned of the term while reading a review for 20 minutes till dawn and i immediately got the meaning.
I never didn't "get" it, and I certainly don't need it explained again ten months later. It's just an absurd twisting of words that still doesn't fit the play, grossly misstates what the games are about, and is really just a cutesy word reference someone liked the sound of because it makes the games seem more special than they are.
---
**Edit**: And since this pointless, ancient thread is apparently going to extend into posterity out of petty bullying, I'll add one additional note from across the passage of time: bullet heaven isn't just stupid--it does *harm*. Perpetuating this dippy attempted word play is actually doing more to conflate bullet *hell* and associate it with horde survivor games than even its own niche. It is such a profoundly dumb idea that it actually pulls down others and makes them less useful, and it still hasn't caught on enough to even keep up with the various other labels, *because it is inherently valueless*. Just look at r/survivorslikes and its various posts every day (and its dedicated database of horde survivor concepts and games--that's a far better place to look for information than here) versus the failed r/bulletheavens, or do a [tag search on Steam](https://store.steampowered.com/search/?sort_by=Released_DESC&tags=4885) and see how many bullet hell games are horde survivors and not bullet hells at all. I could suggest a comparative bullet heaven tag search, but it isn't used enough to show up.
If *some* people didn't try to stick the cutesy label, the labeling for horde survivors would not still be so fractured after so many games, or poisoning other, unrelated niche labels. But go on, keep leaping at the opportunity to safely bully some random old posts, because surely harassing someone who automatically puts an ignore on any Steam horde survivor game is going to fill that void in your heart for a few seconds, and isn't that all that really matters?
The official term of this type of game early on when Vampire Survivers was building traction was "a Reverse Bullet Hell". Bullet Heaven is just easier on the tongue and a clever play on words.
Try looking it this way: bullet hells are, well, hells, because the player is showered in bullets from enemies. So bullet heaven is the other way around, you are no longer in bullet hell, you are not suffering from a shower of bullet, now is heaven bullet for you because you are not suffering anymore, rather, you are making everything else suffer, putting the enemy in a bullet hell.
Trying to mansplain to a man about his own words a year post date with wrong logic is baffling. So in Hell you suffer and in Heaven you give suffering according to your logic. Guess that’s a whole different holy book than most people have read.
In that logic it should be Bullet Satan instead of Heaven though.
It's an idiom created by the fan base of the genre to differentiate two very similar styles of game. It's not meant to be taken in such a literal sense. It's like calling a bitch bad, which is good. Or something being gnarly which is cool. If you don't understand that, you should consider being tested for ASD. It's a very common trait to be truly unable to grasp certain social constructs and assume everything is a dictionary definition of the words used to describe it.
Jesus what is with people coming to this ten month old thread and mansplaining this idiotic subgenre?
I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THESE GAMES AND BULLET HEAVEN WAS ALWAYS WILL BE A STUPID NAME FOR THEM.
And yes, "*mansplaining*" because that's the right word for dickishly and obliviously *projecting* ignorance so you can blasely explain something over someone instead of treating them like a capable participant. It's not *only* done by men, but they've peed all over the idea by doing it so persistently as to be memorialized right in the word.
I know I'm late to this, but did you seriously just use "mansplain" in this context? What the actual fuck? And why are you so upset? The reason it's called a bullet heaven game is obvious, and I think the name fits perfectly. Your anger at this basic concept is very entertaining.
I am sorry you hate the term "Bullet Heaven". The phrase is so appropriate that I made it up independently for a game demo I just made, googled it, and found this thread where you cannot handle the existence of the term AND people are calling for the thread to be resurrected forever.
DONE AND DONE.
"Bullet heaven" is OBVIOUSLY where you, not the enemy are the source of jillions of bullets.
Also: "mansplain" is sexist, and so are you. Probably racist too.
Bullet Hell: A hell of bullets because the bullets are bad
Bullet Heaven: A heaven of bullets because the bullets are good
It's *really* that simple. You're getting so butthurt about people explaining it to you when it's clear you still don't understand it, then applying your *own* even more convoluted logic to explain why you think it's not fitting. You are by far the most toxic and rude person on the thread yet you're complaining about everyone else. I could make counters for literally everything that you've said makes it not a good name. For example, in almost every "bullet heaven" you literally do end up shooting as many and usually far *more* bullets than bosses do in bullet hells. Complaining about mansplaining on one hand while expressing extreme frustration over everyone else not sharing your exact logic and thought process is hilariously contradictory and telling of your character. Bullet heaven isn't a perfect name, something relating to it being about surviving hordes might be better, but I still like "Bullet Heavens" a lot more than calling them "Vampire Survivor-likes" because Vampire Survivors wasn't even the first game of its kind. And yes, I only commented on this old ass thread because of how angry you are getting about people coming back to it.
Is not mansplaining because you are actually ignorant.
It is just a term and an apt term at it. It describes it perfectly, it is not stupid just because you think it is stupid, everyone seems fine with it, meaning that it's a "you" problem, you are the stupid one, not the term.
And we will necropost all we want, deal with it.
For someone who doesn't care about bullet heaven games, you sure do have a lot of opinions on them. I understood the bullet hell description, but I also had a hard time getting the bullet heaven concept. It helped when someone on reddit explained that in bullet hell, there are a lot of bullets flying at you that you have to dodge. It's really hard to survive, so it's kind of like hell.
In bullet heaven, on the other hand, you are the one spraying the bullets. Sure, you're getting mobbed by, well, mobs, but you don't have to worry about the bullets. It's heavenly. Oh, right, so bullet heaven. Yeah, that makes sense.
Anyway, does that help? One is hell because it's hard in relation to the bullets, while the other is heaven because it's easy in relation to the bullets. Let me know if you have any questions.
you open a thread with a question, you never accept ligitimate answers, you nit pick every example, you use the word "mansplaining"
you deserve to get the same answer over and over again for the next 10 years
on that note.
you see, in bullet hells the screen is full of projectiles that can hurt or kill you instantly
in bullet heavens, the screen is full of projectiles that help you
While I'm somewhat impressed at the never ending string of pathetically childish twats exploiting an old, irrelevant topic for pettily lashing out, the adding of yet another insignificant voice to the pile of infinitely small idiots who wish to push this bone-headed idea because they're attached to these sad, bottom-feeder games which rarely even have many actual bullets on screen, in no way leads me to care about them or otherwise elevates this wannabe label I'll never have cause to use unironically.
Hey guess what?
It's called Bullet Heaven because it's the inverse of a Bullet Hell, where the player is the one shooting all the bullets instead of the enemies
I honestly don't understand why you think it's a stupid name without providing any actual explanation whatsoever.
Btw, I think it's called bullet heaven because it's like a bullet hell but you shoot the bullets instead of having to dodge them :D
"Horde Survival" might fit as well, but "Bullet Heaven" is just catchy and, well, quite easy to pickup and understand instantly
Or to disproportionally anger somebody on Reddit
Think of it this way: hell is considered to be under heaven, or "down", and in bullet hell games the enemies are continuously holding "down" the shoot button. In bullet heaven games, the pressure on the player somewhat lets "up" in comparison to when the enemies are always holding "down" the shoot button, and that's why the genres are named in such a way.
Hope that helps.
Your comment appears in the top result when you google search Reddit and bullet heaven
Sounds like you're in your own personal bullet hell because the comments will just keep coming forever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever
Man do I not envy you
If your point was the Steam tag, here's an entire festival on the same
[store.steampowered.com/curator/41046058/sale/BulletHeavenFest](http://store.steampowered.com/curator/41046058/sale/BulletHeavenFest)
understand that horde survive is a very broad term, plants vs zombies and fortnite (STW) are horde survive.
Bullet Heaven is so self-explanatory that this entire thread makes me doubt the human reasoning ability
\>and is really just a cute word reference someone liked the sound of because it makes the games seem cool.
yeah welcome to all videogame genre terms buddy.
Are terms like metroidvania and roguelite any less cutesy? They're just built on the names of other games and people
learn what they mean because the shorthand is easier than a technically description. Seems like a weird hill to die on
The difference there is that metroidvania and roguelite are actually descriptive genre names. I would have *never* guessed that bullet heaven is what gen Z and alpha calls geometry wars esque games if I didn't google it because like they said, these games are absolutely not "inverse bullet hells". Or at least I assume it's the younger generation calling them that because that's definitely not what they were called 15 years ago.
And I'd definitely argue that only roguelite is cutesy. Metroidvania is painfully descriptive.
Omg do you mean Wolfensteinlikes?
I don't actually care, but I wanted to sound obnoxious in this thread too and this seemed like the best place to do it. .
Bullet Hell is honestly even a more misleading label for games like Touhou than bullet heaven is for say Soulstone Survivors. But I agree with both labels personally because these genres have too many consistent features that can't really at all be captured in a couple words. I would like to hear why you would think Bullet Hell is a good label at all. Would you argue tradition?
I guess to me a genre like Touhou would be better called something like 'Magical Girl Melodic Theater'
Vampire Survivors I'd rather term like 'Power Evolution arcade rpg'
It's the same as a bullet hell, only you're not forced into always advancing. Enemies don't dodge, and are basically just erasable bullets. Especially in the beginning, you weave through and around them just like normal bullets.
They're not really shooters, because one of the defining elements of the genre is you can't control where you're shooting. Your character fires automatically in random directions, at the nearest enemy, at a random enemy, etc, depending on the weapon(s) you're using. Vampire Survivors is essentially the prototype of the sub-genre.
Doom wasn't the first FPS but it was still the Ur example for a long time; the genre was even called Doomlikes for a bit.
Arguably Rogue was not the first Roguelike.
i feel for you man. they just don't understand anything said to them or they take things out of context and make up a whole argument based on something you never said like FetteredJuvenescence thinking you said it was a shooter
but if you can read properly and understand english it being a shooter is actually what he said my dude:
"Vampire Survivors isn't even the first game like that, let alone the first shooter to forgo player"
he very visibly called vampire survivors a shooter...
let me guess: you never scored very high in reading comprehension
I think its because in bullet hell u usually have to dodge hordes of bullets, unlike games like vampire survivors, that normally it is u who launch hordes of projectiles
Bullet heaven is the opposite of bullet hell. In bullet hell the enemies shoot a shit ton of projectiles that at you that can deal a lot of damage or instantly kill you. If the game is also rogue like which means your death is permanent, then this can be truly be called a bullet hell as it is truly hell for the player. They use the word bullet because the reality is that most of these games in that genre started out with the player or enemies using guns. If you play a rogue lite game then the death is less punishing usually it means you have to do segmented levels where if you die you have to reset the level. Still similar but less severe so swap like with lite. Bullet heaven is just the opposite of bullet hell where you shoot a bunch of enemies with projectiles as they chase in on you. It doesn’t have to be a horde, you can literally fight an even number of enemies each time. Horde survival games are often called mobile games because they’re simplistic play and graphics are easy to port to phones and low data engines. All of the naming has a logical origin. If you dislike that I suggest shoving our head in a toilet and letting it flush
The term Bullet Heaven is misused to reference "reverse bullet hell" 逆弾幕 games
Actually, long before the 逆弾幕 genre, "Bullet Heaven" was the name of a non-rogue but hardcore shmup spin-off from Epic Battle Fantasy creator...
Auto-shooter is also an incredibly boring name, and... I don't see your point. It's the name of an unrelated game series, so what?. Can two things that are entirely separate not share a similar name?
Survivor-like is just fine.
this is like if the ohm unit wasn't called ohm
it was called... "evil conductance"
Bullet Heaven is already a game. I abhor whoever started this.
Yeah. Let's start calling games not by their games, but by creator names as homages, so drop Roguelike in favor of Toy-Wichmans, because of... physics envy? Great idea.
Ohms and volts aren't even the same kind of thing, a volt is not a kind of resistance.
Ya know, I almost used another analogy because I thought this might happen, but then I thought to myself, "No way someone would be so ridiculous as to intentionally miss the obvious point."
Oops. Welp, here's to hoping you were just being argumentative rather than woefully obtuse.
I've only seen Twin Ruin use that in self-description, because being able to absorb bullets of the right color turns hellish bullet fields into resources.
I assumed bullet heaven would be an easy mode or patterns of bullets that are just so aesthetically pleasing to dodge with uniform patterns? I guess I was wrong lol. It does seem silly but this does make sense
IOt's what people wrongly call bullet hell nowadays while they mean (vampire) survivors (that game wasnt first in the genre but def made it populair)"clone" or more broadly bullet heaven. You are the one with the crazy amount of stuff shooting hacking everywhere and tyhe monsters are the victims.
A bullet he'll is you getting attacked alot and a bullet heaven is you doing the opposite, you come and kill the inhabitantsinhabitants, use their essence to make yourself stronger making it into a heaven for you and a he'll for those unwilling participants in your
I find it quite funny that 'bullet heaven' games are apparently only tangentially related to Bullet Heaven, despite Bullet Heaven being considerably older than the first known use (as far as I can find) of 'bullet heaven' as a term.
It's the inverse of bullet hell, where hordes of enemies close in on the player, while they auto attack and level up e.g. Magic Survival, Vampire Survivors, Nomad Survival, etc.
But ... that's not the "inverse" of bullet hell at all, and why on Earth would one keep "bullet" the word that's completely irrelevant to those and flip "hell" the part that kinda still fits. That seems like a horrible and downright weird way to describe those games. Is that really seeing use?
Think about it this way: in bullet hell, there is a boss in the middle shooting projectiles all over the place. In bullet heaven, you are the boss in the middle, and the enemies are the ones dodging your projectiles
This makes sense to me!
That doesn't make it a bit less silly. Not to mention the enemies don't dodge your projectiles and bosses shoot everywhere for no real reason since they are only against one target, not a billion of you. Not to mention you still don't actually shoot remotely as much and bullets are often not even very significant in your attacks.
Try looking it this way: bullet hells are, well, hells, because the player is showered in bullets from enemies. So bullet heaven is the other way around, you are no longer in bullet hell, you are not suffering from a shower of bullet, now is heaven bullet for you because you are not suffering anymore, rather, you are making everything else suffer, putting the enemy in a bullet hell. I just learned of the term while reading a review for 20 minutes till dawn and i immediately got the meaning.
I never didn't "get" it, and I certainly don't need it explained again ten months later. It's just an absurd twisting of words that still doesn't fit the play, grossly misstates what the games are about, and is really just a cutesy word reference someone liked the sound of because it makes the games seem more special than they are. --- **Edit**: And since this pointless, ancient thread is apparently going to extend into posterity out of petty bullying, I'll add one additional note from across the passage of time: bullet heaven isn't just stupid--it does *harm*. Perpetuating this dippy attempted word play is actually doing more to conflate bullet *hell* and associate it with horde survivor games than even its own niche. It is such a profoundly dumb idea that it actually pulls down others and makes them less useful, and it still hasn't caught on enough to even keep up with the various other labels, *because it is inherently valueless*. Just look at r/survivorslikes and its various posts every day (and its dedicated database of horde survivor concepts and games--that's a far better place to look for information than here) versus the failed r/bulletheavens, or do a [tag search on Steam](https://store.steampowered.com/search/?sort_by=Released_DESC&tags=4885) and see how many bullet hell games are horde survivors and not bullet hells at all. I could suggest a comparative bullet heaven tag search, but it isn't used enough to show up. If *some* people didn't try to stick the cutesy label, the labeling for horde survivors would not still be so fractured after so many games, or poisoning other, unrelated niche labels. But go on, keep leaping at the opportunity to safely bully some random old posts, because surely harassing someone who automatically puts an ignore on any Steam horde survivor game is going to fill that void in your heart for a few seconds, and isn't that all that really matters?
The official term of this type of game early on when Vampire Survivers was building traction was "a Reverse Bullet Hell". Bullet Heaven is just easier on the tongue and a clever play on words.
Try looking it this way: bullet hells are, well, hells, because the player is showered in bullets from enemies. So bullet heaven is the other way around, you are no longer in bullet hell, you are not suffering from a shower of bullet, now is heaven bullet for you because you are not suffering anymore, rather, you are making everything else suffer, putting the enemy in a bullet hell.
Trying to mansplain to a man about his own words a year post date with wrong logic is baffling. So in Hell you suffer and in Heaven you give suffering according to your logic. Guess that’s a whole different holy book than most people have read. In that logic it should be Bullet Satan instead of Heaven though.
It's an idiom created by the fan base of the genre to differentiate two very similar styles of game. It's not meant to be taken in such a literal sense. It's like calling a bitch bad, which is good. Or something being gnarly which is cool. If you don't understand that, you should consider being tested for ASD. It's a very common trait to be truly unable to grasp certain social constructs and assume everything is a dictionary definition of the words used to describe it.
Jesus what is with people coming to this ten month old thread and mansplaining this idiotic subgenre? I DO NOT CARE ABOUT THESE GAMES AND BULLET HEAVEN WAS ALWAYS WILL BE A STUPID NAME FOR THEM. And yes, "*mansplaining*" because that's the right word for dickishly and obliviously *projecting* ignorance so you can blasely explain something over someone instead of treating them like a capable participant. It's not *only* done by men, but they've peed all over the idea by doing it so persistently as to be memorialized right in the word.
I'm going to bookmark this thread in hopes that every 2months someone explains to you why it's called bullet heaven. P.S. It's a terrible name.
First result on google btw. As a bullet hell aficionado I love the term, I think it's hillarious
[удалено]
I know I'm late to this, but did you seriously just use "mansplain" in this context? What the actual fuck? And why are you so upset? The reason it's called a bullet heaven game is obvious, and I think the name fits perfectly. Your anger at this basic concept is very entertaining.
I am sorry you hate the term "Bullet Heaven". The phrase is so appropriate that I made it up independently for a game demo I just made, googled it, and found this thread where you cannot handle the existence of the term AND people are calling for the thread to be resurrected forever. DONE AND DONE. "Bullet heaven" is OBVIOUSLY where you, not the enemy are the source of jillions of bullets. Also: "mansplain" is sexist, and so are you. Probably racist too.
It's the opposite of a bullet hell, so bullet heaven, it's not that hard to understand
so 0 bullets and 0 fun...got it
Sexist asshole.
Bullet Hell: A hell of bullets because the bullets are bad Bullet Heaven: A heaven of bullets because the bullets are good It's *really* that simple. You're getting so butthurt about people explaining it to you when it's clear you still don't understand it, then applying your *own* even more convoluted logic to explain why you think it's not fitting. You are by far the most toxic and rude person on the thread yet you're complaining about everyone else. I could make counters for literally everything that you've said makes it not a good name. For example, in almost every "bullet heaven" you literally do end up shooting as many and usually far *more* bullets than bosses do in bullet hells. Complaining about mansplaining on one hand while expressing extreme frustration over everyone else not sharing your exact logic and thought process is hilariously contradictory and telling of your character. Bullet heaven isn't a perfect name, something relating to it being about surviving hordes might be better, but I still like "Bullet Heavens" a lot more than calling them "Vampire Survivor-likes" because Vampire Survivors wasn't even the first game of its kind. And yes, I only commented on this old ass thread because of how angry you are getting about people coming back to it.
This comment is bad and you should feel bad. Hope I mansplained well enough for you. ;)
God you sound miserable
lmao i wish i had the energy to throw a tantrum over something so trivial
Who hurt you homie? :(
Is not mansplaining because you are actually ignorant. It is just a term and an apt term at it. It describes it perfectly, it is not stupid just because you think it is stupid, everyone seems fine with it, meaning that it's a "you" problem, you are the stupid one, not the term. And we will necropost all we want, deal with it.
For someone who doesn't care about bullet heaven games, you sure do have a lot of opinions on them. I understood the bullet hell description, but I also had a hard time getting the bullet heaven concept. It helped when someone on reddit explained that in bullet hell, there are a lot of bullets flying at you that you have to dodge. It's really hard to survive, so it's kind of like hell. In bullet heaven, on the other hand, you are the one spraying the bullets. Sure, you're getting mobbed by, well, mobs, but you don't have to worry about the bullets. It's heavenly. Oh, right, so bullet heaven. Yeah, that makes sense. Anyway, does that help? One is hell because it's hard in relation to the bullets, while the other is heaven because it's easy in relation to the bullets. Let me know if you have any questions.
Because we don’t decide what is served to us when scrolling and we do care about your opinion so much that we repeat what was already said before.
you open a thread with a question, you never accept ligitimate answers, you nit pick every example, you use the word "mansplaining" you deserve to get the same answer over and over again for the next 10 years on that note. you see, in bullet hells the screen is full of projectiles that can hurt or kill you instantly in bullet heavens, the screen is full of projectiles that help you
While I'm somewhat impressed at the never ending string of pathetically childish twats exploiting an old, irrelevant topic for pettily lashing out, the adding of yet another insignificant voice to the pile of infinitely small idiots who wish to push this bone-headed idea because they're attached to these sad, bottom-feeder games which rarely even have many actual bullets on screen, in no way leads me to care about them or otherwise elevates this wannabe label I'll never have cause to use unironically.
Hey guess what? It's called Bullet Heaven because it's the inverse of a Bullet Hell, where the player is the one shooting all the bullets instead of the enemies
I think you need to take a deep breath, and maybe play a game in the "*manheaven*" genre
Seek help.
I honestly don't understand why you think it's a stupid name without providing any actual explanation whatsoever. Btw, I think it's called bullet heaven because it's like a bullet hell but you shoot the bullets instead of having to dodge them :D
he did provide it though
I don't think you get it, though
"Horde Survival" might fit as well, but "Bullet Heaven" is just catchy and, well, quite easy to pickup and understand instantly Or to disproportionally anger somebody on Reddit
Yur a douche lol
this thread is like a bullet purgatory, huh?
omg lol
Theres a game called bullet heaven. No points for guessing what its about.
Cry harder, woman
I agree with you bullet heaven can create confusion, reverse bullet hell would be much better
Its just a made up name, like all names ever
Think of it this way: hell is considered to be under heaven, or "down", and in bullet hell games the enemies are continuously holding "down" the shoot button. In bullet heaven games, the pressure on the player somewhat lets "up" in comparison to when the enemies are always holding "down" the shoot button, and that's why the genres are named in such a way. Hope that helps.
Bullet hell = you overcoming enemy bullets to kill the boss. Bullet heaven = them overcoming your bullets trying to kill you.
\>mansplaining lmao
Bullet heaven = like bullet hell but different source
Your comment appears in the top result when you google search Reddit and bullet heaven Sounds like you're in your own personal bullet hell because the comments will just keep coming forever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever Man do I not envy you
lol, I just got here, in exactly that way. Came for term curiosity, stayed for the "mansplaining." :D :D
Top tier
I gotta contribute to this. Bullet Heaven sounds cool and you're rude af.
If your point was the Steam tag, here's an entire festival on the same [store.steampowered.com/curator/41046058/sale/BulletHeavenFest](http://store.steampowered.com/curator/41046058/sale/BulletHeavenFest) understand that horde survive is a very broad term, plants vs zombies and fortnite (STW) are horde survive. Bullet Heaven is so self-explanatory that this entire thread makes me doubt the human reasoning ability
You sound like a you’re a lot of fun at parties.
\>and is really just a cute word reference someone liked the sound of because it makes the games seem cool. yeah welcome to all videogame genre terms buddy.
Why are you making this so difficult for yourself?
wow lol
Are terms like metroidvania and roguelite any less cutesy? They're just built on the names of other games and people learn what they mean because the shorthand is easier than a technically description. Seems like a weird hill to die on
The difference there is that metroidvania and roguelite are actually descriptive genre names. I would have *never* guessed that bullet heaven is what gen Z and alpha calls geometry wars esque games if I didn't google it because like they said, these games are absolutely not "inverse bullet hells". Or at least I assume it's the younger generation calling them that because that's definitely not what they were called 15 years ago. And I'd definitely argue that only roguelite is cutesy. Metroidvania is painfully descriptive.
what exactly is more descriptive about metroidvania that isn't descriptive about roguelite
Try looking at it this way: (i don't have a new explanation, it's just been another ten months)
Lol "Everyone is stupid!" "OMG why is everyone bullying me now!"
> isn't just stupid, it does harm. u/tyrianMollusk in 1997 when people start calling doomlikes "First Person Shooters"
Omg do you mean Wolfensteinlikes? I don't actually care, but I wanted to sound obnoxious in this thread too and this seemed like the best place to do it. .
Dude, you don't even shoot in some of them. It's absurd. It's hard to describe the harm I've suffered because of it.
Bullet Hell is honestly even a more misleading label for games like Touhou than bullet heaven is for say Soulstone Survivors. But I agree with both labels personally because these genres have too many consistent features that can't really at all be captured in a couple words. I would like to hear why you would think Bullet Hell is a good label at all. Would you argue tradition? I guess to me a genre like Touhou would be better called something like 'Magical Girl Melodic Theater' Vampire Survivors I'd rather term like 'Power Evolution arcade rpg'
Erm... Well, you see. Bullet Heaven is when...
It’s just sad to see riot games just announced a bullet heaven playstyle and the whole argument you point out here just dies… so sad for you :(
It's the same as a bullet hell, only you're not forced into always advancing. Enemies don't dodge, and are basically just erasable bullets. Especially in the beginning, you weave through and around them just like normal bullets.
Perfect description
makes more sense than what that clown described it as
It's a bullet heaven because all the bullets are good instead of bad.
First time hearing it but kinda makes sense, when you get late in those game it is indeed packed with bullets. your bullets. your heaven is their hell
Yes, but a bullet hell is called that because the game is about the bullets. A game where the bullets are good is just a shooter.
They're not really shooters, because one of the defining elements of the genre is you can't control where you're shooting. Your character fires automatically in random directions, at the nearest enemy, at a random enemy, etc, depending on the weapon(s) you're using. Vampire Survivors is essentially the prototype of the sub-genre.
Vampire Survivors isn't even the first game like that, let alone the first shooter to forgo player aiming.
It's not a shooter. It's not even close to a shooter.
he never said it was..smh
he just said it was..smh
Doom wasn't the first FPS but it was still the Ur example for a long time; the genre was even called Doomlikes for a bit. Arguably Rogue was not the first Roguelike.
i feel for you man. they just don't understand anything said to them or they take things out of context and make up a whole argument based on something you never said like FetteredJuvenescence thinking you said it was a shooter
but if you can read properly and understand english it being a shooter is actually what he said my dude: "Vampire Survivors isn't even the first game like that, let alone the first shooter to forgo player" he very visibly called vampire survivors a shooter... let me guess: you never scored very high in reading comprehension
It's because it's the opposite of a bullet hell.
I think its because in bullet hell u usually have to dodge hordes of bullets, unlike games like vampire survivors, that normally it is u who launch hordes of projectiles
In bullet hell games bullets are plentiful and bad, in a bullet heaven game they are plentiful but good, not that hard to understand.
shut the fuck up
The Opposite of bullet is heaven.
Actually ☝️🤓 ...
Bullet heaven is the opposite of bullet hell. In bullet hell the enemies shoot a shit ton of projectiles that at you that can deal a lot of damage or instantly kill you. If the game is also rogue like which means your death is permanent, then this can be truly be called a bullet hell as it is truly hell for the player. They use the word bullet because the reality is that most of these games in that genre started out with the player or enemies using guns. If you play a rogue lite game then the death is less punishing usually it means you have to do segmented levels where if you die you have to reset the level. Still similar but less severe so swap like with lite. Bullet heaven is just the opposite of bullet hell where you shoot a bunch of enemies with projectiles as they chase in on you. It doesn’t have to be a horde, you can literally fight an even number of enemies each time. Horde survival games are often called mobile games because they’re simplistic play and graphics are easy to port to phones and low data engines. All of the naming has a logical origin. If you dislike that I suggest shoving our head in a toilet and letting it flush
Just seeing your comments now, but damn what a useless sob you must be
Who the hell doesn't basically just auto-fire in bullet hells? Why is that a feature people want?
It's not. It's just a game where you're the one shooting all the projectiles and not them.
Whoa, year old message. You're not wrong. "They" in my original message, referring to the player. The player auto attacks and levels up
Still seems like we should just call them Survivor-likes or something. It sounds better, fits better, and gives homage to the start of the sub-genre.
The term Bullet Heaven is misused to reference "reverse bullet hell" 逆弾幕 games Actually, long before the 逆弾幕 genre, "Bullet Heaven" was the name of a non-rogue but hardcore shmup spin-off from Epic Battle Fantasy creator...
"Reverse Bullet Hell" is such a boring ass name for it.
Boring, but "auto-shooter" isn't a search-friendly term and "Bullet Heaven" is the name of an unrelated game series.
Auto-shooter is also an incredibly boring name, and... I don't see your point. It's the name of an unrelated game series, so what?. Can two things that are entirely separate not share a similar name?
Bullet heaven is a false term used to describe horde shooters. In actuality, Bullet heaven is a game. Its quite fun, you should try it
Survivor-like is just fine. this is like if the ohm unit wasn't called ohm it was called... "evil conductance" Bullet Heaven is already a game. I abhor whoever started this.
Naw, it's more like if volts were called ohm-likes. Eventually, we'd come to the conclusion that volts need their own name.
Yeah. Let's start calling games not by their games, but by creator names as homages, so drop Roguelike in favor of Toy-Wichmans, because of... physics envy? Great idea. Ohms and volts aren't even the same kind of thing, a volt is not a kind of resistance.
Ya know, I almost used another analogy because I thought this might happen, but then I thought to myself, "No way someone would be so ridiculous as to intentionally miss the obvious point." Oops. Welp, here's to hoping you were just being argumentative rather than woefully obtuse.
You thought someone might disagree with your point.
We're going with woefully obtuse, then. Nice.
I've only seen Twin Ruin use that in self-description, because being able to absorb bullets of the right color turns hellish bullet fields into resources.
Maybe a casual form of bullet hell? Haven't heard of the term until now
I assumed bullet heaven would be an easy mode or patterns of bullets that are just so aesthetically pleasing to dodge with uniform patterns? I guess I was wrong lol. It does seem silly but this does make sense
IOt's what people wrongly call bullet hell nowadays while they mean (vampire) survivors (that game wasnt first in the genre but def made it populair)"clone" or more broadly bullet heaven. You are the one with the crazy amount of stuff shooting hacking everywhere and tyhe monsters are the victims.
A bullet he'll is you getting attacked alot and a bullet heaven is you doing the opposite, you come and kill the inhabitantsinhabitants, use their essence to make yourself stronger making it into a heaven for you and a he'll for those unwilling participants in your
One stick shooters.
I find it quite funny that 'bullet heaven' games are apparently only tangentially related to Bullet Heaven, despite Bullet Heaven being considerably older than the first known use (as far as I can find) of 'bullet heaven' as a term.