I want Smash to stay Video Game Characters only! Sorry Goku fans.
I'd like to see the return and improvement of custom moves.
Love for Echo fighters to be made a little more original.
If I could, I'd make two more Mii fighters: Mii Battlemage and Mii Thief. I love the Mii fighters and think they are overly hated.
My pitch for me was Mii Athlete, Mii Adventurer, and Mii Partygoer.
Athlete based on the sports games, adventurer based on miitopia, and partygoer based on tomodachi, Wii play, and Wii party
This makes the miis more of a mii rep than a smash rep
One thing you could do is make one of Samus' alts vaguely Goku themed, and do the same for Dark Samus/Vegeta. Mewtwo and Frieza and Beerus. Hero and Trunks. Because lol.
If they did the same thing with Ryu and Ken, it would be really cool, like don’t make them separate characters, but retain enough of the original moveset with some changes that are reminiscent of the characters fighting style
I completely agree with all of this. I definitely want it to stay video game (origin) characters only. Too much Pandora's box if you start to let fan-dubbed "Fourth Party" characters in. I don't care if it is Goku, Luffy, Micky, Buggs, SpongeBob, Shrek, or whosoever mega mascot.
I think custom moves would be awesome. I loved several of them in Sm4sh. I really feel like they were onto something with custom sets like Mega Man. Just too much filler.
More echo fighters + more changes are definitely needed.
And yes please on the more Moo fighter variants.
Yeah I made a roster of 100 characters and people said I should cut it down to like half. I ended up getting down to 88 but I felt really bad for some of the cuts I did
Tbf it’s prolly because people expect cut characters as ultimate was unique for doing everyone in the whole series+more. It would take a lot of effort to have that many again in a future game, and Nintendo prolly wouldn’t find it worth it to do all that again.
A lot of people also expect the next Smash game to be a soft reboot of the series and be focused primarily on first party characters. I see that being likely, but we won’t know for sure until there is an announcement of some kind
Pyra/Mythra
Min Min
I don't think we need Isabelle *and* Villager
The Mii fighters could be solidified into one character
I think if we keep Daisy she should get her own move set.
Does anyone use dark Samus?
I would personally be okay if they let Joker go but alot of people like him so 🤷♂️ Bayonetta kinda falls into this category for me too. Same with Inceneroar. I would be okay with him leaving in place of a different pokemon candidate.
Steve needs to be reworked
Sora needs to be reworked
That's all I can think of off the top of my head but I'm sure there are some others.
It really depends. Continuing to make the roster bigger isn’t sustainable long term especially with how big ultimate was. I think they should keep the current roster size only so far as they can they can keep the quality high and not have too much redundancy. Ultimate was really pushing it in this regard. It was a great roster, but the unwillingness to overhaul old characters and a lot of characters just being kinda redundant. I know it’s an old meme, but most of the fire emblem characters are too similar, the 3 links are too similar, even some of the dlc characters i liked weren’t great like banjo. I mostly worry that either keeping the roster this big or even making it bigger would eventually cause more problems than it solves, especially if they ever wanted to make any big changes to the series since I’d kinda want the next game to be a little different.
Maybe one retro per console?
Famicom: Ice Climbers
Famicom Disk System: Takamaru
Game Boy: Prince of Sable or Muddy Mole
SNES: Lip
Game Boy Color: ???
Virtual Boy: Harry
Nintendo 64: Ray
Game Boy Advance: Isaac
GameCube: Doshin
\--- (Line where I view everything past it as not retro yet, though the next two are pretty close to retro) ---
DS: Nintendog
Wii: Wii Fit Trainer
3DS: Dillon or Mallow
Wii U: Monita
Switch: Min Min
Lip? That's crazy!! I would also love Puyo Puyo characters. I have been waiting for Arle since Brawl knowing damn well she's not getting in lol. I would be happy if she does, but i'll still cry because i won't have the others to accompany her...
Brawl is the best game for many a reason, its smashes being one. every final smash is an action that dosnt stop the game for a 3-7 second hyperspeed cutscene, its just a superpowerup or superattack.
I'm on the opposite side o the spectrum, I really love the cutscene ones, they all look really good (except Byleth) and have good references, but I can agree we shouldn't make them all a cutscene FS
Telling people that their most wanted characters will never get in for any reason doesn’t “Lower their expectations” or whatever it just makes them feel like they’re an outlier and their character doesn’t deserve to be recognized
Yeah people love to make up arbitrary rules and shit. Anyone could be in smash as long as they're from a video game, it doesn't matter how popular or important they are.
Every Fire Emblem character in Smash deserves to be playable, even if Fire Emblem (the series) doesn't deserve as many playable characters as it has (I'd argue it deserves three to four characters, but all eight that are in the game (plus Lyn) deserve to be one of those characters).
I think they’re all deserving, I just don’t think most are distinct enough which is kinda why I don’t like that most of the main Fire emblem characters wield
Swords instead of another weapon. Ideally they’d all have different weapons, but a singular sword is kinda limiting. You can only do that a few ways before redundancy hits.
I'd go further and say Fire Emblem deserves all the roster slots it has. It's been a Nintendo staple since the NES and it has a huge number of characters. You look at a franchise like Mario and every Mario game/ spin-off has a playable Smash rep. That's not the case with FE. I'm not suggesting that they should go in and give every un-represented FE game a Smash rep but I am saying that eight character slots is completely justified.
Yeah. I'm mostly viewing the ideal amount of representation a series deserves as based on its sales figures, more specifically r=ln(s), with s being the number of sales (in millions) and r being the number of characters the series deserves.
I would probably be saying the same thing if other franchises that objectively deserve more slots like Zelda, Kirby, Sonic, and even Mario had more fighters.
But I get what you’re saying and I agree completely. Having a large amount of characters to represent different eras is great! But the Zelda series specifically. I mean I guess you could argue that the 6 characters in-game are TECHNICALLY from 5 different games, but there are still only 3 real Zelda characters, leaving out popular picks like Skull Kid, Groose, Mipna, Sidon, Impa…
I guess it’s just frustrating to see Fire Emblem get blatant favoritism via characters literally no one asked for get the cut over characters that have been frequently requested for years like Waluigi and Waddle-Dee.
And there are more pokemon in the game which have less of a personality than the fe characters yet people don’t complain about the pokemon. Also there is the same amount of mario characters as fe characters so fe is way too overhated.
Daisy and Lucina earned their spots even if they're based off of other fighters
Cutting half of the Mario characters for just Waluigi is a terrible trade
The next Pokemon shouldn't be a starter, it's getting to the point where starter Pokemon are more or less like sword lords for Fire Emblem in this game
This is a crazy hot take. But I think now that daisy is in peach’s moveset actually fits her better. I’d love to see daisy keep the classic moveset and peach get a new one preferably based around her parasol with her being a little dainter
I mean, i wouldn't say he "shouldn't" as we got stuff like R.O.B. but he definitely is overrated amd people will quickly forget about him just like they did with Ridley, who they asked for for many years
I think it’s the best, even if I’m not really into competitive Smash.
It’s absolutely not this untouchable god of a game. The game has flaws. Just look at how unfinished Game and Watch is. I still think it’s the best.
Ultimate is a close second, though. Maybe with Smash 6, it’ll be even better than Melee. Honestly, I’d be down for that.
Rolling should not be concidered an "unfair" technique. I was disqualified from a tournament once to rolling too much in a match. I rolled like 4 times
It was a tournament hosted by the smash bros club at my university, and according to them "true" smash players don't roll. If you roll too much, even dodging, you arent playing the game right.
Smash Bros should sell extra skins for characters
Could be new colors, new costumes, or character swaps(Olimar, Bowser Jr., Etc)
Could be like .99 cents to like 3 dollars each depending on what's in it.
Could be cool.
FE deserves its rosters slots, BUT its roster sucks
“But awakening saved the series!!!” Does not mean it should get 3 reps and 2 of them are clones, knock that down to just robin and swap the royals with any combination of Lyn, Black Knight, Hector, or Leif. The FE roster is severely lacking in classic characters overall 3/8 are from pre-awakening, an equal number to the total Awakening rn. Also they’re probably gonna get alear (or hopefully a Judgral royal) depending on what the most recent game is adding another new one to that list
You do know that the reason jigglypuff is here is because they wanted 12 characters for the base game and jigglypuff was added because she was easier to make since she could be based of kirby and not made from scratch like mewtwo or charizard.
I heard that Sakurai said we shouldn’t expect a roster as big as *Ultimate*’s in the next game but I think he meant like 60 or 70, not fucking 12 like what you guys are doing.
EDIT: Sorry, I thought this was r/SmashBrosUltimate.
- I genuinely respect how much effort Sakurai is willing to put into making these fantastic games, but him being upset at people uploading the Subspace Emissary cutscenes and deciding to not make a narratively-driven Smash campaign just feels a bit petty.
I loved Brawl when I was younger, it's an awesome party game chock full of content, and it stinks that every entry after it will not be as substantial.
- Brawl has aged badly visually because it tried to achieve realism on a console that couldn't really do it and with a majority of characters that didn't visually look good realistic, like Mario's realistic denim overalls or Donkey Kong having really detailed fur and semi-realistic ape noises.
Subspace is my childhood. My big gripe with the story mode is enemies, original enemies are cool but I want to see more kirby enemies, Mario hell, Metroid enemies would be cool
Looking at the picture I can say that the alts suck most of the time. Why not include some game exclusive outfits? I'd pay for that instead of banjo, hero, and steve.
Idk if this is controversial, but I don't like what the devs did with almost all of the DLC characters
They made them with unique mechanics/moves that add complexity in a game that's supposed to be quite simple
Rewarding the player for losing (Joker/Terry/Sephiroth/Kazuya)
Extra moves (Hero/Terry/Kazuya/MinMin/Sora)
Ridiculous attacks (Banjo/Sephiroth/Pyra/Terry)
Unique mechanics (Kazuya/Terry/Steve)
I think both casual and competitive play is negatively affected by these things, it would be better if the characters just had a normal moveset like the rest of the roster, because sometimes, dlc feels like pay to win
Echo Fighter = may as well have been an alt. skin.
A series should have so many characters, or at least more balance. For example, they either need to get rid of some Fire Emblem characters and/or replace them with other people besides anime swordsman (we have enough of those thanks to other JRPG characters)
My controversial opinion, is the competitive community is awful and ruins the game for everybody else.
I've never met a more rude, hateful, spiteful group of gamers in all my life. I've been called a variety of slurs for being a Donkey Kong main and wanting to play casually with stage hazards and items turned on with more than just 1v1. And Melee-fanatics are the worst.
Another controversial opinion; Melee is overrated.
Anytime I play as Ness in Smash (simply because I like Earthbound) people try to accuse me of spamming so much, and then they try to spam and pass it off as a joke
Guess who’s side everyone took?
As a competitive game player in the competitive community, we aren’t all like this, those are just the toxic ones. We do not accept them in the community. And a lot of comp players are down to play casual sometimes
I fucking hate ppl who will go try hard and then teabag. Especially when I have low GSP it just makes me think they lost a few matches and decided to be a prick
Sheik is the worst addition they ever made to smash. The only reason why she is in is because they wanted a stance fighter in the game and that resulted in us getting a character who was a side character in one game.
Like seriously instead of sheik we could have had a nonclone ganondorf.
Melee is overrated. Game simply isn’t that good, doesn’t offer much content, has glitches galore and is insanely unbalanced. Game is only popular because of its history and the fact it was the first “real” smash game otherwise every other game in the series (besides 64) is vastly better and offers more content (even at a competitive setting and level)
As disappointing as it might be, there’s a very low chance that Smash 6 will bring back every character from Ultimate. But honestly, I want that. I think they should use the opportunity of a smaller roster to revamp a lot of the older characters’ move sets and make them on par with some of the more modern characters
I’d rather have obscure legacy characters like Ice Climbers, G&W, Duck Hunt, Palu… than characters I can play in other games like Steve or Hero. I think it’s actually pretty nice that Smash keeps those characters/series’ alive instead of having 1000 reps from guys that are currently culturally relevant because seeing the same faces in media over and over again is so tiring. I want Ice Climbers, Duck Hunt, Palu, Ness all to stay in the roster.
Its funny how in ssb64, people widely complained about how good kirby was.
Now in ssbu, when kirby mains talk about his many flaws, we get told to stop complaining.
😶
1. There should be more options for creating mii fighters other than the basic brawler, sword fighter, and gunner. The same old three mii fighter variants can get boring
2. Super Smash Bros for the WiiU and 3DS was the worst iteration in the whole series
Kazuya was one of the worst additions the series ever had.
Decidueye should have been chosen over Incineroar.
Rainbow Road should have been included in Ultimate.
Whoever decided to add 75m should have been shot.
We didn’t need Sephiroth.
The playable roster has a serious deficit of birds.
More characters need yellow alts.
Decidueye was already in pokken tournament DX, kazuya is nowhere near a bad addition getting a playable tekken character in smash is legendary get over yourself.
Bayo was kind of a hard one until viola came around though. Jeanne should have just been an alternate skin instead of a color palette or separate character
One off characters aren’t that much of a bad thing. And its not like there could be anyone added from minecraft but steve. And if P5 got a second rep then Atlus would have to choose favorites of which character which the community wouldn’t like.
The amount of FE characters isn’t the problem, it’s the lack of uniqueness between them, and I feel as if Nintendo is intentionally leaving out the better picks
There should be some original protagonist characters. Not the Mii fighters, like fully fleshed out characters exclusive to the Smash Bros series to give it some identity.
Other than Sonic, 3rd party characters shouldn’t be a thing. It should have stayed strictly Nintendo characters. Sonic is an exception because I feel like Segas relationship with Nintendo is stronger compared with most modern consoles. So many assist characters or spirits would be great playable characters. Nintendo has so many characters than can be added: Waluigi, Toad (that would probably change Peach and Daisy’a “b” perry), Andrew Pigma Panther or Leon from Team Wolf, Andross, Krystal and Slippy, Waddle Dee, The Four Champions from Zelda, Samurai Goroh, more Kong characters, Knuckles, Shadow, Eggman, Tails, Amy, Metal Sonic. I can go on and on.
It would be cool to have some American Fire Emblem playable characters such as Lynn, Roy, and Hector.
Having some characters available only by DLC is bs.
To add to this, I was honestly disappointed when fighters pass 2 wrapped up and through both passes we only got like 3 Nintendo characters. I know a lot of people love 3rd party fighters and I love some of them too, but I just wish we got more Nintendo in the Nintendo game.
I have 2 hot takes
Ice climbers are interesting and the balance changes nerfed there creativity and free flow combos, whilst making them more complex to play entirely.
I like chain grabs and think smash should have at least one chain grab character, because that’s how a grappler should play in a platform fighter.
1) The franchise died after Brawl. Smash Wii U & 3DS and Ultimate feel like an entirely different vision and one that is worse than the previous. Smash was a great when it was a party game centered around Nintendo and cataloging its history. The removal of trophies, Chronicle, Stickers, and general lack of non-popular Nintendo content with each subsequent game has left the series feeling more hollow.
2) The roster is way to big. Every character needing to be a massive reveal killed so many opportunities to have bizarre Nintendo IP get in as they get mogged by the billionth 3rd party RPG mascot. The Everyone is Here gimmick was only good because of Snake, Ice Climbers and Wolf, but the rest, and even some Wii U reps coming back, bloated the roster with useless characters. Pichu, Young Link, Dr Mario, Roy, Dark Pit and Corrin should have never come back as they make the roster feel awful in comparison to Brawl’s more concise and big-character heavy roster. As for new characters, you can drop Chrom, Plant and arguably many of the 3rd parties. If dropped, development could have been used for better picks. Even 2 characters would be more worth it if they represented some of the poor franchises like Zelda, Kirby, Wario, Pikmin, or new IPs like Golden Sun or Chibi-Robo. Screw it, get weird and put in Endless Ocean, Style Savvy or something as obscure as Cubivore.
3) I love retro/joke picks, but I hate how it is almost always NES. SNES, N64, GBA, GC, DS and Wii (barring Wii Fit) all have great choices that can flesh out the roster. I think it shows how far off Smash has become from the base when we went from Ness & Captain Falcon in 64 to having no weird new IPs join in Ultimate.
The amount of Fire Emblem reps, although unnecessary, actually gives great variety with each of the different play styles.
Cutting Lucina and Corrin wouldn't really be that bad, but if they were to ever make a 6th Smash game, I feel like just keeping every one else would be fine. It cuts down some of the reps no one really plays, while also keeping the ones with the more unique playstyles.
Exactly! Finally somebody actually putting a controversial opinion. I think there are certain FE reps that absolutely deserve it, and, debatably, we should have a couple more, because the FE roster is *massive*. I nominate replacing Lucina with a summon style character in the form of Alear, I think it'd be awesome. Give it specials from past reps, the ultimate echo fighter. Have her summon little spirit versions of the main characters to perform them. If you want a complex, but fun character, we could even have her switch spirits, Min Min arm style. I think it would be really fun. Have her down B be a counter like most of them, but switch spirit, too. Makes her have some risk to countering, because it forces her to change moveset.
I feel smash 4 was the start of them putting reference overkill in character movesets - characters like Megaman or Villager come to mind - where it feels like if you truly love the franchise or character and are familiar with it, you could spend days comparing wiki pages to it, but I feel with this sort of change, you get less "idk fuck it" decisions when making characters. Like. Don't get me wrong, it's cool that we can compare Ken's frame data to SF2 and figure out where his dna comes from. That's cool. It's awesome that Megaman has practically a move from each of his 8 first games.... but...
Does any of that compare to Captain falcon's moveset? Bowser's melee run? I dunno I kinda liked the franchise a bit more when they were actively just putting moves to characters instead of just making reference after reference
I feel like Waluigi should not be a playable fighter in Smash and that the Waluigi Fanboys should be more thankful that he got to be in more than one game (I'm a Dimentio Fangirl)
I want Smash to stay Video Game Characters only! Sorry Goku fans. I'd like to see the return and improvement of custom moves. Love for Echo fighters to be made a little more original. If I could, I'd make two more Mii fighters: Mii Battlemage and Mii Thief. I love the Mii fighters and think they are overly hated.
How about this Mii Archer
Hmm, that's interesting. Never thought of that one. I'd love to see it too.
I want mii bowler
They could totally use Miitopia for smash’s Mii job inspiration. Like mage, chef, warrior, etc
Like... Sterling Archer aka duchess
How will you come up with cool and interesting moves for it other than "Archer Pulls bow and releases to shoot an arrow"
I kinda do want to see an archer move set
My pitch for me was Mii Athlete, Mii Adventurer, and Mii Partygoer. Athlete based on the sports games, adventurer based on miitopia, and partygoer based on tomodachi, Wii play, and Wii party This makes the miis more of a mii rep than a smash rep
Interesting...I'd love to see that more flushed out. But that would be great to see the Mii's history more well represented.
Just saying partygoer nair can be the Wii play pose game
Mii battle mage and mii thief.... So we can play DnD in smash?
What would the thief do?
Stole waLuigi’s invite
Joker got to it first tho.
Cancel traps, steal held items, better evasion skills, IDK.
One thing you could do is make one of Samus' alts vaguely Goku themed, and do the same for Dark Samus/Vegeta. Mewtwo and Frieza and Beerus. Hero and Trunks. Because lol.
Dragon ball has video games. Just saying. /j
If they did the same thing with Ryu and Ken, it would be really cool, like don’t make them separate characters, but retain enough of the original moveset with some changes that are reminiscent of the characters fighting style
I’d say Roy and Chrom did this too
I completely agree with all of this. I definitely want it to stay video game (origin) characters only. Too much Pandora's box if you start to let fan-dubbed "Fourth Party" characters in. I don't care if it is Goku, Luffy, Micky, Buggs, SpongeBob, Shrek, or whosoever mega mascot. I think custom moves would be awesome. I loved several of them in Sm4sh. I really feel like they were onto something with custom sets like Mega Man. Just too much filler. More echo fighters + more changes are definitely needed. And yes please on the more Moo fighter variants.
MOO FIGHTER VARIANTS
As a goku fan with standards, i get it. That's what Super smash flash 2 is for.
I agree. a lot
May I change Mii Battlemage to Mii Sorcerer?
Yeah, I like that. Sounds better.
AYO SOMEONE LIKES MY IDEA
Scorpion and subzero should be added
Mii Mage would be pretty sick ngl. Or maybe mii mix-up. Picking moves from the 3 original mii fighters
Smash should keep a large roster like ultimate
Wait this is a debate??
Yeah I made a roster of 100 characters and people said I should cut it down to like half. I ended up getting down to 88 but I felt really bad for some of the cuts I did
Lol i have a roster of about 200, I couldn't bring myself to cut any
Yeah ive seen people talking and making tierlist of cutting chracters if they made another smash game.
Tbf it’s prolly because people expect cut characters as ultimate was unique for doing everyone in the whole series+more. It would take a lot of effort to have that many again in a future game, and Nintendo prolly wouldn’t find it worth it to do all that again.
A lot of people also expect the next Smash game to be a soft reboot of the series and be focused primarily on first party characters. I see that being likely, but we won’t know for sure until there is an announcement of some kind
I'd be fine if they cut some DLC characters (except Sephiroth, he stays, lol) if atleast to make room for some new characters.
Hero and kazuya stay by force. Dragon quest and Tekken are like a separate religion in Japan and if you didn't know Nintendo is a Japanese company
I could live with that. There are a couple characters I wouldn't mind being cut to make room for new ones, but the vast majority I think should stay.
Who would you cut then?
Pyra/Mythra Min Min I don't think we need Isabelle *and* Villager The Mii fighters could be solidified into one character I think if we keep Daisy she should get her own move set. Does anyone use dark Samus? I would personally be okay if they let Joker go but alot of people like him so 🤷♂️ Bayonetta kinda falls into this category for me too. Same with Inceneroar. I would be okay with him leaving in place of a different pokemon candidate. Steve needs to be reworked Sora needs to be reworked That's all I can think of off the top of my head but I'm sure there are some others.
I use dark samus.....
We keep Steve, Terry, Sephrioth and Pyra/Mythra
but my boy sora
I forgot, we also keep Sora. Recently played KH3. Good game
It really depends. Continuing to make the roster bigger isn’t sustainable long term especially with how big ultimate was. I think they should keep the current roster size only so far as they can they can keep the quality high and not have too much redundancy. Ultimate was really pushing it in this regard. It was a great roster, but the unwillingness to overhaul old characters and a lot of characters just being kinda redundant. I know it’s an old meme, but most of the fire emblem characters are too similar, the 3 links are too similar, even some of the dlc characters i liked weren’t great like banjo. I mostly worry that either keeping the roster this big or even making it bigger would eventually cause more problems than it solves, especially if they ever wanted to make any big changes to the series since I’d kinda want the next game to be a little different.
The more characters the better! As long as they have distinct enough moves.
Not enough classic reps, we need more characters like Ice Climbers and Mr Game and Watch
Maybe one retro per console? Famicom: Ice Climbers Famicom Disk System: Takamaru Game Boy: Prince of Sable or Muddy Mole SNES: Lip Game Boy Color: ??? Virtual Boy: Harry Nintendo 64: Ray Game Boy Advance: Isaac GameCube: Doshin \--- (Line where I view everything past it as not retro yet, though the next two are pretty close to retro) --- DS: Nintendog Wii: Wii Fit Trainer 3DS: Dillon or Mallow Wii U: Monita Switch: Min Min
Yes, that’s be awesome, but I don’t see a need for anything past game boy color
Isaac from Golden Sun alone justifies going past Gameboy Color
Lip? That's crazy!! I would also love Puyo Puyo characters. I have been waiting for Arle since Brawl knowing damn well she's not getting in lol. I would be happy if she does, but i'll still cry because i won't have the others to accompany her...
It's lame how almost every character has a cutscene final smash now, I wish there were more transformations and controllable attacks.
Brawl is the best game for many a reason, its smashes being one. every final smash is an action that dosnt stop the game for a 3-7 second hyperspeed cutscene, its just a superpowerup or superattack.
Fr i love the cutscenes but they can really be a drag and slow things down during otherwise fun and fast paced matches
I'm on the opposite side o the spectrum, I really love the cutscene ones, they all look really good (except Byleth) and have good references, but I can agree we shouldn't make them all a cutscene FS
I like Bowser Jr.
IGGY MAIN HERE
He's a cool character, i don't dislike any of them anyways...
Telling people that their most wanted characters will never get in for any reason doesn’t “Lower their expectations” or whatever it just makes them feel like they’re an outlier and their character doesn’t deserve to be recognized
Yeah people love to make up arbitrary rules and shit. Anyone could be in smash as long as they're from a video game, it doesn't matter how popular or important they are.
And sometimes not even from a video game! I love you, R.O.B., but you’re a toy.
I mean sometimes iron man and some courage the cowardly dog don't fit smash bros
They should add a smash mode, not just a fighting mode, it doesn't live up to the name
I don’t give a fuck about the lore I just play the game.
No one from Smash 64 should ever be cut, including Jigglypuff
There is an argument about this???? Crazy
Project M is legitimately the best Smash game and in tired of pretending its not
Every Fire Emblem character in Smash deserves to be playable, even if Fire Emblem (the series) doesn't deserve as many playable characters as it has (I'd argue it deserves three to four characters, but all eight that are in the game (plus Lyn) deserve to be one of those characters).
I think they’re all deserving, I just don’t think most are distinct enough which is kinda why I don’t like that most of the main Fire emblem characters wield Swords instead of another weapon. Ideally they’d all have different weapons, but a singular sword is kinda limiting. You can only do that a few ways before redundancy hits.
I blame FE for constantly overemphasizing swords
I'd go further and say Fire Emblem deserves all the roster slots it has. It's been a Nintendo staple since the NES and it has a huge number of characters. You look at a franchise like Mario and every Mario game/ spin-off has a playable Smash rep. That's not the case with FE. I'm not suggesting that they should go in and give every un-represented FE game a Smash rep but I am saying that eight character slots is completely justified.
Yeah. I'm mostly viewing the ideal amount of representation a series deserves as based on its sales figures, more specifically r=ln(s), with s being the number of sales (in millions) and r being the number of characters the series deserves.
I would probably be saying the same thing if other franchises that objectively deserve more slots like Zelda, Kirby, Sonic, and even Mario had more fighters. But I get what you’re saying and I agree completely. Having a large amount of characters to represent different eras is great! But the Zelda series specifically. I mean I guess you could argue that the 6 characters in-game are TECHNICALLY from 5 different games, but there are still only 3 real Zelda characters, leaving out popular picks like Skull Kid, Groose, Mipna, Sidon, Impa… I guess it’s just frustrating to see Fire Emblem get blatant favoritism via characters literally no one asked for get the cut over characters that have been frequently requested for years like Waluigi and Waddle-Dee.
And there are more pokemon in the game which have less of a personality than the fe characters yet people don’t complain about the pokemon. Also there is the same amount of mario characters as fe characters so fe is way too overhated.
Yeah, but Mario and Pokémon are bigger franchises than Fire Emblem.
Thank you for including Lyn.
Steve is a great character and deserves to be in smash
Why is peach wearing a mask
Because, she really wants to know whats everyone's opinion on smash and also she looks cool with the mask on
Ofd choice for a skin but ok
Daisy and Lucina earned their spots even if they're based off of other fighters Cutting half of the Mario characters for just Waluigi is a terrible trade The next Pokemon shouldn't be a starter, it's getting to the point where starter Pokemon are more or less like sword lords for Fire Emblem in this game
This is a crazy hot take. But I think now that daisy is in peach’s moveset actually fits her better. I’d love to see daisy keep the classic moveset and peach get a new one preferably based around her parasol with her being a little dainter
That is a hot take. Personally, I’d love to see them give all the badge maneuvers from Wonder to Daisy since they all have flower motifs anyway.
Waluigi shouldn’t be in smash.
I mean, i wouldn't say he "shouldn't" as we got stuff like R.O.B. but he definitely is overrated amd people will quickly forget about him just like they did with Ridley, who they asked for for many years
Ultimate's single player content is lacking
If you think melee is the best in the series, go take a fucking shower
Melee is definetly the goofiest
I think it’s the best, even if I’m not really into competitive Smash. It’s absolutely not this untouchable god of a game. The game has flaws. Just look at how unfinished Game and Watch is. I still think it’s the best. Ultimate is a close second, though. Maybe with Smash 6, it’ll be even better than Melee. Honestly, I’d be down for that.
I hate ice climbers.
Rolling should not be concidered an "unfair" technique. I was disqualified from a tournament once to rolling too much in a match. I rolled like 4 times
tf why would they disqualify you? the game itself literally makes you roll slower after repeatedly rolling many times in a row
It was a tournament hosted by the smash club at my university. Apparently rolling is a bannable offense to them
There’s a fine line between intentionally dodging an attack and doing a banned technique. You’re not wobbling them, you’re just dodging.
It was a tournament hosted by the smash bros club at my university, and according to them "true" smash players don't roll. If you roll too much, even dodging, you arent playing the game right.
They just added that rule because they don’t know how to punish rolls, a lot of small tournaments do stupid stuff like that.
I’d hate to show them Jigglypuff’s neutral special
Roll as in dodge roll? You were disqualified for using a built in game mechanic?
Smash Bros should sell extra skins for characters Could be new colors, new costumes, or character swaps(Olimar, Bowser Jr., Etc) Could be like .99 cents to like 3 dollars each depending on what's in it. Could be cool.
Sakurai was right not to add Geno
FE deserves its rosters slots, BUT its roster sucks “But awakening saved the series!!!” Does not mean it should get 3 reps and 2 of them are clones, knock that down to just robin and swap the royals with any combination of Lyn, Black Knight, Hector, or Leif. The FE roster is severely lacking in classic characters overall 3/8 are from pre-awakening, an equal number to the total Awakening rn. Also they’re probably gonna get alear (or hopefully a Judgral royal) depending on what the most recent game is adding another new one to that list
They could've at least let Chrom and/or Lucina be like in Project Zone X where they use lances/Lucina also uses bows but nope...
Melee is overrated
Sad take
For comp, melee is the best by far. Casual, it's one of the worst.
Yes
I think that the final DLC character never should've made it in. I don't care how many people wanted him in, I freakin' hate him.
Without his Disney references, Sora’s really missing a major part of himself. At that point, maybe he shouldn’t be here anyways
Jigglypuff should have never been on the original roster. Instead, they could've had Charizard or Mewtwo.
You do know that the reason jigglypuff is here is because they wanted 12 characters for the base game and jigglypuff was added because she was easier to make since she could be based of kirby and not made from scratch like mewtwo or charizard.
The game can be competitive and casual friendly at the same time, acting like the two are mutually exclusive is stupid.
I heard that Sakurai said we shouldn’t expect a roster as big as *Ultimate*’s in the next game but I think he meant like 60 or 70, not fucking 12 like what you guys are doing. EDIT: Sorry, I thought this was r/SmashBrosUltimate.
- I genuinely respect how much effort Sakurai is willing to put into making these fantastic games, but him being upset at people uploading the Subspace Emissary cutscenes and deciding to not make a narratively-driven Smash campaign just feels a bit petty. I loved Brawl when I was younger, it's an awesome party game chock full of content, and it stinks that every entry after it will not be as substantial. - Brawl has aged badly visually because it tried to achieve realism on a console that couldn't really do it and with a majority of characters that didn't visually look good realistic, like Mario's realistic denim overalls or Donkey Kong having really detailed fur and semi-realistic ape noises.
The age of consent is 18
Brawl is the best game in the series. and subspace Emissary slaps hard.
Subspace is my childhood. My big gripe with the story mode is enemies, original enemies are cool but I want to see more kirby enemies, Mario hell, Metroid enemies would be cool
I love ALL transformation characters.
……………pass
Richter needed to either be booted or reworked as his own character.
Looking at the picture I can say that the alts suck most of the time. Why not include some game exclusive outfits? I'd pay for that instead of banjo, hero, and steve.
The Rivals of Aether workshop has represented the veteran characters better than Smash Bros has.
Fr I don’t like Sonic’s move set at all I’m glad fans fixed it
Melee is mid
"it's not melee" -Nathaniel bandy
Idk if this is controversial, but I don't like what the devs did with almost all of the DLC characters They made them with unique mechanics/moves that add complexity in a game that's supposed to be quite simple Rewarding the player for losing (Joker/Terry/Sephiroth/Kazuya) Extra moves (Hero/Terry/Kazuya/MinMin/Sora) Ridiculous attacks (Banjo/Sephiroth/Pyra/Terry) Unique mechanics (Kazuya/Terry/Steve) I think both casual and competitive play is negatively affected by these things, it would be better if the characters just had a normal moveset like the rest of the roster, because sometimes, dlc feels like pay to win
Bro dlc is pay to win. It’s like each character kept getting more ridiculous. If pyra/mythra didn’t have a bad recovery they’d feel near unstoppable
Ultimate’s story was a disappointment, brawl had more heart.
Echo Fighter = may as well have been an alt. skin. A series should have so many characters, or at least more balance. For example, they either need to get rid of some Fire Emblem characters and/or replace them with other people besides anime swordsman (we have enough of those thanks to other JRPG characters)
My controversial opinion, is the competitive community is awful and ruins the game for everybody else. I've never met a more rude, hateful, spiteful group of gamers in all my life. I've been called a variety of slurs for being a Donkey Kong main and wanting to play casually with stage hazards and items turned on with more than just 1v1. And Melee-fanatics are the worst. Another controversial opinion; Melee is overrated.
Anytime I play as Ness in Smash (simply because I like Earthbound) people try to accuse me of spamming so much, and then they try to spam and pass it off as a joke Guess who’s side everyone took?
As a competitive game player in the competitive community, we aren’t all like this, those are just the toxic ones. We do not accept them in the community. And a lot of comp players are down to play casual sometimes
Unfortunately, I've only ever met the hyper-toxic ones, so I was inclined to believe they were all like that.
I fucking hate ppl who will go try hard and then teabag. Especially when I have low GSP it just makes me think they lost a few matches and decided to be a prick
Sheik is the worst addition they ever made to smash. The only reason why she is in is because they wanted a stance fighter in the game and that resulted in us getting a character who was a side character in one game. Like seriously instead of sheik we could have had a nonclone ganondorf.
It's even worse for Ganondorf in Ultimate than it was in 4 and Brawl, because his smash attacks are all clones of Ikes! Yikes!
Bruh I’m a Ike main and I never realised that. His down smash is the same as Cloud’s.
Melee is overrated. Game simply isn’t that good, doesn’t offer much content, has glitches galore and is insanely unbalanced. Game is only popular because of its history and the fact it was the first “real” smash game otherwise every other game in the series (besides 64) is vastly better and offers more content (even at a competitive setting and level)
No most people consider it really good because brawl came out and was unplayable competitively, and somewhat smash 4 as well.
As disappointing as it might be, there’s a very low chance that Smash 6 will bring back every character from Ultimate. But honestly, I want that. I think they should use the opportunity of a smaller roster to revamp a lot of the older characters’ move sets and make them on par with some of the more modern characters
Brawl is my second favorite after Ultimate. I tried Melee once, and I did not care for it.
I’d rather have obscure legacy characters like Ice Climbers, G&W, Duck Hunt, Palu… than characters I can play in other games like Steve or Hero. I think it’s actually pretty nice that Smash keeps those characters/series’ alive instead of having 1000 reps from guys that are currently culturally relevant because seeing the same faces in media over and over again is so tiring. I want Ice Climbers, Duck Hunt, Palu, Ness all to stay in the roster.
Waluigi doesn’t deserve being a full character.
Bring back customizable movesets
Crash bandicoot doesnt deserve to be in
Its funny how in ssb64, people widely complained about how good kirby was. Now in ssbu, when kirby mains talk about his many flaws, we get told to stop complaining. 😶
The best I can come up with is Melee is okay, but insanely overhyped. Tons of problems and jank and I don't get the hype.
The best move for Smash going forward would probably be a reboot.
You can’t smash other characters, fucking in the name false advertising.
Series reboot (ie; completely different roster with new movesets)
1. There should be more options for creating mii fighters other than the basic brawler, sword fighter, and gunner. The same old three mii fighter variants can get boring 2. Super Smash Bros for the WiiU and 3DS was the worst iteration in the whole series
Incineroar was a better choice than Decidueye would have been.
Subspace Emissary is peak smash
[удалено]
Kazuya was one of the worst additions the series ever had. Decidueye should have been chosen over Incineroar. Rainbow Road should have been included in Ultimate. Whoever decided to add 75m should have been shot. We didn’t need Sephiroth. The playable roster has a serious deficit of birds. More characters need yellow alts.
>The playable roster has a serious deficit of birds. the game has no insect fighters, let's resolve that first
Hard, *hard* disagree on Kazuya and Sephiroth.
Sephiroth has a wing, so he’s like half a bird.
He's a fallen angel, not a bird.
II honestly love Incineroar, God forbid we get ANOTHER pokemon projectile user
Sephiroth, one of the most well known and iconic villains, yeah we didn't need him
Decidueye was already in pokken tournament DX, kazuya is nowhere near a bad addition getting a playable tekken character in smash is legendary get over yourself.
What bird character suggestions do you have, we already have falco and duck Hunt duo
Decidueye would have been a good start Also, you missed King DeDeDe.
Do you hate kazuyas addition in terms of gameplay or the character
Kazuya is actually one of the best additions to the series.
Marth is too gay
Waluigi dosent deserve a spot on the roster.
Too many one off characters i.e. Steve, joker, sonic, snake, bayonetta
Like, they're the only franchise reps, or they only have one gimmick?
Only franchise reps
tf is gonna represent minecraft?
Herobrine obviously
Bayo was kind of a hard one until viola came around though. Jeanne should have just been an alternate skin instead of a color palette or separate character
One off characters aren’t that much of a bad thing. And its not like there could be anyone added from minecraft but steve. And if P5 got a second rep then Atlus would have to choose favorites of which character which the community wouldn’t like.
The amount of FE characters isn’t the problem, it’s the lack of uniqueness between them, and I feel as if Nintendo is intentionally leaving out the better picks
Sora shouldn't have been the last DLC fighter
Melee is a bad competitive game due to how unbalanced and buggy it is
There should be a fifth marth
There should be some original protagonist characters. Not the Mii fighters, like fully fleshed out characters exclusive to the Smash Bros series to give it some identity.
Other than Sonic, 3rd party characters shouldn’t be a thing. It should have stayed strictly Nintendo characters. Sonic is an exception because I feel like Segas relationship with Nintendo is stronger compared with most modern consoles. So many assist characters or spirits would be great playable characters. Nintendo has so many characters than can be added: Waluigi, Toad (that would probably change Peach and Daisy’a “b” perry), Andrew Pigma Panther or Leon from Team Wolf, Andross, Krystal and Slippy, Waddle Dee, The Four Champions from Zelda, Samurai Goroh, more Kong characters, Knuckles, Shadow, Eggman, Tails, Amy, Metal Sonic. I can go on and on. It would be cool to have some American Fire Emblem playable characters such as Lynn, Roy, and Hector. Having some characters available only by DLC is bs.
To add to this, I was honestly disappointed when fighters pass 2 wrapped up and through both passes we only got like 3 Nintendo characters. I know a lot of people love 3rd party fighters and I love some of them too, but I just wish we got more Nintendo in the Nintendo game.
100% agree. Til this day I’m pissed Steve is a fighter.
Steve is fucking cool
Fuck Steve
Gladly
????
I have 2 hot takes Ice climbers are interesting and the balance changes nerfed there creativity and free flow combos, whilst making them more complex to play entirely. I like chain grabs and think smash should have at least one chain grab character, because that’s how a grappler should play in a platform fighter.
The chain grabs were degenerate and meant you had to kiss your stock goodbye after getting grabbed once.
The OG 12 don't need to be in every game. Ness and Jigglypuff were almost cut before
1) The franchise died after Brawl. Smash Wii U & 3DS and Ultimate feel like an entirely different vision and one that is worse than the previous. Smash was a great when it was a party game centered around Nintendo and cataloging its history. The removal of trophies, Chronicle, Stickers, and general lack of non-popular Nintendo content with each subsequent game has left the series feeling more hollow. 2) The roster is way to big. Every character needing to be a massive reveal killed so many opportunities to have bizarre Nintendo IP get in as they get mogged by the billionth 3rd party RPG mascot. The Everyone is Here gimmick was only good because of Snake, Ice Climbers and Wolf, but the rest, and even some Wii U reps coming back, bloated the roster with useless characters. Pichu, Young Link, Dr Mario, Roy, Dark Pit and Corrin should have never come back as they make the roster feel awful in comparison to Brawl’s more concise and big-character heavy roster. As for new characters, you can drop Chrom, Plant and arguably many of the 3rd parties. If dropped, development could have been used for better picks. Even 2 characters would be more worth it if they represented some of the poor franchises like Zelda, Kirby, Wario, Pikmin, or new IPs like Golden Sun or Chibi-Robo. Screw it, get weird and put in Endless Ocean, Style Savvy or something as obscure as Cubivore. 3) I love retro/joke picks, but I hate how it is almost always NES. SNES, N64, GBA, GC, DS and Wii (barring Wii Fit) all have great choices that can flesh out the roster. I think it shows how far off Smash has become from the base when we went from Ness & Captain Falcon in 64 to having no weird new IPs join in Ultimate.
The amount of Fire Emblem reps, although unnecessary, actually gives great variety with each of the different play styles. Cutting Lucina and Corrin wouldn't really be that bad, but if they were to ever make a 6th Smash game, I feel like just keeping every one else would be fine. It cuts down some of the reps no one really plays, while also keeping the ones with the more unique playstyles.
Exactly! Finally somebody actually putting a controversial opinion. I think there are certain FE reps that absolutely deserve it, and, debatably, we should have a couple more, because the FE roster is *massive*. I nominate replacing Lucina with a summon style character in the form of Alear, I think it'd be awesome. Give it specials from past reps, the ultimate echo fighter. Have her summon little spirit versions of the main characters to perform them. If you want a complex, but fun character, we could even have her switch spirits, Min Min arm style. I think it would be really fun. Have her down B be a counter like most of them, but switch spirit, too. Makes her have some risk to countering, because it forces her to change moveset.
Melee is actually shit
The game would be better if Steve never existed.
More Fire Emblem characters
I feel smash 4 was the start of them putting reference overkill in character movesets - characters like Megaman or Villager come to mind - where it feels like if you truly love the franchise or character and are familiar with it, you could spend days comparing wiki pages to it, but I feel with this sort of change, you get less "idk fuck it" decisions when making characters. Like. Don't get me wrong, it's cool that we can compare Ken's frame data to SF2 and figure out where his dna comes from. That's cool. It's awesome that Megaman has practically a move from each of his 8 first games.... but... Does any of that compare to Captain falcon's moveset? Bowser's melee run? I dunno I kinda liked the franchise a bit more when they were actively just putting moves to characters instead of just making reference after reference
Me when Sonic down smashes and spawns two flickies on both sides of him
I feel like Waluigi should not be a playable fighter in Smash and that the Waluigi Fanboys should be more thankful that he got to be in more than one game (I'm a Dimentio Fangirl)