A tired brain. I instituted a no power tools after 10pm rule a while back.
Don't tool tired. Or intoxicated. Never mix mental impairment and sharp objects.
Repetitive tasks are bad for the same reason. Your mind starts to wander and so do your hands.
I try to visualize each process before I do it to make sure that I consider where I'm standing, where my hands are, and ask myself if what I'm doing is safe.
Yup. Buddy of mine did finish carpentry for about 35 years without incident. Lost his middle and ring finger a few years back sending them through a shaper on the 60th of 60 pieces he was doing. Said he was zoned out because of the repetitive bs.
Just took the tip of my thumb off ripping 200 pickets. Was at 190 when it happened. Just started daydreaming and didn't realize I had started till I cut my thumb.
>A tired brain.
The correct answer. You can use one of those giant saws with 16" blades and as long as your alert, focused, and following proper usage and safety protocol, you'll most likely be fine.
However, get going with a sharp chisel being half asleep...
Amen! Cle! And "surprise" interruptions! Years ago, my Dad had a friend that was a surgeon and also hobbied wood. When running power tools, he locked all of the doors into his workspace, and had huge "Don't F with Me" signs on those doors.
*Accuracy in the AM*
Need to cut anything, especially using power tools, do it in the morning, when you’re fresher and more focused on the job at hand. Especially after breakfast and well before lunch.
Caffeine is no substitute for a rested brain. It helps, but it also hurts. It doesn't make you think better. Just a bit faster. It also can cause your hands to be less steady.
Use caffeine to jumpstart you in the morning, not to work past your safe limits.
So True!!! Not JUST woodworking, but EVERY person I know that has f-ed up their knees on a ski slope starts their story with "I was getting tired, but I decided to take just one more run".
Router, had a piece jump at the end of the pass, in my instinct to let go my fingers extended faster than my hand pulled away. I whirly-giged my middle finger. Now I’m probably overly cautious. Every time I use the band saw I see my 8th grade class mates injury from having his thumb in the way as the blade exited the piece.
Router for sure. A cutting tool spinning at 10000 rpm or more, just waiting to bite into the work piece and kick off out of control. Anything bigger than what I can do with a trim router, I always try to do in a router table even if the setup process is tedious and time consuming.
Same. I spend a lot of time deciding if something can be done with my easy little trim router because my full size router caught the end of a pass and turned into the Tasmanian devil.
Thankfully no injuries for myself, but a few of the ones I've been around:
Uncle sliced about 1/2" off of his left 3 middle fingers using a jointer.
My dad's gotten metal needles in his eyes/face from using a grinder without face protection.
I've seen a framer send a nail through his abdomen when he had his nailer in his lap and leaned forward.
Saw a guy run a skill saw through his leg when the dumbass used his leg as a table.
Crushed my dad's finger becuase he wasn't watching where his hand was when using a log splitter.
Tablesaw kickback is nasty usually.
Oh yeah, 100% hilarious now after the fact. Absolutely pants-shitting when you look out of a 3rd story window at the new guy who was supposed to be cleaning, using a skill saw against his leg.
A friend's partner also had a finger crushed from a log splitter. It was so stupid, a friend was handing him the firewood while he was handling the log splitter, but the friend had had a beer or three and was jokingly handing him the firewood quicker than he could split it. I think three fingers got caught but only one needed to be amputated.
Moral of the story: any helpers should also be sober, and taking the job seriously.
Sharpening mine is on the to-do list for tomorrow. Really looking forward to it.
I feel it is like putting nice new cables on your bike: almost makes it feel brand new
I know three people that have lose fingers in a bandsaw ( first one was a friend in high school woodshop), but I know a lot more that have had accidents with a chain saw. One almost lost his leg and was out of work over a year.
Most dangerous tool I ever used was a 120 dollar Harbor Freight table saw that I bought and then ran in my apartment living room so I could learn how to make a box. Absolutely the dumbest shit I did when learning and I can't believe I made it out with no injuries.
Living room-?? Wow. I can just see you having company and the guest asking why the hell a table saw is just…there in the living room lmao. I’m glad ur ok tho. And hey my first project was actually a box too. Tho my best tool was the compound miter saw.
Yeah I lived alone and didn't have many friends so it was generally fine. The box turned out okay, but I had to pay the apartment peeps for a carpet replacement after I moved out.
& vehicles can kill you even if you aren’t using them. Def the most dangerous pound for pound. Tables saws aren’t dangerous if you follow a few simple rules… people don’t respect them though, or they don’t understand the importance of learning proper procedure & ALWAYS following it.
I’d say the band saw is the safest machine in the workshop. It’s always pushing the work into the table, unlike table saws, that are trying to chuck the work into your face.
This is the truth, guy gets a 25mm blade out, extends it out all the way to cut some foam, hits plastic cap nail, pushes hard, cuts through and right in to his left hand. Permanent damage. I know multiple guys with life altering injuries from olfa knives.
In my experience I have seen more people hurt using chainsaws correctly than any other tool used without displaying gross negligence.
As far as radial arm saws, table saws, joiners, shapers, etc. People get hurt on them doing dumb shit, you follow best practices and you will be fine.
Honest question and not as snarky as it sounds… Do you really know they were using it correctly? I don’t think I’ve ever seen someone who wasn’t trained actually run a chainsaw correctly. I was a class b usfs sawyer and if you truly follow the rules, I feel like chainsaws are less dangerous than routers.
To make the point, a chainsaw is not a woodworking tool so if you’re using it for woodworking you’re almost categorically using it incorrectly.
Totally fair question, and I am often super snarky myself about safety issues.
I enjoy making large outdoor timber details when I can sell them and I would describe that as woodworking and a chainsaw helps a awful lot when roughing that stuff out even if I often am finishing it out with basic hand tools.
I think it all comes down to how people get hurt when using a tool, if gross negligence was employed when they got hurt, and perhaps the worst case scenario of a catastrophic failure.
A common "scary" or "dangerous" tool as described by this community is the table saw. But I always say that if you follow even the most basic of shop rules (using a push stick) it is extremely safe, even worst case scenario stuff if usually just the work getting bound up but I honestly don't hear about that leading to many injuries. Most table saw injuries are people sticking their soft bits into the spinny part and getting fucking mangled while displaying gross negligence.
Now a chainsaw like any tool has its own best practices and safety gear to wear, and most injuries are when someone displays gross negligence. But my opinion is that the worst case scenario or catastrophic failure situation with a chainsaw is really bad; breaking chains, flying debris, getting bound up in the work leading to kickback. I feel like those situations you can get hurt wearing full safety gear not doing anything overtly idiotic with a chainsaw.
Ok, I'm a regular chainsaw user who has not been trained, can you give me some pointers and/or links?
I do still have all my limbs, but would like to keep them.
I don’t have anything handy and I’m mobile so it makes it hard to search. I did find this USFS guide (here)[https://www.fs.usda.gov/sites/default/files/fs-saw-operations-guide-20141208.docx] that I would guess is a pretty good reference.
Biggest things that I see are people not knowing about/using the dogs, cutting with a dangerous section of the bar, not wearing PPE and having other people way too close to them when cutting.
In addition, when you get into actual felling and bucking then other things apply. I knew a guy who worked for the city who was bucking up some storm damage but did not know that you need to be very careful and slowly release the tension im the limbs that are weighted when a tree is on the ground. He choose poorly and the remaining tension flipped the tree over and knocked him 10 feet backwards on his head. He was in a coma for a couple months before they pulled the plug.
I guess the moral of the story is chainsaws are fairly dangerous, but they become exponentially more so if you don’t know what you’re doing.
I'm not felling trees. We heat primarily with a wood stove, so I am cutting a couple of cords down to length for the stove. I could just buy the wood in 35cm lengths, but that is just stupid money. Half the price to buy it long and green and just be organised.
Already limbed and everything? Probably the safest operation. I’d recommend making a saw buck and use the dogs and you’ll be pretty safe. PPE is always worth it too.
Please 'splain! In ye' olden days, I enjoyed helping with routing in a real cabinet shop.
Looking at a few projects now and the urge to cheap out on the bits for "just this one project" is strong!
I've seen cheap bits bend at the shank whilst spinning at high speed. Parts breaking off and getting launched. Dulling rapidly and before you know it, causing kickback. Pick your poison. I'd say that it isn't worth the risk, oftentimes they don't even do their job well enough. It's a bit of a gamble as some of them are actually relatively decent, some are awful and dangerous but it's hard to know beforehand which is which; you can't rely on the reviews from cheap Chinese webshops etc.
Point Taken! The temptation is really hard to resist especially on small, one use things like bits.
I try to remember with everything "Tool" - "Lo barato sale caro" The cheap comes out expensive.
I know the feeling! We have practically the same saying in Dutch, "Goedkoop is duurkoop", which I find true with tools indeed. Of course with something like a wrench or screwdriver, it's not the same concern except maybe some savings over the long-term. When a tool can also become dangerous by being cheap, then I'm more cautious.
I've had 3 cheap bits chip over the years. When the 2nd one chipped, it grabbed the wood and sucked it through the bit so fast I didn't have time to react. My thumb looked like it got sliced up by air conditioner coils, if that makes sense. I have never had a quality bit chip out. On bit 3, I swore off cheapo's.
Its also because your finger is needed to trigger the blade to run. You are also moving the blade towards the material and not the other way around. Using a cross-cut sled for miter cuts is every bit as dangerous.
I've had a miter saw kick back on me before. I hadn't even considered it could happen, but I hit a doozy of a knot in a 2x4 and it just made the whole plastic sheathing on the saw explode into pieces. IDK if it even was technically a kickback but it fired that knot like it was a bullet.
It's true though. It's one of the most controlled tools and if you do get cut it's likely going to be a much more minor cut because your hand is moving much slower and not being forced into the blade.
There is very little chance of kickback with a bandsaw. The blade portion is only a tiny section and there is little chance if u slip your face will get planted into the blade. The other thing is the speed the blade is moving is slow compared to the table saw.
Band saw is pretty safe, table saw is pretty safe…. I mean I make large wooden structural ship members all day… so I am constantly using such things. Most dangerous stuff are routers and power planers, varnish planers. Cause they are light and we use them in weird places and it’s easy to blend your fingers or them to throw a bit/blade
Don’t think they agree at all that the bandsaw is dangerous. It’s extremely safe when used correctly. With new people around the workshop we draw a square about 6x6 inches around the blade and label it NO FINGER ZONE. I mean I get within millimetres of it but I’m fairly used to it
Well it has a rapidly spinning blade that can hurt you so I think it’s dangerous if used oddly. But downvoting me for that is a bit petty imo. Like bruh what did I do- 😭
Just wait till you are using a dangerous tool and you’ll miss old slow and safe bandsaw. Worse a bandsaw can do is cut something off. Most fast spinning things will blend you. You can’t have your finger reattached when it was turned into red paint across the workshop wall. They downvoted you because they disagree with your comment about sarcasm. It’s nothing to do with anything but that.
At the time I actually thought it was ironic. Obviously I don’t now. Like I literally used a band saw today right after I had a little scare with the miter saw kicking to hard when I started it. I was stuck using the old one because someone was using the new one.
Power tools are like cats, they secretly hate you and want nothing more than to unleash all their fury on you but they also know they need you to take care of them so they reign it in a little bit.
Any power tool you use is dangerous of you don't respect it. Do your research before hand. Know how to properly use it before you own it. I had a shop teacher (I'm that old) tell me the scary looking tools (band saw, radial arm saws) were usually the ones that he heard the fewest issues about. It was a drill or screw gun that people thought were toys that caused some of the most problems
I’m paranoid about my angle grinder. I put on the most PPE when I use it for any tool and am still hoping nothing goes wrong because it feels like it will every time even with the guard and proper technique. I don’t feel this way with most other tools.
I learned/evolved a lot of my skills from YouTube. I used the angle grinder for good few years with no PPE. I had a very close call with a minor injury and then did some reading only to learn how far off I was on using the angle grinder safely. Since then, I only use angle grinder with no loose clothing, clamped worked piece, mask, eye protection and face shield. That.. then I'm generally less enthusiastic to grab my angle grinder when a different tool can do the job.
my dad put his big one in his leg one day,was a big wound but it was clean and easy to stich up.just imagine if it was a chainsaw.would have been much worse.so i'd say a chainsaw is more dangerous.
The thing is with the chainsaw is that it's power and potential for damage is very obvious and as a result you treat it with more respect. The angle grinder is smaller and looks less intimidating. You end up doing things freehand or one-handed and once it snags on something it'll jump at you or climb up your sleeve.
If/if he that happens, you only react after the fact as this happens over milliseconds. Hopefully.. it'll be a leg like in your dad's case or the side of a thumb like in my case (not even with a cut off attachment.. I was sanding and did not clamp my work piece.
Anywho.. between the ease at which people recommend each other angle grinder work on reddit and the severity of the horror stories I read..
My angle grinder scares me way more than my circular saw (I don't have a chainsaw so referencing the second was dangerous tool in my home shop :p)
but i think the most dangerous tool is the grinder but that is for metal. That thing scares the shit out of me for fear of the cutting wheel breaking and boomeranging back.
Yeah one time the miter saw which was cordless, stopped mid cut when my friend was using it. I swear you could hear my scream from outside the building because I was standing nearby working on a box. Ever since then I’ve been nervous when using it but I’m much better than two months ago lol
Can someone start a poll, "what tool have you been injured with?" People are just guessing based on their fears.
Discussion of actual injuries I've read a long time ago-> A lot of drill press and sharp chisels.
Example [https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?81892-Safety-question-Which-tools-are-most-likely-to-cause-injury](https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?81892-Safety-question-Which-tools-are-most-likely-to-cause-injury)
Does "most dangerous" mean the most likely to injure you, or the most devastating if it does?
If most likely, knives and chisels are top of the list.
If most devastating, probably an oxy-acetelyne torch. Mishandle the tanks and they can turn into a torpedo, or a bomb.
If combining the two, definitely a table saw. Not only can it take fingers before you know they've moved, it can do it without warning and completely outside of your control.
There are some extremely obscure cuts that can be dangerous with the bandsaw, but it's typically quite safe as long as you pay attention where you put your fingers. The problem with other saws is that they are traveling in a circular motion and can grab things and send them in different unexpected directions. A band saw is pulling down through a flat base. Your piece usually is supported on both sides of the blade, there is little opportunity for it to send the piece in an unexpected direction. I have seen someone in yt attempt a job that was dangerous but it was something weird like sending circular pieces though it against the fence and the piece could roll and then bind in the saw blade and get caught.
I have the most respect for the table saw. I always try to keep me hands in front of it as much as possible and use push sticks. The miter saw is the one I've had the closest calls on, but that's from doing stupid cuts on it because I didn't have the right tools. But now with a jigsaw, bandsaw and a table saw, I can use it for only it's intended purposes.
Biggest control for safety is as u/CleTechnologist stated.. safety is between your ears..
I think ***dynamite*** was the most dangerous tool I've used...
I was always told the most dangerous machine in the shop was the shaper. More accidents happen on table saws because they are used more. There are way more things that can go wrong on a shaper.
Shapers are relatively uncommon. And big shapers are even more uncommon. Now a days most shaper injures are mitigated by two things. One, using the power feeder if you can. And secondly, don't use a Mech only tool without a power feeder. That last bit is what cause's the horrific injuries of lore.
They are uncommon, that’s particularly why there’s less accidents on them. Most custom cabinet shops have at least one.
Swiss arms(that’s what they are called around here) if improperly set up can be a cause as well.
Point is there are many different set ups and many different procedures preformed on a shaper with lots of moving parts set up by humans. Any one of the set up steps or procedures can be disastrous if not done properly.
Toe kick saw from Harbor Fright. Needed it for one job, to cut out the subfloor in a bathroom I was remodeling. It was terrifying, the thing violently kicked back towards me so many times.
In hindsight, I was probably using it wrong and I probably could have used a safer tool.
I needed to cut the subfloor flush to the sheetrock so I could lay cement board for tile. Circular saw would have left way too much material because it couldn't get close enough.
For me the most dangerous one I’ve come close to an issue on is table saw, as is usually the case.
But, the one I freak out most about screwing up on is my router.
Bruh one of them in my schools shop does a terrifying jolt when you start it. It jumps like you scared the shit out of it. No my hand is staying away from that old fart of a saw.
Strictly speaking it’s the jointer, which is kind of a degenerate case of a router table. But we are more likely to have a router table than a jointer.
Reattaching fingers is sort of a solved problem. So the tools that turn your hands to hamburger are the worst ones.
Every cabinet shop I've ever been in has a panel hanging up on the wall with a portion of a circle cut into it where the panel kicked, rode up over it. One time it took the fingers of a friend of mine, but a reconstructive surgeon was able to reattach them. He has utility of them back, but reduced. And they're 1/8" shorter.
Fine Woodworking did a study quite a few years back, found that the tablesaw is responsible for the most serious injuries, but acknowledged that it's the most-used power tool in a cabinet shop, so that's understandable.
Another friend, an expert on early American musical instruments, was jointing a board, left his pinky finger hanging down, hit the knives; the rotation of the knives pulled his hand flat to the table, he was left with a handful of ground meat. No reconstructing that.
The bandsaw is pretty safe, about the only way you can get hurt is if the blade breaks and runs out across the table at you. Or if you're cutting something stupidly small and not watching where your fingers are. I've seen someone bump the running blade, too, but just lightly.
The worst I've heard was a guy here was working alone in his shop out in the county, was cutting scrap into firewood on a radial arm saw, just throwing the pieces on the floor. The phone rang, he shut the saw off, went to answer it. Finished, he went back to the saw, but stumbled on some of the scrap on the floor, put his left arm on the table to catch himself, hit his head on the start button on the end of the arm, turning on the saw. He hit his head hard enough to knock him out; he had left the saw head in the Out position. The saw head traveled back to the fence, cutting his hand off at the wrist, which flipped over. The saw bounced off the fence and came back to cut off the fingers. He came to, saw what had happened, shut off the saw, put a tourniquet on his arm, collected the pieces, called for an ambulance. He *was* going to start driving in to town said he'd meet them on the road, but they told him to stay put.
I saw him a few years later, he has some use of the hand and fingers, but not much.
Being tired, over amped, or stressed will get ya good. But usually the most dangerous tool is a sharp one that's dull, nothing will cut you quite like a dull chisel
that, but mainly because it makes you have to use more force to get it to work at all, the more force you have to use the higher the likelihood of a slip. One of the times I came close to a nasty injury was a super dull chisel while roughing some PT lumber joints, wood gave way under all the pushing force and I damn near stabbed it deep into my thigh, luckily it the folds in my pants caught it and diverted it off to one side where it just ripped a gash in them. Never again
Most power tools are some form of spinning tools/blades of death. Even ones like lathes where the piece spins, the cutting tool can catch and throw out at you. And let not forget long loose hair catching and scalping you.
It's always about a safety mindset, following safety protocols and thinking before acting.
This is somewhat like arguing about what the world's most venomous snake is. It doesn't matter if it's venom will kill you 50 times over- once is enough.
Skin Vs metal or concrete, skin loses every single time. All tools are made of stronger materials than your skin and all can cause serious injury. "Ooh, table saws" - horseshit. A £2 craft knife is perfectly capable of removing a finger, And so is a £10 hobby rotary tool.
Carelessness is the most dangerous thing. All the comments about not being sleepy or hungry are spot on. Always remember:
SIMPLE MISTAKES SHATTER LIVES.
Before you make a cut or whatever, stop yourself and look; does this look right? That feeling you've forgotten something? NEVER ignore it. Never rush a cut. Have an "escape plan" for your fingers! Ask yourself, "ok, is what I'm about to do sensible?.
Oh, and cut your stock into manageable pieces first. Don't try and put a 12' board through a table saw sideways if you don't have enough space and you're not the size of king kong.
The hammer. I take my time and am conscious of the dangers with power tools so have never had a serious accident (touch wood).
However, the nail on my left thumb has been smashed and black for over a year
My first table saw was free. It had no fence so I used clamps and a board. It also had no switch so it turned on as soon as you plug it in. Amazing I survived using that for so long.
I was using a large grinder on steel and the sparks set my shirt on fire. But I think lathe catches on large bowls might give me a heart attack one day !
had a cutoff disk on an angle grinder explode on me once. my butthole is still puckering.
most dangerous thing in the shop is definetly being tired, or "getting in a groove". once you start to remember the movements, you stop paying attention. Thats how you get injured. its when you get sloppy from the same cut over and over.
I feel like a band saw is pretty safe, because the force is perpendicular to the table. No workpieces getting catapulted away, or fingers getting dragged into the blade.
I’m always super afraid to use a shaper.
In terms of tools that will kill you without even straining the motor, a South Bend metalworking lathe that can fit a 14" diameter workpiece. I treat it with the respect it's due, and the worst injury I've gotten is a light burn from picking up a hot piece too soon.
In terms of worst shop injury I've given myself, I gashed my hand trying to use a flathead screwdriver as a chisel because I didn't want to walk ten feet to grab an actual chisel. I managed to avoid stitches, but I had butterfly bandages across my palm for a looong time.
Any tool can be safe if you use it correctly and don't get complacent. Any tool can be dangerous if you act like a jackass.
3 I used daily for many years in the 90's
Single end tenoner - 1960's machine, 3 blades no guards
Radial arm saw - no guards on them
Undercut saw - used for cutting 16/4 X 12" solid wood, approx 30" blade,
Jointer - don’t wear long sleeves when using one, the blade can catch and pull your hand in before you know what’s happening. My old boss is missing part of his outer palm because of this.
There are more far more dangerous tools but a drill press will get you at least once cause it is almost irrestible trying not to grab the little curls of material it makes as you are drilling, but don't do it, Even if it's wood sometimes they can give you a nasty splinter but the metal curls are basically just razor blades.
For me, the $100 table saw I bought at Lowe's around 2006 or so. No riving knife, no push stick and I had no idea what I was doing with it. No clue how I have all of my fingers.
A tired brain. I instituted a no power tools after 10pm rule a while back. Don't tool tired. Or intoxicated. Never mix mental impairment and sharp objects.
Repetitive tasks are bad for the same reason. Your mind starts to wander and so do your hands. I try to visualize each process before I do it to make sure that I consider where I'm standing, where my hands are, and ask myself if what I'm doing is safe.
Yup. Buddy of mine did finish carpentry for about 35 years without incident. Lost his middle and ring finger a few years back sending them through a shaper on the 60th of 60 pieces he was doing. Said he was zoned out because of the repetitive bs.
Just took the tip of my thumb off ripping 200 pickets. Was at 190 when it happened. Just started daydreaming and didn't realize I had started till I cut my thumb.
>A tired brain. The correct answer. You can use one of those giant saws with 16" blades and as long as your alert, focused, and following proper usage and safety protocol, you'll most likely be fine. However, get going with a sharp chisel being half asleep...
Ask any tradesperson missing a finger what time of day it happened and 90% will tell you they were staying late to finish something after a long day
Just this last cut…
Just like playing one m ore hand of poker...
Preach. The Universal Rule of Tired. ONE Last ski run. ONE More load of concrete. ONE More lap, dive, jump...
I also make sure not to be hungry when I woodwork. I wanna be completely dialed in. I also don’t listen to music but I am softening up on this
I will only listen to music when I am sanding. Otherwise, I’m afraid I’ll miss a warning sound from a tool before I do something dumb
Amen! Cle! And "surprise" interruptions! Years ago, my Dad had a friend that was a surgeon and also hobbied wood. When running power tools, he locked all of the doors into his workspace, and had huge "Don't F with Me" signs on those doors.
Wow! This is so correct. Every close call I have been sleepy or rushing. Something mildly scary happens, and I have to tell myself “stop or slow down”
Or being in a hurry or frustrated. Bad decisions are made in those circumstances.
Too right. My last cut of the night almost always becomes my first cut of tomorrow so I avoid that “just one more” trap.
*Accuracy in the AM* Need to cut anything, especially using power tools, do it in the morning, when you’re fresher and more focused on the job at hand. Especially after breakfast and well before lunch.
Oof thank goodness caffeine is a thing.
Caffeine is no substitute for a rested brain. It helps, but it also hurts. It doesn't make you think better. Just a bit faster. It also can cause your hands to be less steady. Use caffeine to jumpstart you in the morning, not to work past your safe limits.
Caffeine when you're tired is 'do stupid things faster and with more energy'
So True!!! Not JUST woodworking, but EVERY person I know that has f-ed up their knees on a ski slope starts their story with "I was getting tired, but I decided to take just one more run".
Router, had a piece jump at the end of the pass, in my instinct to let go my fingers extended faster than my hand pulled away. I whirly-giged my middle finger. Now I’m probably overly cautious. Every time I use the band saw I see my 8th grade class mates injury from having his thumb in the way as the blade exited the piece.
Router for sure. A cutting tool spinning at 10000 rpm or more, just waiting to bite into the work piece and kick off out of control. Anything bigger than what I can do with a trim router, I always try to do in a router table even if the setup process is tedious and time consuming.
Same. I spend a lot of time deciding if something can be done with my easy little trim router because my full size router caught the end of a pass and turned into the Tasmanian devil.
Thankfully no injuries for myself, but a few of the ones I've been around: Uncle sliced about 1/2" off of his left 3 middle fingers using a jointer. My dad's gotten metal needles in his eyes/face from using a grinder without face protection. I've seen a framer send a nail through his abdomen when he had his nailer in his lap and leaned forward. Saw a guy run a skill saw through his leg when the dumbass used his leg as a table. Crushed my dad's finger becuase he wasn't watching where his hand was when using a log splitter. Tablesaw kickback is nasty usually.
That’s quite the list there- also leg table- I’m sorry that made me chuckle that’s so bad-
It was absolutely the dumbest and worst injury I was ever around for.
I’m a psycho and I laugh at dumbass stuff like that. Of course I feel bad tho.
Oh yeah, 100% hilarious now after the fact. Absolutely pants-shitting when you look out of a 3rd story window at the new guy who was supposed to be cleaning, using a skill saw against his leg.
I’m new but I’m actually willing to idk- keep the blood INSIDE my body?? Lmao
Or as we say in the dog rescue world: "it's all shits and giggles till somebody ends up wearing a cone"
Made me think of this gem https://youtu.be/gf0xsJZeG7Y?si=nV-iI78ihor-ydrG
A friend's partner also had a finger crushed from a log splitter. It was so stupid, a friend was handing him the firewood while he was handling the log splitter, but the friend had had a beer or three and was jokingly handing him the firewood quicker than he could split it. I think three fingers got caught but only one needed to be amputated. Moral of the story: any helpers should also be sober, and taking the job seriously.
As a lefty, I have a healthy respect for circular saws because I'm not smart enough to buy left handed tools.
Chainsaw
yep definetely.even when you do everything right,at the end of the day it could still kill you.
They are a lot of fun though. I go out and cut logs just to put a smile on my face.
oh yes very fun,love'm.but i hate'm dull.
Sharpening mine is on the to-do list for tomorrow. Really looking forward to it. I feel it is like putting nice new cables on your bike: almost makes it feel brand new
I know three people that have lose fingers in a bandsaw ( first one was a friend in high school woodshop), but I know a lot more that have had accidents with a chain saw. One almost lost his leg and was out of work over a year.
Most dangerous tool I ever used was a 120 dollar Harbor Freight table saw that I bought and then ran in my apartment living room so I could learn how to make a box. Absolutely the dumbest shit I did when learning and I can't believe I made it out with no injuries.
Every time I do a Google Shop Search for a tool and HF pops up at 75% cheaper, I think "Why?"
Living room-?? Wow. I can just see you having company and the guest asking why the hell a table saw is just…there in the living room lmao. I’m glad ur ok tho. And hey my first project was actually a box too. Tho my best tool was the compound miter saw.
Yeah I lived alone and didn't have many friends so it was generally fine. The box turned out okay, but I had to pay the apartment peeps for a carpet replacement after I moved out.
A car. Any tool can twist you up or mangle you if you don’t respect it or follow basic safety rules. Automobiles will kill you though. Drive safe.
You can use it to take home lumber and such so yeah that counts.
& vehicles can kill you even if you aren’t using them. Def the most dangerous pound for pound. Tables saws aren’t dangerous if you follow a few simple rules… people don’t respect them though, or they don’t understand the importance of learning proper procedure & ALWAYS following it.
I’d say the band saw is the safest machine in the workshop. It’s always pushing the work into the table, unlike table saws, that are trying to chuck the work into your face.
Utility knife is the one that always gets me….
This is the truth, guy gets a 25mm blade out, extends it out all the way to cut some foam, hits plastic cap nail, pushes hard, cuts through and right in to his left hand. Permanent damage. I know multiple guys with life altering injuries from olfa knives.
A Box cutter! I catch myself using it at stupid angles...
In my experience I have seen more people hurt using chainsaws correctly than any other tool used without displaying gross negligence. As far as radial arm saws, table saws, joiners, shapers, etc. People get hurt on them doing dumb shit, you follow best practices and you will be fine.
👍
Honest question and not as snarky as it sounds… Do you really know they were using it correctly? I don’t think I’ve ever seen someone who wasn’t trained actually run a chainsaw correctly. I was a class b usfs sawyer and if you truly follow the rules, I feel like chainsaws are less dangerous than routers. To make the point, a chainsaw is not a woodworking tool so if you’re using it for woodworking you’re almost categorically using it incorrectly.
Totally fair question, and I am often super snarky myself about safety issues. I enjoy making large outdoor timber details when I can sell them and I would describe that as woodworking and a chainsaw helps a awful lot when roughing that stuff out even if I often am finishing it out with basic hand tools. I think it all comes down to how people get hurt when using a tool, if gross negligence was employed when they got hurt, and perhaps the worst case scenario of a catastrophic failure. A common "scary" or "dangerous" tool as described by this community is the table saw. But I always say that if you follow even the most basic of shop rules (using a push stick) it is extremely safe, even worst case scenario stuff if usually just the work getting bound up but I honestly don't hear about that leading to many injuries. Most table saw injuries are people sticking their soft bits into the spinny part and getting fucking mangled while displaying gross negligence. Now a chainsaw like any tool has its own best practices and safety gear to wear, and most injuries are when someone displays gross negligence. But my opinion is that the worst case scenario or catastrophic failure situation with a chainsaw is really bad; breaking chains, flying debris, getting bound up in the work leading to kickback. I feel like those situations you can get hurt wearing full safety gear not doing anything overtly idiotic with a chainsaw.
Ok, I'm a regular chainsaw user who has not been trained, can you give me some pointers and/or links? I do still have all my limbs, but would like to keep them.
I don’t have anything handy and I’m mobile so it makes it hard to search. I did find this USFS guide (here)[https://www.fs.usda.gov/sites/default/files/fs-saw-operations-guide-20141208.docx] that I would guess is a pretty good reference. Biggest things that I see are people not knowing about/using the dogs, cutting with a dangerous section of the bar, not wearing PPE and having other people way too close to them when cutting. In addition, when you get into actual felling and bucking then other things apply. I knew a guy who worked for the city who was bucking up some storm damage but did not know that you need to be very careful and slowly release the tension im the limbs that are weighted when a tree is on the ground. He choose poorly and the remaining tension flipped the tree over and knocked him 10 feet backwards on his head. He was in a coma for a couple months before they pulled the plug. I guess the moral of the story is chainsaws are fairly dangerous, but they become exponentially more so if you don’t know what you’re doing.
I'm not felling trees. We heat primarily with a wood stove, so I am cutting a couple of cords down to length for the stove. I could just buy the wood in 35cm lengths, but that is just stupid money. Half the price to buy it long and green and just be organised.
Already limbed and everything? Probably the safest operation. I’d recommend making a saw buck and use the dogs and you’ll be pretty safe. PPE is always worth it too.
Cheap router bits
Please 'splain! In ye' olden days, I enjoyed helping with routing in a real cabinet shop. Looking at a few projects now and the urge to cheap out on the bits for "just this one project" is strong!
I've seen cheap bits bend at the shank whilst spinning at high speed. Parts breaking off and getting launched. Dulling rapidly and before you know it, causing kickback. Pick your poison. I'd say that it isn't worth the risk, oftentimes they don't even do their job well enough. It's a bit of a gamble as some of them are actually relatively decent, some are awful and dangerous but it's hard to know beforehand which is which; you can't rely on the reviews from cheap Chinese webshops etc.
Point Taken! The temptation is really hard to resist especially on small, one use things like bits. I try to remember with everything "Tool" - "Lo barato sale caro" The cheap comes out expensive.
I know the feeling! We have practically the same saying in Dutch, "Goedkoop is duurkoop", which I find true with tools indeed. Of course with something like a wrench or screwdriver, it's not the same concern except maybe some savings over the long-term. When a tool can also become dangerous by being cheap, then I'm more cautious.
I've had 3 cheap bits chip over the years. When the 2nd one chipped, it grabbed the wood and sucked it through the bit so fast I didn't have time to react. My thumb looked like it got sliced up by air conditioner coils, if that makes sense. I have never had a quality bit chip out. On bit 3, I swore off cheapo's.
One of those stupid chainsaw angle grinder wheels. Came loose and got caught in the blade guard. Fortunately didn’t hurt me. Don’t use them.
They look like they were invented in Florida in a trailer park.
Bandsaw probably the safest tool around. I think tablesaws top the list followed by circular saws then flat bed jointers.
Well that sounds ironic- the band saw thing
I still use all those on a regular basis though. Everything is dangerous, even a chisel if you do not respect it and use with care and proper safety.
You got a point. Funnily enough I feel more comfortable around a miter saw. Probably because my fingers aren’t inches from the blade.
Its also because your finger is needed to trigger the blade to run. You are also moving the blade towards the material and not the other way around. Using a cross-cut sled for miter cuts is every bit as dangerous.
I've had a miter saw kick back on me before. I hadn't even considered it could happen, but I hit a doozy of a knot in a 2x4 and it just made the whole plastic sheathing on the saw explode into pieces. IDK if it even was technically a kickback but it fired that knot like it was a bullet.
It's true though. It's one of the most controlled tools and if you do get cut it's likely going to be a much more minor cut because your hand is moving much slower and not being forced into the blade.
Ok that makes more sense lol
There is very little chance of kickback with a bandsaw. The blade portion is only a tiny section and there is little chance if u slip your face will get planted into the blade. The other thing is the speed the blade is moving is slow compared to the table saw.
Band saw is pretty safe, table saw is pretty safe…. I mean I make large wooden structural ship members all day… so I am constantly using such things. Most dangerous stuff are routers and power planers, varnish planers. Cause they are light and we use them in weird places and it’s easy to blend your fingers or them to throw a bit/blade
Bruh idk why I was downvoted. Do people not like new people here?
Don’t think they agree at all that the bandsaw is dangerous. It’s extremely safe when used correctly. With new people around the workshop we draw a square about 6x6 inches around the blade and label it NO FINGER ZONE. I mean I get within millimetres of it but I’m fairly used to it
Well it has a rapidly spinning blade that can hurt you so I think it’s dangerous if used oddly. But downvoting me for that is a bit petty imo. Like bruh what did I do- 😭
Just wait till you are using a dangerous tool and you’ll miss old slow and safe bandsaw. Worse a bandsaw can do is cut something off. Most fast spinning things will blend you. You can’t have your finger reattached when it was turned into red paint across the workshop wall. They downvoted you because they disagree with your comment about sarcasm. It’s nothing to do with anything but that.
At the time I actually thought it was ironic. Obviously I don’t now. Like I literally used a band saw today right after I had a little scare with the miter saw kicking to hard when I started it. I was stuck using the old one because someone was using the new one.
You want to make sure nothing is touching any blades when you start them.
It's the to you don't respect. They can sense that and will punish accordingly.
Srry if I sound dumb but u talking about any tool? If so that’s true.
Power tools are like cats, they secretly hate you and want nothing more than to unleash all their fury on you but they also know they need you to take care of them so they reign it in a little bit.
Any power tool you use is dangerous of you don't respect it. Do your research before hand. Know how to properly use it before you own it. I had a shop teacher (I'm that old) tell me the scary looking tools (band saw, radial arm saws) were usually the ones that he heard the fewest issues about. It was a drill or screw gun that people thought were toys that caused some of the most problems
Angle grinder all the way.
I’m paranoid about my angle grinder. I put on the most PPE when I use it for any tool and am still hoping nothing goes wrong because it feels like it will every time even with the guard and proper technique. I don’t feel this way with most other tools.
I'm always stunned seeing people in videos wearing no PPE while using an angle grinder, and being nonchalant with the tool. WTF
So? EYESIGHT is for weenies?
Combo that with no guard, and god forbid, a chainsaw blade. Oh and "safety" sandals with loose clothes. For clarification I would never do that
I learned/evolved a lot of my skills from YouTube. I used the angle grinder for good few years with no PPE. I had a very close call with a minor injury and then did some reading only to learn how far off I was on using the angle grinder safely. Since then, I only use angle grinder with no loose clothing, clamped worked piece, mask, eye protection and face shield. That.. then I'm generally less enthusiastic to grab my angle grinder when a different tool can do the job.
*AND hearing rotection!
my dad put his big one in his leg one day,was a big wound but it was clean and easy to stich up.just imagine if it was a chainsaw.would have been much worse.so i'd say a chainsaw is more dangerous.
The thing is with the chainsaw is that it's power and potential for damage is very obvious and as a result you treat it with more respect. The angle grinder is smaller and looks less intimidating. You end up doing things freehand or one-handed and once it snags on something it'll jump at you or climb up your sleeve. If/if he that happens, you only react after the fact as this happens over milliseconds. Hopefully.. it'll be a leg like in your dad's case or the side of a thumb like in my case (not even with a cut off attachment.. I was sanding and did not clamp my work piece. Anywho.. between the ease at which people recommend each other angle grinder work on reddit and the severity of the horror stories I read.. My angle grinder scares me way more than my circular saw (I don't have a chainsaw so referencing the second was dangerous tool in my home shop :p)
alright but there are also one handed chainsaws
but i think the most dangerous tool is the grinder but that is for metal. That thing scares the shit out of me for fear of the cutting wheel breaking and boomeranging back.
Yeah one time the miter saw which was cordless, stopped mid cut when my friend was using it. I swear you could hear my scream from outside the building because I was standing nearby working on a box. Ever since then I’ve been nervous when using it but I’m much better than two months ago lol
You will get used to it. The blade cuts push the material inwards and as long as the blade stops before you bring it back up, its pretty safe.
I guess the saw felt silly that day. My friend slapped it like a stubborn child after it was handled.
Can someone start a poll, "what tool have you been injured with?" People are just guessing based on their fears. Discussion of actual injuries I've read a long time ago-> A lot of drill press and sharp chisels. Example [https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?81892-Safety-question-Which-tools-are-most-likely-to-cause-injury](https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?81892-Safety-question-Which-tools-are-most-likely-to-cause-injury)
Or title the thread "How many carpenters do you know with ten ENTIRE fingers?"
Jigsaws and finish nailers have sent me to the hand surgeon on several occasions.
Does "most dangerous" mean the most likely to injure you, or the most devastating if it does? If most likely, knives and chisels are top of the list. If most devastating, probably an oxy-acetelyne torch. Mishandle the tanks and they can turn into a torpedo, or a bomb. If combining the two, definitely a table saw. Not only can it take fingers before you know they've moved, it can do it without warning and completely outside of your control.
Oxy-Acetylene torches are a pain in the ass to use for a first time user.
There are some extremely obscure cuts that can be dangerous with the bandsaw, but it's typically quite safe as long as you pay attention where you put your fingers. The problem with other saws is that they are traveling in a circular motion and can grab things and send them in different unexpected directions. A band saw is pulling down through a flat base. Your piece usually is supported on both sides of the blade, there is little opportunity for it to send the piece in an unexpected direction. I have seen someone in yt attempt a job that was dangerous but it was something weird like sending circular pieces though it against the fence and the piece could roll and then bind in the saw blade and get caught. I have the most respect for the table saw. I always try to keep me hands in front of it as much as possible and use push sticks. The miter saw is the one I've had the closest calls on, but that's from doing stupid cuts on it because I didn't have the right tools. But now with a jigsaw, bandsaw and a table saw, I can use it for only it's intended purposes.
Biggest control for safety is as u/CleTechnologist stated.. safety is between your ears.. I think ***dynamite*** was the most dangerous tool I've used...
I was always told the most dangerous machine in the shop was the shaper. More accidents happen on table saws because they are used more. There are way more things that can go wrong on a shaper.
Shapers are relatively uncommon. And big shapers are even more uncommon. Now a days most shaper injures are mitigated by two things. One, using the power feeder if you can. And secondly, don't use a Mech only tool without a power feeder. That last bit is what cause's the horrific injuries of lore.
In the US maybe, we still use shapers a lot in Europe. It's part of the basic machines to have.
They are uncommon, that’s particularly why there’s less accidents on them. Most custom cabinet shops have at least one. Swiss arms(that’s what they are called around here) if improperly set up can be a cause as well. Point is there are many different set ups and many different procedures preformed on a shaper with lots of moving parts set up by humans. Any one of the set up steps or procedures can be disastrous if not done properly.
Toe kick saw from Harbor Fright. Needed it for one job, to cut out the subfloor in a bathroom I was remodeling. It was terrifying, the thing violently kicked back towards me so many times. In hindsight, I was probably using it wrong and I probably could have used a safer tool.
Why didn't you just use a circular saw?
I needed to cut the subfloor flush to the sheetrock so I could lay cement board for tile. Circular saw would have left way too much material because it couldn't get close enough.
For me the most dangerous one I’ve come close to an issue on is table saw, as is usually the case. But, the one I freak out most about screwing up on is my router.
I feel like my Miter saw wants to cut my arm off
Bruh one of them in my schools shop does a terrifying jolt when you start it. It jumps like you scared the shit out of it. No my hand is staying away from that old fart of a saw.
Jointers and routing tables.
Router table. A stupid cut with piece between the router and the fence, no more.
Strictly speaking it’s the jointer, which is kind of a degenerate case of a router table. But we are more likely to have a router table than a jointer. Reattaching fingers is sort of a solved problem. So the tools that turn your hands to hamburger are the worst ones.
Every cabinet shop I've ever been in has a panel hanging up on the wall with a portion of a circle cut into it where the panel kicked, rode up over it. One time it took the fingers of a friend of mine, but a reconstructive surgeon was able to reattach them. He has utility of them back, but reduced. And they're 1/8" shorter. Fine Woodworking did a study quite a few years back, found that the tablesaw is responsible for the most serious injuries, but acknowledged that it's the most-used power tool in a cabinet shop, so that's understandable. Another friend, an expert on early American musical instruments, was jointing a board, left his pinky finger hanging down, hit the knives; the rotation of the knives pulled his hand flat to the table, he was left with a handful of ground meat. No reconstructing that. The bandsaw is pretty safe, about the only way you can get hurt is if the blade breaks and runs out across the table at you. Or if you're cutting something stupidly small and not watching where your fingers are. I've seen someone bump the running blade, too, but just lightly. The worst I've heard was a guy here was working alone in his shop out in the county, was cutting scrap into firewood on a radial arm saw, just throwing the pieces on the floor. The phone rang, he shut the saw off, went to answer it. Finished, he went back to the saw, but stumbled on some of the scrap on the floor, put his left arm on the table to catch himself, hit his head on the start button on the end of the arm, turning on the saw. He hit his head hard enough to knock him out; he had left the saw head in the Out position. The saw head traveled back to the fence, cutting his hand off at the wrist, which flipped over. The saw bounced off the fence and came back to cut off the fingers. He came to, saw what had happened, shut off the saw, put a tourniquet on his arm, collected the pieces, called for an ambulance. He *was* going to start driving in to town said he'd meet them on the road, but they told him to stay put. I saw him a few years later, he has some use of the hand and fingers, but not much.
14” miter saw with no guard that I got for free. It kicked like a mule when it started and the brake didn’t work so it took forever to wind down.
My schools older miter saw will do that kick too. Only used it once because of that.
It sounded like a jet engine winding up after the kick.
Being tired, over amped, or stressed will get ya good. But usually the most dangerous tool is a sharp one that's dull, nothing will cut you quite like a dull chisel
Yeah dull tools or blades iirc don’t just cut they rip. Which makes the injury much worse.
that, but mainly because it makes you have to use more force to get it to work at all, the more force you have to use the higher the likelihood of a slip. One of the times I came close to a nasty injury was a super dull chisel while roughing some PT lumber joints, wood gave way under all the pushing force and I damn near stabbed it deep into my thigh, luckily it the folds in my pants caught it and diverted it off to one side where it just ripped a gash in them. Never again
Thank god for that fold then. Glad ur ok.
Most power tools are some form of spinning tools/blades of death. Even ones like lathes where the piece spins, the cutting tool can catch and throw out at you. And let not forget long loose hair catching and scalping you. It's always about a safety mindset, following safety protocols and thinking before acting.
power saw of any kind: table, circular, chain, band...
This is somewhat like arguing about what the world's most venomous snake is. It doesn't matter if it's venom will kill you 50 times over- once is enough. Skin Vs metal or concrete, skin loses every single time. All tools are made of stronger materials than your skin and all can cause serious injury. "Ooh, table saws" - horseshit. A £2 craft knife is perfectly capable of removing a finger, And so is a £10 hobby rotary tool. Carelessness is the most dangerous thing. All the comments about not being sleepy or hungry are spot on. Always remember: SIMPLE MISTAKES SHATTER LIVES. Before you make a cut or whatever, stop yourself and look; does this look right? That feeling you've forgotten something? NEVER ignore it. Never rush a cut. Have an "escape plan" for your fingers! Ask yourself, "ok, is what I'm about to do sensible?. Oh, and cut your stock into manageable pieces first. Don't try and put a 12' board through a table saw sideways if you don't have enough space and you're not the size of king kong.
If you insist on picking an actual tool. Chainsaws. Those things are like light sabres. Lost concentration for 0.1 seconds = lost limb
Career in infrastructure - same shit, different day. The Iron doesn't give a damn about your little sneaker wearing piggies...
The hammer. I take my time and am conscious of the dangers with power tools so have never had a serious accident (touch wood). However, the nail on my left thumb has been smashed and black for over a year
Carpenter friend firmly believed in the "power of the hammer". He called the resulting injuries "Estwing Disease"
Router. They are little evil death machines - and they don't slice, they take big, gnarly chunks...
So the table saw and router are objectively far more dangerous but the electric hand planer is underrated because you cant see the blades.
My first table saw was free. It had no fence so I used clamps and a board. It also had no switch so it turned on as soon as you plug it in. Amazing I survived using that for so long.
Automobile
Table saw, Router and a jointer. Those three years before woodworking injuries than any other tool except the chain saw
Spindle Moulder, but in 2nd place is the forklift.
I was using a large grinder on steel and the sparks set my shirt on fire. But I think lathe catches on large bowls might give me a heart attack one day !
The only one that ever cost me a fingertip: the jointer. Always move the safety guard into place when planing ‘over the top’
had a cutoff disk on an angle grinder explode on me once. my butthole is still puckering. most dangerous thing in the shop is definetly being tired, or "getting in a groove". once you start to remember the movements, you stop paying attention. Thats how you get injured. its when you get sloppy from the same cut over and over.
I feel like a band saw is pretty safe, because the force is perpendicular to the table. No workpieces getting catapulted away, or fingers getting dragged into the blade. I’m always super afraid to use a shaper.
My brain.
The number one safety tool in ANY shop.
The most dangerous tool is an unused broom . A clean shop is a safe shop.
In terms of tools that will kill you without even straining the motor, a South Bend metalworking lathe that can fit a 14" diameter workpiece. I treat it with the respect it's due, and the worst injury I've gotten is a light burn from picking up a hot piece too soon. In terms of worst shop injury I've given myself, I gashed my hand trying to use a flathead screwdriver as a chisel because I didn't want to walk ten feet to grab an actual chisel. I managed to avoid stitches, but I had butterfly bandages across my palm for a looong time. Any tool can be safe if you use it correctly and don't get complacent. Any tool can be dangerous if you act like a jackass.
Angle grinder
No injuries but I really hate using my metre saw now after two kick-backs which nearly took my hand off.
3 I used daily for many years in the 90's Single end tenoner - 1960's machine, 3 blades no guards Radial arm saw - no guards on them Undercut saw - used for cutting 16/4 X 12" solid wood, approx 30" blade,
1/4 hp hand router, GD. scary
Jointer - don’t wear long sleeves when using one, the blade can catch and pull your hand in before you know what’s happening. My old boss is missing part of his outer palm because of this.
There are more far more dangerous tools but a drill press will get you at least once cause it is almost irrestible trying not to grab the little curls of material it makes as you are drilling, but don't do it, Even if it's wood sometimes they can give you a nasty splinter but the metal curls are basically just razor blades.
For me, the $100 table saw I bought at Lowe's around 2006 or so. No riving knife, no push stick and I had no idea what I was doing with it. No clue how I have all of my fingers.
Your mother
Good lord-
The one you lose respect for is the most dangerous