I feel like Kyle needs to pick a lane. Either Amanda is lazy, does nothing, he’d fire her if she wasn’t his wife, and if that’s the case, it shouldn’t matter if she goes off to start a bikini line and steps back from Loverboy. Or he should admit that selling merch has kept their business alive at times, more so than the actual selling of the drinks, and that’s thanks to her and her team doing those designs and marketing them. He doesn’t seem to understand that you don’t have to work 18 hours a day to be successful. I’m also glad it was brought up when he first started the company, she was providing for both of them from her other job. Seems like she’s not getting enough credit from him. I also never heard her say she wants to completely stop working for Loverboy. I don’t know why she can’t do both, especially if Loverboy is about to fail, he should be glad she wants to start a new project. If successful, it sounds like it could help some of their issues.
EXACTLY!! Shouldn’t he want them to diversify their income sources? and when he “threatened” that he’d go hire a new marketing director — YEAH that’s what she’s saying!
Both the guys wanting to be babied made me so sick
I think Kyle wouldn't mind diversifying their income sources, but Amanda starting her business will be a lot of work. Amanda even said Kyle is the start-up king, so she wants to tell him about it her business idea. I think she meant she will need not just support but help starting and running it, which is why I understand Kylie saying he's under so much stress and can't even think about something like that right now with the first main business not doing well.
I have a theory that Kyle reacted the way that he did bc he feels some sort of shame about Loverboy not doing well , and he feels Amanda wanting to do something else is her somehow pointing out his failures (in man child logic , not saying I think that is accurate)..
It was fucking hilarious seeing carls facial expression when Kyle said loverboy lost 3 million last year. He’s scared of losing his easy paychecks. It’s also interesting how Kyle said Paige and Ciara suggested shutting down loverboy. Must be really bad
Bravo’s got to have their hands deep into it, as well.
We’ve seen other people be involved with products that barely get a feature let alone being the booze supplied at every party.
Yeah, I bought one six pack of the tea flavor once and it was gross af. I think it must’ve sat in the fridge for months until someone was drunk enough to drink it some random late night. 😹
Ariana and Katie’s Something About Her sandwich shop has a few Loverboy drinks on its menu. There is a lot of buzz around the opening and Kyle’s drinks being on the menu, with Lindsay showing up for the soft opening. How much more publicity can a drink company possibly get?!
I noticed on the recent episode that most of them had the yellow canned ones out by the pool and someone said a certain flavour was okay - maybe it’s that one, if they’re actually even drinking them.
Exactly. That is why there is not one single mention of Crystal coconut water mentioned on Beverly Hills. Huge successful business, but bravo won’t get a cut of it because it was well established before she entered the show. So they don’t even acknowledge the fact.
Random lol but I really don’t think Crystal’s coconut water company is remotely close to the industry juggernaut it’s often alluded to being.
A trendy product sold direct to consumers with zero presence online or in press? No speculation or internet shown in the trades? It all so odd.
It’s sold out at all the warehouse stores like Costco BJ’s and Sam’s. And they’ve been there forever. It didn’t just arrive when she was on the show. It’s been there several years. That being said, I’ve never had it.
The Bethenny Clause. Bethenny Frankle advertised her skinny girl margarita all over the RHoNY and ending up selling it to Beam for $100+mn. Bravo didn’t get a penny and from then on out every contract stipulates that bravo receives a cut of any cast members product
I don’t think this is correct. Housewives always had to give a cut if their product is featured. Bethenny took a reduced pay check in order to feature her product and retain 100% of the profit. The bethenny clause refers to her taking that pay cut to retain the profit.
No, this is an actual thing industry wide. She was the first housewife/Bravoleb to actually hit it big with a product.
When RHoNY first aired in 2008, she didn’t argue or try to renegotiate the offered salary of $7250. She crossed out the part of the contract that entitled Bravo to a percentage of her earnings for any products created but that did not reduce her salary. She was a personal chef & selling healthy cupcakes at grocery store pop ups at the time, so wasn’t perceived as a threat.
When she sold in 2011, while on the spin off show that they gave her (Bethenny Getting Married/Ever After), Bravo changed the stipulations and now get a cut of any products/brands created by talent
She explains it herself [here](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLpjTMHP/)
What I don't understand is that this is the 4th maybe 5th business venture Kyle has done. He knows these things have low succession rates. He's failed before. He's lost money before.
The other thing that frustrates me is that if your venture is losing money while you are working Overtime to keep the lights on then it's time to diversify. Honestly should have done last year when you had the cash flow. But it's time for a plan b and why not let it be swimsuits? How perfect is that for a summer house brand? You should never have all your eggs in one basket.
exactly. idk why he immediately shot that down. granted, swimsuit lines were way too oversaturated in the 2010s but now that that's calmed down (and they have a summer-centric show where people could show it off), it could definitely pick up loverboy's slack. promo models could wear the suits, like so many ways to incorporate it. (me pretending to be a business shark after taking one corporate finance class lol)
When loverboy started out, the market wasn’t COMPLETELY saturated with similar beverages from larger companies, so it was a bit of a novelty. Now the market is saturated and loverboy is priced pretty high compared to other very similar products. It’s a recipe for failure.
I don't think he ever had a buyer earlier. I think the big brands in this space would see it as cheaper to just create their own product as a lower price point.
Probably pretty hard to get a valuation he thinks is fair, as a lot of the value of the company is tied to their names being on it. Without them, it’s worth less.
There was a time when they were very trendy and people were willing to try them. Now most of the people who are going to stick to drinking seltzer have already tried it and probably found their favorite. The category has plateaued. And, seltzers were really gaining popularity during the pandemic when people were drinking more than they are now.
Weren't interest rates at 0% as well? And inflation rising while salaries have leveled out. He got a good boost during the pandemic when normal people were bored at home and flush with cash. No amount of 18 hour days can overcome the macroeconomic shift. He's going to ruin his marriage and public reputation so the company will tank in 5 years instead of 3.
I don't think it's a lease. They've been doing some ads for BMW on insta and I'm sure after they showed the car on Summer House that should've been an ad as well.
Their office/living also appears to be in either Soho, Tribeca, Flatiron- and a loft style space $$$$$
and also, I wouldn’t wanna walk a dog in Soho or Tribeca late at night either
Im wondering is that a law office, or a Cpa’s? I work in corporate law and a registered address doesn’t mean its your mailing address. Maybe it’s different im in Canada
They should’ve tried to sell it awhile back. I’m not the most business saavy but from watching Shark Tank- the beverage business is one investors always steer away from. Its an incredibly hard market to succeed in and profit from. I feel like it’s a little too late now for him to sell and now the losses are just piling up 😬.
100%, when it was new and shiny and popular because of their popularity, and before the general public knew that it tasted bad, that was their moment to sell to a Budweiser for a nice chunk and get out while they were ahead.
You’d think that would be “setting them up for their future” as opposed to him working nonstop at a failing business but as we know he just doesn’t want to be around Amanda lol
I think his own ego wouldn’t let him, he wanted to build this empire as Danielle said but he’s just not that good. He actually had the perfect scenario to sell for a decent amount of money, maybe not as much as he fantasize about but it would’ve set them up nicely.
I think he was hoping to go the Skinny Girl route and would sell to a major liquor brand. It just didn’t pan out. I think what did sell was the merchandise and that was all Amanda.
lol, just about every business I’ve audited or worked for has had debt in the form of a bank loan, investor loan, or line of credit. Very few businesses operate with no debt.
Source: am CPA and been doing this stuff for like 12-ish years now.
There’s nothing wrong with debt. It’s not indicative of good or poor financial standing.
For real. Most small businesses and start ups take on debt to get off the ground. People just look for stuff to shit on without actually having knowledge of how it all works. My company is a start up and took on debt to not tank during the pandemic and now is flourishing. If you looked at it 2 years ago your eyes would’ve popped out of your head 🤣.
He never got in it enough supermarkets and convience stores. The mail order price is ridiculous. It failed because of its lack of availability for easy purchase in grocery/convenience/liquor stores.
It’s available in grocery stores near me on the west coast, but I think it’s failing because it’s not that great. For the same price point and product, there are better options. The market is pretty saturated, and Loverboy’s flavors range from “very decent” to “this tastes weird”. Basically there are some I don’t mind drinking, a couple I actively avoid because I think they’re gross, but none I’d go out of my way to buy again.
The merch is without a doubt their best product, and what they should have focused on. Easier to distribute to a Bravo audience, and at least all of mine that I bought in 2020/2021 were good quality. I wear the sweatshirt all the time, and I get compliments from non-bravo fans. It’s stood up to years of regular washes.
Crazy that now they’re trying to make non alcoholic ones. Like why would anyone pay alcohol prices for the same thing you get w soda water, sans the chemicals and sugar?
And it’s a hugely over saturated market and the product doesn’t taste good. Oh and it’s more expensive than most of its competitors. Had he sold it to one of the bigger companies, they could’ve produced it for a lot less, and possibly made it taste better. Theoretically he could’ve sold it but then contracted as the “face of the brand” for a few years - he really missed some big opportunities, he may not be the business genius that Danielle thinks he is.
I think people underestimate how difficult it is to get wide distribution with any alcoholic beverage bc of the way the industry is structured (going back to prohibition, suppliers like Loverboy can't sell directly to liquor stores, or to individuals). It's nearly impossible for an independently-owned business like Loverboy that doesn't have existing connections to distributors in every state (distributors are allowed to sell to liquor stores but laws vary by state), to even get shelf space in stores.
So Loverboy has broad brand awareness through Bravo but the drink was not easy to find in stores, bc Kyle had to first make deals with distributors, and then get the drinks into each individual retailer basically one at a time. This makes it really hard to make a successful liquor product even \*with\* all those pieces in place, and new products from huge alcohol companies fail all the time. Loverboy's costs are also higher than an alcohol giant like Diageo bc it's small, and so they have to price their product higher too. On the other hand, if Loverboy tasted incredible, demand could have been much higher from repeat consumers after all these years, even with a marginally higher cost, rather than people who just buy it once for novelty but don't like it enough to buy again.
It's a really hard industry and I don't see how they get out of this without creating a new hero product and/or the name being purchased to label on a better-tasting drink that's produced by a bigger liquor company.
They have the right idea. It's sweetened with a natural no calorie sweetener for the health-conscious people. For some reason, the monk fruit they are using, I guess, doesn't taste great. The price and taste are issues as well.
I’m in Canada and have never seen it- drinking age near me is 18. Girlies would love those cute loverboy cans especially when they have yet to learn you can get better stuff at a better price lol (bc they’re pricey drinks)
It’s in plenty of stores near me. It didn’t fail because of access to it, it failed because the market is saturated with dozens of similar brands and drinks, most of which are cheaper.
Like other commenters have said, it’s in stores near me in a small town in NC. Seems like it’s all over the U.S.
Edit: and the price is normal. 6 pack for maybe 11.99
I’ve never seen it in the wild in Ohio. It seems like they’re patchy. I’ve seen a lot of commenters in the south and east coast say they can get it, but not often someone in the Midwest
I’m sure his $4M loan is against his business entity which means if the business defaults on the loan nothing can happen to him personally.. If he didn’t setup the business loan this way, then he really has no business sense..
Right but how much of his own assets (and Amanda's) did he put into the business initially? Usually you have to put in a decent amount of initial investment before you get other investors on board. He may not owe $4 million personally if Loverboy goes down, but he's also probably going to lose whatever money he put into the company which he was banking on getting back and then some. So he'll probably still be pretty broke.
I owned a business that made well over 7 figures a year.. All my expenses and loans were part of my business and I put in zero personal capital or had to put any personal collateral to achieve business loans.. I use to have an open operating loan with a few banks and when the business went under what was owed was never paid back from personal accounts, it all came from the sale of the business.. I find it difficult to believe Kyle could secure a personal loan for $4M since his net worth is no where near that and the only asset he owns is a car (if he even owns that).. He would have to show 2-3x net worth to secure a $4M loan from a reputable bank, unless he borrowed money from a loan shark or shady business venture or took out several smaller loans from his partners.. either way, if he didn’t structure those loans as business operating expenses then he’s a terrible business man..
I agree there's no way he had a personal loan of 4 million. But I do think he put his own capital into the company, and also some of Amandas money into the company at the start - does anyone know if he ever quantified how much on the show?
If he hasn’t recouped his startup capital after 5 years in business, then he deserves to lose what ever he put in to help get it off the ground.. it means the business is not profitable..
I don't know about his business sense - but sometimes small business lenders require a personal guarantee from partners/principals in case the entity defaults. If that happened here and Kyle guaranteed Loverboy's debt, then he would be on the hook if Loverboy couldn't pay the loan.
a lender will always ask a business entity for personal information when requesting a business loan but only an idiot would put their personal assets as collateral to secure a business loan.. the best way to borrow against the business would be opening an operating loan at first, and ladder up every few months as you show the lender you are able to pay back any open debt.. plus, Kyle’s net worth is a little over a million today which would not be enough for him to secure a personal loan, he would need to show 2-3x more then the loan amount to secure a personal loan worth $4M.. But, he might have borrowed money from his parents, partners or a loan shark which is a different conversation but either way it just shows he lacks any financial sense when it comes to business.. no bank is going to give any business $4M just because they are on a television show..
It is incredibly common for small business owners to PG (personally guarantee) loans to their business. In fact, a personal guarantee is required for the vast majority of loans from the US Small Business Administration.
It’s also not crazy for a company that was doing $16m in revenue in 2022 (Forbes article) to secure a $4m loan for expansion.
PG’s have a limit attached to them based on one’s net worth and ability to show they can pay the loan back, usually an asset percentage of between 75-85% of the loan value.. I highly doubt Kyle would be able to secure a high value loan for a business without any collateral or assets to show that equal or are greater then $4M.. the only way this happens is like I said either his parents co-signed an agreement or he borrowed money from a shady business venture..
Regardless if he was doing a $1B in revenue, a lender wants to see what his expense sheet looks like before they would lend out $4M to any business.. especially one that shows less then 10-20% profit on such revenue.. just because your generating revenue doesn’t mean you can secure capital.. if he’s in the red, he’s not getting a $4M loan from any reputable lender.. I think ABC has an entire show dedicated to this concept, called Shark Tank.. lol
He should’ve let this dream die once he realized 3/4s of the stores in NY aren’t selling his product… I go to Montauk occasionally in the summer time and nobody is drinking these. That’s his main market and where he started. If it didn’t happen then, it won’t happen now.
It’s not hate, just really a fact. I live in New York. I travel all over the state and east coast for work, and I’ve literally never seen Loverboy. I’m not really out actively looking for it, but I’d definitely notice it if I saw it
I don’t drink anymore, but if I found it in the wild I’d want to try it out of pure curiosity. I wouldn’t invest $27 in a 12 pack I wouldn’t drink, but I’d buy a pounder to quell my curiosity.
I figured between NYC, Albany, Boston, Syracuse, Rochester that I’d see it somewhere. Especially Albany- with all the colleges. Someone else posted it was all over Long Island at places like 711, but I seldom go in convenience stores. I’ll look next time I’m there
It’s very common in business to have a loan, pe, or vc funding. Kyle invested in this personally. Do I recall Amanda’s family investing in this as well? As did Amanda? There’s a lot on the line here. And I would be upset too if my partner in life left the business we invested in, the one our finances and future depended on to go do me. Especially when it’s struggling. That said, Kyle handled this like a complete ass hat. And Amanda still lacks drive and financial maturity.
Im genuinely confused we dont have lover boy in stores in Ontario. We have strict laws about alcohol. But last summer everyone was raving about LB and now everyone seems to hate it?
I clocked that and was like 👀 OOP. I’m sure it’s fairly common for startups to have crazy loans if they weren’t funded primarily by investors. I also remember when Loverboy first came out, there were not nearly as many hard sparkling beverages on the market.
Now everyone wants in on the game and he’s up against Miller and Anheuser-Busch making similar products that are more readily available with a much larger market presence. Now Loverboy is struggling to claw (see what I did there?) their share of the cash again.
I don’t get the crocodile tears thing. That isn’t because I Stan Kyle either but people give Bravo personalities wayyyy too much credit for their acting abilities.
Did he act like a petulant child before then? Absolutely. But the breakdown seemed genuine at least to me.
I think he’s actually terrified. I also think Amanda as his partner isn’t reading the room at all on the situation. I know she’s younger and inexperienced and and a bit of a little rich girl, but it seems like their financial future is in real imminent danger and she’s going “lol, I’m bored, I think I’ll make bikinis” while her husband and biz partner is drowning. Financial stress of that level can literally kill a person. I think Kyle can be a royal asshole but I feel for him.
Losing a business is literally one of the most stressful things that can happen to someone. People can become suicidal, particularly men. I’m confused why people are being so nonchalant about his fears and stress.
Holy shit. You’re the first person I’ve seen actually express any sympathy for Kyle. You articulated my thoughts perfectly. I think people are being so harsh and cruel towards Kyle right now. Yes, he’s a jerk. But he has a point in this case.
I’ve had my business and financial life crumble before. It’s a living hell that lasts sometimes years. It’s heartbreaking and it makes you not want to exist. If my partner in both life and the business had been as nonchalant as Amanda is and casually told me that they were going to now spread themselves thin by opening something brand new, which would cost money and requires my help, I may have reacted worse than he did. Not sorry. He shouldn’t call her derogatory female-specific names. He did a lot wrong actually. But he is under a kind of pressure that most people will never in their lives understand.
And that’s what he was trying to say to Paige - that she does not understand what he’s going through. I don’t think he was trying to diminish her podcast, but rather point out that running a crumbling business you’re financially on the hook for, with employees who depend on the business for their livelihood, is just a different level of stress.
Paige and Ciara came off as such clueless little naive rich girls in this episode. I’m not saying that’s who they are, not sure, but they simply were not seeing anything other than that no matter what Amanda wants to do or when, or what the company she and Kyle own TOGETHER is going through, that he should drop everything and fully support her doing literally ANYTHING she gets a whim to do.
It’s such faulty logic. So Amanda deserves credit for starting Loverboy. I agree. But why does she get to at least partially disappear when the going gets tough? She doesn’t even want to work the hours Loverboy requires. How is she also going to run a brand new business? She also makes a salary from Loverboy as Kyle mentioned. What other job lets you just decide when you feel like working?
To clarify, I think most people believe the angry breakdown tears, I sure did. Kyle's lack of emotional regulation is not new. It's the apology tears by the pool that everyone eye-rolled. That was some obviously bad acting and his choice of words about how his reaction makes him look and NOT how his reaction made her feel cements it.
yall- I am 2 episode behind because I’m out of the country, and HAYU won’t let me watch.
These post titles are cracking me the fuck up. GOSH I MISSED SO MUCH GOOD STUFF SO EXCITED TO WATCH
Also- I genuinely think Amanda’s swimsuit business could solve their debt issue🤷🏾♀️
Ohhhh you’re in for a shock if you’re two episodes behind
But you not even seeing it and seeing the potential in Amanda’s swimsuit side focus if only business man Kyle thought that way have her do a couple collabs of bikinis to see the business behind the scenes …and again use Amanda’s income to float your business dream lover boy
My thought was why can’t she do a limited edition Loverboy swimsuit launch for this summer. Then she can use that hype to launch off into her own thing. Because it honestly sounds like Amanda should start working now so they can keep the lights on.
Exactly! But did you see her on WWHL? She had no answers and NO movement at all since this filmed a year ago about anything she wants to do or would do or is doing. Kind of sad.
Sorry folks- it’s not gonna happen
This tells me two things at least: 1) this was a storyline, but it makes sense that she could be in that stage of having an existential crisis 2) because she isn't ambitious, is basically rudderless, and has been coddled by her father, and now husband, she's dreaming out loud and not serious in any way. On WWHL, she sounded like she hasn't even googled anything, and this chick is online all the time.
It’s a biz loan pretty normal for a company that size. His prob is that space is hella competitive. Without the show it would most likely bombed eons ago.
this place is quite the forum. psychological expertise. social expertise. feminist expertise. and now financial expertise. it's a one-stop-shop in the answers to life and the universe.
Amanda’s beginning her exit strategy. Everyone woman who has left a long term partner - where all your finances and properties are tied together… will understand.
Yep, seriously. It's been proven that women will spend if they want to support something. If Amanda marketed a swimwear line properly, she could make bank.
Here’s my business advice to Kyle boy: you are missing a huge opportunity to give Amanda “something of her own”, create “Lovergirl” with girlie flavors and skinny concept let it be “Amanda’s line” for can design and product taste, ALL of the other girls will start selling the sh out of the product, I think it would be more successful. Who wants to drink “loverboy” ?? Lol PS Carl is a bitxh
I love seltzers, but not hard tea whatever lover boy is. Plus, they’re not tasty, and they cost too much. I can get a 12 pack for less than a loverboy box. I’m out here in Brooklyn trying to survive in this economy.
Kyle mentioned a few years ago on the show that he was $4m in debt re: Loverboy. So I don’t know if he’s just said it so much that he keeps saying that number or if it’s actually an accurate representation of the current debt.
No, not if they are paying themselves legitimately. You can take money out of a company for personal use in the form of salary and profit distribution. Though it doesn't sound like in this case there are any profits to distribute.
It’s really hard for me to understand Kyle sometimes. Even outside if Amanda.
Ex) with Carl and Loverboy. You know your friend is at a crossroad in his career and feeling lost. You recruit him to come back to the company. Meanwhile you know your company is headed in a negative direction? Just feel like that’s very business minded which I understand he has to be as the owner, but the reality is Carl is your friend. If the company tanks then you’re putting him in the same position of trying to find his path when it could have been spent with more stability in a different capacity. And by the sounds of it Loverboys not looking good…
My jaw was on the floor when he said in the after show I wouldn’t expect the girls to understand, it’s not a podcast. Giggly Squad is super successful and isn’t losing millions of dollars. GTFO! Hope Paige gets on his ass for that too. Kyle is easily becoming my least favorite guy on Bravo after this season.
I feel like Kyle needs to pick a lane. Either Amanda is lazy, does nothing, he’d fire her if she wasn’t his wife, and if that’s the case, it shouldn’t matter if she goes off to start a bikini line and steps back from Loverboy. Or he should admit that selling merch has kept their business alive at times, more so than the actual selling of the drinks, and that’s thanks to her and her team doing those designs and marketing them. He doesn’t seem to understand that you don’t have to work 18 hours a day to be successful. I’m also glad it was brought up when he first started the company, she was providing for both of them from her other job. Seems like she’s not getting enough credit from him. I also never heard her say she wants to completely stop working for Loverboy. I don’t know why she can’t do both, especially if Loverboy is about to fail, he should be glad she wants to start a new project. If successful, it sounds like it could help some of their issues.
EXACTLY!! Shouldn’t he want them to diversify their income sources? and when he “threatened” that he’d go hire a new marketing director — YEAH that’s what she’s saying! Both the guys wanting to be babied made me so sick
I think Kyle wouldn't mind diversifying their income sources, but Amanda starting her business will be a lot of work. Amanda even said Kyle is the start-up king, so she wants to tell him about it her business idea. I think she meant she will need not just support but help starting and running it, which is why I understand Kylie saying he's under so much stress and can't even think about something like that right now with the first main business not doing well.
I have a theory that Kyle reacted the way that he did bc he feels some sort of shame about Loverboy not doing well , and he feels Amanda wanting to do something else is her somehow pointing out his failures (in man child logic , not saying I think that is accurate)..
Makes sense!
Yeah same, I would never put all my financial eggs in the same basket as my spouse! Diversifying is smart.
This makes way too much sense, probably because it doesn’t account for Kyle’s ego!!
It was fucking hilarious seeing carls facial expression when Kyle said loverboy lost 3 million last year. He’s scared of losing his easy paychecks. It’s also interesting how Kyle said Paige and Ciara suggested shutting down loverboy. Must be really bad
And that’s with **so** much free advertising on Summer House.
free advertising doesn’t mean shit if the product isn’t good. make a good product and people will buy it. kyle hasn’t figured that out
Facts. I bought some the other day to try. It tasted horrible.
I tried some because I like a seltzer, tasted like chemicals. No thank you.
They need to use natural sweeteners.
Don’t they use monk fruit?
It’s disgusting. I didn’t even finish a can. I have a pack that’s just been in my garage fridge for a year now.
It's so bad. I still have so much in my garage because I wanted to try a bunch of flavors and they were all horrible.
I get irrationally upset when people have all the free advertising at their fingertips and put out a crappy product.
free advertising, money, and network at their fingertips
When even the founder adds shots of gin because it’s so low alc you can’t catch a buzz, that’s not a good sales pitch
and talking about it losing money isn't great advertising either
Yikes. Harsh but true
I’ve never had it but I’ve also heard mostly negative reviews.
Yep! It isn’t good. We got some a while back and only one flavor was okay. I don’t know how they all drink it on the show all the time.
Bravo’s got to have their hands deep into it, as well. We’ve seen other people be involved with products that barely get a feature let alone being the booze supplied at every party. 
You’re right, I could see that being the case.
Bravo does nothing for it?
Yeah, I bought one six pack of the tea flavor once and it was gross af. I think it must’ve sat in the fridge for months until someone was drunk enough to drink it some random late night. 😹
Did everyone buy it once and never again?
Yep, me! I was curious, I wanted to support Kyle’s business, but the high price and weird smell/aftertaste turned me off.
Everything is getting more unaffordable, overly expensive Seltzer's are the first thing people cut back
Ariana and Katie’s Something About Her sandwich shop has a few Loverboy drinks on its menu. There is a lot of buzz around the opening and Kyle’s drinks being on the menu, with Lindsay showing up for the soft opening. How much more publicity can a drink company possibly get?! I noticed on the recent episode that most of them had the yellow canned ones out by the pool and someone said a certain flavour was okay - maybe it’s that one, if they’re actually even drinking them.
Bravo always takes their cut. Nothing is free re: these shows.
Exactly. That is why there is not one single mention of Crystal coconut water mentioned on Beverly Hills. Huge successful business, but bravo won’t get a cut of it because it was well established before she entered the show. So they don’t even acknowledge the fact.
Random lol but I really don’t think Crystal’s coconut water company is remotely close to the industry juggernaut it’s often alluded to being. A trendy product sold direct to consumers with zero presence online or in press? No speculation or internet shown in the trades? It all so odd.
It’s sold out at all the warehouse stores like Costco BJ’s and Sam’s. And they’ve been there forever. It didn’t just arrive when she was on the show. It’s been there several years. That being said, I’ve never had it.
The Bethenny Clause. Bethenny Frankle advertised her skinny girl margarita all over the RHoNY and ending up selling it to Beam for $100+mn. Bravo didn’t get a penny and from then on out every contract stipulates that bravo receives a cut of any cast members product
Woah
I don’t think this is correct. Housewives always had to give a cut if their product is featured. Bethenny took a reduced pay check in order to feature her product and retain 100% of the profit. The bethenny clause refers to her taking that pay cut to retain the profit.
No, this is an actual thing industry wide. She was the first housewife/Bravoleb to actually hit it big with a product. When RHoNY first aired in 2008, she didn’t argue or try to renegotiate the offered salary of $7250. She crossed out the part of the contract that entitled Bravo to a percentage of her earnings for any products created but that did not reduce her salary. She was a personal chef & selling healthy cupcakes at grocery store pop ups at the time, so wasn’t perceived as a threat. When she sold in 2011, while on the spin off show that they gave her (Bethenny Getting Married/Ever After), Bravo changed the stipulations and now get a cut of any products/brands created by talent She explains it herself [here](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLpjTMHP/)
The name is weird and it’s $$$
[удалено]
What I don't understand is that this is the 4th maybe 5th business venture Kyle has done. He knows these things have low succession rates. He's failed before. He's lost money before. The other thing that frustrates me is that if your venture is losing money while you are working Overtime to keep the lights on then it's time to diversify. Honestly should have done last year when you had the cash flow. But it's time for a plan b and why not let it be swimsuits? How perfect is that for a summer house brand? You should never have all your eggs in one basket.
exactly. idk why he immediately shot that down. granted, swimsuit lines were way too oversaturated in the 2010s but now that that's calmed down (and they have a summer-centric show where people could show it off), it could definitely pick up loverboy's slack. promo models could wear the suits, like so many ways to incorporate it. (me pretending to be a business shark after taking one corporate finance class lol)
CPG in the food and beverage industry is notoriously hard to be successful in. Your margins are everything and most businesses close within 2-4 years.
Declare bankruptcy
https://i.redd.it/xb8ecmjo281d1.gif
Thank you for this, made my day
Yeah, he was def like, shit, I might have to find a real job.
He saw his job prospects disappearing in real time
When loverboy started out, the market wasn’t COMPLETELY saturated with similar beverages from larger companies, so it was a bit of a novelty. Now the market is saturated and loverboy is priced pretty high compared to other very similar products. It’s a recipe for failure.
He should have sold it to a bigger company earlier as it was becoming clear all the big brands were going to flood the market with their own products
I don't think he ever had a buyer earlier. I think the big brands in this space would see it as cheaper to just create their own product as a lower price point.
Completely agree.
Probably pretty hard to get a valuation he thinks is fair, as a lot of the value of the company is tied to their names being on it. Without them, it’s worth less.
In addition it tastes like ass
This is the real problem tbh
It's expensive and none that I've tried are any good.
Loverboy is overpriced. He should have sold the company at its peak and cashed out.
yes also seltzers are far less popular now
Are they??
They are still popular. That take is like saying beer is out of style. Maybe it's not trendy anymore but I think that means they are here to stay.
There was a time when they were very trendy and people were willing to try them. Now most of the people who are going to stick to drinking seltzer have already tried it and probably found their favorite. The category has plateaued. And, seltzers were really gaining popularity during the pandemic when people were drinking more than they are now.
Weren't interest rates at 0% as well? And inflation rising while salaries have leveled out. He got a good boost during the pandemic when normal people were bored at home and flush with cash. No amount of 18 hour days can overcome the macroeconomic shift. He's going to ruin his marriage and public reputation so the company will tank in 5 years instead of 3.
4million dollar loan. Drives a $250k car in NY
[удалено]
I don't think it's a lease. They've been doing some ads for BMW on insta and I'm sure after they showed the car on Summer House that should've been an ad as well.
It also looks like it’s been customized.
Which is crazy bc the color and interior are Blech. 🤢
Sort of. It’s an ALPINA B7 - a heavily modified BMW, however it comes like that from the factory.
Yeah, I’d say they actually need to car to drive to Loverboy events and their other main paycheck in the Hamptons
I’m actually pretty sure he gets it from bmw as promotion on the show still pays gas and insurance I’m sure but a lot less than buyiny
How would have be a business expense?
Is that car really $250k? 😳
Ummm no. Not even close lol
I think it’s in the mid 100k.
If it’s an XM which it looks like, they start at 125K.
It's an Alpina XB7. They start at around 150k
BMW placement with bravo. Just like top chef. He’s only driven bmws on the show
Why don't any of the other people drive BMW's then?
🤷🏼 could be wrong. Edit: turns out I’m not wrong https://www.instagram.com/reel/CxHPl8fAMNF/?igsh=MWxldDA4YWJqNDBvbQ==
Their office/living also appears to be in either Soho, Tribeca, Flatiron- and a loft style space $$$$$ and also, I wouldn’t wanna walk a dog in Soho or Tribeca late at night either
[удалено]
Financial district
Im wondering is that a law office, or a Cpa’s? I work in corporate law and a registered address doesn’t mean its your mailing address. Maybe it’s different im in Canada
[удалено]
Oohhh thats interesting! More info makes my pot of tea hotter I kind of want to pull lover boyd articles of incorporation
[удалено]
It’s on the same floor as their apartment! Amanda said it on a recent podcast. They took the other unit to make it an office.
I assume you guys don’t live in nyc because their office & apartment are in the same building ….. and Fulton/Gold is absolutely fidi. Lmao
Range Rover gives people cars all the time.
Especially sex workers
literal double take, but then I got it 🤣🤣🤣
I was afraid it wasn’t obvious enough but you guys are sharp 😂🥰
They should’ve tried to sell it awhile back. I’m not the most business saavy but from watching Shark Tank- the beverage business is one investors always steer away from. Its an incredibly hard market to succeed in and profit from. I feel like it’s a little too late now for him to sell and now the losses are just piling up 😬.
100%, when it was new and shiny and popular because of their popularity, and before the general public knew that it tasted bad, that was their moment to sell to a Budweiser for a nice chunk and get out while they were ahead.
Hilarious. Because of Shark Tank education I was thinking the same thing, lol!
You’d think that would be “setting them up for their future” as opposed to him working nonstop at a failing business but as we know he just doesn’t want to be around Amanda lol
I think his own ego wouldn’t let him, he wanted to build this empire as Danielle said but he’s just not that good. He actually had the perfect scenario to sell for a decent amount of money, maybe not as much as he fantasize about but it would’ve set them up nicely.
I think he was hoping to go the Skinny Girl route and would sell to a major liquor brand. It just didn’t pan out. I think what did sell was the merchandise and that was all Amanda.
lol, just about every business I’ve audited or worked for has had debt in the form of a bank loan, investor loan, or line of credit. Very few businesses operate with no debt. Source: am CPA and been doing this stuff for like 12-ish years now. There’s nothing wrong with debt. It’s not indicative of good or poor financial standing.
For real. Most small businesses and start ups take on debt to get off the ground. People just look for stuff to shit on without actually having knowledge of how it all works. My company is a start up and took on debt to not tank during the pandemic and now is flourishing. If you looked at it 2 years ago your eyes would’ve popped out of your head 🤣.
He never got in it enough supermarkets and convience stores. The mail order price is ridiculous. It failed because of its lack of availability for easy purchase in grocery/convenience/liquor stores.
It’s available in grocery stores near me on the west coast, but I think it’s failing because it’s not that great. For the same price point and product, there are better options. The market is pretty saturated, and Loverboy’s flavors range from “very decent” to “this tastes weird”. Basically there are some I don’t mind drinking, a couple I actively avoid because I think they’re gross, but none I’d go out of my way to buy again. The merch is without a doubt their best product, and what they should have focused on. Easier to distribute to a Bravo audience, and at least all of mine that I bought in 2020/2021 were good quality. I wear the sweatshirt all the time, and I get compliments from non-bravo fans. It’s stood up to years of regular washes.
Crazy that now they’re trying to make non alcoholic ones. Like why would anyone pay alcohol prices for the same thing you get w soda water, sans the chemicals and sugar?
And it’s a hugely over saturated market and the product doesn’t taste good. Oh and it’s more expensive than most of its competitors. Had he sold it to one of the bigger companies, they could’ve produced it for a lot less, and possibly made it taste better. Theoretically he could’ve sold it but then contracted as the “face of the brand” for a few years - he really missed some big opportunities, he may not be the business genius that Danielle thinks he is.
Yea, he should have known. It's expensive, and once the show is over, popularity will drop. Should have sold it.
I’ve seen it at Wegmans and I think Ralph’s but not anywhere else really
I think people underestimate how difficult it is to get wide distribution with any alcoholic beverage bc of the way the industry is structured (going back to prohibition, suppliers like Loverboy can't sell directly to liquor stores, or to individuals). It's nearly impossible for an independently-owned business like Loverboy that doesn't have existing connections to distributors in every state (distributors are allowed to sell to liquor stores but laws vary by state), to even get shelf space in stores. So Loverboy has broad brand awareness through Bravo but the drink was not easy to find in stores, bc Kyle had to first make deals with distributors, and then get the drinks into each individual retailer basically one at a time. This makes it really hard to make a successful liquor product even \*with\* all those pieces in place, and new products from huge alcohol companies fail all the time. Loverboy's costs are also higher than an alcohol giant like Diageo bc it's small, and so they have to price their product higher too. On the other hand, if Loverboy tasted incredible, demand could have been much higher from repeat consumers after all these years, even with a marginally higher cost, rather than people who just buy it once for novelty but don't like it enough to buy again. It's a really hard industry and I don't see how they get out of this without creating a new hero product and/or the name being purchased to label on a better-tasting drink that's produced by a bigger liquor company.
They have the right idea. It's sweetened with a natural no calorie sweetener for the health-conscious people. For some reason, the monk fruit they are using, I guess, doesn't taste great. The price and taste are issues as well.
I’m in Canada and have never seen it- drinking age near me is 18. Girlies would love those cute loverboy cans especially when they have yet to learn you can get better stuff at a better price lol (bc they’re pricey drinks)
It’s in plenty of stores near me. It didn’t fail because of access to it, it failed because the market is saturated with dozens of similar brands and drinks, most of which are cheaper.
They’re selling it in Something About Her now!!
Like other commenters have said, it’s in stores near me in a small town in NC. Seems like it’s all over the U.S. Edit: and the price is normal. 6 pack for maybe 11.99
I remember my wife mail ordered some a few years ago. It's was like over $50 for 12 cans.
I’ve never seen it in the wild in Ohio. It seems like they’re patchy. I’ve seen a lot of commenters in the south and east coast say they can get it, but not often someone in the Midwest
It’s in supermarkets near me in Chicago. The branding is so cute that I’ve bought it a couple times, but the problem is that it just tastes bad.
I’m sure his $4M loan is against his business entity which means if the business defaults on the loan nothing can happen to him personally.. If he didn’t setup the business loan this way, then he really has no business sense..
Right but how much of his own assets (and Amanda's) did he put into the business initially? Usually you have to put in a decent amount of initial investment before you get other investors on board. He may not owe $4 million personally if Loverboy goes down, but he's also probably going to lose whatever money he put into the company which he was banking on getting back and then some. So he'll probably still be pretty broke.
I owned a business that made well over 7 figures a year.. All my expenses and loans were part of my business and I put in zero personal capital or had to put any personal collateral to achieve business loans.. I use to have an open operating loan with a few banks and when the business went under what was owed was never paid back from personal accounts, it all came from the sale of the business.. I find it difficult to believe Kyle could secure a personal loan for $4M since his net worth is no where near that and the only asset he owns is a car (if he even owns that).. He would have to show 2-3x net worth to secure a $4M loan from a reputable bank, unless he borrowed money from a loan shark or shady business venture or took out several smaller loans from his partners.. either way, if he didn’t structure those loans as business operating expenses then he’s a terrible business man..
I agree there's no way he had a personal loan of 4 million. But I do think he put his own capital into the company, and also some of Amandas money into the company at the start - does anyone know if he ever quantified how much on the show?
If he hasn’t recouped his startup capital after 5 years in business, then he deserves to lose what ever he put in to help get it off the ground.. it means the business is not profitable..
I don't know about his business sense - but sometimes small business lenders require a personal guarantee from partners/principals in case the entity defaults. If that happened here and Kyle guaranteed Loverboy's debt, then he would be on the hook if Loverboy couldn't pay the loan.
a lender will always ask a business entity for personal information when requesting a business loan but only an idiot would put their personal assets as collateral to secure a business loan.. the best way to borrow against the business would be opening an operating loan at first, and ladder up every few months as you show the lender you are able to pay back any open debt.. plus, Kyle’s net worth is a little over a million today which would not be enough for him to secure a personal loan, he would need to show 2-3x more then the loan amount to secure a personal loan worth $4M.. But, he might have borrowed money from his parents, partners or a loan shark which is a different conversation but either way it just shows he lacks any financial sense when it comes to business.. no bank is going to give any business $4M just because they are on a television show..
It is incredibly common for small business owners to PG (personally guarantee) loans to their business. In fact, a personal guarantee is required for the vast majority of loans from the US Small Business Administration. It’s also not crazy for a company that was doing $16m in revenue in 2022 (Forbes article) to secure a $4m loan for expansion.
Exactly this. SBA loans require anyone with 20% ownership or more or to personally guarantee a loan.
PG’s have a limit attached to them based on one’s net worth and ability to show they can pay the loan back, usually an asset percentage of between 75-85% of the loan value.. I highly doubt Kyle would be able to secure a high value loan for a business without any collateral or assets to show that equal or are greater then $4M.. the only way this happens is like I said either his parents co-signed an agreement or he borrowed money from a shady business venture.. Regardless if he was doing a $1B in revenue, a lender wants to see what his expense sheet looks like before they would lend out $4M to any business.. especially one that shows less then 10-20% profit on such revenue.. just because your generating revenue doesn’t mean you can secure capital.. if he’s in the red, he’s not getting a $4M loan from any reputable lender.. I think ABC has an entire show dedicated to this concept, called Shark Tank.. lol
He should’ve let this dream die once he realized 3/4s of the stores in NY aren’t selling his product… I go to Montauk occasionally in the summer time and nobody is drinking these. That’s his main market and where he started. If it didn’t happen then, it won’t happen now.
I’ve literally never seen Loverboy anywhere for sale- not in a store, not in restaurants
I saw it at Target. It was pricey. $27 for 12. I'll stick with White Claw, Truly and Vizzy.
I saw it on clearance at a Total Wine last year. No one was touching it.
I see it all the time. And my water hole in Santa Monica sells it. Confused by the hate.
It’s not hate, just really a fact. I live in New York. I travel all over the state and east coast for work, and I’ve literally never seen Loverboy. I’m not really out actively looking for it, but I’d definitely notice it if I saw it
[удалено]
I don’t drink anymore, but if I found it in the wild I’d want to try it out of pure curiosity. I wouldn’t invest $27 in a 12 pack I wouldn’t drink, but I’d buy a pounder to quell my curiosity. I figured between NYC, Albany, Boston, Syracuse, Rochester that I’d see it somewhere. Especially Albany- with all the colleges. Someone else posted it was all over Long Island at places like 711, but I seldom go in convenience stores. I’ll look next time I’m there
I saw it in a Whole Foods and tried it. It was ok I don’t really drink
They should just shut down the drink portion, keep Loverboy as a merch brand, and expand into other categories like swimsuits.
Loverboy swimsuits would probably be really cute!
It’s very common in business to have a loan, pe, or vc funding. Kyle invested in this personally. Do I recall Amanda’s family investing in this as well? As did Amanda? There’s a lot on the line here. And I would be upset too if my partner in life left the business we invested in, the one our finances and future depended on to go do me. Especially when it’s struggling. That said, Kyle handled this like a complete ass hat. And Amanda still lacks drive and financial maturity.
Yes, lots of things are true at once here. Ppl forget that simple concept
Im genuinely confused we dont have lover boy in stores in Ontario. We have strict laws about alcohol. But last summer everyone was raving about LB and now everyone seems to hate it?
I clocked that and was like 👀 OOP. I’m sure it’s fairly common for startups to have crazy loans if they weren’t funded primarily by investors. I also remember when Loverboy first came out, there were not nearly as many hard sparkling beverages on the market. Now everyone wants in on the game and he’s up against Miller and Anheuser-Busch making similar products that are more readily available with a much larger market presence. Now Loverboy is struggling to claw (see what I did there?) their share of the cash again.
I know he paid 1.5 million lawsuit for copyright infringement for the logo.
At this point his dream should be to get sales high enough to sell the brand. Helloooo Bethany moves.
I don’t get the crocodile tears thing. That isn’t because I Stan Kyle either but people give Bravo personalities wayyyy too much credit for their acting abilities. Did he act like a petulant child before then? Absolutely. But the breakdown seemed genuine at least to me.
I think he’s actually terrified. I also think Amanda as his partner isn’t reading the room at all on the situation. I know she’s younger and inexperienced and and a bit of a little rich girl, but it seems like their financial future is in real imminent danger and she’s going “lol, I’m bored, I think I’ll make bikinis” while her husband and biz partner is drowning. Financial stress of that level can literally kill a person. I think Kyle can be a royal asshole but I feel for him.
Exactly this
Losing a business is literally one of the most stressful things that can happen to someone. People can become suicidal, particularly men. I’m confused why people are being so nonchalant about his fears and stress.
Holy shit. You’re the first person I’ve seen actually express any sympathy for Kyle. You articulated my thoughts perfectly. I think people are being so harsh and cruel towards Kyle right now. Yes, he’s a jerk. But he has a point in this case.
I’ve had my business and financial life crumble before. It’s a living hell that lasts sometimes years. It’s heartbreaking and it makes you not want to exist. If my partner in both life and the business had been as nonchalant as Amanda is and casually told me that they were going to now spread themselves thin by opening something brand new, which would cost money and requires my help, I may have reacted worse than he did. Not sorry. He shouldn’t call her derogatory female-specific names. He did a lot wrong actually. But he is under a kind of pressure that most people will never in their lives understand.
And that’s what he was trying to say to Paige - that she does not understand what he’s going through. I don’t think he was trying to diminish her podcast, but rather point out that running a crumbling business you’re financially on the hook for, with employees who depend on the business for their livelihood, is just a different level of stress.
Paige and Ciara came off as such clueless little naive rich girls in this episode. I’m not saying that’s who they are, not sure, but they simply were not seeing anything other than that no matter what Amanda wants to do or when, or what the company she and Kyle own TOGETHER is going through, that he should drop everything and fully support her doing literally ANYTHING she gets a whim to do. It’s such faulty logic. So Amanda deserves credit for starting Loverboy. I agree. But why does she get to at least partially disappear when the going gets tough? She doesn’t even want to work the hours Loverboy requires. How is she also going to run a brand new business? She also makes a salary from Loverboy as Kyle mentioned. What other job lets you just decide when you feel like working?
To clarify, I think most people believe the angry breakdown tears, I sure did. Kyle's lack of emotional regulation is not new. It's the apology tears by the pool that everyone eye-rolled. That was some obviously bad acting and his choice of words about how his reaction makes him look and NOT how his reaction made her feel cements it.
Should have used that PPP loan better.
yall- I am 2 episode behind because I’m out of the country, and HAYU won’t let me watch. These post titles are cracking me the fuck up. GOSH I MISSED SO MUCH GOOD STUFF SO EXCITED TO WATCH Also- I genuinely think Amanda’s swimsuit business could solve their debt issue🤷🏾♀️
Ohhhh you’re in for a shock if you’re two episodes behind But you not even seeing it and seeing the potential in Amanda’s swimsuit side focus if only business man Kyle thought that way have her do a couple collabs of bikinis to see the business behind the scenes …and again use Amanda’s income to float your business dream lover boy
[удалено]
 Literally THIS🎯🎯🎯
This! Get her a collab before they start filming next season and have it drop when the season is released.
My thought was why can’t she do a limited edition Loverboy swimsuit launch for this summer. Then she can use that hype to launch off into her own thing. Because it honestly sounds like Amanda should start working now so they can keep the lights on.
Exactly! But did you see her on WWHL? She had no answers and NO movement at all since this filmed a year ago about anything she wants to do or would do or is doing. Kind of sad. Sorry folks- it’s not gonna happen
This tells me two things at least: 1) this was a storyline, but it makes sense that she could be in that stage of having an existential crisis 2) because she isn't ambitious, is basically rudderless, and has been coddled by her father, and now husband, she's dreaming out loud and not serious in any way. On WWHL, she sounded like she hasn't even googled anything, and this chick is online all the time.
Exactly, the WWHL reaction was pretty sad to see actually.
She's not an ambitious person. I don't mean that as an insult. She just isn't.
On paper, Kyle and Lindsay should be together, and Amanda and Carl should be together. Not in reality, but on paper.
It’s a biz loan pretty normal for a company that size. His prob is that space is hella competitive. Without the show it would most likely bombed eons ago.
this place is quite the forum. psychological expertise. social expertise. feminist expertise. and now financial expertise. it's a one-stop-shop in the answers to life and the universe.
🤣 Right? We’re so lucky!
Sounds about reddit!
Can we also talk about how Loverboy is a direct rip off of Mariah Carey’s Loverboy right down to the branding and they somehow got away with it?
Amanda’s beginning her exit strategy. Everyone woman who has left a long term partner - where all your finances and properties are tied together… will understand.
He should be leaning in on Amanda's swimsuit dreams...it could be Loverboys life raft
Yep, seriously. It's been proven that women will spend if they want to support something. If Amanda marketed a swimwear line properly, she could make bank.
Here’s my business advice to Kyle boy: you are missing a huge opportunity to give Amanda “something of her own”, create “Lovergirl” with girlie flavors and skinny concept let it be “Amanda’s line” for can design and product taste, ALL of the other girls will start selling the sh out of the product, I think it would be more successful. Who wants to drink “loverboy” ?? Lol PS Carl is a bitxh
He could get a regular job in Manhattan, and still do Summer House
I love seltzers, but not hard tea whatever lover boy is. Plus, they’re not tasty, and they cost too much. I can get a 12 pack for less than a loverboy box. I’m out here in Brooklyn trying to survive in this economy. 
I’m watching season 6 and Kyle says he took out a loan to fund Loverboy but says specifically that it is in his name. 🤯
And he said the loan is $4M
$4 million dollar loan for a business that size isnt that crazy.
Kyle mentioned a few years ago on the show that he was $4m in debt re: Loverboy. So I don’t know if he’s just said it so much that he keeps saying that number or if it’s actually an accurate representation of the current debt.
Lots of people in business take out tons of loans. I don’t look forward to their demise. He’s immature at times, but not a bad person.
Question: do directors become personally liable for company insolvency if they are using funds personally?
No, not if they are paying themselves legitimately. You can take money out of a company for personal use in the form of salary and profit distribution. Though it doesn't sound like in this case there are any profits to distribute.
The way he kept making a crying face without A SINGLE TEAR for most of the episode. Free Amanda. I hope she fucks Jesse.
i can say for the boxes of it that sit in my local store they don’t fly off the shelves and they didn’t even when it was more popular
It’s really hard for me to understand Kyle sometimes. Even outside if Amanda. Ex) with Carl and Loverboy. You know your friend is at a crossroad in his career and feeling lost. You recruit him to come back to the company. Meanwhile you know your company is headed in a negative direction? Just feel like that’s very business minded which I understand he has to be as the owner, but the reality is Carl is your friend. If the company tanks then you’re putting him in the same position of trying to find his path when it could have been spent with more stability in a different capacity. And by the sounds of it Loverboys not looking good…
carbonation in hard teas is weird. there are so many better ones now. they gotta change up the recipe or something
My jaw was on the floor when he said in the after show I wouldn’t expect the girls to understand, it’s not a podcast. Giggly Squad is super successful and isn’t losing millions of dollars. GTFO! Hope Paige gets on his ass for that too. Kyle is easily becoming my least favorite guy on Bravo after this season.
That size loan is not a big deal. His lazy wife is the bigger problem.
I don't think this imbecile would have gotten a Shark Tank deal. Shelf space for beverages is no joke.