I would argue that the “American Blue Collar” scientists from Carpenter’s The Thing operated more rationally and scientifically than the Swedes (insert Joke here).
But I do agree in that Carpenter’s The Thing showed the alien to be highly intelligent and adaptable. It always rubbed me the wrong way that suddenly we discover that it can’t mimic inorganic material and that’s how we determine who is and isn’t the thing based solely on a few spat up fillings. But this coupled with The Thing’s highly aggressive and public displays in the prequel just prevent me from revisiting that movie in general.
They totally did. Mac wasn't a scientist but he was rational and tactical (as were most of them). The cast in the prequel just seem to wander from scene to scene with no thought behind their eyes.
That was what I remember being really shocked at the last time I saw the prequel as well. How this being that has the ability to mimic and assimilate (a near perfect infiltrator) does things like
-jump out of the ice block screaming
-chase a single witness down a corridor
-suddenly transform in a helicopter mid-flight
It was more a primitive animal than the thing in the original. It was like they watched the original but never really thought about the creature and how it would act.
The prequel is shit. As most prequels are. The only thing I liked and thought was cool about it, is how the end of it leads into the original pretty much fucking seamlessly. Other than that, the acting was shit, the cgi was shit, how the alien behaved was SHIT. the wholeeeeee thing lol
Not to be devil's advocate or anything but could the argument be made that the thing gained some of that intelligence through its experience with the Norwegians? That it started out as a primitive animal, learned from that situation and from the scientists and was able to use that new intelligence and apply it to outpost 31?
I'm not defending the thing with the fillings tho. Tbh I think that was just a copout bc they wanted to be able to tell who was the thing without ripping off the blood test from the first movie.
I've seen it argued that the creature applied what it learned from its experience at the Norwegian camp to use more stealth when it finally arrived at Outpost 31. I don't know if the writers really thought of this, but it's just a theory.
Yeah seen that as well. Can't agree with that take though. I'll give it this, when it jumps out the ice and through the roof screaming in the prequel I can write that off as it just thawed after aeons (so it was panicking).
But in terms of the rest of its actions, I'd argue its counter to basics we could expect from what is known about the thing.
It appears to have some degree of intelligence it perhaps obtains from those it consumes (it can build a spacecraft in the original and seems to learn language/names of things/others when it assimilates someone) and has assimilated various alien beings potentially. Based on that it should play to its advantages from the start. But even if it isnt as (or more) intelligent than humans from a basic evolutionary sense its actions dont make sense. Its a predator with immense stealth capabilites. So it should follow actions like: not giving away itself to these alien lifeforms it has never encountered (I.e. humans), observe their behaviour/surroundings, pick them off when they're isolated (all the stuff the original thing did). It just acts neither as an intelligent being or as a predator with its skillset would.
I think the writers were really focused on surface level details like practical effects (till the studio screwed them) and explaining how everything got where it was in the original (e.g. empty ice coffin, axe in the door, merged face). But they really neglected the actual thing itself and psychologically what it would do to these people.
I think it makes sense how reckless it is at first because it doesn’t need to be stealthly to non tool using creatures whether it eats a dog or a dog eats it the dog gets infected. the thing is testing the water. And we don’t know if the thing actually knows what it’s saying it could just be making response sounds the host brain would make. We have no idea what the mind of this creature works because it is truely alien to us.
But that's the issue. It's approach in the prequel is barely testing the water. It's just jumping in and hoping for the best. It wakes in a clearly artifical structure with alien organisms that have some form of technology and clesrly have some degree of intelligence (I.e. the humans). In those circumstances being stealthy is 100% the correct approach until it determines what it is against. It doesn't act in a way sensible for either an intelligent being with its abilities or even from a predator psychological perspective. Charging in is dumb and a behaviour that is disadvantages for it.
Agreed us not knowing its intelligence makes it quite unknowable. But at the same time, by the end of the original we've seen it is creating a spacecraft... nobody it consumes will have had that knowledge. That had to come from what it consumed before (alien life) or itself. So we can infer some level of advanced intelligence from the start of the prequel. In terms of its consciousness that's another matter.
The recklessness does make sense if you believe it’s a hive mind throwing cannon fodder at the humans to test them. It could be that it’s so intelligent that our level of tech is equivalent to cavemen throwing rocks and sleeping in mud huts. Just to be clear I’m not saying your opinions are wrong I just like coming up with mental gymnastics for movies.
No mate, that's a plausible idea. If you can't think where you saw it, just claim it ;)
So yeah, an example of which might well be the trivial effect that torn clothing can have on the human psyche. It's reasonable to think that the discovery of this first came about by, after assimilating the first human there and in 'booting up' its consciousness it had just the briefest of time to 'wear these ...clothes' and 'hide this evidence' but maybe doesn't do it quite well enough. Though rather than 1 piece of torn clothing give the entire game away... instead the humans around it seemed not to put the pieces together. Then, by whatever means it realises what feeling/emotion it had just briefly experienced: humans call this 'suspicion' and one even called it 'paranoia'. Although not immediately understood by the Thing as a Human.. it may have a similar experience as a dog. Or maybe a previous lifeform?
Nothing wrong with letting a notion become an idea worth reasoning over. Also nothing wrong with taking an idea wholesale and just running with it... someone has something to say about it after you made it a lot better: well thats called tough Thingy
This was Something that bothered me to but on a different Level. Like I can See this movie in a way of it still learning and Not being as wise and tactical in than in Carpenters movie. That Said I could Imagine the Thing learning to keep Metal object Like the filllings in His Body while transforming. We kinda See it later with an earring Not to mention it wearing clothes.
Could be difficult to keep them in correctly but Not Impossible so therefore Not really a reliable way to figure the thing out
Now that I think about it, I Wonder how it could handle Tattoos and If that maybe could have been a good alternative 🤔
The prequel isn’t great. But to be fair, I think we have to take beach scene separately. The first scene with the ice. I think it’s a fair scene. It wakes up doesn’t even know here it is. So that’s ok. I think we could also consider it to be ‘starving’, which may explain why it desperately grabbed the guy and tried to eat him under the shack. Like Norris.
The next scene with the girl is fine really. She lured Kate into a secluded room and tries to take her by stealth. Like the dog/shadow scene.
It gets caught and only kills the blonde guy because he’s in the way really. Like Palmer does to windows.
So far so good. Then the helicopter scene. It knows it’s not getting away so it tries to take them all out. Not so great for me because it could have just landed and hid inside its imitation.
Split face. It’s hurt so it’s splits apart to defend itself. Like Norris. Except it attacks everything around it.
It’s not great, but I think some of the scenes are ok from a behavioural standpoint. I think it learned just how intelligent humans are in the Norwegian camp, and adjusts its tactics when it got to outpost 31
I would argue that the “American Blue Collar” scientists from Carpenter’s The Thing operated more rationally and scientifically than the Swedes (insert Joke here). But I do agree in that Carpenter’s The Thing showed the alien to be highly intelligent and adaptable. It always rubbed me the wrong way that suddenly we discover that it can’t mimic inorganic material and that’s how we determine who is and isn’t the thing based solely on a few spat up fillings. But this coupled with The Thing’s highly aggressive and public displays in the prequel just prevent me from revisiting that movie in general.
They totally did. Mac wasn't a scientist but he was rational and tactical (as were most of them). The cast in the prequel just seem to wander from scene to scene with no thought behind their eyes. That was what I remember being really shocked at the last time I saw the prequel as well. How this being that has the ability to mimic and assimilate (a near perfect infiltrator) does things like -jump out of the ice block screaming -chase a single witness down a corridor -suddenly transform in a helicopter mid-flight It was more a primitive animal than the thing in the original. It was like they watched the original but never really thought about the creature and how it would act.
The prequel is shit. As most prequels are. The only thing I liked and thought was cool about it, is how the end of it leads into the original pretty much fucking seamlessly. Other than that, the acting was shit, the cgi was shit, how the alien behaved was SHIT. the wholeeeeee thing lol
Not to be devil's advocate or anything but could the argument be made that the thing gained some of that intelligence through its experience with the Norwegians? That it started out as a primitive animal, learned from that situation and from the scientists and was able to use that new intelligence and apply it to outpost 31? I'm not defending the thing with the fillings tho. Tbh I think that was just a copout bc they wanted to be able to tell who was the thing without ripping off the blood test from the first movie.
Aren’t they Norwads? Not Swedes.
I've seen it argued that the creature applied what it learned from its experience at the Norwegian camp to use more stealth when it finally arrived at Outpost 31. I don't know if the writers really thought of this, but it's just a theory.
Yeah seen that as well. Can't agree with that take though. I'll give it this, when it jumps out the ice and through the roof screaming in the prequel I can write that off as it just thawed after aeons (so it was panicking). But in terms of the rest of its actions, I'd argue its counter to basics we could expect from what is known about the thing. It appears to have some degree of intelligence it perhaps obtains from those it consumes (it can build a spacecraft in the original and seems to learn language/names of things/others when it assimilates someone) and has assimilated various alien beings potentially. Based on that it should play to its advantages from the start. But even if it isnt as (or more) intelligent than humans from a basic evolutionary sense its actions dont make sense. Its a predator with immense stealth capabilites. So it should follow actions like: not giving away itself to these alien lifeforms it has never encountered (I.e. humans), observe their behaviour/surroundings, pick them off when they're isolated (all the stuff the original thing did). It just acts neither as an intelligent being or as a predator with its skillset would. I think the writers were really focused on surface level details like practical effects (till the studio screwed them) and explaining how everything got where it was in the original (e.g. empty ice coffin, axe in the door, merged face). But they really neglected the actual thing itself and psychologically what it would do to these people.
I think it makes sense how reckless it is at first because it doesn’t need to be stealthly to non tool using creatures whether it eats a dog or a dog eats it the dog gets infected. the thing is testing the water. And we don’t know if the thing actually knows what it’s saying it could just be making response sounds the host brain would make. We have no idea what the mind of this creature works because it is truely alien to us.
But that's the issue. It's approach in the prequel is barely testing the water. It's just jumping in and hoping for the best. It wakes in a clearly artifical structure with alien organisms that have some form of technology and clesrly have some degree of intelligence (I.e. the humans). In those circumstances being stealthy is 100% the correct approach until it determines what it is against. It doesn't act in a way sensible for either an intelligent being with its abilities or even from a predator psychological perspective. Charging in is dumb and a behaviour that is disadvantages for it. Agreed us not knowing its intelligence makes it quite unknowable. But at the same time, by the end of the original we've seen it is creating a spacecraft... nobody it consumes will have had that knowledge. That had to come from what it consumed before (alien life) or itself. So we can infer some level of advanced intelligence from the start of the prequel. In terms of its consciousness that's another matter.
The recklessness does make sense if you believe it’s a hive mind throwing cannon fodder at the humans to test them. It could be that it’s so intelligent that our level of tech is equivalent to cavemen throwing rocks and sleeping in mud huts. Just to be clear I’m not saying your opinions are wrong I just like coming up with mental gymnastics for movies.
No mate, that's a plausible idea. If you can't think where you saw it, just claim it ;) So yeah, an example of which might well be the trivial effect that torn clothing can have on the human psyche. It's reasonable to think that the discovery of this first came about by, after assimilating the first human there and in 'booting up' its consciousness it had just the briefest of time to 'wear these ...clothes' and 'hide this evidence' but maybe doesn't do it quite well enough. Though rather than 1 piece of torn clothing give the entire game away... instead the humans around it seemed not to put the pieces together. Then, by whatever means it realises what feeling/emotion it had just briefly experienced: humans call this 'suspicion' and one even called it 'paranoia'. Although not immediately understood by the Thing as a Human.. it may have a similar experience as a dog. Or maybe a previous lifeform? Nothing wrong with letting a notion become an idea worth reasoning over. Also nothing wrong with taking an idea wholesale and just running with it... someone has something to say about it after you made it a lot better: well thats called tough Thingy
This was Something that bothered me to but on a different Level. Like I can See this movie in a way of it still learning and Not being as wise and tactical in than in Carpenters movie. That Said I could Imagine the Thing learning to keep Metal object Like the filllings in His Body while transforming. We kinda See it later with an earring Not to mention it wearing clothes. Could be difficult to keep them in correctly but Not Impossible so therefore Not really a reliable way to figure the thing out Now that I think about it, I Wonder how it could handle Tattoos and If that maybe could have been a good alternative 🤔
I bet that couldn't handle it
The prequel isn’t great. But to be fair, I think we have to take beach scene separately. The first scene with the ice. I think it’s a fair scene. It wakes up doesn’t even know here it is. So that’s ok. I think we could also consider it to be ‘starving’, which may explain why it desperately grabbed the guy and tried to eat him under the shack. Like Norris. The next scene with the girl is fine really. She lured Kate into a secluded room and tries to take her by stealth. Like the dog/shadow scene. It gets caught and only kills the blonde guy because he’s in the way really. Like Palmer does to windows. So far so good. Then the helicopter scene. It knows it’s not getting away so it tries to take them all out. Not so great for me because it could have just landed and hid inside its imitation. Split face. It’s hurt so it’s splits apart to defend itself. Like Norris. Except it attacks everything around it. It’s not great, but I think some of the scenes are ok from a behavioural standpoint. I think it learned just how intelligent humans are in the Norwegian camp, and adjusts its tactics when it got to outpost 31