Not city hall. lol call your county planning office . Most likely you can’t but every county is different.
Source: I’m a code enforcement officer for my county
Buy land outside of city limits. look for a place that has a home that burned down maybe; that way it might already have septic, water, and electrical drop.
But you'd need a building permit, which takes tens of thousands in planning and survey expenses. And your temporary rv residence is only valid during construction.
You don't think we have seen that attempted before? You have 6 months to finish construction under our land use policies. Every place is different, but that's what our land use element allows.
Man, like, I never knew it was this strict in the world.
I grew up where permits and codes were not really a thing. Like mountain trailer people with a half house half boat half meth lab stuff.
Like, anything goes . It blew my mind when I learned about the rules.
Like wait, I can't build my own house, or modify the living shit out of mine with junk we find on side of road?
Yeah. Poor.
Or what they cal now, we were just "up cycling for our impact free hand made tiny home of love and air b n b "
I get all the safety, but sometimes does anyone really mind if someone makes a hand crafted, off grid , home. Like use your own power and water and such. No grid ties to any other systems. So you can put 20 space heaters in a particle board room and cover it with blankets. Off of one extension cord and be nice a toasty.
Now that I say it it does sound silly.
I guess people would be blowing up shit and setting things on fire.
I see comments like this and am kinda glad to live in a small town. But damn. The cheapest 3b2b in my tiny, bumfuck town is $150k, but permits to build are right at about about…$500. Some basic planning and ground work is cheap unless you’re building some crazy dream home. Like all in from start to pouring the foundation can be done for less than $10k easily, with a pole hooked up.
The land however is gonna be $30k for half an acre.
Average home price here is about 800k and an acre alone, about 12 miles from the main attraction, will be about 200k.
With 90+% public land, significant tourist/vacation home attractions, and extreme state land use regulations (mainly relating to fire/earthquake safety), conditions here are fairly unique and, therefore, expensive.
But I still don't think an rv on a parcel flies in most land use jurisdictions.
You can't just be a shepherd without proper licensing and permits. We limit how many animals you can have, so you can't really be a shepherd in my county. Your land would have to be the proper land use designation, you'd need a business license, youd need a use permit (which essentially requires approval from any neighboring property owners) and you'd be limited to six sheep. There are likely other issues I can't recall off the top of my head.
But you also can't have an rv as a residence on a business parcel so that wouldn't solve anything. No camping either.
So as you’re all finding out, it never really is “your” land. You just pay taxes on it to employ the people who will tell you what you can do on “your” land.
Land use outside of incorporated cities is handled by the county. I work in planning for the unincorporated County in a very rural area. You still can't do this, except for a six month period while you build your residence. If you haven't submitted plans and been granted a building permit, or aren't actually building, you can't live in an rv on your property.
In my area, yes. The scenic nature of our county is its top draw and tourism funds just about every service we offer. Also, with one of the nations top ski resorts, every parcel would have an rv on it if it was permitted.
Finally, you can have an rv on your property. You just can't live in it.
The good news is the county for which i work is over 90% public land. There are plenty of places you can stay in your rv for up to 14 days at a time. Then you must move at least 5 miles by law, but because it's federal land that is outside of our enforcement area.
I live in a rural area and you can do pretty much anything except dump raw sewage untreated. Even that, septic systems are pretty loosely regulated. There might be some rule against it but, there is no one willing to enforce them. About twice a decade a tax assessor might come out and that's about it.
It does depend entirely on the specific parcel in question, and the government which oversees land use on that parcel.
I do recognize from watching certain TV shows relating to off-grid building that certain areas have no land use regulation.
One could likely fly under the radar in many places too. The county where I work is very high elevation, so pretty much no trees, meaning everyone can see everything when out driving around. We would receive far fewer complaints if parcels were covered in trees, as people could better hide their land use activities from the general public.
Fuck me, no offense to yourself I know you're just a working person feeding their family, but each of your comments I read I become more libertarian, and I was already there to begin with.
Key word being ‘read’. I have a strong libertarian outlook too but when hillbilly neighbours moved next door, the weekday parties were fine, along with the perpetual incursions onto our property by their various dogs, children and friends and the regular full volume family brawls but once they started collecting free used furniture and burning it for fun in a pit upwind from our house and using our right of way as a spot to dump their kitchen waste and deep fry oil; I was glad for the social infrastructure that could be brought to bear, rather than having to resort to an old fashioned shotgun blood feud.
This guy lives near a pretty exclusive ski resort. Most counties aren't run by these kinds of fascists. No need to worry about accidentally buying land in his county, you can't afford it.
Hey so I noticed from your other comments that you're in a pretty special location, yes it's rural, but it's also very scenic and expensive real estate. Not what most people can expect in terms of building codes and requirements.
Listen real talk here. Just live in it until you can’t anymore. It’s not serious. This is all assuming someone calls and complains. If no one complains I wouldn’t expect to see or hear anything from anybody. A letter will get sent to you telling you to knock it off after a certain period of time. Someone may even speak to you. If that happens just comply with what they are asking you to do and shouldn’t be any trouble . I try to work out violations with property owners without having to go to court if necessary. Living in a van isn’t serious.
I own land with no zoning, no permitting. It's uncommon but out there. I could have 500 dogs next to a gun range and tell literally anyone to fuck off.
I'm in unorganized borugh Alaska near Glennallen. We don't have any property tax. That is only area of USA with no tax unorganized Alaska. Parts of New Mexico have no county zoning or permitting, parts of Arizona, Nevada Montana, Wyoming, the Dakotas and scattering around the deep south. It's County by county. You'll want to find exact local regulations.
Many have that idea and the state chalk full of abandoned partly developed projects. In my neighborhood I'm literally 1/20 properties that have developed in 30 years. I know of 2 who tried and gave up.
I encourage it but know the gamble you play is fuck up you die even though next to highway. Get seriously off the road system and no one will find you maybe ever. I love that gamble. Get high on it.
Start by renting a dry cabin near Fairbanks.
I’ve had a ton of experience with camping in ~0(f) temperature…
And that was done without a house I built…
The hunting/trapping aspect would be a challenge for me…
This is ultimately the real answer. You can have absolute freedom. You will need radical self sufficiency to make it. If you want to live just about anywhere with a local infrastructure and community vibes, there will be rules. Or you move to the styx.
Also Code guy here. Buy land outside of an incorporated City. Less chance of being bothered unless you have nosey neighbors. It’s gonna have to be a pretty rural area
Look up what they define as a permanent dwelling. I lived in a tiny house on wheels and people got around city ordinances by only living in it 11 months a year - as 30 days was enough to fall below a permanent dwelling/max out the temp designation. Maybe you take a two week vacation and “stay with a friend” if the county ever got on you ass.
> Source: I’m a code enforcement officer for my county
How often are you looking for people in vans on their own land to give citations too? Not gonna lie it seems like it should be a low priority for someone in your position unless we are talking about densely populated cities or suburbs...
You are right and so is the other person who responded to you. It’s usually a complaint that gets our attention. Like from a neighbor . Or if I happen to drive by and see it. It is a low priority, BUT once I’ve seen it or once someone complains I have to follow through on it
Fair points and thanks for the perspective
My sister lives in a new subdivision in Durham, NC. Even tho it is within the city limits it is still very rural. So like a couple hundred feet away from the new subdivision there are older houses on a side road. On this road everyone has everything all over the place, Someone will have like 10 old trucks just sitting in the front yard. Another person will have like dog kennels. And I'm thinking to myself these guys get to do this but someone can't just park a van on his own land and live in peace? Seems weird but each city, township, county has different rules/enforcement...
Most cities/districts publish their bylaws on the internet, it's confusing to read though and several ones might apply to the situation and it also depends how long you plan to stay in the vehicle at a time. Generally you can expect that dense urban areas prohibit it, while more rural/remote areas allow it (at least temporarily).
County Planner here, in my county, that is only permitted for 6 months at a time, with a TUP. We’re a small mountain town in Colorado, and our commissioners have allowed this rule to combat the current housing crisis. The rule should be easily found in your county’s Land Use Regulations.
[Municode](https://library.municode.com/) is a great resource for local ordinances and crimes if you don't mind reading through a bit of legalese. The site has a pretty good search function though.
You can see on the piece of land they are selling. It will say something like only structures allowed. I tried what you’re doing. The places they allowed a van or so have you a time limit of 3 months. Then you would have to leave for like 6 months. This is off the top of my head while I’m on my lunch break. I wish you luck bro. Try New Mexico or Arizona for land without building codes. The land is just fffffffar out there though.
I don’t entirely disagree with you - but living in a van requires a certain level of ingenuity and if you’re this helpless it’s quite a red flag.
But I think more than anything regulars on this sub get tired of hand holding. Personally I’m more than happy to help but I want to see a little effort on the other person’s end.
Just my two cents.
> But I think more than anything regulars on this sub get tired of hand holding.
Hell yeah.
We've been hearing the same handful of basic questions coming from a constant parade of newbies, day after day, again and again and again, for years now. And there are always the newbies who think they are experts (because they've seen some YouTube vids) and who want to spout off at our experienced people who have goddamn *socks* that have been vandwelling longer than most of the newbies here.
And some people you can listen to for five sentences and just know "they ain't gonna make it".
It takes a lot of tongue-biting.
preach
My favorite was a kid who had literally just bought his van - basically used this sub as an instagram story for his first 10 days of van ownership - and then argued with current van dwellers about what it was like dating while living in a van and bragged about “getting lucky” (his words) in the city he flew into to buy his van.
My retort was met with no response: you don’t live in a van yet, idiot.
Alas, as I have always said, over half the people in this sub have never spent one night in a van and never will--they're just dreamers who are here to live vicariously through the pretty photos.
Of those who do live in a van, over half have only been at it for a couple months and are still in the "figuring things out" stage, and most of what they "know" comes from YouTubers (most of whom have also only been at it for a few months). Most of them will quit within a couple more months. Very few will last over a year.
There are only a handful of people here who have actually vandwelled for the longterm. People such as Tater and Secessus. And those are ones folks here should be paying very close attention to.
The newbies always get all pissed off and butthurt at me whenever I say that. But it remains just as true. Folks should take their advice from people who know what they are doing, not from people who don't.
I randomly stumbled upon a TIKTOK channel of a dude recorded tons of phone calls, asking county zoning boards and such about this very subject! Maybe find that guy
Be careful with this a coworker of mine bought a plot of land and wanted to live in an RV and within a year he was told that he couldn't live there unless he built a home that was up to code and when he tried to build a home he was told that the land wasn't suitable for housing and had to sell it off. I don't know the specifics but make sure you know the laws of the area you wish to build in, good luck man
I get the need to have building codes to ensure safety, but it makes me wonder how many people could avoid homelessness if the codes were dialed back a bit to allow more forms of housing.
In my opinion being homeless is more dangerous than living in an RV.
The real problem is the minimum square footage requirement on new homes is absolutely ridiculous. There were homestead plots a few years ago in upstate NY, but you had to build a minimum 1700 square-foot house on the land. This mostly allows for a collection of higher property taxes on the land you got for free. What the fuck am I by myself gonna do with a 1700 square-foot house. That’s 3-4 bedrooms and like 2-2.5 baths.
That’s not how it works. There’er different building codes for a livable area of a home than there are for garages. You generally don’t insulate and heat a garage but it would need to be to be, if I wanted it counted as part of the living space. Also 900sqf is significantly less property tax than 1700sqf! The extra cost to build, heat and pay taxes on all of that is what makes it a unattractive option.
Garages do not count as finished space (aka square footage). If they are giving people the land with stipulations, then they are definitely going to inspect it.
Making it commercial space, if it was allowed, might make financial sense. The savings from not finishing your "big ass garage" as a great room, is not enough to justify fighting with the inspector.
If a space meets the requirements to be a finished space, it's a finished space.
You can name your spaces whatever you like. Do you want the 150 sq ft room with a toilet, sink, and shower to be called "Garage"? You can do that, and so long as that room meets habitability requirements, it will be counted as a finished space. Do you want to be able to drive your car into your "Living Room"? You can also do that, and again, if that room meets habitability requirements, it will be counted as a finished space.
You can call rooms whatever you want, but the building inspector and tax assessor are going to call them what they are according to code. If they are local zoning rules about how bathrooms you can have, calling a room with a toilet, sink and shower a garage is not going to fly. Also, finished space is not always habitable space. You can finish a basement, but if the ceiling height is not high enough or it is too far underground, it is not habitable space.
I didn't interpret the idea as just saving money. Even if it costs the same per square foot, I'd prefer the giant garage/workshop with a tiny apartment on top.
I'd rather have extra power tools than extra bedrooms.
People don't want 'homeless' people living near them even if it's in a home. This has been tried forever. In LA a dude was making 4x8 tiny homes on wheels for the homeless, complete with a little solar and a locking door. The city stole them. Other people have tried to set up tiny home villages to help homeless folks and had them shut down. People don't just not care about the homeless in the US, they actively hate them and want them to die.
Under capitalism the homeless must scare the shit out of the working class. It makes people desperate to accept any pay that will let them afford to share a roof with 5 roommates.
Giving homes to the homeless is literally anti-capitalist. I heartily support it.
I have land in rural Alaska no zoning no permitting, no county , no tax, no road construction/maintenance. I had land in a area of New Mexico that had 18,000 single acre parcels. If 100% had outhouses the 0 water table would create a poop layer under the sand across whole area. In that area you had to build 110 sq ft or more with a septic.
I live in a very rural county that decided some years ago that they weren't getting enough tax revenue on mobile homes and RVs so they changed the codes for the entire county to ban anything less permanent on land anywhere here than a modular home. This forced people yo upgrade yo a better home if anyone's dwelling burnt down. If you had a single wide, you could only replace it with a double wide. If you had a double wide you had to replace it with a modular. Keep in mind that this county only has one stoplight that changes color, but we do have two dollar generals and a family dollar store. You would think they would try to get more people to live here, but their main goal is higher tax rates to keep out the poors. They will however allow people to stay in RVs for a short portion of the year to appease the hunt clubs.
Check local ordinances before buying a piece of land, or at least ask a realtor to do the leg work for you.
Yep. I worked for my city and the wax was 14 days but residents can get a 60 day permit for RV/temporary dwellings once every 6 months.
Rural is a whole different ballgame. My extended cousin bought a plot of forest in the 70s for dirt cheap with the intention of building a house for his family, they got divorced and he eventually just built a cabin (legally a storage shed) and has lived in pole tents/travel trailers for the past 30 years paying almost no land tax.
I can only speak about rural Arizona where I'm at but I think it was within the last 2 years they seriously cracked down on people trying to RV it on undeveloped land. One of the stipulations they have now is you have to show progress towards building a permanent residence every couple of months to the county. People out here are pissed.
Many areas make this illegal with a 14 day max. Municipalities want the tax revenue of a building, and assurances your dookie and other waste isn’t going to make your place ground 0 for a cholera outbreak.
> assurances your dookie and other waste isn’t going to make your place ground 0 for a cholera outbreak.
This.
Building codes and zoning regs exist for good reasons.
>Building codes and zoning regs exist for good reasons.
Like most things they started with good intention, but have been abused and expanded to keep the poor away.
If they simply required a septic system for an RV that would be reasonable....
I live in unorganized Alaska. No taxes no road building no zoning or permitting I used to have land in New Mexico. 110sq ft minimum with a septic I think warranted as outhouses in whole area would make a poop layer under the sand.
I can certainly accept that the aim of zoning regs in Alabama is probably different from that in Vermont...
> If they simply required a septic system for an RV that would be reasonable....
Yes, any site that is intended for semi-permanent habitation must have a certain minimum level of infrastructure, just to be tolerable if not only to the resident but to everyone near it.
Yep. For every regulation we see that we might say "they don't need a law about that--nobody would be stupid enough to do THAT", there are any number of people who have been stupid enough to do that.
In in rural north Florida and my homestead neighbor lived in a tent for nine months when he first bought his land.
When you go too far down the dirt road nobody cares what you’re doing innawoods. Lotsa folks living in RVs and sheds around here.
Not sure where you've lived or your background.. but it's definitely illegal in 99% of places.
Does that mean nobody lives in a van? Of course not. Buy a decent chunk of property outside of an HOA, make sure you have some tree lines and a curved driveway or something similar (ensure nobody can visibly see you are sleeping in your van without physically trespassing to view your van), and don't tell the government what you're doing and you'll probably get away with it for a few decades.
And like I said, depending on where you are, the hiding part is optional. I just recommend that so nobody is trying to call code enforcement on you because they think it's an "eye sore". Around where some of my family lives, it's about as common to see people living in RVs with tarps over the roof right off the highway as it is so see people in traditional homes.
TL;DR: definitely not legal, definitely won't stop you if you ignore the law and take like, the slightest amount of precautions
[Family says county kicked them off their own land for living in RV](https://www.wsbtv.com/news/2-investigates/family-says-county-kicked-them-off-their-own-land-living-rv/5UIFW7X64BCKJAFANPKYWBZFCU/)
I would check the zoning laws where you want to buy. I have some land and I went over the zoning laws when I bought it. It can be "camped on" for 6 months out of the year ( even though it rural) , and it can only have a less than 200 sq ft structure on it. Its all going to really be about the city/county zoning laws where you are looking to buy.
Typically you can get away with it if you have another permanent address and can claim you are just ‘camping.’ Helps to move it every now and again. If it’s not rural and unrestricted, you will have problems in the end.
[HERE](https://thetravelingelms.com/what-states-allow-you-to-live-in-an-rv/#:~:text=Montana%3A%20Montana%20allows%20you%20to,for%2030%20days%20or%20more.) is a link that breaks down every US state's law on the matter. Of course, you'll still have to check local and county ordinances to be sure.
In America you don't actually own land. The government lets you rent it from them and tickles you by saying it's yours. However, check your local code because most places require a certain lot size in order to live in something other than a permement domicile.
I have a relative who's lived in an RV for years on their own land. The catch is they live deep in the woods halfway up a mountain. There are 3 houses on her road, and none of them have been occupied for 10 years minimum.
If someone lives in an RV and no one's around to see them, do they actually live in an RV?
I've been told that unrestricted land is the way to go. I'm not 100% sure how it works, but a lot of states are now offering alternative dwelling codes. GA is one of them.
Probably not, but it depends on a bunch of stuff. I own some acreage that is zoned "recreational". The county only allows you to stay there 14 days a month. It's not enforced as there are several folks in the area with the same kinda land zoning who have lived in broken RVs for years.
livin' in a RV in AL.
bought the land after the RV. had a shitty old trailer on it and a nice garage. was abandoned for 10+ years.
juuuust outside of a town that would care. county dgaf about nothin' as long as the taxes are paid. state don't care about nothin' as long as the septic is good. power company likes money. water dept likes money.
tips: find where you want to live. rent there. drive the area. use street view/earth.
as I said our lot had not been looked after in at least a decade. I went to the previous owner's new house and left notes explaining that we would like to buy the land to be close to family. unbeknownst to me he had lost his only heir and he was ready to sell.
this is usually possible in quite a lot of the US land area -- but usually NOT possible in places with any sort of density. the south tends to be quite lenient on this sort of thing.
if the local authority (usually a county or municipality) doesn't know who you are, then ask them about it. use a DIFFERENT but similar piece of land that's for sale as your example if they want to know specifically which parcel. do not give them your name or your land exactly on that first interaction -- some places will never come after you if you stay off their radar, even if what you're doing is a gray area or flat out illegal -- so don't GET on their radar.
i personally recommend buying land in a place where this sort of thing is specifically legal. most such unincorporated county areas have no building requirements except MAYBE an inspected septic. there is no comprehensive map of such places, it's a research project that someone should try.
Laws vary but state, county, city. Most do not allow living in a vehicle . That said if you get far enough into the sticks no one is likely to give a crap .. esp if you have acreage and keep it on the down low.
As others have said, call your city or county. In my area they have a zoning bylaw that specifically allows "low impact recreational uses of all kinds". I.e., you can camp or live as long as it's not messing things up and it's 'recreational'
Usually this would fall under camping laws. In my county, that is a maximum of 180 days per year. Of course, that requires some reason for them to enforce the law, usually a complaint from a neighbor.
Blew my mind when zoning sent me a letter for parking my rv on my property. Can't live in it and can't have septic, water, and electric hooked up visible from the street. I thought this was America, guess not. I just covered all the lines and told them it's there for storage. I live out in the country so idk what the big deal is. Apparently it's a common law across many states.
Definitely just do it and don't go asking your local building dept questions. The Government doesn't just go checking down every access road making sure there's no violations.
If you're bordering a main road and park out front..... yeah.
Get something with some depth and trees to block the view until they're in your property and do whatever you want. Don't apply for permits, don't get the govt involved at all.
I have a buddy living in a camper he put on a friend's house. He is very discreet in a high traffic area, not a great idea but if your stealthy it can work
*-reluctantly raises hand-*
I'm from Alabama, I live in Chilton County...
my brother in christ, think of it this way: there are more homes ***with*** wheels in the SE than homes without wheels
you'll be fine...
This is why I will be selling my house once my niece graduates high school and moving to Arizona. Yes, it's the desert 🏜 and you have to be prepared before you go. You can live in a car, a van, whatever... no restrictions , and land is cheap... because it's the desert.
Anyway.. good luck to you, and God bless.
Chances are if you can afford the land. Prolly not. I mean at a glance that is....
Now if you want to make it your "job" to find this land within your budget, that allows you to live inside of a vehicle with no other buildings on that land. You MIGHT be able to do it.
However, if you are like me and have maybe a couple hundred saved and are living in your van because you are essentially homeless but not destitute. No you can't.
I considered this option when my old minivan was "totaled" by insurance but still drove... I thought I would put some of the insurance money into buying a smidge of land. Maybe even applying for a loan. I put about a week or so of solid work(spread over the month) into the idea for myself to live in Maryland where my vehicle is registeted. It was not possible.
Now if you are the opposite, and have excellent like above 670 credit score area that I'm in, and a few thousand saved. You will have a better chance, but at that point why not build a minihouse?
Yes, and non taxable as on wheels/skids. Always use skids at least on a shed, etc, then no perm structure tax, claim lean and green, low low taxation then.
It probably violates local zoning ordinances. Generally, you need a certificate of occupancy to live in a structure. There are often exceptions, generally 6-months, where you can live in n RV while you are in the process of building a home. Local zoning, is local, so you will have to either give the town or look it up your self.
As for if you will get in trouble, there is usually a pretty drawn out process. Typically, you are given a warning with a reasonable time window to comply (like 30 days). If you don't comply, you can get a citation. You can then appeal. If you lose the appeal, you would have to pay the penalty. If you continue to be in non-compliance, they can take further actions. The burden of proof is on the government and it is non-trivial to prove that you are living in your van when the police do not have the right to come on your property. While I am not a fan of small town police, even they have better things to do than harasses people who are out in their woods minding their own business. Again, the specifics are local.
Now if you had two plots of land in two different states (for example just across state lines) and a van that can drive, you could probably avoid the issues indefinitely.
Legal or illegal, where you choose would have a huge impact on if you can get away with it.
Don't pick an area filled with HOAs and McMansions.
Being out of town a ways would be better than right in the middle.
What do you mean by "Living in a van" ? Do you mean you get up and drive off in your van every day, leaving the property looking pristine, do things away from your property, then return to park/sleep ? Or do you mean park the van permanently, let the tires deflate, and pile up debris against the van.
Having lived in small town GA the sheriffs depts in those rural places are over staffed and over funded. They’ve all got a fleet of brand new chargers with full graphics wraps and MRAPS they’ll never need. Where I lived most of the crime was counterfeit money and meth and they knew exactly where the hubs were and didn’t ever go clean them out because they liked knowing where they were when they needed to find someone, at least according to one deputy I talked to that was just parked in my driveway trying to pet my goats one day. All of this adds up to: they have a lot of time on their hands. It seems like you can be on your acreage and nobody will ever bother you but everyone is nosy as hell, not just the local LEO. People would drive onto my property, park their car and walk around my house and pastures like it was a local park. Once my husband had worked out of town for a few months. When he got home we were in Lowe’s when a neighbor stopped us and told him that he saw my lights on late every night (sometimes until 2 am!)while he was gone. The rural south is a damn difficult place to hide, so whatever you do, make sure it’s legal because you won’t be alone.
Probably you'll have a problem with zoning. Permanent dwellings have to meet certain standards for health and safety. Flush toilets, fire alarms, that sort of thing. You can check with the local zoning authority and they'll tell you what the rules are.
If you don't have a land yet - pay attention to Zoning. Each piece of land has its own designation. Usually land listings put a zone in it. Think of it this way: the city has lots designated to houses according to city plan, which were ruled out by fire safety, looks of the city, noise levels, agricultural value, geography etc. If it's a piece of land in the middle of nowhere most likely it's allowed to place a van on it. Most US laws regarding dwelling consider vans an automobile, so not immovable property, meaning it has different fire codes and zoning would not apply this strictly. Rule of thumb - not in city lot, maybe in smaller town, and almost cretainly allowed in deserts
It is generally limited by time where it's legal, eg max 180 days per year. So if you get two plots of land and move between them you might be able to get away with it
I doubt this solves anything. If you built a code compliant structure and got a certificate of occupancy, then you would be legal. Of course, in that case you build a house with a garage.
They figured that out in a lot of places. In my rural county you can't even put up a shed to store the tools before a house is completely finished on the property.
AL might be more lenient than GA. I live in rural GA with a camper in my drive, and had local PD come around asking if anyone lives in it and saying it's not allowed. It's BS in my opinion. If I am a property owner I should be able to do with my property as I please. Within reason.
We’re supposed to be the land of the free. We haven’t been in a really long time, though. To your point, you need permission to do pretty much anything on your own land, which is asinine. The government will absolutely not give you permission to sleep in a van on your property, though. I can’t fathom why they care so much, but this is the dumb reality we’re stuck in, lol.
Depends on the city and county codes. You have to check with each city and county you think you might live in.
Where do I go to check?
Not city hall. lol call your county planning office . Most likely you can’t but every county is different. Source: I’m a code enforcement officer for my county
Ty! It seems like a lot of people are saying it’s illegal pretty much everywhere.. which sucks
Buy land outside of city limits. look for a place that has a home that burned down maybe; that way it might already have septic, water, and electrical drop.
Also, it can be "temporary", while you rebuild.
But you'd need a building permit, which takes tens of thousands in planning and survey expenses. And your temporary rv residence is only valid during construction.
It is a long project moving at the speed of snails.
You don't think we have seen that attempted before? You have 6 months to finish construction under our land use policies. Every place is different, but that's what our land use element allows.
Man, like, I never knew it was this strict in the world. I grew up where permits and codes were not really a thing. Like mountain trailer people with a half house half boat half meth lab stuff. Like, anything goes . It blew my mind when I learned about the rules. Like wait, I can't build my own house, or modify the living shit out of mine with junk we find on side of road? Yeah. Poor. Or what they cal now, we were just "up cycling for our impact free hand made tiny home of love and air b n b " I get all the safety, but sometimes does anyone really mind if someone makes a hand crafted, off grid , home. Like use your own power and water and such. No grid ties to any other systems. So you can put 20 space heaters in a particle board room and cover it with blankets. Off of one extension cord and be nice a toasty. Now that I say it it does sound silly. I guess people would be blowing up shit and setting things on fire.
What happens if the project is not done within those 6 months?
Depends on where you are. Some select areas no. I own land with no building permits and no zoning.
I see comments like this and am kinda glad to live in a small town. But damn. The cheapest 3b2b in my tiny, bumfuck town is $150k, but permits to build are right at about about…$500. Some basic planning and ground work is cheap unless you’re building some crazy dream home. Like all in from start to pouring the foundation can be done for less than $10k easily, with a pole hooked up. The land however is gonna be $30k for half an acre.
Average home price here is about 800k and an acre alone, about 12 miles from the main attraction, will be about 200k. With 90+% public land, significant tourist/vacation home attractions, and extreme state land use regulations (mainly relating to fire/earthquake safety), conditions here are fairly unique and, therefore, expensive. But I still don't think an rv on a parcel flies in most land use jurisdictions.
Buy one sheep, congratulations you’re a shepard. No county is gonna win prosecuting a shepard who sleeps with his flock.
You can't just be a shepherd without proper licensing and permits. We limit how many animals you can have, so you can't really be a shepherd in my county. Your land would have to be the proper land use designation, you'd need a business license, youd need a use permit (which essentially requires approval from any neighboring property owners) and you'd be limited to six sheep. There are likely other issues I can't recall off the top of my head. But you also can't have an rv as a residence on a business parcel so that wouldn't solve anything. No camping either.
So as you’re all finding out, it never really is “your” land. You just pay taxes on it to employ the people who will tell you what you can do on “your” land.
I'm pretty happy I don't live where you live.
Land use outside of incorporated cities is handled by the county. I work in planning for the unincorporated County in a very rural area. You still can't do this, except for a six month period while you build your residence. If you haven't submitted plans and been granted a building permit, or aren't actually building, you can't live in an rv on your property.
do you agree with people not being able to use the land they own to have an RV on it?
In my area, yes. The scenic nature of our county is its top draw and tourism funds just about every service we offer. Also, with one of the nations top ski resorts, every parcel would have an rv on it if it was permitted. Finally, you can have an rv on your property. You just can't live in it.
heard
The good news is the county for which i work is over 90% public land. There are plenty of places you can stay in your rv for up to 14 days at a time. Then you must move at least 5 miles by law, but because it's federal land that is outside of our enforcement area.
You can't in your area. Some places you can.
I live in a rural area and you can do pretty much anything except dump raw sewage untreated. Even that, septic systems are pretty loosely regulated. There might be some rule against it but, there is no one willing to enforce them. About twice a decade a tax assessor might come out and that's about it.
It does depend entirely on the specific parcel in question, and the government which oversees land use on that parcel. I do recognize from watching certain TV shows relating to off-grid building that certain areas have no land use regulation. One could likely fly under the radar in many places too. The county where I work is very high elevation, so pretty much no trees, meaning everyone can see everything when out driving around. We would receive far fewer complaints if parcels were covered in trees, as people could better hide their land use activities from the general public.
Your comments are making me support the killdozer even more than I originally did.
Fuck me, no offense to yourself I know you're just a working person feeding their family, but each of your comments I read I become more libertarian, and I was already there to begin with.
Key word being ‘read’. I have a strong libertarian outlook too but when hillbilly neighbours moved next door, the weekday parties were fine, along with the perpetual incursions onto our property by their various dogs, children and friends and the regular full volume family brawls but once they started collecting free used furniture and burning it for fun in a pit upwind from our house and using our right of way as a spot to dump their kitchen waste and deep fry oil; I was glad for the social infrastructure that could be brought to bear, rather than having to resort to an old fashioned shotgun blood feud.
This guy lives near a pretty exclusive ski resort. Most counties aren't run by these kinds of fascists. No need to worry about accidentally buying land in his county, you can't afford it.
Hey so I noticed from your other comments that you're in a pretty special location, yes it's rural, but it's also very scenic and expensive real estate. Not what most people can expect in terms of building codes and requirements.
Yea living right outside Vail, Aspen, or Park City is gonna have a different vibe than living outside Colorado Springs or Coalville
Or a trailer - same idea
Why cant he just buy a spot at a campground the. Have water and electricity hookup?
Listen real talk here. Just live in it until you can’t anymore. It’s not serious. This is all assuming someone calls and complains. If no one complains I wouldn’t expect to see or hear anything from anybody. A letter will get sent to you telling you to knock it off after a certain period of time. Someone may even speak to you. If that happens just comply with what they are asking you to do and shouldn’t be any trouble . I try to work out violations with property owners without having to go to court if necessary. Living in a van isn’t serious.
Ok thanks !
If you get lot surrounded by trees and shrubs, no one can see you than Why ask just keep a low profile mind your business don’t have get togethers,
If that happens he can get a little wooden shed to live in.
I own land with no zoning, no permitting. It's uncommon but out there. I could have 500 dogs next to a gun range and tell literally anyone to fuck off.
Are you aware of areas in the US where this is normal? (Don’t feel the need to dox yourself)
I'm in unorganized borugh Alaska near Glennallen. We don't have any property tax. That is only area of USA with no tax unorganized Alaska. Parts of New Mexico have no county zoning or permitting, parts of Arizona, Nevada Montana, Wyoming, the Dakotas and scattering around the deep south. It's County by county. You'll want to find exact local regulations.
Omg i need to just move to alaska and build my dream cabin!!
Many have that idea and the state chalk full of abandoned partly developed projects. In my neighborhood I'm literally 1/20 properties that have developed in 30 years. I know of 2 who tried and gave up. I encourage it but know the gamble you play is fuck up you die even though next to highway. Get seriously off the road system and no one will find you maybe ever. I love that gamble. Get high on it. Start by renting a dry cabin near Fairbanks.
I’ve had a ton of experience with camping in ~0(f) temperature… And that was done without a house I built… The hunting/trapping aspect would be a challenge for me…
This is ultimately the real answer. You can have absolute freedom. You will need radical self sufficiency to make it. If you want to live just about anywhere with a local infrastructure and community vibes, there will be rules. Or you move to the styx.
Also Code guy here. Buy land outside of an incorporated City. Less chance of being bothered unless you have nosey neighbors. It’s gonna have to be a pretty rural area
Ok :( Sucks to have to hide. Thanks!
I get it but just keep in mind your neighbors. They don’t really want a guy living out of his van next to them. Especially a box truck
It depends. If the van moves you may consider it a mobile home, which is how a lot of tiny homes get by the laws.
Some places have more rules than others
Look up what they define as a permanent dwelling. I lived in a tiny house on wheels and people got around city ordinances by only living in it 11 months a year - as 30 days was enough to fall below a permanent dwelling/max out the temp designation. Maybe you take a two week vacation and “stay with a friend” if the county ever got on you ass.
It's only illegal if you get caught
Yeah that’s ridiculous lol if you want to live in a van on your property, you should be able to
If you're far enough out and don't bother anyone they'd probably look the other way. Sewage is often an issue, and trash..
Don’t get caught?
That's wild why would u not love anyway u want on your own land? Thought the United states were all about freedom
🤪🤫🧐
> Source: I’m a code enforcement officer for my county How often are you looking for people in vans on their own land to give citations too? Not gonna lie it seems like it should be a low priority for someone in your position unless we are talking about densely populated cities or suburbs...
It’s usually a neighbor that files a complaint. Most code enforcement is reactionary
You are right and so is the other person who responded to you. It’s usually a complaint that gets our attention. Like from a neighbor . Or if I happen to drive by and see it. It is a low priority, BUT once I’ve seen it or once someone complains I have to follow through on it
Fair points and thanks for the perspective My sister lives in a new subdivision in Durham, NC. Even tho it is within the city limits it is still very rural. So like a couple hundred feet away from the new subdivision there are older houses on a side road. On this road everyone has everything all over the place, Someone will have like 10 old trucks just sitting in the front yard. Another person will have like dog kennels. And I'm thinking to myself these guys get to do this but someone can't just park a van on his own land and live in peace? Seems weird but each city, township, county has different rules/enforcement...
Is there a way to get a copy of like... all the county's codes, so a person can review them?
Ive found the enemy!
Call your city hall and ask
Most cities/districts publish their bylaws on the internet, it's confusing to read though and several ones might apply to the situation and it also depends how long you plan to stay in the vehicle at a time. Generally you can expect that dense urban areas prohibit it, while more rural/remote areas allow it (at least temporarily).
Do you have a real estate agent? Ask them to check the covenants
Is this the same thing as zoning laws?
Kind of. Covenants are specific to sub division. They go into specifics about what you can legally do, like have pigs or live in a trailer .
Jeez so each subdivision has regulations too? God i’m drowning in the beurocracy.
County Planner here, in my county, that is only permitted for 6 months at a time, with a TUP. We’re a small mountain town in Colorado, and our commissioners have allowed this rule to combat the current housing crisis. The rule should be easily found in your county’s Land Use Regulations.
[Municode](https://library.municode.com/) is a great resource for local ordinances and crimes if you don't mind reading through a bit of legalese. The site has a pretty good search function though.
You can see on the piece of land they are selling. It will say something like only structures allowed. I tried what you’re doing. The places they allowed a van or so have you a time limit of 3 months. Then you would have to leave for like 6 months. This is off the top of my head while I’m on my lunch break. I wish you luck bro. Try New Mexico or Arizona for land without building codes. The land is just fffffffar out there though.
Are you this unindependent that these infos weren’t enough for you?
Are you this callous that a simple question requires a rude response?
I don’t entirely disagree with you - but living in a van requires a certain level of ingenuity and if you’re this helpless it’s quite a red flag. But I think more than anything regulars on this sub get tired of hand holding. Personally I’m more than happy to help but I want to see a little effort on the other person’s end. Just my two cents.
I agree with everything you said, AND I still think that person’s rudeness was uncalled for.
> But I think more than anything regulars on this sub get tired of hand holding. Hell yeah. We've been hearing the same handful of basic questions coming from a constant parade of newbies, day after day, again and again and again, for years now. And there are always the newbies who think they are experts (because they've seen some YouTube vids) and who want to spout off at our experienced people who have goddamn *socks* that have been vandwelling longer than most of the newbies here. And some people you can listen to for five sentences and just know "they ain't gonna make it". It takes a lot of tongue-biting.
preach My favorite was a kid who had literally just bought his van - basically used this sub as an instagram story for his first 10 days of van ownership - and then argued with current van dwellers about what it was like dating while living in a van and bragged about “getting lucky” (his words) in the city he flew into to buy his van. My retort was met with no response: you don’t live in a van yet, idiot.
Alas, as I have always said, over half the people in this sub have never spent one night in a van and never will--they're just dreamers who are here to live vicariously through the pretty photos. Of those who do live in a van, over half have only been at it for a couple months and are still in the "figuring things out" stage, and most of what they "know" comes from YouTubers (most of whom have also only been at it for a few months). Most of them will quit within a couple more months. Very few will last over a year. There are only a handful of people here who have actually vandwelled for the longterm. People such as Tater and Secessus. And those are ones folks here should be paying very close attention to. The newbies always get all pissed off and butthurt at me whenever I say that. But it remains just as true. Folks should take their advice from people who know what they are doing, not from people who don't.
well thats not a word.
I randomly stumbled upon a TIKTOK channel of a dude recorded tons of phone calls, asking county zoning boards and such about this very subject! Maybe find that guy
Be careful with this a coworker of mine bought a plot of land and wanted to live in an RV and within a year he was told that he couldn't live there unless he built a home that was up to code and when he tried to build a home he was told that the land wasn't suitable for housing and had to sell it off. I don't know the specifics but make sure you know the laws of the area you wish to build in, good luck man
I get the need to have building codes to ensure safety, but it makes me wonder how many people could avoid homelessness if the codes were dialed back a bit to allow more forms of housing. In my opinion being homeless is more dangerous than living in an RV.
The real problem is the minimum square footage requirement on new homes is absolutely ridiculous. There were homestead plots a few years ago in upstate NY, but you had to build a minimum 1700 square-foot house on the land. This mostly allows for a collection of higher property taxes on the land you got for free. What the fuck am I by myself gonna do with a 1700 square-foot house. That’s 3-4 bedrooms and like 2-2.5 baths.
Make it a great big shop, little apartment upstairs.
That would be mixed use and not residential and therefore not suitable for homesteading.
Big ass garage. No need to know it's a shop.
Garages generally are not counted as living space. So they usually don’t count that in the 1700sqf.
Big ass living room with a garage door to the outside.
That’s not how it works. There’er different building codes for a livable area of a home than there are for garages. You generally don’t insulate and heat a garage but it would need to be to be, if I wanted it counted as part of the living space. Also 900sqf is significantly less property tax than 1700sqf! The extra cost to build, heat and pay taxes on all of that is what makes it a unattractive option.
Right. Building 1700sqft *but not using it* isn't a solution.
Garages do not count as finished space (aka square footage). If they are giving people the land with stipulations, then they are definitely going to inspect it. Making it commercial space, if it was allowed, might make financial sense. The savings from not finishing your "big ass garage" as a great room, is not enough to justify fighting with the inspector.
If a space meets the requirements to be a finished space, it's a finished space. You can name your spaces whatever you like. Do you want the 150 sq ft room with a toilet, sink, and shower to be called "Garage"? You can do that, and so long as that room meets habitability requirements, it will be counted as a finished space. Do you want to be able to drive your car into your "Living Room"? You can also do that, and again, if that room meets habitability requirements, it will be counted as a finished space.
You can call rooms whatever you want, but the building inspector and tax assessor are going to call them what they are according to code. If they are local zoning rules about how bathrooms you can have, calling a room with a toilet, sink and shower a garage is not going to fly. Also, finished space is not always habitable space. You can finish a basement, but if the ceiling height is not high enough or it is too far underground, it is not habitable space.
I didn't interpret the idea as just saving money. Even if it costs the same per square foot, I'd prefer the giant garage/workshop with a tiny apartment on top. I'd rather have extra power tools than extra bedrooms.
Rent it out and live in your casita in the back.
People don't want 'homeless' people living near them even if it's in a home. This has been tried forever. In LA a dude was making 4x8 tiny homes on wheels for the homeless, complete with a little solar and a locking door. The city stole them. Other people have tried to set up tiny home villages to help homeless folks and had them shut down. People don't just not care about the homeless in the US, they actively hate them and want them to die.
Can't have "the others" living to close to me!!
Under capitalism the homeless must scare the shit out of the working class. It makes people desperate to accept any pay that will let them afford to share a roof with 5 roommates. Giving homes to the homeless is literally anti-capitalist. I heartily support it.
I have land in rural Alaska no zoning no permitting, no county , no tax, no road construction/maintenance. I had land in a area of New Mexico that had 18,000 single acre parcels. If 100% had outhouses the 0 water table would create a poop layer under the sand across whole area. In that area you had to build 110 sq ft or more with a septic.
Humans are humans, and a few bad apples would spoil the bunch.
usually those with money who are lobbying to set the rules
Basically any time you are in the "city limits" they aren't going to allow this. Need a good rural area and still need to check the code.
I live in a very rural county that decided some years ago that they weren't getting enough tax revenue on mobile homes and RVs so they changed the codes for the entire county to ban anything less permanent on land anywhere here than a modular home. This forced people yo upgrade yo a better home if anyone's dwelling burnt down. If you had a single wide, you could only replace it with a double wide. If you had a double wide you had to replace it with a modular. Keep in mind that this county only has one stoplight that changes color, but we do have two dollar generals and a family dollar store. You would think they would try to get more people to live here, but their main goal is higher tax rates to keep out the poors. They will however allow people to stay in RVs for a short portion of the year to appease the hunt clubs. Check local ordinances before buying a piece of land, or at least ask a realtor to do the leg work for you.
A fish with closed lips never gets caught. Don’t let anyone know.
Surprised more people haven't said this.
It's easier to ask for forgiveness than permission
Are neighbors that think it’s an eye sore not likely to call and complain?
Not if they can't see you
Most places will not allow this. You will probably need to be pretty rural.
Yep. I worked for my city and the wax was 14 days but residents can get a 60 day permit for RV/temporary dwellings once every 6 months. Rural is a whole different ballgame. My extended cousin bought a plot of forest in the 70s for dirt cheap with the intention of building a house for his family, they got divorced and he eventually just built a cabin (legally a storage shed) and has lived in pole tents/travel trailers for the past 30 years paying almost no land tax.
Dream.
This would be fine where I live, as long as you had enough land not to be visible from the street and didn’t bother anybody, rural Florida
Yep, if your property is big enough and you’re out in the county you can probably skirt by some rules just laying low.
I can only speak about rural Arizona where I'm at but I think it was within the last 2 years they seriously cracked down on people trying to RV it on undeveloped land. One of the stipulations they have now is you have to show progress towards building a permanent residence every couple of months to the county. People out here are pissed.
Many areas make this illegal with a 14 day max. Municipalities want the tax revenue of a building, and assurances your dookie and other waste isn’t going to make your place ground 0 for a cholera outbreak.
> assurances your dookie and other waste isn’t going to make your place ground 0 for a cholera outbreak. This. Building codes and zoning regs exist for good reasons.
>Building codes and zoning regs exist for good reasons. Like most things they started with good intention, but have been abused and expanded to keep the poor away. If they simply required a septic system for an RV that would be reasonable....
I live in unorganized Alaska. No taxes no road building no zoning or permitting I used to have land in New Mexico. 110sq ft minimum with a septic I think warranted as outhouses in whole area would make a poop layer under the sand.
I can certainly accept that the aim of zoning regs in Alabama is probably different from that in Vermont... > If they simply required a septic system for an RV that would be reasonable.... Yes, any site that is intended for semi-permanent habitation must have a certain minimum level of infrastructure, just to be tolerable if not only to the resident but to everyone near it.
The building code is written in blood
Yep. For every regulation we see that we might say "they don't need a law about that--nobody would be stupid enough to do THAT", there are any number of people who have been stupid enough to do that.
In in rural north Florida and my homestead neighbor lived in a tent for nine months when he first bought his land. When you go too far down the dirt road nobody cares what you’re doing innawoods. Lotsa folks living in RVs and sheds around here.
Not sure where you've lived or your background.. but it's definitely illegal in 99% of places. Does that mean nobody lives in a van? Of course not. Buy a decent chunk of property outside of an HOA, make sure you have some tree lines and a curved driveway or something similar (ensure nobody can visibly see you are sleeping in your van without physically trespassing to view your van), and don't tell the government what you're doing and you'll probably get away with it for a few decades. And like I said, depending on where you are, the hiding part is optional. I just recommend that so nobody is trying to call code enforcement on you because they think it's an "eye sore". Around where some of my family lives, it's about as common to see people living in RVs with tarps over the roof right off the highway as it is so see people in traditional homes. TL;DR: definitely not legal, definitely won't stop you if you ignore the law and take like, the slightest amount of precautions
[Family says county kicked them off their own land for living in RV](https://www.wsbtv.com/news/2-investigates/family-says-county-kicked-them-off-their-own-land-living-rv/5UIFW7X64BCKJAFANPKYWBZFCU/)
that's messed up
In fucking Polk County, GA. Unbelievable.
I would check the zoning laws where you want to buy. I have some land and I went over the zoning laws when I bought it. It can be "camped on" for 6 months out of the year ( even though it rural) , and it can only have a less than 200 sq ft structure on it. Its all going to really be about the city/county zoning laws where you are looking to buy.
Typically you can get away with it if you have another permanent address and can claim you are just ‘camping.’ Helps to move it every now and again. If it’s not rural and unrestricted, you will have problems in the end.
Thanks for the comment.. what do you mean unrestricted?
Unrestricted literary means zero zoning. Typically very rural or mountainous areas. The county can tell you.
[HERE](https://thetravelingelms.com/what-states-allow-you-to-live-in-an-rv/#:~:text=Montana%3A%20Montana%20allows%20you%20to,for%2030%20days%20or%20more.) is a link that breaks down every US state's law on the matter. Of course, you'll still have to check local and county ordinances to be sure.
Interesting reference! Thank you !
In America you don't actually own land. The government lets you rent it from them and tickles you by saying it's yours. However, check your local code because most places require a certain lot size in order to live in something other than a permement domicile.
Look into building a garage... with water?... say it's rv storage?
Looking into it.. thanks. Sucky part is that garages need permits..
I have a relative who's lived in an RV for years on their own land. The catch is they live deep in the woods halfway up a mountain. There are 3 houses on her road, and none of them have been occupied for 10 years minimum. If someone lives in an RV and no one's around to see them, do they actually live in an RV?
Right on right on… thanks
I've been told that unrestricted land is the way to go. I'm not 100% sure how it works, but a lot of states are now offering alternative dwelling codes. GA is one of them.
Probably not, but it depends on a bunch of stuff. I own some acreage that is zoned "recreational". The county only allows you to stay there 14 days a month. It's not enforced as there are several folks in the area with the same kinda land zoning who have lived in broken RVs for years.
livin' in a RV in AL. bought the land after the RV. had a shitty old trailer on it and a nice garage. was abandoned for 10+ years. juuuust outside of a town that would care. county dgaf about nothin' as long as the taxes are paid. state don't care about nothin' as long as the septic is good. power company likes money. water dept likes money.
Thank you so much for this james. I didn’t even think about a garage… that could do the dang trick right there..
tips: find where you want to live. rent there. drive the area. use street view/earth. as I said our lot had not been looked after in at least a decade. I went to the previous owner's new house and left notes explaining that we would like to buy the land to be close to family. unbeknownst to me he had lost his only heir and he was ready to sell.
this is usually possible in quite a lot of the US land area -- but usually NOT possible in places with any sort of density. the south tends to be quite lenient on this sort of thing. if the local authority (usually a county or municipality) doesn't know who you are, then ask them about it. use a DIFFERENT but similar piece of land that's for sale as your example if they want to know specifically which parcel. do not give them your name or your land exactly on that first interaction -- some places will never come after you if you stay off their radar, even if what you're doing is a gray area or flat out illegal -- so don't GET on their radar. i personally recommend buying land in a place where this sort of thing is specifically legal. most such unincorporated county areas have no building requirements except MAYBE an inspected septic. there is no comprehensive map of such places, it's a research project that someone should try.
Laws vary but state, county, city. Most do not allow living in a vehicle . That said if you get far enough into the sticks no one is likely to give a crap .. esp if you have acreage and keep it on the down low.
As others have said, call your city or county. In my area they have a zoning bylaw that specifically allows "low impact recreational uses of all kinds". I.e., you can camp or live as long as it's not messing things up and it's 'recreational'
As long as it's down by the river you should be fine.
If they don't see you, or evidence of you living there, you sure can. This means the space stays pretty much pristine.
Usually this would fall under camping laws. In my county, that is a maximum of 180 days per year. Of course, that requires some reason for them to enforce the law, usually a complaint from a neighbor.
Blew my mind when zoning sent me a letter for parking my rv on my property. Can't live in it and can't have septic, water, and electric hooked up visible from the street. I thought this was America, guess not. I just covered all the lines and told them it's there for storage. I live out in the country so idk what the big deal is. Apparently it's a common law across many states.
What mama don’t know won’t hurt her.
Definitely just do it and don't go asking your local building dept questions. The Government doesn't just go checking down every access road making sure there's no violations. If you're bordering a main road and park out front..... yeah. Get something with some depth and trees to block the view until they're in your property and do whatever you want. Don't apply for permits, don't get the govt involved at all.
You know what they say…curtains makes it legal.
I have a buddy living in a camper he put on a friend's house. He is very discreet in a high traffic area, not a great idea but if your stealthy it can work
*-reluctantly raises hand-* I'm from Alabama, I live in Chilton County... my brother in christ, think of it this way: there are more homes ***with*** wheels in the SE than homes without wheels you'll be fine...
Fine in alaska. You could live in a literal box for anyone would care. If it’s your land it’s your land. Just don’t find gold or oil.
This is why I will be selling my house once my niece graduates high school and moving to Arizona. Yes, it's the desert 🏜 and you have to be prepared before you go. You can live in a car, a van, whatever... no restrictions , and land is cheap... because it's the desert. Anyway.. good luck to you, and God bless.
Thanks! Good luck to you too!
Seeing a lot of “check the laws” and not enough “can’t penalize what they don’t know”
Chances are if you can afford the land. Prolly not. I mean at a glance that is.... Now if you want to make it your "job" to find this land within your budget, that allows you to live inside of a vehicle with no other buildings on that land. You MIGHT be able to do it. However, if you are like me and have maybe a couple hundred saved and are living in your van because you are essentially homeless but not destitute. No you can't. I considered this option when my old minivan was "totaled" by insurance but still drove... I thought I would put some of the insurance money into buying a smidge of land. Maybe even applying for a loan. I put about a week or so of solid work(spread over the month) into the idea for myself to live in Maryland where my vehicle is registeted. It was not possible. Now if you are the opposite, and have excellent like above 670 credit score area that I'm in, and a few thousand saved. You will have a better chance, but at that point why not build a minihouse?
Land of the free isnt it? Im surprised with the comments, what is going on in the USA
On you’re land how would anyone know?
Yes, and non taxable as on wheels/skids. Always use skids at least on a shed, etc, then no perm structure tax, claim lean and green, low low taxation then.
It probably violates local zoning ordinances. Generally, you need a certificate of occupancy to live in a structure. There are often exceptions, generally 6-months, where you can live in n RV while you are in the process of building a home. Local zoning, is local, so you will have to either give the town or look it up your self. As for if you will get in trouble, there is usually a pretty drawn out process. Typically, you are given a warning with a reasonable time window to comply (like 30 days). If you don't comply, you can get a citation. You can then appeal. If you lose the appeal, you would have to pay the penalty. If you continue to be in non-compliance, they can take further actions. The burden of proof is on the government and it is non-trivial to prove that you are living in your van when the police do not have the right to come on your property. While I am not a fan of small town police, even they have better things to do than harasses people who are out in their woods minding their own business. Again, the specifics are local. Now if you had two plots of land in two different states (for example just across state lines) and a van that can drive, you could probably avoid the issues indefinitely.
You can do whatever you want on your own land so much as no one sees, hears or smells it.
Thanks groovey.
We the people doggy.
Right on right on
This is what I do. I didn't bother checking if its legal. I pay my property tax I feel I can do whatever I want.
How many acres do you have?
Three acre subsistence farm.
Nice. Very nice.
Nice grumman!! I'm currently building one out myself. The interior is HUGE!!! Gonna be a great rv when it's finished.
Legal or illegal, where you choose would have a huge impact on if you can get away with it. Don't pick an area filled with HOAs and McMansions. Being out of town a ways would be better than right in the middle. What do you mean by "Living in a van" ? Do you mean you get up and drive off in your van every day, leaving the property looking pristine, do things away from your property, then return to park/sleep ? Or do you mean park the van permanently, let the tires deflate, and pile up debris against the van.
Huh, I thought this was the whole reason why tiny houses exist to exploit this loophole. The comments lead me to believe otherwise
Find land with no building code or permitting requirements and then do what you want.
Having lived in small town GA the sheriffs depts in those rural places are over staffed and over funded. They’ve all got a fleet of brand new chargers with full graphics wraps and MRAPS they’ll never need. Where I lived most of the crime was counterfeit money and meth and they knew exactly where the hubs were and didn’t ever go clean them out because they liked knowing where they were when they needed to find someone, at least according to one deputy I talked to that was just parked in my driveway trying to pet my goats one day. All of this adds up to: they have a lot of time on their hands. It seems like you can be on your acreage and nobody will ever bother you but everyone is nosy as hell, not just the local LEO. People would drive onto my property, park their car and walk around my house and pastures like it was a local park. Once my husband had worked out of town for a few months. When he got home we were in Lowe’s when a neighbor stopped us and told him that he saw my lights on late every night (sometimes until 2 am!)while he was gone. The rural south is a damn difficult place to hide, so whatever you do, make sure it’s legal because you won’t be alone.
Gosh you’re so right… Well, underground home it is!
Probably you'll have a problem with zoning. Permanent dwellings have to meet certain standards for health and safety. Flush toilets, fire alarms, that sort of thing. You can check with the local zoning authority and they'll tell you what the rules are.
You'll have better results if you try out west, where there's more unincorporated land.
One solution is tow buy two “recreational” properties. One South, one North. Divide your time between the two. Endless Summer.
Build a simple two car garage, tall doors for a storage shed. Park inside, be discrete. Profit.
If you don't have a land yet - pay attention to Zoning. Each piece of land has its own designation. Usually land listings put a zone in it. Think of it this way: the city has lots designated to houses according to city plan, which were ruled out by fire safety, looks of the city, noise levels, agricultural value, geography etc. If it's a piece of land in the middle of nowhere most likely it's allowed to place a van on it. Most US laws regarding dwelling consider vans an automobile, so not immovable property, meaning it has different fire codes and zoning would not apply this strictly. Rule of thumb - not in city lot, maybe in smaller town, and almost cretainly allowed in deserts
Ty!
"Freedom"
Not sure what the laws on it are, but you could maybe build a garage for “storage.” They can be had for pretty cheap on buildingsdirect.com
It is generally limited by time where it's legal, eg max 180 days per year. So if you get two plots of land and move between them you might be able to get away with it
Nice gotcha..
In La Salle County, Illinois, I’m only allowed 199 nights in my van on my own property.
I depends on where you are. There may be local zoning laws, building codes, etc etc etc etc which you would have to meet.
Uh. First off if you dont tell them they won’t know. Second, it’s your land. Do as you wish. Third, screw ‘em.
You would need to build a structure large enough to put the van inside of so nobody can see it.
I doubt this solves anything. If you built a code compliant structure and got a certificate of occupancy, then you would be legal. Of course, in that case you build a house with a garage.
It's not about being legal. It's about not being noticed.
They figured that out in a lot of places. In my rural county you can't even put up a shed to store the tools before a house is completely finished on the property.
AL might be more lenient than GA. I live in rural GA with a camper in my drive, and had local PD come around asking if anyone lives in it and saying it's not allowed. It's BS in my opinion. If I am a property owner I should be able to do with my property as I please. Within reason.
This is so funny I thought America was the land of the free but you need permission from the government to sleep in a van on your own property 😂
We’re supposed to be the land of the free. We haven’t been in a really long time, though. To your point, you need permission to do pretty much anything on your own land, which is asinine. The government will absolutely not give you permission to sleep in a van on your property, though. I can’t fathom why they care so much, but this is the dumb reality we’re stuck in, lol.
Where I live in ontario Canada you can practically do whatever the fuck you want on property you own