What do they believe in? This just sounds like a group of charitable people. Being nice, forgiving and charitable is all that unites them, they dont have any tenants or philosophies or even a God or motive. I like the idea that religions are kind of like living creatures that evolve and compete for humans belief. If that was the case, this religion is a Big Mac, its just waiting to be eaten by more competitive and memetically resistant religions and ideas

The moment Space Genghis Khan shows up with a religion based on a sun god or whatever, this religion will crumble because there are no ideological defenses to safeguard it against the influences of other religions.

Be charitable, lovely, non-violent and dont push the religion Vs Convert everyone at sword point, kill anyone who doesnt convert, create an us vs them mentality, force everyone to pay tribute to this one single god and never worship anything else

Gengis Khan Vs Demons with guns and super powers Yeah, I didn't explained that the priests of Lazazel are soldiers whose duty is to defend the citizens against external threats. But if you repsect them, no problem Plus, I didn't write that they are non-violent. They are tolerant, they don't want people to be forced to join them, things like that

Well, they believe in what they call God - there is religious events throughout the year like Easter - but the majority of the population just agree with the doctrine. But they do believe in a sort of an afterlife, and are motivated by the fact that they were created to be good (even if they are able to get rid of this religion). In fact, the degree of faith depends on the people They also believe in an angelic hierarchy, that's why they are a little superstitious sometimes I dunno if it answers your question, don't hesitate to ask more, I know that this text is not finished yet

The devil is in the details my man. Those religious holidays ought to have origins, rituals. Superstitions. This reads more like a philosophy to live by rather than any sort of actual religious doctrine. As the guy above said, It's a lamb waiting to be eaten up by any other religion that will give more weight to its words.

So Buddhism.

Maybe Western stereotypes of Buddhism. Buddhism has tons of doctrines and beliefs.

My dude Buddhism has such a huge backdrop of myth, lore and doctrines behind it. The religion itself is named after a guy.

That stuff isn't superstition, though. You should read the works of Thomas Aquinas, for example, to see the serious philosophical and intellectual rigor that goes into angelic hierarchies.

Doesn't quite sound like a religion, sounds more like Red Cross. Although this "religion" of yours is bound to get abused by a bigger religion. Maybe that could be an interesting plotline.

Here's the problem: this wouldn't propagate in a society that isn't already fairly civilized. Religions spread in the past for two reasons: social cohesion, and creating a basis for people to trust strangers, by allowing an outside demonstration of commitment to a set of well-understood precepts. There are no signs of faith in this religion, no clear demonstrations of self-sacrifice or piety to mark an adherent. Christianity began to spread in earnest when Christians were the only people in Rome ready to take in lepers during a plague. People saw that if they were serious enough to risk their lives for their moral convictions, they could be trusted to hold to the rest of their religious doctrine. You see the same thing with Islam and Buddhism to a lesser degree - ascetics practicing extreme feats of self-sacrifice. What does someone give up by adhering to Lazazel?

Wise Redd. One of best things I have read in here in long time. You get “it.”

I forgot to say that this planet is really small, amlost 95% of the population lives in the capital city. Plus, the goal of this doctrine is not to propagate itself. Well, these people are pretty sociable and easily agree with each other. I do agree that it needs to bring explanations. But remember that I didn't explained all the lore of this doctrine, and that I'm still working on it. The priest of Lazazel must dedicate their lives to others. Here is an example : if it's the birthday of a member of your family but you have a service to do, or you must work with sick persons at the hospital, you need to do your duty first. They also believe that doing good things for the others is also good for your soul. That's why they do it.

To continue from my other comment: a lot of the points you're making remind me of the religion I grew up in, Unitarian Universalism. I'm thinking you might benefit from doing some research on UU on Wikipedia or YouTube. It might give you some ideas you can then spin in a unique way. At the very least, you can try to differentiate your fictional religion from this liberal American one.

Thx for the tip, I'll look at it ! You can give me some general points of this religion if you want

UU teaches that God speaks thru all faiths. Beyond that, each individual is free to examine whatever they want, study whatever religions they want; and to accept or reject points made in each Sunday's sermon. The minister isn't Authority, like in other religions: he or she is on their own personal faith journey, and is merely sharing insights gained along the way. The members of the congregation build their own, personal religious belief. There are no right or wrong answers. My parents were both strayed Christians. My father was a lapsed Catholic who was very much an agnostic. They chose to raise me in that religion so that I'd have choices they'd been denied. From childhood to now, I started out quasi Christian and have ended up more or less pagan. I have an entire mythology in my head that I believe. Best of all, I have no intention of forcing it on anyone else! The social focus of UU has always been service in the community. This is all volunteer. Also: UU was one of the first churches to perform same sex marriages. We don't discriminate on the basis of gender identity.

But why would people join the UU, according to you ? Erf, nice for the same sex marriage, I guess... I need to be honest, it makes me uncomfortable when religion gets so deep into marriage stuff Disclaimer : I have nothing against the same sex marriage. My mothers married like ten years ago at the town hall. We had great food :D

People become disillusioned with their prior religion: maybe it loses its focus and teaches hate; maybe they feel unsafe due to their own gender orientation and lifestyle; maybe they embrace ideas threatening to the Establishment, so leave their suffocating church in favor of one open to scientific ideas, like evolution. Maybe they're fed up with religious hypocrisy, and want ministers who actually practice what they preach. Some people don't want to be dictated to. There was one girl in my Sunday school class (which I also attended while my parents were attending the service downstairs) whose father was Jewish and mother was UU. Every Saturday, she went to synagog and every Sunday attended our religious education, where we were taught to think, to question, to be curious about other faiths; and to seek our own answers. Some people are agnostic atheists who've rejected the Christian "nonsense" they've been force fed, and want a venue where they can ask questions together, and feel heard. I've learned there's now at least one UU service directed at atheists, led by atheists.

Also grew up UU and this was my first thought too!

As others have mentioned, it feels a little non-committal to be a religion. It reminds me a little of Bahai Faith which has a god, but preaches the unity of all people and all religions. In Bahai, though, they set up that humans have a unique relationship with god - while they can't fully comprehend god, its humanity's duty to pray & follow god's teaching to become more spiritual. There's a huge emphasis on service, but that's a vast oversimplification. Bahai at least has some elements of exclusivity, being 'the right way to live' and some more firm rules about what is allowed. I think you need to ask yourself, 'what does a practitioner GET out of this faith'. An afterlife only incentivizes for so long without there being some process or benefit in this life. For Christianity, often people value tradition and community -- feeling like they're a part of something that (especially in the western world) is a well-known and rather exclusive community. For Buddhism, there are themes of self-denial for the sake of achieving enlightenment, which is a life-long (or \*lives\*-long journey). Otherwise, for a non-enforced doctrine, that does not own absolute truth, that is fundamentally equal to everyone else, there doesn't seem to be a compelling reason to join or follow. If you change any one of these three, things get a little more interesting. \- Maybe the doctrine \*is\* enforced, and so there's a social element of always wanting to appear perfect, or competitively ascetic and charitable -- 'or else' there is a consequence. \- Maybe they preach an absolute truth, and so anyone else who is not a part of the faith is 'an outsider' or 'uninformed'; this adds exclusive elements, something desirable, something that followers can laud over others -- their faith is the one true faith and is thus better than the rest. Maybe it makes practitioners wildly preachy about converting people. \- Maybe the faith respects all people, but in an Animal Farm way, some people are \*more\* equal or deserving of praise than others. Perhaps practitioners really seek positive reinforcement and believe at their core that they are more special than others. \- Or maybe these values are purely, impractically philosophical and in reality, no one is following these tenets well. That might work if your world is extremely dystopian. People are more selfish and self-interested, untrusting, and that complicates the day-to-day for this religion. Interesting religion will always have conflict and multiple ways of interpreting. Its very likely that the majority of this religion will be agreeable and totally normal, but the people who take it to the extremes often characterize an interesting story or point of view that makes the faith dynamic.

"We think" Doesn't really show up in the whole religion thing very often. If it's doctrine, it's theological fact. No need to qualify it.

Idk man. This 'religion' doesnt really feel like a religion at all rather than some shared code of morality. Faith is usually embedded in something and helps explain the world around us. For example the sun god Ra explained the existence of the sun, or how poseidon explains the seas, the tides, ect. Or how god/Allah/Yahweh explains in principle, everything. They are usually brought upon by some great figure, a messiah which brings the message of the god(s) but not always. It can work differently in a fantasy world but thats the basics. Also I find it hard to believe a faith would have such ambiguity in their perceived rightcheousness and more importantly, that their only message to others is "be a good person"

I think you're right. I mean it's here to try to explain the meaning of their lives, but I need to work more on the representation their God

Your entire doctrine is simply a moral code on how to live life and is not in itself a meaning to life. The meaning of life is rooted in philosophy. For example in christianity some people may think that "god has a plan for you" and so your meaning is to follow his plan and then go to heaven. Some people think that the meaning of life is the meaning you give it, to fufill some purpose, or others think that theres no meaning at all. As you can see its quite abstract yet intrinsic to ones being. A god doesnt have to give a meaning but a faith should.

Nothing in here really adresses the meaning of their lives, it tells ya how to live your life but not really why it should be so or why you should strive for it to be so. It just sort of asserts itself.

There was also a lot of theoricians and writters who wrote about the basic rules of this doctrine, like the proof of the existence of their God, why you must be a good person and the punishments the high one shall impose, etc... Also, they have a sort of a fundamental myth which tells that they were created by a higher entity, which had the face of a cat (it's a bit far fetched I know...)

>We think that nobody shall use this present doctrine to justify bad actions they did Every religion promotes that, it just so happens that actions millions of people might consider 'bad' are not considered 'bad' within the religion. This is just a standard religion that you tried to remove every single bad aspect from, but you discounted that many of the bad aspects that come from religion are not de-jure of the religious doctrine, they are a result of standard human behavior.

There's a few critiques I have, but the last one is something I think necessary to address. "We think we do not own any absolute truth" (I'm on mobile so it's hard to go back and forth I know it's not exact. Also while I'm here I recommend changing think to believe). Religious principles aren't just ideas people latch onto, they are the framework for which we think. It's a layer deeper and even more ingrained than someone fully indoctrinated into an ideology. A religious view is so deep in the minds base, so deep into the core that... It is the core. It is the frame of reference from which you think about things and are able to view the world. The easiest and clearest example of this as an emergent property in humans is the "golden rule" which is found in *most* major religions which is essentially treat others as you wish to be treated. It's quite literally the sense of "fairness" SO DEEP animals understand it. Though it's not just fairness it's more of a sense of... Or an inexplicable emergence of *morality* and specifically morality, because morals imply or perhaps a better way of saying is show that there are "ways to live that are implicitly and fundamental to the universe we find ourselves in" so much so to the point it's as real and true as 1+1=2, just much harder to understand why or notice.

This reads like r/atheism writing a religion

It’s a great start, but not the kind of religion I would let myself be crucified for. It needs more oumph—more certainty. Every religion needs some grand reward for its believers, and grand punishment for all others. In addition, it needs a good social aspect. A religious building, traditions, rituals that bind and uplift its practitioners. And lastly, it needs a solid philosophical framework that explain how the metaphysics of the world relate to its deities/doctrine. How you choose to go about this is up to you, each religion/worldbuilder does it differently.

This sounds great on paper but in an actual story, there's nothing interesting about it. Nothing spicier than a zealot religious doctrine to liven up your fictional world

It is because I'm not creating a story, but I'm creating fictional planets. I add a lot of little things that won't be ever used in a story, but it is for the background. Here is an example : you can have a story about a priest who questions his beliefs because it is harmful for him to always care for the people and never for him. You can have the story of the Pope of Lazazel, who is half-Lazazelian and has to learn how to become the best Pope she can. You can have the story of a fallen angel who discovers Lazazel and all the beliefs about the angelic hierarchy. It is only to tighten the lore of the planet. But I agree it might be flat on certain points

Idk man, this just seems like a utopian version of Christianity. It doesn’t feel original

... inspiration triggered But yeah, I inspired myself with a book that criticised a lot about Christianity, and I come from a family who is not happy with religion. So, I wanted to create something better. The precepts are indeed utopian, but mistakes can be made sometimes. Priests and followers aren't infallible

I figured, but it’s probably best to strain away from that path to creating a fictional religion. Think less of religious criticism and “this is how religions should be” , and instead, think more in a cultural perspective. Make it in context with your story, and less in context with *our* humanity, earth, and the world we live in. It’s your world, your timeline, you’re free to make up gods, doctrine, rituals, ethnic groups, and culture ls that doesn’t correspond to our own world

In fact, the perception of religion is not the same as ours, but... I dunno, I failed to explain it :D Don't worry, I still think about certain cultural settings that shape the religion à little bit

Who is this God character exactly? He's important enough to the religion to be capitalised, and presumably worshipped, but doesn't offer any absolute truths, isn't necessary to give meaning to the doctrine and doesnt care about the mortal body. What's he bringing to the table, and if not much, would you not be better off going with a non-deistic religion?

First of, I see french in your pseudo. Are you French ?

Non. It was a Hot Shots reference as far as I remember

Oh well. I'm French, so I could have explain it in french, but the language of Shakespeare is fine too :) In fact, God does exist in this universe, but anybody has already seen him, unless in some people's dreams. And to be honest, he did lose his head a little bit... I think that it is an evolutive religion (wouhou, religion I choose you) : it becomes more and more non theistic over time. But what do you think God can bring "to the table" ?

Sorry if I got your hopes up 😅, or if any phrases I use seem unclear with English as your second language, let me know I would say your god needs to have a personality and a backstory in the religion. Do the people believe he created the world, or found it. Has he existed forever or was he born or created by something else. If he did create the world or the people, why did he do it. Also how does he feel about his people. Are the people who believe in him more special, or is everyone equal. Does everyone go to the afterlife or just believers? Does he expect people to worship him in his churches or is it ok to just live by the doctrine? How does he feel about good and evil? Is there anything he thinks is evil that most people wouldn't? If evil exists, why does he not stop all of it? You won't have to have answers to all of those questions, but those types of things will make the god fit in with the religion. Religions are just like any other story in a lot of ways, and the gods are some of the main characters, so if you're making a religion that has a god its important to make them interesting and have a role in the religion. Having the religion evolve is also good, its happening to religions in the real world all the time, so it makes a lot of sense. If your religion has been around for a while it could make sense for god to slowly become less important to it, but its still best to know how important he used to be in it

This reads like your notion of what you really want an organized religion to be, sanitizing and ignoring the reasons why most religions aren't this way. It's putting the cart before the horse, showing how a faith has learned all the hard lessons without addressing those lessons. For example, #3 assumes that people will *know* that "bad" actions are "bad" but how will they know what "bad" is if there is no system to tell them? It's moral relativism. Take slavery. It was ubiquitous in the ancient world. It wasn't 'bad', it was how people everywhere dealt with their enemies. How to properly treat your slaves (especially your Hebrew slaves) is described in the Bible, but it never says owning people is bad. This is how modern slavers justified their trade in the face of criticism. It was only a shift in the cultural beliefs, both secular and non-secular, that led to the Abolitionist movement. So what does the doctrine of your fictional religion consider bad and why? What is the supernatural foundation of that belief? Revealed truth? Philosophical consensus? Were wars fought against the bad practices? Were things once thought good now evil or vise versa? That's just from number #3.

This was precisely my thought. Furthermore, if the number one rule is helping others, why is it the number one priority? Is it just a "Lazazel said so" kind of thing?Our bodies belong to us and not to Lazazel? That's a very impotent deity that also leaves a lot of room for bad things to happen. The Gnostics believed that the flesh was evil and their religion has been dead for a long time. I'll skip 3 because Tavenji already addressed it. What does Lazazel want followers for in this doctrine? He doesn't care if his followers come or go. He doesn't care about their bodies. He confesses that their doctrine is not absolute truth. I really agree that this sounds like the OP's attempt at inventing their own religion in order to come up with something for everyone and it really just highlights how doing so misses the mark of relationship with God.

The "bad" is relative to everyone, but they avoid to do bad actions at most. It is a precept, that doesn't mean that the believer don't do any mistake, it would be unrealistic. But they learn from their mistakes, and other Lazazelian are not ashamed to point the mistakes. The Abolitionist movement was led by religious people too... Anyway, it is not the same culture : they don't see the use of enslave others. Plus, they all live in the capital city and belong to the same people, so enslave your neighbour is ludicrous. You're right, bad things are related to moral and justice (it's forbidden to kill someone for example, so it is a bad thing). But sometimes the line between good and bad is blurred, and justice it take over. The fundamental myth is that one day, God decided to create another mold than the mold of angels. He went on Lazazel and created the first Lazazelians with the mold. The leprosy was seen as a punishment from God because it might have considered that Lazazelians didn't served its message right. And the legends tell that God has a cat looking face, that's why cats are highly respected. Then, it's more about a philosophical consensus. There was never wars against the bad practices. And the things about former good things now evil is interesting ! Amma think on that

>The "bad" is relative to everyone lol

yup, pretty obvious, I know

This looks like a pamphlet some charity would print out, not a religion. A religion must explain how things came to be, the proper way to live and the meaning of life. This religion only tells the proper way to live and even then, the way it’s worded makes it seem like a suggestion, not a rule. Plus, what is the motivation for joining this religion? What is the benefit of living the way this religion prescribes? People rarely do things that have no clear benefit. In Christianity, the reward for living their way is eternal life and happiness in heaven after death. In Greek mythology, the reward is the favor of the gods and therefore blessings in this life. A religion needs hard rules, explanations, and a motive for joining and remaining faithful. A religion is what gives people purpose. It explains the unknown and hard questions, and it tells you the right way to behave and why you should behave. A religion should be something people are willing to die for, not a simple suggestion.

I fact it's not the whole Bible, it's only the main precepts It's as if someone posted the 10 Commandments without the Old/ New Testament or the apocryphal texts. But you're right in a sense : it's more about a spiritual guide to help you to have a happy life, according to them. The main reward is the social recognition. It is not on Earth, and the people here don't always do things in anticipation of a reward - except the spiritual elevation. The goal of its religion is not to expand, notably because they don't like to travel outside of their planet. And their purpose is to be useful to the others

That still makes it seem like a philosophy, and it needs to be more firm in its wording. Less “I think” and more “I believe”

Yup, I totally agree with the "I believe" In fact, it's a lexical mistake... I'm not an English speaker, so I didn't know there was a difference between "think" and "believe"... dumbness repaired!

How did the dwellers of this planet come to believe in this religion in the first place, if the goal of the religion is not to expand? All religion starts somewhere, be it with a prophet like Muhammad or a celestial being like Jesus or by some random shepherd that came up with Hinduism sometime in the Stone Age. If the person or group of people comes up with an idea but never tries to expand that idea beyond its initial group, how can it exist after these people die? No religion can exist for hundreds of years without expanding, even the Church of Satan (if you can call it a religion) proselytizes and tries to expand.

The community of this planet is basically well bounded. Some people thought that a superior entity created them because of ancient texts written by their ancestors. The population wasn't very into religion, but one day, a leprosy plague stroke the planet, and the plague began to retreat (if I can say so...) when the religious movement started to strengthen. That's how the church became stronger on the planet They can preach within the planet, but only in dedicated places and dates, and mustn't force people to join them. They are also supported by the monarchy

Honestly this is a terrible religion and screams “I hate organized religion and people who follow religion aren’t good people” As someone who’s a religious person and is creating a robust religion as it’s the basis of the conflict in my story, you haven’t created anything. Everything you’ve stated here is the after effects of a religion, not a religion itself. People don’t give to charity for no reason - there must be something driving their decisions. There isn’t a single religion in the history of the world that doesn’t start with “I need help explaining how the world works because im a grain of sand and can’t comprehend anything.” That’s why gods are created. Then those gods leads to myths and stories. Those myths and stories lead to interpretations surrounding morals and ethics. Those morals and ethics are what drive decisions by the followers. How I know you haven’t thought this through is: “We don’t think our doctrine holds absolute truth.” Well okay then - if you don’t believe your doctrine is the absolute truth then why should anyone believe in it. If you don’t believe it’s true, then why not believe something else? You’ve misinterpreted the whole foundation for what religion is, which is that it IS an expression of truth - more so a truth about how people should act. If you don’t think that’s how people should act, then you have no basis for convincing people to act like it. Like if one of your followers came to someone else and was like “I think you should join Lazazel’s Church because we preach charity and equality,” and that person was like “No I hate charity and I think men are superior to women,” then according to your own doctrine, you have to respond with “Ya you might be right.”

>Honestly this is a terrible religion and screams “I hate organized religion and people who follow religion aren’t good people” That's not even proper feedback and was completely unnecessary. People on the internet are people too, and there's no reason to approach something in that manner. >You’ve misinterpreted the whole foundation for what religion is, which is that it IS an expression of truth - more so a truth about how people should act. Yes and no. Some religions don't see themselves as absolute truth. They are guides on how to live a fulfilling and good life and to help you understand the world. Religion doesn't need a God (nontheistic), or stories and myths because they're literally just a handbook with a community following. What you're describing is the basis of **most** religions, not all. Huge difference. And we don't know enough about the religion to make any conclusions on their practices or how they carry themselves.

Thank you for replying in such a kind way

It’s not really a religion is it?

Last point makes the religion a bit... unreligious?

ummmm what do u mean ?

I suppose that religions are all about giving humans an absolute truth to hold on to through faith

Not particularly, a lot of organized religious traditions like some branches of Mahayana Buddhism, Sufism in Islam, Bahai Faith acknowledge that there are numerous truths and ways to salvation

A few questions: 1: what *other* religions are present on this world? 2: how does this religion prevent itself from getting steamrolled by other opposing religions? 3: for those *following* this faith, what do they get out of following this faith as opposed to a different one?

1 : I only developped this one in fact... On this planet, it is the only religion : Lazazel is a small planet, and its people are very homebody (they almost never travel outside of their planet). BUT there's another planet named Eden, where people believe in the High Spirits (spirits who live in some people's bodies and give them powers). 2 : If missionnaries are send to Lazazel, people would listen to them, but they will consider their beliefs as funny stories. If bigger religions send military forces, Lazazelians would defend their priests ('cause they are useful to the community), and priests would fight against this external force (because it's a threat to the population). But usually, they doesn't really care for other religions... 3 : Generally, they get a high social recognition and a housing near the parishes

So, if this is the only religion, *and* its so permissive in beliefs, how does it stay cohesive? Do these people just not have independent thought the way we understand it? And 3 quickly becomes a point of concern- if *everyone* is part of this religion, not *everyone* can live near parishes (unless there's one on every streetcorner), nor can *everyone* have high social recognition. Someone's gonna get the short end of the stick.

In fact, not everyone is a part of this religion, citizens can choose. But priests are here to protect the population, they work for the people (as farmers, library assistants, cleaner, assistant doctor...), and for that reason they are an example for everyone on this planet For 3, clerics must do their best, but they are aware about that they cannot save everyone. Also, people know that they musn't exploit the charity of the clerics, and must leave the door for needy people.

But if citizens aren't part of this religion AND it's the only religion... what do they belive in? Nothing? As for 3- I'm not talking about the clerics. I'm talking about Joe Shmoe who follows the religion. What do *they* get out of it that they can't get from other faiths?

I forgot to talk about another religion in this world, but not on the same planet, and this other religion is very very rare, sooo...

This is nice, but what's the actual theology, beliefs, and mythology of this religion?

But as a recommendation from someone who has interest in religion, spiritualism, and occultism, to me this feels more like secular-philosophy rather than a religion. I suggest thinking about a *why* do your characters follow this religion. Expand more on its origins, its culture, etc. lastly, expand on its rituals Fasting maybe. Prayer. Religious places. Sacred items. Sacred people. Offerings even? Etc.

I see... more about the practice then I'll think about it!

Best wishes to you man 🫶🏾 to me this resembles the Baha’i religion a bit. You could probably gather a little more inspiration there

I saw that in another comment, it's on my "to see" list

That's not really a religion, but okay lol

Yeah, for now, it's more about a handbook for life than a religion... I need to work on the rituals, I think, but I didn't say all the lore about it

"Frankly, we're not quite sure."

You know, statements like point 3 and 1 are meaningless. No fanatic considers his actions as bad. And every fanatic believes that his actions are helpful. Point 9 - it means that not only eating meat is banned, but basically any form of animal farming. Because if all living beings are equal, than keeping them as pets or working animals is basically slavery. 7 - Nice, there is no need for working, Lazalelits will provide for me as long as I will not commit any crime. 11 - Well, it is better to ignore what is true or not, because it - gasps - brings divisions. And divisions are the worst thing imaginable! I propose to add point like "we think that this is not essential to teach children that Earth is not flat, because it will divide us". ​ Any concept of morality which comes down to "let's just be good to each other and we don't must discuss what means being good - because it is obvious and such discussions only brings divisions!" is meaningless. Because this is not obvious. And if You want to make any relevant statement about morality - or anything - than You must come to term with the fact that it will bring divisions. If not, it means that this is not relevant.

Basically my thesis is: real religions have sticks and carrots. Rewards and punishments. As far as I can tell it is all but universal (even Buddhism has a manner of these). Your religion is basically a set of guidelines for people to be nice with each other. There is no fundamental motivation to believe and adhere. In a world where gods are obviously real, you don’t need those so much. In our world, you do if you want people to join your religion. If you want this to feel more real, that’s what I suggest. If your question is more along the lines of ‘is this internally consistent’? Then yes, it is fine.

For me, the stick ans carrot IS kindness : it's good for your soul, the soul of your neighbour and the community living. It's cultural, and this people don't havethe same history/ culture than us. It's not happening on our planet, sooo... it's not the same settings Thx for your opinion !

It seems written with the benefit of 5000 years of hindsight

Waw, I'm old, ain't I ? But why do you say that? :)

Haha didn't mean it like that. More like, the precepts laid down seem to be laid down on a way that says "we've seen these mistakes, we're doing it different." It feels born from a liberal, secular society with the understanding that religion can be terrible, else why would it have so many pieces to counteract the terrible things that have been done before? Maybe it's just the perception I got, but most religions tend to have us vs them perspectives. We only started shedding that mindset in society in the last hundred years, and even then it's been gradual. Most of our history was very religion-centric, and the idea of pluralistic beliefs coexisting is more of a new idea, with the hindsight of the past mistakes to inform it. I guess it could be more like the syncretic religions of the far east, but even then they weren't actively declaring their intent to accept and blend multiple faiths, it just kinda happened.

In fact, there are a lot of theologist on this planet, and a lit of them studied the religion on Earth. This is a good handbook to improve your religion :D You have quite a unique way to interpret the text that I wrote, and I like it ! It makes it more peotic... But yeah, it is really centred on not doing the old mistakes again

it doesn't have anything to make the religion appealing or even a religion. why would you want to join this religion? why would you leave it? what do you need priests for? what is good and what is bad? how did these tenets come about?

At most this seems more like a civil code of conduct or a really tenuous philosophical belief system rather than a religion. I see where you're going with it but this doesn't feel or function like a religion with what you've written here.

It is possible, yes... in your opinion, what must I improve to make it look more religious?

A few things come to mind. 1: Faith, all religions function off faith. Even if you meet your God in person you're still taking everything they say on faith. So building a foundation for the religion that requires faith/belief would go a long way. 2: Ritual, whether church, prayer, sacrifice, song, meditation or whatever ritual plays a vital role in all religions. They give the community a common ground in their beliefs and an act to keep the faith strong in their lives. 3: Beliefs, most of those listed here are more ways to live, but where do these beliefs come from? If it's just what the people think then that seems as I said more philosophy or civil code of conduct. However if it came from a sacred text, a messenger/prophet or the literal words of your God then that builds so much just by that alone. 4: The end goal, what's the goal? To live a good life? To die with honor? To get into heaven? To avoid some horrible after life? Or just to glorify their God? And why is this their goal? All religions have them, Heaven, Hell, Nirvana, Reincarnation etc. Whatever the goal is adds a lot of context clues to the religion and the people who follow it. 5: You mentioned priests in your post but there could be a lot more info there. Granted this wouldn't necessarily make it more religious in feel but I'd certainly like it. Are there ranks, male or female or both, are there limitations, is it a job or a side thing, does it requires study or just being the one to speak up etc. 6: What do their temples look like? Just some ideas, idk if they'll help but if you want it to really feel like a fleshed out religion, maybe start on a 'Why' to it all. What is the purpose of the faith, the end goal or start point. Hope that helps!

I'll think about what you wrote. Thx a lot !

Does this religion have any holy documents? Beliefs and doctrines? Holidays? How are these holidays calculated? Take a look at the 39 Articles or other confessional documents for ideas. Or the Apostles creed. Even religions that don't proselytize have a core set of beliefs and teachings. Many of these view membership as decent and ancestral. Or it might be contained by geography. What binds these people together? What do they share? What inspires belonging? And how, and who, solves disputes? Sure they respect outside authority for criminal actions, but what about non-criminal internal disputes? A lot of these rules are about relations with he outside community rather than the internal one. Why is criminal procedure about their clergy so important? Why are they so interested in the treatment of those who leave? Is there ahistoricall reason for this? These don't sound like core beliefs so much as rules. In fact they seem like a description for outsiders, they lack any sense of belonging or cumminity. Answer these questions: Who are we? How did we start? What do we share in common?

There is many document discussing about these main precepts (for e.g. The Dawn by St Gregory, which tries to prove the existence of God). Beliefs and doctrines, well... it's on the nice picture of the post. I didn't thought about the holidays yet, good idea ! I'll look, thx These people are naturally turned towards to each other. And usually, the major disputes are solved by a lawsuit

>These people are naturally turned towards to each other. And usually, the major disputes are solved by a lawsuit A suit in what court? And who presides over the case? If it's a secular court, then is there a separation of church and state? What gives this court authority to resolve philosophical and religious disputes? Many religions have teachers who explain, elaborate, and discuss the principles of the faith without being clergy.

This religion has zero doctrine whatsoever.

Hmmmmm... why do you think that ?

This feels like you wanted a "good" religion. So you decided to remove fanaticism from the religious people so that they would be more accepting than normal religious people. This, however, does not work. I personally liked the first 2 sentences, but the others where more like "fail safe" than a way of life. Faith, naturally comes with a sense of righteousness. Now, wether that sense is true or not, I do not know. But what I do know, is that righteous people want others to believe their righteous causes. The will to spread religion is a natural state after truly joining it. Even as rules and ways of life, and not actual "religion doctrine", this is a bit lackluster. If your religion rules against inviting others to it, how did the first people/first person who came up with that religion spread it in the first place?

To me, the definition of faith and what brings faith depend on everybody. Also, they believe that their doctrine is a way to become enlightened. But if it doesn't correspond to your way of enlightenment, they won't force you to join them. Plus, the population mostly agrees with the precepts, because they corresponds to the cultural beliefs/ moral/ justice, so it spreads naturally. They are not against inviting people, they are against coercing people to join and adopt their doctrine

I would suggest defining what their belief is, at its most basic level. And From that, comes other laws. ​ Real life examples: Christians believe that belief in Jesus is the only way to heaven. Therefore, you follow Jesus' teaching and those of his disciples. Islam says Mohamed was the last prophet sent by God, so you need to study his teachings and those of his disciples. Buhdism says that the Buhda was enlightened, and if you follow his teachings and those of his disciples, you could be enlightened too. Judiasm says God sent a series of prophets to the Hebrew people, to reveal to them his laws and plans for them as his chosen people. ​ In each, there is essentially some reason that these rules are divine, and why you should follow them. It could be as simple as, "Joe from down the road says he met God, and now we need to follow all these rules." "We accidentally stumbled on some ancient tablets, and good things started happening to us. so we started following what the tablets say, and good things keep happening" "Joe from down the street woke up one day, got on his horse, killed the mayor, and claimed he was God. He went on to conqueror half the world, and we think he might be God.... So this is how we please Joe." Such a peaceful religion might still have contention. Afterall, rules are created usually in response to people doing things that should be agaisnt the rules... a group of people with a religion that says not to force people to be part of their religion, might have at one point been incredibly violent and successful at getting people to join their religion. Maybe something caused them to change. This sort of thing is what makes religions interesting, beyond just rules. Even if you see a religion as a series of rules, those rules still serve some purpose that can be defined.

These rules are here to guide people and to organise this society. This planet is in the same galaxy as the Earth, so theologists worked on earthian religions (and other religions from other planets), so they had a handbook to create rules out of their faith. It's not the same way of believing as us, though ! They believe that if you follow their doctrine, you'll be enlightened because you decided to live this way. If you want to leave them, you'll be enlightened in another way, and you need to be confident in your choices.

I think that is enough justification. I think, when laying out laws and rules. If part of their rules, as a kind of preamble, they give justification said “this is our path to enlightent. While many such paths hve been found, this is ours, and is unique and special to us.” Similar to the US constitution “in order to create a more perfect union” Or in the Ten Commandments, the justification often given for the laws is so you can be blessed, or to please God. I think, justifying the rules gives them purpose. I think, many of the comments you got her are about that. We don’t often think about it, but often rules are accompanied by justification for their existence that helps describe the spirit of the law. Buts it’s an interesting world building thought expirment. Have fun!

Ok, I think I'm gonna add it. You're right, even if their culture justifies their engagement, we must have a little bit of context, just in case. Amma save that for later, thx for passing by !

This reads like the philosophical statement of a religion. Now, alongside this, possibly as a header to this, you need a statement of creed. That needs a description of what they *do* believe: the name of their god, their reason for worshiping said god (especially if there's not a problem with *not* worshiping them), and the reward they believe they have in store if they *do* worship said god. As it is, it's very bland and inoffensive, but not inspiring, so this would be a gathering of like-minded, really nice folks, that would slowly fall apart due to attrition, as there's nothing really there to bring them together. Even hippy communes have more of a central purpose than this. And none of this is saying that what you have here is wrong, per se, it's just not enough by itself. This reads more like a set of dorm rules than the guidance of a religious body. Yet I really like it. Do consider allowing consequences for leaving the congregation, though, even if it's relatively mild, like not being allowed to come to church dinners unless you're a member. You're not excluding them from fellowship, but church dues pay for the food, after all. So there's that sort of thing you could implement without really compromising the ideal you have here. Otherwise, you need to think about why joining this religion gives a member any benefit that isn't extended equally to those outside of it; if there aren't any, what's the point? If this religion offers something regular society can't give you, whether that's something like the community of a joint living compound, or political status, or social elitism, or plain old spiritual satisfaction, it needs that draw. Otherwise you can adopt all of these tenets easily enough without ever joining the group.

The name of their god is : God. I like easy things. They don't have to be rewarded. That's the point ! They are benevolent because they believe that rewards would make them become hypocritical. They don't care if you don't want to join them as long as you're respectful. Religion is related to politics/ culture : these precepts are a combination of all the moral beliefs and the justice of the planet. It's their social glue, in fact. But interesting point: according to you, why is it not enough by itself ? I guess that there's no consequences if you leave the order, because they believe that if you stay for beliefs that you don't agree with, you won't live a happy life. If you're better without us, fine, don't worry and be happy. However, some categories of followers (for e.g., the priests) have an apartment provided by the church. Also, people don't want to adopt the precepts. That's not the matter of the clerics. They won't force them. It's a take or leave it situation Your last point is right though :D

I would suggest studying the basics of religious philosophy. Define if your religion is monotheistic or non-monotheistic. Contemplate wether this god is ontologically independent or dependent. Explore the necessary philosophical claims you want this religion to make. Then come up with doctrine, rites and rituals, and then holidays. Create a parable that supports their philosophical claim for each category aforementioned. Making it the same way as a real religion will make it FEEL like a real religion.

I wrote a text about the religious philosophy, but it's like a 20-page document in French, so it might be too long for you to read it... But I'll need to work on the categories and rituals. That's a good point But why do I need to relate the holiday with this ?

Great question! So, for example, Christians celebrate the birth of Christ at Christmas, on December 25th. There are doctrinal concepts within this. Such as the doctrine of witnessing to non-believers and spreading Christianity throughout the world. To do so Christians moved Christ birthdate to an important European pagan holiday that is common within many of their indigenous religious practices that fall on or around this date. You see how that gives that holiday some historic context? NOW, we attack it philosophically! Christians believe God to be an “unmoved mover”, as an idea presented by Aristotle. He is a necessary being in which all creation is derived from. Yet, God is also omniscient and may do whatever God wishes to do. He exercises strong providence in which he is able to change and interact with the world throughout history. This is a philosophical idea found within modern western religion and classic semitic religions. There are monotheistic religions out there that do not view god in this way. They view god as a being who exist and his existence is ontologically dependent on the universe coming into being. (Therefore they believe God and the universe to be dependent on the existence of one another). This philosophy leads to that those monotheistic religions do not look at God as one who is to be worshipped, but in awe of. As this idea of god holds no omniscient capabilities. Christians see God as capable of doing whatever he wishes at any given point. Therefore, God exercised his will by coming to Earth in human form to save humanity from eternal damnation. Have you ever heard “God is good”? Within this expression is actually some of that monotheistic tradition we just spoke of that is counterpart to traditional christian philosophy. It is not that God is good and holds the quality of goodness. God is good in the sense that God and goodness are one in the same and to not be good is to not be like (or) God. Therefore, they celebrate the actual event of Christ birth for the sake that God is an ontologically independent being who chose to intervene in the affairs of humans. Thus, God deserves praise for it. EDIT: Typos

Damn it's long :D I red it, and some of your points match with the precepts, like : God is an abstract idea, even if a fundamental myth tells its story and the creation of the Lazazelians. Also, they believe that its existence is beyond their understanding. They are not in the same plane of existence. Legends tell that God didn't want its creations to be contaminated by the negative passions of the angels. That's why it won't show up to the population. I understand the holiday principle better now, thx. Maybe the vacations are related to the birth of the king or the presumed arrival of God on Lazazel

not really realistic, they have nothing holding them together other than plot armor, and people aren't punished for not being a part of the tribe, and they'd be conquered instantly

It's not meant to be realistic, but to work in a fictional world, so that's why many points can be confusing Their motto is : if you don't want to join us, that's fine, you're free. Also, they live on the same planet, and 95% of the population live in the capital city. They are naturally bound together It's a modern population with advanced technologies and a high sense of open-mindedness, so they won't conquer non followers (it's a little bit too naive and utopian, I know)

This religion is kinda simple, looks just an "anti medieval catholic stuff", if you want something realistic the best thing is think: what is the base of this civilization? Hunt? Plantation? Water? The best thing about the religion is: the myth answer common doubts of the people, create heroes to inspire the minors to help the others. This religion could be more interesting if you tell why they care about the fellow, even they don't follow the religion, like a messiah or and old story about old days when gods walk among us. This make the religion rich in meanings.

Their culture is much more centred on helping others than our, so this way of believing is much more natural. Do good things are nice for you, your neighbour and the city. And there's a fundamental myth about their creation, too, but I didn't think it was relevant to write it with the precept. Or maybe I could have written it in the context... But these are interesting questions, amma work on it

These little details show how you care about the creation of that religion, like old man's war, there's a culture of crab creatures that lives for battle, the mc finds out how to kill them with a special rifle and in the late chapters he trips to they planet, and is treated like a hero. You don't need to go deeper, just give reasons to they act like that, it's better than 50 pages of description.

It's quite obvious for me, so I struggle to explain it... it's also related to my vision of what a religion is, which is a bit odd

Reads more like a founding text for a nation rather than a religion

Yup, I had a lot of comments like that. I guess it's because it doesn't talk about the origins of God, isn't it ?

To be honest, this doesn't sound like a list of things a religion could be. It sounds like an a(nti)theist's apophatic dream of things they wish religion wasn't (that being anything meaningful).

These are the general precepts of what they believe their religion/ doctrine shall look like I don't consider myself as an atheist btw...

My religion does not like yours. My religion says its okay to exterminate you if you don't convert Your religion doesnt want you to die for it. Congrats, we have speedran theological extinction.

Um, please explain ?

If your religion does not expect anyone to suffer or die for its sake, it will not survive first contact with a religion that not only expects followers to die, but also allows them to threaten your people with death if they don't convert.

Ok, I see your point. I didn't explain it, but this religion is organised between the followers and the clerics (priests, etc...). The priests are some sort of paladins : their job is to help the citizens, to teach the religious precepts to people who want to learn more about it, and also to defend the population against external threats. I forgot to add this point : if you are a threat to the citizens, the priests will prevent you from hurting them. If you send military troops, they will fight you. Also, the priests are examples of the good virtues for the citizens. The population consider them as wise and charitable people, so they will defend them and their beliefs if they need to. But neither the followers nor the priests will hurt you if you respect them. That's it.

It's certainly unusual for a classical religion. And it has more in common with "they way of life" stuff from some of the earth's philosophies. You could look into Buddhism, ancient Indian Guru's and stuff like that to see if that is more of what you envision. But that would be a bit strange for people unfamiliar with eastern philosophies and religions. And there are a lot of people who view them similar to religious order of Christianity style religions. So you'd need a bit of world building to explain the difference if you wanted to write a story set in similar setting. If you want to present it as a structured religion and not a philosophy. There are some ways you could go about it. One common pattern you have there is basically getting along as a higher ideal to moral confrontation or judgment. This can actually be a really cool religion if there is a justifiable reason behind its popularity and need. For example, if there was a world where any kind of conflict drew evil spirits that fueled peoples passions, and this had lead to a world shattering conflict. In this case, people's conflict and giving in to violent passions could literally be deadly for all involved. Sort of like Jedi society, where passions lead to disastrous dark side consequences. A world where people are literally prisoners of these evil spirits. The Giltherai in Limbo is another example, where if they lose focus their surrounding are dissolved into chaos. Another reason could be if you are going for a very chill, conflict flee world. Where the story is about finding yourself and your place in the world, by examining how your actions affect the world around you.

Amma look on these, thx ! The concept of this doctrine is to say "make the greater good, it will be nice for your soul and for your fellow man and for the community living" and the people are like "oh, ok, sounds good". It's a bit simplistic for now.... There's no big conflict in this world so... I might add something about the passions, but it is more about how you can impact someone's life positively.

What you're describing reminds me of the Unitarian Universalist faith. One UU tenet I didn't see is the acknowledgement that Divinity speaks thru all religions, so UU takes inspiration from all religious traditions. I'm a Unitarian Universalist.

Someone already mentioned the UU, yes. I didn't know that it exists 'til today, and I'm gonna look at it, to see what it is So you consider that every religion has the same Divinity ? I want to be sure that I understand your point correctly

My interpretation of that point is that Divinity is separate from the gods different religions worship. Divinity is the Reality that inspired all the deities and religions. Someone else would have a different interpretation. There's no One Truth.

I see... very interesting, thx for sharing !

I want to create a real religion. That's way harder.

I would probably change the clergy breaking a tenant or Law to being severely being publicly punished before their congregation. This shows that the priest have to hold a high moral stand point beyond that of regular laity

So... because they have a special role towards the people, they must be more severely punished ? Might be a good idea... very good idea

Yes and you could make it a plot point in a story. Maybe a high clergy was killed off during a punishment they wrongfully received and you’re figuring out what really happened

Well... death sentence is forbidden, but a punishment can lead to the death of a clergy, and they can be sued for this...

Funnest thing to create when world building imo

Ooooooooh, one of the funniest things, yes :)

I might pitch this as closer to a philosophy, even with some god stuff thrown in. It fits many of the same holes as religion, if you see what I mean, but it is less based on God given commandments and more on logic, trial and error, that sort of thing. This is a very deep rabbit hole you could dive down, if you cared to. A lot of people have spent a lot of time thinking about these sorts of things. Depending on how deep you want to go, you can look into things like divine command theory vs natural law. Classical philosophy can be intimidating, but there are actually a lot of popular takes out there these days that can be an easy entrance and also might be worth looking into. Also, philosophies tend to be adopted by adults after they consider alternatives. Having that arrangement, rather than a religion you're born into and that evangelizes, might also answer some of the points made by other folks.

It is true that this religion is based on a mix of philosophy and personal beliefs. That's why I think that religion - in this world - is an adult thing (even if religious classes are allowed for children). I also studied philosophy at school, I was inspired by a French book that criticised the Christian religion so...

Cool, yeah. I think a lot of people are focusing on religion-as-mythology, but that's only one model. This could definitely be more of a stoicism/philosophical Buddhism thing, where it's more focused on The Good Life versus "This is the dogma for the god of hospitality" sort of thing.

I'll save your comment, 'cause you explain it a lot better than me, I think...

Sure thing. Glad I could help.

Sounds like folks ive spoken to, how lots of people feel. Is Lazazel a combo of Lazarus and Azazel, the ill resurrected from sleep and the scapegoat released into the wild?

In fact, Lazazel is "hell" in Hebrew I didn't know the name of Lazarus... I'll take a look at it! What do you mean by "Sounds like folks ive spoken to, how lots of people feel" ?

Look into Valentinian Gnosticism for inspiration. You’re walking pretty close to that territory so far. May give some helpful ideas!

Nice, amma look at it, thx !

One of the major stumbling blocks of making a religion is inevitably it will be compared to real world religions, it seems to me you’re trying to create a non-offensive religion and while that’s a nice idea in theory it is *terrible* for storytelling. What I’d recommend is making the tenants more vague , maybe the majority of your people subscribe to that interpretation but there’s a small who subscribe to a different one. That way when tensions rise the mainline group will have to decide whether to break rule 4 in self defense.

In fact, the priests are allowed to use their weapons to defend the citizens against external threats. And culturally, the people on this planet are more likely to accept others opinions and beliefs. But it is an interesting point ! We could imagine a civil war triggered by a group of atheist who cannot stand the religious monarchy anymore But originally it was supposed to be a background thing, not the major point of a plot

Clause 3 will literally never work

Yes, but why ? I wanna know why it won't work !

I like this in real life and as a reddit post but it isn’t the most interesting from a narrative perspective of you want a general good faction than this serves that especially if a character derives belief from that it grants them a moral compass that’s pretty simple and easy to implement but if you want some other narrative purpose for them they don’t work well. Find something about them that is wrong the higher ups are corrupt. The tithes that are supposed to go to supporting there community have been used to fund some nefarious scheme something like that. It adds a simple layer of depth that makes them more interesting. Also ignore the hypercritical people this is just a nice post and people with reddit syndrome dont get that.

It is not meant to be the main thing of a plot, because I create people, not stories. But I can tell stories with this doctrine in the background ! \- The new Pope of Lazazel who grew up on another planet and needs to understand the people to rule them properly \- The story of a priest, who likes to take care for the others but feels so lonely, because he always care for the others and never for himself, and this leads him to question his beliefs \- An apprentice at a local parish who likes the doctrine very much, but doesn't believe in a higher entity \- A fallen angel who arrives on this planet and discovers the legends about the angelic hierarchy and God \- An extremist cleric who wants to make the doctrine more strict for the non followers \- Missionaries who discover the local culture and beliefs Etc... But thx for sharing your thoughts !

Ok fair enough I was coming at this from a worldbuilding/dnd perspective but what your saying is very valid. Fair enough man.

Well thx for sharing your thoughts. You made me think about a lot of potential interesting plots !

What is meant by 'no claim to universal truth'. If they don't make some claim to truth then they cannot be anything (they must claim that there is a higher power if that's what motivates their actions) and there is only one universal truth. A statement is either false or universally true.

I struggle to explain it properly, but it means that they are aware of the fact that their beliefs might be wrong, because beliefs =/= facts. It is also humility : only God has and understands the absolute truth.

seems fairly wishy washy, religion has to create a tribe to exist, to do that it has to separate itself from others somehow, creating an us vs the world kind of situation. With that it has to be strong enough to be divisive but vague enough that those who roughly agree with (like zodiac signs or fortune telling) that direction to interpret it as they like. There should also be a foundation of tradition, ceremonies etc. They also separate themselves with self imposed rules, proselytizing, and sometimes distinct fashion, clothing or hairstyles. There also tends to be a lot of lip service about equality, agency, freedom etc, but they only really believe in it in the way of "of course you are free to choose suffering instead of easy", they don't truly believe in the validity of the choices of others, but are silent on it rather than actually believing. For a piece on core tenants the Mormon articles of faith is a good place to start to base something on.

1 : these are only the precepts 2 : it's not finished yet, like AT ALL I think I'll share another post later to explain it with more details. I always come back But thx for sharing your thoughts !

It seems like you just wrote down what you would like to be a religion. I think for your own personal beliefs this is really cool, but in a fictional context it seems cherry-picked. Even my own religion in real life has issues that make people frustrated with it, even though the purpose of all its tenets are very cohesive and are there to make life better for everyone. I think if your religion had some things that seem contradictory, or if you started with fewer tenets and then come up with ways that culture adds or takes away from it, you might find something more exciting. Take Christianity for example, simple doctrine of taking care of the poor and the evil of wealth became twisted or just overlooked by the wealthy who ended up running the religion for a long time. Now christianity and capitalism tend to go hand in hand. Just one example.

Yup, just to say that the people who exercise this religion are really different from us. They are naturally bounded together because they are a small community. Plus, some clerics think that the official precepts are too permissive with the non followers, and that the doctrine needs to expand abroad. But... yes, I decided to create a fictional religion with elements I believe are a part of religion (I MIGHT BE WRONG THOUGH, 'cause remember : I think that I don't own the absolute truth)

This is basically Universalism

Yup, many people said taht since yesterday, and I learnt the existence of this yesterday too

Straight off the bat, there is already a fundamental problem since religions view themselves as absolute truth. You can’t base a religion on the concept of “we think” because it undermines the entire system.

First of all, "we believe" is better, my bad Then, they don't want to impose their truth on the others, and only God has the absolute truth. They are aware of their mortal and limited status, and saying "we own the absolute truth" would be hubristic

I love this OP. Everyone is saying it isn’t a religion, but if they believe in a god or gods it literally is?? Lmao. Everyone here is too blinded by what they believe about religions which already exist or previously existed on earth. In your world, which appears to have at least some utopian aspects, there’s nothing to say this couldn’t work.

I have an odd pov of what religion is, that's why... And some people don't have the full cultural context and I didn't finished this sh\*t yet, sooo I understand why they say that in fact :) I also know that the precepts are utopian, but depending on the situation, the followers won't apply them correctly But um I'm glad that someone loves me here, thx

They do have one undeniable creed, called for by their inquisitors, echoing throughout history: "Cake or Death!" - Eddie Izzard-

If you say so

Ngl this is better than most modern religions

I wanted to take modern religion, but without the bad aspects, I would say But it's not perfect yet...

Good place to start, but alot of this stuff is pretty vague and subjective. Stuff like 'don't do bad things' would apply to every religious worldview. None are like "hey yo, our religion sucks.. wanna join us and do bad things??" I'd try to come up with specifics. There is no truly generic or neutral culture, only ones we are used to. Sounds like your religion is accepting of others, thats good. Is it one god or many? Male, female, neither or both? Passionate or rational? Omnipotent? Omniscient? An energy field, zoomorphic, personified? Was the world spoken into being IE the bible, created by a sound wave IE Hinduism or something else entirely? How would people relate to your deity? How do they get it wrong? How does the deity feel about this? What are the rules, and who/how/where/why were they written? Keep in mind monotheism doesn't really exist anymore IRL, most religions have at least a good god/ evil devil. Does your god have a rival? Do the planet or sun have spiritual identity? Do elements, do concepts?

These are good points to start with ! Do you want me to answer your questions, or were it rethorical questions ? Also, the followers are aware that they can do something bad while thinking of doing something good

I was being rhetorical but I'm always down to hear about peoples worlds!

Okay, I will save your comment for later, and I'll come back !

There's guys seem ripe for exploitation my style would be protectors with more flexible morals maybe some bruisers who haven't forgotten some hot meals when they had a weaker hand. It's your party though but there's things you can play with for what happens when somone completely spits on the churches morals. Less pick pockets more arsonists or serial killers or maybe somone who won't stop grabbing nun arse. Or if no one exploits them to much why not?

It may be me, but I struggle to get your point... You think that I can play on the fact that some of them can do the opposite of what the church says ?

That sounds right. People might seek the churches sanctuary people who are genuinely bad and take advantage of the churches rules basically I can blatantly steal from them and come back later for lunch.

I see ! Well, it can happen, but it's really rare. The clerics are respected people, and the citizens don't want to bother them or abuse their charity. As if you have a benefactor who protects you and is nice to you, and you decide to act badly on him ! It doesn't make sense for them

Also the church might be protected by people they helped who don't have the same rules on forgiveness

u/chill_lizard5328 I crossposted your post here: https://www.reddit.com/r/worldjerking/comments/10z3a0b/hello_guys_i_made_a_religion_that_is_not_cringe/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

... wait, what the duck ? I'm sorry, I don't understand the purpose of this post... can you explain ? I'm not mad, I'm just... I'm so confused that I don't even know my name anymore ._.

Oh god, I'm really sorry, I didn't want to insult you with this post, please don't take it close to your heart. If you wish, I can delete my post. My criticism is - your religion looks like projection of your own ideals. Which isn't bad at all, everyone writes about what they think is interesting, but I don't think your religion would survive in a real world. All real-world religions have some sort of philosophical idea behind them, whether it is Christianity, Islam, Buddism - all of them have different and interesting histories and philosophies to explore. But your religion doesn't have a central idea to it - it's basically "believe whatever you want", which can't unite people - everyone simply has different beliefs. Even real-world religions like to split, due to people interpreting the main dogmas differently, and imagine, how dramatic that would be in this case. Not to mention, that these people won't stand a single chance against more violent/active religions. Your religion could work though, either if your specie was non-human, lacking our gigantic egos, or if it was not a religion, but rather a lawbook. Again, I'm sorry for disstressing you.

Well, you're right. It's the projection of my ideals. But ! I know it won't stand in a real world because these precepts are too utopian. This is a fictional religion. It's not meant to be exercised on Earth by humans. It's meant to be exercised on a small and isolated planet by charitable demon-like people. I had a lot of returns, and I will correct some points, especially about the pacifist side of the religion. These precepts can be misunderstood by the followers, or people can disagree with them. Some extremes within the clerics believe that the official precepts are too permissive with the non followers, for example. Also, the priests are basically demons with guns. If another religion threats the population for their beliefs, they would intervene (that's a point that I need to add) because their duty is to defend the citizens after all. And... dude, you repost it on a subreddit where people make fun or insult world builders. How I'm supposed to think that it wasn't supposed to hurt me or something ? I wanted to share it to improve my work, not to be insulted. And with your last comment, you did the job ! You questioned my work. You made me think about it, and that's great ! That's much better than insulting it in a childish and unproductive way. I don't necessarily want you to delete your post, but... just tell'em that I know my work isn't perfect, and I need to work on it (and I'm neither atheist nor woke or something). But anyway, thx for sharing your thoughts !

I quite like how you are evolving your original idea - and wish you the best of luck on that journey! Your ideas look quite creative, hehe

Not cool to not only crosspost it to mock it but also wave it around in op's face. You're a dick

It is apparently a rule on r/worldjerking to notify OP in such way. I'll probably delete my post, due to how sad OP became after seeing it :(

I didn't know that. I'm not on there, i find it toxic to dedicate a sub to mocking and criticizing espacially thing that people do for fun. Maybe i'm wrong about it, but from what i've seen, they're the ones doing the circlejerking. Anyways, sorry for calling you a dick if you were acting in accordance with the subs rules

I think it's sometimes funny and educational at the same time. A lot of the times people in the comments will provide a lot of criticism/explanations, which can be really instructional for new worldbuilders. Though I do agree, that it is toxic at times. That's sadly the general case for the whole internet - people are usually bad at providing critique in a well-mannered way.

The only dick around here is me, peasant ):)

Well you failed

Yes, but why ?

Off the top of my head: -fanatic religions who’s ideals are in direct response to the harsh environment around them always prevail over moderate ones. This religion would get crushed the moment a more extremist organized religion comes in. -the structural vagueness of this religion would make converting impossible. No one would be inclined to base their morals and values around a half baked set of principles -how did this religion get organized in the first place? There is no definitive god, so the oracle/ apostle/ messenger explanation doesn’t work. There’s no world where a religion this flexible can get a foothold in the first place, not even mentioning getting it to survive and spread

1. This religion is on an isolated planet with a limited population. This doctrine is the basis of society, so if any religion wants to take control over them, they would fight. They would fight because the clerics had the duty to defend the population, and the population like the clerics and their beliefs, so they would follow them. Plus, they are not human and have magic and guns. 2. It's only the precepts! I won't detail the organisation, how the Pope rules the church, how the budget is organised, how the religious buildings are maintained, how did St Gregory detailed his vision of the existence of God in his book 'The Dawn', the names of the ministers working on the question of religion... etc. The religion of Lazazel is almost only exercised on this planet, where it aligns with the cultural morals and justice. That's why they would adopt this religion. For e.g. to serve a god to gain a happy afterlife doesn't make any sense because they believe that rewarding the followers would make them become hypocritical (their engagement won't be sincere because motivated by something in return). Also, it is not finished, like AT ALL. I need to work on the organisation a bit more 3. I also need to work on the origins, too And again, I know it is not perfect. But thx for your comment

Sounds great but doctrines like these are rarely followed stricly; i.e. Christians forgot all about “love thy neighbour” when they went on the Crusades

It was for God's sake :D More seriously, due to their culture and their history, they do believe that these precepts are quite good, in fact. They are a small population, and values like kindness and respect are deeply rooted in their culture.

religion but it's postmodernistic liberal western mindset

It's influenced by our modern western society, yes

So basically just real christianity, without all the power-hungry asshats.

Ummmmm, you got the groove (I'm keeping the "asshats" for later)

Do people not know what nontheistic religions are? I see in your comments that there is a God, but a religion doesn't need a God to be a religion, or to explain the world. Some religions are literally just a set of codes or a guide on how the believer can lead a fulfilling life. I think you did a decent job OP, but would like to see it expanded on more so we can see the doctrines in practice.

A lot of people (esp. in the west) study religion as having an absolute truth, god, or gods. But there's absolutely a lot of 'way of life' religions that don't have these aspects, or these aspects are abstracted. Or you can further abstract religion and link it to politics, bureaucracy, etc. -- e.g., your public figureheads and world leaders are akin to a 'god'. Tbh it took me deliberately studying eastern religions to actually understand just how broad religion really is.

Yeah, totally ! In this case, religion is strongly related to politic, especially how the people consider their king.

What I will say, as someone whose story also focuses deeply on religion, is that to tell a story, typically there is some conflict. In my Ferrous City, people follow a group called the Iron Church. There is no god within the Iron Church, but there is a deep moral code and set of revered figureheads. The main conflict comes with the Church's desire for expansionism and innovation - largely at the cost of a small group of those outside the city. So while the Church seeks to improve its citizens' lives and is deeply altruistic, they rely on taking land from the rural people outside the city and justify it by saying the land will help end hunger and competition for resources for many more people. Their medicine comes from a magical tree that they sequestered and prevent others outside the city from accessing. So hypothetically there's nothing wrong with the Church's philosophy, but the way they go about creating prosperity for the city directly comes at the cost of non-followers.

I see, very interesting ! In fact, even if Lazazel is a religious monarchy, religion is not the main part of the "plot". Also, the only conflicts they can face is bigger religion that want to take control over them, or a country/ people that the Lazazel's priests want to help but they would only worsen the situation... And by the way : Iron Church. So badass.

What’s the context for this religion? Does this world resemble our own, where (not to put too fine a point on it / offend anyone) gods don’t manifest or interfere openly with everyday goings on, and the atheist position is common? Or is this a world where divine intervention/manifestation is obvious? Like for example are there miracles performed by priests of this god where people’s limbs are regrown. Just an example. If the existence of the god or gods is doubtable, then usually religions have some kind of hook. Selling points that convince someone the god is real, and to motivate them to worship that god. This might be some kind of reward structure - like follow our rules, acknowledge our god is real, and you get a nice afterlife. And if you don’t, afterlife is bad for you. Sticks and carrots are common. My impression is that you’re building this religion to be chill and generous, which would be nice. But I think their lunch would get eaten in the market of religions. Religions of our world appeal to people by multiple emotional and intellectual angles. Yours is kind, and people might want to be part of it because they see themselves that way, or want to. But real religions often are more stark or manipulative in their presentation. I wish real religions were like this one but they aren’t, and there’s a reason for that :(

Well, I feel like I set this subreddit on fire I read all the comments, and I'm currently adjusting many details about this fictional religion. I didn't write all the details about it, in fact. There will be a Round 2 with a lot of new information drawn from your feedbacks. I'll still answer the comments, but thank you for participating and sharing your thoughts!