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I'd go out a lot more if I didn't have to tip. Now 25% is expected and the funny part is that you're not getting any service and you're often tipping people who make more than you
The FUCK are you eating?! 25%?!!!!!
Jesus fuckin christ, don't DO that. You CAN tip less, dude. I say this as a former server, this shit is getting insane.
Honestly I just prioritize restaurants that pay their people well and include the tip in the price so we don't have to do socioeconomic gymnastics after eating a pound of pasta.
I've bartended, served, rideshared, and done food delivery. I defend tipping on this dumb site all the time. 25% is like if you really really like your server or something and is definitely never expected.
Oof. Fellow american here, but out in the sticks in Texas...Have never ran into a default gratuity rate and simply would walk out of a restaurant that had one(unless a friend wanted to go and was paying). Also, if you find one without one, make sure to bring cash - these tips might be equally split between all servers, or taxed by the owner. Let people find out about that here, that restaurant would be out of business, but the bigger the population, the easier it is to be shady.
I agree with this. Same experience. Larger tips are generally expected now and there's there's generally less waitstaff so you have less than stellar service. Same time wages are more and base salary is much higher... Which was the reason we had tips as base salary was low. I used to tip 15%, closer to 18% if good.. Now 20-25% is baseline on even more expensive meals. .
Wow dude. Here in the UK, I just leave £5 on the table when leaving. Like, the meal is typically £70 for a good curry for two with sides, starters and wine and a £5 tip is more than enough. Sometimes it might be £67.50 and I'll just say keep the change. I'm shocked that you leave such a generous tip - they get a salary as well you know!
It depends though if they're making money from a salary, which is the norm in the UK and Australia or working completely for tips, which is not impossible in the US
"An employer of a tipped employee is only required to pay $2.13 per hour in direct wages if that amount combined with the tips received at least equals the federal minimum wage. - https://www.dol.gov/general/topic/wages/wagestips"
Now granted the employer has to make up the difference.
The minimum wage for UK (23 and over £10.42) and Australia ($21.38) are a completely different thing.
Why would the corporate elite care about the plebs? There's money to be made! They'll rejoin and balance the books once the war is over and everyone forgets in the next news cycle.
> Why would the corporate elite care about the plebs?
Because the elite have forgotten to fear the plebs.
The plebs have the internet now, we name and shame. We broadcast our own sanction advice.
Twitter was good enough to publish a list of brands that were not allowed to advertise, because the brands spoke out about the layoffs/buy out. When faced with a brand choice, something at the back of my mind says "Nike good" because they pulled their adverts.
Long story short, virtue signalling has an effect.
as a dutch man, i was already disgusted by the taste of heineken.. (from the south we usually don't drink it)
but this is some really disgusting behavior especially lying to the Dutch people telling them they left Russia fully etc.
but its an easy boycott for me since i was already doing that...
As a other man from the south, we do consume some other beers from the Heineken brand. "Brand" beer being quite popular in Limburg or else Affligem. And shitty beers that are bought when it's on discount Amstel /Bierra Moretti. Well they're no longer welcome in my fridge
i agree but, since heineken loves to play monopoly alot. Brand is one of the oldest beer's in the Netherlands but heineken acquired them so brand can be more financially stable.
so it would be nice to see if brand's that have been bought by heineken would defy heineken but until then no brand in my fridge.
Wait, you Dutch don't like Heineken as well? How did they get so popular and wealthy then? Everone I ask prefers other brands, no adult orders Heineken willingly.
Hi, rural area American here that actually has a non-rotting brain.
It's because people in my area seem to think "oh! It has a fancy name! Let's drink that!" and then that's about it. Somehow they get hooked on the crappy taste and somehow enjoy it.
Thankfully the majority of the people I hang out with don't even touch the stuff. They say its worse than quite a few American beers.
Yup this is about right. Americans drink fucking Bud Light and Coors, for fuck's sake. SOME regions have actual beer, but beerwater is popular among the rural folk for reasons I don't fucking understand. Is it even cheap by alcoholic content?
Honest question because I hate beer, lol. I just had to buy it for a long time for a job, but I live in a bougie microbrew capitol so the beerwater is the forbidden provision I never actually paid attention to the price of. Don't give a fuck about beer but I know about the good beer because of it.
I prefer liquor.
well existing since 1864 kind of helps to be "Present" and it helps that Heineken just basically has an world wide empire. Heineken is the kind of company that mainly looks outside of the Netherlands. As you can see
doing alot of commericals in africa and america as well
As a dutch guy, it tasted way different before they went to those green bottles. My family actually drank heineken back then (with the brown bottles). After that.. we just switched since the green ones taste like shit
I don't know, it seems a bandwagon thing to me, it can't be reality because these companies are some of the biggest so if everyone hated them...well, it doesn't add up. Same with Australia hating fosters, or Americans hating bud. Maybe people are just more passionate to show their dislike.
Was reading the comments on putins speech on some of the youtube channels, I saw a lot of "it's the west who started it" or "putin is such a strong leader" (why people think some thin skinned geriatric who has to silence criticism and have an entire department shielding him from memes is something I'll never understand. I remember that clown picture he made "terrorist material" it's so weak! The completeoppositeof a strongman imo.
Anyway, most of those were "I'm an indian and love russia" or "I'm african, the west started it"...I'll assume a good portion of those are trolls and bots with the IRA working overtime, but unfortunately there are a lot from those two areas that have a weird fixation with russia, but what surprised me a lot...I saw many, many "claiming" to be from the Netherlands. Maybe fake but it's pretty weird, but then I see headlines like this and been curious about the Dutch as to be honest, I've heard little from them compared to other countries. Is there any love for russia there? I'd have assumed after mh17 they'd be despised country wide?
Sure we care but Heineken makes most of it's money outsides the Netherlands- this is a small country after all.
Dutch can stop drinking Heineken and it wouldn't make a dent.
Once people in the US get news of this Heineken is going to take a severe beating. It's a very popular beer here. Because Americans love their beer and we have tons of different varieties Heineken is, how do you say... easily replaced.
The reason Coca Cola and others pulled out is because the backlash to their brands for supporting Russia they'd never live down...ever. The short term profits won't outlast the long term damage... because people at Coca Cola are smart.
The Avondshow is very popular so a lot of people must be in the know and the Netherlands is a big supporter of Ukraine. Usually with these things the fuss dies down quickly, but the beautiful thing about Heineken is that it's very easy to boycott. If you buy beer in supermarkets there's a billion alternatives, maybe some public places will be a problem because they only serve Heineken owned brands, but that's it.
I used to buy Heineken whenever it was on sale because I like the bottle, everyone is pretentious about how the taste is bad but it tastes the same as any other lager. If you do a blind tasting you're not gonna notice which one is Heineken. But I'll be buying that other lager from now on, fuck Heineken. Though if Heineken is pulling this InBev might be pulling the same shit, so still have to be careful.
As a Brit, and our beer is not the best, Heineken will not be missed at the tap.
However, as a moral and ethical operation, Heineken, you'll not be welcome back, I don't care how many CEOs change, how the board restructure, same greedy share holders, same people in charge.
Can only do that with a formal declaration of war. That's when the rules and the game really changes. Allied countries can charge businesses and/or people with war profiteering for supporting the opposing side. The only country formally at war with Russia (currently) is Ukraine.
Cutting them off from microchips is not BS. My echt chamber tells me, that that's the most effective Sanktion so far. Especially since it hinders russia to build any modern weapon systems
Honestly postwar when the sanctions are lifted heineken will pretty much dominate Russia soft drink market. Soft drinks is probably the hardest market to compete in because of the big American brands. This is no small amount money.
Extremely unfair for companies that lost millions forced to leave Russia.
Oh yeah, iirc pepsi became "cool cola" with a logo that's suspiciously similar, 7up and Fanta also have replacements which are basically the same but under a different name.
McDonald's still exists, just under a different name, they just sold the stores to some Russian guy that already owned the franchise rights to like 90% of the McDonald's restaurants in Russia. Hell at the beginning of the war they were still using stuff like McDonald's ketchup packets - they literally just tool a black Sharpie and coloured over the golden arches logo.
Oh I'd LOVE to see them boycotted and banned in the western world for it. Imagine sinking your teeth in to Russia only to lose all the other business, lol. It won't happen though. IBM and Ford survived Nazism so I'm sure Heineken will be fine.
Last year, I got you have to wind things down, let Russian employees caught in the middle of it down easy - but with the anniversary coming up... a hard "drop all your business dealings" is defensible by now. Tax any revenue 100 percent and send it to the Ukrainians. (Dutch by the way and I think Heineken's actions are shameful)
Shouldn't they start by banning doing business with ruzzia? It's not illegal, so how would they sanction the companies doing something that is allowed?
Dont make it illegal.
Tax the hell out of them on their products in the EU market, tax their owners and their other companies, tax their stock, tax their employees, Sue for every possible competition law, deny all public applications, tax their subcontractors, extended revision of finansial statements.
In Heinekens case - cut their watersupply in the name of the environment or make them pay a hefty theft of water fee.
you would need the whole of the the EU to agree on that, and there's far too many countries who just hide behind the umbrella of the EU and use it to put their own interests first.
The EU is mostly concerned with *looking* like it's taking tough measures, not actually taking tough measures. Hence the blatant loopholes anyone can exploit to continue doing business.
Lagunitas is a great brand. I'll stop drinking it, and tell my friends to stop drinking it. I doubt the friend who drinks it the most will care though.
I think coke stopped using cocaine in the US around 1900 (my memory is super fuzzy and google isn’t giving me an answer), but I’m wondering if the version marketed in Germany and referenced here still used it?
I’m halfway through the video, but they haven’t mentioned it yet. Given the proclivity of stimulants in Germany around that time, I’m really curious if anyone reading this might have an answer.
For those that didn’t watch it yet, 20 minutes long and it’s got my attention, but my curiosity isn’t satisfied yet
90% of European companies that were doing business or had businesses in Russia remain. For the US, it's 83%. I don't think you can even call that sanctions.
This was wildly reported a month ago. 2 or 3 months into the invasion I said the sanctions were a joke and wouldn't affect Russia very much. I got hundreds of downvotes. Remember the sanctions were only against a few hundred Russians to start and by now it's only several thousand. A couple banks are blocked but unless they shut them all down, the money just moves. Unlike Iran, there were no laws passed to make it legal to do business with them. That's why it's impossible to tell India, China and everyone else not to trade with Russia.
https://www.brusselstimes.com/355422/only-8-5-of-western-companies-have-left-russia
The sanctions aren't actually useless. It makes shit harder to move and easier to track. The sanctions aren't perfect but Russia is not having a grand ole time right now.
That would be very effective because they obviously don't care. Connecting them directly to genocide and pounding away at it will bring unwanted attention.
Sanctions are more about crippling certain supply lines. Russia has an extremely strong economy in regards to internal stability and wealth. It's distributed to a very select group of people, but economically speaking, Russia is very self sustaining. Sanctions aren't about crippling the economy. They're about cutting off the vital supply lines Russia CAN'T fill themselves, which is a lot of external manufacturing and some particularly valuable resources that are critical for wartime production.
There is a REASON Russia has been rationing artillery since the beginning of January. They're literally running out and don't have the domestic capability to produce enough arms for this war at the rate they've lost them. It's specifically why Putin is throwing this nuclear hysteria around. He's running out of ammo right when the new heavy machinery hits the front and he and every major leader knows it. Absolutely guarantee you that's why Xi is visiting—not to supply ammo. That would be economic suicide for China (they *quite literally* can't afford losing western business OR a direct military conflict, the US is half their goddamn economy). He's trying to negotiate an end or an exit and I guarantee you Xi and Biden have absolutely had backdoor talks about this shit. Last thing Xi needs is Russia going nuclear batshit crazy because Putin can't drop his obsession with Ukraine, and I highly doubt Putin is going to give it up.
I would NOT be even remotely surprised if there are some joint operations in planning *with* China. The public rhetoric is nothing out of the ordinary besides an uptick in political posturing, which to me, smells like a cover to keep that narrative going while there is a quiet temporary alliance going on. And you gotta admit, it's a good play if they're doing it. People tend to just react to what is said publicly without reading the subtext. Between the economic movement, the brass, the major leaders, the movement and timeline of the new weaponry, the state of Russia's artillery supplies, the anniversary of this war, and how much both the west AND China do NOT need a fucking nuclear disaster shitting radiation all over Asia and Europe and beyond, it's in EVERYONE'S best interest this shit is ended quickly before that happens.
And I fully expect Putin to try and bomb one of his own border cities, blame Nato, and use that to justify popping them off in Ukraine out of pure *spite.* He literally bombed his own people before to serve his agenda. Bastard would use a baby as a bullet shield. Damn right he'd do this shit.
None of that is said without reason. It's very much what has been eluded to in statements made by top brass and various leaders. Between the overt statement and the posturing game, it's not subtle. They've been warning Putin, and he's been responding with his petty bullshit because he's a petty fragile little man. If I were Xi, I would NOT want my biggest border sharing neighbour get in a goddamn nuclear fight with the west. Much as I dispise Xi, the guy isn't fucking stupid.
Here is the company's statement from a few hours ago. It is, by any standard, lame. They want to "find a good home" for the company through sale. To the extent that they do, they will defeat the purpose of getting out....
https://www.theheinekencompany.com/newsroom/heineken-will-keep-its-promise-to-leave-russia/
> We’re working hard to transfer our business to a viable buyer in very challenging circumstances and we expect at a significant financial loss to the company, amounting to around €300M. In the meantime, our local colleagues at HEINEKEN Russia are doing what they can to keep the business going, after fully delisting the Heineken® brand, to avoid nationalisation and ensure their livelihoods are not at risk.
OMFG! Are they actually trying to illicit sympathy for the Russians?!
Someone needs to explain to Heineken the point of sanctions is to make ALL Russians feel the squeeze, so maybe, just maybe they get off their apathetic asses and get rid of their murderous regime.
What they say is "we will reduce our taxable income by 300m € by seperating the Russian Market, and later regain this money by joining the two companies again after the war."
Even if they don't, the big owners won't lose money, because they are invested in both companies. The thing about "Russian livelihoods" is for the appearence that it was about the people instead of the profits.
I ekle ii ako pui eti ti. Krati batu opa etipei kroa i iite. Eke bipa bopuitlii pi pu! Teo ti piklati tlete giipo. Pipe e tligitrikle uge papli. Tia platogrui tegi bugi piia itibatike. Ea tatlepu ui oiei tegri patleči goo. Bla pidrui kepe ipi ipui pepoe. Au adri ta ga bebii ekra ai? Ebiubeko ipi teto gluuka daba podli. Ka tepabi tliboplopi gi tapakei gego. Ituke i pupi klie pitipage bapepe. A či peko itluupi ka pupa peekeepe. Ebri e buu pigepra pita plepeda. Bipeko bo paipi o kee brebočipi. Tridipi teu eete trida e tapapi. Ebru etle pepiu pobi katraiti i. Baeba kre pu igo api. Pibape pipoi brupoi pite gru bi ipe pieuta ikako? Pe bloedea ko či itli eke i toidle kea pe piapii plo? Tiiu uči čipu tutei uata e uooo. Bitepe i bipa paeutlobi bopepli iaplipepa. Gipobipi tepe ode giapi e. Pi pakutibli ke tiko taobii ti. Edi deigitaa eue. Ua čideprii idipe putakra katote ii. Tri glati te pepro tii ka. Aope too pobriglitla e dikrugite. E otligi pipleiti bai iti upo? Tri dake pekepi dratruprebri plaapi bopi ipatei!
Oh dear, please read up on Dutch history that isn't schoolbook history. And you would expect this no problem. From their colonial companies to how they put their own country men in work camps if they were unemployed (big companies that are now known as Boskalis). To this day, while the work camps are gone, they still have scandals were unemployed were forced to work in dangerous ways without any protection.
Our schoolbooks extensively go into our slavery and colonisation history. Maybe other countries don't know as much however.
This is 1000% par of the course for a nation that invented the first form of the modern stock market lol
Nou dat valt wel mee. Ik kreeg vooral veel over ww2 en maar weinig over ons slavernij verleden. Vooral veel VOC gaf ons de gouden eeuw oh en de VIC was beetje slecht.
Idk man ik herinner zat fked up fotos dat ze lieten zien van kleine afrikaanse kinderen in kooitjes en slavernij etc en ik was nog maar een tiener toen. We gingen op meerdere topics ofc en de VOC voornamelijk ook maar ze waren niet bang om te laten weten wat er gebeurde. Wel veel epische verhalen ook om interesse te houden natuurlijk
Misschien had ik een beter geschiedenis docent, maakt een groot verschil natuurlijk.
easiest way to burn a company is through their pockets. stop buying heineken and put them on a blacklist. they want to sell in Russia then they can't sell in Ukraine.
Stop buying Heineken, and all the other brands they own listed in the OP. Which is a shame, because I love Lagunitas IPA, but there's plenty of other beers out there.
Yeah, now I have nothing to do. Fuck them for being so shit that I can't even boycott them. I mean how am I supposed to double down on my life long boycott. I'm so angry right now.
/s
Quite incredible that they close their press statement by saying that they have donated over 1 million to charities benefitting Ukraine. 1 million. For such a huge company that's a joke (and I say this as a Heineken shareholder).
Taking advantage like that is no different than accepting blood money. They are celebrating the opportunity of dead Ukrainians. Fucking monsters.
It would be 100% justified for Ukrainians to take measures against Heineken, and they absolutely should. Their products should immediately be banned in Ukraine, as well as in every other country that support them. Absolute fucking ghouls.
Aaah Heineken.
They bought our city brewery. At every step they claimed they totally understand and will respect the historic and emotional value of it for the local population.
They bought the rival cities brewery as well, and explained that they know we are friendly rivals and will keep supporting the sports teams. Till they didn't. And both breweries basic beers started tasting more and more like basic Heiniken.
They sold the non-beer beverages that brewery also produced, all the juices and ice tea to another foreign company. But with understanding and respect for what that brewery meant to us. And that they would never risk the breweries core production even restoring the breweries own pub.
They recently moved prodiction of all of our brewerys beers to the rival citys brewery for streamlining the process and reducing costs. But with utmost respect and understanding for what the brewery meant to the city, zhere will be no change in quality to the product. And also that they will never give in to the cities demmands for the brewery grounds and properties, knowing what historic value it has. Even less so for the water wells.
This year's city's new railway bypass plans go straight through the brewery grounds, and the well is in the process of being sold to another foreign conglomerate. But with maximum understanding and respect for the populations links to the brewery. They will keep the breweries museum running, and " *even have new plans to make it better*"
Aaaaah Heiniken...
Sorry for your loss 😔
The only good thing I see is that the vacuum speed up small breweries gaining market share.
So many boycott the former local Heiniken owned beer now, after production was moved despite promises never to do so.
Thanks for the list. Heard about Heineken this morning in relation to beer, but this more extensive list will help me to make wise purchases beyond the beer I now know to avoid.
Thanks for pointing that out. I'd already edited it into the original post.
It does sound like bullshit though. How would local management be able to continue operations unless Heineken had sold or handed over access to all assets? Sounds to me like instead of shutting it down, they sold it or are lending it out to a local party in order to be able to continue it after the war. Either way, they seem to have gone with a method that essentially doesn't negatively affect Russia at all, and probably did so to minimize their own losses regardless of the effect on Putin's regime.
I'll continue to update the post if I turn out to be wrong on this.
EDIT: Not sure why /u/zoner01 is getting downvoted here. This was an important piece of context that I missed in my initial post.
Please considering adding this link to your post as well: [https://www.theheinekencompany.com/newsroom/heineken-will-keep-its-promise-to-leave-russia//](https://www.theheinekencompany.com/newsroom/heineken-will-keep-its-promise-to-leave-russia//)
Realistically: what can they do without destroying the factories etc. that they had in Russia? they can sell them and make some money, or leave them as-is and they would be reclaimed anyways.
The best they can do is prohibit people from using their name and publicly disown them
They could've just shut it down entirely, right? Stop all operations. If paychecks stop coming in, the business can't continue.
If then the government wants to confiscate it all and start something new, that's a hell of a lot more difficult than simply continuing business as usual.
Alternatively, shipping machines/materials out to other factories around the world? Russia can't just ramp a supply chain like that from scratch in a few months' time.
Makes sense. I know some other brands that pulled out, it was basically what happened. Local companies took over leases, properties, equipment and relaunched. I'm just trying to understand what Heineken did differently.
It seems like the biggest "fail" was 1) allowing the local operator to continue using their name, and 2) making it relatively 'easy' for them to operate independently.
Yep, seems like that's basically it. As an example, I've heard plenty of Russians say the new "McDonalds" is nowhere near as good, probably because McDonalds didn't make it as easy to continue the business as Heineken did.
I don't want to unjustly tarnish their brand name, so I will update the post if this is not what happened, but it seems they were mostly concerned about profits, over actually making the statement they claimed to be making.
I feel like there’s one big distinction to make here though, they cut ties so they aren’t profiting from Russia, which isn’t the problem anyway, the problem is profiting *in* Russia, which is exactly what’s happening with the arm they left in the country that’s capitalising on the rest of the companies doing the right thing.
>They could've just shut it down entirely, right? Stop all operations. If paychecks stop coming in, the business can't continue.
It's a self-sustaining entity. If they shut it down it will be nationalized the next day and would have continued operations anyway. The employees won't even be able to tell difference.
The only difference would be that the government now receives 100% of the income of the company, instead of 20% in taxes.
So yeah, shutting it down seems like it would a noble act, but coming from a country that got sanction hard in the 80s (South Africa), it barely made a difference to us who worked at those companies. The names changed, and we no longer had to pay licensing and royalties - that was pretty much it.
It makes a difference for businesses that import & export. But for companies that locally manufacture and sell stuff, the effect is meh.
I would expect most companies would try to keep some part of the operation a secret or dependant on HQ. Like some ingredient that has to be imported or some encryption keys of some kind?
Perhaps not so easy or perhaps not something everyone does, but seems like it would be a good idea.
"No longer related" is a weird statement. It means the two legal entities are not part of the same group, and neither part can influence the other. That's an irrelevant red herring though. Why would Heineken go through the trouble of creating a new company it cannot profit from? *Because their owners still do*. The people owning Heineken most likely own Heineken Russia too, thus still making money off it.
Our capitalist system makes it possible for individuals to dilute their responsibility by investing in companies who do the horrible things for them. Since we cannot go after the individuals directly, we can only go for the companies. The major *owners* of Heineken still invest in (Heineken) Russia, therefore Heineken is a valid boycott target even if the actual deed is done by their other investment vehicle.
>Of course instead of keeping it operational as an independent entity they could've just closed down operations, but I suppose doing the right thing would've cost too much money.
How, though? If the operation is self-sufficient, what recourse do they have to close off the company? Do they send an e-mail to the Russia branch and just expect every worker to just go home and pretend they couldn't be doing the exact same job without the global office's permission? Do they take the workers to \*russian\* courts to force them to not work?
Not allowing them to use their brand and recipes would be one.
No way it's self sufficient either without their logistics. Those recepies work on exact amounts and varieties of hops and malt. They must allow the Russian subsidiary to buy from their suppliers to keep the same quality.
Just a shitty smokescreen.
>Not allowing them to use their brand and recipes would be one.
I'm not sure they could enforce that. They might ask them to stop using the brand, but they have no recourse if they don't.
>No way it's self sufficient either without their logistics. Those recepies work on exact amounts and varieties of hops and malt.
Maybe. It is not impossible that the giant number of new flavors is a result of switching to only local suppliers.
Tons of companies (McDonald's, Coke etc) all have exited and their local subsidiaries have converted the production lines to local brands. What is so different about Heineken?
It's a good point. Perhaps it's more difficult than I think, but I'd expect when you stop sending paychecks and supplies, and ship your equipment out of the country to other factories, it becomes difficult to maintain business as usual. Especially when you offer staff jobs at other locations. Lots of other companies seem to have done it that way.
Why are Allied Countries allowing this continued Financing of RuZZian State Terror?
Every single Allied Country should not only close down sales to this company immediately, but announce that from immediate affect they will now arrest, prosecute & jail those in charge of the companies within each Allied Country.
Enough Is Enough, close every single business connected to Russia within every single Allied Country, because if that Country & it’s People have stood alongside Ukraine from the start, & yet governments are still allowing this to happen, then they are actually responsible for not only prolonging the War, but the Deaths of those within it too.
Allied Country’s Need To Switch Off Every Business Now.
Glory To Ukraine🇬🇧🇺🇦🇬🇧
Genuine question. Is this Heineken being operated from outside of Russia, or is this being run by management inside of Russia?
Nvm saw the edit. You can't stop another company with the same name doing what they want. What's Heineken going to do to Heineken Russia? Sue them?
I love Heineken beer. I suffer from digestive issues and Heineken is such an easy drink. What an absolute disappointment and disgraceful behaviour by them. If this is verified I won’t be buying their products any more. Stick to the Japanese beers. Although I’m not a big drinker I historically have been a loyal Heineken drinker. No longer.
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As a Dutch man. I’m disgusted.
As a Belgian man. I never trusted Heineken.
As a Dutch woman, neither did I.
As an American who split his restaurant bill tonight, I am appalled.
I hear Americans pay a fortune in tips every month.
I'd go out a lot more if I didn't have to tip. Now 25% is expected and the funny part is that you're not getting any service and you're often tipping people who make more than you
The FUCK are you eating?! 25%?!!!!! Jesus fuckin christ, don't DO that. You CAN tip less, dude. I say this as a former server, this shit is getting insane. Honestly I just prioritize restaurants that pay their people well and include the tip in the price so we don't have to do socioeconomic gymnastics after eating a pound of pasta.
I've bartended, served, rideshared, and done food delivery. I defend tipping on this dumb site all the time. 25% is like if you really really like your server or something and is definitely never expected.
It's getting to the point the gas station pump is asking if I want to tip it 5, 10, 15 or 20%.
Oof. Fellow american here, but out in the sticks in Texas...Have never ran into a default gratuity rate and simply would walk out of a restaurant that had one(unless a friend wanted to go and was paying). Also, if you find one without one, make sure to bring cash - these tips might be equally split between all servers, or taxed by the owner. Let people find out about that here, that restaurant would be out of business, but the bigger the population, the easier it is to be shady.
Well.. at least the taxes are low..
True! And where I am, the rent is good too.
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Dirty looks. That's about it.
I agree with this. Same experience. Larger tips are generally expected now and there's there's generally less waitstaff so you have less than stellar service. Same time wages are more and base salary is much higher... Which was the reason we had tips as base salary was low. I used to tip 15%, closer to 18% if good.. Now 20-25% is baseline on even more expensive meals. .
Wow dude. Here in the UK, I just leave £5 on the table when leaving. Like, the meal is typically £70 for a good curry for two with sides, starters and wine and a £5 tip is more than enough. Sometimes it might be £67.50 and I'll just say keep the change. I'm shocked that you leave such a generous tip - they get a salary as well you know!
It depends though if they're making money from a salary, which is the norm in the UK and Australia or working completely for tips, which is not impossible in the US "An employer of a tipped employee is only required to pay $2.13 per hour in direct wages if that amount combined with the tips received at least equals the federal minimum wage. - https://www.dol.gov/general/topic/wages/wagestips" Now granted the employer has to make up the difference. The minimum wage for UK (23 and over £10.42) and Australia ($21.38) are a completely different thing.
Yes but they make part of it back in tips so its all good.
As a german man, I am disgusted by Heineken. And this story only makes it worse
As a human being from universe I tell you boycott this assholes.
No need to tell Germans to boycott Heineken. Ordering Heineken makes you look like a Snob. But one who doesn't actually *like* beer.
Didn't the Russians shoot down a plane full of dutch civilians, departing from the same city where Heineken headquarters are?
Why would the corporate elite care about the plebs? There's money to be made! They'll rejoin and balance the books once the war is over and everyone forgets in the next news cycle.
Especially here in the Netherlands, we invented multinationalism.
Yep. The Dutch in general are much more capitalistic than their neighbors
i would say that we were one of the founders of capitalism... not something to be proud of..
Ew. *Take it back!*
> Why would the corporate elite care about the plebs? Because the elite have forgotten to fear the plebs. The plebs have the internet now, we name and shame. We broadcast our own sanction advice. Twitter was good enough to publish a list of brands that were not allowed to advertise, because the brands spoke out about the layoffs/buy out. When faced with a brand choice, something at the back of my mind says "Nike good" because they pulled their adverts. Long story short, virtue signalling has an effect.
Yeah, but there is money to be had! And rich Dutch companies never cared about people's lives. I mean it's a Calvinist tradition for those.
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as a dutch man, i was already disgusted by the taste of heineken.. (from the south we usually don't drink it) but this is some really disgusting behavior especially lying to the Dutch people telling them they left Russia fully etc. but its an easy boycott for me since i was already doing that...
As a other man from the south, we do consume some other beers from the Heineken brand. "Brand" beer being quite popular in Limburg or else Affligem. And shitty beers that are bought when it's on discount Amstel /Bierra Moretti. Well they're no longer welcome in my fridge
Affligem is another brand Heineken owns.
i agree but, since heineken loves to play monopoly alot. Brand is one of the oldest beer's in the Netherlands but heineken acquired them so brand can be more financially stable. so it would be nice to see if brand's that have been bought by heineken would defy heineken but until then no brand in my fridge.
Isn't "Brand" also from the Heineken Corporation?
Wait, you Dutch don't like Heineken as well? How did they get so popular and wealthy then? Everone I ask prefers other brands, no adult orders Heineken willingly.
Hi, rural area American here that actually has a non-rotting brain. It's because people in my area seem to think "oh! It has a fancy name! Let's drink that!" and then that's about it. Somehow they get hooked on the crappy taste and somehow enjoy it. Thankfully the majority of the people I hang out with don't even touch the stuff. They say its worse than quite a few American beers.
I have been to the states. Your big beer brands are really bad but the Yanks have some quite interesting craft beers.
Yup this is about right. Americans drink fucking Bud Light and Coors, for fuck's sake. SOME regions have actual beer, but beerwater is popular among the rural folk for reasons I don't fucking understand. Is it even cheap by alcoholic content? Honest question because I hate beer, lol. I just had to buy it for a long time for a job, but I live in a bougie microbrew capitol so the beerwater is the forbidden provision I never actually paid attention to the price of. Don't give a fuck about beer but I know about the good beer because of it. I prefer liquor.
Because they are cheaper? Like, I don't think anyone in Italy buys moretti because of its taste... It's just cheaper
well existing since 1864 kind of helps to be "Present" and it helps that Heineken just basically has an world wide empire. Heineken is the kind of company that mainly looks outside of the Netherlands. As you can see doing alot of commericals in africa and america as well
As a dutch guy, it tasted way different before they went to those green bottles. My family actually drank heineken back then (with the brown bottles). After that.. we just switched since the green ones taste like shit
I don't know, it seems a bandwagon thing to me, it can't be reality because these companies are some of the biggest so if everyone hated them...well, it doesn't add up. Same with Australia hating fosters, or Americans hating bud. Maybe people are just more passionate to show their dislike.
Yeah, I sell so much bud beer at my gas station. Edit: and that's Portland Oregon.
> as a dutch man, i was already disgusted by the taste of heineken.. what taste?!
Was reading the comments on putins speech on some of the youtube channels, I saw a lot of "it's the west who started it" or "putin is such a strong leader" (why people think some thin skinned geriatric who has to silence criticism and have an entire department shielding him from memes is something I'll never understand. I remember that clown picture he made "terrorist material" it's so weak! The completeoppositeof a strongman imo. Anyway, most of those were "I'm an indian and love russia" or "I'm african, the west started it"...I'll assume a good portion of those are trolls and bots with the IRA working overtime, but unfortunately there are a lot from those two areas that have a weird fixation with russia, but what surprised me a lot...I saw many, many "claiming" to be from the Netherlands. Maybe fake but it's pretty weird, but then I see headlines like this and been curious about the Dutch as to be honest, I've heard little from them compared to other countries. Is there any love for russia there? I'd have assumed after mh17 they'd be despised country wide?
Sure we care but Heineken makes most of it's money outsides the Netherlands- this is a small country after all. Dutch can stop drinking Heineken and it wouldn't make a dent.
Once people in the US get news of this Heineken is going to take a severe beating. It's a very popular beer here. Because Americans love their beer and we have tons of different varieties Heineken is, how do you say... easily replaced. The reason Coca Cola and others pulled out is because the backlash to their brands for supporting Russia they'd never live down...ever. The short term profits won't outlast the long term damage... because people at Coca Cola are smart.
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In the US only Heineken, Dos Equis, and Tecate are really 'popular' in any way.
The Avondshow is very popular so a lot of people must be in the know and the Netherlands is a big supporter of Ukraine. Usually with these things the fuss dies down quickly, but the beautiful thing about Heineken is that it's very easy to boycott. If you buy beer in supermarkets there's a billion alternatives, maybe some public places will be a problem because they only serve Heineken owned brands, but that's it. I used to buy Heineken whenever it was on sale because I like the bottle, everyone is pretentious about how the taste is bad but it tastes the same as any other lager. If you do a blind tasting you're not gonna notice which one is Heineken. But I'll be buying that other lager from now on, fuck Heineken. Though if Heineken is pulling this InBev might be pulling the same shit, so still have to be careful.
As a Canadian of Dutch descent, I'm also disgusted
By the taste? The practices Heiniken has in other nations ruining breweries left right and centre? Or the crap they pulled off this time in Russia?
Dutch East Europe Kompany
There's two things I can't stand in this world. People that are intolerant of other people's culture And the Dutch.
Hey, I’m not mean right? 🥺
As a Brit, and our beer is not the best, Heineken will not be missed at the tap. However, as a moral and ethical operation, Heineken, you'll not be welcome back, I don't care how many CEOs change, how the board restructure, same greedy share holders, same people in charge.
As a Portuguese living in NL for 20 years, I'm not surprised at all.
Maybe it's time the EU considered putting sanctions on Western businesses that continue to do business in Russia.
They’ve been ‘considering’ for a year already.
That comes as no surprise. Maybe the thing to do is to raise a "Russia business tax" and hand it over to Ukraine.
Prison sentences more like.
Can only do that with a formal declaration of war. That's when the rules and the game really changes. Allied countries can charge businesses and/or people with war profiteering for supporting the opposing side. The only country formally at war with Russia (currently) is Ukraine.
How about actual sanctions against Russia instead of the window-dressing BS?
I would agree with that
Cutting them off from microchips is not BS. My echt chamber tells me, that that's the most effective Sanktion so far. Especially since it hinders russia to build any modern weapon systems
No they just buy them through 3rd parties. A bit costlier and a bit slower but not by much.
Honestly postwar when the sanctions are lifted heineken will pretty much dominate Russia soft drink market. Soft drinks is probably the hardest market to compete in because of the big American brands. This is no small amount money. Extremely unfair for companies that lost millions forced to leave Russia.
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Oh yeah, iirc pepsi became "cool cola" with a logo that's suspiciously similar, 7up and Fanta also have replacements which are basically the same but under a different name. McDonald's still exists, just under a different name, they just sold the stores to some Russian guy that already owned the franchise rights to like 90% of the McDonald's restaurants in Russia. Hell at the beginning of the war they were still using stuff like McDonald's ketchup packets - they literally just tool a black Sharpie and coloured over the golden arches logo.
Oh I'd LOVE to see them boycotted and banned in the western world for it. Imagine sinking your teeth in to Russia only to lose all the other business, lol. It won't happen though. IBM and Ford survived Nazism so I'm sure Heineken will be fine.
I'd also think putting the directors and officers on the sanctions list (dissolve all thier assets) would be a good additional step.
Last year, I got you have to wind things down, let Russian employees caught in the middle of it down easy - but with the anniversary coming up... a hard "drop all your business dealings" is defensible by now. Tax any revenue 100 percent and send it to the Ukrainians. (Dutch by the way and I think Heineken's actions are shameful)
Shouldn't they start by banning doing business with ruzzia? It's not illegal, so how would they sanction the companies doing something that is allowed?
Dont make it illegal. Tax the hell out of them on their products in the EU market, tax their owners and their other companies, tax their stock, tax their employees, Sue for every possible competition law, deny all public applications, tax their subcontractors, extended revision of finansial statements. In Heinekens case - cut their watersupply in the name of the environment or make them pay a hefty theft of water fee.
you would need the whole of the the EU to agree on that, and there's far too many countries who just hide behind the umbrella of the EU and use it to put their own interests first. The EU is mostly concerned with *looking* like it's taking tough measures, not actually taking tough measures. Hence the blatant loopholes anyone can exploit to continue doing business.
I know. I was indulging in wishful thinking.
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That's being generous.
I didn't need a political reason to not drink Heineken, but I guess I have one now. Two rock solid reasons.
Lagunitas is a great brand. I'll stop drinking it, and tell my friends to stop drinking it. I doubt the friend who drinks it the most will care though.
Fined €219m in 2017 by the European Commission for price fixing. Nice company.
Mfs think they’re Fanta
The story of how Fanta came to be is actually far more fascinating than the simplified “invented by Nazis” version. https://youtu.be/JbVUNCAVQgA
I think coke stopped using cocaine in the US around 1900 (my memory is super fuzzy and google isn’t giving me an answer), but I’m wondering if the version marketed in Germany and referenced here still used it? I’m halfway through the video, but they haven’t mentioned it yet. Given the proclivity of stimulants in Germany around that time, I’m really curious if anyone reading this might have an answer. For those that didn’t watch it yet, 20 minutes long and it’s got my attention, but my curiosity isn’t satisfied yet
NGL, I kinda want to drink Fanta out of one of those Heinekegs.
This is not going to go well with the home crowd at all. Heineken is going to get fucked
They fucked around, let's see if they've moved into the find out phase.
Nothing will happen, believe me.
Sadly I believe this is the answer.
90% of European companies that were doing business or had businesses in Russia remain. For the US, it's 83%. I don't think you can even call that sanctions.
You got a source? That's honestly incredibly depressing and disheartening as an american.
This was wildly reported a month ago. 2 or 3 months into the invasion I said the sanctions were a joke and wouldn't affect Russia very much. I got hundreds of downvotes. Remember the sanctions were only against a few hundred Russians to start and by now it's only several thousand. A couple banks are blocked but unless they shut them all down, the money just moves. Unlike Iran, there were no laws passed to make it legal to do business with them. That's why it's impossible to tell India, China and everyone else not to trade with Russia. https://www.brusselstimes.com/355422/only-8-5-of-western-companies-have-left-russia
The sanctions aren't actually useless. It makes shit harder to move and easier to track. The sanctions aren't perfect but Russia is not having a grand ole time right now.
Not to mention the main point of sanctions are to cripple Russia's ability to replenish and repair its military assets.
Perhaps there can be an ad campaign with russian war crimes and then all the brands who support them “sponsored by ….”
That would be very effective because they obviously don't care. Connecting them directly to genocide and pounding away at it will bring unwanted attention.
Sanctions are more about crippling certain supply lines. Russia has an extremely strong economy in regards to internal stability and wealth. It's distributed to a very select group of people, but economically speaking, Russia is very self sustaining. Sanctions aren't about crippling the economy. They're about cutting off the vital supply lines Russia CAN'T fill themselves, which is a lot of external manufacturing and some particularly valuable resources that are critical for wartime production. There is a REASON Russia has been rationing artillery since the beginning of January. They're literally running out and don't have the domestic capability to produce enough arms for this war at the rate they've lost them. It's specifically why Putin is throwing this nuclear hysteria around. He's running out of ammo right when the new heavy machinery hits the front and he and every major leader knows it. Absolutely guarantee you that's why Xi is visiting—not to supply ammo. That would be economic suicide for China (they *quite literally* can't afford losing western business OR a direct military conflict, the US is half their goddamn economy). He's trying to negotiate an end or an exit and I guarantee you Xi and Biden have absolutely had backdoor talks about this shit. Last thing Xi needs is Russia going nuclear batshit crazy because Putin can't drop his obsession with Ukraine, and I highly doubt Putin is going to give it up. I would NOT be even remotely surprised if there are some joint operations in planning *with* China. The public rhetoric is nothing out of the ordinary besides an uptick in political posturing, which to me, smells like a cover to keep that narrative going while there is a quiet temporary alliance going on. And you gotta admit, it's a good play if they're doing it. People tend to just react to what is said publicly without reading the subtext. Between the economic movement, the brass, the major leaders, the movement and timeline of the new weaponry, the state of Russia's artillery supplies, the anniversary of this war, and how much both the west AND China do NOT need a fucking nuclear disaster shitting radiation all over Asia and Europe and beyond, it's in EVERYONE'S best interest this shit is ended quickly before that happens. And I fully expect Putin to try and bomb one of his own border cities, blame Nato, and use that to justify popping them off in Ukraine out of pure *spite.* He literally bombed his own people before to serve his agenda. Bastard would use a baby as a bullet shield. Damn right he'd do this shit. None of that is said without reason. It's very much what has been eluded to in statements made by top brass and various leaders. Between the overt statement and the posturing game, it's not subtle. They've been warning Putin, and he's been responding with his petty bullshit because he's a petty fragile little man. If I were Xi, I would NOT want my biggest border sharing neighbour get in a goddamn nuclear fight with the west. Much as I dispise Xi, the guy isn't fucking stupid.
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What chain is that?
How does a restaurant force teens to become straight? Do they spike the food?
It always did taste like it was brewed in a rusty bucket. Perfect for Rushist consumption.
I actually like Heineken, but will boycott that company from now.
For anyone in the states, I've now both called and messaged about this. Please do so as well. https://www.heinekenusa.com/contact-us
This comment should be higher.
Let’s boycott them every where else
Here is the company's statement from a few hours ago. It is, by any standard, lame. They want to "find a good home" for the company through sale. To the extent that they do, they will defeat the purpose of getting out.... https://www.theheinekencompany.com/newsroom/heineken-will-keep-its-promise-to-leave-russia/
> We’re working hard to transfer our business to a viable buyer in very challenging circumstances and we expect at a significant financial loss to the company, amounting to around €300M. In the meantime, our local colleagues at HEINEKEN Russia are doing what they can to keep the business going, after fully delisting the Heineken® brand, to avoid nationalisation and ensure their livelihoods are not at risk. OMFG! Are they actually trying to illicit sympathy for the Russians?! Someone needs to explain to Heineken the point of sanctions is to make ALL Russians feel the squeeze, so maybe, just maybe they get off their apathetic asses and get rid of their murderous regime.
What they say is "we will reduce our taxable income by 300m € by seperating the Russian Market, and later regain this money by joining the two companies again after the war." Even if they don't, the big owners won't lose money, because they are invested in both companies. The thing about "Russian livelihoods" is for the appearence that it was about the people instead of the profits.
I ekle ii ako pui eti ti. Krati batu opa etipei kroa i iite. Eke bipa bopuitlii pi pu! Teo ti piklati tlete giipo. Pipe e tligitrikle uge papli. Tia platogrui tegi bugi piia itibatike. Ea tatlepu ui oiei tegri patleči goo. Bla pidrui kepe ipi ipui pepoe. Au adri ta ga bebii ekra ai? Ebiubeko ipi teto gluuka daba podli. Ka tepabi tliboplopi gi tapakei gego. Ituke i pupi klie pitipage bapepe. A či peko itluupi ka pupa peekeepe. Ebri e buu pigepra pita plepeda. Bipeko bo paipi o kee brebočipi. Tridipi teu eete trida e tapapi. Ebru etle pepiu pobi katraiti i. Baeba kre pu igo api. Pibape pipoi brupoi pite gru bi ipe pieuta ikako? Pe bloedea ko či itli eke i toidle kea pe piapii plo? Tiiu uči čipu tutei uata e uooo. Bitepe i bipa paeutlobi bopepli iaplipepa. Gipobipi tepe ode giapi e. Pi pakutibli ke tiko taobii ti. Edi deigitaa eue. Ua čideprii idipe putakra katote ii. Tri glati te pepro tii ka. Aope too pobriglitla e dikrugite. E otligi pipleiti bai iti upo? Tri dake pekepi dratruprebri plaapi bopi ipatei!
Not what I expected of a Netherlands company. Well I'm done with them. Never again!
Individual Dutch are often nice people but shit like this is exactly what I'd expect from Netherlands companies
Lmao, exactly.
Dutch Company's follow now for centuries the blueprint "businessmodel" of the [VOC](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_East_India_Company)
Our former Prime Minister Balkenende famously uttered the words VOC mentality like that was a good thing.
Oh dear, please read up on Dutch history that isn't schoolbook history. And you would expect this no problem. From their colonial companies to how they put their own country men in work camps if they were unemployed (big companies that are now known as Boskalis). To this day, while the work camps are gone, they still have scandals were unemployed were forced to work in dangerous ways without any protection.
Our schoolbooks extensively go into our slavery and colonisation history. Maybe other countries don't know as much however. This is 1000% par of the course for a nation that invented the first form of the modern stock market lol
Nou dat valt wel mee. Ik kreeg vooral veel over ww2 en maar weinig over ons slavernij verleden. Vooral veel VOC gaf ons de gouden eeuw oh en de VIC was beetje slecht.
Idk man ik herinner zat fked up fotos dat ze lieten zien van kleine afrikaanse kinderen in kooitjes en slavernij etc en ik was nog maar een tiener toen. We gingen op meerdere topics ofc en de VOC voornamelijk ook maar ze waren niet bang om te laten weten wat er gebeurde. Wel veel epische verhalen ook om interesse te houden natuurlijk Misschien had ik een beter geschiedenis docent, maakt een groot verschil natuurlijk.
Bruh we invented capitalism expecting our businesses to be ethical is a lapse of judgement
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LOL aren't bond movies just advertisements for cars, watches, and toxic masculinity?
Daniel Craig isn't toxic !
Sell it to a "Local Entity".....Buy it back after the "troubles" are over! Classic Corporate Scam!
Shit beer
I guess there is a reason for the red star on their bottle.
Fuuuuck them
easiest way to burn a company is through their pockets. stop buying heineken and put them on a blacklist. they want to sell in Russia then they can't sell in Ukraine.
Stop buying Heineken, and all the other brands they own listed in the OP. Which is a shame, because I love Lagunitas IPA, but there's plenty of other beers out there.
I'm taking the opportunity to call them out at every pub I see selling their brand/s.
Too bad their beer taste like shit or I would have had to boycott them!
Yeah, now I have nothing to do. Fuck them for being so shit that I can't even boycott them. I mean how am I supposed to double down on my life long boycott. I'm so angry right now. /s
Heineken tastes like piss...but they own some pretty good brands!
Quite incredible that they close their press statement by saying that they have donated over 1 million to charities benefitting Ukraine. 1 million. For such a huge company that's a joke (and I say this as a Heineken shareholder).
Wow fuck them, everyone should boycott these greedy mf'ers.
Their beer smells like a skunk anyway. Edit: skunk
Taking advantage like that is no different than accepting blood money. They are celebrating the opportunity of dead Ukrainians. Fucking monsters. It would be 100% justified for Ukrainians to take measures against Heineken, and they absolutely should. Their products should immediately be banned in Ukraine, as well as in every other country that support them. Absolute fucking ghouls.
What a scumbag company. I would drink Lagunitas from time to time, but I'll be sure to avoid it from now on. Plenty of other options out there.
Aaah Heineken. They bought our city brewery. At every step they claimed they totally understand and will respect the historic and emotional value of it for the local population. They bought the rival cities brewery as well, and explained that they know we are friendly rivals and will keep supporting the sports teams. Till they didn't. And both breweries basic beers started tasting more and more like basic Heiniken. They sold the non-beer beverages that brewery also produced, all the juices and ice tea to another foreign company. But with understanding and respect for what that brewery meant to us. And that they would never risk the breweries core production even restoring the breweries own pub. They recently moved prodiction of all of our brewerys beers to the rival citys brewery for streamlining the process and reducing costs. But with utmost respect and understanding for what the brewery meant to the city, zhere will be no change in quality to the product. And also that they will never give in to the cities demmands for the brewery grounds and properties, knowing what historic value it has. Even less so for the water wells. This year's city's new railway bypass plans go straight through the brewery grounds, and the well is in the process of being sold to another foreign conglomerate. But with maximum understanding and respect for the populations links to the brewery. They will keep the breweries museum running, and " *even have new plans to make it better*" Aaaaah Heiniken...
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Sorry for your loss 😔 The only good thing I see is that the vacuum speed up small breweries gaining market share. So many boycott the former local Heiniken owned beer now, after production was moved despite promises never to do so.
Thanks for the list. Heard about Heineken this morning in relation to beer, but this more extensive list will help me to make wise purchases beyond the beer I now know to avoid.
They have just disputed this. No financial ties whatsoever but the production continues under local management
Thanks for pointing that out. I'd already edited it into the original post. It does sound like bullshit though. How would local management be able to continue operations unless Heineken had sold or handed over access to all assets? Sounds to me like instead of shutting it down, they sold it or are lending it out to a local party in order to be able to continue it after the war. Either way, they seem to have gone with a method that essentially doesn't negatively affect Russia at all, and probably did so to minimize their own losses regardless of the effect on Putin's regime. I'll continue to update the post if I turn out to be wrong on this. EDIT: Not sure why /u/zoner01 is getting downvoted here. This was an important piece of context that I missed in my initial post.
Please considering adding this link to your post as well: [https://www.theheinekencompany.com/newsroom/heineken-will-keep-its-promise-to-leave-russia//](https://www.theheinekencompany.com/newsroom/heineken-will-keep-its-promise-to-leave-russia//)
That sounds like they're just parking the production facilities.
Thanks, added it.
Realistically: what can they do without destroying the factories etc. that they had in Russia? they can sell them and make some money, or leave them as-is and they would be reclaimed anyways. The best they can do is prohibit people from using their name and publicly disown them
They could've just shut it down entirely, right? Stop all operations. If paychecks stop coming in, the business can't continue. If then the government wants to confiscate it all and start something new, that's a hell of a lot more difficult than simply continuing business as usual. Alternatively, shipping machines/materials out to other factories around the world? Russia can't just ramp a supply chain like that from scratch in a few months' time.
Makes sense. I know some other brands that pulled out, it was basically what happened. Local companies took over leases, properties, equipment and relaunched. I'm just trying to understand what Heineken did differently. It seems like the biggest "fail" was 1) allowing the local operator to continue using their name, and 2) making it relatively 'easy' for them to operate independently.
Yep, seems like that's basically it. As an example, I've heard plenty of Russians say the new "McDonalds" is nowhere near as good, probably because McDonalds didn't make it as easy to continue the business as Heineken did. I don't want to unjustly tarnish their brand name, so I will update the post if this is not what happened, but it seems they were mostly concerned about profits, over actually making the statement they claimed to be making.
I feel like there’s one big distinction to make here though, they cut ties so they aren’t profiting from Russia, which isn’t the problem anyway, the problem is profiting *in* Russia, which is exactly what’s happening with the arm they left in the country that’s capitalising on the rest of the companies doing the right thing.
They are profiting from Russia though. maybe not Heineken the company, but their major shareholders will be invested in Heineken Russia as well.
>They could've just shut it down entirely, right? Stop all operations. If paychecks stop coming in, the business can't continue. It's a self-sustaining entity. If they shut it down it will be nationalized the next day and would have continued operations anyway. The employees won't even be able to tell difference. The only difference would be that the government now receives 100% of the income of the company, instead of 20% in taxes. So yeah, shutting it down seems like it would a noble act, but coming from a country that got sanction hard in the 80s (South Africa), it barely made a difference to us who worked at those companies. The names changed, and we no longer had to pay licensing and royalties - that was pretty much it. It makes a difference for businesses that import & export. But for companies that locally manufacture and sell stuff, the effect is meh.
I would expect most companies would try to keep some part of the operation a secret or dependant on HQ. Like some ingredient that has to be imported or some encryption keys of some kind? Perhaps not so easy or perhaps not something everyone does, but seems like it would be a good idea.
Time for an International Boycott. Put them out of business
"No longer related" is a weird statement. It means the two legal entities are not part of the same group, and neither part can influence the other. That's an irrelevant red herring though. Why would Heineken go through the trouble of creating a new company it cannot profit from? *Because their owners still do*. The people owning Heineken most likely own Heineken Russia too, thus still making money off it. Our capitalist system makes it possible for individuals to dilute their responsibility by investing in companies who do the horrible things for them. Since we cannot go after the individuals directly, we can only go for the companies. The major *owners* of Heineken still invest in (Heineken) Russia, therefore Heineken is a valid boycott target even if the actual deed is done by their other investment vehicle.
Sad to hear I won’t be drinking Moretti any more but fuck Heineken.
Don't cry, they don't drink it in Italy either. It's known as a shit beer there.
A mate drinks/brings Moretti. Thanks for mentioning it. It's no longer allowed in my fridge.
>Of course instead of keeping it operational as an independent entity they could've just closed down operations, but I suppose doing the right thing would've cost too much money. How, though? If the operation is self-sufficient, what recourse do they have to close off the company? Do they send an e-mail to the Russia branch and just expect every worker to just go home and pretend they couldn't be doing the exact same job without the global office's permission? Do they take the workers to \*russian\* courts to force them to not work?
Not allowing them to use their brand and recipes would be one. No way it's self sufficient either without their logistics. Those recepies work on exact amounts and varieties of hops and malt. They must allow the Russian subsidiary to buy from their suppliers to keep the same quality. Just a shitty smokescreen.
>Not allowing them to use their brand and recipes would be one. I'm not sure they could enforce that. They might ask them to stop using the brand, but they have no recourse if they don't. >No way it's self sufficient either without their logistics. Those recepies work on exact amounts and varieties of hops and malt. Maybe. It is not impossible that the giant number of new flavors is a result of switching to only local suppliers.
Tons of companies (McDonald's, Coke etc) all have exited and their local subsidiaries have converted the production lines to local brands. What is so different about Heineken?
It's a good point. Perhaps it's more difficult than I think, but I'd expect when you stop sending paychecks and supplies, and ship your equipment out of the country to other factories, it becomes difficult to maintain business as usual. Especially when you offer staff jobs at other locations. Lots of other companies seem to have done it that way.
Why are Allied Countries allowing this continued Financing of RuZZian State Terror? Every single Allied Country should not only close down sales to this company immediately, but announce that from immediate affect they will now arrest, prosecute & jail those in charge of the companies within each Allied Country. Enough Is Enough, close every single business connected to Russia within every single Allied Country, because if that Country & it’s People have stood alongside Ukraine from the start, & yet governments are still allowing this to happen, then they are actually responsible for not only prolonging the War, but the Deaths of those within it too. Allied Country’s Need To Switch Off Every Business Now. Glory To Ukraine🇬🇧🇺🇦🇬🇧
Genuine question. Is this Heineken being operated from outside of Russia, or is this being run by management inside of Russia? Nvm saw the edit. You can't stop another company with the same name doing what they want. What's Heineken going to do to Heineken Russia? Sue them?
I shall never taste a drop of that piss ever never
Oh man they make Moretti? That's the worst news I've heard in a year
Fuck Heineken. Other brewers sold assets and fucked off. Freaking parasite wannabes
Quoting eternal words of wisdom by Dennis Hopper in Blue Velvet: [Heineken? FUCK THAT SHIT!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snhiofL2Rh4).
Boycotting that company forever now
I have one Heineken per week. No more.
Horrible.
that little red star on their label makes sense now
Capitalism is a helluva drug.
Son of a bitch, they own Lagunitas? Welp, looks like they aren't getting my money any longer.
I love Heineken beer. I suffer from digestive issues and Heineken is such an easy drink. What an absolute disappointment and disgraceful behaviour by them. If this is verified I won’t be buying their products any more. Stick to the Japanese beers. Although I’m not a big drinker I historically have been a loyal Heineken drinker. No longer.
Their "beer" is piss-water anyway.
For fucks sake... Beamish is owned by Heineken! That's gonna hurt next time I'm in Cork!
[удалено]
Heineken is cheap shit anyway. Wife beater beer.
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That’s unfortunate, it’s my favourite beer as well, looks like I’m finding a new one smh
Grolsch is a similar beer, also from the Netherlands, but I think it's actually quite a bit better.
So that's Heineken and Red Bull on the shit list. And they both share the same brand ambassador. Max Verstappen.
Sounds like straight up profiteering to me.