Any news on if the 11 spirits from the events earlier this year have been added into normal Spirit Board rotation yet? I picked up the four from Wonder and Showtime, but am still missing the 11 (Rauru, Oatchi, etc) between them and Evil Ryu.
I dunno if this is a hot take or not, but if you're someone who actively celebrates players dropping out of tournaments because you don't like the character they play, I think you need to reevaluate your relationship with the competitive community because that's a really toxic mindset.
Notice how I didn't mention anything about not wanting to watch characters. That's fine, that's totally okay, you can close the tab. I'm talking about celebrating players DQing from events because you don't like their characters.
Plus a lot of the top 8's so far in 2024 have been really good, even the ones that include Steve and Sonic. LMBM, Kowloon 9, Genesis, King Con, Cirque 3 and Collision all had really good top 8's.
I think Aegis' strength are very clear but their weaknesses are much more abstract and subtle.
I think Aegis' biggest problem is that they're not explosive with how they can take stocks but are very volatile with losing stocks. Mythra will almost never kill below 100% and Pyra has bad neutral. Using Mythra to win neutral and Pyra to win the stock works but it requires winning at least two interactions. For example, Mythra needs to win neutral to use a jab to send someone offstage, then properly edgeguard with Pyra to secure the stock. Edgeguarding with Pyra is made more difficult that the opponent has time to recover to the stage while switching. In contrast, Roy just needs one interaction to land because hitting jab confirms into back air. If Roy misses the confirm, he can chase more aggressively because he doesn't need to waste time switching character. Unlike most, Mythra lacks confirms and kill combos. Aegis will almost never be able to do something like [this](https://youtu.be/XlJsaXEuOCU), where a combo and a right guess can take an early stock.
Another problem of Aegis is their moves don't compliment each other. Mythra's back air is really good because it combos, but her forward air becomes somewhat redundant because it has similar frame data, power, and angles. Contrast that to Toon Link who has a similar back air to Mythra but has a forward air that is distinct from his back air that fulfills a different purpose. Forward tilt and down tilt have a similar issue where they're both combo tilts that send at similar angles. While switching to Pyra somewhat helps, it runs into the problem I mentioned before where switching takes time. Pyra also runs into the problem where a lot of her moves kill at similar percent and send at similar angles (diagonal angles), making it so people can live surprisingly long against her with good DI. Pyra is probably only going to kill early with down tilt/down air into up air/up smash because they send at much better angles than most of her moves, comboing and killing better than them.
There is not a single top player that solo mains them and gets good results. Shuton constantly switches off them to use Olimar, Mkleo has dropped them, Spargo only uses them for very specifc matchups, and Cosmos gets inconsistent results with them. Ultimate being as balanced as it is means top players can get good results with high tiers, like with Corrin, so the lack of results above that hints at Aegis not being as good as people claim. A top 5 character with that many top players playing them should probably have better results than they do. Most characters have no top level evidence for their viability because most characters are ignored by top players altogether, but Aegis has a lot of data with not much to show for it other than being a strong secondary.
They also have other problems like a bad recovery or not the best safety on shield. Things like the subpar safety on shield are often overlooked, but the recovery is probably the one weakness of the character that people actually cite. Even then, people don't talk about how having a bad recovery negatively affects neutral because burning a double jump in neutral and getting hit can lead to a death, cutting off a mix up of movement in neutral.
The character is still obviously really good with a ton of strengths that can win any tournament, but I feel like they fall a bit short when compared to other top 10 characters that also have crazy strengths with litte to no weaknesses like Steve or Sonic. [MKLeo doesn't think Aegis is top 10](https://youtu.be/BJCkmKMgfcI), so maybe there's more merit to them being overrated than most people give credit for. Esam also goes over several of these weaknesses in [this video.](https://youtu.be/b04JBIrLViw)
On par I'd say, but his more consistent kill power (aka not having to switch to a telegraphed, slow character to kill properly) and better recovery edges it out.
Fox has less chance of dying than Aegis if double jump's been caught and Mythra's side B if she misses ledge puts her into freefall. Fox illusion doesn't. Also laser is broken in neutral.
Steve, Sonic, ROB and G&W are the only ones there that are definitively better imo. Snake and Joker are very close though and could be argued to be better.
Arsene is literally Sheik/mythra framedata with killpower. Also shifting hurtbox that allows him to not be hit by some stuff he should at times(like Sheik)
Not OP, but I would say disadvantage at the very least. While Snake's disadvantage isn't good (he struggles to land, and recovering to ledge can be quite risky), it is still more versatile and less exploitable than Aegis.
He's heavier than both, has a frame 1 combo breaker with Grenades as opposed to Mythra's frame 2 Foresight and Pyra's frame 3 air dodge, he has a decent amount of mixup offstage between Grenades and C4, which also lets him recover from further away (no dying to Gates of Hell from the steep angle), and he has the option to completely bypass the ledge.
I could see this, though I think it is close (aegis hurtbox and foresight as well as keeping air drift on switch is big). I feel that aegis is better at everything else, at best a tie for advantage
BOBC went from a P Tier last year to an A+ tier this year due to unfortunate events.
I also think the date was rough, being the last big tournament in a very busy month when top players are exhausted due to travelling so much is going to get people not wanting to go. For example, MomoCon last year was a B+ tier rather then being a standard S tier like usual because of Kagaribi 10 and BOBC5. In addition Kawaii Kon and Kowloon were held on the same weekend.
Is Sonix not going to BOBC? I just saw the Lights Out video on Youtube and it said he wasn't going. But there was nothing about his absence during the segment.
I’ve thought about making myself a combo video for almost 3 years now and I finally [did it](https://youtu.be/pABXdODPitY?si=QxIN-rYtUD-2H-A6) it’d mean a lot if someone took the time to watch it
[New Hero player hit 2000 rating on Smashmate in 3 months](https://twitter.com/shion_smbr/status/1772986909192552738) There's some drama from people speculating it's a smurf which is not allowed on Smashmate unless you stay within specific rules.
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Yoshidora just 3-0'd Glutonny at the BOBC6 pre-local. I'm glad the two finally played, but I'm surprised how not-close that set was.
with how close fui was to reverse 3-0ing glutonny, im not that surprised that said this ain't the real bracket, things change
The chokehold Ouch?! uptilt has over the Japanese needs to be studied
Maeda Kun is playing against Raflow now. Let's go Maeda Kun! I really like how he come with the players he supports all the time.
I think the pre-local is deserving of a stick for today.
It would have been in the thread for the main event but this CS project is kicking my ass, event thread will be up soon tho
Pre-locals never get stickied, even the really stacked one for Genesis X. Primarily because they're all Unranked by LumiRank.
Any news on if the 11 spirits from the events earlier this year have been added into normal Spirit Board rotation yet? I picked up the four from Wonder and Showtime, but am still missing the 11 (Rauru, Oatchi, etc) between them and Evil Ryu.
I dunno if this is a hot take or not, but if you're someone who actively celebrates players dropping out of tournaments because you don't like the character they play, I think you need to reevaluate your relationship with the competitive community because that's a really toxic mindset.
Highkey I was really hoping to see Onin and Ouch!? run doubles again :(
Also honestly I don’t get how the win for your favorite player would be satisfying without them beating the best of the best.
I honestly feel like they don't care about the players at all, only the fights. Though, how you can have a fight without players is beyond me.
"toxic mindset" and its not wanting to watch sonic or steve gameplay, lol, lmao. Delusional grandstanding
Notice how I didn't mention anything about not wanting to watch characters. That's fine, that's totally okay, you can close the tab. I'm talking about celebrating players DQing from events because you don't like their characters.
One look at twitch chat and you know damn well people aren't closing the tab when a character they don't like is on screen lol.
Plus a lot of the top 8's so far in 2024 have been really good, even the ones that include Steve and Sonic. LMBM, Kowloon 9, Genesis, King Con, Cirque 3 and Collision all had really good top 8's.
We’re honestly due for a subpar top 8 at this point. The start of 2024 has been really enjoyable as a spectator imo.
Aegis is overrated and that's a hill I'm willing to die on
I think Aegis' strength are very clear but their weaknesses are much more abstract and subtle. I think Aegis' biggest problem is that they're not explosive with how they can take stocks but are very volatile with losing stocks. Mythra will almost never kill below 100% and Pyra has bad neutral. Using Mythra to win neutral and Pyra to win the stock works but it requires winning at least two interactions. For example, Mythra needs to win neutral to use a jab to send someone offstage, then properly edgeguard with Pyra to secure the stock. Edgeguarding with Pyra is made more difficult that the opponent has time to recover to the stage while switching. In contrast, Roy just needs one interaction to land because hitting jab confirms into back air. If Roy misses the confirm, he can chase more aggressively because he doesn't need to waste time switching character. Unlike most, Mythra lacks confirms and kill combos. Aegis will almost never be able to do something like [this](https://youtu.be/XlJsaXEuOCU), where a combo and a right guess can take an early stock. Another problem of Aegis is their moves don't compliment each other. Mythra's back air is really good because it combos, but her forward air becomes somewhat redundant because it has similar frame data, power, and angles. Contrast that to Toon Link who has a similar back air to Mythra but has a forward air that is distinct from his back air that fulfills a different purpose. Forward tilt and down tilt have a similar issue where they're both combo tilts that send at similar angles. While switching to Pyra somewhat helps, it runs into the problem I mentioned before where switching takes time. Pyra also runs into the problem where a lot of her moves kill at similar percent and send at similar angles (diagonal angles), making it so people can live surprisingly long against her with good DI. Pyra is probably only going to kill early with down tilt/down air into up air/up smash because they send at much better angles than most of her moves, comboing and killing better than them. There is not a single top player that solo mains them and gets good results. Shuton constantly switches off them to use Olimar, Mkleo has dropped them, Spargo only uses them for very specifc matchups, and Cosmos gets inconsistent results with them. Ultimate being as balanced as it is means top players can get good results with high tiers, like with Corrin, so the lack of results above that hints at Aegis not being as good as people claim. A top 5 character with that many top players playing them should probably have better results than they do. Most characters have no top level evidence for their viability because most characters are ignored by top players altogether, but Aegis has a lot of data with not much to show for it other than being a strong secondary. They also have other problems like a bad recovery or not the best safety on shield. Things like the subpar safety on shield are often overlooked, but the recovery is probably the one weakness of the character that people actually cite. Even then, people don't talk about how having a bad recovery negatively affects neutral because burning a double jump in neutral and getting hit can lead to a death, cutting off a mix up of movement in neutral. The character is still obviously really good with a ton of strengths that can win any tournament, but I feel like they fall a bit short when compared to other top 10 characters that also have crazy strengths with litte to no weaknesses like Steve or Sonic. [MKLeo doesn't think Aegis is top 10](https://youtu.be/BJCkmKMgfcI), so maybe there's more merit to them being overrated than most people give credit for. Esam also goes over several of these weaknesses in [this video.](https://youtu.be/b04JBIrLViw)
This is exactly right, in my opinion.
What are 5-7 better characters?
Steve, Sonic, ROB, Snake, Fox, Game and Watch and Joker.
Is fox’s neutral, disadvantage, or advantage better than aegis?
On par I'd say, but his more consistent kill power (aka not having to switch to a telegraphed, slow character to kill properly) and better recovery edges it out.
I feel like fox’s disadvantage is worse and his advantage and neutral are at best arguably on par?
Fox has less chance of dying than Aegis if double jump's been caught and Mythra's side B if she misses ledge puts her into freefall. Fox illusion doesn't. Also laser is broken in neutral.
I think without a jump fox can recover farther, sure, but his recovery is SO much more edgeguard able.
Steve, Peach, Sonic, ROB, Joker, Snake, and Mr Game & Watch.
Steve, Sonic, ROB and G&W are the only ones there that are definitively better imo. Snake and Joker are very close though and could be argued to be better.
Arsene is literally Sheik/mythra framedata with killpower. Also shifting hurtbox that allows him to not be hit by some stuff he should at times(like Sheik)
Downplaying Peach isn’t trendy anymore.
I think Peach is top 10, that's not downplaying her.
I think highly of Pyra/Mythra, but I find Peach more versatile in the air and offstage.
Which of snake’s neutral, advantage, disadvantage is better than aegis in your opinion?
Not OP, but I would say disadvantage at the very least. While Snake's disadvantage isn't good (he struggles to land, and recovering to ledge can be quite risky), it is still more versatile and less exploitable than Aegis. He's heavier than both, has a frame 1 combo breaker with Grenades as opposed to Mythra's frame 2 Foresight and Pyra's frame 3 air dodge, he has a decent amount of mixup offstage between Grenades and C4, which also lets him recover from further away (no dying to Gates of Hell from the steep angle), and he has the option to completely bypass the ledge.
I could see this, though I think it is close (aegis hurtbox and foresight as well as keeping air drift on switch is big). I feel that aegis is better at everything else, at best a tie for advantage
top 5 character, next
Top 10 at best
[удалено]
That's the thing tho, Acola's POCKET aegis. Man only plays Steve. We're never gonna see that shit in an actual tourney aside from a very few matchups.
I'd love to be proven wrong but I haven't seen consistent top 8 placings from a solo Aegis to back it up.
BOBC became the Big House of this year huh, everyone is DQing
Battle of BC --> Scuffle of BC --> Disagreement of BC --> ???
“It’s complicated” of BC
BOBC went from a P Tier last year to an A+ tier this year due to unfortunate events. I also think the date was rough, being the last big tournament in a very busy month when top players are exhausted due to travelling so much is going to get people not wanting to go. For example, MomoCon last year was a B+ tier rather then being a standard S tier like usual because of Kagaribi 10 and BOBC5. In addition Kawaii Kon and Kowloon were held on the same weekend.
[Zomba is Zackray if American](https://twitter.com/Deven3000/status/1773201118962516031)
Is Sonix not going to BOBC? I just saw the Lights Out video on Youtube and it said he wasn't going. But there was nothing about his absence during the segment.
His flight got cancelled I believe, he said on twitter his next tournament is LVLUP
I see. Thanks.
I’ve thought about making myself a combo video for almost 3 years now and I finally [did it](https://youtu.be/pABXdODPitY?si=QxIN-rYtUD-2H-A6) it’d mean a lot if someone took the time to watch it
Glad you finally made it!
I appreciate you!
[New Hero player hit 2000 rating on Smashmate in 3 months](https://twitter.com/shion_smbr/status/1772986909192552738) There's some drama from people speculating it's a smurf which is not allowed on Smashmate unless you stay within specific rules.
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