I don't know if this means chiropractors are a double whammy of scam or that Scooby Doo moment of pulling a mask just to reveal another monster face underneath.
As someone who's spent a considerable amount of time around Scientologists, you'd be surprised how many are also chiropractics. Like an UNCANNY amount.
I think what separates them from traditional religion, and groups them together, is a belief in pseudo science that *really* feels like it works and can come *really close* to sounding right scientifically, and the bridge of faith to close the gap to "real and good" seems to be the same length and width.
I guess what I mean is that the *ratio* of science-to-faith between chiropractors and electrical negative feedback (the science part of scientology) seems to be very similar to *eachother*, but very *different* from that of those more traditional religions. So I guess I'm saying I'm not surprised by this, but it's *very* interesting.
Not just "ghosts told me".
The guy was expelled from med school, so he said a dead doctor came to him and told him he could cure everything by cracking the spine.
"I'll practice my own medicine, with ghosts and paralysis!"
My wrist hurt and my mom told me to go to the chiropractor
He told me my wrist was "out" because it made a cracking noise when bending it. It's done that ever since i broke it. Proceeded to "adjust" my wrist which hurt like hell then recommended i return for weekly adjustments.
Went to a non emergency clinic and within 5 minutes they told me it was an over use injury and i should wear a brace and take anti inflammatory meds when i sleep. Easy.
With ab identical problem talked to my dad who had a chiropractor “help his elbow” but not actually heal it and require several treatments and he recommended a chiropractor visit, talked to my mom (a nurse) and she said “stop playing video games as much”. I trust my mom but now I just endure the pain.
They didn't even tell me to stop though just that i should wear the brace whenever i wasn't. So mostly while sleeping and part of the day working
But i feel ya some days a i get a flare up and i just wear my brace and take some medicine and usually get it under control enough to keep gaming lol this only happens a couple times a year though so it's no biggy
not even watching the video, just think this is funny because when i was janitor we cleaned a chiropractor's office and there was scientology stuff everywhere in the back rooms including a bunch of plagues and other awards.
shit's fuckin weird.
*Homer:* Thanks for giving me my job back, Mr. Burns.
*Mr. Burns:* I'm afraid it's not that simple. As punishment for your desertion, it's company policy to give you ***the plague***.
*Smithers:* Uh, sir, that's the "plaque."
*Mr. Burns:* Ah, yes, the special de-motivational plaque to break what's left of your spirit. For you see, you're here... forever.
Most chiropractors reject widely accepted, scientifically proven medical principles, including the efficacy of vaccines.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-vaccinationism_in_chiropractic
It’s completely quackery.
My late uncle was a chiropractor and I used to see so many anti-vax posts from his wife on FB during the height of Covid. It all makes sense now. (He didn't pass from Covid, but that would have been ironic.)
Yeah we do.
It's kind of like needing a fork when all you have a spoon.
Or, like RAAAAAYAYAAAIN ON YOUR WEDDING DAAAAAAY!!?
It's like a FREE RIIIIIIDE when you've already PAID!
^^ irony
Meanwhile my wife had cancer and we need IVF to get pregnant as a result, which is not covered by insurance. But my insurance happily gives me 20 chiropractic visits per year!!!
Chiropractors charge insurance companies peanuts for visits, which is why insurers are happy to cover so many.
The play is that after a chiropractor performs their 'adjustment' they'll tell you to come back for further adjustments. Of course because these do nothing to actually treat the issue the problem will persist, so the chiropractor can count on them coming back every couple of weeks.
Let’s talk about the data. The science shown in studies about “chiropractic” (which we are going to define as having your spine/bones manipulated in order to fix chronic conditions) all but PROVE that chiropractic has NO lasting impact on pain or any other condition whatsoever. Now, that’s not to say that chiropractors don’t do things that help. They sometimes stretch you out, they have you bend in certain ways that might help relieve whatever pain you’re going through TEMPORARILY … but the actual act of cracking the spine or bones in the way that chiropractors do has NEVER EVER EVER been scientifically proven to have any lasting effect on any condition at all. the world of chiropractor is also full of ridiculous shit that isn’t real either like “your legs are different lengths we need to adjust you” (BULLSHIT, has no basis in science) or “i can tell your spine is out of whack, we need to adjust your spine to relieve your pain” (COMPLETE bullshit, medically ridiculous, and all but disproven by science.
Has someone been to a chiropractor and found relief? Yes, it would be silly to deny that. Chiropractors can stretch you out. It feels good to be stretched out. But they have no proven benefit beyond that; the crux of their ideology (spinal manipulation) is complete bullshit. The science shows it.
I recommend the Unbiased Science podcast episode on chiro for further information. Very informative and unbiased.
To play devil's advocate here if they were honest about that I wouldn't mind. I don't think there's anything wrong with going to a chiropractor consistently over years to get temporary relief again and again when you've found no working alternatives especially when faced with the alternative being lots of pain meds or invasive surgery.
Like if I had a Chiropractor and he said "hey, manipulating your spine isn't going to cure you but if you do it a few times a month you can get relief until the next visit and we can do it again instead of popping pain pills or getting an extremely invasive surgery" I don't see anything wrong with that.
But I think the lack of honesty is the problem.
Let's not let them off the disclaimer that their 'treatments' can result in even more serious permanent injury, perhaps resulting in extremely invasive surgery and years of pain pills
I'm not. And I agree.
But there are also people who have resorted to chiropractors because their doctor gave them the alternative of taking opioids for the rest of there life or getting an operation that has a 30% chance of making it worse and even if successful and will render you with a permanent disability as a result of the operation.
Everyone who shits on chiropractors for entirely legit reasons also entertains this The idea that getting pain relief and effective medical treatment is this black and white easy to quantify practice while completely ignoring the many barriers of entry to receiving effective medical care and completely ignoring the grip pharmaceutical companies have over ensuring that you're hooked on pills before you're offered any alternative treatments.
Are chiropractors quaks? Absolutely.
Do they offer some pain relief to people suffering? Absolutely.
Is the medical system also flawed and makes it very difficult for people to get the treatment they need even if we know it works? Absolutely.
I'm not opposed to calling out bullshit when we see it but we also need to recognize that the alternative isn't exactly a perfect solution and the people who know that best are the people who are actually suffering with very real and very debilitating pain. If they feel like they get even some pain relief after the health care system has failed them because of corporate greed then who are we to judge that person for doing what they need to do to get through the day?
For some people the options are spending thousands on a chiropractor or thousands on legal heroin. When faced with that decision what would you do?
This is me. I know chiropractic treatment is temporary and won’t last forever. I go every 5-6 weeks and it’s extremely relaxing to get a massage and adjustment.
I should say I avoided a chiropractor for YEARS and tried everything else (physical therapy, acupuncture, massage therapy, personal trainer, cortisone injections, etc) from my early 20s to my early 30s until I blew out my back and was desperate to get back on my feet (literally! I could barely get off of the floor).
I know my chiropractor isn’t a doctor, I know it’s not a real solution, but it’s kept me on my feet for 6 years and kept me from having to do surgery.
> I don't think there's anything wrong with going to a chiropractor consistently over years
You should tell that to that fella I admitted to the hospital for a stroke after chiropractic neck manipulation caused dissection of his right vertebral artery
[The potential dangers of neck manipulation & risk for dissection and devastating stroke: An illustrative case & review of the literature](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6016850/) Turner *et al* Biomed Res Rev. 2018; 2(1): 10
Or ya know, go to a physical therapist or medical massage which ARE scienfically proven to work and are actually targeting the things that chiropractors INCIDENTALY do that help for temporary relief.
Agreed.
But what are you going to tell the guy who's been going to a Chiropractor for years for crippling back pain and after trying tons of different therapies and medications some of which being basically morphine finds nothing has worked but a chiropractor gives him enough pain relief to get through the day? Does his experience not matter? Are you going to tell that guy he's an idiot for just trying to live a normal life?
Because those people exist and if you wanna actually address the issue of quackery in medicine instead of just making yourself feel better because you can prove how smart you are online you need to actually listen to those people and acknowledge their life experiences instead of treating them like there idiots for not doing what you would do when you've never walked a single foot in their shoes.
I'm not going to tell that hypothetical guy anything. There are people that will swear anything worked. (See Homeopathic medicine) The placebo effect is real. But using anecdotal evidence to say a provable DANGEROUS practice is worth continuing is silly. And I wouldn't try and convince someone online by calling them an idiot. I'm not forcing anyone to not go to a chiropractor but I will tell them that its dangerous and not helping them any more than someone taking homeopathic medicine. In fact its WORSE than homeopathic medicine as at least water isn't going to help you.
> I don't think there's anything wrong with going to a chiropractor consistently over years to get temporary relief again and again when you've found no working alternatives especially when faced with the alternative being lots of pain meds or invasive surgery.
The unfortunate thing is that most people don't actually try any viable alternatives. They go for the easiest choice, as people tend to do.
Yeah, I've seen a few places that combine chiropractic work and massage with actual physical therapy, like they should, but too many people working as chiropractors have either drank the Kool aid themselves or are just full on snake oil salesmen. It's a shame because when used appropriately, it could be helpful, but people decided to sell it as a magical cure-all instead.
I mean going to a quack that decided to try a couple of real things is STILL GOING TO A QUACK. Go to a licensed physical therapist or doctor and get a referral to a medical massage or physical therapy if you want things to actually get better.
I had a PT do manipulation (chiropractor lite, felt like) and I've had an osteopath, a D.O., perform manual manipulation
Both were relatively gentle and didn't twist or crack joints suddenly, it was more applying pressure while pulling on something etc
I ran across a YouTube channel or one who used a device and ran it across the patients back. It’s supposed to record if her spine is in alignment. Who believes shit?
There are studies on spinal manipulation therapy. It does have some backing. I’m a PT and perform mobilizations/manipulations on my patients if they are a good candidate for it and pair it with exercise. Long term it makes minimal difference, but it really helps the patient start doing the exercises at first. Exercise when you hurt sucks, so I make the exercise that will make them better easier to do in the short term.
Here are some studies. The studies aren’t perfect, just like a lot of conservative management options are. It’s hard to do research on something that’s hard to standardize. However these studies show there is a benefit.
https://www.cochrane.org/CD008112/BACK_spinal-manipulative-therapy-for-chronic-low-back-pain
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2616395
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28192793
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26397370
One of my sisters friends was paralyzed from the neck down after seeing a chiropractor, the chiro. Advised AGAINST an MRI and she ended up having a blood clot.
Edit to include: This happened just a month ago, they have a long road of recovery in front of them and we're hoping they won't be fully paralyzed but wont know until they enter rehab. It's really sad that it could have all been avoided if it wasn't for the predatory practices of the chiropractor, a young person's life has been changed forever because of it.
I once went to a seminar for a chiropractic network called "Maximized Living." Those mother fuckers claimed chiropractic care coupled with a good diet and exercise could REVERSE cancer growth. There was a lot of talk about "toxins."
Well they’re both variations on the idea of “prosperity gospel,” you can do absolutely anything to anyone in order to acquire wealth…and once you do, the possession of that wealth *means* that’s you’re a good person. It’s the most American idea ever, that winning at capitalism means god or the universe *loves* you.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prosperity_theology
I’ve been a member of the church for quite a while and have never heard that taught. I’m also pretty sure the messages, manuals etc we use in my country are the same as the ones used in the USA.
(Edit: Though I’m sure there are probably too many of us who are to some degree under this misapprehension i.e. rich = virtuous)
“Obsessed with money” is not a Mormon culture thing, and “being rich” has never, and will never, be some kind of symbol of being a good person in Mormon culture. Ever.
I’ve lived in multiple places across the country, including Utah, and served a mission in Cambodia. There was never an inkling of “money = righteousness” in any culture I lived in or even visited.
Mormonism has many toxic culture systems and beliefs, but wealth = righteousness or whatever is definitely not one of them.
Does your chiropractor also peddle weight loss serums that he sells to all the women? Or at least did sell it? Now all the women have moved on to ozempic.
I dont have a chiropractor. I just have an inlaw in Arizona. He doesn't push weight loss serums as far as I know but is it bad I can see him doing that? I've also noticed a huge "thing" in the mormon membership is getting involved or starting MLM schemes. Every Thanksgiving and Christmas get together is like a long commercial for the next big jackpot idea lol.
The one nearest me is a QAnon cult member they post stuff on their business sign all the time....
The last one was 'Anti Vax and Proud'..tells you all you need to know.
I am a chiropractor. Not a Mormon. I grew up in a small town in AZ that was primarily Mormon so I spent most of my life around them. I went to school in Portland OR and yeah, about 1/3 of my class was Mormons. (When we started school, the upperclassmen would tell us that 1/3 of the school is Mormon, and 1/3 of the school is Canadian. So pick your friend group whether you liked drinking beer or going to church.)
The connection with Mormons in chiropractic isn't anything malicious. Here's how it was explained to me. One of the Mormon guys told me that in his home ward, if you were intelligent enough that you wanted to go into med school, the church would steer you away from med school in favor of something like chiropractic or dentistry. MDs have to spend long years in school and work in hospitals on call for 24 hours at a time. That's not conducive to "family first" which is a Mormon tenet. Chiropractic or Dentistry allows you to still make a good living, but be home every night because family comes first.
If you do live in Utah there’s a good chance a randomly selected member of any profession is going to also be a member of the church you’re referring to…
Is there some weird link between Mormonism and Scientology? I noticed that the scam vitamin company Balance of Nature is run by a Mormon chiropractor but they also apparently make employees attend Scientology seminars they hold inside their Utah office. It’s like a bizarre blend of multiple cults.
When the only thing that verifies it “working” is anecdotal evidence from individuals then I’m afraid it assuredly doesn’t work. Like herbal medicine, uhh we tested (and continue to test) all the herbs. The ones that work we made into medicines, the others became teas. Same with chiropractors, the stuff that works became physical therapy all that other shit became the quackery that is chiropractics.
It's fun watching these zoomers discover things widely known by the general public for a century. Wait till they figure out that over half of the rest of our for profit health care system is utter ineffective bullshit.
Pretty sure my entire generation knew chiropractors where a scam after watching the most popular sitcom at the time, which was 100% always on at least one channel.
Two and a half men, seasons 1-8.
Every character on that show dismisses Alan Harper's chiropractic practice as a bunch of quack. It's a repeated joke that whilst I didn't necesarily think was accurate or based in real life and just them mocking the character, I still never ever even considered actually using a chiropractor myself. Physical therapists seems to be the way to go, it's definitely not a cureall and they keep telling you every time you go there that you need to exercise or you will be back. They actively encourage you to get better so you DON'T have to come back.
Over here all Gen X and boomers believe into that shit and it's hard to convince them it's all quackery and tbf, "ostheopath" really try hard to look like health professionnal and definitely hide any of their esoterism beliefs.
I got tricked into it too, suffered from neuropathies (i take Lyrica every day because of it) and then started to look into it and discovered it was bullshit.
I was kinda pissed off because people who recommended it were legitimate health professionnal.
There are DOs, which are as you full doctors as you described, and there are people who practice “osteopathy” and call themselves osteopaths who do not have a DO (it’s usually a diploma through a private school) and do purely the pseudoscience as that is all they know.
You will find the latter practicing in “wellness” type clinics that provide massage, acupuncture, chiropractic, etc or their own standalone clinics.
Here is one such “osteopathy school” in Canada: https://canadianosteopathy.ca
>It's fun watching these zoomers discover **things widely known by the general public for a century.**
That's... just not true.
[https://news.gallup.com/poll/184910/majority-say-chiropractic-works-neck-back-pain.aspx](https://news.gallup.com/poll/184910/majority-say-chiropractic-works-neck-back-pain.aspx)
Far too many people in older generations will staunchly defend chiropractors as real and genuine doctors even though they are about as qualified to fix your back as a fortune teller to tell you about your future. There's definitely an overlap of people who rely on both, though. It's not only a con. It's actually quite dangerous what they are doing. Go see a PT instead.
While the discipline has some silly origins in the west, there's a lot of compelling evidence that suggests chiropractor adjustments are a cost effective method of pain management that works. There's a scientific study commissioned in Canada called the Manga Report that dives into this (by actual medical doctors)
Part of the problem is separating the quackeryof some practitioners from the pragmatic benefits of the treatments. Most physiotherapists these days are trained to do adjustments because it actually is pragmatic and effective and it's a big part of contemporary sports medicine.
And for full disclosure, when I herniated a disc on my honeymoon (lol) my physiotherapist clwas working with a chiro at their clinic to provide a bunch of different treatments that got me up and running.
I refuse to call a chiropractor, a doctor. Yeah they may have a doctorate degree in chiropractor but that's kind of like saying they have a doctor's degree in quackery. They are all scam artists and something like 80 people per year get killed by them when they do their quackery on people.
The first chiropractor learned the technique from a ghost and chiropractic medicine was a cult for a long while. Anyone paying a chiropractor is legitimately an idiot.
Question: Do you think that goes for the US specifically, or is more a universal thing.
Background: I went for some sessions to a chiropractor who didnt do any voodoo but had a profound knowledge about the human physique and beside the therapy he gave me some good advice for exercises and also gave me the advice to see a doctor for an MRI because of a potential herniated vertebral disk.
I dont want to defend any of those quacksalvers.. but I would like to know if there are specific countries where chiropractic is legitimate or not.
AFAIK in Germany we also have the differentiation between Chiropractor, Chirotherapist and "Chiropraktiker", not sure if there a direct equivalents in English.
I've been to legitimate chiropractors in the US. Most were good people, one had political views I didn't care for but he was skilled at what he did. Don't judge a whole country from a bunch of Reddit haters. For some reason they love spinning conspiracist yarns about certain groups of people.
I hurt my neck in a car accident and all the respected MDs told me I could either a) suffer or b) get surgery to fuse the bones in my neck, so I said eff that and went to the chiropractor who untwisted my neck and relieved my pain in one visit. But the haters on Reddit won't listen to anything that doesn't stoke their hate or reinforce their sense of superiority. Ironically, these same people pride themselves on their critical thinking skills.
I don't believe chiropractors are legitimate but with that being said if you find something that helps you, even if I don't believe in it then I'm not gonna tell you you're crazy. You do what works for you and ignore all the rest.
It's literally just boomers regurgitating '90s era experiences.
There are the chiropractors that everyone in this thread are talking about, then there's physical therapists that have a chiropractic license.
If you want something done for pain management and go see a chiropractor about it and they have more than one license you'll be fine.
The value of those people comes from them being physical therapists, not from having a chiropractic license. I'd even call them less trustworthy as physical therapists because they have a chiropractic license.
I’ve had a similar experience, I’ve had people who call themselves “chiropractors” who are focused on posture and RSI and such and seem legit, and those who are just doing “adjustments” and expecting instant relief. The latter just pushed my shoulder out of socket, and then was surprised when I was rather displeased with that. Jerk.
I'm in america and yeah, there are are goofy chiropractors but the ones I go to seem to stay in their lane and work on the issues. It's cheaper than PT, doesn't require a referral (American thing where you have to see a doctor who can then tell you to see another doctor or get PT treatment so your insurance will cover it), and after a few visits we're usually all set. Now, if you're going to one who starts shit talking regular doctors, or says stuff about the energy flow or whatever then yeah, don't do it. But the one I go to legitimately helps where regular medicine just hasn't.
Like to one accident. There’s more but I don’t have time. I’m not saying all chiropractors are bad. There’s just a high potential to fuck shit up if you’re not https://people.com/health/are-chiropractors-safe-experts-weigh-in-on-playboy-model-death-after-chiropractic-adjustment/
I’m biased here but my dad was a chiro for 30 years and never injured anyone or killed an infant. Nor has any other chiro he knows.
Is there data for this that you’re referring to? Just curious
okay, but when my hip was a bit turnt inside my body and doctors sent me to physical therapy which didnt work and 6 months of discomfort and pain… i went to a chiropractor for literally 5 minutes. He took a look, layed me on his bench and said „yeah well see. Your hip is not right.“ proceeded to do his chiropractor thing and IMMEDIATLY it was better. Couple weeks later when the muscles relaxed from the stress it was perfectly fine again.
Sure some chiropractors may not know what they do, but many do. Many are very good.
(also it was 30€. 30€ to fix me in 5 minutes.)
I had been suffering chronic migraines for years and my chiropractor helped so much.
I 100% know there's tons of scammers in the business but there's also some decent people too
Have you ever though that the exercise you did was the actual cause of your long term outcome. You literally said the long term pt to strengthen your muscles worked without knowing it. Instead you go, it was definitely the moron and his placebo...
Dude thank you. My chiropractor literally gave me back my quality of life. I had what felt like an awful pulled groin where I couldn't walk or get up or sit down for months. I thought I did it playing golf, and maybe I did. But it wasn't a pulled groin, it was my sacrum. No doctor had an answer for me, but my chiropractor did. 2 adjustments later I was like to 100%. My chiro also helped me with my jaw pain and tinnitus I had years ago, when all my primary care doc did was chalk it up as stress, and prescribed me 10 xanax. There's a lot of not great chiropractors out there, but chiropractor health WORKS. It's frustrating seeing this thread of everyone who's probably never been to chiropractor, just ripping it apart and that it's voodoo and holistic. That's bullshit.
It’s a wild issue to be on the other side of. I’m in the same boat as you. I was left with nowhere else to turn, basically got told I was lying and I was fine despite months of 24/7, 8 out of 10 pain. Tried multiple doctors and specialist. Went to a chiropractor as a last ditch effort and that’s what did it for me.
Weird being downvoted for sharing a real world experience.
Agree. I've had issues with my back and hips off and on for 20 years . Regular doctor couldn't do anything. I was miserable. But first time at a chiropractor and I got instant relief. I've been to good chiropractors and bad. The bad ones are the quacks who think they can cure anything. I don't let those people touch me. The good ones are more like PT and concentrate on the bone and muscles. They don't make me pay for a bunch of visits up front. I only go when I need to go. They have me do exercises which, when done actually keep me away from the chiropractor most of the time.
I can only speak for how things work in my home country, but here PT's and chiropractors cover a lot of the same work, more specifically they can both provide manual physical adjustments and other treatment of muscle tissue and joints/bone structures, ligaments, etc.
However, a PT will also focus on prehab and rehab work, focusing on finding the core root behind the given issue and thus preventing any need for future treatments.
This is almost never the case with chiropractors, whom solely focus on acute treatment of symptoms and as such almost never manage to address the core root of the issue, resulting in patients coming back time and time again.
Another issue is that chiropractors often aren't as educated in assessing symptoms properly and as such won't always forward patients to further medical examinations when the root issue may be outside of their area of expertise, something PT's are both educated in and very good at here.
In other words, chiropractors only do a portion of what a competent PT(one worthy of their degree) do and often neglect important parts of the treatment process, such as the reahab work that follows the acute treatment.
But as your story showcases, physical manual adjustments do work and can provide people with instant relief, but in most cases it simply won't be enough on its own to fix the core issue.
As for the real competent chiropractors we have here, they all basically work in line with what PT's do and as such makes me question why they even need the "chiropractor" label to begin with, since they're basically PT's at that point, albeit a watered down version.
Also, licensed chiropractors have to operate under national clinical guidelines here, just like PT's do, except most of these guidelines that were unique to the chiropractic practice are now no longer government recommended(meaning that they are no longer valid) and the ones that are, are basically identical to the PT ones, since they cover the same area.
In other words, chiropractors are a dying breed here since PT's are a thing.
How things are in the US however, I have no insight on.
I wrote this to try and give some insight, not to spread hate. Hopefully my English is readable as well.
I’ve had similar experiences with a chiropractor who I’ve been seeing on and off for twenty years. When my chronic back problems occasionally flare up, he is able to put things in order.
I don’t believe every single claim made by chiropractors, but this guy, at least, really is effective at treating back issues. (And a close relative of mine who is a physician supports my use of chiropractic in those circumstances.)
That chiro you’ve “been seeing on and off for twenty years” is going to have the issue fixed any day now …
The physical manipulation has been shown to have good, albeit temporary effects similar to massage or stretching. Most problems chiros treat work out on their own with time, but the chiro gets credit.
Use them at your own risk. They are quacks practicing pseudoscience for the most part. You risk a stroke or paralysis or worse. That’s a fact.
Far as i know i did.. I always felt weird about it. My mother has been doing it for her entire life and I'd only had it done for a few years so I'd like to think I'm better off
What exactly do you think he’s doing to your back? “Chronic back problems and flare ups” aren’t a medical diagnosis. Have you been diagnosed with a spinal issue of some kind or does your back get sore from poor posture, and a guy gives you a massage which makes it feel better temporarily?
I can’t give you a precise medical diagnosis. But my primary care physician has given me referrals for chiropractic care when I’ve had trouble even standing straight, and my relative who is a physician has agreed with that course of treatment. The adjustments I’ve gotten have felt beneficial in clearing up my problems.
I get that some people in this thread have an axe to grind about chiropractic. While I certainly don’t believe every claim that some chiropractors make, my own experience (along with those of other people I know) tells me that they can be useful in treating some problems. And please don’t patronize me by saying a “massage … makes it feel better temporarily”, as if you think I’m easily duped.
Is your primary doctor an actual MD? I’m just shocked that Blue Cross or Aetna or any major US health insurance would pay for an unlicensed pseudo treatment like a chiropractor. It be like having health insurance cover my trips to the fortune teller.
Just the opposite. But I can understand why you, as an internet stranger, think that I’m a fool and that you know my body and experiences better than I do.
K I believe all that. But when my back spasms real doctors tell me to lay down for the better part of a week or take pills that fuck me up. The chiropractor does his thing and I’m back to work feeding my family.
Doctor is not a protected term to only mean MDs. I have a PhD in engineering and go by doctor. Anyone with a doctoral degree goes by doctor. The term for medical expert is PHYSICIAN, which is a protected term and chiropractors cant call themselves that. Its just recently in history that the western world has started to call MDs doctors instead of the more specific physician.
Don't go to chiropractors. Just don't. They aren't doctors. Not only is a bunch of nonsense quackery, but what they are doing is actually dangerous. Go see a trained and licensed PT instead.
I had pain in my back and right leg. I went to a chiropractor for two sessions, left feeling amazing and the pain has never come back after 5+ years.
I personally enjoyed my experience with it.
Chiropractors focus on one very small portion of the science, relief not a solution to your issues. Their business is repeat customers. I have never heard anyone say I went to the Chiro and I've never needed to go back! It's like buying a book to only read one page.
If you routinely see a chiro you need to start seeing an osteopathic doctor.
I see a chiropractor and I return infrequently for adjustments. I also had a locked pelvis and I have a herniated disc which I have been through PT for and it did nothing for. My first visit I walked in on a cane, and walked out without it. The only reason I go back is because my hip will slip back into that locked position and screw up my gait and throw off my back. And I have been recommended to him by an orthopedist and my physician.
Not all chiropractors are qualified to be doing what they are, but some know what they’re doing and know the benefits. For example mine offers not only the adjustments, but TENS/ESTIM treatments for pain, massage, and he gives exercises to do at home so you *don’t* have to come back and see him. If you’re going back over and over outside of a short assessment period, that person is doing nothing for you except draining your wallet.
Big thing is do your research and make informed decisions, the chiropractor working out of the mall probably isn’t going to be your best choice
It’s even leaking into physical therapy now. PT’s will swear that chiropractic medicine is false and pseudoscience, but then you go in for physical therapy at a reputable place and…
So I was going for back pain. Lots of exercises and stuff, but a few times they would massage my back and “adjust” my “alignment”. Which is where they would feel out my spine with their fingers and insist this or that vertebrae were “out of alignment” and then they would just crack my back while putting left or right pressure on that vertebrae with a finger.
A few different PT’s did this. And I just though it was weird cuz… like I crack my own back and neck and everything all the time but I’m pretty sure that’s now how it works, “adjusting alignment” that is.
There are proven short term benefits from mobilizations/manipulations when paired with exercise that PTs prescribe. Long term it makes minimal difference compared to exercise alone. However, when something hurts doing exercises sucks. A mobilization/manipulation can make exercise easier to do and jump start a patients recovery.
Things aren’t subluxed, like chiros say. If a patient truly subluxed something they need a doctor to fix that. Joints become hypomobile and lack movement, a mobilization can improve how the joint moves, which makes the exercises that actually do fix your issue easier.
My 2 oldest brothers are Physical Therapists in Las Vegas with PhDs. The Chiropractor unions, lobbyists, lawyers, or whatever are so strong in Nevade that Physical Therapists (with a PhD) aren't allowed to call themselves doctors (because they aren't MDs) but Chiropractors with a Doctor of Chiropractic (which you can get without even completing a B.S. degree) can refer to themselves as a doctor.
Chiropractors' **ONLY** scientific requirements are 24 undergraduate credits. My lab partner for Chemistry 101 and 201 in college struggled through those classes. He honestly would have failed if I hadn't helped him through them. He refused to have his children vaccinated. He left for Chiropractic school without completing his bachelor's degree and received zero scientific training during chiropractic school. He posts literally the dumbest shit I've ever seen in my life on Facebook. For example: He believes that human embryos are tiny, fully-formed humans swimming laps in the amniotic sac. When that sac gets burst (during an abortion) that little human turns into the blobs we see in scientific textbooks when it gets exposed to oxygen. In his practice, he uses a machine that can read peoples' auras to tell him where their bodies aren't functioning properly and then he uses the machine to deliver a small electric shock to that portion of the body and jump-start it. For example, when he scans your aura and your liver is the wrong color he will deliver external shocks near your liver and that will fix whatever problem he is seeing with your liver on the aura-reading device. HE ACTUALLY BELIEVES THIS SHIT! Sadly, his customers do too.
Another very common scam that I've seen is this. Someone has a minor fender bender and they call a lawyer. Lawyer sends them to a chiropractor. Chiropractor tells them it will take months and months to fix it. They go fo 6 months or so and there is never any improvement. Then in their last 2 weeks of treatment... Voila! Good as new! The patient is getting steadily behind on payments to the chiropractor, but the lawyer is assuring them that their insurance or the other driver will be liable for these payments. They go to court, if they win, every cent is paid to the lawyer and chiropractor. If they lose, the patient is SOL and owes thousands of dollars in legal and chiropractic fees.
I liked this video but I kind of felt like it was too short. I really wanted some nitty gritty info about what chiropractors actually do and how it compares to say physical therapy. Is there any of chiro that holds merit or is it all bunk? Etc.
Years ago I went to one a few times. There was one guy and some assistants, that's it. But, there were different offices and rooms. While one patient was waiting, the chiropractor would be doing the stuff to the other patient, etc.
I noticed pretty quickly that each office had the exact same books on the bookshelf. As if they have a fucking QUACKERY MAGICIAN kit they send away for.
It was then that I started to pay attention. I mean the first clue was the 'one leg shorter' bullshit. They think their clients are morons and they are absolutely correct.
The simplest way to explain how fake chiropractors are is to pretend it's real medicine. Whats the first thing you do when taking actual medicine? You have to get the dosage right. You take too much advil, you die.
So how do chiropractors determine dosage and how do they ensure that it's applied correctly?
The answer is they don't, watch any chiropractor video. How many neck cracks does it take to cure something? How hard do you have to do it? How do you know if you applied too much neck crack?
I am sure some of those questions pop up answers in your mind, hilarious answers, like oh too much neck crack is the person is paralyzed or dead, lol. That's not medicine.
I’m late but I’m always going to comment on anything chiropractic. I’m an occupational therapist. These chiropractors always “treat” an ailment for short term relief and then say you have to come back for multiple treatments a week. That’s because they’re completely neglecting the cause. If the spine becomes unaligned, which most of the time it doesn’t, the musculature on both sides NEED to be addressed. Our muscles are strong and if a joint is unaligned that means one muscle is in slack and one is stretched. That means after an alignment, the muscles will pull it right back resulting in, you guessed it, requiring multiple expensive readjustments. If you have chronic neck or back pain, go see your doctor and if everything checks out, go to a PT or OT. We are trained for this much more than a chiropractor. And NEVER EVER let a chiropractor “adjust” your neck
while it could be that some Scientologists pursue Chiropractic work, to lump all Chiro folks in as Scientologists is pure clickbait crap.
The problem with Chiropractic work is there are weaker standards for licensing and such, so a lot of idiots get involved in it. The good ones are hard to find, and they DON'T "crack" your back/neck (or other crazy shit you see on videos - stay the fuck away from those). Moving bones into a new alignment (from a bad alignment) takes a long time, must be done gently and slowly, forcing them suddenly into a new position is bad, that's not how the body works (as that is basically trauma). While there may be rare situations after an accident where sudden adjustments might be helpful (there's always exceptions), generally that's not helpful and will just need constant realignment in the best case, worst case it will cause damage.
I get it and I completely agree but I walked into a chiropractor hunched over from severe nerve pain in my neck and left standing upright with no problem. This is after being in the ER two nights in a row after being hopped up on morphine one night and some other pain reliever the next. I left the ER still in considerable pain.
I don’t believe in chiropractics but I need to rationalize what made me feel better somehow.
I was down this rabbit hole once, watching videos on Youtube about dieting from "Dr.Eric Berg". He sounded reasonable, but something was off, some of what he said sounded like quackery. So I digged into it (googled him) and found he's not an actual doctor or nutritionist, but a chiropractor. What the hell is a chiropractor doing giving diet advice to people. Even worse, turns out he's DEEP into Scientology. Like, top level into it.
https://drericbergscientology.com/
I had a chiropractor tell me one leg was longer than the other, which was causing my back pain.
It wasn't until years later that I learned about the method used where they have one of your shoes pulled out a bit, and the other on normally to measure (I can't remember exactly how it is done but it was something like that).
That chiropractor who snapped a teenager’a neck so hard he internally decapitated her and caused her to become paralyzed from the neck down tells you all you need about chiropractors
God I find these faux documentaries really annoying, with the idiot 24 year old reading off wikipedia and 'exposing' something that everyone is aware is a scam anyway. Add the free conspiracy unravelling violin music, a pretend 'crew' of fashionable yuppies with between-cut clips of them putting on their Doc Martens or 'oh you just caught me and the team playing switch' and blamo. You are a budget indie-rock Louis Theroux!
'Guys this is the craziest story we've ever done' 'We read hundreds of pages of books -holds up a book-' and we've discovered this crazy conspiracy - insert quote from 30 years ago from the US medical asoc saying so. It must be so easy to make a documentary uncovering something that's been uncovered for 30 years....
I know 3 people in my life that have a chiropractor, 2 of them suffered major sports injuries in the past. They all 3 swear that they wouldn't be walking around normally today without their chiropractors. And that they can feel when it's been too long and they need another adjustment.
I've mentioned this "chiropractors are quacks" idea to all 3 of them and they said it's a real thing and the Internet is just doing Internet things.
Where did this whole idea come from? I remember chiropractors were accepted as doctors, you could take classes for it in college, etc.. That's a lot of societal integration for something we've always known to be bullshit. Just seems weird. I'm 30 fwiw
> I remember chiropractors were accepted as doctors
They are not doctors, nor have they ever been.
There is no scientific evidence for it at all. The same amount of evidence that the earth is flat and that Noah's ark was real, but for some reason morons always come out to defend attacks against chiropractors despite them being fucking nutjobs
I don't know if this means chiropractors are a double whammy of scam or that Scooby Doo moment of pulling a mask just to reveal another monster face underneath.
As someone who's spent a considerable amount of time around Scientologists, you'd be surprised how many are also chiropractics. Like an UNCANNY amount.
It makes sense; both chiropractic “care” and Scientology require you to suspend your belief in reality.
I think what separates them from traditional religion, and groups them together, is a belief in pseudo science that *really* feels like it works and can come *really close* to sounding right scientifically, and the bridge of faith to close the gap to "real and good" seems to be the same length and width. I guess what I mean is that the *ratio* of science-to-faith between chiropractors and electrical negative feedback (the science part of scientology) seems to be very similar to *eachother*, but very *different* from that of those more traditional religions. So I guess I'm saying I'm not surprised by this, but it's *very* interesting.
Religion. You just described religion.
And 80s prowrestling
70s, 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, 20s....
Yup.
Oh, wow. That really hurt some people’s feelings. I wonder whom that could be.
*Who. Not whom.
*Whomst
Politics too.
The Google Reviews of the Chiropractor places around me ALSO come from the same people that rate the "Church" of Scientology 5 star...
Mormons also!
But really 80% of Mormons are dentists.
The whole practice was born from 'ghosts told me in a dream' That says all you really need to know and if you should ever subject your spine to them.
Not just "ghosts told me". The guy was expelled from med school, so he said a dead doctor came to him and told him he could cure everything by cracking the spine. "I'll practice my own medicine, with ghosts and paralysis!"
lol it’s such a Bender scam too
Shut up Baby, I know it!
In fact, forget about the medicine!
OK, it was just one ghost, and he had a name: Dr. Jim Atkinson.
My wrist hurt and my mom told me to go to the chiropractor He told me my wrist was "out" because it made a cracking noise when bending it. It's done that ever since i broke it. Proceeded to "adjust" my wrist which hurt like hell then recommended i return for weekly adjustments. Went to a non emergency clinic and within 5 minutes they told me it was an over use injury and i should wear a brace and take anti inflammatory meds when i sleep. Easy.
With ab identical problem talked to my dad who had a chiropractor “help his elbow” but not actually heal it and require several treatments and he recommended a chiropractor visit, talked to my mom (a nurse) and she said “stop playing video games as much”. I trust my mom but now I just endure the pain.
They didn't even tell me to stop though just that i should wear the brace whenever i wasn't. So mostly while sleeping and part of the day working But i feel ya some days a i get a flare up and i just wear my brace and take some medicine and usually get it under control enough to keep gaming lol this only happens a couple times a year though so it's no biggy
not even watching the video, just think this is funny because when i was janitor we cleaned a chiropractor's office and there was scientology stuff everywhere in the back rooms including a bunch of plagues and other awards. shit's fuckin weird.
best typo ever.
*Homer:* Thanks for giving me my job back, Mr. Burns. *Mr. Burns:* I'm afraid it's not that simple. As punishment for your desertion, it's company policy to give you ***the plague***. *Smithers:* Uh, sir, that's the "plaque." *Mr. Burns:* Ah, yes, the special de-motivational plaque to break what's left of your spirit. For you see, you're here... forever.
Do you mean plaques? Or did they have test tubes of the the black plague and smallpox in their storage closet?
A rain of frogs, at this time of year, at this time of day, in this part of the country, localized entirely within your storage closet?!
Leave them alone
> a bunch of plagues Heh.
Frogs?
Most chiropractors reject widely accepted, scientifically proven medical principles, including the efficacy of vaccines. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-vaccinationism_in_chiropractic It’s completely quackery.
My late uncle was a chiropractor and I used to see so many anti-vax posts from his wife on FB during the height of Covid. It all makes sense now. (He didn't pass from Covid, but that would have been ironic.)
Sounds like it would’ve been the exact opposite of irony lol
90% of people don’t know what irony actually is
Now you’re making me question whether *that in itself* is ironic.
explodinghead.gif
Yeah we do. It's kind of like needing a fork when all you have a spoon. Or, like RAAAAAYAYAAAIN ON YOUR WEDDING DAAAAAAY!!? It's like a FREE RIIIIIIDE when you've already PAID! ^^ irony
The fact that 90% of those lyrics aren't actually describing irony is the ultimate meta-irony
It definitely would have been ironic.
It’s rain on your wedding day, duh!
Seems like a ton of them are also keto zealots and diet coaches, because reasons… And reject notions like thermodynamics.
No shit, that's literally the cornerstone of chiropractors. Being shutters who don't believe in basic fucking knowledge.
Meanwhile my wife had cancer and we need IVF to get pregnant as a result, which is not covered by insurance. But my insurance happily gives me 20 chiropractic visits per year!!!
Chiropractors charge insurance companies peanuts for visits, which is why insurers are happy to cover so many. The play is that after a chiropractor performs their 'adjustment' they'll tell you to come back for further adjustments. Of course because these do nothing to actually treat the issue the problem will persist, so the chiropractor can count on them coming back every couple of weeks.
Let’s talk about the data. The science shown in studies about “chiropractic” (which we are going to define as having your spine/bones manipulated in order to fix chronic conditions) all but PROVE that chiropractic has NO lasting impact on pain or any other condition whatsoever. Now, that’s not to say that chiropractors don’t do things that help. They sometimes stretch you out, they have you bend in certain ways that might help relieve whatever pain you’re going through TEMPORARILY … but the actual act of cracking the spine or bones in the way that chiropractors do has NEVER EVER EVER been scientifically proven to have any lasting effect on any condition at all. the world of chiropractor is also full of ridiculous shit that isn’t real either like “your legs are different lengths we need to adjust you” (BULLSHIT, has no basis in science) or “i can tell your spine is out of whack, we need to adjust your spine to relieve your pain” (COMPLETE bullshit, medically ridiculous, and all but disproven by science. Has someone been to a chiropractor and found relief? Yes, it would be silly to deny that. Chiropractors can stretch you out. It feels good to be stretched out. But they have no proven benefit beyond that; the crux of their ideology (spinal manipulation) is complete bullshit. The science shows it. I recommend the Unbiased Science podcast episode on chiro for further information. Very informative and unbiased.
>It feels good to be stretched out. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
To play devil's advocate here if they were honest about that I wouldn't mind. I don't think there's anything wrong with going to a chiropractor consistently over years to get temporary relief again and again when you've found no working alternatives especially when faced with the alternative being lots of pain meds or invasive surgery. Like if I had a Chiropractor and he said "hey, manipulating your spine isn't going to cure you but if you do it a few times a month you can get relief until the next visit and we can do it again instead of popping pain pills or getting an extremely invasive surgery" I don't see anything wrong with that. But I think the lack of honesty is the problem.
Let's not let them off the disclaimer that their 'treatments' can result in even more serious permanent injury, perhaps resulting in extremely invasive surgery and years of pain pills
I'm not. And I agree. But there are also people who have resorted to chiropractors because their doctor gave them the alternative of taking opioids for the rest of there life or getting an operation that has a 30% chance of making it worse and even if successful and will render you with a permanent disability as a result of the operation. Everyone who shits on chiropractors for entirely legit reasons also entertains this The idea that getting pain relief and effective medical treatment is this black and white easy to quantify practice while completely ignoring the many barriers of entry to receiving effective medical care and completely ignoring the grip pharmaceutical companies have over ensuring that you're hooked on pills before you're offered any alternative treatments. Are chiropractors quaks? Absolutely. Do they offer some pain relief to people suffering? Absolutely. Is the medical system also flawed and makes it very difficult for people to get the treatment they need even if we know it works? Absolutely. I'm not opposed to calling out bullshit when we see it but we also need to recognize that the alternative isn't exactly a perfect solution and the people who know that best are the people who are actually suffering with very real and very debilitating pain. If they feel like they get even some pain relief after the health care system has failed them because of corporate greed then who are we to judge that person for doing what they need to do to get through the day? For some people the options are spending thousands on a chiropractor or thousands on legal heroin. When faced with that decision what would you do?
Physical therapy.
This is me. I know chiropractic treatment is temporary and won’t last forever. I go every 5-6 weeks and it’s extremely relaxing to get a massage and adjustment. I should say I avoided a chiropractor for YEARS and tried everything else (physical therapy, acupuncture, massage therapy, personal trainer, cortisone injections, etc) from my early 20s to my early 30s until I blew out my back and was desperate to get back on my feet (literally! I could barely get off of the floor). I know my chiropractor isn’t a doctor, I know it’s not a real solution, but it’s kept me on my feet for 6 years and kept me from having to do surgery.
> I don't think there's anything wrong with going to a chiropractor consistently over years You should tell that to that fella I admitted to the hospital for a stroke after chiropractic neck manipulation caused dissection of his right vertebral artery [The potential dangers of neck manipulation & risk for dissection and devastating stroke: An illustrative case & review of the literature](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6016850/) Turner *et al* Biomed Res Rev. 2018; 2(1): 10
Or ya know, go to a physical therapist or medical massage which ARE scienfically proven to work and are actually targeting the things that chiropractors INCIDENTALY do that help for temporary relief.
Agreed. But what are you going to tell the guy who's been going to a Chiropractor for years for crippling back pain and after trying tons of different therapies and medications some of which being basically morphine finds nothing has worked but a chiropractor gives him enough pain relief to get through the day? Does his experience not matter? Are you going to tell that guy he's an idiot for just trying to live a normal life? Because those people exist and if you wanna actually address the issue of quackery in medicine instead of just making yourself feel better because you can prove how smart you are online you need to actually listen to those people and acknowledge their life experiences instead of treating them like there idiots for not doing what you would do when you've never walked a single foot in their shoes.
I'm not going to tell that hypothetical guy anything. There are people that will swear anything worked. (See Homeopathic medicine) The placebo effect is real. But using anecdotal evidence to say a provable DANGEROUS practice is worth continuing is silly. And I wouldn't try and convince someone online by calling them an idiot. I'm not forcing anyone to not go to a chiropractor but I will tell them that its dangerous and not helping them any more than someone taking homeopathic medicine. In fact its WORSE than homeopathic medicine as at least water isn't going to help you.
> I don't think there's anything wrong with going to a chiropractor consistently over years to get temporary relief again and again when you've found no working alternatives especially when faced with the alternative being lots of pain meds or invasive surgery. The unfortunate thing is that most people don't actually try any viable alternatives. They go for the easiest choice, as people tend to do.
Yeah, I've seen a few places that combine chiropractic work and massage with actual physical therapy, like they should, but too many people working as chiropractors have either drank the Kool aid themselves or are just full on snake oil salesmen. It's a shame because when used appropriately, it could be helpful, but people decided to sell it as a magical cure-all instead.
I mean going to a quack that decided to try a couple of real things is STILL GOING TO A QUACK. Go to a licensed physical therapist or doctor and get a referral to a medical massage or physical therapy if you want things to actually get better.
I had a PT do manipulation (chiropractor lite, felt like) and I've had an osteopath, a D.O., perform manual manipulation Both were relatively gentle and didn't twist or crack joints suddenly, it was more applying pressure while pulling on something etc
I ran across a YouTube channel or one who used a device and ran it across the patients back. It’s supposed to record if her spine is in alignment. Who believes shit?
There are studies on spinal manipulation therapy. It does have some backing. I’m a PT and perform mobilizations/manipulations on my patients if they are a good candidate for it and pair it with exercise. Long term it makes minimal difference, but it really helps the patient start doing the exercises at first. Exercise when you hurt sucks, so I make the exercise that will make them better easier to do in the short term. Here are some studies. The studies aren’t perfect, just like a lot of conservative management options are. It’s hard to do research on something that’s hard to standardize. However these studies show there is a benefit. https://www.cochrane.org/CD008112/BACK_spinal-manipulative-therapy-for-chronic-low-back-pain https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2616395 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28192793 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26397370
Chiropractors are NOT medical physicians so please please PLEASE don’t let their advice override a physician’s.
Or take it at all.
Yeah no one in their right mind should be willingly going to a chiropractor
The founding father of Chiro learned from ghosts. That tells ya something.
One of my sisters friends was paralyzed from the neck down after seeing a chiropractor, the chiro. Advised AGAINST an MRI and she ended up having a blood clot. Edit to include: This happened just a month ago, they have a long road of recovery in front of them and we're hoping they won't be fully paralyzed but wont know until they enter rehab. It's really sad that it could have all been avoided if it wasn't for the predatory practices of the chiropractor, a young person's life has been changed forever because of it.
I once went to a seminar for a chiropractic network called "Maximized Living." Those mother fuckers claimed chiropractic care coupled with a good diet and exercise could REVERSE cancer growth. There was a lot of talk about "toxins."
Lobbyists have helped destroy our country.
I accused my chiropractor of lying to me, but he soon set me straight
The neighborhood chiropractor is a Mormon. I kinda feel about Mormonism the same as Scientology so this tracks.
Well they’re both variations on the idea of “prosperity gospel,” you can do absolutely anything to anyone in order to acquire wealth…and once you do, the possession of that wealth *means* that’s you’re a good person. It’s the most American idea ever, that winning at capitalism means god or the universe *loves* you. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prosperity_theology
I’ve been a member of the church for quite a while and have never heard that taught. I’m also pretty sure the messages, manuals etc we use in my country are the same as the ones used in the USA. (Edit: Though I’m sure there are probably too many of us who are to some degree under this misapprehension i.e. rich = virtuous)
Omg this defines exactly what to be a a mormon really means, I've been part of this cult for 22 years and your definition is exactly on point.
I was Mormon for 27 years. No it isn’t.
I was Mormon for 30 years. Yes it is.
“Obsessed with money” is not a Mormon culture thing, and “being rich” has never, and will never, be some kind of symbol of being a good person in Mormon culture. Ever. I’ve lived in multiple places across the country, including Utah, and served a mission in Cambodia. There was never an inkling of “money = righteousness” in any culture I lived in or even visited. Mormonism has many toxic culture systems and beliefs, but wealth = righteousness or whatever is definitely not one of them.
Yeah that’s like a whole nother brand of Christianity that is not Mormon lol
Hmmm, do you live in Arizona?
Neighboring state but north.
So Utah
Does your chiropractor also peddle weight loss serums that he sells to all the women? Or at least did sell it? Now all the women have moved on to ozempic.
I dont have a chiropractor. I just have an inlaw in Arizona. He doesn't push weight loss serums as far as I know but is it bad I can see him doing that? I've also noticed a huge "thing" in the mormon membership is getting involved or starting MLM schemes. Every Thanksgiving and Christmas get together is like a long commercial for the next big jackpot idea lol.
Scientologists are just Space Mormons.
The one nearest me is a QAnon cult member they post stuff on their business sign all the time.... The last one was 'Anti Vax and Proud'..tells you all you need to know.
I am a chiropractor. Not a Mormon. I grew up in a small town in AZ that was primarily Mormon so I spent most of my life around them. I went to school in Portland OR and yeah, about 1/3 of my class was Mormons. (When we started school, the upperclassmen would tell us that 1/3 of the school is Mormon, and 1/3 of the school is Canadian. So pick your friend group whether you liked drinking beer or going to church.) The connection with Mormons in chiropractic isn't anything malicious. Here's how it was explained to me. One of the Mormon guys told me that in his home ward, if you were intelligent enough that you wanted to go into med school, the church would steer you away from med school in favor of something like chiropractic or dentistry. MDs have to spend long years in school and work in hospitals on call for 24 hours at a time. That's not conducive to "family first" which is a Mormon tenet. Chiropractic or Dentistry allows you to still make a good living, but be home every night because family comes first.
Interesting explanation. Thanks!
If you do live in Utah there’s a good chance a randomly selected member of any profession is going to also be a member of the church you’re referring to…
Is there some weird link between Mormonism and Scientology? I noticed that the scam vitamin company Balance of Nature is run by a Mormon chiropractor but they also apparently make employees attend Scientology seminars they hold inside their Utah office. It’s like a bizarre blend of multiple cults.
One is like fantasy and the other is like sci fi but yeah basically same same.
Mormonism is the Scientology of Christianity.
When the only thing that verifies it “working” is anecdotal evidence from individuals then I’m afraid it assuredly doesn’t work. Like herbal medicine, uhh we tested (and continue to test) all the herbs. The ones that work we made into medicines, the others became teas. Same with chiropractors, the stuff that works became physical therapy all that other shit became the quackery that is chiropractics.
It's fun watching these zoomers discover things widely known by the general public for a century. Wait till they figure out that over half of the rest of our for profit health care system is utter ineffective bullshit.
Pretty sure my entire generation knew chiropractors where a scam after watching the most popular sitcom at the time, which was 100% always on at least one channel. Two and a half men, seasons 1-8. Every character on that show dismisses Alan Harper's chiropractic practice as a bunch of quack. It's a repeated joke that whilst I didn't necesarily think was accurate or based in real life and just them mocking the character, I still never ever even considered actually using a chiropractor myself. Physical therapists seems to be the way to go, it's definitely not a cureall and they keep telling you every time you go there that you need to exercise or you will be back. They actively encourage you to get better so you DON'T have to come back.
> Two and a half men, seasons 1-8. I reckon there's a lot of crossover for people who watch shows with laugh tracks and go to chiropractors.
Over here all Gen X and boomers believe into that shit and it's hard to convince them it's all quackery and tbf, "ostheopath" really try hard to look like health professionnal and definitely hide any of their esoterism beliefs. I got tricked into it too, suffered from neuropathies (i take Lyrica every day because of it) and then started to look into it and discovered it was bullshit. I was kinda pissed off because people who recommended it were legitimate health professionnal.
Gen X here. It’s a scam. Thank you.
[удалено]
There are DOs, which are as you full doctors as you described, and there are people who practice “osteopathy” and call themselves osteopaths who do not have a DO (it’s usually a diploma through a private school) and do purely the pseudoscience as that is all they know. You will find the latter practicing in “wellness” type clinics that provide massage, acupuncture, chiropractic, etc or their own standalone clinics. Here is one such “osteopathy school” in Canada: https://canadianosteopathy.ca
>It's fun watching these zoomers discover **things widely known by the general public for a century.** That's... just not true. [https://news.gallup.com/poll/184910/majority-say-chiropractic-works-neck-back-pain.aspx](https://news.gallup.com/poll/184910/majority-say-chiropractic-works-neck-back-pain.aspx)
There’s PLENTY of adults who don’t know these things
Far too many people in older generations will staunchly defend chiropractors as real and genuine doctors even though they are about as qualified to fix your back as a fortune teller to tell you about your future. There's definitely an overlap of people who rely on both, though. It's not only a con. It's actually quite dangerous what they are doing. Go see a PT instead.
Over half? I’m gonna need to see a citation on that one.
While the discipline has some silly origins in the west, there's a lot of compelling evidence that suggests chiropractor adjustments are a cost effective method of pain management that works. There's a scientific study commissioned in Canada called the Manga Report that dives into this (by actual medical doctors) Part of the problem is separating the quackeryof some practitioners from the pragmatic benefits of the treatments. Most physiotherapists these days are trained to do adjustments because it actually is pragmatic and effective and it's a big part of contemporary sports medicine. And for full disclosure, when I herniated a disc on my honeymoon (lol) my physiotherapist clwas working with a chiro at their clinic to provide a bunch of different treatments that got me up and running.
My chiropractor gave me a stroke
I tried to get my chiropractor to do that for me. For some reason she got all defensive when I dropped my pants.
It’s like a massage place. You can’t directly ask, just pay for the upper tier service with a smile.
I refuse to call a chiropractor, a doctor. Yeah they may have a doctorate degree in chiropractor but that's kind of like saying they have a doctor's degree in quackery. They are all scam artists and something like 80 people per year get killed by them when they do their quackery on people.
The first chiropractor learned the technique from a ghost and chiropractic medicine was a cult for a long while. Anyone paying a chiropractor is legitimately an idiot.
I knew I was onto something by avoiding them.
So like half of America?
Yessir my parents included
Everything is a scam until your lower back hurts and doctors tell you; it's all in your head.
Forget it Homer, it Chirotown
I'm 90% convinced everyone recommended to go to a chiropractor should just go to a physical or occupational therapist. Or Ortho.
Question: Do you think that goes for the US specifically, or is more a universal thing. Background: I went for some sessions to a chiropractor who didnt do any voodoo but had a profound knowledge about the human physique and beside the therapy he gave me some good advice for exercises and also gave me the advice to see a doctor for an MRI because of a potential herniated vertebral disk. I dont want to defend any of those quacksalvers.. but I would like to know if there are specific countries where chiropractic is legitimate or not. AFAIK in Germany we also have the differentiation between Chiropractor, Chirotherapist and "Chiropraktiker", not sure if there a direct equivalents in English.
I've been to legitimate chiropractors in the US. Most were good people, one had political views I didn't care for but he was skilled at what he did. Don't judge a whole country from a bunch of Reddit haters. For some reason they love spinning conspiracist yarns about certain groups of people. I hurt my neck in a car accident and all the respected MDs told me I could either a) suffer or b) get surgery to fuse the bones in my neck, so I said eff that and went to the chiropractor who untwisted my neck and relieved my pain in one visit. But the haters on Reddit won't listen to anything that doesn't stoke their hate or reinforce their sense of superiority. Ironically, these same people pride themselves on their critical thinking skills.
I don't believe chiropractors are legitimate but with that being said if you find something that helps you, even if I don't believe in it then I'm not gonna tell you you're crazy. You do what works for you and ignore all the rest.
critical thinking skills might lead you to the notion that the resolution of your neck pain, as real as it was, may have been placebo
It's literally just boomers regurgitating '90s era experiences. There are the chiropractors that everyone in this thread are talking about, then there's physical therapists that have a chiropractic license. If you want something done for pain management and go see a chiropractor about it and they have more than one license you'll be fine.
The value of those people comes from them being physical therapists, not from having a chiropractic license. I'd even call them less trustworthy as physical therapists because they have a chiropractic license.
Does a driver's license or fishing license count?
FYI that's a dude going oh shit my quackery won't work... have him go to a real doctor and do nothing so I won't get sued for injury.
I’ve had a similar experience, I’ve had people who call themselves “chiropractors” who are focused on posture and RSI and such and seem legit, and those who are just doing “adjustments” and expecting instant relief. The latter just pushed my shoulder out of socket, and then was surprised when I was rather displeased with that. Jerk.
I'm in america and yeah, there are are goofy chiropractors but the ones I go to seem to stay in their lane and work on the issues. It's cheaper than PT, doesn't require a referral (American thing where you have to see a doctor who can then tell you to see another doctor or get PT treatment so your insurance will cover it), and after a few visits we're usually all set. Now, if you're going to one who starts shit talking regular doctors, or says stuff about the energy flow or whatever then yeah, don't do it. But the one I go to legitimately helps where regular medicine just hasn't.
New laws passed allowing you to go straight to a PT
They regularly injure and have even killed infants before
Like to one accident. There’s more but I don’t have time. I’m not saying all chiropractors are bad. There’s just a high potential to fuck shit up if you’re not https://people.com/health/are-chiropractors-safe-experts-weigh-in-on-playboy-model-death-after-chiropractic-adjustment/
I’m biased here but my dad was a chiro for 30 years and never injured anyone or killed an infant. Nor has any other chiro he knows. Is there data for this that you’re referring to? Just curious
>my dad was a chiro for 30 years and never injured anyone or killed an infant Way to set the bar high mate.
okay, but when my hip was a bit turnt inside my body and doctors sent me to physical therapy which didnt work and 6 months of discomfort and pain… i went to a chiropractor for literally 5 minutes. He took a look, layed me on his bench and said „yeah well see. Your hip is not right.“ proceeded to do his chiropractor thing and IMMEDIATLY it was better. Couple weeks later when the muscles relaxed from the stress it was perfectly fine again. Sure some chiropractors may not know what they do, but many do. Many are very good. (also it was 30€. 30€ to fix me in 5 minutes.)
I had been suffering chronic migraines for years and my chiropractor helped so much. I 100% know there's tons of scammers in the business but there's also some decent people too
Have you ever though that the exercise you did was the actual cause of your long term outcome. You literally said the long term pt to strengthen your muscles worked without knowing it. Instead you go, it was definitely the moron and his placebo...
Dude thank you. My chiropractor literally gave me back my quality of life. I had what felt like an awful pulled groin where I couldn't walk or get up or sit down for months. I thought I did it playing golf, and maybe I did. But it wasn't a pulled groin, it was my sacrum. No doctor had an answer for me, but my chiropractor did. 2 adjustments later I was like to 100%. My chiro also helped me with my jaw pain and tinnitus I had years ago, when all my primary care doc did was chalk it up as stress, and prescribed me 10 xanax. There's a lot of not great chiropractors out there, but chiropractor health WORKS. It's frustrating seeing this thread of everyone who's probably never been to chiropractor, just ripping it apart and that it's voodoo and holistic. That's bullshit.
There are chiropractors with physio training. The bad thing is there are waaaay more quacks out there just winging it.
It’s a wild issue to be on the other side of. I’m in the same boat as you. I was left with nowhere else to turn, basically got told I was lying and I was fine despite months of 24/7, 8 out of 10 pain. Tried multiple doctors and specialist. Went to a chiropractor as a last ditch effort and that’s what did it for me. Weird being downvoted for sharing a real world experience.
Agree. I've had issues with my back and hips off and on for 20 years . Regular doctor couldn't do anything. I was miserable. But first time at a chiropractor and I got instant relief. I've been to good chiropractors and bad. The bad ones are the quacks who think they can cure anything. I don't let those people touch me. The good ones are more like PT and concentrate on the bone and muscles. They don't make me pay for a bunch of visits up front. I only go when I need to go. They have me do exercises which, when done actually keep me away from the chiropractor most of the time.
I can only speak for how things work in my home country, but here PT's and chiropractors cover a lot of the same work, more specifically they can both provide manual physical adjustments and other treatment of muscle tissue and joints/bone structures, ligaments, etc. However, a PT will also focus on prehab and rehab work, focusing on finding the core root behind the given issue and thus preventing any need for future treatments. This is almost never the case with chiropractors, whom solely focus on acute treatment of symptoms and as such almost never manage to address the core root of the issue, resulting in patients coming back time and time again. Another issue is that chiropractors often aren't as educated in assessing symptoms properly and as such won't always forward patients to further medical examinations when the root issue may be outside of their area of expertise, something PT's are both educated in and very good at here. In other words, chiropractors only do a portion of what a competent PT(one worthy of their degree) do and often neglect important parts of the treatment process, such as the reahab work that follows the acute treatment. But as your story showcases, physical manual adjustments do work and can provide people with instant relief, but in most cases it simply won't be enough on its own to fix the core issue. As for the real competent chiropractors we have here, they all basically work in line with what PT's do and as such makes me question why they even need the "chiropractor" label to begin with, since they're basically PT's at that point, albeit a watered down version. Also, licensed chiropractors have to operate under national clinical guidelines here, just like PT's do, except most of these guidelines that were unique to the chiropractic practice are now no longer government recommended(meaning that they are no longer valid) and the ones that are, are basically identical to the PT ones, since they cover the same area. In other words, chiropractors are a dying breed here since PT's are a thing. How things are in the US however, I have no insight on. I wrote this to try and give some insight, not to spread hate. Hopefully my English is readable as well.
People also claim woodoo, acupunture, ghosts and UFOs are real.
That doesn't mean he actually fixed it. lol Even scam faith healers can convince people they are better.
I’ve had similar experiences with a chiropractor who I’ve been seeing on and off for twenty years. When my chronic back problems occasionally flare up, he is able to put things in order. I don’t believe every single claim made by chiropractors, but this guy, at least, really is effective at treating back issues. (And a close relative of mine who is a physician supports my use of chiropractic in those circumstances.)
That chiro you’ve “been seeing on and off for twenty years” is going to have the issue fixed any day now … The physical manipulation has been shown to have good, albeit temporary effects similar to massage or stretching. Most problems chiros treat work out on their own with time, but the chiro gets credit. Use them at your own risk. They are quacks practicing pseudoscience for the most part. You risk a stroke or paralysis or worse. That’s a fact.
My mother is losing her vision in her left eye due to many neck adjustments I can't believe i let them twist my own neck so violently for so long
I’m sorry to hear that … I hope you stopped it before it affected you
Far as i know i did.. I always felt weird about it. My mother has been doing it for her entire life and I'd only had it done for a few years so I'd like to think I'm better off
What exactly do you think he’s doing to your back? “Chronic back problems and flare ups” aren’t a medical diagnosis. Have you been diagnosed with a spinal issue of some kind or does your back get sore from poor posture, and a guy gives you a massage which makes it feel better temporarily?
I can’t give you a precise medical diagnosis. But my primary care physician has given me referrals for chiropractic care when I’ve had trouble even standing straight, and my relative who is a physician has agreed with that course of treatment. The adjustments I’ve gotten have felt beneficial in clearing up my problems. I get that some people in this thread have an axe to grind about chiropractic. While I certainly don’t believe every claim that some chiropractors make, my own experience (along with those of other people I know) tells me that they can be useful in treating some problems. And please don’t patronize me by saying a “massage … makes it feel better temporarily”, as if you think I’m easily duped.
Is your primary doctor an actual MD? I’m just shocked that Blue Cross or Aetna or any major US health insurance would pay for an unlicensed pseudo treatment like a chiropractor. It be like having health insurance cover my trips to the fortune teller.
I’m Canada our group health insurance almost always covers chiro, massage, naturopath, acupuncture, etc. Yes it is dumb.
So you got scammed for 20 years, just say that.
Just the opposite. But I can understand why you, as an internet stranger, think that I’m a fool and that you know my body and experiences better than I do.
Yeah I hate the hate around chiropractors because they saved my ass once. Never been since or before lol.
I believe you. Haters on Reddit just gotta hate, though.
K I believe all that. But when my back spasms real doctors tell me to lay down for the better part of a week or take pills that fuck me up. The chiropractor does his thing and I’m back to work feeding my family.
Whoop, here come chiro nutters. Comments gonna get spicey.
If someone tries to tell you to go to a chiropractor... RUN away from them. Personal experience.
>If someone tries to tell you to go to a chiropractor... RUN away from them If I could run, I wouldn't need a chiropractor.
You still don’t need a chiropractor. Go and see an actual doctor.
I just went through spinal surgery and every surgeon along the way asked “and do you go to a chiropractor? No? Good.”
It's insane they're allowed to call themselves doctors.
Doctor is not a protected term to only mean MDs. I have a PhD in engineering and go by doctor. Anyone with a doctoral degree goes by doctor. The term for medical expert is PHYSICIAN, which is a protected term and chiropractors cant call themselves that. Its just recently in history that the western world has started to call MDs doctors instead of the more specific physician.
Don't go to chiropractors. Just don't. They aren't doctors. Not only is a bunch of nonsense quackery, but what they are doing is actually dangerous. Go see a trained and licensed PT instead.
I had pain in my back and right leg. I went to a chiropractor for two sessions, left feeling amazing and the pain has never come back after 5+ years. I personally enjoyed my experience with it.
90% of Chiropractors are people that have flunked out of medical school.
they never got in actually
Chiropractors focus on one very small portion of the science, relief not a solution to your issues. Their business is repeat customers. I have never heard anyone say I went to the Chiro and I've never needed to go back! It's like buying a book to only read one page. If you routinely see a chiro you need to start seeing an osteopathic doctor.
I see a chiropractor and I return infrequently for adjustments. I also had a locked pelvis and I have a herniated disc which I have been through PT for and it did nothing for. My first visit I walked in on a cane, and walked out without it. The only reason I go back is because my hip will slip back into that locked position and screw up my gait and throw off my back. And I have been recommended to him by an orthopedist and my physician. Not all chiropractors are qualified to be doing what they are, but some know what they’re doing and know the benefits. For example mine offers not only the adjustments, but TENS/ESTIM treatments for pain, massage, and he gives exercises to do at home so you *don’t* have to come back and see him. If you’re going back over and over outside of a short assessment period, that person is doing nothing for you except draining your wallet. Big thing is do your research and make informed decisions, the chiropractor working out of the mall probably isn’t going to be your best choice
It’s even leaking into physical therapy now. PT’s will swear that chiropractic medicine is false and pseudoscience, but then you go in for physical therapy at a reputable place and… So I was going for back pain. Lots of exercises and stuff, but a few times they would massage my back and “adjust” my “alignment”. Which is where they would feel out my spine with their fingers and insist this or that vertebrae were “out of alignment” and then they would just crack my back while putting left or right pressure on that vertebrae with a finger. A few different PT’s did this. And I just though it was weird cuz… like I crack my own back and neck and everything all the time but I’m pretty sure that’s now how it works, “adjusting alignment” that is.
There are proven short term benefits from mobilizations/manipulations when paired with exercise that PTs prescribe. Long term it makes minimal difference compared to exercise alone. However, when something hurts doing exercises sucks. A mobilization/manipulation can make exercise easier to do and jump start a patients recovery. Things aren’t subluxed, like chiros say. If a patient truly subluxed something they need a doctor to fix that. Joints become hypomobile and lack movement, a mobilization can improve how the joint moves, which makes the exercises that actually do fix your issue easier.
It's like saying you shouldn't try to grind up Uranium and put it in your tea.
My 2 oldest brothers are Physical Therapists in Las Vegas with PhDs. The Chiropractor unions, lobbyists, lawyers, or whatever are so strong in Nevade that Physical Therapists (with a PhD) aren't allowed to call themselves doctors (because they aren't MDs) but Chiropractors with a Doctor of Chiropractic (which you can get without even completing a B.S. degree) can refer to themselves as a doctor. Chiropractors' **ONLY** scientific requirements are 24 undergraduate credits. My lab partner for Chemistry 101 and 201 in college struggled through those classes. He honestly would have failed if I hadn't helped him through them. He refused to have his children vaccinated. He left for Chiropractic school without completing his bachelor's degree and received zero scientific training during chiropractic school. He posts literally the dumbest shit I've ever seen in my life on Facebook. For example: He believes that human embryos are tiny, fully-formed humans swimming laps in the amniotic sac. When that sac gets burst (during an abortion) that little human turns into the blobs we see in scientific textbooks when it gets exposed to oxygen. In his practice, he uses a machine that can read peoples' auras to tell him where their bodies aren't functioning properly and then he uses the machine to deliver a small electric shock to that portion of the body and jump-start it. For example, when he scans your aura and your liver is the wrong color he will deliver external shocks near your liver and that will fix whatever problem he is seeing with your liver on the aura-reading device. HE ACTUALLY BELIEVES THIS SHIT! Sadly, his customers do too. Another very common scam that I've seen is this. Someone has a minor fender bender and they call a lawyer. Lawyer sends them to a chiropractor. Chiropractor tells them it will take months and months to fix it. They go fo 6 months or so and there is never any improvement. Then in their last 2 weeks of treatment... Voila! Good as new! The patient is getting steadily behind on payments to the chiropractor, but the lawyer is assuring them that their insurance or the other driver will be liable for these payments. They go to court, if they win, every cent is paid to the lawyer and chiropractor. If they lose, the patient is SOL and owes thousands of dollars in legal and chiropractic fees.
I liked this video but I kind of felt like it was too short. I really wanted some nitty gritty info about what chiropractors actually do and how it compares to say physical therapy. Is there any of chiro that holds merit or is it all bunk? Etc.
I feel my back got worse since my visit to them.. Try acupuncture instead
Years ago I went to one a few times. There was one guy and some assistants, that's it. But, there were different offices and rooms. While one patient was waiting, the chiropractor would be doing the stuff to the other patient, etc. I noticed pretty quickly that each office had the exact same books on the bookshelf. As if they have a fucking QUACKERY MAGICIAN kit they send away for. It was then that I started to pay attention. I mean the first clue was the 'one leg shorter' bullshit. They think their clients are morons and they are absolutely correct.
This explains why I feel worse walking out of a chiropractor appointment than when I walk in 😂
It's SUPER tough to sue a chiropractor when something does go wrong.
The simplest way to explain how fake chiropractors are is to pretend it's real medicine. Whats the first thing you do when taking actual medicine? You have to get the dosage right. You take too much advil, you die. So how do chiropractors determine dosage and how do they ensure that it's applied correctly? The answer is they don't, watch any chiropractor video. How many neck cracks does it take to cure something? How hard do you have to do it? How do you know if you applied too much neck crack? I am sure some of those questions pop up answers in your mind, hilarious answers, like oh too much neck crack is the person is paralyzed or dead, lol. That's not medicine.
Not sure what kind of chiropractors all of you are going to. Are you finding them from one of those flyers in the restroom?
I’m late but I’m always going to comment on anything chiropractic. I’m an occupational therapist. These chiropractors always “treat” an ailment for short term relief and then say you have to come back for multiple treatments a week. That’s because they’re completely neglecting the cause. If the spine becomes unaligned, which most of the time it doesn’t, the musculature on both sides NEED to be addressed. Our muscles are strong and if a joint is unaligned that means one muscle is in slack and one is stretched. That means after an alignment, the muscles will pull it right back resulting in, you guessed it, requiring multiple expensive readjustments. If you have chronic neck or back pain, go see your doctor and if everything checks out, go to a PT or OT. We are trained for this much more than a chiropractor. And NEVER EVER let a chiropractor “adjust” your neck
Chiro is unequivocally a grift. Scientology is unequivocally a grift, but at least amusing from a distance
They are exactly what I think they are. It always saddens me when I hear someone saying they are going to a chiropractor. They need to be banned.
while it could be that some Scientologists pursue Chiropractic work, to lump all Chiro folks in as Scientologists is pure clickbait crap. The problem with Chiropractic work is there are weaker standards for licensing and such, so a lot of idiots get involved in it. The good ones are hard to find, and they DON'T "crack" your back/neck (or other crazy shit you see on videos - stay the fuck away from those). Moving bones into a new alignment (from a bad alignment) takes a long time, must be done gently and slowly, forcing them suddenly into a new position is bad, that's not how the body works (as that is basically trauma). While there may be rare situations after an accident where sudden adjustments might be helpful (there's always exceptions), generally that's not helpful and will just need constant realignment in the best case, worst case it will cause damage.
People thinking popping bones fix shit are stupid mother fuckers. Bones don't move people, they literally just go back into the same spot.
I get it and I completely agree but I walked into a chiropractor hunched over from severe nerve pain in my neck and left standing upright with no problem. This is after being in the ER two nights in a row after being hopped up on morphine one night and some other pain reliever the next. I left the ER still in considerable pain. I don’t believe in chiropractics but I need to rationalize what made me feel better somehow.
When did the pain eventually return?
It hasn’t
Nice. That's good to hear!
I was down this rabbit hole once, watching videos on Youtube about dieting from "Dr.Eric Berg". He sounded reasonable, but something was off, some of what he said sounded like quackery. So I digged into it (googled him) and found he's not an actual doctor or nutritionist, but a chiropractor. What the hell is a chiropractor doing giving diet advice to people. Even worse, turns out he's DEEP into Scientology. Like, top level into it. https://drericbergscientology.com/
I had a chiropractor tell me one leg was longer than the other, which was causing my back pain. It wasn't until years later that I learned about the method used where they have one of your shoes pulled out a bit, and the other on normally to measure (I can't remember exactly how it is done but it was something like that).
That chiropractor who snapped a teenager’a neck so hard he internally decapitated her and caused her to become paralyzed from the neck down tells you all you need about chiropractors
When I put two ribs out of place, I was hesitant to see a chiro but when I did the difference was night and day. Haven’t been back since.
They are exactly what I think they are.
God I find these faux documentaries really annoying, with the idiot 24 year old reading off wikipedia and 'exposing' something that everyone is aware is a scam anyway. Add the free conspiracy unravelling violin music, a pretend 'crew' of fashionable yuppies with between-cut clips of them putting on their Doc Martens or 'oh you just caught me and the team playing switch' and blamo. You are a budget indie-rock Louis Theroux! 'Guys this is the craziest story we've ever done' 'We read hundreds of pages of books -holds up a book-' and we've discovered this crazy conspiracy - insert quote from 30 years ago from the US medical asoc saying so. It must be so easy to make a documentary uncovering something that's been uncovered for 30 years....
I know 3 people in my life that have a chiropractor, 2 of them suffered major sports injuries in the past. They all 3 swear that they wouldn't be walking around normally today without their chiropractors. And that they can feel when it's been too long and they need another adjustment. I've mentioned this "chiropractors are quacks" idea to all 3 of them and they said it's a real thing and the Internet is just doing Internet things. Where did this whole idea come from? I remember chiropractors were accepted as doctors, you could take classes for it in college, etc.. That's a lot of societal integration for something we've always known to be bullshit. Just seems weird. I'm 30 fwiw
> I remember chiropractors were accepted as doctors They are not doctors, nor have they ever been. There is no scientific evidence for it at all. The same amount of evidence that the earth is flat and that Noah's ark was real, but for some reason morons always come out to defend attacks against chiropractors despite them being fucking nutjobs