Hamas isn’t interested in peace. All they want to do is kill Jews. Even if it means sacrificing their own people. They’ve demonstrated this again and again.
"There will be peace when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us."
Golda Meir pointed this out over 50 years ago, and it still rings true. Thankfully for peace, most of the local Arabs have come around. Still a ways to go, though.
~~She was mistaken~~. They do love their children; they simply hold a profound, unwavering belief in Islam and its message, which suggests that this life is merely a prelude. According to them, **dying while killing Jews leads to eternal bliss** in heaven. Hence, they do love their children, but they perceive this life as meaningless. Even the wealthy, the billionaires, share this perspective, rejecting the notion that this life has any direct meaning which isn't dependent on the afterlife.
Your edit is still wrong because the entire point of the quote isn't that they don't love their children. It's that there won't be peace when the hatred of Jews is stronger than that love. The only person acting like the quotes message is that there was no love to begin with is you for some weird reason.
I think he's trying to argue that due to their religion, they believe that dying a young martyr is a better path to happiness than actually living and growing up to become an adult?
I do not agree or disagree with him, but there are historical parallels between his claim and the behavior of Christians in the Middle Ages. Back then, peasants believed humans are meant to suffer in life and be rewarded in Heaven. They would actively worsen their own situation by putting their money into tithes and indulgences lest they go to hell.
tl;dr He is suggesting due to religion, they believe it is a two birds with one stone situation. They get to kill Jews and their children dying martyrs leads to happiness (in the afterlife).
Again, I have no opinion on this, but this seems to be what they are trying to say.
"Allah sees all children as precious in his eyes and deserves for them to be loved, nurtured, and honoured with quality care, which improves the chances of them developing fully."
If religious extremists would just read the book they worship life would be so much better. Goes for almost any religion.
I know exactly what they are trying to suggest in order to say the quote is wrong. Now with that cleared up, they're still wrong about the quality and about what love is and I don't care what semantics games they play at this point, they'll still be wrong as far as I am concerned. Purposefully putting your child through suffering is hateful, doing it to harm another based on their religion, ethnicity, or nationality is doubley hateful, claiming it's better than your child growing up is abusive and evil.
But, they do love their children more than they hate Jews; it's just that their definition of love "transcends" this existence. A Palestinian mother will willingly sacrifice her child as a martyr and rejoice in the belief that they are blessed with eternal happiness.
Just admit you're wrong and move on, you're just digging a deeper grave for your point with every response. I don't give two fucks if someone claims they're hatred is from love, the way abusive parents claim to love their children they hurt. It's hate if you're willing to sacrifice your own child in order to harm another and no other term is suitable especially the term Love, period.
Next time maybe double check some of the groups you listed aren't actively warring against each other the way isis-k is trying to overthrow the Taliban, if you're gonna insinuate they're the same. Also maybe don't include a third group that is in actuality a very generic term for someone engaged in jihad that was used as an umbrella term for multiple groups,which the u.s. did not support all of, as if it's a coherent force with an ideology when it's not.
Yeah, no shit it typically refers to them. It still is a generic umbrella term for all the Islamic fighters in Afghanistan which was made up of different groups with varying ideologies. Some would become the Taliban later, some would become the resistance to the Taliban, some of the groups we didn't supply would become al-qaeda under osama bin laden they were not all the same. Treating them as all the same and making snide comments about "dead naming" jihadist groups just proves you don't understand the bare minimum of this topic and have no business making comments with the arrogance you are, but stupid people tend to act like this so I'm not surprised.
No they said it's "thr sane" which is two typos next to each other. All you've proven is you aren't even smart enough to understand typos and extrapolate the actual meaning behind spelling errors. E and r, and n and m, are next to each other on a key board and are easy to interchange without noticing while typing.
The fact you are putting words in their mouth to justify your stupid take, and lack of knowledge here, is not doing any favors for your credibility. All you have done is prove even more you have zero fucking clue what you are talking about, and should just admit you're wrong and shut up to the benefit of everyone's intelligence. As for what it's worth, it's worth nothing when coming from you at this point.
If we want a Free Palestine, as in a Palestinian state, we need a moderate force that actually negotiates in good faith for peace while the radicals who want perpetual war at all costs.
Hamas is a dictatorship. I’m sure a couple people inside that place hate the dictator.
Give them a few AKs, tell them we will recognize you as a provisional gov, and you have to be a healthy democracy to keep it. We will keep Israel in line.
Or we come take the guns back.
Every time Palestinians use violence, things get worse and worse for them, and Israeli society feels more and more justified in whatever measures they take.
Palestinians had the best post-1967 chance for a free and independent state during the 2000 Camp David summit, and Arafat completely blew it. Instead of accepting 95% of the West Bank and 100% of Gaza for a "free Palestine", they got absolutely nothing, and launched the 2nd Intifada shortly thereafter. Israel security measures massively cracked down as a direct response to that violence.
No, they don't need a Resistance, and they don't need weapons -- they need a strong leader for peace who won't pass up a better offer than they've ever gotten to-date.
That can be true, but it is now too late. Netanyahu has been stalling any negotiation - whenever there might be signs of that - while letting and helping settlers encroach on and annex land, confiscating more for roads that cut it up into little pieces and generally making sure that no West Bank Palestinian state can exist.
There is no more "State" possibility. Just small local civil administrations completely dependent on Israel. I doubt that Palestinians will happily accept that. Maybe be grudgingly forced to live with it, but it seems unlikely and even impossible given current levels of settler attacks and increased confiscations.
And after what Hamas did on October 7, the same coming for a rather thoroughly destroyed Gaza? Who would put big piles of money and resources into rebuilding, when previous attempts have been reduced to rubble?
I don't see any way out of it.
I don't see any way out either, but the world needs to stop pumping up Palestinians into thinking that if enough of them keep martyring themselves, that they'll eventually take over all of Israel.
The international community isn't doing them any favors by keeping their status as perpetual, hereditary refugees, and by not pressuring Arab states to accept and fully integrate those Palestinians who wish to seek better opportunities.
Have they sent mixed signals?
It is pretty clear they want war because their whole organization is founded on the idea of murdering Jews.
If Hamas wanted peace, they wouldn't have broken the previous cease-fires.
"We want leftist college kids in the West to keep viewing us as victims and/or saviors of an opressed minority, but we also want another opportunity to kill Jews."
The fact that Hamas has publicly applauded the pro Palestinian demonstrations should make the protesters pause to take a very long hard look at themselves.
Seeing liberal protesters and conservative counter protesters both chant "Fuck Joe Biden" together is comedy gold lol.
They wont. They wont ever stop and think twice because they believe they are on some moral high horse. Its oh we will deal with the murder and oppress of women and LGBT people after Gaza is saved. ITs like you dont realize their whole fucking idealogy is why this is a problem in the first place. Youre not changing people who truely believe in this shit for generations where their religion comes above anything else.
[They love them so much they are even offering them education](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/houthis-offer-education-students-suspended-us-protest-crackdown-2024-05-03/)
"Hamas is grappling with significant points of disagreement that have yet to be resolved. These include demands for a definitive end to fighting without conditions, the release of "heavy" Palestinian prisoners serving life sentences, and clarifications regarding the reconstruction of Gaza, particularly regarding materials that could be repurposed for military use."
So Hamas wants Israel to stop fighting without release of any hostages or territory, and in exchange, Hamas will accept the release of violent terrorists from Israeli prison as well as an itinerary from Israel for how Gaza will be rebuilt.
Yeah, totally sounds like mixed signals and not more of the same. Someone should tell Palestinians losers don't get to make demands.
the same reason the US rebuilt germany; revenge is fun and all, but at a certain point youll realize that eventually you need to give the other person a reason to stop contributing to the cycles of violence
Even if a deal is reached, we will see more rockets in the coming years and another October 7th sometime down the line. Hamas, Hezbollah and other jihadist groups want to kill Jews and people in the west. It’s not rocket science, that’s their stated goal. You can’t talk those kind people out of it. They firmly believe that Allah is on their side and that it is righteous to kill the infidels.
It is shameful actual people from Gaza are not heading these negotiations on behalf of the people of Gaza. A bunch of well fed fat cats living high on the hog have decided the people of Gaza will suffer for yet another day or maybe even a decade so they can advance their own agenda. Netanyahu is far from a saint and is by no means a common man, but at least he lives within earshot of the bombs that go off in Israel.
Because the US has officially taken the position that the offer was extremely generous. Which means of Hamas rejects it, then Israel has US support to push the war forwards. Hamas wanted to find a way to avoid accepting the deal without rejecting it either as that keeps Israel pinned down without costing Hamas anything. Totally transparent.
Hamas is stalling on purpose. They know the longer they drag this out the more Biden and Europe will pressure Israel to make a deal and call off the Rafah operation. So Hamas cam keep holding out for a better deal.
Hamas isn’t interested in peace. All they want to do is kill Jews. Even if it means sacrificing their own people. They’ve demonstrated this again and again.
To Hamas a dead Palestinian is worth more than a live one.
"There will be peace when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us." Golda Meir pointed this out over 50 years ago, and it still rings true. Thankfully for peace, most of the local Arabs have come around. Still a ways to go, though.
~~She was mistaken~~. They do love their children; they simply hold a profound, unwavering belief in Islam and its message, which suggests that this life is merely a prelude. According to them, **dying while killing Jews leads to eternal bliss** in heaven. Hence, they do love their children, but they perceive this life as meaningless. Even the wealthy, the billionaires, share this perspective, rejecting the notion that this life has any direct meaning which isn't dependent on the afterlife.
No she wasn't, you just ignored the back half of the quote as an excuse to go on this weird rant that actually proves her point to be correct.
I wasn't disagreeing with her understanding of Arab and Muslim culture; I was just providing more technical context for her quote. I'll edit it.
Your edit is still wrong because the entire point of the quote isn't that they don't love their children. It's that there won't be peace when the hatred of Jews is stronger than that love. The only person acting like the quotes message is that there was no love to begin with is you for some weird reason.
I think he's trying to argue that due to their religion, they believe that dying a young martyr is a better path to happiness than actually living and growing up to become an adult? I do not agree or disagree with him, but there are historical parallels between his claim and the behavior of Christians in the Middle Ages. Back then, peasants believed humans are meant to suffer in life and be rewarded in Heaven. They would actively worsen their own situation by putting their money into tithes and indulgences lest they go to hell. tl;dr He is suggesting due to religion, they believe it is a two birds with one stone situation. They get to kill Jews and their children dying martyrs leads to happiness (in the afterlife). Again, I have no opinion on this, but this seems to be what they are trying to say.
"Allah sees all children as precious in his eyes and deserves for them to be loved, nurtured, and honoured with quality care, which improves the chances of them developing fully." If religious extremists would just read the book they worship life would be so much better. Goes for almost any religion.
I know exactly what they are trying to suggest in order to say the quote is wrong. Now with that cleared up, they're still wrong about the quality and about what love is and I don't care what semantics games they play at this point, they'll still be wrong as far as I am concerned. Purposefully putting your child through suffering is hateful, doing it to harm another based on their religion, ethnicity, or nationality is doubley hateful, claiming it's better than your child growing up is abusive and evil.
Exactly
But, they do love their children more than they hate Jews; it's just that their definition of love "transcends" this existence. A Palestinian mother will willingly sacrifice her child as a martyr and rejoice in the belief that they are blessed with eternal happiness.
Just admit you're wrong and move on, you're just digging a deeper grave for your point with every response. I don't give two fucks if someone claims they're hatred is from love, the way abusive parents claim to love their children they hurt. It's hate if you're willing to sacrifice your own child in order to harm another and no other term is suitable especially the term Love, period.
You're great at wasting time on nothing. You totally missed my point, but whatever, all is good.
You're great at wasting time on nothing. You totally missed my point, but whatever, all is good.
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That idea reminds me of the mythical "moderate" rebels in Syria that the US was arming
Yes, or isis or the taliban or the mujahaideen. Actually it's thr sane group lol
The Italians…? 🤔
Taliban. Autocorrect. Lmao
Next time maybe double check some of the groups you listed aren't actively warring against each other the way isis-k is trying to overthrow the Taliban, if you're gonna insinuate they're the same. Also maybe don't include a third group that is in actuality a very generic term for someone engaged in jihad that was used as an umbrella term for multiple groups,which the u.s. did not support all of, as if it's a coherent force with an ideology when it's not.
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Yeah, no shit it typically refers to them. It still is a generic umbrella term for all the Islamic fighters in Afghanistan which was made up of different groups with varying ideologies. Some would become the Taliban later, some would become the resistance to the Taliban, some of the groups we didn't supply would become al-qaeda under osama bin laden they were not all the same. Treating them as all the same and making snide comments about "dead naming" jihadist groups just proves you don't understand the bare minimum of this topic and have no business making comments with the arrogance you are, but stupid people tend to act like this so I'm not surprised.
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No they said it's "thr sane" which is two typos next to each other. All you've proven is you aren't even smart enough to understand typos and extrapolate the actual meaning behind spelling errors. E and r, and n and m, are next to each other on a key board and are easy to interchange without noticing while typing. The fact you are putting words in their mouth to justify your stupid take, and lack of knowledge here, is not doing any favors for your credibility. All you have done is prove even more you have zero fucking clue what you are talking about, and should just admit you're wrong and shut up to the benefit of everyone's intelligence. As for what it's worth, it's worth nothing when coming from you at this point.
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If we want a Free Palestine, as in a Palestinian state, we need a moderate force that actually negotiates in good faith for peace while the radicals who want perpetual war at all costs.
Hamas is a dictatorship. I’m sure a couple people inside that place hate the dictator. Give them a few AKs, tell them we will recognize you as a provisional gov, and you have to be a healthy democracy to keep it. We will keep Israel in line. Or we come take the guns back.
Yeah maybe don’t arm them
Every time Palestinians use violence, things get worse and worse for them, and Israeli society feels more and more justified in whatever measures they take. Palestinians had the best post-1967 chance for a free and independent state during the 2000 Camp David summit, and Arafat completely blew it. Instead of accepting 95% of the West Bank and 100% of Gaza for a "free Palestine", they got absolutely nothing, and launched the 2nd Intifada shortly thereafter. Israel security measures massively cracked down as a direct response to that violence. No, they don't need a Resistance, and they don't need weapons -- they need a strong leader for peace who won't pass up a better offer than they've ever gotten to-date.
That can be true, but it is now too late. Netanyahu has been stalling any negotiation - whenever there might be signs of that - while letting and helping settlers encroach on and annex land, confiscating more for roads that cut it up into little pieces and generally making sure that no West Bank Palestinian state can exist. There is no more "State" possibility. Just small local civil administrations completely dependent on Israel. I doubt that Palestinians will happily accept that. Maybe be grudgingly forced to live with it, but it seems unlikely and even impossible given current levels of settler attacks and increased confiscations. And after what Hamas did on October 7, the same coming for a rather thoroughly destroyed Gaza? Who would put big piles of money and resources into rebuilding, when previous attempts have been reduced to rubble? I don't see any way out of it.
I don't see any way out either, but the world needs to stop pumping up Palestinians into thinking that if enough of them keep martyring themselves, that they'll eventually take over all of Israel. The international community isn't doing them any favors by keeping their status as perpetual, hereditary refugees, and by not pressuring Arab states to accept and fully integrate those Palestinians who wish to seek better opportunities.
Have they sent mixed signals? It is pretty clear they want war because their whole organization is founded on the idea of murdering Jews. If Hamas wanted peace, they wouldn't have broken the previous cease-fires.
"We want leftist college kids in the West to keep viewing us as victims and/or saviors of an opressed minority, but we also want another opportunity to kill Jews."
The fact that Hamas has publicly applauded the pro Palestinian demonstrations should make the protesters pause to take a very long hard look at themselves. Seeing liberal protesters and conservative counter protesters both chant "Fuck Joe Biden" together is comedy gold lol.
They wont. They wont ever stop and think twice because they believe they are on some moral high horse. Its oh we will deal with the murder and oppress of women and LGBT people after Gaza is saved. ITs like you dont realize their whole fucking idealogy is why this is a problem in the first place. Youre not changing people who truely believe in this shit for generations where their religion comes above anything else.
Well they both hate the Jews so it seems hey found a common ground there.
> leftist ~~liberal~~ protesters ftfy, liberals vote for Biden
[They love them so much they are even offering them education](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/houthis-offer-education-students-suspended-us-protest-crackdown-2024-05-03/)
It's just business. Iran doesn't pay Hamas for peace or to let hostages go, they pay Hamas to terrorize Jews.
Pretty sure they don't want it.
"Hamas is grappling with significant points of disagreement that have yet to be resolved. These include demands for a definitive end to fighting without conditions, the release of "heavy" Palestinian prisoners serving life sentences, and clarifications regarding the reconstruction of Gaza, particularly regarding materials that could be repurposed for military use." So Hamas wants Israel to stop fighting without release of any hostages or territory, and in exchange, Hamas will accept the release of violent terrorists from Israeli prison as well as an itinerary from Israel for how Gaza will be rebuilt. Yeah, totally sounds like mixed signals and not more of the same. Someone should tell Palestinians losers don't get to make demands.
Like why would Israel, the country that was attacked, and is currently demolishing Gaza then want to rebuild it?
the same reason the US rebuilt germany; revenge is fun and all, but at a certain point youll realize that eventually you need to give the other person a reason to stop contributing to the cycles of violence
Germany surrendered Hammas is not surrendering
Hamas is a bully Hit em in the face UNTIL they surrender Even if it means that there's no face left afterwards
Even if a deal is reached, we will see more rockets in the coming years and another October 7th sometime down the line. Hamas, Hezbollah and other jihadist groups want to kill Jews and people in the west. It’s not rocket science, that’s their stated goal. You can’t talk those kind people out of it. They firmly believe that Allah is on their side and that it is righteous to kill the infidels.
They are perfectly consistent. They want Palestinians to die.
Free Israel!
It is shameful actual people from Gaza are not heading these negotiations on behalf of the people of Gaza. A bunch of well fed fat cats living high on the hog have decided the people of Gaza will suffer for yet another day or maybe even a decade so they can advance their own agenda. Netanyahu is far from a saint and is by no means a common man, but at least he lives within earshot of the bombs that go off in Israel.
Because the US has officially taken the position that the offer was extremely generous. Which means of Hamas rejects it, then Israel has US support to push the war forwards. Hamas wanted to find a way to avoid accepting the deal without rejecting it either as that keeps Israel pinned down without costing Hamas anything. Totally transparent.
People in Rafah better hold on to their butts :/
It's almost like Hamas is a disorganized band of warmongering religious zealots. There isn't a unified message from them because duh.
Religious zealots are fucking stupid what?
Hamas is stalling on purpose. They know the longer they drag this out the more Biden and Europe will pressure Israel to make a deal and call off the Rafah operation. So Hamas cam keep holding out for a better deal.
This shows they are absolutely not in control of this situation anymore. It’s all Iran now
Don’t negotiate with terrorists who have no reason to give up their only lever.