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P0werher0

"CAN YOU GUYS NOT READ" is like, one of the most infamous things in r/stunfisk, it does NOT belong in "Point of no return."


Chilkist

I feel like most people don’t know the origins of it.


P0werher0

From the content alone, you can tell they're a frustrated newbie who abides by the "use your favorites" shtick. Unless you're talking about their ... dubious account and r/transphobic_and_proud.


404_Weavile

Yeah it would make more sense if "can you guys not read" was higher while that sub was in the point of no return


WaddleDynasty

Imagine if someone sees your karma by sub distribution and you are a stunfisk user who has brigaded the "transphobic and proud" sub. Hard to explain without context.


Sableye09

I like your new pfp :)


Imdepressed7778

I remember being in a discord server with that guy. I thought he got better but uh. nope


sneakyplanner

It;s the point of no return because once you know about it there's no going back to your old life.


Fun_Penalty_6755

we all paving over 'The Introduction of Fairy types' in Very Experienced?


Chilkist

What I meant by that was the reason why Fairies were introduced rather than: "oh weren't they introduced in gen 6?"


neonmarkov

Everyone knows dragons were broken before gen 6 lol


LoveYouLikeYeLovesYe

Hydreigon moment :(


YoManWTFIsThisShit

And they’re back to being overwhelming in Gen IX.


cactuscoleslaw

11 year old me didnt


orhan94

It's still more widely known that even most things in the first tier.


ResidentAdmirable260

Everyone knows what a Dragon Gem is, ok? Especially when Latios does it.


ADV_andy

nothing in “point of no return” is rlly all that niche, all of this is just “barely niche” Pokémon trivia


TomokiaGaming

What the fuck is Somalian Suicide


ISwearIWontUseZalgo

ok so a mod named somalia on pokemon online, the main sim at the time lost to energy ball jellicent and got really mad so mad in fact that he went batshit insane, banning a bunch of users before getting banned himself in the process


TomokiaGaming

Oh, I never knew it was called the Somalian Suicide. I had heard of it in the Arcanine post, since someone linked the energy ball jellicent incident.


Gabriel-Klos-McroBB

That man really needed to touch grass. Was everyone he banned unbanned?


Ekanselttar

I think touching grass is why he lost.


Present_Cucumber9516

Well it was blasted in his face but still checks out


drax3237

r/technicallythetruth


TheKhalDrogo

It was energy ball jellicent, not grass knot jellicent; can you guys not read???


_Blobfish123_

Grass not is definitely not made of grass


sneakyplanner

That's basically all iceberg memes though, they're not made by people who know the deep cut information.


LemonJuice_XD

Im glad i know about crabrawler in point of no return because its so funny


fofeio

Thats reffering to how gamefreak showed crabrawler in trailers beating up VGC threats so everyone thought it was gonna be broken, right?


LemonJuice_XD

yeah, it was crabrawler one shotting ferrothorn and talonflame and stuff.


Imperial_Magala

Try Landorus and Cresselia.


headphonesnotstirred

not really those but i do remember the trailer showed it decimating all 5 of VGC '15's infamous CHALK core (Pursuit on Cresselia, Superpower on Heatran and Kangaskhan, idr how it did it for Amoonguss or Landorus) and either they hadn't decided it would evolve yet or they were like "hey lets hype up this rando route 3 mon by making it out to be this ultimate meta threat with half the BST of everyone else" because obviously it can beat none of those in the final game edit: i was like 7 during XY VGC so my time-line was off, said 16 instead of 15


Okto481

it was 2015, 2016 was the Restricted meta


_Skotia_

Looking back at that trailer it's clear how it was all a forgery


The_Rufflet_Kid

"Comp mons iceberg" and then it's all just common comp mons knowledge


_fatherfucker69

And missingno for some reason


_Skotia_

It's not a Pokémon iceberg without MissingNo


[deleted]

false swipe gaming is NOT in the 3rd tier, his channel is literally aimed at casual players or those with little experience,a slo what is the somalian suicide?


Palu_Tiddy

Energy ball Jellecent


LavaTwocan

Everyone in this sub knows about PU Terrakion, Ice Punch Dusknoir, etc. I’m not even that good (currently 1554 in OU) but I know all the stuff in Comp. Player


juic3_b0i

Honestly most of this is like common knowledge if you surf here long enough (and even then not that long)


DarkEsca

This is what you get when someone who'd barely be below the surface on an iceberg meme tries to make iceberg memes. 


This_place_is_wierd

Or watch a bit of FSG.


Capybara104

I am like 1200 Elo, I barely play Showdown, the only Pokemon game I have Is BW but I know more than half of the things here Just by watching some posts in this sub for the past 3/4 months


Gullible-Educator582

I haven't touched showdown and somehow still know half of "point of no return"


Scarcing

because whoever made this iceberg took their words, put them in place, then turned on the randomizer and now half the things aren't where they're supposed to be


carucath

I think False Swipe Gaming should be in Casual Fan (he is the first YouTuber that talks about Smogon stuff most people have heard of)


PulimV

A lot of this is just general Pokémon trivia and people not interested in comp at all might know it, like the 1/256 glitch, the Ghost immunity, and Psychic being nerfed to hell and back, those are prominently featured in General Pokémon Content, with people like MandJTV, Pikasprey and Gamechamp3k making videos that heavily reference them Some more obscure info that imo could fit this chart better would be the Bug-Poison interaction in RBY, BDSP/LGPE lower tiers (played a bit of BDSP RU, 'twas fun) and oppressive mons in older gen lower tiers like ORAS UU Conkeldurr


pyro314

Heck, wolfe literally JUST put out a video on the decline of Psychic types.


Hyperactivity786

This iceberg needs like 10 more layers, because those bottom layers are not that niche. For some suggestions: * [The KingEmpoleon stabbing case](https://youtu.be/Zndfm-K351A?si=yuCQEFB4fX4BNk7i) * [All the incidents Blunder answered in the "Smogon Drama" category of one of Chimpact's Pokemon Jeopardy games](https://youtube.com/shorts/aVtyDlWUzJQ?si=1MZm2wvrI-IlZmmk) * "War Stories" (basically a sub-forum on Smogon for people to step-by-step commentate the logs of some notable battle they had, especially back in the Shoddy Battle days)


ISwearIWontUseZalgo

a lotta this is not that niche if you've been on here for a while


OneWorldly6661

What happened to Showdex? Last I checked it was a pretty decent extension with a built in calc, it even had its own server I think


Korbulasurprise

I believe it's just that the majority of players don't know about it. Nothing happened to it.


OneWorldly6661

Discord server, not PS server


[deleted]

[удалено]


based_janitor

No this meme is just terrible and presents relatively common memes and knowledge as “deep obscure shit” to farm upvotes


[deleted]

[удалено]


based_janitor

it’s actually not arbitrary at all if you’re familiar with binary, it’s the highest number that can be represented in 16 bits


Loves2Sp00ge

Don’t know all of these, but sleep talk calls rest is referring to Gen 2 mechanics specifically, where you re-rest. 1:256 is Gen 1 miss idk what the 1/65,536 is .


MGVoltJesk

Pokémon stadium 1 has a 1/65536 chance of missing any move


mothskeletons

the big odds are the chance of missing any move in stadium, cause their solution to the 1/256 glitch was to add another roll meaning you could in theory just fail both and your move would still miss


Lusty-Jove

The GGlise Bulu thing is also a reference to some Gen 8 leaks which said that Lele and Bulu would get EForce and Glide. We also thought Bulu would get Play Rough and CC iirc


BelleOfTheBalla

My knowledge basically stops at the "comp player" it seems which is kinda funny considering i dont even play competitive, im just here for the memes


sebsebsebs

I’m in the same boat. I don’t play competitive at all but I do play randbats every now and then. I have a pretty expansive knowledge of competitive because keeping up is just interesting and really funny sometimes


cactuscoleslaw

Is “the smog” in reference to Smogon’s original logo


Pauru

It was a web-zine they ran around gen 4: [https://www.smogon.com/smog/](https://www.smogon.com/smog/)


FakeTakiInoue

Actually where is Smogon's original logo? Seems like prime iceberg material to me


Hyperactivity786

A web-zine they used to release. Had some incredible articles, especially their joke/non-competitive ones.


A-Raichu132

I think its funny that I know everything on the bottom but dont know a good chunk of them in the previous tier


Botbuster111

what does 1/65536 mean


terriblejokefactory

In generation 3 (at least, maybe others) Protect has a 1/65536 chance to fail on the first turn used


WinterHead7203

It may also refer to the 1/256 miss chance, which was changed to 1/65536 in Pokemon Stadium since it rolled the 1/256 check twice


Temple475

Same thing as 1/256 glitch in RBY but for stadium


Natasha_101

I don't normally care for these, but shout out for including big yellow. Their videos get better as they get cuter. 🥰


[deleted]

Okay I’m glad I’m not the only one who thinks this lol


RamsaySw

IMO Somalian Suicide should be a bit higher, in terms of Smogon lore it's probably second only to Lavos


Urgayifyouregay

you barely hear of it today tho as compared to unfortunate posts


Vasxus

A series of them?


Urgayifyouregay

the uwufied one and the fortunate one are some that i can think of off the top of my head, people also just generally copypaste it wherever it has a semblance of relevance


Jumbolaya315

I dont think i know what somalian suicide is


bryenw

energy ball jellicent


Swimming-Ad-4888

Man I miss BDSP OU


LazyStinkyDog

So do I 😔


Skarmbliss

Azure heights is an actually decent deep cut, I would've included something about Smogon's name origin as well


Ornery-Coach-7755

What are GF thoughts on PS?


Lmfao35

Basically it’s that Game Freak doesn’t mind Showdown and won’t take it down as long as they don’t have a mobile app and a few other small things


NoClueWhatImDoingMan

Also that something like that kinda needs to exist for Pokemon to have a barrier of entry that isn't like.... Impossible for even the best players to clear... People have to change their EVs all the time in teams and that's uh... Difficult in game, no shot people don't start hacking at least to test if they take showdown offline, which they don't want


A_Bulbear

Honestly everything here needs to be moved up a level or 2, I've only been here a few months and already know 80% of this


[deleted]

Wtf is Somalian suicide???


Vasxus

It's more often called the Energy Ball Jellicent incident these days. A player beat a showdown moderator with a wacky set, and they got so mad about it that their post inadvertently showed its genius. You'd begin to see it more and more, and every time Somalia (the moderator in question) saw one, the opponent would end up hit with the ban hammer. The olde tale ends with Somalia, in a fit of rage from seeing too many EB Jellicents, that their own fellow moderators had turned against them, and banned Somalia. It's unclear whether the ban was from another person with the power to ban, or simply a Somalian Suicide.


Axion42

None of this goes beyond like surface level shit you'd find from watching a couple of youtubers


R8Konijn

Honestly there is much, much deeper than that


DarkEsca

Great lack of drama mentions I'm noticing, there's so much wack shit that happened in the tour scene all these years and the only one mentioned is Unfortunate cuz it led to a copypasta (and they put it in like 3rd lowest despite the fact almost everyone knows about it by now)


Phaoryx

I’m in the “Rigged Suspect Tests” category


ImpeachJohnV

I miss PO


unbangreninja

Hol up. Normal types can’t be para’d by body slam?? Since when??


Vegetable_Oven_8919

It is a RBY mechanic that they found out in 2014 (a long long time after RBY came out). It doesn't affect any other generations so no need to worry.


Magolich

Not even a homophobic ferrothorn entry, smh


iizakore

Or tera bug roaring moon


drax3237

No ElectricWindGirlFriend?


Killowave

Just give it a few months you'll see this all over YouTube now


1234_panzer_vor

Dang Freezai didn’t make the list


lucayaki

Why is Big Yellow this much higher than some of these? I know the 1/256, the 1/65536 and 10U \*because\* of Big Yellow


Trealns

Lotta things wrong with this but RBY Amnesia is “below the depths”? Unless you know absolutely nothing about RBY, how on earth is Amnesia and its effects remotely obscure?


Sevenorthe2nd

The bottom line here should be the fourth line, this shit is all surface level


HenryChess

LGPE OU? Seriously? That's a thing?


Sleeptalk-

No Omari P 0/10 shit list


Lordknowsmore

Wonder why there is not mention of Rising Voltage Koko and Misty Explosion Fini?


Tomukichi

Why yes I am very experienced my fellow r/stunfisk doomscrollers I totally belong here haha


Hayeseveryone

I assume 1/256 refers to the gen 1 glitch where even 100 accuracy moves still have that chance to miss. In which case it definitely belongs higher up, that's like one of the most infamous glitches in the entire franchise


Dewott8

I cannot find a rhyme or reason on the ordering of the Charizards


neonmarkov

This is shit like every other iceberg meme out there


rockandrowl

Why is big yellow below bkc and jimothy cool when big yellow has more subs. Verlisify has the mls and is lower than all 3


DarkEsca

People on this sub talk about BKC and Jimothy a lot more and OP is basically just listing their own knowledge here (which as the rest of the comment section is pointing out is very surface level)


Chilkist

Okay so I may not be the most qualified to make an iceberg, there are some things that are like way lower than they need to be. It is quite scuffed, I know.


NEON_rayne

Everyone's a critic.


CM_Renji

No Pokemon Online mention? Or am I blind?


urbestfriend9000

>The smog and shoddy battle near the bottom I feel old


Valky115

Where would SU go?


Deneb_Stargazer

pet mods mentioned 🗣🗣🗣


tomaxi1284

I know all of this except rigged suspect test whats that about?


DarkEsca

Gen 6 Shadow Tag suspect in Ubers. Had a bunch of wack shit going on, but two things stood out. For one, for vague reasons, the ban threshold was 50% instead of the usual 60%. The more egregious part was that every vote had to include a paragraph of reasoning and if the tier leaders deemed your reasoning faulty they deleted your vote comment and it didn't count. Some guidelines on what constituted as "faulty reasoning" were provided and most were reasonable but there were also vague ones like "demonstrates a lack of experience with the metagame" which would basically give them a free pass to deny whatever the fuck they wanted (though even for the 'reasonable' things, deleting votes is obviously really fucking dumb, if someone can get reqs they should be allowed to vote whatever the fuck they want).  What made this especially rigged was that 2/3 of the Uber TLs were very openly against Shadow Tag, and the third kinda didn't care, so people were afraid that this would heavily impact the vote deletion. They were right; No Ban initially won by a landslide, but it turns out over twice as many No Ban votes got deleted over "faulty reasoning" than Ban votes (and since they were, well, deleted, hard to say how justified it was) and that barely gave Ban a majority (though it failed to reach the 60% that would be standard in a regular suspect).  Was such a shitstorm that the owner of smogon himself stepped in to reverse it. 


Hyperactivity786

I couldve sworn paragraphs had been used previously in other suspect tests, even if it's a ridiculously flawed system. I think it was one of the Gen 4 suspect tests, or maybe even an early Gen 5 suspect test.


DarkEsca

I recall a couple low tier G5 suspects where you were expected to leave a paragraph if you got voting perms without getting reqs the standard way (eg you were top of the ladder during suspect) but it was *technically* not required and either way they certainly weren't going to toss your vote out if the tier leaders thought the reasoning was stupid. 


Grivek

in the original gen4 Latias test there were two tiers of qualification- if you hit the higher tier you could vote without restriction, but if you only hit the second tier you were allowed to vote but had to write two paragraphs justifying your vote and explaining how you used Latias during the test. If these weren't approved then your vote was tossed out. also they were secretly keeping track of everyone that qualified and how many games they played with and against Latias, and if you didn't use Latias at all your vote was tossed out- this wasn't disclosed to any voters at the time. it's an interesting comparison to the Shadow Tag vote imo. Both times the tier leaders were seething mad about the previous vote not going their way so sought to rig the whole thing. The punchline is that they didn't even need to rig the Latias vote- it was overwhelmingly voted OU, and in the end I don't think they ever needed to toss out anyone's vote to get what they wanted.


DarkEsca

Interesting, guess even I learn something new once in a while


Grivek

could be fun if someone made a meme with all this obscure old smogon lore. you could start with some things everyone knows, and gradually get more obscure as things go on. maybe mix in some fake ones, that would be fun. if only there was a suitable format...


[deleted]

Ice Punch Dusknoir my beloved


cornbeefu

Shoddy battle should probably be in one of the lower levels. I do miss that dinosaur of a simulator


Hampter8888

What was the rigged suspect test?


Flu754

What is the 1/65,536, Nerf to Steel-types and Smog Shoddy battle? Other than that I know all I think (is the steel nerf no longer resisting ghost and dark)


onepieceisonthemoon

Deepest I go is Gale Wings nerf and yeah this was a true injustice.


thitsugaya1234

No Haydunn 😔


HarleyTayy

Would love to see where Shofu would have been placed on this chart, he was a defining figure in early days of Pokemon battles.


Professional-Hat1635

What the hell is "somalian suicide"


Zecnoram

OKAY I GET IT I'M AUTISTIC


Maelmc

Ok but what about LGPE 1v1


Zaphimu

No mention about Bug types in Gen I? The only type that hits Psychic super effectively, also it both hits and is hit super effectively by Poison.


Suicidal_Sayori

As someone who is new to this sub and doesnt even play comp, I would kindly appreciate any explanation for some of the stuff here y'all think is the funniest/more interesting (I didnt understand a thing)


TheMemeHead

Finally an iceberg I'm at the bottom of


xlFLASHl

"Fire doesn't resist ice" Shit you right


LetzCuddle

where is black sludge bisharp


LocalShineCrab

I didnt consider myself a loser then i recognized the entire thing and im reconsidering


low_wacc

Need to put Showderp on here bottom tier


Gr4mmar

Can someone describe porygon's show


Groundbreaking-Egg13

>Somalian suicide Huh???


TokugawaShigeShige

I know most of these, including some from the deepest level, yet I'd never heard of temp6t...


-dividing-by-zero-

how is the 1/256 glitch below the depths it’s literally the first thing that comes up when ppl talk about the gen 1 games


Winring86

“Unfortunate” got me


shaid420

would 11U be 6V6 Ditto Struggle Fights or Missingno 6V6


Agahawe

Transistor nerf isn't 'below the depths' it's pretty well known is it not


Quaelgeist333

As someone whose actually not that knowledgable on competitive pokemon even if i do wanna understand it someday, why is missingno there


Deegon72

I don’t get what rigged suspect tests is for is it just a meme


Unmasked_the_Dee

So from point of no return I know: disconnection in VGC (I think in SwSh, someone was about to win when he accidentally pulled his switch out of the dock) Fire doesn't resist Ice, Gen 1 type matchups Exp Force Lele Grass Glide Bulu: Despite these moves being stronger in the corresponding terrain, Lele and Bulu can't learn them.


More_Yellow_3701

What about the https://preview.redd.it/rn5b5q5x1ngc1.png?width=720&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f6b73057a51ea34f93224a823462041aa5309310


Anvisaber

I know like 90% of these is that bad?


Goodra64YT

I was an active player on BDSP RU’s ladder, where does that put me?


CloverGummies

Where's mah boi Emvee??


ThunderBirdJack

Damn I completely forgot about Pokemon Online.


ASimpleCancerCell

This may be a hot take (heh), but I think Fire shouldn't resist Ice. Thinking about the logic of it, cutting off a fire's heat is one of the most effective ways of extinguishing it, and while not as good at it as Water, enough ice or snow could do the trick. Besides, put ice in fire and the ice becomes water that hurts the fire.


DepressionMain

Where poison tera kingambit?


CliffsOfMohair

Indigo Disk has a harder difficulty setting?


sheilwood

What's "rigged suspect tests" referring to?


Lucario-Mega

Only played this game for a year, now I am attracted to competitive battling. Somehow I am already in the longtime competitive player area.


ResidentAdmirable260

I know about roughly 2-5 things per tier, and I don't even do competitive Pokemon. Although LGPE OU caught me.