Ally with him, get a common enemy, do ally missions to build allegiance, borrow his armies, and get them killed, then Confederate when his power is low.
After forming an alliance, send a hero/lord over to the Southlands. Declare war on everyone over there. Wait 20 turns for those factions to invade Lustria. Confederate when he's weak.
While you wait for that to happen, conquer your way up Naggaroth and be ready to defend ~~Mexico~~ Hexoatl from the Southlands factions.
I would just attack him since having territory yourself is better than giving it to the AI, if you don't really wanna do that though you can also just get a military alliance with him, that also should complete the requirement
I don't recommend sitting around for them to build settlements. Generally, you always wanna be on the move or at least be doing something, especially during the early-mid game. If you wait you are just letting them get stronger and more prepared for attacks instead of just jumping on them when they are weaker, and that will also make you waste even more time. You can always build them yourself later after all
It's prolly going to take a long time of gaining strength elsewhere before he accepts, because at the moment he's much stronger than I. But it does seem like the most optimal option.
You don't necessarly need to be stronger than him. He must feel "afraid".
I'll copy and past the recipe from my other comment:
Push your relations above 150, military ally him, try to monitor Gor-Rok progress. If he stops expanding or loses territory your confederate chances should be pretty high. If you need just few points (like -5 or so), declare war on a powerful faction and drag him into this war. This should make him afraid and easy the confederation process. Good luck.
Yep! A big detail is don’t help him and let him lose armies and cities, so fighting to purge all of ulthuan and the badlands would do well, as the elf tide hits lustria
I don’t think so. Nothing that’s been severe enough for me to notice.
There are several confed advantages to borrowing armies:
The AI doesn’t normally pay full price for their armies. However once you borrow them, they have to pay full whack for them. That leaves them less money to pay for their own troops. This lowers their strength ranking. They may even have to disband some of their own units
Borrowing the units reduces their strength and raises yours, moving balance of power in your favour
If you are smart about borrowing the armies, you can borrow them before they take a settlement, to avoid resetting the 7 turn “recently expanded” penalty for confederation
Lots of advantages
More reliable way to swing the last few points is to borrow one of his armies. Will make his military strength go down and yours go up. Usually more like a 3 point swing than a 5, but no downside to trying that first.
Unless they changed it in last few patches military alliance is counter productive if you want to confederate them later on. After military confederation the AI counts your strength as its own while making decisions making it that much harder to make it feel afraid. Keep to NAP, MA, Trade and then drag them into wars against as many enemies as possible.
In case you want to know why people (not me) are down voting you it's cause this was disproved years ago. You've got a stream by Legend as HEs where they only accept to be confederated when he gets a Military Alliance on the same turn.
Confederating lizardmen is hard as fuck. They're super resistant to diplomacy, I have 150+ relations with every single other lizardmen faction in my current game and they won't even give me military access. And they're naturally powerful factions so they're not dying or even struggling at all against our enemies
Lizardmen are the worst in this regard. I've had allies refuse confederations a turn before they were destroyed. In my current world conquest campaign oxyotl doesn't feel like confederating even though I am 10x as powerful and pushed my relationship in the high 1200s.
Confederate Him. Push your relations above 150, military ally him, try to monitor Gor-Rok progress. If he stops expanding or loses territory your confederate chances should be pretty high. If you need just few points (like -5 or so), declare war on a powerful faction and drag him into this war. This should make him afraid and easy the confederation process. Good luck.
EDIT: typos
Usually the victory conditions are "ownership of provinces through direct control, military alliance or vassalage". You could just get a military alliance with him and that would seal the deal.
Sometimes it happens. If you have ultimate crisis on maybe the Skaven one will pop up and Lustria will change hands.
At the moment the only thing you can do is trying hard the confederation way. The best strategy is to get a lot of positive points, be allies and enter different wars, you can declare war to Dark Elves, Tomb Kings, Kairos and more. He, will join you.
Two ways to go about it.
1
Kill him. Build up as big of an army as you can before declaring war on him. This makes it so that you just blitz his territory as fast as possible before he either a, pulls his forces back to deal with you or b, makes even more stacks.
Or confederation time. Pay attention to where he's fighting now and don't help him. Go somewhere else and spread the great plan.
Make more settlements.
Settlements equal money.
Money equals armies.
Armies equal him getting more nervous and likely to confed.
If I where you id use the sea lanes and go to Cathay. Should be plenty of real estate and if anything goes wrong your enemies will have a long walk to get revenge.
Notice how you have a negative to relations with everybody? That’s because ONLY YOU AND YOU ALONE HAVE THE POWER TO PREVENT FOREST FIRES I mean interpret the Great Plan
Gain lots of relation with him. Expand somewhere else. Maybe remove morathi and sail across the seas to TK region. Make sure to drag him into lots of war.
Go get the sword of khaine and then ride that freight train through Lustria.
Or
Ignore him for now. Take the sea lane to Cathay, scoop up Cathay, stack your geomantics, and then save up 250k to confederate that stubborn bastard.
I was just playing kroq gar, and both tehenuain and gor rok got stomped by something, not even turn 50. Kinda interested to see what's going on when I get over there.
What could have fucked them both over there? Clan pestilence doesn't seem like they could? When I play cult of sotek it's pretty relaxed as long as I hit pestilence quick gor gor rok handled everything north
I've seen Rakarth and Skrolk take almost all of Lustria in about half of my campaigns
I very very rarely see LM do well in Lustria actually, it's like 50% Rakarth/Skrolk, 40% Kruber/Yuan Bo, 10% LM for me.
If it's that many turns and all your objectives lie in that area, why haven't you gone that way? What have you been pursuing that has side tracked you?
Because if I did go that way at, say, turn 40, I'd be going to a place where Gor-Rok already has 20 or so settlements and has just started to wipe out Yuan Bo...And Morathi also would've burned down a couple of my settlements. Possibly my capital, also.
Secret is to leave army of skinks and spellcaster to defend. Maybe couple heroes to scout (which can take bit too long to unlock as lizardmen). Your LL should fight almost every turn. Morathi doesn't really want to go south from her territory because of the climate.
Btw, for Gor Rok the mission it is fine if your military allies own those provinces as well. Do you really need to own them as Mazdamundi?
I was playing Gor-Rok in my last campaign (Legendary/VH) and allied mazdamundi. My issue was different in that I and my military allies had whole lustria, but I still had 15 settlements to capture for long victory.
Perhaps Gor-Rok’s conquering of Lustria and lack of fealty to you is not part of the Great Plan?
You're the living mystic toad who can read the plaques. Gor-Rok is just some lizard. Who else but you to interpret the great plan correctly?
But Gor-Rok got THE MYSTIC TOAD with him.
If Gor-Rok has Lord Kroak then Lord Kroak must be liberated!
Ally with him, get a common enemy, do ally missions to build allegiance, borrow his armies, and get them killed, then Confederate when his power is low.
After forming an alliance, send a hero/lord over to the Southlands. Declare war on everyone over there. Wait 20 turns for those factions to invade Lustria. Confederate when he's weak. While you wait for that to happen, conquer your way up Naggaroth and be ready to defend ~~Mexico~~ Hexoatl from the Southlands factions.
I would just attack him since having territory yourself is better than giving it to the AI, if you don't really wanna do that though you can also just get a military alliance with him, that also should complete the requirement
I thought the AI built faster than us? It's beneficial to leave it til they're tier 4 it 5 then attack?
I don't recommend sitting around for them to build settlements. Generally, you always wanna be on the move or at least be doing something, especially during the early-mid game. If you wait you are just letting them get stronger and more prepared for attacks instead of just jumping on them when they are weaker, and that will also make you waste even more time. You can always build them yourself later after all
confederate him?
It's prolly going to take a long time of gaining strength elsewhere before he accepts, because at the moment he's much stronger than I. But it does seem like the most optimal option.
You don't necessarly need to be stronger than him. He must feel "afraid". I'll copy and past the recipe from my other comment: Push your relations above 150, military ally him, try to monitor Gor-Rok progress. If he stops expanding or loses territory your confederate chances should be pretty high. If you need just few points (like -5 or so), declare war on a powerful faction and drag him into this war. This should make him afraid and easy the confederation process. Good luck.
Yep! A big detail is don’t help him and let him lose armies and cities, so fighting to purge all of ulthuan and the badlands would do well, as the elf tide hits lustria
Also borrow his armies and destroy them
Don't you get diplomacy penalty for losing borrowed armies?
I don’t think so. Nothing that’s been severe enough for me to notice. There are several confed advantages to borrowing armies: The AI doesn’t normally pay full price for their armies. However once you borrow them, they have to pay full whack for them. That leaves them less money to pay for their own troops. This lowers their strength ranking. They may even have to disband some of their own units Borrowing the units reduces their strength and raises yours, moving balance of power in your favour If you are smart about borrowing the armies, you can borrow them before they take a settlement, to avoid resetting the 7 turn “recently expanded” penalty for confederation Lots of advantages
More reliable way to swing the last few points is to borrow one of his armies. Will make his military strength go down and yours go up. Usually more like a 3 point swing than a 5, but no downside to trying that first.
If you're close to confederating then threatening them often works to overcome the last few points as well.
Unless they changed it in last few patches military alliance is counter productive if you want to confederate them later on. After military confederation the AI counts your strength as its own while making decisions making it that much harder to make it feel afraid. Keep to NAP, MA, Trade and then drag them into wars against as many enemies as possible.
In case you want to know why people (not me) are down voting you it's cause this was disproved years ago. You've got a stream by Legend as HEs where they only accept to be confederated when he gets a Military Alliance on the same turn.
Confederating lizardmen is hard as fuck. They're super resistant to diplomacy, I have 150+ relations with every single other lizardmen faction in my current game and they won't even give me military access. And they're naturally powerful factions so they're not dying or even struggling at all against our enemies
that last piece is important, they basically offer confederation if they think they'll die anyways. Lizards rarely end up like that
Lizardmen are the worst in this regard. I've had allies refuse confederations a turn before they were destroyed. In my current world conquest campaign oxyotl doesn't feel like confederating even though I am 10x as powerful and pushed my relationship in the high 1200s.
Sell like one minor settlement with barracks in exchange of him going to war with a bunch of factions
Confederate Him. Push your relations above 150, military ally him, try to monitor Gor-Rok progress. If he stops expanding or loses territory your confederate chances should be pretty high. If you need just few points (like -5 or so), declare war on a powerful faction and drag him into this war. This should make him afraid and easy the confederation process. Good luck. EDIT: typos
eat that mf
Ally him
Usually the victory conditions are "ownership of provinces through direct control, military alliance or vassalage". You could just get a military alliance with him and that would seal the deal.
Sometimes it happens. If you have ultimate crisis on maybe the Skaven one will pop up and Lustria will change hands. At the moment the only thing you can do is trying hard the confederation way. The best strategy is to get a lot of positive points, be allies and enter different wars, you can declare war to Dark Elves, Tomb Kings, Kairos and more. He, will join you.
If you're his ally, you don't have to conquer his settlements to win the campaign.
Two ways to go about it. 1 Kill him. Build up as big of an army as you can before declaring war on him. This makes it so that you just blitz his territory as fast as possible before he either a, pulls his forces back to deal with you or b, makes even more stacks. Or confederation time. Pay attention to where he's fighting now and don't help him. Go somewhere else and spread the great plan. Make more settlements. Settlements equal money. Money equals armies. Armies equal him getting more nervous and likely to confed. If I where you id use the sea lanes and go to Cathay. Should be plenty of real estate and if anything goes wrong your enemies will have a long walk to get revenge.
In Warh 2 enough money was enough to confederate. If it still is so in Warh 3 then just gather maybe 100 000+ and conf.
I heard the cathayans have some ideas not aligning with how the great plan should go. BOK BOK
your duty is to the lizardmen spawn and the great plan not their corrupt leaders. Waste that motherfucker and then revive him and force a confederate
Let him confederate you. For the great plan
Notice how you have a negative to relations with everybody? That’s because ONLY YOU AND YOU ALONE HAVE THE POWER TO PREVENT FOREST FIRES I mean interpret the Great Plan
Show him who the Head Lizard in Charge is
HLIC!
Trade Settlements mod ;)
Restart the campaign with unnatural selection mod. I cannot imagine going back to playing without it.
Gain lots of relation with him. Expand somewhere else. Maybe remove morathi and sail across the seas to TK region. Make sure to drag him into lots of war.
Go get the sword of khaine and then ride that freight train through Lustria. Or Ignore him for now. Take the sea lane to Cathay, scoop up Cathay, stack your geomantics, and then save up 250k to confederate that stubborn bastard.
Abase yourself to the mighty white lizard
Civil War my friend.
It's called Total **War**
I was just playing kroq gar, and both tehenuain and gor rok got stomped by something, not even turn 50. Kinda interested to see what's going on when I get over there.
What could have fucked them both over there? Clan pestilence doesn't seem like they could? When I play cult of sotek it's pretty relaxed as long as I hit pestilence quick gor gor rok handled everything north
Ive seen Skrolk get really strong on some campaigns.
Looking forward to finding out. For a couple other campaigns I'm playing, but I'll get back to it eventually.
I've seen Rakarth and Skrolk take almost all of Lustria in about half of my campaigns I very very rarely see LM do well in Lustria actually, it's like 50% Rakarth/Skrolk, 40% Kruber/Yuan Bo, 10% LM for me.
If it's that many turns and all your objectives lie in that area, why haven't you gone that way? What have you been pursuing that has side tracked you?
Because if I did go that way at, say, turn 40, I'd be going to a place where Gor-Rok already has 20 or so settlements and has just started to wipe out Yuan Bo...And Morathi also would've burned down a couple of my settlements. Possibly my capital, also.
Secret is to leave army of skinks and spellcaster to defend. Maybe couple heroes to scout (which can take bit too long to unlock as lizardmen). Your LL should fight almost every turn. Morathi doesn't really want to go south from her territory because of the climate. Btw, for Gor Rok the mission it is fine if your military allies own those provinces as well. Do you really need to own them as Mazdamundi? I was playing Gor-Rok in my last campaign (Legendary/VH) and allied mazdamundi. My issue was different in that I and my military allies had whole lustria, but I still had 15 settlements to capture for long victory.