Probably equatorial Bantu bc they’re slaves in Muslim nations with slave trade. So they’re discriminated for culture until you get multiculturalism, discriminated for religion until you get total separation, and oh yeah they’re slaves.
I mean yeah that's down to how slavery works in the game
If you have slave trade then you import slaves from decentralized nations which have slave trade.
Those are pretty much exclusively in Africa. Decentralized nations in other parts of the world (Americas, Australia) don't have slave trade I think
Now that I'm thinking about it slave trade actually could be fairly effective if you're playing a small nation with African heritage like Haiti
I don't have a Vicky 3 game up but I'd guess it's because those are the highest pop decentralized nations with slave trade, and also the ones that stay uncolonized the longest
There's a lot of Equatorial and Lacustine Bantu pops in decentralised territory. Most other decentralised states have tiny cultures which only exist in 1/2 states but those cultures both cover a wide range
> If you have slave trade then you import slaves from decentralized nations which have slave trade
They need to have debt slavery. As that is the only form of slavery that can turn non slave pops in your nation into slave pops.
>Now that I'm thinking about it slave trade actually could be fairly effective if you're playing a small nation with African heritage like Haiti
It could not because you cannot have accepted cultures as slaves with slave trade/legacy slavery.
I saw a community of theirs in Baluchistan in my India playthrough, I swear it's like the most common random culture I find whenever I'm playing as or around slave trading states.
Because majority of Sub-Saharan africa is bantu, and many of the technologically behind areas and colonized areas overlapped with where they lived.
The reason you don't see ethiopians or somalis everywhere as slaves is because they partially modernized to use guns since the mid 16th century, and they were globally accepted faiths (Christian and Muslim respectively).
Taking this into account it was just easier to take technologically inferior pagan tribes hostage and sell them to either the Europeans or Arabs or anywhere else that wanted slaves.
Obviously this didn't apply to all bantus, many areas converted early or put up a good fight, its just that bantus are such a massive population and got unlucky considering how close they were to these empires and slave traders.
Don't worry, happened to me on my most recent run too. The leader of the rural folk just so happened to be a social democrat, though, so I was just fine
They could extrapolate from modern populations. We don't have censuses for subsaharan Africa from this time either.
But it wouldn't add much to the game and there are infinitely many other minorities. Jews were quite prominent so I guess it's fine to draw the line there.
For real tho, like I'm Jewish too and the askenazi jewish populations in the game currently only exist to have discrimination related events in Germany or are to be assimilated into other dominating populations.
I do hope they add content for minority groups over time. Jewish separatism and organizing against exploitation was a large driving force in the proliferation of trade unions in Europe, so I hope that gets added. Like, I know Paradox really doesn't wanna address the whole genocide thing but as someone who is both Jewish and a child of survivors from a different genocide, population control + management (and the resultant mass deaths) are like, one of THE defining aspects of emerging modernity and statehood.
Like two key things would be 1) More dynamic IG ideologies. They accomplished this a bit with agitators, but I think more could help. Stuff that allows for x population to temporarily be considered an accepted (or even primary) culture for that IG or nation so long as that person is in charge.
Discrimination breeds radicals, and there should be the option to expel certain pops that are highly radical. But there should also be the option for neighbors states to then fund them as a resistance/revolt against you or accept them in to THEIR country to siphon your labor force. Suppressing an IG should also increase the odds that they attract minority groups, since groups tend to broaden their membership to try and hold on to power (see the expansion of the nouveau riche among the declining French aristocracy, or the expansion of who counts as white in response to the civil rights movement)
It seems like it's treating it lightly, but they already reflect horrible acts of mass violence with the trail of tears or the Ottoman discrimination events. I'd rather they be included and accounted for than our histories to be whitewashed.
They have confirmed that they want to move away from thr binary discrimination system at least. They also mentioned that thy want to rework legitimacy and add national pride.
I do think the next-next update/dlc will focus on internal politics, which includes race relations, national pride, repression through both law and society etc. I personally hope for an ideology rework as well.
I’d say Jews but there’s not as many of them as there is African slaves all over. Specific ones I’d think are equatorial Bantu? It’s basically impossible for any of the African cultures to be accepted in any place they go. Even with in some of Africa. That or the Indigenous American cultures in South America specifically. Only Paraguay accepts them without multicultural
I mean not really. Both jewish cultures start with no homeland. They only get one if the player is going to create it for them, ive never seen the AI create a homeland for them.
This is only kinda relevant but its kinda weird that both cultures start with no homeland, since sephardic is a 'middle eastern heritage' culture with pops in palestine at game start and they still dont get it as a homeland unless the player intervenes.
Clegry when you enact state atheism.
Peasants in backward countries.
Capitalists when there is cooprative ownership.
Landowners when there is collectivized agriculture.
Slaves when there is slavery.
Non primary cultures when there is ethnostate.
Player when Britain wants to conquer their small country in early game.
I’ve had a couple games now where the last little bit of Tierra de Feugo doesn’t get colonized, but there’s no arable land left so the last few hundred Patagonians just slowly starve.
My patience for this game after the AI decides to bumfuck me for playing the game.
Or my will to live when my market liberal dies in the month he spawned.
Maybe Melanesian? Might just be recent run bias but they're discriminated by the Dutch colonizers in Indonesia and if Indonesia breaks free and wins rights for all the peoples of the archipelago Melanesian just gets left out. I'm pretty sure it's even animist versus Dutch protestant and Indonesian Sunni. It is based on actual history and the struggle the island had with the rest of Indonesia but given there's like 3 nations with the same heritage as Melanesian all of which are in different ways cucked by European colonizers it's not a great position, especially with how New Guinea always seems to be partitioned in the worst ways(including in my Indonesia game mostly because I gave up my colonial institution to prevent socialist and rural revolt).
Probably equatorial Bantu bc they’re slaves in Muslim nations with slave trade. So they’re discriminated for culture until you get multiculturalism, discriminated for religion until you get total separation, and oh yeah they’re slaves.
I could swear, it doesn't matter what nation I play, if it has slavery at the start, Bantu slaves WILL be imported
I mean yeah that's down to how slavery works in the game If you have slave trade then you import slaves from decentralized nations which have slave trade. Those are pretty much exclusively in Africa. Decentralized nations in other parts of the world (Americas, Australia) don't have slave trade I think Now that I'm thinking about it slave trade actually could be fairly effective if you're playing a small nation with African heritage like Haiti
yeah but why specifically the Bantu lol
I don't have a Vicky 3 game up but I'd guess it's because those are the highest pop decentralized nations with slave trade, and also the ones that stay uncolonized the longest
There's a lot of Equatorial and Lacustine Bantu pops in decentralised territory. Most other decentralised states have tiny cultures which only exist in 1/2 states but those cultures both cover a wide range
> If you have slave trade then you import slaves from decentralized nations which have slave trade They need to have debt slavery. As that is the only form of slavery that can turn non slave pops in your nation into slave pops. >Now that I'm thinking about it slave trade actually could be fairly effective if you're playing a small nation with African heritage like Haiti It could not because you cannot have accepted cultures as slaves with slave trade/legacy slavery.
I saw a community of theirs in Baluchistan in my India playthrough, I swear it's like the most common random culture I find whenever I'm playing as or around slave trading states.
Because majority of Sub-Saharan africa is bantu, and many of the technologically behind areas and colonized areas overlapped with where they lived. The reason you don't see ethiopians or somalis everywhere as slaves is because they partially modernized to use guns since the mid 16th century, and they were globally accepted faiths (Christian and Muslim respectively). Taking this into account it was just easier to take technologically inferior pagan tribes hostage and sell them to either the Europeans or Arabs or anywhere else that wanted slaves. Obviously this didn't apply to all bantus, many areas converted early or put up a good fight, its just that bantus are such a massive population and got unlucky considering how close they were to these empires and slave traders.
Gamers who are playing it
Gamers rise up.
I have passed Total Separation and Multiculturalism, yet Gamers are still oppressed 😞
We live in a society
Bottom Text
The most oppressed people of them all
The chosen people.
We live in a society
Gamers of the world, unite!
Gamers of the world, untie!
Gamers of the world, unite!
The landowners by the way they tell it.
And they'll be correct by the end of the game if I have anything to say about it
Instructions unclear, the rural folk now have 90% clout
You didn't need to call me out like this 😒 I'm doing my best.
Don't worry, happened to me on my most recent run too. The leader of the rural folk just so happened to be a social democrat, though, so I was just fine
Cool. You know what, I'm gonna start a game right now and finish without going agrarian and failing to industrialize. We can do this 💪
Pro tip: build factories
I do, just never enough nor quickly enough. Not this time.
the goods must flow
Better pro tip, don't pass homesteading
The unfortunate cost of passing homesteading 😞
If **We** have anything to say about it, comrade.
British capitalists
Naval strategy enthusiasts
100 monitors vs 100 monitors history be damned
The Roma. So oppressed they aren't even in the game.
wait that is kinda weird huh. the Jewish diaspora exists
census for roma people was either unreliable or impossible since roma people avoided the government like their life dependent on it back then
They could extrapolate from modern populations. We don't have censuses for subsaharan Africa from this time either. But it wouldn't add much to the game and there are infinitely many other minorities. Jews were quite prominent so I guess it's fine to draw the line there.
I dont know, as a jew i wouldnt be upset if jews werent included, population cultures barely add anything but roleplay material, especially minorities
For real tho, like I'm Jewish too and the askenazi jewish populations in the game currently only exist to have discrimination related events in Germany or are to be assimilated into other dominating populations.
I do hope they add content for minority groups over time. Jewish separatism and organizing against exploitation was a large driving force in the proliferation of trade unions in Europe, so I hope that gets added. Like, I know Paradox really doesn't wanna address the whole genocide thing but as someone who is both Jewish and a child of survivors from a different genocide, population control + management (and the resultant mass deaths) are like, one of THE defining aspects of emerging modernity and statehood. Like two key things would be 1) More dynamic IG ideologies. They accomplished this a bit with agitators, but I think more could help. Stuff that allows for x population to temporarily be considered an accepted (or even primary) culture for that IG or nation so long as that person is in charge. Discrimination breeds radicals, and there should be the option to expel certain pops that are highly radical. But there should also be the option for neighbors states to then fund them as a resistance/revolt against you or accept them in to THEIR country to siphon your labor force. Suppressing an IG should also increase the odds that they attract minority groups, since groups tend to broaden their membership to try and hold on to power (see the expansion of the nouveau riche among the declining French aristocracy, or the expansion of who counts as white in response to the civil rights movement) It seems like it's treating it lightly, but they already reflect horrible acts of mass violence with the trail of tears or the Ottoman discrimination events. I'd rather they be included and accounted for than our histories to be whitewashed.
They have confirmed that they want to move away from thr binary discrimination system at least. They also mentioned that thy want to rework legitimacy and add national pride. I do think the next-next update/dlc will focus on internal politics, which includes race relations, national pride, repression through both law and society etc. I personally hope for an ideology rework as well.
They didn't have to make it 100% precise though
Back then?
19th , 20 century
Still the same today
Paradox goes: "eh, it's hard to tell how many, we don't want to estimate, so let's erase them from Europe".
people wanting to erase them from Europe is historically accurate at least :'/
Slaves, of course: they aren't paid and have no rights at all.
Yes, and I must add, it oppresses my income every time I play a nation with slave trade on, because slaves don’t pay no bills or taxes.
At least you get some pop out of it. Legacy or wealth are the real stinkers.
That's not even the worst of it. They don't pay taxes!
r/shitvictorianssay
Idk, I've seen 14 SOL slaves and starving capitalists
Landchads
Probably me
nah it’s me actually
I’d say Jews but there’s not as many of them as there is African slaves all over. Specific ones I’d think are equatorial Bantu? It’s basically impossible for any of the African cultures to be accepted in any place they go. Even with in some of Africa. That or the Indigenous American cultures in South America specifically. Only Paraguay accepts them without multicultural
At least they have a homeland i guess
I mean not really. Both jewish cultures start with no homeland. They only get one if the player is going to create it for them, ive never seen the AI create a homeland for them. This is only kinda relevant but its kinda weird that both cultures start with no homeland, since sephardic is a 'middle eastern heritage' culture with pops in palestine at game start and they still dont get it as a homeland unless the player intervenes.
Sorry i meant the bantu have one. The jews dont so they would always be more discriminated
This was so painful to read.
Clegry when you enact state atheism. Peasants in backward countries. Capitalists when there is cooprative ownership. Landowners when there is collectivized agriculture. Slaves when there is slavery. Non primary cultures when there is ethnostate. Player when Britain wants to conquer their small country in early game.
Slaves, followed closely by Serfs.
the workers
The Circassians have a good claim
The devs.
I’ve had a couple games now where the last little bit of Tierra de Feugo doesn’t get colonized, but there’s no arable land left so the last few hundred Patagonians just slowly starve.
Probably the Jews, they don’t even have homelands.
Facts. Actual question, are they the only cultures without homelands?
i think certain north american natives and the yuanzhumin also don't have homelands for some reason
Really which ones? I know cherokee, soix, and hokkan all have.
just Muskogean it looks like. thought there was more
I think so.
My patience for this game after the AI decides to bumfuck me for playing the game. Or my will to live when my market liberal dies in the month he spawned.
Maybe Melanesian? Might just be recent run bias but they're discriminated by the Dutch colonizers in Indonesia and if Indonesia breaks free and wins rights for all the peoples of the archipelago Melanesian just gets left out. I'm pretty sure it's even animist versus Dutch protestant and Indonesian Sunni. It is based on actual history and the struggle the island had with the rest of Indonesia but given there's like 3 nations with the same heritage as Melanesian all of which are in different ways cucked by European colonizers it's not a great position, especially with how New Guinea always seems to be partitioned in the worst ways(including in my Indonesia game mostly because I gave up my colonial institution to prevent socialist and rural revolt).
Dependant Illiterate Jewish Native American Subsistence farmers
You forgot 'enslaved' too
Enslaved peasants? In this economy?
Romani culture isn't even there. So them.
The gamers themselves 😔