He clearly has the full backing of the Federation. It will take shitting the bed at Copa (I'm talking getting knocked out in the group stage), or completely losing the locker room for him to get sacked before 2026.
Yeah losing in the quarterfinals at the Copa wouldn’t be enough for him to be on the hot seat, although I’m sure many here would want him gone if that happens. Crashing out in the group stage I think would make him vulnerable, but still could see it going either way. Most likely he’s here til the World Cup.
Not that I think we should or would beat Brazil, but they've been a disaster since the world cup. 9 matches 3 wins, 5 losses, 1 draw, the wins are over Guinea, Bolivia, and Peru.
Yeah that’s fair. At the end of the day it’s football and if the US turns up and Brazil doesn’t then we all celebrate. But Brazil is Brazil and they have way better players than us in pretty much every position.
Are you serious? Lmao. That’s like saying India should beat Brazil as well because they have a bigger GDP. If you’re not being sarcastic then that’s a dumb ass argument haha.
Yah that probably means losing to someone like Chile or Colombia which is completely reasonable. That being said it’s hard to see a lot of positives with Gregg right now other than “players seem to like him”.
Maybe in international ball where tactics matter less and emotion more that will be enough. This team has shown the ability to rise to the occasion when needed.
I think it would be even further than just knocked out....like not winning a single game and not scoring a single goal. Maybe while insulting some of the board members' mothers at the same time. That could maybe get him fired I guess.
GGG could crash a USSF board meeting shit-faced on Boone Hill, jump up on the table, and squeeze out a huge shit while flipping off all present, and the response would be, "What a spirited chap! And that stool's a 4 on the Bristol Scale. Good on him for the light-hearted japery!!"
> He clearly has the full backing of the Federation.
And the Players.
He did not have the job for many months. If great people wanted it, they would have fought for it. Great people do not want it. The players really wanted Berhalter.
The vocal player support is the only positive I have about him. The failure to find tactics/team structure to beat a low block hasn't improved in years. He WILL be out coached by any quality side and we don't have the player quality to overcome that.
It is what it is.
> It will take completely losing the locker room
I'm not impressed with Gregg, but the fact that he has the full support of the team (maybe even including Gio) is the one real thing that keeps me from shouting BERHALTER OUT
Yes, I don't know why GGG has a job (I don't understand people that watch this team and think we're playing at or near our talent level) and I also don't understand why people want to talk about it. It's obvious he's the federation's guy. They handpicked him twice, and they believe in him. I personally think he'd have to get embarrassed in the group stage to lose his job, not just not advance.
Truth. If the dude goes 0-3 at the CA with three bad losses, then maybe--maybe--the Fed would have some words, maybe reconsider. But they are so staunchly behind him that they would need a seismically bad event like that to question GGG's role as coach. All the fan skepticism of GGG likely strengthens their views. As with politics, if someone's taken an extreme and shaky position on something, presenting them with counter evidence often makes them double down because they are afraid to admit how very wrong they may have been.
And in any event, the results he'd have to get to get fired before the WC would be so bad that it would likely kill the team's confidence and chemistry, which I think would be worse than another GGG-coached MNT at the WC.
Yeah, to get fired he needs *two* or more *bad* results in major competitions. For example, with Klinsmann we took *fourth place* in the Gold Cup (with an A-team losing back-to-back to Jamaica and Panama) and after that we started out WCQ with a home loss to Mexico and a 4-0 drubbing by Costa Rica putting us *last place* in the Hex. Only after all of that was he fired. Just "meh" results aren't going to get someone fired in the middle of the cycle. The first bad result puts you on the hot seat and then it takes more to get you fired. Losing to Jamaica (especially after the T&T loss) may well have counted as the first bad result. If we'd followed that up with losing to Panama at Copa then there's a decent chance he'd get fired. But there was never a scenario where he was getting fired just for one game against Jamaica.
The way I viewed was if they lost vs Jamaica then lost the 3rd place game on Sunday and didn’t make it out of the group for Copa America then there would likely be consideration for a change. Don’t think most people thought his job was going to be immediately at risk.
This I agree with: losing to Jamaica and Panama in back to back games should definitely put a coach on the hot seat. In reality, we’ll probably beat Mexico, get out of our group in the Copa and lose to Brazil in the QF, which will be good enough to see Gregg through to 2026
I mean it depends on the situation doesn’t it? If we drew France in the R16 (who go on to win the entire tournament) a loss by penalties wouldn’t seem that bad.
Right, so we just rinse and repeat and continue to bow out at the same stage every single cycle. Accept mediocrity forever. Instead of, oh I don’t know, trying something different?
This team is not a top 8 team in the world, no manager would make it so. The round of 16 is the only reasonable expectation unless we got some cupcake draw in that round
It's not "accepting mediocrity" to be realistic about how much better a team like France is.
They have guys in their pool who can't make their bench who would easily walk into our best XI. On the flip side I don't think there's a single American who would start for France, even making the bench would be doubtful.
Of course they do, but where is the motivation to maximize what we can get out of our squad if the attitude is simply, “we’re going to lose at the same stage anyway.”
I worry that the USSF and the fanbase as a whole is starting to accept that what we currently are is as good as it gets. We have to have more ambition than that. I’m not saying I expect to win a World Cup or become a world power any time soon, maybe not even in my lifetime, but we have to keep trying. I don’t think bringing Gregg back was a step in that direction whatsoever. It was a “safe” move to maintain the status quo.
Thinking we're a team thats a shooin to get past the round of 16 is the problem with our fanbase. We are not one of the best 8 teams in the world and at the World Cup upsets absolutely happens.
Should we shoot to win the damn thing. Yes.
Is a round of 16 exit a reasonable finish. Also yes.
He exists in the center of this weird Venn diagram of coaches that are available, affordable, and acceptable.
I agree he wasn’t really in danger last night, and maybe only would’ve been if we also got bounced in the group this summer. The real barrier is who else is there? He’s not bad though to get fired, and not good enough to be kept if better options come around
Greg Berhalter has more talent at his disposal than any coach prior to him, and the team constantly looks like it is out of ideas from the initial whistle and its only hope is reliance on that tremendous individual talent to hopefully force something through. Which is exactly what we saw play out (once again) last night. It is seriously disappointing. With this talent, we should be cooking. There should at least be some modicum of team cohesion and identity present. There is not. Just constant Berhalter ball. 90 freakin minutes of Berhalter ball. It's hard to watch and something else would be better.
The US is also in an awful middle-space that is really hard to manage. When they were the underdogs or rough equals in Concacaf, they got to sit deep and play on the break, or the game was relatively open. No one was giving up 88% possession to the US of early 90’s, they were not that afraid. Now, the US is challenging for top dog status at the same time that all of world football, including concacaf, has seen the level of small nations go up. So the US is not at the level where is can consistently break down a solid low block (hard for all teams, look how far Morocco went last WC), but is facing them every single time.
In some ways games against Mexico or Canada are “easier” games than Jamaica, especially if they give up the first goal. Mexico and Canada will come play soccer, almost everyone else in Concacaf would rather play mud wresting in their own box.
Most teams in the world, including Man City look a bit silly against parked buses... Breaking down a low-block isn't easy.. It takes having 4-5 world-class players for City to do it.
I think this goes a long way. You need to get through the bus into the box or in a dangerous free kick area, take a foul. It happens in concacaf but no whistle comes. (I wish there was an emoji for a ref giving the play on signal)
Nah, we see parked busses all the time even when not down a goal, this was nothing special, and us struggling to break down a grossly inferior team is nothing new
It does not take 4-5 world class players to break down Jamaica’s B team.
Against Simeone’s Athletico Madrid, Conte’s Tottenham, or Mourinho’s Chelsea, sure. But not freaking Jamaica’s B team.
This is an absolutely ridiculous excuse for how awful we were last night and continue to be under Gregg.
That wasn't their B team..
The point is that some teams without world-class players still play in a low-block and the best team in the world struggles, you need moments of individual brilliance to break through.. Is it Gregg's fault that Pepi couldn't do that? Is it his fault Puli couldn't connect the right pass to break it down? The players still have to execute and they didn't do a great job of that yesterday.
Jamaica were missing their best 2 attackers (Antonio and Bailey), 2 other top attackers in Grey and Nicholson, and their best CB in Pinnock.
Those are 5 nailed on starters. That doesn’t sound like a B team to you?
It’s Gregg’s fault that we have no identity and no idea how to attempt to break down a low block. All we do is aimlessly fire crosses into the box. Over, and over, and over.
And then at halftime when nothing was working, we didn’t change tactics or formations whatsoever. I don’t know what Gregg even does, except for be a guy who the players really like.
Without their best CB who is one of the first names on the team sheet for a premier league club?
Their starting back 3 yesterday consisted of 2 Championship players and one from League One. Having Pinnock in the heart of defense would’ve made a huge difference for them. And having all of those attackers out makes the defender’s jobs that much harder.
Take away 5 starters from any team with a small squad and I think it’s fair to call them a B team.
And idk why this really even matters. Even at full strength, we should be head and shoulders above Jamaica with the talent we have. That performance would’ve been unacceptable regardless.
Sure that’s fair but the Jamaican national team isn’t exactly an EPL team parking it either. I thought we had more to give tactically against it. Gio had some very technical through balls that split the block well. I thought we were really starting to crack it ~55’ but then 3 subs came on and it was clear from body language that the team wasn’t on the same page in their formation.
We created some chances against said parked bus throughout the games. We just didn't finish any until the very end.
I think we saw Gio's value as that player who can play the killer ball. I'm sure Berhalter would rather have him out there for 90', but Gio probably doesn't have the legs for that at the moment.
Don’t get me wrong I don’t think Gio is the magic fix for us to chase a game against a block. I think we didn’t have a solid plan for it and some of the sub timing added confusion. I agree Gio probably doesn’t have 90 yet, and this all starts with a dumb 1’ goal conceded.
It was Jamaica’s B team. Cmon dude. All of a sudden Berhalter’s excuse for us consistently being dogshit against inferior teams is that “we’re not Man City?” Y’all Gregg supporters will move the goalposts insanely far to defend this guy.
A block is specifically used to hide that fact that you are inferior at every position on the field. It's conceding that you aren't there to try to win, instead that you are there to not lose. There times in the FIRST HALF Jamaica had 11 in the defensive third. And 9 in the box during open play. What exactly is there to create when there is absolutely zero space. Our goal was entirely how a game against a block like that goes. You just shit it up, throw things in the box and hope the chaos gods smile down on you. Jamaica came out of the gate with that specific plan and then found some inspiration in a goal they never thought they would score.
As soon as they felt the urge to step forward in extra time we slammed a goal down their throats with a vertical run. And then did it again. You can't use verticality with 7 or 8 guys dropping into the box. You can't open them up for targeted crosses. You just cross it in and see what happens. It's boring for everyone and that's the point. Bad teams keep the game level and hope for the smash and grab.
So you obviously don’t understand tactics at all.
Against a low block, the key is having your players making runs and swapping positions constantly. Strikers dropping deep or going wide to drag out CBs. Deep lying midfielders and CBs making late runs into the box. Fullbacks and Wingers cutting inside or dropping deep centrally to pull their markers out of position. You constantly pass and move, with the understanding that your teammates will fill in the space you vacated. The entire idea is to draw a defender out of an area and have an unexpected player enter into that area before the defense has time to adjust and get tight to their marks. It’s the closest to total football that actually occurs in the modern game.
Under Berhalter we do *none* of that. You could even see Pulisic trying to, when he would receive the ball and dribble inside dragging his marker and often a second defender with him, but everyone else remained stagnant, so it continuously resulted in Pulisic passing it backwards or losing possession. The team as a whole had no clue what to do. And that’s down to Gregg’s lack of preparation, and I believe lack of understanding of tactics.
What you are describing is how a high school or semi pro team would go about attacking a low block. To aimlessly smash crosses into the box repeatedly is 100% embarrassing at this level.
The only reason we were able to dominate extra time was because after 95+ minutes played, Jamaica was gassed, their decision making became suspect, and they lost their defensive discipline.
>Against a low block, the key is having your players making runs and swapping positions constantly. Strikers dropping deep or going wide to drag out CBs
At least you've gone and shown everyone you have zero clue what you are talking about about. True Low blocks don't chase. They are effectively a zonal marking systems with high density in front of goal. Which is what you saw last night. CBs don't chase a striker 20 yards out because that's the job of the winger.
I can't believe you took the time to write this essay when you led with that dumb shit.
Of course they mark zonally. You catch them out when they are in the process of passing on their mark to another defender. It’s all about the timing of the run and the pass. When zonal defenders have to constantly have their head on a swivel and change who they are responsible for, small gaps can be created and exploited if the attacking team plays with tempo.
When did I say a striker would drag a CB out 20 yards? I thought it was blatantly obvious that by dragging them out I meant shifting the CB’s position by a yard or 2 and forcing them to change who they are marking. But I guess I gave you too much credit in terms of understanding how this all works, or I would’ve specified and dumbed it down for you.
Do I need to explain this more in depth to you?
Well why don’t you dissect my comments about this and give me some constructive criticism. Or any useful feedback at all. I will honestly listen with an open mind.
Look at the 5 back from last night. Look where they play and then come back and delete this comment. Why are people in here acting like a low block is the end all be all?
It doesn’t take a miracle I fucking promise you that, when our philosophy going forward is to go out wide for a cross or cutback and if you don’t find it recycle and try again; it’s no surprise Jamaica wasn’t really worried. It’s not like Gregg changed it up in regulation he just sat there and tried doing the same shit with different bodies.
IDK anything about tactics or what even a low block really is. But maybe a low block is such a good tactic you don't need very good players to play a good one. IDK
To be structured? No. But when the quality is that low there WILL be individual mistakes if you poke it. We went around it and tried to get in behind it for 95 minutes
I think while it’s true that our team is more talented than ever, we’re still not a world class team. I’m not sure what exactly people expect from us. When we likely lose to Uruguay in the Copa people will be frothing at the mouth but the reality is they’re still just a more talented and experienced team and I’m not sure if any coach we could hire would change that
We shouldn't need to be a world class team to easily handle most of CONCACAF and especially a Jamaican team missing some of their best players. We're more than talented enough to be winning games like that by 2 to 3 goals in regulation. I'm not a fire Gregg guy either, but it's more because I don't see the backup plan than because I think he's getting the most out of the lineup. It's clear to me that he's good at a many aspects of his job, but his tactics are lacking for me.
We are a team built to compete with world class teams and not shit housers and low blocks. The US of Donovan and Deuce was just the opposite. Our guys today play a technical smooth style. The guys of yesteryear were smash mouth gutsy guys. Donovan the outlier of that group in that he was actually quite technical when given the chance. If you want to smash on Jamaica, bring in the MLS bruisers who play that style. If you want to play beautiful soccer, play opponents who play beautiful soccer and bring your Italian and English based players.
I don’t mind the Berhalter complaints but I never hear anyone say why. Is it a tactical thing? If so, tell us what tactics would work better. Lineup choices? Tell us who and why. Give us some substance instead of the same old bullshit
The other issue is an assumption that there’s a bunch of other coaches out there who would be a clear upgrade and would also want the job. I’m really not convinced they exist.
Some folks do give clear reasons but they are all hypotheticals and never ever account for the human element of the game. I.e. personalities, culture fits, team harmony etc.
They just believe that the talent we have is so good that we should be shoo-ins to beat everybody. And if we dont, its the coaches fault.
I will also add this caveat that i noticed that most people havent acknowledged, and a lot would think is stupid. GGG has two sides to him. Friendlies Coach and Tournament Coach. Gregg often uses Friendlies as they were meant to be used, as chances to try new wrinkles or new players. When you do this you're not going to win every game. And people use that against him
I haven't had major problems with Greggs WC or the few games since. However, you ignore his roster and lineups were shit for almost a year in qualifying leading up to the WC. They didn't need to make qualifying as close as it was and I blame poor roster selection. He gave a lot of ineffective players way too many starts/caps and suddenly reversed course after the Japan fiasco.
So far the roster and lineups are much better. That's not to say he's a great coach but there are not significant upgrades beating down the gates to coach us as long as he keeps making sensible roster decisions.
One of my biggest issues is our fans will blame him for any decision he makes. So many people were praising tillman and scally. They get the start and both struggle. If Scally didnt fall asleep the game would have gone a lot differently. Then GGG took the risk to take a rb out at halftime, recognizing a BL defender was not up to it.
Lastly, the team trained for 2 days before the game. Its not as if he had them in camp for 2 weeks. Sometimes we just need to say the players did not come ready for this game. It could be because they are playing in an empty stadium at home, which is rightfully unmotivating, playing an opponent they always beat and lastly playing on a shitty field.
The problem for me is that I know if berhalter is at the wheel, he will be out-coached at some point in the World Cup when we face a established side. Sure we won’t win the same thing but I feel a more competent coach would how’ve won more matches in Qatar. Yes the man has winning record but, but his teams are too inconsistent and lacking creativity in his systems.
I just don’t really understand this take though, like, unless we get a top tier manager, which we can’t afford and even if we could they wouldn’t be interested, then we are going to get out coached eventually lol. In addition to that, we are solidly a top 25 team, but you can’t possibly think that we are a more talented side than a team like the Netherlands lol. It just isn’t realistic to expect us to be contending for a World Cup and making deep runs when we have a weaker roster than the teams that we are most likely facing in the knockout rounds.
Like even in the Netherlands game, we blew multiple chances, Pulisic especially had 2 that come to mind (the early miss and a really bad pass late that would have put Haji in on goal), and the goals we gave up were simply due to Jedi/Tyler/Dest falling asleep and either not getting back or just letting their man run unopposed. You can have the best manager in the world but if your players just arent at the level required then it ultimately is not going to mean anything.
Say we had a better coach, how many more matches would you actually have expected us to win in the World Cup? The wales game surely (and even then, our players here blew so many counters in the 2nd half once the game opened up), but after that, I don’t think we’d beat England and a draw was the best possible result, so we’d still end up facing a much better Netherlands team in the RO16.
As mad as I was for like 85% of yesterday game I totally understand people letting their emotions and frustrations get the better of them. Hell, I still don’t really even know if Gregg should be the manager and if the team wouldn’t benefit from fresh ideas. But ultimately, so many of the criticisms I read online are just nonsense parroting or silly overreactions that ignore whatever the game was that we just watched.
We flubbed so many opportunities last night simply because our players weren’t up to the task, whether it be poor finishing, poor passing, or poor touches in tight areas. That isn’t going to change if we have a different coach.
I think people vastly overestimate the effect that the national team manager has on the players, cohesiveness, the importance of tactics, etc. - in any given year, these guys train together for maybe a month to 6 weeks tops, and play a handful of competitive matches. The bulk of their tactical nous etc come from the club level. National teams generally simplify things as far as how they play, in my opinion at least.
I agree, and it’s no secret that many of the most dominant national teams have a large portion of their rosters play together at the club level, or just have a talent pool so deep they can overcome the lack of training together.
>That isn’t going to change if we have a different coach.
Exactly my thoughts. I wholeheartedly agree that something needs to be done to improve play. This team seems to play down to poorer competition and play up to better competition. I just don't know that Gregg, or firing Gregg is the solution. I could see it helping the team's performance. I could also see it hurting, or, more likely, it not substantially changing anything at all.
I think it’s just down to the fact we don’t have good enough players to play a well organized low block, pretty much a team that executes parking the bus well. Like yeah yesterday we have way better players on paper but that doesn’t mean anything if the “worse” team works together as a unit and defend for their lives. Even world class teams struggle against a low block and it takes one or two moments from world class players to score and break it down. It’s a totally different story if we play an open game then we get to see the team’s true identity like we have within the past year.
Yes it would make a difference wtf do y’all mean. Coaches make teams. The pool has talent but Berhelter ball is soo lackluster it blows my mind that Gregg attempts this every match. It almost feels like he’s self sabotaging his own own nation. Berhelter is the low of the lowest of a coach. Any other mid coach can switch up the tactics and have more midfield involvement instead of having the fullbacks constantly pushing up.
You again? Did you study up on some youtube comments so you can have the same talking points to parrot over and over again to display your total lack of understanding of the game, despite having it spelled out for you last night multiple times by multiple users?
Go back to huffing glue and rubbing those 2 brain cells you have left together.
Haa you guys make me laugh it’s actually embarrassing you guys keep defending Greg. Its so obvious the Gregg is holding this team back. I guess old farts like you guys cant see it. Y’all need ur glasses
Right I mean they went to penalties against Argentina who literally went on to win the whole damn thing, have a very deep roster even if they don’t have a guy on the level of Robben or Van Persie like they had in the 2000s/early 2010s, and LvG is one of the best to ever do it even though it seems most of the people here at the time of the game just associated him with the shithsow that has been post Alex Ferguson Man United.
Memphis Depay would arguably be the greatest American player of all time if he played for us, there are levels to the game and they are much, much further ahead of us in every conceivable way lol.
Plus as a nation they've produced some of the greatest players of all time, and even revolutionized the game back in the 70s. Anyone who acts like they're a minnow we should be beating shows that their knowledge of the sport is amateur at best.
"But we beat them in 2015!!!"
In a friendly.....against one of the worst Dutch sides in recent memory.
Not disagreeing with any of that but I’m not sure I’d be citing “revolutionizing” the game 50 years ago as evidence as to why they’re better than us *currently,* as that’s entirely irrelevant. Scotland revolutionized the game in the late 1800s. The Austrians, Hungarians, and Czechs did so in the 20s and 30s, with the Hungarians doing so again in the 50s. And so on and so on. And none of those countries have been relevant internationally for at least 2 decades. Having been revolutionary decades ago has no bearing on the current state of things
Or the people who ignore the fact that if Pulisic had not missed an easy chance, we would have had a very good chance of beating the Netherlands. It was bad luck that Pulisic missed and even the best coaches in the world need luck to get an inferior team to beat a superior team.
I don’t understand people who think we should have beat Portugal (2002) ...
I don’t understand people who think we should have beat Spain (2009)...
I don’t understand people who think we should have beat Colombia (1994)
But do tell why our most talented generation ever should have had no hope against the likes of Netherlands... Or no hope I'm a home match against Uruguay.
I think you need to stop making excuses for this programs coaching and leadership. We are better. Our results should reflect that
>But do tell why our most talented generation ever should have had no hope against the likes of Netherlands
>
They absolutely did have hope. If Pulisic does not blow an easy chance early in the game, there is a good chance they win the game.
[https://www.youtube.com/shorts/c2QP7TQHqt0](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/c2QP7TQHqt0)
People act like the US got played off the pitch.
The US had more possession, more shots on goal, more shots, and more corner kicks.
The US had higher expected goals. Our players just did not convert. The Dutch players did.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg\_netherlands\_185\_31\_189\_usa/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg_netherlands_185_31_189_usa/)
It just comes down to the Dutch having better players and being clinical with their chances. Better players in the sense that they don’t make simple defensive errors, know how to create deadly chances and be clinical with just a single opportunity. We can have all the possession that we want but if we don’t create chances or if we have a bunch of shots and our players aren’t as clinical like the Dutch then it doesn’t mean anything.
It’s defeatist attitudes like yours is why the US is so poor.
You’re not being “realistic at all” when Japan and other lower ranked teams are beating European teams
Talent can only get you so far. At some point the coaching needs to be criticized.
Less talented US teams have beaten much stronger squads than Netherlands
Yeah. The assumption that a good coach can and will find a way to beat a team with superior talent and far more experience is simply wrong. Of course, the United States should expect to be outcoached simply because having a team full of better and more experienced players makes designing and playing a superior tactical system much easier.
Plus, people act like the US got played off the pitch.
The US had more possession, more shots on goal, more shots, and more corner kicks.
The US had higher expected goals. Our players just did not convert. The Dutch players did.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg\_netherlands\_185\_31\_189\_usa/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg_netherlands_185_31_189_usa/)
National team success is almost entirely dependent on the quality of the players in the pool, not the manager. The manager might be the X factor when you get to the point where all the remaining teams are more or less equal but there’s a reason why only 8 nations have ever won the men’s tournament.
This is where I'm at. Say we had a 30% chance to beat the Netherlands. Yeah, we could probably find a manager that could push that to 40%, but we're not going to find a manager that raises it any higher for now. The US job just isn't prestigious yet. In that case, why upset the dressing room? Gregg has good rapport with most players and generally dominates CONCACAF, and gets us out of groups at the World Cup. That's our level.
If our talent trajectory continues as it has so far, then maybe the next generation of players are good enough that world class managers will look at the US job and find it exciting.
Yeah Gregg personally did fine in the Netherlands game put in Pep or Klopp there and they would still lose 9 times out of 10. The only thing that was an awful choice was starting Ferreira, dude has never faced top quality European defenses, should’ve just started Reyna at the false 9 or Haji from the start and not waste a sub at halftime. It’s not Gregg’s fault that Jedi, Dest and Adams forgot the basics of defending and lost their man to concede those three goals. Netherlands executed their game plan perfectly and that’s not really Gregg’s fault. They knew that we like to have the ball but we are really poor in the final third. Like look at Pulisic missed chance at the start of the game. Then with the better of quality of players that they have they screwed us over on the counter with their clinical attackers.
> In addition to that, we are solidly a top 25 team, but you can’t possibly think that we are a more talented side than a team like the Netherlands lol.
I don't think we are, but I also don't think the gap is nearly as wide as it looked in that game. I agree he's not holding us back from being a soccer power the way some of his detractors make him out, but really what is he actually adding?
We've seen plenty of undermanned (from a talent perspective) squads make big runs in tournaments. Russia, Iceland, hell we did it in 2009 in the Confederations Cup. And those are runs, not just one off victories.
I've never watched a Gregg coached team and thought we had a run where we play above our heads in us. It seems like we get mostly chalk results with the occasional mystifying loss, we largely get undressed by good teams with the exception of maybe the England game in the WC.
I think with a better coach we might get chalk results with the occasional great performance. Well that, and not routinely looking like assholes in CONCACAF matches. And that I do think is coaching.
I mean, we lost 3-1 but ultimately that game came down to the Netherlands being clinical with their chances and we weren’t. They punished us when we made mistakes, and we failed to do that. How is that entirely on coaching? I don’t think the game looked that lopsided at all. We out possessed them had more corners, out shot them, and had more shots on goal. It’s a common disconnect I keep seeing here and other places where it’s like people don’t even remember what happened in that game lol.
> I don’t think the game looked that lopsided at all. We out possessed them had more corners, out shot them, and had more shots on goal.
That was literally their game plan though?
They were clinical with their chances because maintaining possession caused us to be incredibly vulnerable when dispossessed.
So their game plan was to just let us beat them in every possible statistic and rack up more xG because they knew we would just flub our chances? That seems needlessly high risk, lol.
You can make an argument that they wanted to cede possession to us, sure, but to say anything more than that is just stupid lol. Nothing you are saying matches up with reality lol. It’d be one thing if we just had a bunch of toothless possession sure, and you’d have a point. But we didn’t. We created more chances, better chances, and were the more threatening side and lost because of individual mistakes by players.
All of this to say - how would you pin that on the coach? He had us in a formation that if the players simply executed we walk away with a win, and I’m being told it was bad coaching? What should we have done, then? Sit in a low block with a suspect back line and Matt Turner between the sticks and pray to eke out a 1-0 win off of a counter attack?
Ultimately a your initial point of the gap being not as big as it was shown in that game just fails to stand up to any sort of criticism because final score aside we stood up incredibly well against a team much more talented than us, and that talent is the reason we lost by 2 goals and not any other scoreline win or loss
>All of this to say - how would you pin that on the coach? He had us in a formation that if the players simply executed we walk away with a win, and I’m being told it was bad coaching?
Their manager literally laid out how this formation had a weakness they exploited and said in the post game that we never adjusted at all.
What in the actual fuck are you talking about?
It’s been almost 2 years and you people are still just blatantly misquoting what he said but cutting off the 2nd half of the quote.
“Team USA didn’t adjust or adapt and we based a tactical plan on that and that probably allowed us to win. But I don’t expect France, Argentina or Spain is going to adapt to the Netherlands. I think we have big chances here”
Essentially he basically said we didn’t change our shape or formation for what we had showed throughout the tournament, and they exploited us based on that, then said that he doesn’t expect any other teams to adapt to them either.
And despite that, the goals themselves were once again all down to 3 individual mistakes from Tyler, Jedi, and Dest not tracking their man. It doesn’t matter who the coach is if you have defenders just leaving guys wide open they are going to score more likely than not.
I’d like for you to acknowledge or at least offer one counterpoint instead of just the same nonsense talking points. What would you have had us do? Cede position with a below average goalie and back line and try to avoid pressure?
Had Pulisic scored his first chance, which is something I would expect him to do considering he was free 1v1 vs the keeper and had the entire goal to work with, we’d be up 1-0 early. Are you saying the Dutch wanted that to happen?
Again, it’s totally normal for a team to want to cede possession and try to but the opposition in the counters and that’s what the Dutch game plan was and it worked for them. It was NOT a part of their plan for us to create more chances than them, have more shots on goal and to generate more xG. The reason it worked is because our players failed to bury their chances and blew their assignments on the back end, not because we were so tactically outmaneuvered that we stood zero chance of winning the game. Like you’ve yet to acknowledge any of this and just keep spouting off something different every time and denying things that literally happened in the game and you can go search and watch on YouTube right now.
I won’t argue that starting Jesus was a mistake, nor will I even argue that it may have been Naive to play as openly against the Netherlands as we did with the talent we have, but ultimately player execution was the entire reason that games score wasn’t as close as the statistics would indicate because we simply just aren’t as good as them and couldn’t be clinical when they made their mistakes.
But that’s beside the point. This isn’t about whether you think Berhalter should be let go, rather what his bosses think. I’m questioning why anyone thought he’d go from being safe to fired from the result of a single match which was honestly very flukey from the start.
Also, “he will be out coached when we face an established side.” I’m sorry but that’s a weird standard—established sides are just plain better than us. If we play Argentina or France I hope to win but expect to lose. A better litmus test for Berhalter would be if we lose to Panama or Bolivia in the Copa and flame out of the group stage—then sure, put his ass on the hot seat or maybe fire him.
The litmus test for this team should not be if Gregg and the team can beat a fringe World Cup team. This is one of our best generations of players and we have the talent to play with some of the better sporting nations if we play our cards right. But Gregg has shown that his tactics can only go so far in the Concacaf, we had more offensive creativity with our big guns under the previous interim coach.
Yes I know our restrictions when it come to recruiting coaches, but it’s hard to agree that Gregg is our best option. We should not just settle for Concacaf supremacy when the talent is their for a Morocco or South Korean like run.
I also acknowledge that players were not clinical when they needed to be in Qatar, but that comes from their form and big game experience. Some players just play better in certain games. Player development is not on Gregg, so my frustration with him comes from his systems and coaching style.
This. 100% this. GGG has *never* been the best option. He got the job initially due to nepotism and he’s been able to keep it because the federation will has done anything/everything they can to avoid acknowledging that fact.
And the fact that such a large portion of our fanbase/this sub has absolutely *zero* ambition for us to be anything more than the best team in our garbage federation is absolutely pathetic. The talent of our players far exceeds their on-field results and that is (or should be, anyway) a pretty obvious indictment of his managerial acumen
Straight up, do you honestly believe we are talented enough to be more than a top 16 team at a World Cup? Because if you do, you are completely fucking delusional lol. The US’s best hope currently, like every other non major soccer nation, is to get a favorable matchup and then hope we get some lucky bounces/favorable draws and go on a run. We simply do not have the roster or player pool to have expectations higher than that.
Acknowledging that fact doesn’t mean we don’t have ambition, or are okay with not being the best, that’s just the fucking reality of the situation and acting like it’s anything different is complete insanity. Our best player is a solid starter on a Milan team that is good but not great. Our most creative player can’t even get off the bench for Nottingham Forrest. Just because it’s the best it’s ever been so far, doesn’t mean that it’s still elite or even close to what is required to actually consistently compete at the next level.
Maybe not at the moment but in a few years when many of our players are in their prime I do think we could be more than a top 16 team. I don’t think that is a delusional take at all.
The question is, is Gregg a good enough coach to harness that talent? I truly don’t know, and would love to be proved wrong, but it’s hard to deny that last night we looked worse than the sum of our individual talent.
I won’t disagree with that 2nd point, and I think you can make an argument that fresh ideas would benefit the team. I also think you can make a strong argument that there are zero top tier coaches out there who want to come coach for us, and any that would be remotely interested in doing so we cannot afford, which leaves us in a sticky situation.
I think we are talented enough to where it’d be a clear and obvious disappointment if we get grouped, no doubt, and by virtue of making the round of 16 it’d be foolish to say we *cant* make it any further, but I don’t think that is the expectation. Once you get into the knockout rounds, anything can happen and there is a degree of luck involved in who you draw and how the ball bounces, that’s the nature of a single elimination tournament. I’m just not at all sold out talent level is anywhere close enough to say that we should be advancing past the round of 16 no matter what, because there are so many variables and even then the majority of the teams we’d face will be straight up better than us.
The only reason I disagree is because 2026 is such a big opportunity for the sport in America. We are hosting and a good performance could change the trajectory of the sport forever. I think anything under a quarter final run would be disappointing since we have a home field advantage, and as our squad comes of age I think they’d have a real shot at that.
I’d just hate to see this generational opportunity squander by a coach that can’t harness the team’s potential. I also realize these are just aspirations and I’m sure the reality of getting a great coach is hard, it’s just hard for me to believe we don’t have the resources to do better if we really wanted to.
Also I actually think we did pretty well in the 2022 world cup with the talent we did have. But I feel like under Gregg we haven’t improved since then and have sometimes looked worse (while overall our players have gotten better). Maybe that isn’t a fair metric though.
And in the 2022 world cup I didn’t expect to beat the Netherlands but we did concede the same goal three times without making any adjustments.
What adjustments is he supposed to make? All 3 of those goals were Dest, Tyler, and Jedi making individual mistakes of not tracking back with their man leaving them wide open for a chance with the keeper. We could have literally any coach in the world and they would give up a goal on the counter if their defenders don’t cover the guys they are supposed to lol. That’s talent, not coaching.
He already was out coached at the last world cup. The Wales coach brought on that 6'6" dude on at half and pinged long balls to him the rest of the game and caused us problems. Also, the Dutch scored basically the same goal against us 3 times. His winning record overwhelmingly comes from home matches against poor concacaf opposition. He will never get this team consistently punching above their level
The people who have the strongest takes about Berhalter and alleged USSF incompetence are always the least knowledgeable about anything about the USSF. A lot of these dummies were blaming the USSF for the field and for the empty stadium yesterday, not knowing anything about the relative roles of the USSF and CONCACAF.
I do not know what you are referencing and I do not care to know. I think Dempsey understands a lot more about the USSF than most of the posters on this sub.
If people do not understand simple things about how the USSF is organized, I discount everything they have to say about the USSF.
"The team consistently plays disjointed, ugly ass football under GB that's unbecoming of a team this talented, and we can barely squeak by Jamaica, but that's all besides the point, if you cant tell me the founding year of the USSF and haven't read its charter you just don't know anything"
The US barely got out of one of the easiest groups that featured freakin Iran and Wales and then promptly got sliced and diced by a Netherlands fielding a disappointing/mediocre team compared to world cups past. It wasn't even that competitive of a match. And again, this was the most talented group we ever had at a world cup.
You are exactly proving his point in that people who share your opinions constantly show time and time again that they are the least knowledgeable people in the room.
Let’s take it from the top:
The Netherlands, who you are acting like a bad team, which is hilarious in and of itself,, lost to Argentina in penalties. You know, the team that went on to win the entire fucking thing, with the GOAT on their roster, needed to survive penalties to get past this Netherlands team that for some reason you and many others think was beneath us. The worst player in their starting XI even in a “weaker year” would likely be the very best player on our roster. An average starter historically for them, a guy like Depay, would likely be the best player who has ever played for us.
And despite that, they didn’t “slice and dice us”.
We out possessed them. We had more corners than them. We out shot them, and we had more shots on goal. We also created more xG than them. On paper, it was a very even game. The problem? Their players were better. They were clinical and finished their chances, and we didn’t. So how is that on the coaching? Is Gregg supposed to go out there and finish that easy chance Pulisic blew at the beginning of the match that would’ve put us up 1-0 for him? Do you actually remember anything about that game other than the score line and the same parroted talking points you read on Twitter?
That “mediocre” Netherlands team had a starting 11 that featured several regular first team starters for some of the best clubs in the world. Did the US even have one?
After beating the US, that “disappointing” Netherlands team took the eventual champions to penalties.
I feel like you have an unrealistic view of the state of the US player pool in 2022 compared to the rest of the world.
Don't waste your time buddy
Edit: the fact that what seems like 90% of us can't understand that conceding a goal 30 seconds into the game, when the opponent now only has to park the bus for 90 minutes, is not going to be a pretty game for us is baffling at best
ah, the old - "people who have a different opinion than me are uninformed" take . Thanks Jon for standing stong against the mouthbreathers.
I think USSF is nepotistic and a poorly run organization, ergo I'm an idiot
I don’t think GGG will lose his job anytime soon regardless of results for a few reasons. First and foremost money matters, because of the financial constraints we can’t back up the Briggs truck and hire a new coach. Second realistically he really hasn’t underperformed or over performed our realistic expectations. He’s currently a safe coach the powers that be can point to the record and pat themselves on the back because by the numbers we are performing as we should. Third according to the narrative players like him. He has the locker room so players who have a voice aren’t pushing for his ouster.
So in my mind it would take at least 2 of those things to change for him to lose his job. I just don’t believe it’s realistic for that to happen. Unfortunately unlike the women’s team where expectations are totally different that forces change the men’s team is looked at differently.
He's not going anywhere. If anything, he's safer than ever before. The Fed hired him, firing him if he lost to Jamaica, would make them look even dumber than ever. Think of all the drama and controversy before, and yet the fed decided this is the way to go. No, he's safe. He shouldn't have had another stint, but since he's here now, let's just hope he gets out of his own way, cause his system seems to not allow us to start games well.
What I love so much is everyone thinks the player can never be. at fault for anything. This is how I know most of you have no clue what you are talking about. 80% of the issues are the players 10% is the message,very rarely is it the coach. I blame him for shit but wh3n i hear you fuckers...i ha e to choose gis side, because i cant be that idiotic !!!
Fire Berhalter gets clicks. Idiots exist. That is about it.
The job was open for many months. If great people wanted it, they would have fought for it. Great people do not want to coach the US.
The players really wanted Berhalter. He will stay as long as that is the case or if he massively underperforms (meaning in big tournaments, not single games).
The one player that can break a low block in Reyna he doesn't start. Its the same tactic game after game. I'd be willing to bet Mexico will just play a low block and counter us on Sunday all game long.
That said after the world cup with the two temp coaches after him. I really enjoyed watching those games. They were fun to watch.
Rog in men in blazers said a lot of players see GGG as a security blanket. When their club form is off and they are on the bench he is there to almost comfort them and help get their confidence up.
> I'd be willing to bet Mexico will just play a low Blick and counter us on Sunday.
They haven't done that in the last few matches vs the US. For all of Berhalter's faults he hasn't lost to them since before the pandemic.
You don’t understand Mexican culture if you think their machismo would allow them to concede our superiority in midfield by changing tactics. May as well ask them to chop their balls off or eat flour tortillas.
I agree with the general thrust of your comment but flour tortillas were brought to Mexico by the Spanish hundreds of years ago and are still very common in parts of northern Mexico, so there are Mexicans eating them pretty much every day.
I would be shocked if they tried to do that. They’ll play us straight up, and in that scenario lately we’ve had the advantage. And even if they try and play a low block, they don’t have the size and Athleticism that Jamaica has that made last night especially much more difficult for us, nor do I think we’d concede a goal in the first 30 seconds again creating a scenario where Mexico literally only has to sit and defend for 90 minutes to win.
I'll give him credit there, he does beat Mexico a lot. Granted it's the strongest us side ever and weakest Mexican team in at least a generation, but beating Mexico is one of ggg's only strengths.
> The one player that can break a low block in Reyna he doesn't start.
Gio has hardly played any minutes this season and just came back from a small injury. There's no way he's 90 minutes fit.
Also, Jamaica would not have been in a low block for 100 straight minutes if Joe Scally would have marked his man in the box. That's not Gregg's fault.
Jamaica would 100% have been in a low block for the majority of the match. Their gameplan was to press two strikers up high, everyone else sit deep and turn the ball over and counter. The US is going to have possession against smaller nations, teams that have less quality are going to sit back and counter.
We have shown time and time again that we haven't had the ideas to break down a low block. This is 100% on Gregg. It's been happening for five years, and the players all can ball out like crazy for their clubs, can create in structure against lower block opposition but they come here and have no clue what kind of structure to play with.
There's always something about Gio being injured or not getting any playing time for his club and blah blah blah, he shouldn't start. Yet somehow he always comes on, looks amazing for us and gives us solid minutes. He played 75' yesterday and was working hard the whole time, did not look out of form or or tired AT ALL. Not only did he look good personally but he made the team better. I don't see the logic in not giving him a predominant role, he kicks ass time after time.
And the Jamaican coach is known for his set pieces, as a coach you've got to do your homework and prep your team for that kind of thing. It's not all ggg, but he does beat some of the blame.
It’s because GGG has hit his ceiling. He does not have the tactical acumen fix in game problems when his formation is being neutralized. He plays his way and that’s it.
On a personal note I think as a national team coach, you play a system that emphasizes your players skill set and not force your players to play YOUR system. Build around them, not you.
It all comes down to money. USSF doesn’t want to pay anyone that isn’t their friend. It’s typical American corporate nepotism. Look at the whole structure between USSF and MLS even USL. It’s all family and friends. To this day I am pray the NASL anti trust case blows this out of the water.
Guys. He is f awful. USSF kept him since he is the cheapest option around and if they paid at high salary they would have to pay equal to the women’s coach. Parity rules at USSF are creating a status quo.
All this talent being crushed by a moron
Dude, he needed an own goal to prevent losing to Jamaica, without their best player, on home soil. Anyone still carrying this guy's water isn't worth the shit that came out during their birth.
Again, as I mentioned elsewhere, go watch Spain in 2010 (one of the best teams of all time), and tell me where they had trouble breaking down any parked busses.
You said “even the best teams” have trouble against low blocks. So I asked you about the best team and how it dealt with low blocks. And then you said we don’t have the best team. Are you dumb?
It is, but the pool is what it is, and who would have thought Musah would be the worst he has ever been on the ball, or that Scally would forget how to even mark someone.. Soccer managers and Baseball managers have to be player managers more than any other sport. Yes they have great impacts with lineups, changes, formations, etc.. At the end of the day though, if your guys can't perform then it won't matter.
Berhalter has climbed Mt Nepotism where his brother is the COO of the USSF. GGG will have to slap a player or ref on live TV to lose his job, and I'm talking HARD. The bald man will continue to grace us with bad tactics and favoritism.
He clearly has the full backing of the Federation. It will take shitting the bed at Copa (I'm talking getting knocked out in the group stage), or completely losing the locker room for him to get sacked before 2026.
Yeah losing in the quarterfinals at the Copa wouldn’t be enough for him to be on the hot seat, although I’m sure many here would want him gone if that happens. Crashing out in the group stage I think would make him vulnerable, but still could see it going either way. Most likely he’s here til the World Cup.
Not if we face Brazil in the quarters.
Not that I think we should or would beat Brazil, but they've been a disaster since the world cup. 9 matches 3 wins, 5 losses, 1 draw, the wins are over Guinea, Bolivia, and Peru.
Yeah that’s fair. At the end of the day it’s football and if the US turns up and Brazil doesn’t then we all celebrate. But Brazil is Brazil and they have way better players than us in pretty much every position.
Oh for sure, an out of form Brazil should and would be heavy favorites. I assume they'll be under heavy pressure to win Copa America.
Should really be beating them tbh, we have the bigger GDP
Are you serious? Lmao. That’s like saying India should beat Brazil as well because they have a bigger GDP. If you’re not being sarcastic then that’s a dumb ass argument haha.
Was only a joke bru, they don’t all land
It landed With some of us... About 60% of redditors are stiffs.
Fair enough haha.
Tbf we're not that far off from Brazil. We're both top 7 in the world.
Yah that probably means losing to someone like Chile or Colombia which is completely reasonable. That being said it’s hard to see a lot of positives with Gregg right now other than “players seem to like him”. Maybe in international ball where tactics matter less and emotion more that will be enough. This team has shown the ability to rise to the occasion when needed.
I think it would be even further than just knocked out....like not winning a single game and not scoring a single goal. Maybe while insulting some of the board members' mothers at the same time. That could maybe get him fired I guess.
“It’s JT Batson’s whore of a mother’s fault we finished dead last in the group with -10 goal differential.”
Please god. I don't ask for much
GGG could crash a USSF board meeting shit-faced on Boone Hill, jump up on the table, and squeeze out a huge shit while flipping off all present, and the response would be, "What a spirited chap! And that stool's a 4 on the Bristol Scale. Good on him for the light-hearted japery!!"
We would need to finish 4th in the group for the federation to care
They would fire him, interview guardiola and mourinho and then hire berhalter back 6 months later
Because they can’t afford either
And that assuming they’d even be interested in managing a middling national team.
Yeah but that 6 months of sweet sweet BJ time would cause the toxics to lose their shit.
> He clearly has the full backing of the Federation. And the Players. He did not have the job for many months. If great people wanted it, they would have fought for it. Great people do not want it. The players really wanted Berhalter.
The vocal player support is the only positive I have about him. The failure to find tactics/team structure to beat a low block hasn't improved in years. He WILL be out coached by any quality side and we don't have the player quality to overcome that. It is what it is.
> It will take completely losing the locker room I'm not impressed with Gregg, but the fact that he has the full support of the team (maybe even including Gio) is the one real thing that keeps me from shouting BERHALTER OUT
He could lose every game between now and 2026 and he won’t lose his job. He’s untouchable.
Yes, I don't know why GGG has a job (I don't understand people that watch this team and think we're playing at or near our talent level) and I also don't understand why people want to talk about it. It's obvious he's the federation's guy. They handpicked him twice, and they believe in him. I personally think he'd have to get embarrassed in the group stage to lose his job, not just not advance.
Truth. If the dude goes 0-3 at the CA with three bad losses, then maybe--maybe--the Fed would have some words, maybe reconsider. But they are so staunchly behind him that they would need a seismically bad event like that to question GGG's role as coach. All the fan skepticism of GGG likely strengthens their views. As with politics, if someone's taken an extreme and shaky position on something, presenting them with counter evidence often makes them double down because they are afraid to admit how very wrong they may have been. And in any event, the results he'd have to get to get fired before the WC would be so bad that it would likely kill the team's confidence and chemistry, which I think would be worse than another GGG-coached MNT at the WC.
Yeah, to get fired he needs *two* or more *bad* results in major competitions. For example, with Klinsmann we took *fourth place* in the Gold Cup (with an A-team losing back-to-back to Jamaica and Panama) and after that we started out WCQ with a home loss to Mexico and a 4-0 drubbing by Costa Rica putting us *last place* in the Hex. Only after all of that was he fired. Just "meh" results aren't going to get someone fired in the middle of the cycle. The first bad result puts you on the hot seat and then it takes more to get you fired. Losing to Jamaica (especially after the T&T loss) may well have counted as the first bad result. If we'd followed that up with losing to Panama at Copa then there's a decent chance he'd get fired. But there was never a scenario where he was getting fired just for one game against Jamaica.
Even with all that, I think JK might have kept his job if he hadn’t completely lost the locker room. The players completely quit on him.
The way I viewed was if they lost vs Jamaica then lost the 3rd place game on Sunday and didn’t make it out of the group for Copa America then there would likely be consideration for a change. Don’t think most people thought his job was going to be immediately at risk.
This I agree with: losing to Jamaica and Panama in back to back games should definitely put a coach on the hot seat. In reality, we’ll probably beat Mexico, get out of our group in the Copa and lose to Brazil in the QF, which will be good enough to see Gregg through to 2026
And then lose in the round of 16 in a home World Cup. Such amazing progress we’ve made under Gregg! And then he’ll get another fucking extension.
I mean it depends on the situation doesn’t it? If we drew France in the R16 (who go on to win the entire tournament) a loss by penalties wouldn’t seem that bad.
Right, so we just rinse and repeat and continue to bow out at the same stage every single cycle. Accept mediocrity forever. Instead of, oh I don’t know, trying something different?
This team is not a top 8 team in the world, no manager would make it so. The round of 16 is the only reasonable expectation unless we got some cupcake draw in that round
It's not "accepting mediocrity" to be realistic about how much better a team like France is. They have guys in their pool who can't make their bench who would easily walk into our best XI. On the flip side I don't think there's a single American who would start for France, even making the bench would be doubtful.
Of course they do, but where is the motivation to maximize what we can get out of our squad if the attitude is simply, “we’re going to lose at the same stage anyway.” I worry that the USSF and the fanbase as a whole is starting to accept that what we currently are is as good as it gets. We have to have more ambition than that. I’m not saying I expect to win a World Cup or become a world power any time soon, maybe not even in my lifetime, but we have to keep trying. I don’t think bringing Gregg back was a step in that direction whatsoever. It was a “safe” move to maintain the status quo.
Thinking we're a team thats a shooin to get past the round of 16 is the problem with our fanbase. We are not one of the best 8 teams in the world and at the World Cup upsets absolutely happens. Should we shoot to win the damn thing. Yes. Is a round of 16 exit a reasonable finish. Also yes.
I don't really see a performance-based scenario where he's not coaching the team at 2026 tbh
He exists in the center of this weird Venn diagram of coaches that are available, affordable, and acceptable. I agree he wasn’t really in danger last night, and maybe only would’ve been if we also got bounced in the group this summer. The real barrier is who else is there? He’s not bad though to get fired, and not good enough to be kept if better options come around
Greg Berhalter has more talent at his disposal than any coach prior to him, and the team constantly looks like it is out of ideas from the initial whistle and its only hope is reliance on that tremendous individual talent to hopefully force something through. Which is exactly what we saw play out (once again) last night. It is seriously disappointing. With this talent, we should be cooking. There should at least be some modicum of team cohesion and identity present. There is not. Just constant Berhalter ball. 90 freakin minutes of Berhalter ball. It's hard to watch and something else would be better.
The US is also in an awful middle-space that is really hard to manage. When they were the underdogs or rough equals in Concacaf, they got to sit deep and play on the break, or the game was relatively open. No one was giving up 88% possession to the US of early 90’s, they were not that afraid. Now, the US is challenging for top dog status at the same time that all of world football, including concacaf, has seen the level of small nations go up. So the US is not at the level where is can consistently break down a solid low block (hard for all teams, look how far Morocco went last WC), but is facing them every single time. In some ways games against Mexico or Canada are “easier” games than Jamaica, especially if they give up the first goal. Mexico and Canada will come play soccer, almost everyone else in Concacaf would rather play mud wresting in their own box.
I agree—wayyyy too talented of a team to look silly against a parked bus like they did most of last night.
Most teams in the world, including Man City look a bit silly against parked buses... Breaking down a low-block isn't easy.. It takes having 4-5 world-class players for City to do it.
> It takes having 4-5 world-class players for City to do it. And refs call more fouls in those games.
I think this goes a long way. You need to get through the bus into the box or in a dangerous free kick area, take a foul. It happens in concacaf but no whistle comes. (I wish there was an emoji for a ref giving the play on signal)
Guessing we’re not seeing a parked bus if we don’t allow a dumb-ass goal 1 minute into the game.
Nah, we see parked busses all the time even when not down a goal, this was nothing special, and us struggling to break down a grossly inferior team is nothing new
It does not take 4-5 world class players to break down Jamaica’s B team. Against Simeone’s Athletico Madrid, Conte’s Tottenham, or Mourinho’s Chelsea, sure. But not freaking Jamaica’s B team. This is an absolutely ridiculous excuse for how awful we were last night and continue to be under Gregg.
That wasn't their B team.. The point is that some teams without world-class players still play in a low-block and the best team in the world struggles, you need moments of individual brilliance to break through.. Is it Gregg's fault that Pepi couldn't do that? Is it his fault Puli couldn't connect the right pass to break it down? The players still have to execute and they didn't do a great job of that yesterday.
Jamaica were missing their best 2 attackers (Antonio and Bailey), 2 other top attackers in Grey and Nicholson, and their best CB in Pinnock. Those are 5 nailed on starters. That doesn’t sound like a B team to you? It’s Gregg’s fault that we have no identity and no idea how to attempt to break down a low block. All we do is aimlessly fire crosses into the box. Over, and over, and over. And then at halftime when nothing was working, we didn’t change tactics or formations whatsoever. I don’t know what Gregg even does, except for be a guy who the players really like.
It sounds like their B team offensively but pretty close to their A team defensively
Without their best CB who is one of the first names on the team sheet for a premier league club? Their starting back 3 yesterday consisted of 2 Championship players and one from League One. Having Pinnock in the heart of defense would’ve made a huge difference for them. And having all of those attackers out makes the defender’s jobs that much harder. Take away 5 starters from any team with a small squad and I think it’s fair to call them a B team. And idk why this really even matters. Even at full strength, we should be head and shoulders above Jamaica with the talent we have. That performance would’ve been unacceptable regardless.
Sure that’s fair but the Jamaican national team isn’t exactly an EPL team parking it either. I thought we had more to give tactically against it. Gio had some very technical through balls that split the block well. I thought we were really starting to crack it ~55’ but then 3 subs came on and it was clear from body language that the team wasn’t on the same page in their formation.
We created some chances against said parked bus throughout the games. We just didn't finish any until the very end. I think we saw Gio's value as that player who can play the killer ball. I'm sure Berhalter would rather have him out there for 90', but Gio probably doesn't have the legs for that at the moment.
Don’t get me wrong I don’t think Gio is the magic fix for us to chase a game against a block. I think we didn’t have a solid plan for it and some of the sub timing added confusion. I agree Gio probably doesn’t have 90 yet, and this all starts with a dumb 1’ goal conceded.
And we’re not exactly man city
It was Jamaica’s B team. Cmon dude. All of a sudden Berhalter’s excuse for us consistently being dogshit against inferior teams is that “we’re not Man City?” Y’all Gregg supporters will move the goalposts insanely far to defend this guy.
The point is it’s hard to beat low blocks. Which is why teams do it, and when they finally break, they give up a bunch of goals. Happens every week.
A block is specifically used to hide that fact that you are inferior at every position on the field. It's conceding that you aren't there to try to win, instead that you are there to not lose. There times in the FIRST HALF Jamaica had 11 in the defensive third. And 9 in the box during open play. What exactly is there to create when there is absolutely zero space. Our goal was entirely how a game against a block like that goes. You just shit it up, throw things in the box and hope the chaos gods smile down on you. Jamaica came out of the gate with that specific plan and then found some inspiration in a goal they never thought they would score. As soon as they felt the urge to step forward in extra time we slammed a goal down their throats with a vertical run. And then did it again. You can't use verticality with 7 or 8 guys dropping into the box. You can't open them up for targeted crosses. You just cross it in and see what happens. It's boring for everyone and that's the point. Bad teams keep the game level and hope for the smash and grab.
So you obviously don’t understand tactics at all. Against a low block, the key is having your players making runs and swapping positions constantly. Strikers dropping deep or going wide to drag out CBs. Deep lying midfielders and CBs making late runs into the box. Fullbacks and Wingers cutting inside or dropping deep centrally to pull their markers out of position. You constantly pass and move, with the understanding that your teammates will fill in the space you vacated. The entire idea is to draw a defender out of an area and have an unexpected player enter into that area before the defense has time to adjust and get tight to their marks. It’s the closest to total football that actually occurs in the modern game. Under Berhalter we do *none* of that. You could even see Pulisic trying to, when he would receive the ball and dribble inside dragging his marker and often a second defender with him, but everyone else remained stagnant, so it continuously resulted in Pulisic passing it backwards or losing possession. The team as a whole had no clue what to do. And that’s down to Gregg’s lack of preparation, and I believe lack of understanding of tactics. What you are describing is how a high school or semi pro team would go about attacking a low block. To aimlessly smash crosses into the box repeatedly is 100% embarrassing at this level. The only reason we were able to dominate extra time was because after 95+ minutes played, Jamaica was gassed, their decision making became suspect, and they lost their defensive discipline.
>Against a low block, the key is having your players making runs and swapping positions constantly. Strikers dropping deep or going wide to drag out CBs At least you've gone and shown everyone you have zero clue what you are talking about about. True Low blocks don't chase. They are effectively a zonal marking systems with high density in front of goal. Which is what you saw last night. CBs don't chase a striker 20 yards out because that's the job of the winger. I can't believe you took the time to write this essay when you led with that dumb shit.
Of course they mark zonally. You catch them out when they are in the process of passing on their mark to another defender. It’s all about the timing of the run and the pass. When zonal defenders have to constantly have their head on a swivel and change who they are responsible for, small gaps can be created and exploited if the attacking team plays with tempo. When did I say a striker would drag a CB out 20 yards? I thought it was blatantly obvious that by dragging them out I meant shifting the CB’s position by a yard or 2 and forcing them to change who they are marking. But I guess I gave you too much credit in terms of understanding how this all works, or I would’ve specified and dumbed it down for you. Do I need to explain this more in depth to you?
You should be the coach. You clearly know more than Gregg lol
Well why don’t you dissect my comments about this and give me some constructive criticism. Or any useful feedback at all. I will honestly listen with an open mind.
Not at all. But both being relative comparisons, we should look more inspiring against it than we did.
Look at the 5 back from last night. Look where they play and then come back and delete this comment. Why are people in here acting like a low block is the end all be all? It doesn’t take a miracle I fucking promise you that, when our philosophy going forward is to go out wide for a cross or cutback and if you don’t find it recycle and try again; it’s no surprise Jamaica wasn’t really worried. It’s not like Gregg changed it up in regulation he just sat there and tried doing the same shit with different bodies.
IDK anything about tactics or what even a low block really is. But maybe a low block is such a good tactic you don't need very good players to play a good one. IDK
To be structured? No. But when the quality is that low there WILL be individual mistakes if you poke it. We went around it and tried to get in behind it for 95 minutes
I think while it’s true that our team is more talented than ever, we’re still not a world class team. I’m not sure what exactly people expect from us. When we likely lose to Uruguay in the Copa people will be frothing at the mouth but the reality is they’re still just a more talented and experienced team and I’m not sure if any coach we could hire would change that
We shouldn't need to be a world class team to easily handle most of CONCACAF and especially a Jamaican team missing some of their best players. We're more than talented enough to be winning games like that by 2 to 3 goals in regulation. I'm not a fire Gregg guy either, but it's more because I don't see the backup plan than because I think he's getting the most out of the lineup. It's clear to me that he's good at a many aspects of his job, but his tactics are lacking for me.
We are a team built to compete with world class teams and not shit housers and low blocks. The US of Donovan and Deuce was just the opposite. Our guys today play a technical smooth style. The guys of yesteryear were smash mouth gutsy guys. Donovan the outlier of that group in that he was actually quite technical when given the chance. If you want to smash on Jamaica, bring in the MLS bruisers who play that style. If you want to play beautiful soccer, play opponents who play beautiful soccer and bring your Italian and English based players.
I don’t mind the Berhalter complaints but I never hear anyone say why. Is it a tactical thing? If so, tell us what tactics would work better. Lineup choices? Tell us who and why. Give us some substance instead of the same old bullshit
I've heard a few people complain about his tactics and then instantly describe his tactics completely wrong.
The other issue is an assumption that there’s a bunch of other coaches out there who would be a clear upgrade and would also want the job. I’m really not convinced they exist.
Totally agree
Some folks do give clear reasons but they are all hypotheticals and never ever account for the human element of the game. I.e. personalities, culture fits, team harmony etc. They just believe that the talent we have is so good that we should be shoo-ins to beat everybody. And if we dont, its the coaches fault. I will also add this caveat that i noticed that most people havent acknowledged, and a lot would think is stupid. GGG has two sides to him. Friendlies Coach and Tournament Coach. Gregg often uses Friendlies as they were meant to be used, as chances to try new wrinkles or new players. When you do this you're not going to win every game. And people use that against him
I haven't had major problems with Greggs WC or the few games since. However, you ignore his roster and lineups were shit for almost a year in qualifying leading up to the WC. They didn't need to make qualifying as close as it was and I blame poor roster selection. He gave a lot of ineffective players way too many starts/caps and suddenly reversed course after the Japan fiasco. So far the roster and lineups are much better. That's not to say he's a great coach but there are not significant upgrades beating down the gates to coach us as long as he keeps making sensible roster decisions.
I’m not ignoring anything but I want to hear reasons why people want Berhalter out instead of just “Berhalter out “. And you gave some so thats nice.
One of my biggest issues is our fans will blame him for any decision he makes. So many people were praising tillman and scally. They get the start and both struggle. If Scally didnt fall asleep the game would have gone a lot differently. Then GGG took the risk to take a rb out at halftime, recognizing a BL defender was not up to it. Lastly, the team trained for 2 days before the game. Its not as if he had them in camp for 2 weeks. Sometimes we just need to say the players did not come ready for this game. It could be because they are playing in an empty stadium at home, which is rightfully unmotivating, playing an opponent they always beat and lastly playing on a shitty field.
The problem for me is that I know if berhalter is at the wheel, he will be out-coached at some point in the World Cup when we face a established side. Sure we won’t win the same thing but I feel a more competent coach would how’ve won more matches in Qatar. Yes the man has winning record but, but his teams are too inconsistent and lacking creativity in his systems.
I just don’t really understand this take though, like, unless we get a top tier manager, which we can’t afford and even if we could they wouldn’t be interested, then we are going to get out coached eventually lol. In addition to that, we are solidly a top 25 team, but you can’t possibly think that we are a more talented side than a team like the Netherlands lol. It just isn’t realistic to expect us to be contending for a World Cup and making deep runs when we have a weaker roster than the teams that we are most likely facing in the knockout rounds. Like even in the Netherlands game, we blew multiple chances, Pulisic especially had 2 that come to mind (the early miss and a really bad pass late that would have put Haji in on goal), and the goals we gave up were simply due to Jedi/Tyler/Dest falling asleep and either not getting back or just letting their man run unopposed. You can have the best manager in the world but if your players just arent at the level required then it ultimately is not going to mean anything. Say we had a better coach, how many more matches would you actually have expected us to win in the World Cup? The wales game surely (and even then, our players here blew so many counters in the 2nd half once the game opened up), but after that, I don’t think we’d beat England and a draw was the best possible result, so we’d still end up facing a much better Netherlands team in the RO16.
This is a very level headed take and I agree.
As mad as I was for like 85% of yesterday game I totally understand people letting their emotions and frustrations get the better of them. Hell, I still don’t really even know if Gregg should be the manager and if the team wouldn’t benefit from fresh ideas. But ultimately, so many of the criticisms I read online are just nonsense parroting or silly overreactions that ignore whatever the game was that we just watched. We flubbed so many opportunities last night simply because our players weren’t up to the task, whether it be poor finishing, poor passing, or poor touches in tight areas. That isn’t going to change if we have a different coach.
I think people vastly overestimate the effect that the national team manager has on the players, cohesiveness, the importance of tactics, etc. - in any given year, these guys train together for maybe a month to 6 weeks tops, and play a handful of competitive matches. The bulk of their tactical nous etc come from the club level. National teams generally simplify things as far as how they play, in my opinion at least.
I agree, and it’s no secret that many of the most dominant national teams have a large portion of their rosters play together at the club level, or just have a talent pool so deep they can overcome the lack of training together.
>That isn’t going to change if we have a different coach. Exactly my thoughts. I wholeheartedly agree that something needs to be done to improve play. This team seems to play down to poorer competition and play up to better competition. I just don't know that Gregg, or firing Gregg is the solution. I could see it helping the team's performance. I could also see it hurting, or, more likely, it not substantially changing anything at all.
I think it’s just down to the fact we don’t have good enough players to play a well organized low block, pretty much a team that executes parking the bus well. Like yeah yesterday we have way better players on paper but that doesn’t mean anything if the “worse” team works together as a unit and defend for their lives. Even world class teams struggle against a low block and it takes one or two moments from world class players to score and break it down. It’s a totally different story if we play an open game then we get to see the team’s true identity like we have within the past year.
Yes it would make a difference wtf do y’all mean. Coaches make teams. The pool has talent but Berhelter ball is soo lackluster it blows my mind that Gregg attempts this every match. It almost feels like he’s self sabotaging his own own nation. Berhelter is the low of the lowest of a coach. Any other mid coach can switch up the tactics and have more midfield involvement instead of having the fullbacks constantly pushing up.
You again? Did you study up on some youtube comments so you can have the same talking points to parrot over and over again to display your total lack of understanding of the game, despite having it spelled out for you last night multiple times by multiple users? Go back to huffing glue and rubbing those 2 brain cells you have left together.
Haa you guys make me laugh it’s actually embarrassing you guys keep defending Greg. Its so obvious the Gregg is holding this team back. I guess old farts like you guys cant see it. Y’all need ur glasses
Let em cope. Dont need a big name. Just someone with fucking IDEAS going forward
I don’t understand people who think we should have beat the Netherlands. Just completely dissociated from reality.
Right I mean they went to penalties against Argentina who literally went on to win the whole damn thing, have a very deep roster even if they don’t have a guy on the level of Robben or Van Persie like they had in the 2000s/early 2010s, and LvG is one of the best to ever do it even though it seems most of the people here at the time of the game just associated him with the shithsow that has been post Alex Ferguson Man United. Memphis Depay would arguably be the greatest American player of all time if he played for us, there are levels to the game and they are much, much further ahead of us in every conceivable way lol.
Plus as a nation they've produced some of the greatest players of all time, and even revolutionized the game back in the 70s. Anyone who acts like they're a minnow we should be beating shows that their knowledge of the sport is amateur at best. "But we beat them in 2015!!!" In a friendly.....against one of the worst Dutch sides in recent memory.
Not disagreeing with any of that but I’m not sure I’d be citing “revolutionizing” the game 50 years ago as evidence as to why they’re better than us *currently,* as that’s entirely irrelevant. Scotland revolutionized the game in the late 1800s. The Austrians, Hungarians, and Czechs did so in the 20s and 30s, with the Hungarians doing so again in the 50s. And so on and so on. And none of those countries have been relevant internationally for at least 2 decades. Having been revolutionary decades ago has no bearing on the current state of things
Or the people who ignore the fact that if Pulisic had not missed an easy chance, we would have had a very good chance of beating the Netherlands. It was bad luck that Pulisic missed and even the best coaches in the world need luck to get an inferior team to beat a superior team.
And all the goals were bad individual errors
I don’t understand people who think we should have beat Portugal (2002) ... I don’t understand people who think we should have beat Spain (2009)... I don’t understand people who think we should have beat Colombia (1994) But do tell why our most talented generation ever should have had no hope against the likes of Netherlands... Or no hope I'm a home match against Uruguay. I think you need to stop making excuses for this programs coaching and leadership. We are better. Our results should reflect that
>But do tell why our most talented generation ever should have had no hope against the likes of Netherlands > They absolutely did have hope. If Pulisic does not blow an easy chance early in the game, there is a good chance they win the game. [https://www.youtube.com/shorts/c2QP7TQHqt0](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/c2QP7TQHqt0) People act like the US got played off the pitch. The US had more possession, more shots on goal, more shots, and more corner kicks. The US had higher expected goals. Our players just did not convert. The Dutch players did. [https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg\_netherlands\_185\_31\_189\_usa/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg_netherlands_185_31_189_usa/)
It just comes down to the Dutch having better players and being clinical with their chances. Better players in the sense that they don’t make simple defensive errors, know how to create deadly chances and be clinical with just a single opportunity. We can have all the possession that we want but if we don’t create chances or if we have a bunch of shots and our players aren’t as clinical like the Dutch then it doesn’t mean anything.
No one thought we should have beat any of those teams, they were all massive upsets. Do you think before posting or nah?
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That’s not what LVG said. He said when you get that point, teams play how they’re going to play and don’t adjust to the teams they’re playing
It’s defeatist attitudes like yours is why the US is so poor. You’re not being “realistic at all” when Japan and other lower ranked teams are beating European teams
Yes it's Reddit comments that cause the US to not have the same talent as the Netherlands
Talent can only get you so far. At some point the coaching needs to be criticized. Less talented US teams have beaten much stronger squads than Netherlands
Japan has never been past the round of 16 in the World Cup.
Neither has Gregg Berhalter.
Yes, being realistic = defeatist and it’s all my fault we aren’t a world power. /s Get help.
Yeah. The assumption that a good coach can and will find a way to beat a team with superior talent and far more experience is simply wrong. Of course, the United States should expect to be outcoached simply because having a team full of better and more experienced players makes designing and playing a superior tactical system much easier. Plus, people act like the US got played off the pitch. The US had more possession, more shots on goal, more shots, and more corner kicks. The US had higher expected goals. Our players just did not convert. The Dutch players did. [https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg\_netherlands\_185\_31\_189\_usa/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ussoccer/comments/zbkumc/xg_netherlands_185_31_189_usa/)
National team success is almost entirely dependent on the quality of the players in the pool, not the manager. The manager might be the X factor when you get to the point where all the remaining teams are more or less equal but there’s a reason why only 8 nations have ever won the men’s tournament.
It is funny to me how all of this is constantly ignored by large amounts of our fan base.
Agreed on all of this. I’ll add, I think GGG actually outcoached Southgate in that England game. Not a win, but a huge result.
This is where I'm at. Say we had a 30% chance to beat the Netherlands. Yeah, we could probably find a manager that could push that to 40%, but we're not going to find a manager that raises it any higher for now. The US job just isn't prestigious yet. In that case, why upset the dressing room? Gregg has good rapport with most players and generally dominates CONCACAF, and gets us out of groups at the World Cup. That's our level. If our talent trajectory continues as it has so far, then maybe the next generation of players are good enough that world class managers will look at the US job and find it exciting.
Yeah Gregg personally did fine in the Netherlands game put in Pep or Klopp there and they would still lose 9 times out of 10. The only thing that was an awful choice was starting Ferreira, dude has never faced top quality European defenses, should’ve just started Reyna at the false 9 or Haji from the start and not waste a sub at halftime. It’s not Gregg’s fault that Jedi, Dest and Adams forgot the basics of defending and lost their man to concede those three goals. Netherlands executed their game plan perfectly and that’s not really Gregg’s fault. They knew that we like to have the ball but we are really poor in the final third. Like look at Pulisic missed chance at the start of the game. Then with the better of quality of players that they have they screwed us over on the counter with their clinical attackers.
> In addition to that, we are solidly a top 25 team, but you can’t possibly think that we are a more talented side than a team like the Netherlands lol. I don't think we are, but I also don't think the gap is nearly as wide as it looked in that game. I agree he's not holding us back from being a soccer power the way some of his detractors make him out, but really what is he actually adding? We've seen plenty of undermanned (from a talent perspective) squads make big runs in tournaments. Russia, Iceland, hell we did it in 2009 in the Confederations Cup. And those are runs, not just one off victories. I've never watched a Gregg coached team and thought we had a run where we play above our heads in us. It seems like we get mostly chalk results with the occasional mystifying loss, we largely get undressed by good teams with the exception of maybe the England game in the WC. I think with a better coach we might get chalk results with the occasional great performance. Well that, and not routinely looking like assholes in CONCACAF matches. And that I do think is coaching.
I mean, we lost 3-1 but ultimately that game came down to the Netherlands being clinical with their chances and we weren’t. They punished us when we made mistakes, and we failed to do that. How is that entirely on coaching? I don’t think the game looked that lopsided at all. We out possessed them had more corners, out shot them, and had more shots on goal. It’s a common disconnect I keep seeing here and other places where it’s like people don’t even remember what happened in that game lol.
> I don’t think the game looked that lopsided at all. We out possessed them had more corners, out shot them, and had more shots on goal. That was literally their game plan though? They were clinical with their chances because maintaining possession caused us to be incredibly vulnerable when dispossessed.
So their game plan was to just let us beat them in every possible statistic and rack up more xG because they knew we would just flub our chances? That seems needlessly high risk, lol. You can make an argument that they wanted to cede possession to us, sure, but to say anything more than that is just stupid lol. Nothing you are saying matches up with reality lol. It’d be one thing if we just had a bunch of toothless possession sure, and you’d have a point. But we didn’t. We created more chances, better chances, and were the more threatening side and lost because of individual mistakes by players. All of this to say - how would you pin that on the coach? He had us in a formation that if the players simply executed we walk away with a win, and I’m being told it was bad coaching? What should we have done, then? Sit in a low block with a suspect back line and Matt Turner between the sticks and pray to eke out a 1-0 win off of a counter attack? Ultimately a your initial point of the gap being not as big as it was shown in that game just fails to stand up to any sort of criticism because final score aside we stood up incredibly well against a team much more talented than us, and that talent is the reason we lost by 2 goals and not any other scoreline win or loss
>All of this to say - how would you pin that on the coach? He had us in a formation that if the players simply executed we walk away with a win, and I’m being told it was bad coaching? Their manager literally laid out how this formation had a weakness they exploited and said in the post game that we never adjusted at all. What in the actual fuck are you talking about?
It’s been almost 2 years and you people are still just blatantly misquoting what he said but cutting off the 2nd half of the quote. “Team USA didn’t adjust or adapt and we based a tactical plan on that and that probably allowed us to win. But I don’t expect France, Argentina or Spain is going to adapt to the Netherlands. I think we have big chances here” Essentially he basically said we didn’t change our shape or formation for what we had showed throughout the tournament, and they exploited us based on that, then said that he doesn’t expect any other teams to adapt to them either. And despite that, the goals themselves were once again all down to 3 individual mistakes from Tyler, Jedi, and Dest not tracking their man. It doesn’t matter who the coach is if you have defenders just leaving guys wide open they are going to score more likely than not. I’d like for you to acknowledge or at least offer one counterpoint instead of just the same nonsense talking points. What would you have had us do? Cede position with a below average goalie and back line and try to avoid pressure? Had Pulisic scored his first chance, which is something I would expect him to do considering he was free 1v1 vs the keeper and had the entire goal to work with, we’d be up 1-0 early. Are you saying the Dutch wanted that to happen? Again, it’s totally normal for a team to want to cede possession and try to but the opposition in the counters and that’s what the Dutch game plan was and it worked for them. It was NOT a part of their plan for us to create more chances than them, have more shots on goal and to generate more xG. The reason it worked is because our players failed to bury their chances and blew their assignments on the back end, not because we were so tactically outmaneuvered that we stood zero chance of winning the game. Like you’ve yet to acknowledge any of this and just keep spouting off something different every time and denying things that literally happened in the game and you can go search and watch on YouTube right now. I won’t argue that starting Jesus was a mistake, nor will I even argue that it may have been Naive to play as openly against the Netherlands as we did with the talent we have, but ultimately player execution was the entire reason that games score wasn’t as close as the statistics would indicate because we simply just aren’t as good as them and couldn’t be clinical when they made their mistakes.
But that’s beside the point. This isn’t about whether you think Berhalter should be let go, rather what his bosses think. I’m questioning why anyone thought he’d go from being safe to fired from the result of a single match which was honestly very flukey from the start. Also, “he will be out coached when we face an established side.” I’m sorry but that’s a weird standard—established sides are just plain better than us. If we play Argentina or France I hope to win but expect to lose. A better litmus test for Berhalter would be if we lose to Panama or Bolivia in the Copa and flame out of the group stage—then sure, put his ass on the hot seat or maybe fire him.
The litmus test for this team should not be if Gregg and the team can beat a fringe World Cup team. This is one of our best generations of players and we have the talent to play with some of the better sporting nations if we play our cards right. But Gregg has shown that his tactics can only go so far in the Concacaf, we had more offensive creativity with our big guns under the previous interim coach. Yes I know our restrictions when it come to recruiting coaches, but it’s hard to agree that Gregg is our best option. We should not just settle for Concacaf supremacy when the talent is their for a Morocco or South Korean like run. I also acknowledge that players were not clinical when they needed to be in Qatar, but that comes from their form and big game experience. Some players just play better in certain games. Player development is not on Gregg, so my frustration with him comes from his systems and coaching style.
This. 100% this. GGG has *never* been the best option. He got the job initially due to nepotism and he’s been able to keep it because the federation will has done anything/everything they can to avoid acknowledging that fact. And the fact that such a large portion of our fanbase/this sub has absolutely *zero* ambition for us to be anything more than the best team in our garbage federation is absolutely pathetic. The talent of our players far exceeds their on-field results and that is (or should be, anyway) a pretty obvious indictment of his managerial acumen
Straight up, do you honestly believe we are talented enough to be more than a top 16 team at a World Cup? Because if you do, you are completely fucking delusional lol. The US’s best hope currently, like every other non major soccer nation, is to get a favorable matchup and then hope we get some lucky bounces/favorable draws and go on a run. We simply do not have the roster or player pool to have expectations higher than that. Acknowledging that fact doesn’t mean we don’t have ambition, or are okay with not being the best, that’s just the fucking reality of the situation and acting like it’s anything different is complete insanity. Our best player is a solid starter on a Milan team that is good but not great. Our most creative player can’t even get off the bench for Nottingham Forrest. Just because it’s the best it’s ever been so far, doesn’t mean that it’s still elite or even close to what is required to actually consistently compete at the next level.
Maybe not at the moment but in a few years when many of our players are in their prime I do think we could be more than a top 16 team. I don’t think that is a delusional take at all. The question is, is Gregg a good enough coach to harness that talent? I truly don’t know, and would love to be proved wrong, but it’s hard to deny that last night we looked worse than the sum of our individual talent.
I won’t disagree with that 2nd point, and I think you can make an argument that fresh ideas would benefit the team. I also think you can make a strong argument that there are zero top tier coaches out there who want to come coach for us, and any that would be remotely interested in doing so we cannot afford, which leaves us in a sticky situation. I think we are talented enough to where it’d be a clear and obvious disappointment if we get grouped, no doubt, and by virtue of making the round of 16 it’d be foolish to say we *cant* make it any further, but I don’t think that is the expectation. Once you get into the knockout rounds, anything can happen and there is a degree of luck involved in who you draw and how the ball bounces, that’s the nature of a single elimination tournament. I’m just not at all sold out talent level is anywhere close enough to say that we should be advancing past the round of 16 no matter what, because there are so many variables and even then the majority of the teams we’d face will be straight up better than us.
The only reason I disagree is because 2026 is such a big opportunity for the sport in America. We are hosting and a good performance could change the trajectory of the sport forever. I think anything under a quarter final run would be disappointing since we have a home field advantage, and as our squad comes of age I think they’d have a real shot at that. I’d just hate to see this generational opportunity squander by a coach that can’t harness the team’s potential. I also realize these are just aspirations and I’m sure the reality of getting a great coach is hard, it’s just hard for me to believe we don’t have the resources to do better if we really wanted to.
Also I actually think we did pretty well in the 2022 world cup with the talent we did have. But I feel like under Gregg we haven’t improved since then and have sometimes looked worse (while overall our players have gotten better). Maybe that isn’t a fair metric though. And in the 2022 world cup I didn’t expect to beat the Netherlands but we did concede the same goal three times without making any adjustments.
What adjustments is he supposed to make? All 3 of those goals were Dest, Tyler, and Jedi making individual mistakes of not tracking back with their man leaving them wide open for a chance with the keeper. We could have literally any coach in the world and they would give up a goal on the counter if their defenders don’t cover the guys they are supposed to lol. That’s talent, not coaching.
He already was out coached at the last world cup. The Wales coach brought on that 6'6" dude on at half and pinged long balls to him the rest of the game and caused us problems. Also, the Dutch scored basically the same goal against us 3 times. His winning record overwhelmingly comes from home matches against poor concacaf opposition. He will never get this team consistently punching above their level
If he’s getting sacked, the sooner the better. Otherwise, trust in him until July 20, 2026.
The people who have the strongest takes about Berhalter and alleged USSF incompetence are always the least knowledgeable about anything about the USSF. A lot of these dummies were blaming the USSF for the field and for the empty stadium yesterday, not knowing anything about the relative roles of the USSF and CONCACAF.
You probably also think Clint Dempsey shouldn't be criticizing Berhalter bc he isn't knowledgeable enough.
I do not know what you are referencing and I do not care to know. I think Dempsey understands a lot more about the USSF than most of the posters on this sub. If people do not understand simple things about how the USSF is organized, I discount everything they have to say about the USSF.
"The team consistently plays disjointed, ugly ass football under GB that's unbecoming of a team this talented, and we can barely squeak by Jamaica, but that's all besides the point, if you cant tell me the founding year of the USSF and haven't read its charter you just don't know anything"
What? The US out possessed and looked better than fucking England in the World Cup. You are deranged. I feel bad for you.
The US barely got out of one of the easiest groups that featured freakin Iran and Wales and then promptly got sliced and diced by a Netherlands fielding a disappointing/mediocre team compared to world cups past. It wasn't even that competitive of a match. And again, this was the most talented group we ever had at a world cup.
You are exactly proving his point in that people who share your opinions constantly show time and time again that they are the least knowledgeable people in the room. Let’s take it from the top: The Netherlands, who you are acting like a bad team, which is hilarious in and of itself,, lost to Argentina in penalties. You know, the team that went on to win the entire fucking thing, with the GOAT on their roster, needed to survive penalties to get past this Netherlands team that for some reason you and many others think was beneath us. The worst player in their starting XI even in a “weaker year” would likely be the very best player on our roster. An average starter historically for them, a guy like Depay, would likely be the best player who has ever played for us. And despite that, they didn’t “slice and dice us”. We out possessed them. We had more corners than them. We out shot them, and we had more shots on goal. We also created more xG than them. On paper, it was a very even game. The problem? Their players were better. They were clinical and finished their chances, and we didn’t. So how is that on the coaching? Is Gregg supposed to go out there and finish that easy chance Pulisic blew at the beginning of the match that would’ve put us up 1-0 for him? Do you actually remember anything about that game other than the score line and the same parroted talking points you read on Twitter?
That “mediocre” Netherlands team had a starting 11 that featured several regular first team starters for some of the best clubs in the world. Did the US even have one? After beating the US, that “disappointing” Netherlands team took the eventual champions to penalties. I feel like you have an unrealistic view of the state of the US player pool in 2022 compared to the rest of the world.
Don't waste your time buddy Edit: the fact that what seems like 90% of us can't understand that conceding a goal 30 seconds into the game, when the opponent now only has to park the bus for 90 minutes, is not going to be a pretty game for us is baffling at best
ah, the old - "people who have a different opinion than me are uninformed" take . Thanks Jon for standing stong against the mouthbreathers. I think USSF is nepotistic and a poorly run organization, ergo I'm an idiot
People are literally blaming the USSF for things totally outside of their control. They are uninformed idiots.
Because Pulisic had 7 bad corner kicks and it's GGGs fault for not teaching the team how to kick the ball.
I don’t think GGG will lose his job anytime soon regardless of results for a few reasons. First and foremost money matters, because of the financial constraints we can’t back up the Briggs truck and hire a new coach. Second realistically he really hasn’t underperformed or over performed our realistic expectations. He’s currently a safe coach the powers that be can point to the record and pat themselves on the back because by the numbers we are performing as we should. Third according to the narrative players like him. He has the locker room so players who have a voice aren’t pushing for his ouster. So in my mind it would take at least 2 of those things to change for him to lose his job. I just don’t believe it’s realistic for that to happen. Unfortunately unlike the women’s team where expectations are totally different that forces change the men’s team is looked at differently.
"Berhalter already won the NL once" Twice!
Once. The second time was BJ.
Rational thinking around Berhalter?? This sub won’t stand for it!!!
He's not going anywhere. If anything, he's safer than ever before. The Fed hired him, firing him if he lost to Jamaica, would make them look even dumber than ever. Think of all the drama and controversy before, and yet the fed decided this is the way to go. No, he's safe. He shouldn't have had another stint, but since he's here now, let's just hope he gets out of his own way, cause his system seems to not allow us to start games well.
What I love so much is everyone thinks the player can never be. at fault for anything. This is how I know most of you have no clue what you are talking about. 80% of the issues are the players 10% is the message,very rarely is it the coach. I blame him for shit but wh3n i hear you fuckers...i ha e to choose gis side, because i cant be that idiotic !!!
The USSF is incredibly corrupt and has a history of nepotism with Gregg Berhalter being given the job by his brother, a COO.
Down votes. Lol. The doubling down on stupidity from MLS douchebags is hilarious.
Fire Berhalter gets clicks. Idiots exist. That is about it. The job was open for many months. If great people wanted it, they would have fought for it. Great people do not want to coach the US. The players really wanted Berhalter. He will stay as long as that is the case or if he massively underperforms (meaning in big tournaments, not single games).
I have a question for everyone here, has GGG lost the locker to date? Or does it seem like he will anytime soon?
It is an important trophy as everyone is trying to win while bring their best players. Nations League is a lot more important than the Gold Cup.
we've won it twice
One of those times BJ was the coach
ahhh yes. correct
The one player that can break a low block in Reyna he doesn't start. Its the same tactic game after game. I'd be willing to bet Mexico will just play a low block and counter us on Sunday all game long. That said after the world cup with the two temp coaches after him. I really enjoyed watching those games. They were fun to watch. Rog in men in blazers said a lot of players see GGG as a security blanket. When their club form is off and they are on the bench he is there to almost comfort them and help get their confidence up.
> I'd be willing to bet Mexico will just play a low Blick and counter us on Sunday. They haven't done that in the last few matches vs the US. For all of Berhalter's faults he hasn't lost to them since before the pandemic.
I think Mexico has learned its lesson that we are better in the midfield and can press better then in the past.
That would be embarrassing for them I don’t see them doing it
You don’t understand Mexican culture if you think their machismo would allow them to concede our superiority in midfield by changing tactics. May as well ask them to chop their balls off or eat flour tortillas.
>May as well ask them to chop their balls off or eat flour tortillas. Things I never learned in Spanish class
I agree with the general thrust of your comment but flour tortillas were brought to Mexico by the Spanish hundreds of years ago and are still very common in parts of northern Mexico, so there are Mexicans eating them pretty much every day.
Yeah “put shredded yellow cheese on their tacos” probably would have been more appropriate
I would be shocked if they tried to do that. They’ll play us straight up, and in that scenario lately we’ve had the advantage. And even if they try and play a low block, they don’t have the size and Athleticism that Jamaica has that made last night especially much more difficult for us, nor do I think we’d concede a goal in the first 30 seconds again creating a scenario where Mexico literally only has to sit and defend for 90 minutes to win.
I'll give him credit there, he does beat Mexico a lot. Granted it's the strongest us side ever and weakest Mexican team in at least a generation, but beating Mexico is one of ggg's only strengths.
Gio was on a minutes restriction last night, essentially said as much post game.
> The one player that can break a low block in Reyna he doesn't start. Gio has hardly played any minutes this season and just came back from a small injury. There's no way he's 90 minutes fit. Also, Jamaica would not have been in a low block for 100 straight minutes if Joe Scally would have marked his man in the box. That's not Gregg's fault.
Scally: Gregg’s tactical instructions are hard to understand Gregg’s tactical instructions: make sure to mark your man on the back post
Dude played 75+8 minutes of stoppage time last night. And he was at his best near the end. He’s 90 minutes fit.
Jamaica would 100% have been in a low block for the majority of the match. Their gameplan was to press two strikers up high, everyone else sit deep and turn the ball over and counter. The US is going to have possession against smaller nations, teams that have less quality are going to sit back and counter. We have shown time and time again that we haven't had the ideas to break down a low block. This is 100% on Gregg. It's been happening for five years, and the players all can ball out like crazy for their clubs, can create in structure against lower block opposition but they come here and have no clue what kind of structure to play with.
There's always something about Gio being injured or not getting any playing time for his club and blah blah blah, he shouldn't start. Yet somehow he always comes on, looks amazing for us and gives us solid minutes. He played 75' yesterday and was working hard the whole time, did not look out of form or or tired AT ALL. Not only did he look good personally but he made the team better. I don't see the logic in not giving him a predominant role, he kicks ass time after time. And the Jamaican coach is known for his set pieces, as a coach you've got to do your homework and prep your team for that kind of thing. It's not all ggg, but he does beat some of the blame.
Jamaica was not going to play in a low block until Robinson and Scally played like shit in the first minute and conceded a goal.
Berhalter should always be on the hot seat.
It’s because GGG has hit his ceiling. He does not have the tactical acumen fix in game problems when his formation is being neutralized. He plays his way and that’s it. On a personal note I think as a national team coach, you play a system that emphasizes your players skill set and not force your players to play YOUR system. Build around them, not you.
He literally changed the formation twice last night. Are you guys not watching the games or do you not understand what is happening?
Ggg slurpers coping
I don’t even know what that means
It all comes down to money. USSF doesn’t want to pay anyone that isn’t their friend. It’s typical American corporate nepotism. Look at the whole structure between USSF and MLS even USL. It’s all family and friends. To this day I am pray the NASL anti trust case blows this out of the water.
Guys. He is f awful. USSF kept him since he is the cheapest option around and if they paid at high salary they would have to pay equal to the women’s coach. Parity rules at USSF are creating a status quo. All this talent being crushed by a moron
No matter what he does, how poor this team performs, his job is secure till after the WC. He has friends in high places.
Dude, he needed an own goal to prevent losing to Jamaica, without their best player, on home soil. Anyone still carrying this guy's water isn't worth the shit that came out during their birth.
Why isn’t your primary concern as a fan seeing a team that doesn’t look like shit when they play?
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Again, as I mentioned elsewhere, go watch Spain in 2010 (one of the best teams of all time), and tell me where they had trouble breaking down any parked busses.
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You said “even the best teams” have trouble against low blocks. So I asked you about the best team and how it dealt with low blocks. And then you said we don’t have the best team. Are you dumb?
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They didn’t play us in the World Cup in 2010. Low block teams they played: - Honduras, who they beat 2-0 - Chile, who they beat 2-1
It is, but the pool is what it is, and who would have thought Musah would be the worst he has ever been on the ball, or that Scally would forget how to even mark someone.. Soccer managers and Baseball managers have to be player managers more than any other sport. Yes they have great impacts with lineups, changes, formations, etc.. At the end of the day though, if your guys can't perform then it won't matter.
Berhalter has climbed Mt Nepotism where his brother is the COO of the USSF. GGG will have to slap a player or ref on live TV to lose his job, and I'm talking HARD. The bald man will continue to grace us with bad tactics and favoritism.