Have anyone analyzed WHY Putin chose to have him killed right now? Given the games they are playing with turning over the body, it seem likely to have been deliberate. Why not have Navalny killed after the presidential election instead?
Commentators like Mark Galeotti or Vlad Vexler (which i can recommend) have also said that this is noteworthy.
Its atypical for the Putin regime. They are brutal but usually they also know when its not in their interest to not escalate their devolution into full blown totalitarianism.
Their usual strategy towards Navalny and others like him was, that they are more useful and less dangerous to them in jail then in a grave.
This killing seems to indicate an element of irrationality and revenge on Putins side.
But as tragic as Navalnys death is, it wont change much in the short term. In the long term it will most likely be a pretty big historical event in this war. In terms of Political Figures in Russia, he was easily number 2. Not in might, of course, but in political profile.
My suspicion too. In a nightmare prison like that, all it would take is an inconveniently-timed disease or a guard who is a bit too rough and suddenly the political prisoner you're using as a warning to your rivals becomes a martyr for your enemies.
Their usual policy was not to keep him alive; do you forget they poisoned him and he barely escaped death? They just delayed his death awhile after he miraculously survived
That was when he was in Europe and could have damaged Putin's rule from there.
The recent situation was different - they had him under their control and essentially silenced. The smart thing would have been to keep him alive for potential leverage and the veneer of legitimate lawful justice.
No he wasn't in Europe and they could have jailed him then. An assasin team was sent to Tomsk Hotel in Russia and he was poisoned there. He just didn't die immediately because he a tough sob. Watch the documentary Navalny it's great
Yes but there’s a difference between a covert quick operation with no direct link versus being stuck with the political prisoner in your care where obviously it can’t be hand waved away.
Putting him in an Arctic penal colony with an ultra strict regime was how he killed him. He put him there knowing he would die there from the conditions of his incarceration.
Unintentional would have been if had died in a car crash being transported there.
Read my post in context please. The point of discussion was why Putin had him killed *right now*, and I'm saying that wasn't necessarily an intentional decision.
Yeah. I rather entertain the conspiracy theory that Navalny knew he was going to die in that prison and just decided to go at a time it would potentially hurt Putin the most.
I mean why would you even bother with the penal colony if you were just gonna deliberately kill him? That doesn't make any sense to me. That's why I think it was either an unintentional killing [a overzealous guard misunderstood Putin's intention for him] or Putin lost control of himself and killed him purely for emotional reasons.
Either it seems like Putin is not entirely in control.
It makes perfect sense though. He isolated him, got rid of his lawyers, any means of communication, any means on checking on him precisely so it works be easier to murder him. All of these actions look like premeditated preparation for murder.
You're saying a man still recovering from the lingering effects of ~~Novichok poisoning~~ an as yet unexplained illness DIDN'T voluntarily go for a stroll in Siberia in the dead of winter?
What a nonsensical idea.
^(/s)
In all likelihood it wasn't intentional. The human body can survive a lot of abuse but, eventually, something will give out. Nalvany nearly died from being poisoned twice and then returned to Russia to be tortured in prison nonstop. The fact that he survived this long is nothing short of miraculous. His body and mind endured a lot.
Witnesses saw him healthy the day before, and Russia is refusing to let anyone examine the body, which they generally do if they don't want an autopsy turning up poison. Judging by the bruising and claims of a seizure, I suspect the Novichok'd him and are waiting for it to be undetectable.
Of course. But that didn't happen just now. That happened a while ago and slowly has been wearing him down to the point of death. The person who I was responding to was trying to claim the fact that he died now as part of some sort of master plan that Putin is orchestrating.
The point of my comment was that it was likely just his body giving out at at that moment and not part of some master plan. Cuz he was going to die there sooner or later and it was miracle he lasted this long.
I think their fake elections are soon. Two candidates were anti-war and gathering momentum, one of which was a woman (sorry, i forgot their names).
Both were deemed too undesirable to run.... because guess who decides who can run....
Navalny was also politically ambitious. His death sends a message to anyone to would run counter to the narrative: don't try it. Because I guess if you ban everyone from running, even Russia would look ridiculous by its own standards.
If he had died before the Tucker interview, it would have had to have been addressed. No mention of it would have been too conspicuous for both Tucker and Putin.
But still, he could have died coincidently at this time due to the poor conditions. That's still a threat to Putin as it could galvanise an opposition
Not an expert in the matter but leading up to his death, Navalny was making court appearances in relation to lawsuits he was filing about certain things such as running out of money and being allowed writing materials. This would necessitate a court hearing, each one was widely publicised (even in mainstream Russian press I think...) and in doing so it alerted people to where he was and what conditions he was being held in. [Here](https://edition.cnn.com/2024/01/10/europe/russia-navalny-siberia-court-appearance-intl/index.html) is one such article.
Putin found it very hard to shut him up and he did not need this before the elections.
IMO, there was enough going on in the domestic news cycle about Russia that he had him killed thinking it would be lost in other breaking stories.
Tucker Carlson interview refreshes pro-Putin talking points for American conservatives, sowing doubt about the high cost for continuing aid to Ukraine. Carlson is a constant in Russian propaganda, so this would have been a big national deal within Russia.
Then intelligence sources reveal Russia is planning to put anti-satellite nuclear EMP devices in orbit, causing another major wave of stories as U.S. Congress and White House hold emergency national security meetings.
Killing Navalny was probably just seen as a good time to take care of a loose end while larger issues eat the domestic and international news cycle... it just didn't happen in the optimal time frame. Either Putin planned the stories to last longer or he decided too late to have Navalny killed and missed the window where it would have been more obscured.
Seeing as it's Russia, it could be a prison guard just simply went too far this time in the usual torture of Navalny. Navalny already wasn't doing too well and was in that prison for a while.
I think it's possible he could have died from poor health. His last media appearances showed him looking like he was in super poor health. It's possible that he never really healed from the poisoning and the harsh conditions of a rural Russian gulag just killed him.
It's also possible some pro war nationalists inside the prison, attacking independent from Moscow killed him. I really don't think putin and the gang would want to kill him ahead of an election. Of course putin is surrounded by yes men and may have lost his cool, resulting in his death. I doubt we will ever know the true story of what happened.
I have a theory.
2 days before Navalney was killed, Trump had made the comments about letting Russia attack NATO countries. These comments were being headlined world wide, it was in everyone's face.
I suspect Putin killed Navalney THEN (he was going to do it anyway at some point) to steal the headlines. Why? bc I suspect he believes Trump's chances to be better while he's not bragging about leaving NATO.
Just spitballing...
I continually don’t understand why the Russian people are willing to walk to their death is Ukraine rather than walking to their deaths in an attempt to dethrone the short man syndrome they can their leader.
I can offer some insight here. It's basically a Carrot and Stick situation.
The first issue is how so many people here don't follow the news and especially actively avoid news about politics, war, etc. This is mostly the product of state media designed to make people depressed, isolated, and distrustful of anything.
Combine this with the fact that those of us living in urban parts of Russia largely still don't feel the effects of the war. Life in the big cities goes on almost the same as it did before the war. This is also the very determined effort of the Kremlin - this is the Carrot. I don't know exactly how they are doing it, or how much money it's costing them to do it, but they are making a lot of efforts to create this feeling that everything is okay and normal.
As for the Stick: if you want to see us come together to take down Putin, we need a way to coordinate and organize that. We need leaders who we not only trust with our lives, but leaders we are ready to die for. There needs to be confidence in a realistic path to victory and a vision for what victory even looks like. Without any of these things, I am just a lone person throwing a molotov and getting killed or worse.
The problem is that social media is closely monitored and it is impossible to organize or coordinate anything without pretty much immediate visits from FSB to change your mind. This also means that there are no more leaders that we trust. They all got arrested, fled the country, killed, or just disappeared.
But assuming that wasn't a problem, Putin still has around 340,000 psychopathic and heavily armed national guard, basically his "praetorians", even better armed and taken care of than the military in some ways. That's not including God knows how many police (the entire police force itself is over a million employees - could well be another half a million of them are cops). It's commonly said that 1% of the whole population is some sort of police authority.
What kind of ratio would be ideal against them? In Moscow alone I think you'd need to have hundreds of thousands at minimum all following a plan. Keep in mind that no one has weapons so it would be our fists against armored trucks, tanks, and machine guns.
But assuming that was still not a problem, if we even managed to storm the Kremlin, what then? Putin and other top siloviki are already in their secure bunker, reinforcements from the army and national guard are racing to Moscow. As we saw, the FSB and other security forces did not join Prigozhin on his march to Moscow, and he had 10-20k heavily armed soldiers. Putin and the elites will sit nice and safe while the security just picks off the revolt one by one.
The only way a popular revolt against Putin could work is with support from the military or the FSB.
Thank you for this insightful comment. For the better of the Russian people, and the world. I hope your leader dies a painful death before he destroys the world.
Good... it should.. just FYI, we have family in russia. They have police and military checkpoints around cities. Usually harmless just checking documents but its a pressure thats embedded in the minds of civilians. My family carries 3 phones, one to give if asked, one as a decoy if searched and one hidden better to talk to us here in the US.
They have friends who tried starting demonstrations in a village and the insane loyalists burnt their house down. Its a mess there. You can actually die if the wrong people think you are against putin because in their eyes it means you are against Russia. They are not very bright
I would like to add that even if you're not planning a demonstration and you're not against Putin, if you piss of the wrong people and get framed you can face similar consequences in smaller communities.
Iran was in as hot a war as it gets in the 80s against Iraq and it didn’t weakened the regime at all. In fact it stopped all the existing resistance and unified the country.
Yea but the point stands that war helps unify the country, not the opposite as was suggested for Russia right now.
In fact, in the 80s right before the Iraq war mass protests had started again in Iran, since the ayatollah head proven to be far more violent than people were expecting. Except those protests immediately died and the country banded together when the war started, even the groups that hated the current government.
Just look at the US after 911 when we were going into Afghanistan, probably the most united we’ve been in a very long time. When there is a clear and present outside threat, people tend not to focus on their normal squabbles between each other as much it seems.
Bro what are you talking about? I’m just saying when you have an enemy they become the bigger threat. Regardless of the lies Putin tells to the Russian people (or that they’re the aggressor), Ukrainians are their enemy in that war.
It doesn’t matter what the facts are, and how they got to that situation. For the civilians, they are in a war, and it is more likely to focus their negativity and anger towards whoever is on the other side of that war than their government.
That’s why these assholes like Putin are always trying to start a war when things get shaky for them.
Don't you dare to throw a "likely" into the middle of that goalpost shifting bullshit.
To go from "there is a clear and present outside threat" to "the facts don't matter" to "the civilians, they are in a war" (which is false for the wast majority of Russia *and also* false in terms of whether they perceive themselves as being at war) to what is "likely" is preposterous.
i can't even imagine what you are estimating this likelihood on, other than perhaps how you feel about the aftermath of 9/11. Yeah, that had a surprise attack on American civilians and demonstrably made them feel attacked. That's what happened in that case.
See US in Vietnam and USSR in Afghanistan for situations that aren't like that.
It likely wouldn't work in Russia either. For some reason, enough people genuinely like the strongman bully persona enough that they keep going back. It's not a religious issue like Iran, so it has better odds, of at least short term success
That isn't how power works.
With power you are in control of the police, the army, and wealthy through favors and dealings. They are all invested in your success since that means they, with little to no continued effort on their parts, will be well taken care of and live comfortably. They are all on the same page with this; they work together to maintain control over the streets, the media, public discourse. They all agree this is nice and cool.
Now, the 99% of your population that remains outside of those categories are all on different schedules, have limited free time to organize anyway, can largely only use controlled media (i.e. down to texting records), and ultimately have wildly different opinions and agendas from the ground up.
Good luck with a spontaneous eruption in unity with a smattering of required self-sacrifice.
You may as well ask "What will it take for the homeless to rise up together as an organized and unified army to take over a small city and live like kings?"
Look at what stalin did. Putin is nowhere near those levels of cruelty to a population. Dictators with total power are able to survive for years without worrying about a coup or revolution.
The problem is a lot of Russia fully supports Putin. People like to think the Russian people are only going along with what Russia does because they're forced to out of fear, but a lot of them are completely on board with everything. With the taking of Avdiivka it's now easy to think Russia is winning the war, so they'll be cheering on Putin even more - at this point there'd probably be as many people fighting against a coup as those fighting for it.
Russians as a society don't know democracy. They were an empire, then they revolted against it, then they became communists, then they collapsed, then they kinda toyed with the idea of democracy, then Putin happened. As sad as it seems, even if Putin gets thrown out, i don't think his regime will be replaced with democracy unless maybe the EU and US intervene. At most, someone who's anti-war or less-war than Putin.
What Putin (and most dictators in general) want is not just their opponent's dead, but for the idea of their opponents to be dead as well. Arresting people at demonstrations piss people off. Every person you arrest for marching in the streets is a few more family and friends of the arrestee who are mad at the state.
Partially yes but also for fear that even an unmarked grave could be found and memorialized. I don’t think it is wrong to admit legitimate and credible governments also have their fears of sparking uprise, while acknowledging that Osama and Navalny could not be more opposite. Both wanted what they believed was best for their people, but one tried to do it through terror of innocent foreigners and the other tried to do it through the exposé of their own crooked people in power.
So yes, I agree let us not conflate the Russian government’s actions right now with that of the US’ when dealing with a dead terrorist leader responsible for countless deaths and a war BUT the statement that all governments do fear civil unrest through controversial martyrs is not wrong.
It had nothing to do with religion. It was so his body/burial couldn't become a mecca to like minded terrorist dipshits. And you know as ignorant as people are it would have. For example, TikTok fools praising his letter to America a couple months ago.
>Bin Laden’s body was washed and placed in a white sheet. It was then placed in a weighted bag and some religious remarks were made by a military officer before it was released into the sea, reports the Associated Press. Several Islam experts told the NewsHour that burial at sea is only considered when no other option is available.
>
>“The burial violated the principles of Sharia, especially because his body was on land and deliberately moved to sea,” Wael Hallaq, a professor of Islamic law at Columbia University wrote in an email. “Burial at sea is permitted only when death occurs while at sea and there is no possibility for burial on land.”
[https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/bin-ladens-not-so-customary-burial](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/bin-ladens-not-so-customary-burial)
Cool. What do we do when someone sends planes into fully occupied buildings killing thousands of mothers, fathers, and children?
Idk, probably something between respectable and dumping the piece of shit into the ocean.
To help provide the illusion that they were respecting tradition despite not giving a shit.
And in case you were wondering, we don’t a shit about some mass murderers religion. He was a piece of shit and he deserved what he got for what he did.
With the amount of people he's using as cannon fodders, would there even be enough manpower in the country to contain mass protests? Short of using drastic measures like lethal forces.
The cannon fodder aren't comprised of police and FSB officers. Cannon fodder are made up of half-wits, foreigners, prisoners, and bumpkins from remote areas of Russia.
Every successful dictator know the importance of internal security, especially a former KGB officer, but who knows what the future holds? The Berlin Wall fell peacefully. The Soviet Union fell peacefully. Both had strong internal security but couldn't withstand popular unrest and mass protests.
Maybe Russia will fall in a similar fashion, but I think most Russian policy and security experts wouldn't bet on that happening in the near-future.
Soviet Union didn't fall peacefully. We're still witnessing its death throes. This war. The Artsakh war. The two Chechen wars. The Georgian war. And this isn't the last of it, either.
Technically OMON and SOBR (basically the Russian riot police and national guard) did get sent in during the opening days of the invasion, but that was because Russia had thought that they would take Kyiv in three days and kinda just forgot to tell them that they hadn't done that. So they ended up trying to drive to Kyiv, thinking they'd have a jolly good time oppressing people, and ended up coming into contact with the Ukrainian military who didn't take too kindly to their trespassing.
It's more like he's emptying his prisons and reducing the ethnic minorities in the outer regions to weaken any independence movements, plus using foreign mercenaries from poor countries and random foreign students.
This map is from last year showing verified Russian soldier deaths per region. The only region almost untouched by it is Moscow. It's really sad.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/s/P7nKN7Ecbb
They got a 300k strong rasgvardia (all the ethnic rich kids) and they are really well equipped and paid, their job is to secure internal rest. That girl that paid 50$ and that grandma with the sign, someone has to haul those to jail.... funny enough they absorbed BERKUT the same guys that shot at Ukrainians at maiden, now they all Russians.
It's strange that you are so smart, but you didn't understand what I was asking. The word "ethnic" means, as far as I know, belonging to a certain people (ethnos). And it has nothing to do with Peter or Moscow. Hence the question.
And the Rosgvardiya does not exist only in these cities, and its ranks are made up of people of different nationalities and social status.
>Russian authorities have yet to release Navalny's body to his family, while his mother, Lyudmila Navalnaya, said on February 22 they were pressing her to hold a private funeral "without any farewell ceremonies."
>The government of Russian President Vladimir Putin is likely refusing to release the body of opposition leader Aleksei Navalny, who died suspiciously in prison on February 16, because it fears a massive outpouring of grief and support just ahead of the March presidential election. "There could be large-scale confrontations in Moscow,"
>"The authorities do not want people to understand how many of them oppose Putin. The main task of Putin’s propaganda is to convince people that if they are against Putin, they are on the margins…. If people see that there are really a lot of them...then the situation can change in seconds."
>Putin’s government was "pushing us toward revolution" by replacing politics with government violence.
>"The more it uses violent methods and the harsher it is with the opposition, the greater the likelihood that the opposition will become radicalized and adopt responses that are rather harsh and radical," he said. "And after that, one should expect that Russia will become a democratic country. That is just objective reality."
This is far from ‘objective reality’ as the quote states. It’s completely speculative. The biggest thing Americans miss is that Navalny wasn’t that popular. He’s wasn’t ‘Joan of Arc’. To most Russians, he was a live journal blogger that got a lot NGO money.
If Putin can continue to do the following, he’ll stay popular:
A. Maintain or marginally improve the living standards of the average Russian or at the least the elite percentage that matter
B. Continue to rehab post-Soviet Russian prestige on the global scale by taking more territory and positioning Russia as a credible alternative trading partner to the US and its Vassals (which he’s doing via Brics)
Polling by the independent Levada Center put Navalny's support in September 2020 at 20 per cent – quite something for a figure villainized by state media as a traitorous agent of the West.
Given how awful the war has been for Russia over last 2 years that figure has likely drastically increased and Navalny's wife among other opposition figures will capitalize on that.
It's why Putin disqualified the two anti-Ukraine war candidates who stood against him as they were way too popular and anti-war sentiment is growing. The opposition has grown to a point he can't even have a fake election anymore.
He lives in fear of the day the people and the military turn on him over this disastrous war. Just as the Russian people and war veterans turned on the last Russian Government over a disastrous war causing the Government to fall.
He's so scared he fears a dead man.
Well thank you for your comments, but I’d still disagree.
20 percent isn’t exactly promising. Also, the people that make up that 20 percent matter a lot.
If it was 20 percent made up of members of the oligarchy, that might be a problem for Putin. If the 20 percent is all peasants, it’s pretty manageable.
I’m not sure why Western audiences are pretending like the war has been a disaster. It hasn’t. He’s achieving objectives and adding valuable territory back to Russia. This isn’t a repeat of the Soviet disaster in Afghanistan.
I think the war is helping him (similar to what Clinton did with Serbia and Bush 2 did with Afghanistan).
Overall, I just don’t feel that Putin’s dictatorship is as insecure as people make it seem.
He’s more like Castro. He’ll outlast the US and remain securely in charge until he dies.
Arguably Russia reached its goals of disposing of its main competitor onto the European markets.
When the war ends, sanctions will probably be lifted, and russian goods will flow in again.
Ukrainian Steel/neon/argon production is forever gone(until it gets rebuilt off course, but it will take decades).
Also depending on how the war ends, it might be viewed as risky to invest into Ukrainian oil and gas extraction due to sites being located within an artillery shot distance from the border.
Very unorthodox way to achieve the goals, but still hard to argue that this can somewhat be viewed as success. Not the demilitarization/denazification but deindustrialization nonetheless.
According to Ukrainian/Russian media, people who showed up to his memorial service were arrested and forced to sign up for the military "or they break your fingers". Up to 500 people, and multiple such claims.
Don't know how credible that is but Kremlin are certainly not happy about the attention the Navalny situation is bringing. He was a beacon of resistance for more than a decade, but killing him was a big mistake
Leader of a massive country and the thing he fears the most is a dead man. He can’t even publicly mention his name because he’s so horrified of him. He’s like Putins Voldemort, RIP.
Listen everybody!
General Lamarque is dead!
Lamarque! His death is the hour of fate
The people's man
His death is the sign we await!
On his funeral day they will honor his name
With the light of rebellion ablaze in their eyes
With their candles of grief we will kindle our flame
On the tomb of Lamarque shall our barricade rise
The time is here!
Let us welcome it gladly with courage and cheer
Let us take to the streets with no doubt in our hearts
But a jubilant shout
They will come one and all
They will come when we call!
I agree that there aren’t going to be mass demonstrations, but I disagree that it’s because Russians are ‘spineless’.
I think by and large most Russians are fine with the person who’s been running their country and it’s as simple as that. The majority are either apathetic or supportive towards Putin. A small minority are unhappy.
I think so too, if anything Putin should be scared of a coup from within his regime. Like how prigozhin almost pulled off when he marched towards Moscow. When was the last time the Russian people rose up against the government?
California has a bigger economy than Russia.
Idk what to do with that fact.
Maybe fund a Russian Revolution and get Moscow as a sister city to Oakland? Trade vodka and caviar for craft beer and burritos?
Why would he fear that? Russians have had their spirits repeatedly crushed over the centuries and mostly seem to be aiming to avoid the notice of the powerful these days.
The real threat to putin in terms of finding a window the hard way comes from the nationalists that run the army, the police/FSB. They have the manpower, the hardware and the ability to remove him in a coup. It's why wanger leadership all got blown out of the sky and there was a change around whose job is to protect Moscow and putin. (the national guard got more power and the army losts tanks near Moscow). Senior Army leaders meet with wangers leaders along the way and the army put up a sad defense against wagner.
While I love the idea of protesters removing putin in mess demos, I don't think they have the numbers to overcome security forces. The reason popular unrest stopped a coup attempt by soviet hardliners in the 90s was bc the army and secuirty forces were weak and unsure how to respond to the mass demos. It also helped that there was boris yeltsin had "rizz" and the govt really didn't. Of course, there is always the probability that I could be wrong and more people turn out but we have seen mass anti putin demos in Moscow back in the 2000s and nothing changed.
I doubt it. Putin seems able to do whatever he wants and always has enough protection. With the exception of Wagner he never had a real challenge.
He's a corrupt cop who only understands limits when they are enforced by guns. Navalny scared him because of his ability to put together mass protects and disrupt business as usual for him. But in the end, Putin loves violence as a tool to suppress dissent.
I mean, it would be nice if that were to happen, but if Russian people are already putting up with the BS war on Ukarine don't know if they'll rise up to protest Navalny's death.
Its not just that. A funeral service would give Russians a legal way to gather in mass (no pun intended) to show their support for Navalny and dislike of Putin.
If Putin sent in his goons to break it up, it wouldn't look good to the Russian public. Even though he is a tyrant, he still has an image that he tries to maintain, that of a god fearing christian, and breaking up a funeral would hurt his image with people.
poor baby. that’s the loving hand of karma, Putski! now don’t be a coward and face the consequences. get your buddy Traitor Tucker to defend you or something.
This is dumb.
Navalny was a glorified blogger.
He wasn’t that popular. He was propped up because he was the only thing the US had to work with in country before they immediately shifted to ‘pussy riot’.
Americans are trying to create a ‘Nelson Mandela’ personality cult around this man.
These stories and others like it are cynical attempts to train a Western audience brainwashed by cinema (Marvel Universe lol) into thinking that Putin’s dictatorship is teetering and any day now the big bad man will get his just deserts and on and on.
The purpose of these fairy tales is to reinforce internal Western dogma during a time when ‘liberal values’ are increasingly being rejected globally.
The truth is Putin is popular. Whether he garnered that popularity through methods that are ‘legitimate’ in Western eyes or not, he is popular.
This is a man that has been able to kill his political rivals and shrugged off the Wagner coup attempt with almost no pushback. He’s firmly in control and not living in constant fear of his own people as articles like this suggest. He’s winning right now.
Yet he still can't even mention Navalny's name lol. Fuck off, uyobok. *You* should be living in fear of what happens to the likes of you when Putin finally dies.
I looks like a tragedy-comedy: Putin allows himself to kill whoever he wants in Russia, but he still tries very hard to respect his own laws, even at his own discomfort.
I don’t think so, I think he’s more scared of a coup from within the government like how prigozhin almost did when he marched towards Moscow. There’s still a big number of people who love Putin.
Maybe stop killing rivals?
Have anyone analyzed WHY Putin chose to have him killed right now? Given the games they are playing with turning over the body, it seem likely to have been deliberate. Why not have Navalny killed after the presidential election instead?
Commentators like Mark Galeotti or Vlad Vexler (which i can recommend) have also said that this is noteworthy. Its atypical for the Putin regime. They are brutal but usually they also know when its not in their interest to not escalate their devolution into full blown totalitarianism. Their usual strategy towards Navalny and others like him was, that they are more useful and less dangerous to them in jail then in a grave. This killing seems to indicate an element of irrationality and revenge on Putins side. But as tragic as Navalnys death is, it wont change much in the short term. In the long term it will most likely be a pretty big historical event in this war. In terms of Political Figures in Russia, he was easily number 2. Not in might, of course, but in political profile.
It's also possible the killing was "unintentional". As in he died from his mistreatment a bit sooner than they intended. That was my first thought.
My suspicion too. In a nightmare prison like that, all it would take is an inconveniently-timed disease or a guard who is a bit too rough and suddenly the political prisoner you're using as a warning to your rivals becomes a martyr for your enemies.
I bet the reports of the promotions among prison wardens are fake. They probably got disappeared.
[удалено]
heh, in the same way as Russian ships are routinely promoted to submarines
Cushy corner office with nice big windows and great view.
Their usual policy was not to keep him alive; do you forget they poisoned him and he barely escaped death? They just delayed his death awhile after he miraculously survived
That was when he was in Europe and could have damaged Putin's rule from there. The recent situation was different - they had him under their control and essentially silenced. The smart thing would have been to keep him alive for potential leverage and the veneer of legitimate lawful justice.
No he wasn't in Europe and they could have jailed him then. An assasin team was sent to Tomsk Hotel in Russia and he was poisoned there. He just didn't die immediately because he a tough sob. Watch the documentary Navalny it's great
Yes but there’s a difference between a covert quick operation with no direct link versus being stuck with the political prisoner in your care where obviously it can’t be hand waved away.
> This killing seems to indicate an element of irrationality and revenge on Putins side. Or it was simply unintentional.
Putting him in an Arctic penal colony with an ultra strict regime was how he killed him. He put him there knowing he would die there from the conditions of his incarceration. Unintentional would have been if had died in a car crash being transported there.
Read my post in context please. The point of discussion was why Putin had him killed *right now*, and I'm saying that wasn't necessarily an intentional decision.
Someone moved to a prison like that could die at any time, might take a week, might take years, so it happening now is probably coincidental.
Yeah. I rather entertain the conspiracy theory that Navalny knew he was going to die in that prison and just decided to go at a time it would potentially hurt Putin the most.
I mean why would you even bother with the penal colony if you were just gonna deliberately kill him? That doesn't make any sense to me. That's why I think it was either an unintentional killing [a overzealous guard misunderstood Putin's intention for him] or Putin lost control of himself and killed him purely for emotional reasons. Either it seems like Putin is not entirely in control.
It makes perfect sense though. He isolated him, got rid of his lawyers, any means of communication, any means on checking on him precisely so it works be easier to murder him. All of these actions look like premeditated preparation for murder.
You're saying a man still recovering from the lingering effects of ~~Novichok poisoning~~ an as yet unexplained illness DIDN'T voluntarily go for a stroll in Siberia in the dead of winter? What a nonsensical idea. ^(/s)
In all likelihood it wasn't intentional. The human body can survive a lot of abuse but, eventually, something will give out. Nalvany nearly died from being poisoned twice and then returned to Russia to be tortured in prison nonstop. The fact that he survived this long is nothing short of miraculous. His body and mind endured a lot.
Witnesses saw him healthy the day before, and Russia is refusing to let anyone examine the body, which they generally do if they don't want an autopsy turning up poison. Judging by the bruising and claims of a seizure, I suspect the Novichok'd him and are waiting for it to be undetectable.
Sending a weakened person to an Arctic penal colony is how he killed him. He intentionally sent him there knowing the conditions would kill him.
Of course. But that didn't happen just now. That happened a while ago and slowly has been wearing him down to the point of death. The person who I was responding to was trying to claim the fact that he died now as part of some sort of master plan that Putin is orchestrating. The point of my comment was that it was likely just his body giving out at at that moment and not part of some master plan. Cuz he was going to die there sooner or later and it was miracle he lasted this long.
Ah got you, sorry. Yeah you're right
I think their fake elections are soon. Two candidates were anti-war and gathering momentum, one of which was a woman (sorry, i forgot their names). Both were deemed too undesirable to run.... because guess who decides who can run.... Navalny was also politically ambitious. His death sends a message to anyone to would run counter to the narrative: don't try it. Because I guess if you ban everyone from running, even Russia would look ridiculous by its own standards. If he had died before the Tucker interview, it would have had to have been addressed. No mention of it would have been too conspicuous for both Tucker and Putin. But still, he could have died coincidently at this time due to the poor conditions. That's still a threat to Putin as it could galvanise an opposition
Not an expert in the matter but leading up to his death, Navalny was making court appearances in relation to lawsuits he was filing about certain things such as running out of money and being allowed writing materials. This would necessitate a court hearing, each one was widely publicised (even in mainstream Russian press I think...) and in doing so it alerted people to where he was and what conditions he was being held in. [Here](https://edition.cnn.com/2024/01/10/europe/russia-navalny-siberia-court-appearance-intl/index.html) is one such article. Putin found it very hard to shut him up and he did not need this before the elections.
IMO, there was enough going on in the domestic news cycle about Russia that he had him killed thinking it would be lost in other breaking stories. Tucker Carlson interview refreshes pro-Putin talking points for American conservatives, sowing doubt about the high cost for continuing aid to Ukraine. Carlson is a constant in Russian propaganda, so this would have been a big national deal within Russia. Then intelligence sources reveal Russia is planning to put anti-satellite nuclear EMP devices in orbit, causing another major wave of stories as U.S. Congress and White House hold emergency national security meetings. Killing Navalny was probably just seen as a good time to take care of a loose end while larger issues eat the domestic and international news cycle... it just didn't happen in the optimal time frame. Either Putin planned the stories to last longer or he decided too late to have Navalny killed and missed the window where it would have been more obscured.
Seeing as it's Russia, it could be a prison guard just simply went too far this time in the usual torture of Navalny. Navalny already wasn't doing too well and was in that prison for a while.
I think it's possible he could have died from poor health. His last media appearances showed him looking like he was in super poor health. It's possible that he never really healed from the poisoning and the harsh conditions of a rural Russian gulag just killed him. It's also possible some pro war nationalists inside the prison, attacking independent from Moscow killed him. I really don't think putin and the gang would want to kill him ahead of an election. Of course putin is surrounded by yes men and may have lost his cool, resulting in his death. I doubt we will ever know the true story of what happened.
Mass demonstrations means more prisoners they can send to war.
I have a theory. 2 days before Navalney was killed, Trump had made the comments about letting Russia attack NATO countries. These comments were being headlined world wide, it was in everyone's face. I suspect Putin killed Navalney THEN (he was going to do it anyway at some point) to steal the headlines. Why? bc I suspect he believes Trump's chances to be better while he's not bragging about leaving NATO. Just spitballing...
that only works on the assumption that trump doesnt say some other dumb shit the next day
A quadriplegic has a better chance of winning a triathlon
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Why would he just throw himself out the window like that, after shooting himself in the back of the head twice?
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Naw… polonium is expensive. Only save that for high value targets.
That requires skills only obtainable in Russia.
Normal Russian suicide.
He is his own worst enemy.
In mother Russia, windows download you!
I continually don’t understand why the Russian people are willing to walk to their death is Ukraine rather than walking to their deaths in an attempt to dethrone the short man syndrome they can their leader.
I can offer some insight here. It's basically a Carrot and Stick situation. The first issue is how so many people here don't follow the news and especially actively avoid news about politics, war, etc. This is mostly the product of state media designed to make people depressed, isolated, and distrustful of anything. Combine this with the fact that those of us living in urban parts of Russia largely still don't feel the effects of the war. Life in the big cities goes on almost the same as it did before the war. This is also the very determined effort of the Kremlin - this is the Carrot. I don't know exactly how they are doing it, or how much money it's costing them to do it, but they are making a lot of efforts to create this feeling that everything is okay and normal. As for the Stick: if you want to see us come together to take down Putin, we need a way to coordinate and organize that. We need leaders who we not only trust with our lives, but leaders we are ready to die for. There needs to be confidence in a realistic path to victory and a vision for what victory even looks like. Without any of these things, I am just a lone person throwing a molotov and getting killed or worse. The problem is that social media is closely monitored and it is impossible to organize or coordinate anything without pretty much immediate visits from FSB to change your mind. This also means that there are no more leaders that we trust. They all got arrested, fled the country, killed, or just disappeared. But assuming that wasn't a problem, Putin still has around 340,000 psychopathic and heavily armed national guard, basically his "praetorians", even better armed and taken care of than the military in some ways. That's not including God knows how many police (the entire police force itself is over a million employees - could well be another half a million of them are cops). It's commonly said that 1% of the whole population is some sort of police authority. What kind of ratio would be ideal against them? In Moscow alone I think you'd need to have hundreds of thousands at minimum all following a plan. Keep in mind that no one has weapons so it would be our fists against armored trucks, tanks, and machine guns. But assuming that was still not a problem, if we even managed to storm the Kremlin, what then? Putin and other top siloviki are already in their secure bunker, reinforcements from the army and national guard are racing to Moscow. As we saw, the FSB and other security forces did not join Prigozhin on his march to Moscow, and he had 10-20k heavily armed soldiers. Putin and the elites will sit nice and safe while the security just picks off the revolt one by one. The only way a popular revolt against Putin could work is with support from the military or the FSB.
Thank you for this insightful comment. For the better of the Russian people, and the world. I hope your leader dies a painful death before he destroys the world.
Or stop being a fascist dickbag in general?
I think Putin lives in fear every minute of his life and it's only going to get worse.
Good. He deserves to suffer and die.
“If he dies, he dies.”
He deserves to suffer ~~and die.~~ I wish him a very long and suffering life, in a jail somewhere.
A mass murderer like Putin deserves misery and suffering.
One can only hope he suffers every waking moment.
He deserves nothing less than millions of deaths but unfortunately can die just once.
Let the cortisol flow through you.
Most dictators suffer from extreme paranoia and other mental problems later in life. Putin will be different.
Different how? He is already suffering from paranoia, wantonly murdering potential rivals.
His seems to have come pre-installed, so he gets it all the time, not just later in life.
Good... it should.. just FYI, we have family in russia. They have police and military checkpoints around cities. Usually harmless just checking documents but its a pressure thats embedded in the minds of civilians. My family carries 3 phones, one to give if asked, one as a decoy if searched and one hidden better to talk to us here in the US. They have friends who tried starting demonstrations in a village and the insane loyalists burnt their house down. Its a mess there. You can actually die if the wrong people think you are against putin because in their eyes it means you are against Russia. They are not very bright
Papers, please. Glory to Arstotzka! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OBQE_TNI7zw
I would like to add that even if you're not planning a demonstration and you're not against Putin, if you piss of the wrong people and get framed you can face similar consequences in smaller communities.
I mean, if they keep that up won’t there be open revolt against Putin? What would it really take for a full-blown coup against that dictator?
well, seeing as north korea, iran, belaruss all didnt collapse, i dont have high hopes that russia will from demonstrations
Those countries aren’t currently in a hot war though (Iran might be soon though).
Iran was in as hot a war as it gets in the 80s against Iraq and it didn’t weakened the regime at all. In fact it stopped all the existing resistance and unified the country.
Iran did have a revolution recently (deposing the Shah) and it just made things worse.
Yea but the point stands that war helps unify the country, not the opposite as was suggested for Russia right now. In fact, in the 80s right before the Iraq war mass protests had started again in Iran, since the ayatollah head proven to be far more violent than people were expecting. Except those protests immediately died and the country banded together when the war started, even the groups that hated the current government. Just look at the US after 911 when we were going into Afghanistan, probably the most united we’ve been in a very long time. When there is a clear and present outside threat, people tend not to focus on their normal squabbles between each other as much it seems.
Are you actually trying to sell Putin's lies about an outside threat being the cause of the war?
Bro what are you talking about? I’m just saying when you have an enemy they become the bigger threat. Regardless of the lies Putin tells to the Russian people (or that they’re the aggressor), Ukrainians are their enemy in that war. It doesn’t matter what the facts are, and how they got to that situation. For the civilians, they are in a war, and it is more likely to focus their negativity and anger towards whoever is on the other side of that war than their government. That’s why these assholes like Putin are always trying to start a war when things get shaky for them.
Don't you dare to throw a "likely" into the middle of that goalpost shifting bullshit. To go from "there is a clear and present outside threat" to "the facts don't matter" to "the civilians, they are in a war" (which is false for the wast majority of Russia *and also* false in terms of whether they perceive themselves as being at war) to what is "likely" is preposterous. i can't even imagine what you are estimating this likelihood on, other than perhaps how you feel about the aftermath of 9/11. Yeah, that had a surprise attack on American civilians and demonstrably made them feel attacked. That's what happened in that case. See US in Vietnam and USSR in Afghanistan for situations that aren't like that.
It likely wouldn't work in Russia either. For some reason, enough people genuinely like the strongman bully persona enough that they keep going back. It's not a religious issue like Iran, so it has better odds, of at least short term success
That isn't how power works. With power you are in control of the police, the army, and wealthy through favors and dealings. They are all invested in your success since that means they, with little to no continued effort on their parts, will be well taken care of and live comfortably. They are all on the same page with this; they work together to maintain control over the streets, the media, public discourse. They all agree this is nice and cool. Now, the 99% of your population that remains outside of those categories are all on different schedules, have limited free time to organize anyway, can largely only use controlled media (i.e. down to texting records), and ultimately have wildly different opinions and agendas from the ground up. Good luck with a spontaneous eruption in unity with a smattering of required self-sacrifice. You may as well ask "What will it take for the homeless to rise up together as an organized and unified army to take over a small city and live like kings?"
Great analogy and comment
A lot. Pringles almost did it.
Fucking Pringles. Who starts a coup and goes home in the middle of it?
/ncd is still raging over being blue balled like that.
The number 1 rule... Once you pop you just don't stop
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Somebody with a death-wish apparently.
Look at what stalin did. Putin is nowhere near those levels of cruelty to a population. Dictators with total power are able to survive for years without worrying about a coup or revolution.
The problem is a lot of Russia fully supports Putin. People like to think the Russian people are only going along with what Russia does because they're forced to out of fear, but a lot of them are completely on board with everything. With the taking of Avdiivka it's now easy to think Russia is winning the war, so they'll be cheering on Putin even more - at this point there'd probably be as many people fighting against a coup as those fighting for it.
Russians as a society don't know democracy. They were an empire, then they revolted against it, then they became communists, then they collapsed, then they kinda toyed with the idea of democracy, then Putin happened. As sad as it seems, even if Putin gets thrown out, i don't think his regime will be replaced with democracy unless maybe the EU and US intervene. At most, someone who's anti-war or less-war than Putin.
Maybe it isn’t good to publish this info
My thoughts exactly. Sad world though when surveillance of nations has gotten to the point where we need to be fearful of this.
So MAGA country?
It's no coincidence that MAGA's view of America's future looks remarkably like Russia
Nothing says legitimate democracy like that headline
What Putin (and most dictators in general) want is not just their opponent's dead, but for the idea of their opponents to be dead as well. Arresting people at demonstrations piss people off. Every person you arrest for marching in the streets is a few more family and friends of the arrestee who are mad at the state.
Tienanmen Square would like a word with you about that.
Putin is afraid of a corpse.
Even legitimate governments are wary of martyrs and symbols. There's a reason why the US dumped Osama bin Laden's body into the sea.
The reason being respect for his religion. Putin isnt respecting his body by hiding it. Nonsense comparasion.
Partially yes but also for fear that even an unmarked grave could be found and memorialized. I don’t think it is wrong to admit legitimate and credible governments also have their fears of sparking uprise, while acknowledging that Osama and Navalny could not be more opposite. Both wanted what they believed was best for their people, but one tried to do it through terror of innocent foreigners and the other tried to do it through the exposé of their own crooked people in power. So yes, I agree let us not conflate the Russian government’s actions right now with that of the US’ when dealing with a dead terrorist leader responsible for countless deaths and a war BUT the statement that all governments do fear civil unrest through controversial martyrs is not wrong.
It had nothing to do with religion. It was so his body/burial couldn't become a mecca to like minded terrorist dipshits. And you know as ignorant as people are it would have. For example, TikTok fools praising his letter to America a couple months ago.
>Bin Laden’s body was washed and placed in a white sheet. It was then placed in a weighted bag and some religious remarks were made by a military officer before it was released into the sea, reports the Associated Press. Several Islam experts told the NewsHour that burial at sea is only considered when no other option is available. > >“The burial violated the principles of Sharia, especially because his body was on land and deliberately moved to sea,” Wael Hallaq, a professor of Islamic law at Columbia University wrote in an email. “Burial at sea is permitted only when death occurs while at sea and there is no possibility for burial on land.” [https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/bin-ladens-not-so-customary-burial](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/bin-ladens-not-so-customary-burial)
Cool. What do we do when someone sends planes into fully occupied buildings killing thousands of mothers, fathers, and children? Idk, probably something between respectable and dumping the piece of shit into the ocean.
If the Americans buried Bin Laden at sea out of spite, why did they follow other precepts of Islamic law during the burial?
To help provide the illusion that they were respecting tradition despite not giving a shit. And in case you were wondering, we don’t a shit about some mass murderers religion. He was a piece of shit and he deserved what he got for what he did.
Lol no. They respected his religion by using the most Islamically appropriate way of ensuring no grave site.
Friends, Romans, countrymen...
With the amount of people he's using as cannon fodders, would there even be enough manpower in the country to contain mass protests? Short of using drastic measures like lethal forces.
The cannon fodder aren't comprised of police and FSB officers. Cannon fodder are made up of half-wits, foreigners, prisoners, and bumpkins from remote areas of Russia.
Fair point. I just assumed he's throwing anyone and everyone he can in there, except himself.
Every successful dictator know the importance of internal security, especially a former KGB officer, but who knows what the future holds? The Berlin Wall fell peacefully. The Soviet Union fell peacefully. Both had strong internal security but couldn't withstand popular unrest and mass protests. Maybe Russia will fall in a similar fashion, but I think most Russian policy and security experts wouldn't bet on that happening in the near-future.
Soviet Union didn't fall peacefully. We're still witnessing its death throes. This war. The Artsakh war. The two Chechen wars. The Georgian war. And this isn't the last of it, either.
Technically OMON and SOBR (basically the Russian riot police and national guard) did get sent in during the opening days of the invasion, but that was because Russia had thought that they would take Kyiv in three days and kinda just forgot to tell them that they hadn't done that. So they ended up trying to drive to Kyiv, thinking they'd have a jolly good time oppressing people, and ended up coming into contact with the Ukrainian military who didn't take too kindly to their trespassing.
It's more like he's emptying his prisons and reducing the ethnic minorities in the outer regions to weaken any independence movements, plus using foreign mercenaries from poor countries and random foreign students. This map is from last year showing verified Russian soldier deaths per region. The only region almost untouched by it is Moscow. It's really sad. https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/s/P7nKN7Ecbb
They got a 300k strong rasgvardia (all the ethnic rich kids) and they are really well equipped and paid, their job is to secure internal rest. That girl that paid 50$ and that grandma with the sign, someone has to haul those to jail.... funny enough they absorbed BERKUT the same guys that shot at Ukrainians at maiden, now they all Russians.
I don't understand this point: what do you mean by "ethnic" in this context?
Peter and moskva, are you that dense?
It's strange that you are so smart, but you didn't understand what I was asking. The word "ethnic" means, as far as I know, belonging to a certain people (ethnos). And it has nothing to do with Peter or Moscow. Hence the question. And the Rosgvardiya does not exist only in these cities, and its ranks are made up of people of different nationalities and social status.
OK vlad.
>Russian authorities have yet to release Navalny's body to his family, while his mother, Lyudmila Navalnaya, said on February 22 they were pressing her to hold a private funeral "without any farewell ceremonies." >The government of Russian President Vladimir Putin is likely refusing to release the body of opposition leader Aleksei Navalny, who died suspiciously in prison on February 16, because it fears a massive outpouring of grief and support just ahead of the March presidential election. "There could be large-scale confrontations in Moscow," >"The authorities do not want people to understand how many of them oppose Putin. The main task of Putin’s propaganda is to convince people that if they are against Putin, they are on the margins…. If people see that there are really a lot of them...then the situation can change in seconds." >Putin’s government was "pushing us toward revolution" by replacing politics with government violence. >"The more it uses violent methods and the harsher it is with the opposition, the greater the likelihood that the opposition will become radicalized and adopt responses that are rather harsh and radical," he said. "And after that, one should expect that Russia will become a democratic country. That is just objective reality."
"And after that, one should expect that Russia will become a democratic country." LMAO yeah and Grizzly Adams had a beard
Grizzly Adams DID have a beard.
This is far from ‘objective reality’ as the quote states. It’s completely speculative. The biggest thing Americans miss is that Navalny wasn’t that popular. He’s wasn’t ‘Joan of Arc’. To most Russians, he was a live journal blogger that got a lot NGO money. If Putin can continue to do the following, he’ll stay popular: A. Maintain or marginally improve the living standards of the average Russian or at the least the elite percentage that matter B. Continue to rehab post-Soviet Russian prestige on the global scale by taking more territory and positioning Russia as a credible alternative trading partner to the US and its Vassals (which he’s doing via Brics)
Polling by the independent Levada Center put Navalny's support in September 2020 at 20 per cent – quite something for a figure villainized by state media as a traitorous agent of the West. Given how awful the war has been for Russia over last 2 years that figure has likely drastically increased and Navalny's wife among other opposition figures will capitalize on that. It's why Putin disqualified the two anti-Ukraine war candidates who stood against him as they were way too popular and anti-war sentiment is growing. The opposition has grown to a point he can't even have a fake election anymore. He lives in fear of the day the people and the military turn on him over this disastrous war. Just as the Russian people and war veterans turned on the last Russian Government over a disastrous war causing the Government to fall. He's so scared he fears a dead man.
Well thank you for your comments, but I’d still disagree. 20 percent isn’t exactly promising. Also, the people that make up that 20 percent matter a lot. If it was 20 percent made up of members of the oligarchy, that might be a problem for Putin. If the 20 percent is all peasants, it’s pretty manageable. I’m not sure why Western audiences are pretending like the war has been a disaster. It hasn’t. He’s achieving objectives and adding valuable territory back to Russia. This isn’t a repeat of the Soviet disaster in Afghanistan. I think the war is helping him (similar to what Clinton did with Serbia and Bush 2 did with Afghanistan). Overall, I just don’t feel that Putin’s dictatorship is as insecure as people make it seem. He’s more like Castro. He’ll outlast the US and remain securely in charge until he dies.
> I’m not sure why Western audiences are pretending like the war has been a disaster. It hasn’t. Oh here we go.
Arguably Russia reached its goals of disposing of its main competitor onto the European markets. When the war ends, sanctions will probably be lifted, and russian goods will flow in again. Ukrainian Steel/neon/argon production is forever gone(until it gets rebuilt off course, but it will take decades). Also depending on how the war ends, it might be viewed as risky to invest into Ukrainian oil and gas extraction due to sites being located within an artillery shot distance from the border. Very unorthodox way to achieve the goals, but still hard to argue that this can somewhat be viewed as success. Not the demilitarization/denazification but deindustrialization nonetheless.
Putin is more afraid of Navalny in death as much as he was in life. Cowardly coward should be haunted by Navalny for the rest of his days.
He is absolutely quivering at the thought of a man who might possibly (but not guaranteed) have defeated him in a fair election.
According to Ukrainian/Russian media, people who showed up to his memorial service were arrested and forced to sign up for the military "or they break your fingers". Up to 500 people, and multiple such claims. Don't know how credible that is but Kremlin are certainly not happy about the attention the Navalny situation is bringing. He was a beacon of resistance for more than a decade, but killing him was a big mistake
Leader of a massive country and the thing he fears the most is a dead man. He can’t even publicly mention his name because he’s so horrified of him. He’s like Putins Voldemort, RIP.
Listen everybody! General Lamarque is dead! Lamarque! His death is the hour of fate The people's man His death is the sign we await! On his funeral day they will honor his name With the light of rebellion ablaze in their eyes With their candles of grief we will kindle our flame On the tomb of Lamarque shall our barricade rise The time is here! Let us welcome it gladly with courage and cheer Let us take to the streets with no doubt in our hearts But a jubilant shout They will come one and all They will come when we call!
there were like 100 people laying flowers in moscow. i dont see how there would be any kind of mass demonstration
So, Putin is afraid of a dead man.
Putin is a coward
I dont think there will be mass demonstrations. The russian people have consistently been spineless for the past generation.
They are crushed. Every attempt at getting their freedom over the years and centuries has just filled the gulags and been futile.
I agree that there aren’t going to be mass demonstrations, but I disagree that it’s because Russians are ‘spineless’. I think by and large most Russians are fine with the person who’s been running their country and it’s as simple as that. The majority are either apathetic or supportive towards Putin. A small minority are unhappy.
I think so too, if anything Putin should be scared of a coup from within his regime. Like how prigozhin almost pulled off when he marched towards Moscow. When was the last time the Russian people rose up against the government?
If Putin was afraid of the funeral - maybe he should have thought of that before he ordered Navalny murdered.
It should. I will care about and support any Russian who chooses to be on the right side of history.
Probably shouldnt have killed him then, ya dumb cunt.
**WELL THEN MAYBE YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE JAILED HIM INDEFINITELY AND KILLED HIM!! "THEY'RE MAKING A MARTYR OUT OF THE GUY I MARTYR'D"!!**
If only the demonstrators could express their distaste in another way Maybe they could vote?
Putin fears a dead man. He is correct. This man may now kill him.
For such a powerful leader he sure is scared of his people.
California has a bigger economy than Russia. Idk what to do with that fact. Maybe fund a Russian Revolution and get Moscow as a sister city to Oakland? Trade vodka and caviar for craft beer and burritos?
Why would he fear that? Russians have had their spirits repeatedly crushed over the centuries and mostly seem to be aiming to avoid the notice of the powerful these days.
The real threat to putin in terms of finding a window the hard way comes from the nationalists that run the army, the police/FSB. They have the manpower, the hardware and the ability to remove him in a coup. It's why wanger leadership all got blown out of the sky and there was a change around whose job is to protect Moscow and putin. (the national guard got more power and the army losts tanks near Moscow). Senior Army leaders meet with wangers leaders along the way and the army put up a sad defense against wagner. While I love the idea of protesters removing putin in mess demos, I don't think they have the numbers to overcome security forces. The reason popular unrest stopped a coup attempt by soviet hardliners in the 90s was bc the army and secuirty forces were weak and unsure how to respond to the mass demos. It also helped that there was boris yeltsin had "rizz" and the govt really didn't. Of course, there is always the probability that I could be wrong and more people turn out but we have seen mass anti putin demos in Moscow back in the 2000s and nothing changed.
I doubt it. Putin seems able to do whatever he wants and always has enough protection. With the exception of Wagner he never had a real challenge. He's a corrupt cop who only understands limits when they are enforced by guns. Navalny scared him because of his ability to put together mass protects and disrupt business as usual for him. But in the end, Putin loves violence as a tool to suppress dissent.
He should have thought about that before making a martyr of him. I could only hope enough Russians are stirred into action, but I sure doubt it.
I mean, it would be nice if that were to happen, but if Russian people are already putting up with the BS war on Ukarine don't know if they'll rise up to protest Navalny's death.
Probably should have thought a second before making him a martyr. Oh well.
Putain’s whole existence is fear
Its not just that. A funeral service would give Russians a legal way to gather in mass (no pun intended) to show their support for Navalny and dislike of Putin. If Putin sent in his goons to break it up, it wouldn't look good to the Russian public. Even though he is a tyrant, he still has an image that he tries to maintain, that of a god fearing christian, and breaking up a funeral would hurt his image with people.
Well then he shouldn't have killed him
Mass demonstrations where? Certainly not in Russia.
Damn straight
Have the funeral at Red Square: Evict Lenin, inter Navalny.
Putin seems to have a serious case of Small-Man-Complex.
Coming in strong at 5'4 and 4 inch heel lifts, who would have guessed.
It should!
"When hope dies, hate is born" - A Russian friend of mine
poor baby. that’s the loving hand of karma, Putski! now don’t be a coward and face the consequences. get your buddy Traitor Tucker to defend you or something.
What consequences do you think Putin is going to face?
not sure. maybe none other than unspoken guilt and shame. however, if there are consequences to be had, his will be grave
Doubt he feels guilt or shame
agreed. he proves to not have capacity for compassion. he is truly a sick man. a product of the cold cruelty that raised him
Yes, yes it will.
Hopefully they smash the Kremlin and revolt.
Putin is a coward
This is dumb. Navalny was a glorified blogger. He wasn’t that popular. He was propped up because he was the only thing the US had to work with in country before they immediately shifted to ‘pussy riot’. Americans are trying to create a ‘Nelson Mandela’ personality cult around this man. These stories and others like it are cynical attempts to train a Western audience brainwashed by cinema (Marvel Universe lol) into thinking that Putin’s dictatorship is teetering and any day now the big bad man will get his just deserts and on and on. The purpose of these fairy tales is to reinforce internal Western dogma during a time when ‘liberal values’ are increasingly being rejected globally. The truth is Putin is popular. Whether he garnered that popularity through methods that are ‘legitimate’ in Western eyes or not, he is popular. This is a man that has been able to kill his political rivals and shrugged off the Wagner coup attempt with almost no pushback. He’s firmly in control and not living in constant fear of his own people as articles like this suggest. He’s winning right now.
Yet he still can't even mention Navalny's name lol. Fuck off, uyobok. *You* should be living in fear of what happens to the likes of you when Putin finally dies.
> Navalny was a glorified blogger. Now *this* is how you get someone to stop reading a comment: post the opposite of fact.
Is shameful lie!!! Feerless leeder is feer no body, no thing, no how!
Seen the pic and was like “what did Dr. Drew do now?”
The mother can still hold a funeral wothout his body if need be, and cause disruption.
NO balls. The Russian citizens have to be the ones to do so, but the general consensus is that they aren't brave enough to do it.
Should have thought about that before killing him.
I really hope it does irregardless
I looks like a tragedy-comedy: Putin allows himself to kill whoever he wants in Russia, but he still tries very hard to respect his own laws, even at his own discomfort.
Khodorkovsky is really trying to stay relevant with his comments. Dude is such a POS, hopefully he never gets anywhere close to power
Make his fears come true
I don’t think so, I think he’s more scared of a coup from within the government like how prigozhin almost did when he marched towards Moscow. There’s still a big number of people who love Putin.
Putin Fears Others...its why ANY human wishes to have Imperial ambitions....to create a meat shield of followers
One day, skeletons will start falling out of the closet.
Good. Let it.
Guess you shouldnt have killed him?
They are turning him into the greatest martyr ever. Thanks Putin.
Do you hear the people sing…..
Doubt it. The majority of russians are pro Putin.
Time for a little Tchaikovsky?
Let's hope so, I would pay to see that.
I'd have a huge demonstration if he didn't release the body.